Unexpected Amputation: This Is More Than a Story. It's a Roadmap for Healing

An unexpected amputation changes everything, but you don’t have to face it alone.

In this compassionate and empowering episode, host Rachael Auyer is joined by Licensed Certified Prosthetist-Orthotist (LCPO) Jason Auyer to discuss what comes after the unexpected amputation. From processing overwhelming emotions to navigating the maze of documentation, referrals, and prosthetic care, this episode is here to offer hope, clarity, and real next steps.

Jason shares insight from his work with patients and families, especially parents coping with a child’s limb loss. His message is clear: You may feel helpless at first, but you have a voice. Use it. Fight for your loved ones. Fight for yourself.

Rachael and Jason discuss the importance of building a care team, leaning on your resources, and understanding that while this road is challenging, it is not impossible. Our team collaborates with the Longstreet Clinic Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation office to support you through the documentation and recovery process, because no one should go through this without guidance. 

This isn’t just about what’s been lost. It’s about everything that’s still possible.

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Guest: Jason Auyer, LCPO, Owner of Alliance Prosthetics and Orthotics

Host: Rachael Auyer, Co-Owner of Alliance Prosthetics and Orthotics

Producer: Laine Johnson, Alliance Prosthetics and Orthotics, Marketing Assistant 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Welcome to the Alliance Gold Digger Podcast. Today, we will be discussing how to mentally prepare for an unexpected amputation. Unfortunately, you didn't have the time to consider this decision. You had this thrust upon you. So on today's episode, licensed certified prosthetist orthodist Jason Oyer and owner of Alliance Prosthetics and Orthotics joins us again to discuss how we can handle the unfathomable news that you have undergone an amputation. Whether you or a loved one is facing life after limb loss, we hope today's episode gives you strength for today and hope for tomorrow. Thank you, Jason, for joining us today. I know you have been a regular unusual guest on our podcast. And I'm sorry, as my husband and the expert here at Alliance Prosthetics Northotics, along with all of our other clinicians, I'm tapping you to make sure all of our patients have the very best information. So today we're gonna talk about a really difficult uh process, which is why we started the podcast in the first place. When we dreamed this up for our clinic, we thought the patients who one day were able-bodied or uh had uh their limbs and the next day they don't. They came in one way and walking out or not walking out a different way. And this patient population is so near and dear to our heart because how do you plan for something like this? You you simply can't. And what would you want to open our podcast with? What prevailing thought do you have?

SPEAKER_01 1:40

I think the biggest thing, and I'll kind of go back to what our goal is that we want to communicate to every patient. Uh, and that's one word, and that's hope. Yeah. Um, that this is very challenging. No one, no one thinks, hey, today I'm gonna have to have my leg amputated. No one wakes up thinking that. Um, and it is hard to even prepare for it. It is not a normal thing that, you know, quote unquote normal thing you think you're gonna go through. And so I and I say this to every single patient, every single patient that I am counseling and I'm meeting before their amputation, and they probably have just found out they're gonna have to have their leg amputated. I want to communicate hope. Hope that this is not the end of your mobility. This doesn't mean that you know there's no moving forward here. Uh, there is. Um, it can be a challenging road, but it is not impossible. So there's hope and you need a team of people around you. I know we'll talk about this. You need a team of people around you to help you moving forward towards those goals.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

The thing that's so challenging uh is because we don't have the patients in front of us, we can't look at each person and kind of say every single scenario. So I want to go ahead and prepare the listener. We're generalizing every traumatic injury is going to be a little bit different because it's traumatic. We don't know the circumstances surrounding it. But for some of our patients, an amputation was the least of their worries. They had other things going on uh besides just losing a limb. What do you want to say to those patients who have a myriad of injuries, and this is one of the many?

