Down the Rabbit Hole
Things outside of the conventional strength & conditioning stuff.
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Down the Rabbit Hole
Left Turns and Brain Gains: A Pit Crew's Tale
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Step into the unseen athletic world of NASCAR with Chad Emmons, strength and conditioning coach for Haas Factory Team. In this eye-opening conversation, Chad reveals how his journey from college football led him to the high-stakes world of racing—a sport he once dismissed as "just turning left."
NASCAR's physical demands will surprise even seasoned sports fans. Pit crews change four tires in under 10 seconds while handling 75-pound wheels and 95-pound fuel cans. Drivers endure 5+ hours of constant vibration and G-forces that wreak havoc on their vestibular systems. It's an athletic challenge requiring specialized training methods that Chad has pioneered by integrating cutting-edge neurological approaches.
You'll discover how the grueling 44-week NASCAR season shapes training programs that must adapt weekly to different tracks, weather conditions, and the physical toll of constant travel. Chad explains how he implements visual training, vestibular conditioning, and posturology principles to optimize performance for both drivers and pit crew members—innovations that initially raised eyebrows but have proven effective in this high-precision sport.
Whether you're a racing enthusiast or simply curious about human performance at its limits, this conversation reveals the extraordinary athletic demands hidden beneath NASCAR's surface. The next time you watch cars "just turning left," you'll see it through entirely new eyes.
Meeting Chad Emmons, NASCAR Coach
Speaker 1Hey , jeff , you're back with another episode of Down the Rabbit Hole . In today's podcast we have Chad Emmons . Chad is a former pit crew member and strength and conditioning coach for Haas , racing in NASCAR . I wanted to get Chad on because , to be honest with you , I don't know much about NASCAR . I've never , historically , really paid much to it . It was always kind of like , just I don't go fast , turn left and I never uh , I don't know never a sport I really got into . But , uh , having the experience of getting to know Chad for the last , I think seven or eight years super awesome guy , very knowledgeable strength and conditioning coach and one that's also very interested in neurology which is uh rare . But neurology and NASCAR , I think is pretty cool , and so I want to get him on to learn one how does someone get into NASCAR , what was his experiences before that , what led him into it , and then what are the demands of working with NASCAR and guys ? This is such an enlightening episode because I was unaware of , like , the grueling schedule that they have , the grueling physicality at which which working in the pit crew has to go through and , from a motor learning standpoint , everything that they practice and , as a strength and niche coach what they have to , what they have to go through in order to program and plan for their crew and the racers and everything . So this was an awesome podcast . Chad is a great guy , very lucky to have him on .
Speaker 1I hope you guys enjoyed it this episode as much as I do . Please give us a like and a share . Thanks , chad . Listen , man . This is nice to finally see you . We've we've spoken on the phone for shit since 2018 . Um so what ? Seven years , man ? So this is nice to actually see on zoom man . Um , yeah , thanks for jumping on . I know you're getting your kids down . I'm trying to get my crazies down , so it's not not always easy , but , uh , I appreciate you taking the time , man , absolutely , um yeah , if you don't mind .
Speaker 1Of course , dude , you know , having gotten to know you a little bit over these seven years , man like I'm very interested to learn more about you and what it is you do at Stuart Haas and your journey to this point and everything . So , if you don't mind , you know , for the people that may not know you , can you give a little intro about yourself ?
Speaker 2Yep , so I am a change one thing . So in the past , for seven years , I worked for Stuart Haas Racing , and this past year we changed ownership and now it's just Haas Factory Team Gotcha . Okay .
Speaker 1I just wanted to .
Speaker 2So in case , like other people here , they're like well , stewart hoss isn't a thing anymore , so I just wanted to . But I get it all the time like , yeah , it's all good , I just wanted to , okay , update that because , whenever you're fine . Whenever you and I first started talking , it was always stewart hoss like forever , so yeah , so you're good .
Speaker 2I don't know how far back you want to go , but , like for me , I played college football at Ouachita Baptist University . It's a Division II school in Arkansas . Okay , I'm originally from Texas , so that wasn't too far away from home .
Speaker 1Yeah , where in ?
Speaker 2Texas . Do I now ? Where in Texas ? Tyler , texas , where's that ? It's , it's east texas , it's a hundred miles southeast of dallas , so it's , it's , it's deep in there .
Speaker 2Um , and then , uh , once I got done with washtau , I actually was able to GA with the same for the same school , same staff . So I was a graduate assistant and I was like the defensive backs coach and then that was like my entry points of strength and conditioning and most division two schools . You got to . You kind of got to do , you know , multiple jobs . So I was like the strength coach and the secondary coach and I started really enjoying more strength and conditioning . And after those couple of years I was like , man , I want to do the division one dream and I applied to 76 schools just for an internship and I was trying to do a division one school and only four got back to me After I just talked briefly to them . I did an internship at Maryland in 2015 . It was with the Olympic sports staff . When I got done with Maryland , took my CSCS , got a job at Davidson College and from 2015 to 2018 I was at Davidson College .
Speaker 2I'm in the , you know , and it was 20 miles north of Charlotte . I know nothing about NASCAR . Even when I was growing up in Texas , I thought NASCAR was like the silliest sport . I would watch Sunday football with my dad , and then NASCAR comes on . I'm like man , all they do is left turn . You know , all they do is like turn left go fast drive .
Speaker 2I would immediately and I'd immediately turn . And then , long story short , I'm in Davidson and I had a buddy who was working for Stuart Haas at the time , part-time . He's like , hey , you should , you should try out . I said , man , I don't want to do that , I want it for pit crew . Yeah , I was like I don't want to do that , man . I said I said I want to , I want to do strength and conditioning Like I'm . I'm trying to do like the division one dream I want to make it to a big school . And another year ago , hey , man , like they're always looking for people , you should try out for pit crew .
Speaker 2And at this point I was probably I guess that'd have been I was like 28 . I was like , man , I feel pretty young , athletic , I miss playing sports , so I in sports . So I did a tryout at stewart haas . Yeah , they didn't have a spot . But the coach there at the time he was like hey , if you want to come at 6 am whenever you can , that's where we do like our developmental practices . So I worked it out when I was at davidson to where , if we didn't have like an early team , I would go practice and immediately come and work . And less than a year later . I landed a job
Path from Football to NASCAR
Speaker 2later , in 2018 , and I've been in racing ever since .
Speaker 2So that's like my whirlwind NASCAR story of getting in . Most people like grow up , dream about it . They want to do pit crew or obviously they're a driver , and I knew nothing about it , nor could I . What have I ever like thought of doing something like that ?
Speaker 1That's awesome . What did the tryout ent tell ? What kind of stuff so ?
Speaker 2when I did a tryout it was . It was kind of weird , but they made you do like a sit and reach test . I had to . I had to jump another . I mean it's changed now , but like I had it for when I did it I had to jump rope as fast as I could , as many reps in 60 seconds . Okay , I had to jump rope as fast as I could , as many reps in 60 seconds , okay . I had to do an L drill . I had to do a vertical jump and I remember in which I get now why they did it .
