Gundog Nation
A show to bring together gundog enthusiasts, trainers, and handlers with discussion focused on all breeds and styles of gundogs.
Gundog Nation
Gundog Nation #004: Casey Maggard, 2024 UKC World Champion Coon Dog
Ken Witt interviews Casey Maggard, the 2024 UKC World Champion Coon Hunter. They discuss Casey's journey to becoming a champion, the intricacies of coon hunting competitions, the importance of dog breeds, training techniques, and the health and maintenance of coonhounds. Casey shares insights on the bond between handler and dog, the challenges of competition, and his future aspirations in the sport. The conversation highlights the passion and dedication required in the world of coon hunting, making it an inspiring listen for enthusiasts and newcomers alike.
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All right. So I'm proud to announce that I've got on the show tonight a fellow Eastern Kentuckian, also from my hometown of Hyden, Kentucky. First of all, let me tell you who he is. He's the 2024 UKC World Champion. Coon Dog winner from this weekend, Mr Casey Maggard. Casey, how you doing.
Speaker 2:Doing good. Doing good. Glad to be here. Thanks for having me on your podcast.
Speaker 1:Well, we're just a few days out from you winning. How does it feel? Has it sunk in yet?
Speaker 2:I guess you know I've had several of my buddies ask me how does it feel now, or if I've realized it yet, I guess so I've had so much support and recognition to all my friends and family. Everybody's reached out and congratulated us. It means a lot. I really can't believe it, but yeah, it's something special, that's for sure.
Speaker 1:Yes, I mean as long as I fool with dogs. I haven't even gotten close to that level in the stuff that I do. Casey, how old are you?
Speaker 2:31.
Speaker 1:Okay, I wasn't even sure you were that old, so you're just a little older than my oldest daughter, mckenna. Yeah, so what is the youngest person that's ever won the world championship, do you know?
Speaker 2:I'm not really sure, but actually you know, in this final cast here of the UK Sea World Hunt there was a young boy from Missouri made it Braxton Wills. He was actually the youngest to ever be in the final cast. He's a 15-year-old. I thought that was really impressive. He's a good kid and he's got a bright future in competition coon hunting.
Speaker 1:Well, that's one of the things, one of the purposes and you and I talked a little bit earlier but about this, this show is to to encourage young people to get into the sport. So that you know, to me I want to, I'm an old guy, I'm, I'm your dad mother's age. I know, I know your dad mom really well. By the way, we've talked about that uh, I'm actually a little younger than your dad, a little older than your mother. So, know, young people are too busy on their phones and doing other stuff and they just don't get involved and get outdoors and don't hunt. Hunting licenses are down for the youth, so it's so encouraging to see young people getting involved in the sport and in the hunting and in the competition. Do you see more of that out there?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know a lot of it is, um, I guess, passed down. You know you see more like family traditions. You know something I can relate to. You know my whole family's coon hunted for as long as I can remember that. You see that a lot. But you know any kid that likes the outdoors I I encourage them to get out and hunt or find, you know, find. Find somebody that in the in the community that hunts, say hey, I'm interested. What can you show me? What do I need to do or how do I need to go about it?
Speaker 1:as far as learning to hunt, whether it's hunting deer or hunting with dogs or anything like that, I agree, I said on the show last night I did a show with Josh Parvin and I've got four kids Gage. My youngest hunted some, justin hunted and he don't hunt anymore and only two of my kids really care for dogs, you know, and none of them really do hunt dogs.
Speaker 1:So, it's good to see. Another thing I thought was real neat after we talked Casey, you and I actually you and your dad and I grew up less than half a mile from each other.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And you still live a half mile from where my whole family has been. For over 100 years my daughter has been on that property. She's the sixth generation down there in town on that property. Man, that's so cool, that's my great-grandfather, he built that house. Okay, all right, that's enough of that. So take me through, educate me, casey. Take me through what it takes to make it, just to make it to the world champion. The levels that you have to go to. I don't fully understand all of it. Tell me how it works.
Speaker 2:Okay, the World Hunt was put on by UKC, the United Kennel Club, I guess you could say different levels throughout. You've got to win advance. United Kennel Club they have, I guess you could say, different levels throughout. You've got to win advance and move on Throughout the year. They have regional qualifying events. There's coon clubs pretty much in every state in the United States, or most of them anyway, and some of these coon clubs they'll have what they call regional qualifying events where you go to that hunt, you know, and you've got to get a win.
Speaker 2:Once you get a regional qualifying event win, then you're, I guess, you're, qualified to enter a zone, and I think they had eight zones throughout the United States one in Ohio, Illinois, michigan, south Carolina, I think, missouri, texas, um. One in ohio, illinois, michigan, south carolina, I think, missouri, texas. But yeah, you, you go to. You go to that zone and, depending on the number of dogs that have registered for that zone, um, they'll take so many winners and it's a two-night event and they primarily do it on, say, like what we call double cast wins, that's, winning friday and saturday night, um, or if not, then they'll take the winners that had the high score of an individual night, which is how I I was able to advance, and from there you make it to the top 108.