SPEAKER_01 3:20

Well, I think that's why you need to have a team of people. Um, there are a lot of challenges that you could be going through health-wise. Again, whether this is a uh a result of a traumatic amputation, um, you were in a car accident or um some other accident there, or hey, this was something because of problems associated with diabetes and uh dysvascular uh disease uh or an infection of something that happened. And maybe you also have in conjunction with this, you're dealing with diabetes, you're dealing with kidney disease, you're having issues with your heart. There's all these things that are going on. And so you need to have a team of people that are helping you with it because it's a lot to manage. And not just, when I say a team of people, not just a medical professionals that are helping you medically to make good decisions, but other people that can come alongside and help you just to process this and to remember it all. There's a lot of things, you know. Sometimes we go in and we talk to patients, and it can be a deer and headlight situation because maybe they just found out they're gonna have to have their leg amputated and they had just gone through a heart attack, or they also are on dialysis, which means they're having um to go to a dialysis center three times uh a week for multiple hours uh with uh within those days. There can be a lot of other things going on. And to just manage all of that, it can be overwhelming uh to do on your own.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

Yeah, absolutely. I honestly, while you're talking, I was thinking about the parents. Because sometimes we treat children or young adults, and unfortunately, for a parent to see their child in this kind of state, can you talk to parents right now if they're listening to us? What would you want them to hear?

unknown 5:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:04

I think you know, any parent, and I can say this as being a parent, uh, not that our boys have gone through amputation, uh, but we have four boys. Um we've been we've been through some scars. We've been through some things. We we have some scars. Yeah. Um, but as a parent, you don't want anything wrong to happen to your child. You would shield them from any of this. If your child is having to go through an amputation, you wish that you were the one going through that. And I think that's the thing that can be so hard is because sometimes you just feel helpless, that you you can't do anything. And again, I know that this is not the same at all, uh, but I think about our oldest uh Samuel, uh, when he was four months old, uh, three or four months old, and was diagnosed with RSV, uh, had to be in the hospital for about a week. I mean, just this little guy, you know, lying in this hospital bed, um, and they had to draw blood. And so I had to hold Samuel and they had to prick his heel, which again, I know is a small thing. He was okay, nothing. But I just remember him as a dad looking at me, not that he was speaking or saying anything, but if he could, dad, why why are you holding me? Why are you letting them do this to me? Why are you allowing this to happen? And I just felt helpless. What what what can I do? I I wish I could take it from him and I couldn't. Um, and so I think as a parent, um, knowing that when your children are going through these hard things, you might not have all the answers all the time, and that's okay. But to be there, to be present, to listen, to not have almost expectations on your kids of how they should handle it. They might process it a little bit differently than you would process it, and uh that's okay. And so being able to listen, being able to be there, and then as a parent, the one thing that we can do, even if we don't have the answer, is we can fight for our kids. We can fight that they get the best care. We can fight to make sure they have what they need. And so I think kind of being prepared on both fronts that sometimes as a parent we want to be activated and we want to do do do and go, go, go.

SPEAKER_00 7:11

Right.

SPEAKER_01 7:11

Right. And sometimes we do.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

And I need to be.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

And you need to be. And sometimes you just have to be and be there. And it seems like you're not solving anything, but you just need to be there with your with your son or daughter.

SPEAKER_00 7:24

Yeah. I want to transition to potentially uh a harder conversation is that this amputation is the result of a loved one in an accident, specifically thinking car accident or someone else, that there might be guilt or shame that they might be carrying, either they themselves caused their own personal uh amputation or the result of the action of a loved one or a complete stranger. Sometimes these sort of things carry a layer of of real grief. What would you want to say to those patients?

SPEAKER_01 8:00

I think uh first off, and this is just shame in general. Shame is not anything that ever helps. It does not help you move forward, it doesn't change anything. It really is a despair, it's a a wallowing. Um you're you're sitting in this and it's it's almost um it's it's a it's a dark room you can't get out of, and you feel like you can't talk to anyone about it. That if they knew this or if this was brought out again, that's what that shame does. Yeah. Um and it takes us away from having again a tribe, a community of people that can walk through this with us. Sometimes shame will isolate our will isolate ourselves so much that we don't want to get help. We want to do it all on our own. And we it ends up hurting us more than it does help us. So I think when you've gone through that, you analyze the game tape and you kind of see, and then one, if someone else caused it, this is what I would strongly recommend of working through forgiveness. Yeah, which I know is easy for me to say in a podcast, you know, in a second here. Yep. But forgiveness, it changes you more than it changes the other person. The other person doesn't even need to ask for it. But if you hold on to this anger and this hatred, it's gonna tear you down. Um, but then also say you feel you were the cause of it, you need to forgive yourself. Because if you continue to carry that, that is gonna keep you from moving forward and it's gonna be like shackles around your legs as you're trying to walk.