Speaker 2But to let I kind of judge your character and just kind of see like where your head space was at , we had to do a 300-yard shuttle , but it was at 25-yard cuts , okay , and that was like the the . I guess at times they just say like some people kind of dog it , or you can see that some people just didn't like put effort , and so from what I figured out you go because I used to run that same test until I changed it was you above and beyond . So it's like we don't want this guy , like we want people that have high energy , high effort . So but yeah , that was my trial and then I was able to , from there , just show up to practices , learn and try to just figure it out and fit in . That's awesome .
Speaker 1What do they do now for trouts Is it changed .
Speaker 2So now , as we evolved , and once I started running the strength and conditioning program there , I was like man , I really don't care about their sit and reach , I don't care about jumping rope . I said let's just condense it down . So we literally just did a 10-yard sprint , a vertical . We had them go off of the . It's like the European military . If I YouTube it , I can figure out , but it was to a metronome . They had to do push-ups on cadence . You just go until you can do as many as you could . Same thing . They did pull-ups and then at times , yeah , it would be like up , beep down , oh yeah . So like I was like that way , people can't like half rep it , they can't like barely get up or not yeah , I was like I wanted to get to a standard and I wanted to just condense the test .
Speaker 2Interesting um and then um . The last thing was we used to do that 300 , but at times we would have people from other teams try out . Well , if they're in the middle of season they're like man , I don't want to tear a hamstring , I don't want to like hurt myself because they haven't trained for it . So we switched to doing like a fan bike or like an assault bike . Okay , and I would make them . They would have to maintain the cadence at 80 or higher for as long as they could that's it , nice man , it's yeah , it was just .
Speaker 2It was just trying to think of another way to where they're not , you know , running the actual 300 . So yeah um . The glycolytic piece got checked that's good man .
Speaker 1So what ? What currently is your role at Haas' team ?
Speaker 2So when it was Stuart Haas , I was a pit crew member , okay , and then I was the strength and conditioning coach . When we went to Haas , we went from four cup teams to one cup team , okay , and we also we always had like two Xfinity teams for a long time , and I can get into more details on that in a second . So now we only have three total teams compared to like even when , you know , previously we had six if you include Xfinity . And so what we did was we only had 10 pit crew members . Before we had around like 40 . So we just kind of like transitioned things to where now the pit crew is pretty responsible and they kind of know what they're doing , so they just handle their own business , and now I just train the drivers so how many guys , uh , I mean , how many guys do you do , train what's ?
Speaker 2we ? We currently have three drivers two xfinity drivers and one cup driver okay and you only work with that one team .
Speaker 1How many teams does haas team have ?
Speaker 2well , that's what I'm saying we . We have three total teams , so we have a cup . No , no , you're good . We have a cup team and two xfinity teams . Okay , and this might help .
Speaker 2I'll break this down , because I didn't know any of this stuff until I got in the sport so I'm very novice to nascar so I apologize dude , I'm telling you like I'm still learning and like there's , there's people that , yeah , so , in NASCAR , as far as like the series that pertain more to us , whether it's pit crew or like most I guess you say like higher level organizations , you have the truck series , xfinity series , cup series . Now , I'm not saying this is like a perfect , like a comparison , but I always say like cup series , think of as like high school level , xfinity is your college , cup is like your professional . Now there's great drivers in all series . I'm just saying like , think of them as stepping stones to work towards the pros .
Speaker 1Okay , Now do you have a central hub location that you guys have and that you train at ?
Speaker 2Yes , we are located in Kannapolis , North Carolina . It's very close to Charlotte At that facility . That's where we build all the race cars , where we practice , where we train . Everything is right there .
Speaker 1Sweet .
Speaker 2Yes .
Speaker 1Okay , let's get into it , man . So first of all , as a pit crew member , before we go back to the strength and conditioning , like again , I'm a novice man Like what is the demands of a pit crew member for team Haas or Stuart Haas before ?
Speaker 2so it's a loaded question , but I'm going to try to condense this down as much as I can . So I've had this , I've had this debate with several people and this is when I was coming from like the college setting . I felt like when I was in college or even like when I talked to I'm not saying this is like all college coaches , but I feel like the number one thing is like we got to get strong . Okay , I get that . But like I've come to a point in my life where I'm like , at the end of the day , if you can do your job at a high level , you're not getting constantly hurt , so you can always be used , you know you're not sitting out and you can do that for long periods of time , that's , that's pretty good . Like you're going to get a decent paycheck . You can stay in the sport 10 , 15 , maybe 20 years and you know , then you can move on to your next career .
Speaker 2So as far as like a pit crew member myself , I don't even . I'm not a meathead like I used to be like . I don't even I'm not a meathead like I used to be Like . I don't chase metrics . I'm like I have to bench at least three plates . You know I got to squat at least like this or whatever .
Speaker 2Like I'm like as long as I can move , good , um , like recently I bought a force plate . So that's how I like track all my metrics . But if I'm like , hey man , like if I'm checking these boxes , if I just feel good when I'm doing like my normal workout , and hey , as long as like at the track and practice , it's not like I'm having to be limited , whether that's age or whatever other factors I got going on , I'm like to me that's just good enough . Now I know other organizations . They might have other metrics they go off of or how they evaluate people for what they need , but like that's just where I'm currently at in my life and like now , especially a hospital that's only have 10 people , guys know what they need to do to be able to show up , whether that's on a friday , saturday or sunday , and perform and do pit stops so what again ?
Speaker 1what ? What are the kind of the demands that go into a pit stop ? So now , okay , so that that's what I'm saying , I know'm saying I know the speed in which the tires have to be changed is fast . How heavy is the tire ? I ?
Speaker 2don't know . Here's the demands If you're in the truck or Xfinity series . If you're at a bigger racetrack , you have five lug nuts on the wheel and those tires weigh anywhere from 70 to 75 pounds . If you're at a shorter track or road courses , they're around 50 to 55 . On the Cup Series they recently changed to a single lug nut tire or design . It's all independent suspension . Those wheels are aluminum and they weigh about 50 pounds . Oh , nice , when before it was all the same .
Speaker 2Okay , so those are just like the tire part , A pit stop . If you're in like the truck series or Xfinity series , it can range anywhere from 13 to 16 , maybe 17 seconds . In the cup series there's some teams running like in the low eight seconds because it's just extremely fast and like the technology they have for that cup series , like how you're just having to do everything . It's , it's just nuts , um and it . It definitely had a learning curve because you're so used to like the , the speed and stuff of like five lug and now , with it being single lug , like it's yeah , it's , it's literally organized chaos Like that's , that's how
Inside the NASCAR Pit Crew Demands
Speaker 2pit stops are .
Speaker 1I mean what ? What ? The average pit stop like 10 seconds less than that .