Speaker 2:Usually it's a top 100, but now I guess, just the way the numbers came out, it was 108, which was in Marshall Illinois, and that's where it was. It was a three-day event. We started with 108, down to 27, down to nine and then the final three cast. I think there was around 1,340-some dogs that were initially qualified for this year's World Hunt.
Speaker 1:That's incredible 1,300-some competitors Yep. Explain to me, for people that's never been to the event that know how it works, or maybe kids that wants to learn what is a cast, what do you do once you show up in Illinois there this weekend, what's the first event you do? Explain that to me.
Speaker 2:Okay, you know, basically at any coonhound event when you show up your dog must be registered. You know with that kennel club whether it's United Kennel Club, professional Kennel Club or there's several more. You know you have AKC, there's different ones, but your dog has to be registered with that kennel club. You sign your dog up and then they'll randomly draw out cast and in most circumstances a cast is four dogs. You'll have a guide which is usually one of the hunters. You'll go to an area you know and you have a judge in each cast which is usually one of the hunters, unless you know further into maybe a bigger type hunt or like the world hunt, for example that top 100, we had non-hunting judges.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:What does that?
Speaker 1:mean a non-hunting judge.
Speaker 2:A non-hunting judge is a guy that goes out, you know, and he's kind of the leader of the cast. You know he's a scorekeeper, is what he is, you know he makes all the hunters and the hounds have to abide by each kennel club's rules. And it's a point system, you know, and at the end of the hunt, in this situation the casts were two hours long and the dog with the most plus points win the cast and there's so many different rules into it and there's so many different rules into it. But plus points is, say, if you know you've got to know your dog by its mouth or voice, and a dog with, say, the dog that barks first, you know they're going to get 100 points.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Okay. Say, if that dog trees, then it's going to be 125 points. You go in, you score that tree and if a coon is seen, then those points are plussed. Say if this tree has a big hole in it and you don't see a coon it's a place of refuge then you get circle points. You think there could be a coon there, but you're not sure. Or if you go into this tree and it's obvious that there's not a coon in it, then you would receive minus points.
Speaker 1:Okay, now, this might be an ignorant question, but are these planty coons or live coons?
Speaker 2:These are live coons. Yeah, yeah, you're going out to. You know, just like this past weekend I hunted in forecast in Marshall Illinois and it was four different locations and you're hunting wild co in places. I've never been, yeah.
Speaker 1:So you're hunting in places. You've never even got to pre-qualify, go out and scout or anything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's 100% random, I guess, each of these casts. It's crazy how many people are involved with this just because, for example, that top 108, that's 27 casts they had to have 27 guides, 27 judges. That was people willing to take their time to come up there to help.
Speaker 1:How many people on the grounds? A thousand, probably spectators Up there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, they had the World Bench Show, you know, with it and I'd say, all in all, yeah, there's probably six or 700 people there combined yeah.
Speaker 1:Now a bench show. Is that regular, like a regular dog show or showing for looks? Yeah, yeah, okay, do you do that much?
Speaker 2:um, that's something that, um, that I haven't, I haven't done. No, I'm not familiar with it. I I've seen it and stuff. I'd like to try it, but we're more on the hunting side aspect of it, I guess you could say now.
Speaker 1:Here's what I want to get into with you and I know from being back home. You know how people you got your red bone people, your black and tan people, and why walkers.
Speaker 2:Well, I can't really answer that. You know, growing up my family, when I was little, in our kennels it was always red bones.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:And, yeah, started started out with red bones. As I got older, things kind of changed. We bought some walker dogs and that's just kind of where I am now. You know this, there's there's good ones and bad ones and all of them, but it just seemed like for some reason, you know, people prefer to hunt walker, most people prefer to hunt walker, so they they probably are more walker coonhounds than they are other breeds.
Speaker 1:All in all, is it just me? Every time I see online a championship or a champion dog, it's. That's a coonhound. It's usually a walker. Is that right accurate to say or?
Speaker 2:uh, I, I guess it is, and you know that's just probably just because of the, the numbers, you know. You know that's just probably just because of the numbers, you know. But that's a lot of people, you know. They talk about good dogs and bad dogs and they'll say, hey, I'm not colorblind. If it's a good one, it don't matter if it's a black and tan or a red bone, blue tick. You know, walker, yeah yeah.
Speaker 2:But it just seems like you know there's probably there's just there's more walkers in general have you ever competed with anything other than a walker? When I was younger. Yeah, I had hunted some of the red bones that we had.
Speaker 1:If, you don't mind, and it's about to take you a while, but go through all the awards and stuff the titles that you've won since you've been. Well, first of all, let me start all over how. How young did you start competing? I know you've hunted probably all your life, but when did you start actually compete?