SPEAKER_00 9:36

I I love what you're talking about because I think this applies to those who are undergoing amputation and those who are not. So if someone heard this podcast and they're not even a patient of ours and they needed a little reminder of how important forgiveness is, I hope it found them today. Uh I want to transition from the mindset of the grief capacity because while it is going to be a part of their journey, a patient's journey throughout this whole process, and it is like waves, it will knock you down. And it sometimes it it comes on without any warning. We want to talk about the practical stuff. There's a patient sitting in the hospital room, um, their family founder podcast, hopefully, because our referral sources sent it to them. I'm hoping we've got some strong ones who said, Hey, you should listen to this. This will give you some hope. What do you want to tell them to do? What should they do first?

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Well, I think, you know, if they've gone through an amputation, uh, they want to make sure that they are connected with a prosthetist. Um, and one of the things, and I know this wasn't your question, but I want to bring this up. If you've had an unexpected amputation, more likely than not, your surgeon probably has orchestrated to bring a prosthetist to come and meet you at the hospital, or they have a recommendation. And as much as you trust your doctor and you love them and they've been great, if you don't connect with that prosthetic company, it is okay to choose somebody else. You are not obligated to stay with the first person that you meet. This is someone that you're gonna have probably a long-standing relationship with, and you want to be able to trust them and recommendations that they're giving and make sure that they see you and they hear you. So I think having making that connection is gonna be real important. But then also knowing, too, sometimes it's gonna be very hard to know even what questions to ask.

SPEAKER_00 11:26

Right.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

It is very common when we go and meet with patients after their amputation or maybe even right before when it's unexpected, and we'll ask, hey, is there any questions you have? The vast majority of the time, this is very normal. I I don't have any right now, I'm sure I'll have them later. Yeah. I think I've heard that a hundred times.

SPEAKER_00 11:43

I know I have as well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:45

And that is okay. And once that person leaves the room or is off the phone, it doesn't mean if you think about a question a minute later, you can't write it down. And one of the things for us, we have email us questions. We'll meet another time, but um, keep that list so we can help as those come up. And whether it's a big question, seemingly or a small, seemingly insignificant question, ask. Don't keep that to yourself. Allow us, allow other people to help you along in your journey there. And then usually, too, what we will do is we will ask patients if they'd like to be connected with a peer counselor or peer visitor. And that's just another individual who can say, I know how you feel. They've gone through amputation and that you can chat with them, you can meet with them, you can ask about their story. But what I always encourage patients when they meet other amputees, whether in person or maybe they see them, you know, uh on TikTok or Facebook or whatever, right? Yeah, look to the right and to the left for encouragement, but not for comparison. Everyone's story is unique. And just because you saw someone, hey, three weeks after their amputation, seemingly they were doing backflips, you don't know everything that was going on with their story. And just like they don't know about your story. However, you can get encouragement from that individual, right? Right. Um, and so talking to other amputees is super helpful. Um, but just because they say this worked for me doesn't necessarily mean that that would be the best treatment in your case.

SPEAKER_00 13:22

And that makes total sense. I I'm kind of thinking uh we need to transition to the caregiver because if it's a traumatic amputation, typically the caregiver or loved one is the one having to make some of these calls with very limited information and they're they're navigating the insurance process typically, or they're navigating the home, return to home. What should they be preparing for? Can you talk to the caregiver right now? Tell them some things that they need to start doing, and maybe they're doers, so it's okay to tell them, like, hey, do these things, but then also speak to the person who is very overwhelmed and the thought of doing one more thing might do them in.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