Speaker 2Yeah , I would say , I would say on the cup , on where you're at . But yeah , and that's including like changing all four tires and getting like fuel in the car , wow , um , and that's why I'm kind of saying , like for xfinity or truck , it could be anywhere from like 13 to 17 seconds , just because it takes longer to hit the lug nuts , things like that . Yeah , um , and then , just because you're saying you're novice , there's five pit , there's five pit crew members . I'm trying to draw it out to you because I know you can see it this way . Just imagine a car . If you're looking at the nose of the car , just head on , you got your right side , left side , the way we distinguish the car is . You got your right front , right , rear , left , front , left , rear . So you now here's your positions you have a front changer . He is the guy that either hits the lug nuts or takes the one lug nut off and then retightens the wheel . Once the new tires put on , the jack man will jack up the car on one side so that way the tires are off the ground . To actually take the tires off , put them on , then you have a rear changer here , the rear tires , and then there's a this , which is what I do too .
Speaker 2This is a called a tire carrier . You carry two tires out to give one of them off to the jack man to put that tire on the right front . You keep on running around , you put the right rear on , then you transition all the way over to the left . The jack man will get the car up , he will hang the left rear and the tire carrier runs around . He hangs the left front and then the left rear , okay , and the tire carrier runs around , he hangs the left front and then the whole time you have your fueler , which is crazy like if you fuel like in the cup series , especially like they made some changes , but like cup series , the gas can at minimum holds 12 gallons if they fill it up a little bit more and get a little bit heavier . But that can will weigh anywhere from like 90 to 95 pounds , okay , and so you're holding like a giant gas can way up here , like into your chest and it's just moving and sloshing , so like it takes a pretty lengthy or strong guy .
Speaker 1Yeah , and then how many times are you changing tires and doing this throughout ?
Speaker 2So every track is different . I'm just , I'm guesstimating . I want to say it was like in the cup series this year , there's like 38 races . I want to say an Xfinity , there was like 31 or 32 . But on the cup series , depending on where you're at , if you're not at a track , that's very abrasive , you could have your tires last a little bit longer . So that just changes up your strategy . If , uh , I'm trying to think of some track like walk-ins glen , since you're talking about , that's near you , like that's a road course , yeah , um , yeah , tires do wear out , but track position matters . Like there , there will be teams that can do that race in like two or three pit stops , oh okay , and that's it , just because they don't want to lose the track position . Have you ever heard of Darlington , south Carolina ?
Speaker 1Yes , I've heard of Darlington .
Speaker 2Okay . So like that particular racetrack , it is like that race . If you're on the Cup Series , I swear at minimum . It's like you're doing 10 to 14 pit stops . Yeah , the track's just so rough . It's like you could literally do one lap and if there's a caution that comes out or a wreck or something , you're going to come right back in and you're going to pit . If you have the tires and how your track position is , just because they wear down so much and your lap time suffers . Okay , if you don't .
Speaker 1All right , well dang , yeah , yeah , as a strength and issue coach . First of all , before we get into what you do with team haas as a strength and issue coach , is that that once you went to college ?
Speaker 2for yes , yep , I got my degree in kinesiology , okay , um , and that's why I was kind of saying , at washington I just was able to double dip , but I as I was like playing college football and then coaching it I really , really enjoyed it , but I was like man , I just don't see like a way for me to really advance as quick maybe . So that's when I was like I'm putting more of my eggs in one basket as far as like on the strength and conditioning side , gotcha .
Speaker 1Yeah , and you're pretty persistent .
Speaker 2Now it's super saturated .
Speaker 1So yeah , yeah , but I mean you're pretty persistent to send out 76 fricking letters , man , that's , that's , that's a lot .
Speaker 2I just , I just wanted to intern at a D one school because I wanted to see what it was like .
Speaker 1Yeah Well , maryland , maryland's pretty good , it's a big school .
Speaker 2I loved it yeah .
Speaker 1Yeah , man . So now team Haas , like what ? What are the demands of a strength and nutrition coach in NASCAR ? Cause I've to be honest with you , you're the only one I've ever met in the world of NASCAR . I've been fortunate to NFL and MLB and NHL and stuff , but not not NASCAR . So I'm I'm very curious as far as what you know , what goes into that in the day-to-day ?
Speaker 2and then how do you program and plan and individualize if , if , if , if you're able to do that , like what goes into that ? Yep , so the to me , the biggest challenge with nascar especially like even when I was at college working with several other sports teams is there's hardly any variability . You beside , like when you do backwards pit stops , you always have a car coming in from your right , so you're always like moving . I'm just saying as the pit crew , they're always , for the most part , they're moving to their right . They do the right side , then they transition , they do the left and then it's done , um , and there's no change . So it's like you literally do the most repetitive thing ever . It's not like if you're a football player , it's like , hey , I can pass block this time . Oh , I can run block , I can pull , I can , yeah , I can . You know it doesn't like I guess maybe you could say track or swimming , like there's not a whole lot of variance , but like it's , you're literally stuck and that window of time is nine to , at most , 17 seconds , depending on whatever series you're in . So what I started doing from like early on was I was just like hey , yeah , I understand that I want you guys to have like a base level of strength so that you're not breaking down . Have like a base level of strength or so that way you're not breaking down . But I started taking way more time into thinking of , hey , literally weekly , what track are we going to , as well as what's the weather demands and how many pit stops and volume from practice we're probably going to have . So , instead of me like writing out a giant , sweet , like macro cycle plan , I literally lived in like the week to week . I didn't care about writing up a plan , cause it's like I can have this sweet plan and now , all of a sudden , if we get rained out and or if you don't get back until 4am because there's a plane failure or whatever , well , it's just altered your whole week and so I literally would make changes . I would , I would , I would only have , like I would think about something . I'd write up a plan for the next day within 12 hours . I don't like think it all out , like to make it some like glorious , glamorous thing . It's like what do we need ? And and so , as far as like what we need , I feel like you need to be able to have control of your entire body . I'm just like being more broad here . You just got to be able to have control of your body as far as certain positions .
Speaker 2This is where I would slightly specialize . You could say I would do again kind of like the gas man there's holding a heavy implement . I did a lot more carries with them . You could almost say kind of like strong men-esque type things .
Speaker 2And if there were some guys that were a little bit more into it , like I would almost try to treat it like hey , if you could think of you . You know , if you're like a , a track , like thrower of some sort , like kind of like a bigger guy that can still move because you got to transition with the can pretty quick , yeah . But we got some guys that are 40 years old and they're still doing it and they can , they can handle it . So I'm like , hey , if you just really like riding this bike and you're able to do it , then hey , you can ride this bike , we can do a cardio circuit . But like that would be like the perfect case scenario of how I'd like it to be , like the perfect case scenario of how I'd like it to be as far as like your Jack man . Think of them as kind of like . They're almost like a linebacker , tight end type build Some of them you know there's a lot of guys that come from like a baseball type background too .
Speaker 2Yeah , I would . I would say I'd spend more time with them on upper body strength , just because whenever they're at the end of the Jack they're having to just like push it down that final piece with their upper body . And then also like , whenever you're grabbing and throwing a tiger , it's away from you and so like and I'm just going off of my experience , like when I realized I was not heavy enough , as well as like my grip was atrocious , the tire would just whip my ass because you're just holding some of the 70 pounds , you're literally just suspending it here and you're barely having any leverage to push the bottom of it . Um , those grips and I grip strength's a big thing that you guys train . Oh , my god , dude , like you're , you're gripping forearm strength like they're .