Speaker 2:um, you know I probably went to my first hunt I was around 10 or 11 local ukc coon club here in leslie county. Okay, um, I didn't really go to many hunts. I went with my uncles, you know, maybe on the weekends here and there. But as I got older I got my driver's license I went to a few. But as far as you know, serious competition hunting I really didn't. Didn't go to many until probably the last. I guess the last five years or so and and again.
Speaker 1:you know we've talked about this a little bit case before, but there's, it's going to be a big money market and I mean there's quite a bit of purse, big size purses in these competitions.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Yeah, you know, just like this hunt here, you know we were fortunate enough to win $10,000. That's a lot of money, you know, for a coonhound. But other kennel clubs, you know you, you primarily hunt for money. Pkc, for example, you know they have, uh, um, you know, any weekend you can go to a, to a competition hunt where you can enter for $35 up to you know they'll have hunts $4,000 entry fee, $6,500 entry fee.
Speaker 1:So now, now, now, since I got you off track there, let's go through your resume. Tell me the titles and stuff that you've won so far.
Speaker 2:The big stuff oh well, this one here is by far this one tops the tops everything.
Speaker 2:You know the ukc world hunt, that that is that's. You know that was a goal, everybody's goal. You know, if you competition coon hunt, but other than that, um, I've won the the fall super stakes championship with, with the dog that I'm hunting now, um, that was back in 2021, that's in pkc, um. And then you know they have these other hunts, they call pro classics, which are money hunts. I've gotten the final four of those and one of one, several of them, um, I don't know, total money wise, I've probably won, I guess, 80 to 90 thousand dollars so.
Speaker 1:So could a man almost quit his day job, or you got to keep plugging.
Speaker 2:You know there's, there's guys out there that like to own top hounds, you know, and they'll, they'll pay handlers to hunt for a living and go to these hunts. It's a I joke with my buddy all the time. You know, this past, like this past two weeks, I was gone both weekends and I was ready, man, man, I was ready to be home after this. And you know there's guys that love to do it and love to travel, but you know, a couple times a month's plenty for me the hotels get old, don't they?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah it's. You know you put the miles on a vehicle and you're in different states and stuff it's. It's tough but yeah, there's guys that do it and they make a living out of it. If you got a good enough hound and put the time in, you're going to win, and it could.
Speaker 1:It could pay your way, that's for sure I assume that you always handle your own dogs correct?
Speaker 2:um well, it's more of a family type thing. You know, my, my uncle, jack, he, he actually he, everything that I hunt, he he owns.
Speaker 1:But okay, do you, do you take turns handling, or or does one of you handle the competition?
Speaker 2:Jack don't really competition hunt much anymore. He keeps up with it a lot, you know. But as far as that, no, we actually have another fellow that hunts for us too. His name is Eric Pied. He lives in southern Ohio and he's been very successful over the years and you know it's either him or myself. You know he has a dog up there. He's hunting right now and I have this female that I'm hunting. But you know we've traded back and forth and stuff.
Speaker 1:Interesting. Those dogs adapt pretty easy to different handlers.
Speaker 2:No, no, that's kind of. You know, a lot of people ask me about this, this dog here, lacy, how she is towards other people and you know I I guess when we first got her she's just she wasn't used to someone else. You know that she was used to the people that had her then and it took her a while to really come around to me and she's still that way to this day. Um, my buddy eric, there, she, she likes him. You know there's certain people that she don't like. She, she enjoys, she likes my wife. I always say that she likes women better, better than she does men. Yeah, seem like I don't know anymore. Most of these, these hounds are. They've changed a lot, you know, they're more. I can't really explain it, but I guess they're more worried about who's taking care of them every day. That's who they want to perform for.
Speaker 1:That's interesting because you know some of those old dogs, those lions, are just bred to hunt and that's all they cared about.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Is that fair to say?
Speaker 2:Yeah, but now you know it's crazy, man. If you sit down and you pay attention to a dog and you spend a lot of time with it, they've got a personality you know, and they they want to please you. And when you form, form that bond with the dog, it just makes it that much better.
Speaker 1:See, that's me, I, I, I trained retrievers and hunt with them and stuff too, and to me that's what it's all about. Is that bond you build as a team.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Yep, in the retriever world you're always communicating with your dog at a distance. You're casting it left, right back, you know to go find birds. Anyway, I know there's a lot of similarities in dog training. I'm sure you and I probably have some of the same philosophies, but then when you get a little more advanced, the treeing and the retrieving is a whole different way of a whole different method, I should say. So let's talk about your dog a little bit. How did you acquire this dog?
Speaker 2:Well, actually I was at a hunt one weekend in southern Indiana and I actually drew out with a good friend of mine, jr Gray, and you know it's rare that you go to a hunt that far away and you'll draw someone you know that lives that close to you. He lives actually in London. I was going to say Clay County a bit. Yeah, we actually drew another dog that was from Clay County over in Olnita area, a little female. She was I guess 15, 16 months old at the time, first hunt she'd ever been in man. She just put it on us and she was actually out of his stud dog, which his name is rackham willie. He's won the ukc world hunt.
