Gundog Nation
A show to bring together gundog enthusiasts, trainers, and handlers with discussion focused on all breeds and styles of gundogs.
Gundog Nation
Gundog Nation #013: Landon Poplin - Trainer, Guide, German Wirehaired Pointers
In this episode of Gundog Nation, Kenneth Witt and Landon Poplin discuss Landon's impressive journey in dog training, focusing on his experiences with wirehaired breeds, particularly his dog Harker. They explore the unique qualities of wirehaired breeds, the challenges of transitioning from hunting to competition, and the training techniques that have led to Landon's success, including achieving a Grand Pass with Harker. The conversation also touches on the differences between various dog breeds, including labs and cockers, and their respective training and hunting styles. In this segment, Landon Poplin and Kenneth Witt discuss various aspects of dog training, particularly focusing on hunting dogs. They explore the challenges of training dogs to be steady, the rising popularity of English Cockers in the South, and the criteria for selecting the right dog for training. The conversation also touches on the unique case of mixed breed hunting dogs, the experience of hunting cranes, and insights into professional dog training. Additionally, they discuss the offerings at George High Plantation and the importance of choosing the right gear for hunting. In this engaging conversation, Kenneth Witt and Landon Poplin discuss various topics related to outdoor activities, including the durability of footwear for rugged terrains, the beauty of photography in nature, and the intricacies of dog breeds, particularly the Drathar. They also touch on the unique St. Hubert's Field Trial, a competition for hunting dogs, and share insights on the differences between wirehaired and shorthaired pointers. The discussion highlights the importance of collaboration, education, and the joy of connecting with others who share a passion for the outdoors and hunting.
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Hello and welcome to Gun Dog Nation. This is Kenneth Witt and I'm coming to you from Texas. I want you to know that Gun Dog Nation is more than just a podcast. It's a movement to unite those who want to watch a well-trained dog do what it's bred to do. Also, we are set out to try to encourage youth, to get encouraged in the sport of gun dogs, whether it's hunting, competition, trials, hunt tests, all the above. This is a community of people that are united to preserve our heritage of gun dog ownership and also to be better gun dog owners. So if you'll stay tuned to all of our episodes, we're going to have people on here to educate you about training, about nutrition, health. Anything can make you a better gun dog owner. It's my pleasure to welcome our listeners and please join our community. All right, welcome to gundog nation. I'm Kenneth Witt, live here from Texas. I've got Landon popping over in North Carolina and we're going to have somebody on here. You know we'd like to diversify our podcast and, you know, not just we got a lot of retriever people. I'm mostly a retriever person myself and it's going to be the rest. It's going to be very interesting to hear Landon's background, what he does and what he took to the grand it's, and then what he took to the season level test, which it's going to be impressive. We'll talk about that. Before we do I just want to give a quick shout.
Speaker 1:The music you hear on the beginning of my podcast. I've never said this and I feel so bad for not giving credit, but the music you hear on the beginning of this podcast and the end is by a really good friend of mine named Sean Brock. I played bluegrass years ago back in eastern Kentucky and Sean was right across the mountain from me on the Harlan side in Harlan County and we were over in Leslie County. He's phenomenal. The guy can play. I don't even deserve to carry his case, but Sean Brock is truly just. I made a virtue of so the guy can play anything. He can go in a studio and record an album. He writes jingles and stuff and I asked him to give me a couple songs. You know studio and record an album. He writes jingles and stuff. I ask him to give me a couple songs instead of using somebody else's. The song on the intro to the podcast is some real famous guys. If you know Bluegrass, one is Sean Brock playing almost everything except the dobro is Jerry Douglas. Jerry Douglas is a Grammy Award winner. He's played for Alison Krauss for years. When you see a Bluegrass man on TV it's Jerry Douglas. He's usually playing dobro. He's the best, one of the best. Rob Icks is also top of my book. And then the banjo player on here is Scott Vestal. Only true bluegrass players know that he is, but he is one of the best, also just a phenomenal banjo player. Again, I wouldn't carry his case, I don't have that kind of talent.