Speaker 2They're like very , very vital , like it goes a long way . Um , even like the changers , because , like , whenever they're pulling the trigger on the gun , like the torque , or like the rpm speed , like some of the guns , they get up to like 11 , 12 000 rpm , and I'm talking like you can pull the trigger and it feels like it's just gonna like snap your wrist in half . It's just gonna like bend it over , like for them to like pull the trigger , have control , hit lug nuts or even just hit the single lug like it's . It's pretty impressive what those guys can do . Um , so like similar , like the jack man , we I would definitely do like even more like forearm and grip work with them .
Speaker 2Um , so you guys , as far as , as far as , like as far as like lower butt , and I'm kind of like generalizing these two groups because like they're either having like run around the car a little bit more would still do like different plyos or just sprints . I didn't really make the gasman necessarily have to like run sprints , let's just want it to Um , uh , and then you know . And then I'm just saying like there's a lot more nuances , but I don't think that's what you're wanting to get into as much .
Speaker 2You guys do more like strong man type type stuff with the no like no , I guess I'm just trying to say like if it was like a , if it was a cookie-cutter approach . It's like Sunday , you know you do your race . Monday you come in . Think of it as like an active recovery lift , yep , so guys can do cardio , some core , maybe some light if they want to get in the sauna , cold tub , whatever . Tuesday and Wednesday is kind of like your harder days of practice . So like Tuesday , I would try to like stack the same intensity on that , instead of me making it like easy . But you're doing a lot of reps of practice . It's like , well , let's just get them all over with at once .
Speaker 2So might do like some type of compound lift , whether it's bench or squat . You're going to either sprint or jump , do some auxiliaries . Move on to the next day , wednesday
Strength Training for NASCAR Athletes
Speaker 2still would practice . You're going through , not saying an exact workout , something similar , because again , just trying to like get that done earlier in the week to get prepared and let it clear out by the time you get to either Saturday or Sunday . Thursday we possibly would practice A lot of our guys like love , spike ball or anything like where they can be like active and like play a game . So like half the time you get done with practice on Thursdays , like guys are just playing spike ball or you know , we're just looking for something like kind of fun like that , or I would have a little light circuit they could do Then it's like hey , rest Friday , saturday , go do your deal on Sunday , repeat .
Speaker 2As far as the overall lifts and training , I feel like everybody does the same stuff . 80% to 90% of the time it's just like when and where do you do it . 90% of the time it's just like when and where do you do it . And that was that , to me , was the biggest help was the fact that I get to go to the racetrack every week and , you know , do the races with these guys . I'm in the elements , I'm feeling the same things as them . So I feel like I could really have a better grasp of hey , if my body's feeling like crap , more than likely there's ours , because this is my job and I want to take care of you guys .
Speaker 1So I'm curious about , like practice . You mentioned practice a couple of times , so what does that entail ? Do you guys practice a lot of variability in practice , so if there is a mistake you guys can quickly change , like yes motor learning . So I'm interested in what you guys practice , so yes .
Speaker 2Motor learning , so I'm interested in what you guys practice , so , so like our . Now , every organization is different , but as far as our place our tire changers , they wear a GoPro on their helmet so you can see everything that's taken place within the hub Yep , oh cool . And then also when we're doing , you know , at the track and we do this practice too , but at the track , like we have an overhead camera so that way it can just see everything that's taking place during the pit stop . Now at practice we have a very similar setup where the changers wear GoPros as well , as we have like an overhead camera , but we also have like a right and left side so you can really like dive in on it at practice . So normally I feel like this is like for any any team , if you like do really good . I feel like film goes really smooth and practices are a little bit lighter . But it's like as soon as you screw up or if , like the teams are struggling , it's's like you know you're dissecting every single little mistake you made in the practice . Volume just kind of creeps up a little bit more . And I do like the way you know , whether it was through Haas or Haas , I always liked it because our coaches I felt like for the , you know , the majority of the time I really thought they were conscious of , like you know , the personnel they were dealing with .
Speaker 2They could , you know , not everybody was 21 to 24 , so they could just pile a bunch of crap on them because the season's 38 weeks on top of preseason , so it's even longer than that . I mean you're probably looking at it's like 44 , 43 weeks of nonstop stuff . So how I thought our coaches were really tactical and how they approach stuff is , if someone was having an issue , they would try to like replicate that scenario of just like that segment , instead of making them having to do the entire , you know , the entire like song and dance of the pit stop , which I feel , like you know , very similar to other sports . Yeah , so it's a part whole approach , correct ? Yes , and I mean honestly , like even you know from my times , if you're screwing up like I , I feel like the majority of the time like it , just it , it just works in nascar , or at least I've seen it work for us a lot and then you know eventually you can .
Speaker 2You know if you have guys that you're just trying to help and get better , they're just not figuring out , then it's the next guy up , um , I mean , because it's a competitive sport , like you're not getting the job done . We got to find the next guy that came , um , but definitely a lot of part hole , um . The other thing which a lot of people don't think about is you could have a screw up , and it's not like you're always trying to find like a cop out . But where there are variances is and I'm trying to show you but like , think of like a car stopping in a pit stall . Well , let's say there's a car that's right in front of you or a stall that's right in front of you and that's where they got to go . Well , someone , sometimes they're you call that like they're going nose in or they're coming around .
Speaker 2They will just be really tight to you and then they're parking and so they're crowding down your space yeah and if you have people that you know either aren't experienced or they don't know exactly how to handle it , some things can get pretty awkward as well as like they can go uh , arrive really quick , um . Same thing like if you already have a car parked and now you're coming into the stall like your driver well , if they , if you happen to get done before the other team , well , you can't move forward because they're blocking you . So you might have like stock short in your stall . Well , that changes up normally where everybody's at the timing your spacing . So like this is where , like the experience I feel , like you know , getting to be in those positions also helps Like , so there's , you know , there's sometimes just younger guys like they're doing the job right , but when they're in these awkward positions they're just not quite as successful .
Speaker 2Yeah , and it's like all right , well , this is just gonna take time , you're just gonna have to do it . So like , yeah , we'll try to replicate in that practice , but you can't , nothing can , you can't make anything like practices as like the track , like the track is a different animal I hear it , but no , that's again .
Speaker 1I've motor learning so fascinated me and I've never honestly thought about it for nascar . Now , talking to here , my , my wheels are spinning just like okay , all the variants that can go into it , from the weather to you know . I mean all of a sudden a bolt accidentally slips and falls and it's under the fucking car oh , yeah , oh , that's , that's .
Speaker 2Yeah , dude , like I'm I'm almost kind of pissed now . I almost wish like I was , like , which I'm obviously at home . I wish I was like at work and I could get you on the projector so you could see it . Yeah , because I could show you one pit stop of it going like perfectly clean , and then all of a sudden you could go to another variable . We'll just like one little thing happens and now all of a sudden it adds like a second , second and a half . Yeah , because we live in the hundreds of thousands of a second . Like we care about all of those metrics and there's way too many . Yeah , you would have a field trip if you , if you ever had a chance to come to North Carolina like you would . I feel like people that are very analytical as well as they just like seeing things and just yeah , I think you would have a . You'd have a blast yeah , that sounds crazy .