Sure. I'd say the first thing is to know that you're gonna be your loved one's best advocate. A lot of times we just assume, oh, I'm sure the doctor knows this. I'm sure the prosthetist or the nurse or fill in the blank, I'm sure they know that this is going on. I wouldn't always assume that. If you're feeling that, hey, we need some more help, we need some more care, reach out, communicate. It doesn't mean you have to fix it, but if you see it, I'd say you're responsible for taking that next step to brings bringing somebody else in. And the person that is overwhelmed, I think you need to bring people in so that they can share that. You know, one of the things I believe really strongly is that we all have our own load to carry, but burdens we need other people to help us with. Okay. And so your load, there may be some things that no one else can do. You're the only one that can do it in this caregiver situation, but there's a burden of things that this is more than I can handle. And people don't know that unless you voice it and that you bring it up. I think some other practical things, talk if you're still at the hospital, talk with the case manager. Hey, what is the process for discharge? What does my loved one need to be able to do in order to go home? Do they need to go to a subacute rehab facility? Uh, do they need to go to an acute care uh rehab facility? Are they gonna stay in the hospital? Um, how does that work? Uh I don't have a wheelchair, I don't have a walker, do I need these things? Do I need a bedside commode? How do all these things uh go through and happen? And they'll go through this with you. And normally at discharge, they'll go through it. But if you have a question, you don't need to wait. You know, you know, bring this up and ask. Talk to the nurses, talk to the surgeon when they come in. Even if they don't have the answer, they should be able to point you in the right direction. Talk to the prosthetist. You know, find your people that, um, and this is what I say to all of our patients. I might not know the answer, but I probably know the person that does. Yep. And so voice that to me and let me connect you in the right spot. You do not need to do this on your own.

SPEAKER_00 16:08

And typically we use something called the amputee clinic. And so I thought maybe you could talk about uh how that even works on this podcast to just better understand what it's like after amputation. There's a healing period. Maybe talk about where they can find instructions for that beautiful protector that we put on people. Sure. And just kind of go over those next steps because a lot's happening.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

You got it. Um, and so that is, you know, any prosthetic company, and you know, uh, we we try and do this really well as we want to You mean we do do it really well. We do this very well. Thank you for the correction, is to communicate very clearly of what those next steps are. If you've worked with one of our clinicians and you've gone through an amputation, you know we left you with a whole packet of information, right? A lot of good stuff to be able to go through. But again, at the beginning can be very overwhelming with asking the questions like we talked about earlier. But you have this as a resource and you have this as a reference. But the normal standard of care is you're gonna leave the hospital and go home or go to a rehab facility. And typically, after your amputation, anywhere between four to eight weeks, depending on your surgeon, depending on how your body's healing, they're gonna try and take those staples or those sutures out. What we do at Alliance is we partner with the Longstreet Clinic physical, medicine, and rehab department, and we do an amputee clinic with them. And what that is, it's just a time where us as the prosthetist and uh Dr. O'Shery, Holly Archer as the physicians, um, that they are meeting, we're meeting with you to talk about next steps with your prosthesis, to start some of the documentation process so that when you are healed up and the staples are removed, we're not waiting multiple weeks or months to fit you with your prosthesis. We can do that a little bit faster. So a lot of times patients will wonder, well, why do I need to go to this appointment when I still have my staples in? We're not fitting you with the prosthesis at the appointment, but we're starting the process. I think everyone understands, you know, there's positives and negatives to insurance, you know, uh thankful for insurance that it helps with uh carrying the cost with a lot of these things, but there's also a lot of documentation that is needed. And so we want to start that early on. The other thing is that we're gonna help to kind of connect you with some different physical therapy options. Uh, just because you get fit with a prosthesis does not mean you just put it on and you get up and you go and that's it. There's no training involved. Um, there's gonna be a period that you're gonna need to go through physical therapy, sometimes before and definitely after you have um received your prosthesis to understand how to utilize it.

SPEAKER_00 18:46

No, that's so helpful. Thank you for connecting the dots. I I was wondering if we could kind of run through the inspiring stories, because that's the thing I think patients who are sitting in a hospital room, I'm hoping that they saw you face to face, or one of our certified clinicians has come in, but maybe they didn't. Maybe they were referred somewhere else and they're finding this randomly. They need to hear some hope, some stories, some people. You carry so many great stories with you. Who are you thinking about sharing about today?

SPEAKER_01 19:19

Yeah. Well, I have one uh individual and I met him. I still remember I met him in the in the hospital after his amputation. He was at inpatient rehab, and this was back a few years ago when Georgia was playing Alabama um in the SEC championship game. Yeah. Uh and my guy here, I'm not gonna say his name, but he is a bulldog through and through. And so, you know, we kind of talked about that a little bit, but he had a lot of health concerns, um, a lot of issues. Um, he ended up having his leg amputated after some complications uh with uh a back surgery that I won't go through the whole detail, but he had his leg amputated below his knee. He also had some weakness on his other side that um needed uh him to have support uh with an orthotic brace uh to help with drop foot on the other side. And so again, when I saw him, a lot of health concerns, some kidney issues, some heart issues. I mean, there's a lot of things that were going on. And he is uh someone just a super guy, and he knows everybody. And so uh if I ever needed help with something at my house, like I know who he is because we use him all the time.