Speaker 1:And then the hat I'm wearing I'm putting it on tonight even though I look goofy these headphones on too. I've got so many compliments and people ask me about it. I've got to give credit to the lady that custom made this hat in Mississippi. It's ML Provisions and you can get a hold of Mary down there. She makes custom. She learned out West. Actually I think the hat says in it uh, inspired by the West and made in the South. So she spent years out West making custom making cowboy hats and and any kind of hat she does Derby hats and whatever you want she's got it. And uh, I've got some custom cowboy hats from you know, texas and Colorado and New Mexico, and actually it was funny, barton Ramsey was talking about her and I was like, man, I'm going to check her stuff out. Excellent.
Speaker 1:And I've had people from England.
Speaker 1:I always had this hat for a week and a half. I've had people stop me in the airport. I had a guy from England mess me on Tik TOK. Man, I love that hat, you know, and he was a dog trainer. So, anyway, I will give her a big thank you and give her credit for that. All right, that's enough of that stuff and I'm not getting paid for that. That's just me thanking people that's been good to me.
Speaker 1:And, landon, man, you've been really nice to me. We talked and you messaged me on Facebook and you did something I hope everybody does. You were suggesting something for the podcast and I really appreciate that because, listen, I'm always open to people's ideas. I'm definitely not a know-it-all, I never will be, and I don't ever act that way, right? So I love when people have suggestions and I responded to him but, yes, I definitely want to have. I'm getting ready to have a gown here that has dogs, that does mountain lions and bears up in New Mexico, those plot hound kind of dogs, but they're different levels, uh, but anyway, landon, I'm gonna let you introduce yourself, tell where you are, who you are, where you're from, what you do. Then we're gonna start digging in, because you've got a very interesting history. But I'll take what I will say about land. I'm gonna brag on, before you get started, what this guy's accomplished in landonon. Correct me if I'm wrong five years.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just under five years.
Speaker 1:Under less than five years of training. When you listen to his story it will blow you away. It'll make all of us old guys or guys that's been training for more than five years feel completely inadequate. I told him I may have to go to you know remedial dog training courses to try to catch up with you, but amazing. So let's hear it. I'll talk no more.
Speaker 2:Landon take the floor. I'm Landon Poplin. I'm from Hamptonville, North Carolina, just outside of Winston-Salem going north of Charlotte. I own and operate Wirehair Outdoors. I train all breeds, obedience training, but my main focus is duck dogs and versatile breeds in the retrieving aspect.
Speaker 1:Okay, now, when you started off, were you like everybody else? You started with a retriever.
Speaker 2:Or what did you start with? I mean, growing up I always had labs. We had a few bloodhounds, a few basset hounds we ran deer with but squirrel hunted with stuff like that. But my training, when I started, almost five years ago now, I got a wirehair German wirehair pointer All right, what's his name?
Speaker 1:wire hair, german. Wire hair pointer. All right, what's his name?
Speaker 2:His name is Harker, h-a-r-k-e-r, like Harker's Island just off the coast of North Carolina, so that's where I grew up, duck hunting.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, is that? I might sound stupid. Is that saltwater, I guess?
Speaker 2:It is saltwater.
Speaker 1:You know, landon, I heard a guy oh what do they call him? The pit boss guy up in Maryland or Delaware area.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, jack.
Speaker 1:Coates. Yeah, yeah, talking about those sea ducks, I was like man, I didn't know you could duck hunting saltwater. And then I heard about somebody's lab getting taken out by a shark. I'm like, well, maybe I don't want to do saltwater, we'll talk about that too. That's interesting to me.
Speaker 2:So when you got this wire hair, when you got Harker, was it a pup? Yeah, I got him at 12 weeks old and, man, we started obedience training, this simple stuff and contacted a local pro and he kind of told me a few steps to go through and then I got into force fetch and, um, he helped me along with that and I just kind of ran with it from there, trained with him four or five days a week, and he's like man, you ought to really kind of push harker to his limit and see what this dog's all about. And then then we jump right into HRC headfirst and, man, it's been a journey from there.