Speaker 1Um , yeah , yeah , it sounds pretty chaotic in there at times that's what I said it's organized chaos . It really is and then , like every track is the size of the I don't know what it's called the , the area which you they pull in and stuff . Yeah , uh , I don't know what't know what it's called the , the area which you they pull in and stuff . Yeah , uh , I don't know what you call it .
Speaker 1It's called the pit stall so every pit stall is a different size . So then you have to like right that week for that pit stall , in case they block you in or and shit like that .
Speaker 2Cool yep um , yeah , like this real , real quick , I was going to tell you like this past weekend we were in Indianapolis , indianapolis Motor Speedway , so like Indianapolis has really really long pit stalls but they're extremely narrow , been times where and it still happens to this day like you will mark exactly where you want your driver to stop , because if he happens to be a little bit close to like our pit wall , like where we have to like jump off or when the car's coming in , yeah , they're a little bit too close when you transition to that left side , the jack man's literally jammed up because there's a wall in the car . So like every little thing like matters and like that , just again , you're not saying that's the pit crew fault , but it still just is the overall team's fault , because now you're just losing time yeah , man variability um yeah now , uh , um , do you ?
Speaker 1do you work with the drivers as well , or just like the pit crew and the staff once we transition to now haas .
Speaker 1Now I work with only the drivers , okay yep no as soon as yep , yep , what are the demands , uh , of the drivers ? I mean , obviously they're going very , very fast and they're turning left but , like you know , for anyone that's never actually watched next car , like what are the demands ? I was fortunate to uh do a podcast with a buddy of mine who's a bobsled Olympic bobsledder and never thought about the demands of being in a bobsled , and it was pretty enlightening , it was pretty crazy . So I'm curious , like what are the demands of working with a , you know , a driver and the things they go through ?
Speaker 1I mean is concussions like a high , high rate of concussions with drivers due to the force .
Speaker 2Is concussions like a high rate of concussions with drivers due to the force they're actually . Yes , they are not as high as you would think , but if they sustain a pretty hard hit , yes , there's definitely symptoms . Yes , so , yeah , that is a factor as far as , like a driver , I mean there's a . You know , we can get as nitpicky as we want . There are a lot of factors , but I feel like some of the bigger ones , because now I'm going to nerd out in a second , but not yet . So now , as far as the bigger items is , depending on what series you're in , you could be in that car for two hours to maybe four or five Straight . The only way those guys are getting a break is if you're under a caution lap or for the time you're in the pit stall , just being able to stay still , and that's when you're getting a water
Motor Learning in Racing
Speaker 2bottle . Other than that , laps are always going , so you're always driving , and so obviously their stamina is huge .
Speaker 2Yeah , um , this is where I feel like the crew chief who obviously is telling the driver like information as well as like the spotter , just so that way the driver knows what's going on around them , like how they manage , whether it's a mistake , something good you know , like the events of the race , like just their overall psychology is like it's insane , cause I've seen some guys where , like , some type of issue can happen and they immediately just flip the switch and all of a sudden they're going like crazy , they're driving erratic and the next thing you know like they're wrecking their car or now they have like a penalty on pit road cause they're driving too fast . Like they , they just lose focus . I've seen other guys where , like you know , something crappy can happen to them , whatever that is , and they just brush it off and they just keep on going and you're like dang , how can you like do that ? And you know a lot of them . They're just like well , it's a really long race , I can't . Just there are a lot of things are going to happen no-transcript .
Speaker 1I was not happy .
Speaker 2Yeah , I can't imagine now like yeah , technology's changed where the guys , like most drivers , have like a cool suit okay so it's like flowing cool water , you know throughout their obviously more like vital organ area , but like there's sometimes where like that cool suit like malfunctions and guys just have to like deal with the race for that long and there you send the heat now are they ?
Speaker 1are they monitored ? Do they have , have some kind of HRV or anything like that ?
Speaker 2There are some guys I know out there that wear whether it's a whoop a Garmin . Some guys wear their polar . I tried doing that before , but some guys just didn't like having something either on their wrist or extra on their body . Everyone's a little bit different . Some guys can handle it Like . What some people try to do is they'll just try to subject , you know , put their driver more of like a controlled setting , whether that's the heat or getting their heart rate to like whenever they're on the simulator , so they get an idea and then they'll just try to see like hey , where are you at at this position , or like this part of the race , and they just kind of like guesstimate that way yeah .
Speaker 1If a guy doesn't , yeah , sorry . No , that's just what I'm thinking in my head is like okay , heart in monitoring the heart rate and doing you know , breathing techniques and things like that big with those yeah oh , yeah , yeah , um , a lot of just quick nasal breaths , just trying to trying to eliminate like the mouth breathing .
Speaker 2Yeah , um , that's just me thinking of , like sean with his like square one stuff , but yeah , like a lot of quick little yeah , we'll get into that okay , so now this is .
Speaker 2This is me now nerding out . This is finally where I get . So until and now this plays , until obviously , your podcast , which I love the name obviously going down the rabbit hole . So so , until I knew anything about this , I never realized the amount of visual and vestibular input the drivers deal with . Yes , absolutely , and several other people made this even more clear to me , people made this even more clear to me , and there's a lot of . I mean , I'm I gotta , I gotta tell them to like Dan Nick , dr Lucky even you might know him because of Matt but Dr Clark , joe Clark , like , and there's several , so many other people .
Speaker 2But all these guys made things even more apparent as I started learning from them . But to me is when you're in the race car , we're saying , for the most part , if you're on a oval track , you're turning left . Well , they have a Hans device so they can't move as much with their neck . However , when you're in that seat , you get constant vibrations . So they're like and I've done this on the guys they're literally like , just in the car , yeah , there's constantly getting vibrations , the entire time there , there's oscillating , yeah , and now you're getting that for two to five hours what's that ?
Speaker 2due to their vestibular oh , it's getting , I mean it's getting just wrecked because they never get a break . They never get a break . So now that's where , now that I've gone down this , you know and again I do not know near as much as you guys , but just finally like at least seeing it and looking at it from a different lens , I'm like holy cow well let's like let's get into that man , because one , that's one of the things that that , uh , we we've talked about through years .
Speaker 1And you know , uh , and the little bit I know about nascar , I've seen , at least with companies like synaptic , they do training , vision training with drivers . You know , is that something ? I mean , what kind of steered you to looking into that stuff ? I mean , how did you get into Matt and Dan and posturology and IP and Sean and you know the whole gamut .