SPEAKER_00 20:23

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 20:23

He would, oh, I got a guy for that, I got I got a guy for that. And so he would start to set some some goals, some things that he wanted to do. He lives uh on on a farm, takes care of cattle, um, need to get in his bobcat again. Yep, needs to get on his tractor again, needs to be able to walk from the house to the barn, loves to go fishing, wanted to be able to get on, walk on a dock to be able to get in into a boat. And a step forward, another step, another step, he's walking to the barn, another step, he's getting into his tractor, another step forward, he's on his bobcat, you know, going and buying and settled, you know, selling cattle, um, and uh taking care of his goats and all all the things, and then he gets on his boat, right? Um, and so goal after goal after goal, he sets these goals and then he achieves them. And this is not easy. I'm I'm giving a story in you know two seconds. These are months, this is going after years. And then he was an individual that we have every year at our gold digger banquet, we have a gold digger of the year. Um, and it's the person that we think over this past year best exemplified what it means to be a gold digger, that they have a clear vision and view of what they want to go after and have the grit and the tenacity to achieve that. Um, and we celebrate it because it is amazing uh to be able to see. That's one one story that that I was thinking of. Another story is that this this is another individual, he he also, I guess a common theme loves his you know track. And he loves his equipment. But he came in at the amputee clinic when I saw him, and I'd even talked about our gold digger process. We hadn't even gone through it. He gave me a piece of paper with 15 goals written down on there. I won't go through all of them, but there was a bunch of different goals, everything from um again, uh being able to drive his zero-turn lawnmower again, being able to uh chop wood um on his own. This is a guy who's in his mid-70s, lost his leg above his knee and is walking around. He comes in the office often. And again, he just happened to be another one of our gold digger of the year uh uh uh individuals that we're able to celebrate. And what I love about both of those stories, these two individuals, they come in with their wives. We talked about a support system. Yeah, they come in with their wives to just about every appointment. Um, sometimes we leave with um some extra tasty treats as they come in with some cakes and some different things that have been baked for us at the office, which we're very grateful for. But they have these two bedrock people that support them through this entire process. As much as I've seen some of the highs and lows, they've seen it all.

SPEAKER_00 23:14

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 23:14

And they have stood by them and encouraged them and not put unrealistic expectations on them, but maybe push them along maybe a little bit further of where they thought they could go on their own. And with that team, these individuals were able to accomplish so much more than they would have when no one was there with them. And so the support team around them, family probably being the most important, is so vital and key so that we can celebrate these kinds of stories.

SPEAKER_00 23:44

And I I love that you brought up those two gentlemen. I know exactly who they are because their wives are amazing, plus, they're also great guys. Um I was thinking about how amazing our team is, though, when you don't have the family or when your loved one or caregiver you feel a little bit underappreciated or unseen. What are some things that you think we do really well? This is your opportunity to brag on your clinical team and your admin team and your compliance team, that they do really well to make sure patients feel like they have the family experience.

SPEAKER_01 24:22

I think as soon as they walk in the door that they they feel valued, but that the team here at Alliance is so excited that they're here.

SPEAKER_00 24:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:33

Uh, that there are big smiles, that we know them by name, that we call them out. We're grateful that they're here. We might come out and you know, get a cup of coffee for them or get some snacks or some something to drink. Um, we ask about their family, um, what's going on there. Um, I have I have certain patients that when they come in and they only see me, they're wondering, where where was Lane? Where where was where was Letty? How come Cindy's you know not here? They have relationships with our patient care coordinators because those individuals on our team, and I'll brag about them, have been just as vital to their rehab, just as vital as them achieving goals as what I've done with fitting them with a prosthesis. Um, and so I think that that is one thing. They've also seen when maybe insurance is pushing back, they've seen a team that is willing to go to bat and to fight. We got some bulldogs on our team.

SPEAKER_00 25:26

We do.

SPEAKER_01 25:26

Right?