Speaker 1:You need to be my tutor, Landon. So, you're over in.
Speaker 2:North.
Speaker 1:Carolina. You're just a little bit north of Boykin country. Why we're north? Why Wirehairs? I can't imagine North Carolina nor Kentucky, where I'm from, that there's a lot of Wirehairs or wirehair breeders either. How'd you find them?
Speaker 2:There's a few. I actually got really lucky. A guy I went to high school with bred this litter that Harker came from and literally just went to high school with him lives 20 minutes from my house and got lucky enough to get one of those dogs minutes from my house and got lucky enough to to get one of those dogs. And, um man, he just I wanted something that I like to be different. Yeah, I always like to be different and you know, labs are labs. There's nothing wrong with it. I have, I own one, um, one of my many dogs that I own. But, um, man, I just I wanted something that was a statement when I went out and that could kind of show off him Not nothing that I do, man, it's all him. But I wanted something that was versatile, that could track deer, shed hunt with me, pick up my ducks and geese my swan and then, you know, point and retrieve up on birds as well.
Speaker 1:You know it's funny. You say you want to be different. I know that feeling. I don't know if I always follow that practice more. I probably should a lot more. My daughter, my youngest daughter, she's getting married here in a couple days. But Maureen, my redhead, she's always like that. She researched one in Airedale which I got one last year, kept a year but it started killing deer here at the ranch. Other than that it's the best dog ever. I highly recommend them. But that's my bread and butter, my livestock here, and I couldn't have that. So Landon, your friend from high school, did you know this was hunting bloodlines and he had like champion bloodlines or was just backyard breeder? And I'm not trying to be condescending, but you know you just go grab a dog off the street. Was this a hunting back bred dog?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's strictly hunting bred. I've been researching the breed for about a year. I've been researching the breed for about a year. I've been talking to people all across the country and just kind of filling people out. I was planning on going to meet a few of the breeders, watch some of their dogs work and man, he posted those puppies on Facebook and I was like, well, I'll just go look at them, watch the parents work on the field and the water. And he showed me some videos and after those videos watching the parents man it and watching them work that day it was I said, well, I'll let you know and I called him on the way home.
Speaker 1:I said I'll be back tomorrow to get that puppy so you just filled in the blanks of where I was going. You're a, you're an educated buyer, you, you, you know what you're doing. You said you researched about a year, a year, yeah, okay, now let's, let's take listeners through, through the process, because when it the end game, the end story on this dog is is it's something, it's something here. I mean, I, I, when you told me that, I was like I thought she was joking. I was like no, that dog didn't win that. But anyway, I'll let you talk, landon, tell us, tell us how you did it, what you did um.
Speaker 2:So, like I said, I started with the local pro there at home and, um, if anybody listening knows tracy hayes or purple hayes, um, you know who I'm talking about he's a he's a character, but him and he helped me along the way get started and, along with many others Stephen Durrance and Clark Kennington, all those guys helped me a lot.
Speaker 2:Jimmy Rogers, my friend back home those are legends, yeah yeah, my friend back home. Colt Simmons, I mean, he, he trained with me almost every day and, um, they've always been an advocate of harker and I and just really kept me going when I wanted to quit at times.
Speaker 1:Um, because, those days come, don't they?
Speaker 2:yeah, trying, trying teaching him to mark was not the problem. I mean that fool can mark. I mean I run srs series with him, uh, or trials now with him, we're not having been super successful yet, but we're getting there. Um, yeah, so I would. I would train with tracy, uh, four or five days a week. Um, if not him, I train with Colt, and every weekend I was doing something with that dog in the retriever world.
Speaker 1:As far as HRC is concerned, so you just put the time in.
Speaker 2:Oh, absolutely, and we still right now I'm guiding down here at the plantation. So we'll be back home in March. So you know they hunt four or five days a week here and as soon as it's over here we'll be back home in march. So you know they hunt four or five days a week here and as soon as it's over here we'll be grand prepping. As soon as I get home and we'll be at the grand of wisconsin and in the spring um, I think it's yes, in may, this, this spring I I want to attend atlanta.