Speaker 2Man , how it first started was when I was doing it with still Stuart Haas . I was able to first start working with our drivers when we were Stuart Haas and I was talking to our competition director and the competition director was like , hey , you're going to be able to work with the drivers this upcoming year If there's anything you want for the drivers . And I was like , man , this will be cool . So I started like flipping back through like old podcasts and I just remember and I never listened to like a ton , but , like I , one of the very first ones I listened to was Joel Smith's and the variety of people he had , and so I literally started looking back on ones that I had saved and I started replaying them from you know know whether that was like 2015 on , and I'd be like who was kind of just out there , like who was like talking , like different , and like the first two people I came across was Corfist and Dan . Yeah , and so , anyways , that same year I was taught when I was talking to my competition director , I was like , hey , man , I want to , I want to talk with these people because I want to see , you know , if I can get anything like . I just want to know . Yeah , and he's like all right , he's like when you want to do it ? I said , well , we go to Chicago for this race .
Speaker 2And I reached out to Corfis and he only lives like 30-45 minutes away . So I was like , can I fly out a day early and go meet him ? Email , email , chris , you know whatever ? And he got back to me and he's like , yeah , man , you come , you come over , like we can hang out and then we can go to the basement . And I did that , so I got to experience it , and so I picked his brain , all sorts of stuff and and then and it was awesome and then he was telling me cause I was like he's the RPR guy , you know , and obviously other people are too , but I was like we're going to go down that rabbit hole .
Speaker 2So then I'm talking to talking to him and he's like you should see my buddy Dan . I was like that's crazy , cause I actually reached out to him like a few days later after I reached out to you , because I saw how you guys would do stuff together a lot . And so then we go to Watkins , glen , and I flew out a day early and I saw Dan and Nick , I can't remember if I met Doc that that time . But yeah , yeah , I love it . Yeah , that guy , he's awesome , but he's , he's a yeah , he's just , it's just Doc . But anyways , dan , and I don't , I know you know of him or maybe y'all are really good friends .
Speaker 1Yeah , we're from the same hometown .
Speaker 2Oh see , I didn't realize that . Okay , I feel like everyone's connected
Vestibular and Visual Training
Speaker 2, I just don't know . Yeah , I feel like everyone's connected , I just don't know to what extent . Well , anyways , dan blew my mind because he did the whole , which I'm not saying it's not stupid , but he did the whole thing where he did the muscle test on me , on my shoulders , and he had me do the squats compared to marching , and it was like the light bulb moment . I was like whoa . And then I was like I need to know more about this .
Speaker 2And then , ever since I whether it's between dan , nick or Doc I probably like annoy them maybe , but I would just ask them questions , figure out you know who they learn from and what I really and what I really liked , even from from really everybody that I've met . But like even going from like Chris to then Dan and then now Matt and then Sean , and then even when I've talked to Dr Clark , like yeah , everybody might have like their system , but I feel like they still are like evolving their system . So it's not like they're just like stuck in a box . And you know the way I've been viewing all this stuff is I'm like man , if I can just like have a bigger toolbox , so there's just more tools that I can pull from .
Speaker 2To whether it's helping somebody on the performance side pain , I don't care Like so but but now but now I still want to learn more on the Malilo side and I do want to , I do want to do the , the PERT . I do want to do that now , Just to .
Speaker 1I want to do PERT ?
Speaker 2I know I've heard I can hook you up with that . I've heard I want to learn PERT just because I want to know what can I gain ?
Speaker 1from it . Honestly , right down in Charlotte you got Rachel Henderson . She was one of my teachers of PERT . She's right in Charlotte . All right , she's got to practice with her and her husband . She's an instructor , rachel Hendrick , I'll put you in contact . All right . Well , I'm at job . Okay , perfect . So with that . Now , how do you implement that in what you do as a strength and conditioning coach at Haas ?
Speaker 2All right , so and I know you have like your gym , but I'm saying like , obviously I don't have my own gym Like I'm . I'm at Haas . Well , I would say 80 to 90% of people probably think I'm a quack or I'm just like some weirdo , because I'm like viewing things from a different lens and I really don't care . That's what . I want to be .
Speaker 2I'm fine , yeah , but yeah . But where I've had to , like I would be like man , I've seen like all these great things and I know like these actually work , but if people don't care , they don't care , and so , and this was actually like Doc the other , the this is like a couple of weeks ago we had this conversation . He was like he's like Chad , think about like the 10 principles of neuroplasticity , and I was like man I don't even remember if I've actually really looked that over and all of a sudden I like looked it over and he was like check out salience and I was like man , that makes total sense and so and so , uh and like that kind of like even grounded me more of recent . But like I just remember when I first started , I had all these ideas . I would tell the guys about it and they're just like this sounds stupid , that's not going to work , like this is . And so now , like , over time , I've just tried to like just show them a little bit at a time .
Speaker 2But but at least for the people who are willing to listen , and even myself , like it's it's been awesome , um , but like yeah , I it's , it's . It's very , very small increments , like probably the . The biggest thing I do right now is like , whether it's like the IP or posturology S stuff , I will , I will do two to three drills of whatever type throughout , like a lift , and then , just so that way I'm not like doing square one on somebody like I , I literally will just plug in signal six just because it's quick , um , and then kind of gravitating off of like off you know not or not non-traditional training . Just thinking of what I gained more from like dan , or even how he learned from like jay , or uh , you could say like then db hammer , but like that's where I've done a little bit more of like the brain friendly trading on the body with some of the just isos in that tree of isos , um , but yeah , that's uh , yeah , like I love the stuff and like that .
Speaker 2That's why I want to just keep on learning about it because , like damn it it's , it's it's been awesome , like , okay , this is a random example , but like I'm 36 and I tore my ACL when I was 21 , like my senior year of football , so that was cut short . That's why I was then GA , but this was probably like three months ago , cause I got my force plate and I was like man , I want to auto-regulate everything and I want to do some box drops . All right , this is , let's just absorb force . Well , like I was jumping off of a 48 inch box and I did it 47 times in a row and I actually could have kept on going , but I just didn't want to do it anymore .
Speaker 2Yeah , just got bored and never and never in my life would I thought that I'm 36 , could I and I I treat and I really attribute it to better system integration as well as like the training not being destructive but more constructive for my body on the brain side , and I couldn't .
Speaker 2And besides , like when , also like that first visit when I was meeting Dan , like I remember I had this like terrible elbow pain and like that's when he showed me Sean stuff , but he's like hey , lay down the table and he took me through square one and I remember if I just shook someone's hand , like my arm hurt and by the time I shook his hand , like after he did , like you know , cleared out like 12 joint actions . I was like , dude , my arm doesn't hurt anymore . I was like , dude , my arm doesn't hurt anymore . I was like , all right , I gotta learn , like yeah , so like , but but now like implementing all that stuff together , like I couldn't tell you last time I had pain . I just feel so fresh and it's like I can train as hard as I want or it's not well , I know , I know , yeah but it's just .
Speaker 2I'm not saying I'm Superman , but like I , just I just feel fresh , Like I'm like man . Where was this before ?