Speaker 2:I told that fella. I said I don't know what your plans are with that dog, but if you decide to sell her we would be interested in buying her. And it was I guess a month or so later he had contacted me. He said I think I'm going to sell this dog if you'd be interested. And he priced her and I went straight and bought her out. You know we talked about it. We went straight and got her before he changed his mind.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's how you got her.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's how we got her.
Speaker 1:And I assume her being that young. You had to do some finished work on her, or no?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I assume her being that young you had to do some finished work on her, or no, yeah, yeah, she was. You know she's running tree and coons good and do it. You know a lot of a lot of the stuff that these dogs how you want these dogs to perform I think is you know it's genetics. You know a lot of people they breed for certain characteristics, traits, that that you want to see. And, uh, she had. She had a lot of natural ability but as far as you know, she was started well but as far as you know, finishing her up and putting a lot of hunting on her, a couple good seasons, you know that went a long way.
Speaker 1:You know, I guess, casey, like I said, I'm still trying to learn you're all's game, the the coon hunting game, because I'm I'm not versed in it. But I know you, you want to nose, you want hunt drive, just like we do in the lab world. But is speed important at all? Is that a factor in these hunts or no?
Speaker 2:yeah, you, you know I guess there's. There's kind of what people say, two different kind of hounds. And you've got dogs that are more ambush style. They're just say, if you cut one around a cornfield, they're looking for a coon that's probably on the ground or hasn't been up a tree very long. And then you have dogs that are more track minded, that they may try to tree the first coon first track that they come to, you know, and it may take a little longer. But there's dogs that do have better, you know, a better sense of smell, better nose than than others, and people train different ways for what they prefer to have now I assume there's points and how they track is there or how does that work?
Speaker 1:like if I guess I need to go watch one of these would be the best thing, but but like are they? Are they scored on how fast they get to a track? Or, once they're on a track, are they scored how fast they get to a tree? How does that work?
Speaker 2:Could you turn the volume?
Speaker 1:up a little bit, man, it's coming to get to the song. Oh, yeah, sorry, we may have to. I was going to say, should we? If it gets too bad, we'll pause and redo it. Okay, I can hear you. Good now, okay. So yeah, good now, okay. Um, so yeah, casey, what I was saying is like it, as far as scoring in a coon test, a coon hunting test, are the dogs scored on how fast they get to a track or how fast they get to a tree? How does that work?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, you know, I guess in a sense they are. It's a. It's about the dog that trees first, you know it gets the most points. And then say for like this in the ukc, the dog that trees first, you know, gets the most points. And then say for like this in the ukc, the dog that trees first, they'll receive 125 points, which you know the handler has to call their dog treat. So say, if I tree my dog first, it's 125, and then the next is 75, then 50 and 25 but so does that mean you gotta be moving with your dog, or are you sending on the gps?
Speaker 2:yeah, we have gps, but you can't tree a dog. You know you got a tree a dog based off seeing it. You're hearing them, you know, okay, not just what they're doing off gps, okay, but um, but yeah, you, you know speed does definitely matter and I guess, going back to characteristics, genetics, you know the traits of what people prefer. These dogs are bred to be independent, and what I mean by that is when you turn four dogs loose in a cast, you're expecting your dog to be out here by itself. You know, running its own track, treeing its own coon, not with another dog.
Speaker 1:You know, and I was going to ask you about that, about socializing these dogs, because I I one time I tree, I trained a squirrel dog and I was using a original mountain cur and they're kind of gamish, you know they're, they're almost pit bullish like they like to fight and another dog get around a tree under with him and it was on. You know it was a fight, yeah, but I noticed that about that breed, the mountain original mountain courage. I've never, like I said, never really worked traditional coonhound type stuff, but yeah, yeah, so but they're going one at a time.
Speaker 1:Is that what you're saying? That they're not the dogs three or four cut like at a cast is? Are several dogs turn loose to tree at a time, or how does that work?
Speaker 2:No, you're turning all four dogs loose at the same time. Yeah, you know, say, if they strike a track right here out of the truck, you know myself I would prefer my dog. They tree a coon within 100 yards. You know you want to get some of those points, but if you go in there and handle that dog you see that, handle those dogs, see that coon and recut, then you're expecting your dog to be somewhere by itself, treed by itself, with its own coon okay, now what when you say recut?
Speaker 1:explain that to me okay.
Speaker 2:So if we turn loose in a cast, the dog say if, say, if all four dogs get treed right here, you know 100 yards, you score tree, you pull those dogs off that tree and then you recut and you're still hunting, you know, within the two-hour time frame.
Speaker 1:Do you give them a command to stop treeing and go to another, to a new hunt?