Speaker 1:You please keep me posted, because I've run around 10 different directions and I'm horrible. So now that, how many months do you stay at the plantation there where you're guiding full time? I'm here mid-October through the end of March and I mean, do you even get to go home, or occasionally Not much I went home.
Speaker 2:I did go home one day last week and that was just. I went to go pick up another dog to bring down here to hunt with.
Speaker 1:Do you run your own dogs at the plantation?
Speaker 2:Yes, sir, I have two wire hares a short hare and an English cocker.
Speaker 1:All right. So you're running harker, I assume, daily there, right?
Speaker 2:Man, I'm pretty selective now, since he got that grand pass and he did. Let's see, last year he did 187 hunts last season I'm going to probably keep that to around 120-some this year. Keep them healthy for the spring.
Speaker 1:The reason I ask that, landon, is do you feel like and I'm trying to learn this part too, I'm getting ready to find out, because my dogs just spent several consecutive seven days for several, several weeks running at South Dakota, when you're running your dogs every day like that in true hunting scenarios, retrieving birds at a at your job, when you get back and that's over and you're back to training world and competition world again, tell me, if, do you have to do tune-ups? Is there some major reconstruction that you have to do? What do you have to do, if anything, to get the dogs back into trial mode versus live bird hunting mode?
Speaker 2:As he's getting older now it's becoming easier for that transition Now. When I first started here three seasons ago, it was tough.
Speaker 1:I've always heard that from guys like you that are guides and running.
Speaker 2:What's different.
Speaker 1:Tell me what you see. That's different, that you have to fix.
Speaker 2:As the saying goes, hunting always erodes training, always. Now, granted, is he breaking on the shots and stuff like that? No. However, when I make him heel to my side right out of the dog box and I say, hunt him up, he's got 700 acres to hunt, as much as he wants to hunt. And you know, he's just, I mean you're just giving him free reign. He's just, I mean, you're just giving him free reign. Now, if I can squeeze in a blind, run a cold blind on a bird every now and then that the cocker didn't get and I can, there's the cover's thin enough I can see him the whole time I mean I'll throw that, I'll run that cold blind in a heartbeat, just just to get that little control back into the hunt.
Speaker 1:So you're doing it for control, to keep, keep some discipline.
Speaker 2:Right and you know you're finding a tiny little quail in broom, straw and Indian blue stand. So you know I get them to the area and then I tell them to hunt it up or fetch, if I know pretty much exactly where it is, and then he'll, you know, sniff around, which I know people in the retrieval world if they're listening, that they just made them cringe because you're letting them hunt at the end of a blind. But I mean, that's what tune-ups for after season or for. You know we tighten that back up before we go to the grand.
Speaker 1:How many days or so? How long does it generally take to get them tuned back, trial ready or test ready?
Speaker 2:To my standard, probably two months Wow, Two months To where he's not trying to go independent, you know, and that when we were coming through our training, when we first started all this to segue back to that, getting a bird, dog or versatile breed and labs do it too now, but labs don't test their independence as much as these versatile breeds do. When you're trying to teach them how to run, do force to pile T-work pattern blinds, forced to pile T-work pattern blinds, and then when you strictly transition over to those cold blinds and they go into hunt mode and that tail starts cracking, that nose goes down, you blow that whistle to try to get them to stop. That's another ball game when it's not a lab.
Speaker 1:Is that because labs generally hunt closer? They're just bred to hunt closer than than pointing breeds and other breeds.