Speaker 1Yeah , man , so are you doing like ? I mean , you said it's and I get it ? Man , it's not an easy sell some of that stuff because it's just different . And and you know , I have some interns with me right now and they're they're asking me , they're very much into the interesting about learning this stuff and they're asking me how I learn it or implement it . And it's , you know , it's very much , it's gotta be they , they gotta want it . You know what I mean ? Cause they're not gonna , it's not gonna stick , it's not gonna mean anything to them . If you're just trying to have to do it , so with the drivers , like , are you , are you doing a lot of vision stuff with them ? Are you trying to have to sell them on that stuff ? Again , the little bit I've seen on NASCAR training , it was with drivers and it was a lot of it with the synaptics and the fit lights and things like that .
Speaker 2Are you guys doing a lot of that kind of stuff or are you doing more ? So I want to get the syn synaptic , but kind of like when I was alluding to before , as far as just like doing a little bit at a time . I know that they would like that , but I wanted as far as like some other things . I have some other like . I'm not saying they're like that cool , but I have other things that I utilize and I'm really trying to get as much as I can out of that before I add in a new stimulus .
Speaker 2But I do like the synaptics on my list , um , but like on the visual side , yeah , we do a lot of pursuits , a lot of saccades , and I do a lot of them because again peripheral stuff yeah , well , yeah , we also do some peripheral stuff , because then I'll I'll add on with it , um , a lot of like different rom romberg variations , um , because I just want to make their eyes have to work harder in a tougher position , because again they're , and instead of me just always doing a vestibular input , because again , I know the Romberg is , but I'm just saying , like their , their eyes are constantly just getting fatigued because our vestibular systems compromise the entire time they're driving .
Speaker 1You've seen that because I know , I know Christian McCaffrey , do you see , I think ? I think there was a place in in Carolina when he was there and I know there's a place out in Colorado that he goes to . Do you see the sphere thing he does for vestibular training ?
Speaker 2I haven't seen the sphere thing .
Speaker 1Yeah , so it's for astronauts . I think there was an article online about it where he pays a pretty penny where he gets in this sphere and it spins him around , I mean like in all directions , but there's this red light that every time he sees it he's supposed to hit a trigger , and it's for vision training , but under kind of chaos and it just I don't know just what you're talking about just kind of made me , made me think about that , because you got to be able to , like you know , get dizzy or get disoriented , but then quickly be able to lock on and get back into you know , visual focus , so that that that almost sounds like it's maybe like some type .
Speaker 2I'm not saying it's exactly , but it's almost like it's some type of VOR , because they're having oh , I mean it's , I mean it's we we , yeah , yeah , we do a lot of those . Yeah , we do a lot of that . Um man , that's actually like really cool . That almost almost sounds like a like a amusement park or carnival ride . No , it is it literally is this giant thing .
Speaker 1He gets in and they spin him and he does all types of visual tasks while doing the spinning stuff , and he's the only NFL player I've seen that that does that . But uh , I think that's fascinating . It just made me think what you're talking about with doing vestibular and uhular exercise together .
Speaker 2No , that's awesome , All right . Well , now you're leading me into something , because obviously now you being a posturology guy , which I'm still very fresh , but I just remember when I was taking the course and Matt , when I remember , obviously I remember JP role , but when I forgot the other neuroscientists it was like Fitzpatrick and someone else . Um , yeah , yeah , yeah , I'm just saying with those guys .
Speaker 1Yeah , no , I have it . I have all the info I can send you . Um , I made a uh neurology of the feet , a little PDF and I can send you that .
Speaker 2Yes , it's um something if it's Patrick , but yeah , yes , well , now you're talking about that device with McCaffrey , because I've had this , I've slightly had this debate is I'm just saying , between all of those entities they're just talking about like feet and eyes to obviously handle , being balanced and maintaining posture , yep , but now and then , you know , going into the insole , like whenever I've tried like debunking those things , it's like if I try to do like any , like somewhat crazy vestibular , whether it's you know , any head position , body position , it's like I can maintain it way better . Yeah , well , now going on with McCaffrey , I feel like the work those guys proved , I still feel like you do need to work on vestibular aspects because , whether you know the canals or the otoliths , those movements happen faster in athletics than I'm just saying . Like the work those guys are talking about you know , what I'm getting at .
Speaker 1Yeah , 100% .
Speaker 2So like yeah , so like that was for a while I was just like man that makes sense about the feet and eyes , but I was like , well , hold on a second , I'm still moving pretty quick ,
Neurological Approaches in NASCAR
Speaker 2obviously , depending on what I'm doing , and like , no , I do need to still like work a little bit of this dealer .
Speaker 1No , yeah , again , for me , I take this kind of view on things from ito portal uh , we're , we're humans first , we're movers second , we're specialists third . So , as a human , as a human , we have to be able to stand up and resist gravity . So that's the posturology and the things , and that's the neurology and the primitive reflexes . Then , as a mover , okay , do we have general movement capacities and ranges of motion ? And then as a specialist , okay , do we have general movement capacities and ranges of motion ? And then as a specialist , that's where , okay , now I'm trying to be more specific towards things , um , and for me , that's just how I view it . But no , you're , you're right , because I mean the demands of your sport and the speeds and the I mean the g-forces going around , the fucking turns and everything are you know , I mean like that's , that's not , that's not normal stuff . So , yeah , you guys have to do special . Yeah , that I can't imagine what that feels like on your vestibular system . I'm just getting nauseous thinking about it .
Speaker 2Um it's not as bad as f1 , but there are certain tracks where it gets up there yeah , yeah , yeah , that was watkins glenn , they're right I love watkins . Glenn like that area . It's one . To me it's one of the most fun road courses because I feel like the drivers can just like go , like they can just go .
Speaker 1I like that spot , yeah um , maybe you should go up a day early and we can meet up . And we'll meet up with dan .
Speaker 2Well , I am actually I'm gonna go I'm gonna go up a day early , I'm gonna go up on that thursday and I was gonna go go to the facility and just shoot the shoot the shit with him yeah , drink his .
Speaker 1Uh , he likes his piss beer . Um , he likes , he likes crappy beer . Uh , he's been to pittsburgh . I've taken him out to a brewery and he didn't like any of the craft beer . He likes crappy beer . He's been to Pittsburgh . I've taken him out to a brewery and he didn't like any of the craft beer . He likes his . Jenny , yeah , dr Lucky . I mean that place is right next to where my mom lives . So my mom's Dr Lucky . So , yeah , that's awesome .
Speaker 2Let me know I'll head up and visit All right , well , I'm going to be there literally in what's today , wednesday . All right , well , I'm going to be there literally in what's today , wednesday , I'll be there in eight days , eight days , oh shit . Ok , watkins Glen's not this weekend , but the next .
Speaker 1Oh , no , kidding man , that's awesome . Yeah , yeah , can you reiterate the demands you said ? What's 44 weeks of ?
Speaker 2Yeah like as soon as , as soon as , as soon as the new year kicks off , like normally it's like January 2nd or January 3rd you're starting , whether it's workouts or practices , and then we do not get done until the normally it's either the first or second weekend of November .
Speaker 1Like I thought pro baseball was crazy . That seems worse .
Speaker 2Like the only .
Speaker 1Nine weeks total off .
Speaker 2Yeah , that sucks .
Speaker 1Yeah , like the only nine weeks total off .