SPEAKER_00 25:27

That they're not don't mess with them.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

Don't mess with them. Um, I don't mess with them. Um that well, I yeah. Um, but you know, these individuals are gonna make sure anything that they can do so that your device is covered appropriately with what your insurance is supposed to do. Um and I think that's a way that we show patients that we care about them because we're gonna fight for them as if it was our son, our daughter, our spouse, our grandfather, our grandmother, uh anywhere in between. And I think as far as with our clinicians of how we care for patients really well, um, you're not just a number. You're not just another amputee, you're not just uh another patient visit. Uh you have a name, you have a story, um, you have goals, you have aspirations, and we want to know that. We want to see you, we want to know you, and we want to partner with you to go after those things so that you can honestly say, Hey, you know what, I wouldn't wish this on anybody of going through this amputation. In the end, I would love it if tomorrow my leg would grow back. However, life has still been great, life has still been fulfilling, I'm still accomplishing goals, I'm still moving forward. And that's what our goal is that as a team here at Alliance, that we're helping to facilitate that. We we don't magically do that, we partner with you because it's got to be a decision on both sides.

SPEAKER_00 27:01

I have a wild idea now, so you were not prepared for this, so buckle up. We started this company together, and one of the things that we say to everyone interviewing is that we are not a Christian company. We're a company run by two Christians, so people should experience that and the best that our faith has to offer. One thing you do, you always ask permission first, but you pray for a patient. And so I was hoping if you would imagine there is a patient who's sitting in a hospital room and they found out that they've lost their leg or their arm and they need, they said, Yeah, please pray for me. Jason, would you please pray for the patient? Imagine them and their loved one, and they just need uh to hear that there is somebody praying for them.

SPEAKER_01 27:47

Yeah. And I'm grateful that you uh asked for that for that opportunity. Um, because in the end, as much as we say at Alliance, we're on your team and we want to help with this or that, there are mountains that we cannot move. Yeah. Um, but I know a God who can. And so when patients allow me to, I love to do this because I think it makes a big difference. Agreed. So yeah, let's pray. Heavenly Father, God, there are individuals right now that maybe they're lying in a hospital bed and they're wondering, how am I gonna be able to go on? They're wondering and they're thinking, should I even continue to go on? I won't be able to do the things I did before. How can I handle this? God, I believe strongly uh that you are close to the brokenhearted. I believe strongly that you hear us when we cry out to you. Uh that you're not far. God, you say that when we go through storms in life, that you're in the boat with us. God, one of my favorite stories uh in the Bible is Jesus, when you were in the boat with their with your disciples uh and the storm was raging and you were sleeping in the boat, um, and they woke you up uh because they thought they were gonna capsize, and they said, You know, Jesus, wake up, we're gonna die. And you you stood up uh and you quieted the storm, you quieted the wo the waves, and then you looked at them and you said, Why were you afraid? And I believe the reason you asked that, why were you afraid is because you were in the boat with them. And so, God, when patients are going through these hard scenarios, you're not always going to change the storm, that it goes away. They might have to endure that storm, but they can have hope, they can have a future because you are with them, that you're in the boat with them. And so, God, I pray that you would comfort them. I pray that even though we're speaking, you know, over the podcast right here, that your presence would be in that uh room, that they would feel it, that they would know it, and they would be changed by it, and that it would change their perspective. It would change their perspective to know that I can have hope, um, I can have joy in the midst of this sorrow because there's a God who sees me, there's a God who knows me, and there's a God who has a great plan for me. And we pray this in Jesus' name. Amen.

SPEAKER_00 30:13

Well, thank you, Jason. I I do love it when you pray. Today, we just wanted to close the podcast with a big thank you to Jason and all the team at Alliance Prosthetics and Orthotics for the continued care that they give patients. Uh, if you are listening to this podcast and you want to connect with our clinic, you can call us at 770-679-3090 and speak to any of our patient care coordinators and schedule an appointment with our clinicians. But the other thing is, is if you are not connected and you are considering uh how do I find a clinic like this, you can still call us and we will help you find a clinic. We care so much about this patient population and we are honored that you listen today. Thank you so much. Were you inspired or challenged today? If so, connect with us. Follow the links in the description box below. We want to hear from you. Until next time, thanks for listening to the Alliance Goldigger podcast.