Speaker 2:Um, I don't I don't think it's that. In my opinion, from my experience with the different breeds I've trained, it's just they're more independent. You know labs like, okay, yes, sir, what do you want me to do? You know they might get a little hunt, hunt savvy, savvy on a blind every now and then, but a little color correction or a whistle set, tweet them back to you. Okay, you changed my mind. Where do you want me to go? Whereas that bird, dog, wirehair, boykins, they want to go in that hunt mode and be independent and say, hey, I got this Watch and I'm like, nah, you don't quite have it yet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, that's interesting. So I've not got any experience with that breed. But you know I sent you some pictures. We did some photo stuff last week in Alabama and I sent you a picture of a dog. It's so funny. The guy said I'm going to let you work this dog and he had it stuck its head out the window of his truck. I said, dang, that's a big boykin. He said that's not a boykin and I sent you a picture of it.
Speaker 1:I'd never seen one, nor had I ever heard one. And I know my dogs, I know the breeds. I don't like you, I don't know, but I know what that breed is when I see it. And it was a the German word is Dutch like Lockhart, but basically a German longhair. German longhair, yeah, yeah. And man, what a versatile breed.
Speaker 1:We had that dog picking up quail that setters weren't picking up and were pointing and actually they weren't picking the birds up, they couldn't find them. And finally the guy said, hey, see if he'll do it, that dog picked up, he, he retrieved every bird shot but one, uh, and there were setters working it, uh, but I, it made me think about you. I was one of those inner similarities. I know it's a different breed but, uh, they're bred from what I researched and talked to him and the boy knew the guy. He works for retriever supply. Uh, really nice guy, he, he would really research that breed. But they're a very versatile use, for I mean, these are for coyotes, like they'll finish. They're so gamey they'll finish off and kill a coyote and retrieve it. I think I've got a dog that would retrieve a coyote and a quail and a dove without being mouthy and destroying it.
Speaker 1:It's amazing. I love the dog. It's calm and chill, but it'll hunt until it falls, would you think. Is that similar to the wire hairs or?
Speaker 2:oh, absolutely. Harker sleeps in the bed beside me every night, so okay yeah, when you see them, you don't think that they're like.
Speaker 1:You know how lambs are. They're jacked up, juiced up. Mine are. And you don't see. You know, you don't see that my dogs, you're not going to see that much.
Speaker 2:Right. But now I mean, when they get on something fur the fur game that's a different switch. It flips in their head. And I have a half-sister of Harker. Her name is Freya and she's rough and tough. She'll fight anything and everything. She don't care how big or little it is, she's going to kill it and bring it back to you. But then you shoot a duck or goose or whatever, like you just said, gentlest can be, bring it right to you and put it right in your hand.
Speaker 1:I mean, isn't that crazy, that dog, that they have that Distinction. So what was the first title you put on Harker?
Speaker 2:His started title.
Speaker 1:Okay, and how old was he when you got your started on him? He was like seven, just under eight months, okay, and then you went to season.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and now it was a little bit of a transition time, so he was probably, I'd say I think he was around 11 months old when we went to season, okay, and then he knocked that out pretty quick and we moved on to finished.
Speaker 1:And then after finished, how was he at the finish level? You got a finish title on him.
Speaker 2:He got a finish title. Uh, he got his finish title at 15 months old, wow. And he would at that time, uh, I don't know now, but at the time, uh, he was the fifth wire hair to ever get a finish title, wow. So the only other ones were um, jimmy Rogers put, I can't remember, but Jimmy Rogers put two on a wire here and Clark Kenton put one on a wire here, or Clark did two and Jimmy did one, and a fellow by the name of Lynn Nightdale had another one.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow. So most of those guys you know, yeah, yeah, I've talked to Lynn, but I don't. I've never met him, so you, didn't stop there.
Speaker 2:What next? No, we, uh, we kept pushing and everybody said, man, you should just. I said I'm gonna go watch the grand. They said, man, if you're gonna spend the time and money to go out there, you might as well just enter your dog and see what happens. So our first grand was in Music City right there in Nashville, tennessee, and we made it to the fourth series on our first grand. So fourth series out of five. I was pretty happy.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And he was just, he was two years old did you?
Speaker 1:did you have a lot of? I mean, I'm sure the judge's eyebrows are raised and a lot of people just freaking out that you had that dog.