Speaker 2:You know, you just go in there, you handle your dog, you know leash it up.
Speaker 1:Okay, so you physically get your dog.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've always trained, you know, leash it up, okay, so you've always been getting your dog. Yeah, I've always trained you know I'll tell my dog dead, you know, so they, they know that means to to not stop tree. And and once you recut, you know this is another, another training tool. You've got to practice. You teach those dogs not to go back to that tree. They got to know to go on to find another track another tree.
Speaker 1:Okay, and that just takes practice, repetition. Yep, a lot of it. I was going to ask you what was it? Oh, yes, so you know, at least I know, like, where you and I are from, and you run dogs back home, man, they're on some steep terrain. What do you do to keep your dogs in condition? What do you feed them to keep? I mean, how do you get your dog prep for trials and for hunting?
Speaker 2:you know the, yeah, the main ingredient in anything like this, you know is is got to be in good condition, good shape, so and that that falls back to health. A lot of tick disease is terrible within pretty much any hounds or anything. Quality of dog food and then just practice as far as hunting. But around here it's difficult to hunt man, like you said, the terrain and snakes and everything else. So we do, we travel, you know, hour or two hours to go hunting where there's better terrain, better coon population, yeah, flatter land, yeah. But you know, as far as monthly maintenance, you know you've got to have your dog on some kind of tick prevention, heartworm prevention, flea and tick prevention yes.
Speaker 1:Do you all snake break your dogs? One big thing in Texas. Here they have snake break clinics all over the state, especially a lot of these retriever clubs, but not just retriever, but yeah, they're so bad here. I know back home they're bad too, but it seems like it's worse here. They have a rattlesnake vaccine out here, but I've had dogs bit and I don't see that it does a whole lot yeah, we no, we don't really train for anything like that.
Speaker 2:You know we try to stay away from many areas that has snakes, but you know it's. It happens, especially the boys hunt down south. You know dogs get, dogs get bit and you just got to have something.
Speaker 1:You better carry some type of medicine with you to hopefully get them through it, and I'm sure you, being a hunter, you probably can do a little bit of your own vet work there if you had to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know, traveling to these hunts, man, you've got to have a little kit with you, you know, if something happens, you've got to have a little kit with you. You know, if something happens, you got to be prepared for it. Or, yeah, there's, there's some things you know you can take with you.
Speaker 1:Just to minor, I guess well, now that you own a world champion female, I assume that your phone's gonna be burned up.
Speaker 2:People wanting puppies yeah, there's been several people ask already. You know we haven't really thought much about it but I guess that'll that'll come down the road. I she enjoys hunting, I enjoy taking her hunting, so hopefully we can enjoy that for a little while longer how old is she, casey?
Speaker 1:he's five, okay, and you've had her since 21.
Speaker 2:Uh, I guess we got her in um it's in 2020. She's born in January, so I think around September of 2020.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Somewhere around there, yeah.
Speaker 1:Has she had litter yet?
Speaker 2:She has actually had a litter of pups. Yeah, she was bred year before last.
Speaker 1:Are any of them on the circuit yet any of those pups? They're young.
Speaker 2:I don't think they're two yet. Are any of them on the circuit yet? Any of those pups? They're young, you know, I don't think they're two yet. Several of them are doing good. But yeah, as far as competition-wise, I don't think I've seen any or heard of any report yet, but hopefully that'll change.
Speaker 1:What was she bred to?
Speaker 2:She's a walker dog down in Georgia. Yeah, he's done some winning, you know. Know, I guess we'll just have to wait and see. You know, they all don't turn out. That's one thing about it. You know, if you have a litter of pups 10 in it if you get two or three, that that makes it you. That's a pretty good percentage it's.
Speaker 1:It's true, you know I've, uh, I've did, I've talked a little bit to you about protection dogs, malinoisinois, yeah, and in a protection sports Malinois are kind of like the walkers. You know you're going to see more of those dogs being successful in competition. Their drive is just so much stronger than a German Shepherd or a Rottweiler. I've got Dobermans. They're just a different level.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely or even though I've got dobermans and it's just. They're just a different level and I don't know if the walkers and I don't. I don't know if the walkers are that much above the other breeds or not, but it's like that in the stuff that I've done in the past.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, not, yeah. I don't think you know as far as athleticism or you know as far as tracking conditions or mouth type of mouth or anything. There's no difference. It's just you know, if there's 1,000 walkers and say 500 red bones or any other breed, you know you just stand a better chance of getting more of what you're looking for.
Speaker 1:Of the coonhound breeds that you're familiar with, is the walker the most athletic in your opinion?
Speaker 2:It's hard to say. You know you see them all different breeds. You know you see different hounds that are built different. That's just like Lacey, for example. You know she's 50 pounds, soaking wet. She's a smaller type dog. Her heart's that big too. You know that's what I like about her. But yeah too, you know that's what I like about her. But yeah, you know some of these dogs, man, they get 70, 80 pound, just whatever you prefer. People like big stout male dogs or smaller type females.