Speaker 2Yeah , that sucks . Yeah , the only , the only , like saving I'm not saying it's that , but like the only saving grace is like , depending on if you're , like you know , pretty experienced , established and you just know what you're doing . That's where you know some guys might only practice one or two times a week at most . Okay , have you know , maybe up to two to three off days , go perform on Sunday and then you repeat it . So like that's kind of the I guess I'm not saying it's that glorious , but it does . It is pretty nice if you're like oh man , I didn't have to practice near as much this week compared to when I was younger and trying to figure it out .
Speaker 2Yeah , but no , the the kind of going on when you're asking about the drivers , though , like these , these guys are actually more receptive , like when I have conversations with them as far as like the whole , like neurology spectrum , and that's been nice , cause it's just like the whole , like neurology spectrum , yeah , and that's been nice because it's just like oh man , at least like I would hope . So , yeah , but and like yeah , it , it just , it just makes my life a little bit better because , like , there's times where I'm like I'm racking my brain . I'm like I know I could either do this , this or this , but I just know yours not there yet , and then slowly spoon feeding them . They're like all right , show me . And I'm like , yes , I will .
Speaker 1You , you . I mean both of us have taken IP and posturology , so we know those tests . But do you have now , based off of your your time studying under Dan and Dr Lucky and and Matt and stuff , have you come up with your own kind of neurology tests to to go with ? That's a little more , maybe a little more specific for for the drivers and stuff like that ? You know what I mean .
Speaker 2Yeah , I have like my own little test that I do the and you'll find this shocking , but maybe not like the very first one I do is I just have them roll out their feet with the neuro spike ball . Yeah , and almost everybody sucks with it Super ticklish , super ticklish , or they're . They just cannot stand it at all . And it's crazy because there'll be times where they're like , wow , my back really hurts and I'm like this is like early on when I like first met and I'm like , wow , no wonder why . Early on when I like first met them , I'm like , wow , no wonder why , like literally everything is so overactive and you can't ever truly relax . No wonder why your back hurts like have you got any have you ?
Speaker 1have you won any drivers over and gotten them into the postural insoles or anything ? Uh , yes , there is one guy , yes , yes , any feedback or stories with that guy ?
Speaker 2No . So he's a slightly odd like . He's not an odd case like great guy . I'm just making sure I don't add names . The problem it's not even a problem . I just know how he's wired . And the issue I've run into and this is why I'm now going down this other rabbit hole is he's very it's not dependent . He respects what , like , the medical staff tells him . So if you're in any type of medical position , whatever they're saying , it's going to trump what a strength and conditioning coach tells you . And so I was
Year-Round Demands of Racing
Speaker 2able to get him in the insoles . But now it's like hey , I'm trying to convince you on footwear , that's tough . Hey , I'm trying to convince you on , hey , let's try this . Ah , but I was told by this specialist I need to do this . All right , well , do what I can . So yeah , but yeah .
Speaker 1Do the teams . I mean you don't have to necessarily get into the details but like , okay With with at least Haas , because that's that's who you've been with for the longest . You know our team's pretty good as far as meeting and communicating and you work well with the PT and you work well with the higher guys and everything's kind of a you know what I mean A nice integrated yeah .
Speaker 2I would .
Speaker 2I would definitely , yeah , I would definitely say and yes , like , since we are , whether it was Stuart Haas or Haas , overall we're really not that big , because you only have 40 pit crew members , or now it's even 10 .
Speaker 2You only have three coaches or one , like it's not that much staff , and we would always have either one , or it could rotate between , like two physical therapists on site and then obviously they have like a team doc , but like they check in constantly and the communication is really good . And the other thing is , you know , I feel like , whether it's medical staff or myself , you know , or even like whoever we've had in the past , it's like you know your boundaries and you just don't step on anyone's toes , you're not gonna have an issue . Now , you know , I feel like at the same time , it's like hey , if a player or a driver is actively wanting to just do something , well , what's the ? There's no harm in that ? But like , hey , as long as you know what they do , you do . But as , but as far as , like the communication , like having a plan like that's , that's awesome .
Speaker 2I would actually say it's probably better than college even , cause I feel like in college , like they just kind of kind of like strung out and we're literally all right there , like the training room is literally an open door to the weight room and then it's 200 feet from the practice area , like it's just all right there .
Speaker 1So the trainer's seeing you , muscle testing and square one and people and stuff and they're cool with it .
Speaker 2That that that wasn't like necessarily great initially , but now it's just . But I think now they just realize like I'm not just doing , you know I'm not doing , yeah , it's just chad being a weirdo , but he's I'm not doing any manipulation , you know . No , I'm not . You know I'm not doing . Yeah , it's just chad being a weirdo , but he's I'm not doing any manipulation , you know no , I'm not .
Speaker 2You know what I mean . Like I'm not , yeah , so like I don't use any type of medical tools . I'm like it's just yeah , yeah , yeah , but yeah , at first on the yeah , I'm not even gonna go there , but yeah , um , I am glad that , whether it was sean that figured it out I think it's actually some other people but like just Sean talking about like the muscle testing on the arm way better than being on your back , it doesn't yeah .
Speaker 1Yeah , I just had a level one course with him this winter here and he went through that and it just was so much . You know I've known sean . Uh , I put you know I met sean with with dan and stuff , 2019 and so before it was all table and now he's got the different levels and stuff and it's way better with it , with this , yeah yeah , because I feel like as soon as you're like on a table , I'm just saying on the yeah , as soon as you're on that table .
Speaker 2It's like whoa hey , that's my date . It's like ah , but I'm not doing anything with it . All right , you're right , you know what I need to get off of your table . It's just , yeah , not .
Speaker 1It's not raising the eyebrows here , but Well , good , well , hey , man , listen , I I've taken enough of your time . I know the kids are in bed , man , so I don't want to keep you up too late . But , chad dude , awesome catching up with you , man , and very enlightening Again . I've never not going to lie , man , never been a biggest NASCAR fan , never really thought too much about it . But since talking just in this conversation , man , I think about the motor learning and the different things and the physical demands , it's pretty cool .
Speaker 2Plus , you're implementing neurologyy which is always fucking cool . Yes , I'm , I'm , I wish I knew about it sooner , and I almost feel like to make this even better . You just need to get to north carolina and then we podcast , but then you can like see and you're almost like interpreting , like you're able to like just speak into the camera from what you're seeing we'll do yeah it yeah .
Speaker 1We'll do a live . I'm telling you it's .
Speaker 2It's wild because even when I've had other people come visit , they're like , wow , I never knew about and they even opened up my eyes and seeing things differently . Like it's .
Speaker 1All right , man , I'm , I'm game right . Literally the week before COVID hit , I was there for PERC level four with Dr Rachel .
Speaker 2I got to get with her now .
Speaker 1Yeah , dude , she's right there with her husband . He's a chiro , she's a physical therapist . Really cool system that they got there . She's great . Highly recommend checking her out . But yeah , we loved Charlotte . That was awesome . So definitely would love to come down . That would be a lot of fun to do like a live video podcast of that man . But Chad , thank you so much , man . That was a great , great , great talk .