Speaker 1:I like a smaller type dog that can move around good that's me in retriever world especially I'm I like upland, you know pheasant stuff better than ducks, but just for me personally, and I want a dog that's athletic, that can take the running, absolutely yeah. And to me. I've learned over the years I've had German Shepherds for years from imported stuff and the bigger they are, the more hip problems you have. Everything else goes with it, just like being overweight is a human, I think.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like it. And I had a lab, uh, female. I've got a lab female. I bet she wouldn't run. I don't know if she'll make 45 pounds. If she's full grown she almost looks like a miniature. But son her, her hunt drive is off the charts. I mean, she'd rather she'd rather retrieve a bird and breathe. Yeah, and I love that, you know. Yeah, so it is, and I assume that in the coonhound world that that drive is so obvious and you see these dogs like that tailgate drops their own, I guess right yeah, you, yeah, that's what you're looking for.
Speaker 2:You know something that's got one thing on its mind and that's going a tree in a coon. You know so if you turn it loose, it goes in there and trees a coon. You pull it off that tree and turn it loose again.
Speaker 1:It's looking to do the same thing yeah, and and you know the stuff that I fool with, you know I me personally I like find a dog that has an off switch that can like, when the tailgate drops, it's gone, it's, it's fired up and it's just wired up. But but when it's not hunting time that they can actually be calm and have some sense. Yeah, you see that a lot in the coon hounds breeds oh yeah, you know, especially in different breeds.
Speaker 2:You know, some dogs are just wired different. I guess it falls back to genetics. You know, some they're just, they're more naturally hyper, I guess you could say, and some are more laid back yeah, yeah, it's definitely like getting in retriever world and that falls back to everything as far as kennel manners you know, and how, how you haul these, haul them around, you know.
Speaker 2:That's one thing that's super important is you know if you're traveling, say to illinois for example, and you're staying there three or four days, that dog's got to be able to rest good. You know and handle that trip and eat good and you know and just maintain itself over a period of time.
Speaker 1:That means a lot yeah, I, and I'm sure you prepare and condition your dogs for traveling, you know you have to be in a dog box or whatever yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:You know every you know when you're out here preparing for a hunt you or for you just got to prepare for everything you know. You got to put that dog in every scenario or situation that it's going to see when it's in a in an actual event.
Speaker 1:Do you have a? Do you have cousins or family members that are also have won championships?
Speaker 2:Um, my uncle has won. He's won several hunts, you know, in the past, and his brothers, my other uncles, you know they've also been successful. They don't hunt as much as they used to, but it's still. You know, they all keep up with it, just like this deal here, man, they're all tickled to death.
Speaker 1:I love that. Yeah Well, man Casey, I tell you I'm proud of you. You know we don't have a lot of famous people come out of Leslie County. We got Tim Couch and the Osram brothers who ironically wrote the you know, recorded Rocky Top was the Tennessee State song and they're from our hometown of Kentucky. You got to love it.
Speaker 1:But, you and I are both University of Kentucky grads. I'm proud of that. I got my youngest son's down there now, but, man, it's just a pleasure having you on here. I can't imagine being that successful at a young age, and I hope this is not your last championship. I hope to see you some more and hopefully I'm interviewing you again for your next one.
Speaker 2:Man? I hope so. You know it's. It's a great feeling to to win something like this. You know, if you're, like I said, if you're a competition hunter, this is this is the dream. You know, this is what you what, you what, you're out there all night for you know it's. It's tough to hunt and work. Man, you stay up. That's the thing about coon hunting you do it in the dark, you're not during the daytime, so it's tough to make it all work.
Speaker 1:Well, you and I talked a little bit about why I got deterred from coon hunting, and that's another reason to stay up all night, but I was telling you I hunted with some guys that we ran deer all night. Yeah, that's not what we were hunting, uh, but it, it's, it's tough, it's definitely hardcore, and not sleeping is rough too. Um well, heck, I was gonna ask you something. Lost my train of thought, but uh, anyway. Um, oh, yes. So what do you have? Do you have any trials, competitions, the rest of the year playing?
Speaker 2:yeah, um, you know, like this hunt here it was a UKC World Hunt. Actually, my buddy there I was talking about that owns Lacey's Sire. He's doing a pup hunt coming up here in a couple weeks and it'll be a hunt just for all pups that are off of him. I think we're going to go to that, and then the AKC World Hunt it's coming up. We're going to try to that. And then the AKC world hunt it's coming up. We're going to try to go to it too. It's in Southern Ohio.
Speaker 1:So they have a world hunt.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Educate me again here, casey. So you know. Obviously I'm familiar with AKC and UKC both, but it seems like that the UKC does more hunting type trials and stuff and events than AKC. Or is that how it is on the coon dog side too?
Speaker 2:or I think so. You know UKC they're a large registry, akc is too, you know, but I think UKC they, you know, just like this world hunt, you know it's it's a little more towards the coon hound side, whereas AKC, you know, they do a, a lot of bench shows and stuff like that and you actually you'll see the, you'll see that on TV, you know on ESPN and stuff. I've saw AKC bench shows and stuff, field trials, water races, all that.
Speaker 1:Well, on the AKC coon hunt. So they do live coons. Is it true hunting, or is it?
Speaker 2:staged. Yeah, it's all, yeah, every, every, every hunt. They're all you know, you're out there hunting wild coon yeah okay, yep, interest, didn't know that.
Speaker 1:I know they're different on some stuff on the yeah okay, waterfowl side, yeah, okay, um so, and will you be entering the AKC world?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, as long as everything goes the way it is, that's our plan. Yeah, we're going to try it.
Speaker 1:Make sure you let me know about that. I'll have to follow that, I will. Where did you say it was going to be?
Speaker 2:It's in Bainbridge Ohio. It's southern Ohio, I guess, but it's, I think, october 16th through the 19th, I think is the dates on that?
Speaker 1:Okay, 19th is opening day of pheasant season in South Dakota. Yeah, but yeah, I'll definitely keep in touch with you on that and see how you do. Hey, if you win that one, we'll do it again.
Speaker 2:You know what's impressive about that Lacey Sire? He actually won the UKC and the AKC World Hunt in the same year. He's a three-time world champion, yeah has that happened before? Not that I know of, um, maybe I don't think it has.
Speaker 1:You know that I recall it hasn't well, I started following your dog sire on on facebook there yeah man. It's impressive and I saw that that competition with all of his pups. That'd be something to see. He's thrown a lot of champions right, Not necessarily world champions, but he's thrown a lot of successful dogs.
Speaker 2:As far as monetary value, pup earnings, it's a million dollars. His pups has won over a million dollars. That's insane, and he's in Ohio.
Speaker 1:No, he's actually million dollars. His bus has won over a million dollars, that's insane.
Speaker 2:He's in Ohio. No, he's actually in London. Oh.
Speaker 1:Your dog's here.
Speaker 2:I grew up with him, coon hunting with him for I don't know 15 years.
Speaker 1:Who would that be? I know a lot of people in London.
Speaker 2:JR Gray is his name because all his family's from clay county okay, I don't know some of them.
Speaker 1:I I can't think of who I mean. I know a lot of grace from clay county and yeah like everybody else obviously I can't like any people else moved to london yeah, I didn't but, but that was always the trend, well, anyway.
Speaker 1:Well, hey, man, it was a pleasure having you on there. You tell your parents hello and I'll be following you and keeping up with you now that I know a famous person in the dog world, and that's why guys like me do shows, because we're not as good as guys like you, so we have to have guys like you to talk to. But, uh, man, I really appreciate I learned. You know I'm a trainer. Uh, I learned from people like you and everybody on my show. I actually try to learn something from and oh, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, if anytime you're dealing with training dogs, you know you can take something from everybody and add it to what you're doing, and it'll definitely help, and no two dogs are alike that's a fact you can have a litter and have 10 different dogs to their personalities, and it's yeah, these hounds, all these hounds, they're definitely like that. Even back to to what you're doing, you know it's, it's very relatable yeah, little quirks, little things, that something to spook them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I try socialize pups, you know, as soon as I get them, and get them exposed to every possible noise and thing that they can see and I don't think you can, there's enough of that that you could possibly do and it makes a difference. Otherwise, you, you get a dog, new surroundings and they'll just freeze and you know whatever and I'm sure you all have to do that too, right you? You gotta get those dogs used to other dogs and trucks and different.
Speaker 2:You're always hunting in a different area yeah, yeah, that's the main thing you know. Hauling a dog man, they've got to be used to that they've. And hunting different terrain. You know whether you're hunting around crop fields or in big woods or more hilly type terrain. You know they've got to, you've got to expose them to all of it and that.
Speaker 1:So in the competition you're, there's no you're. You're either in crops, timber, high grass, I mean whatever yeah I mean, I know you're probably exponentially going to timber, but I guess you see it all, don't you?
Speaker 2:yeah, you know the main thing is you know you got to hunt around woods. You know you got to hunt around trees for for dogs to treat coon but yeah but yeah, yeah, yeah, it's all different terrain and that's you know. That's one thing I like about most of these competition hunts they like to have them in good, good locations where coon population is. It's pretty good. That makes it a lot nicer, you know, when you're scoring on multiple coon.
Speaker 1:You know, casey, you know this probably better than me, I think. When a dog can see more game, it keeps their drive up. You know the hardest thing I ever did? I trained antler dogs for a long time and trained quite a few. And the hardest thing about training a dog to find antlers there ain't many of them, yeah, you know. So you might. You might walk three days and not find a shed. Well, it's hard to keep a dog's drive, you know to do that when they're never seeing them?
Speaker 1:so I'd keep fresh sheds with saran wrap or something in my pocket so they'd have a little scent on them still right if it was a fresh shed and throw it with, you know. Or of course, down here we can go to high fence ranches like I have one too, and their sheds everywhere, but yeah, it was just so hard. So when you can't, so when you take a dog and hunt it, hunt it, hunt it. There's no game, man.
Speaker 2:It hurts their drive, I think yeah, yep, and you know that's another thing too. You know you're training these dogs to focus on one thing where, whether whether it's coon or whatever else, when you've got to train, say, tree opossum, you know they got to know that they're not allowed to do that or run a deer or skunk or whatever Fox, you know they, they've got to be taught what's right and what's wrong that's so yeah, when I run beagles back home, uh, they run deer, like you know, so you have to you trash, break them.
Speaker 2:I guess kind of, yeah, yeah, you know this this day and age. You know the technology that that goes into it. Man, it's crazy with garmin. You know you've got your gps locators and your your what you use to train with. You know your shock and collars and any more. You know the biggest thing here in the last couple of years is, um, I guess, um, thermals using using heat thermals to score trees. You know you can. Dog gets treed. You look up that tree with that thermal. You can find that coon.
Speaker 2:That's so easy yeah.
Speaker 1:I remember you know I told you about the coon hunt experience and having them big antennas. You know it's transmitters trying to find those dogs and and now it's. It's not cheap either. I was just looking at garments the other day that's got the cell phone kind of tracker so track it. It's like a thousand dollars the whole the whole.
Speaker 2:Yeah they're, they're expensive, but you know they're man, they're worth it.
Speaker 1:I mean you got a forty thousand dollar dog.
Speaker 2:I guess it's a yeah, ain't much to spend, absolutely yeah, you know. You know if it's close to a highway, if it's across it, or you anymore you know these things are so clear you can about tell what tree they're on well, let me ask you this, because we talked about this earlier and you touched on it, but when we was on the phone, uh, what's?
Speaker 1:what's the most expensive coon dog you've ever seen?
Speaker 2:sale for um, I guess hundred thousand dollars would be most I've known of someone paying for a dog. But you know, you know it's. People have different hobbies, whether it's bass fishing or bird dogs or coon dogs. You know the way it is. Now, man, that dog's good and successful. It don't take it long. It can win that much and a whole lot more back.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. That just blows me away.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Maybe I'm in the wrong breed. I need this. Oh yeah, They'll come, let you train me.
Speaker 2:It's crazy. It's crazy, that's for sure.
Speaker 1:Wow, yeah, my dogs break me and, like you, fellas are making money. This, this might be, I might be on the wrong side, uh, so, yeah, I know it's not easy. I, I believe me, I, I. What you've done is a great accomplishment. Uh well, you know, as long as I fool stuff, I've never, ever even got close to that kind of level. That's impressive, very impressive. Well, hey, we've. I guess we'll hop off here and I'm going to keep up with you and hopefully I'll get to interview you with another championship. You're young. I hope you do a bunch more of these.
Speaker 2:That sounds good. I sure appreciate it. Yeahall, that's what I always say. You know people call and wish you luck in these hunts and stuff. Man, you need all you can get it. You gotta catch the right breaks and all that. I mean you gotta go your way how many people you competed against.
Speaker 1:It's just hard for me to even fathom. I mean a field trial event which is pretty high in stuff on the retriever side. Yeah, no, not that many competitors. That's just amazing uh yeah, that's, that's like.
Speaker 2:You know ukc, they put on a big hunt every year. It's in richmond, indiana. They call it autumn oaks and it's a three. It's a three, well, basically a week-long event. But you know the autumn oaks itself it's a, it's like a three-day event and all they'll hunt 600 dogs that weekend. Jeez, people coming from all over the united states to to hunt, and that just that one hunt when do you go to that one?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah, we usually go to it. I didn't go to it this past year, but normally we will go. If we don't, we don't hunt, we just go up there and hang out. You know, they've got a lot of vendors and it's just just a good thing to go check out.
Speaker 1:Well, I've got me a dog trailer. Now I've got a Jones I had refurbished. It's just a six-hole, but I've got it in good shape. So I might have to start which I ain't going to compete, but I might start heading out to some of these events. I have to take my dogs with me because I work with them every day, Right, Anyway? Well, Casey, listen, I really appreciate you taking time to meet with me and especially, hopefully, I'm the first guy to interview you after you're, you are yeah.
Speaker 1:Good, good, that's good, that's what I want. Well, hey, again, tell everybody it's your family. Hello, and man, when I get back to Leslie County I'm probably going here pretty soon Visit my kids. And I've got, I've got to look.
Speaker 2:Yet yeah, get up with me, we'll go hunting. We'll do it All right, thank you. All right, appreciate it. All right, we'll see you guys.