Speaker 2:They're competing oh yeah, uh, they called it that grand. Let's see, they always have a new hashtag for harker at every grand. Just about, I think, that grand. They called him the hippie of the grand. You know the big old beard and big eyebrows. And so they called him the hippie of the grand.
Speaker 1:Now, how many grands has he competed in now?
Speaker 2:This past fall was our fifth Wow.
Speaker 1:So so you've got the, you've Landon. You're the only guy that's put a grand title on a German Wirehair corner.
Speaker 2:A grand pass. You got to pass the grand twice to get the title. Okay, okay, yeah.
Speaker 1:Interesting Okay. I've not got that high, so I'm still learning. You have to educate me.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, so he was. Harker was the first German wire hair to ever run the Grand, and now he's the first to ever pass the Grand Nice, as a four-year-old at that.
Speaker 1:And you're going to keep going with him. Oh, absolutely, and you do. You said earlier, you do SRS with him too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we ran two SRS this past year. He put himself out on one test and then I made a mistake and put us out on the other one, but he didn't do too bad. I mean, we've kind of created a little bit of a monster with the white coat field trial setups, kind of created a little bit of a monster with the white coat field trial setups. Um which I'm after hunting season, we're gonna talk to some pros that know a whole lot more than I do to try to fix that problem.
Speaker 1:But yeah, there's a couple guys I well one of I had on here. It's not been released yet. I had roadie best is coming out on with an episode with me okay, yeah and then I've got luke too. Actually, luke and I have been kind of like me and you. We've had to reset two or three times. I got sick there several weeks. Anyway, those guys you know, when you hear SRS, you hear their names mentioned in the same paragraph.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So being a guy that's, and you've got an English cocker too. I do Now explain to people because I'm getting ready to have some more cocker folks on here. I'm going to have Jay on here from Raglan Gun Dogs.
Speaker 1:Right Jay oh shoot, shoot, shoot, shoot. I talk to so many people today. It'll hit me in a minute, but his last name is killing me. It'll hit me in a minute, but his last name is killing me. It'll hit me in a second. But how would you compare? You've obviously got lab experience, and now you've got quite a bit of wire hair experience too. What about the Cockers? How are they in comparison, especially when you're at the plantation?
Speaker 2:The way I describe it to people is a tiny little bundle of joy. But when you say that word backed, or whatever your flush word q is, they turn into a tasmanian devil.
Speaker 1:Wow I've heard there's something to watch and work and cover man, that I mean the point.
Speaker 2:The pointers make a hunt too, but you talking about putting those birds up for clients and putting on a show. Those cockers put on a show, that's for sure.
Speaker 1:Are this kind of dramatic? Yeah, would you say. Oh yeah, I've got one coming. I don't have it yet, but I'm real excited because everybody I talk to and like you, says the same thing about cockers. And it's people that are lab guys or whatever, but now they're trying to cocker and they're all like man, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, now that I've worked here, I'll probably always own a cocker Always.
Speaker 1:And why?
Speaker 2:is that. Man, you can have the worst day and you just let that little sucker out of the kennel or out of the dog box, wherever you're at, and just I mean just watch the thing run around the field and it'll crack you up. And I mean for me if I'm having a rough and tough day training or, you know, had a tough day here at the plantation hunting. It's been hot and dry here so it's been hard to find some birds until this week. But man, they just brighten my day. They really do.
Speaker 1:They look kind of animated, you know, like this yeah, well, as far as now and so I've talked to lots of people like you about the drive, about you know that excitement that they have what about trainability? How do you compare training a cocker to wire hairs, pointers, labs?
Speaker 2:I would say the hardest thing to teach them to do is sit still and be steady. Thing to teach them to do is sit still and be steady, yeah. Everything else they soak up like a sponge. Now, when it's when it's time we're, when we're hunting in the field, she's a rock solid she'll. She'll back my pointer, she'll. If a pointer is off, you know, running through the cover, and she smells a bird out in front of us, she'll actually point. She'll back point. She'll back a pointer. She'll back a pointer. And my dogs will back her whenever she goes on point.
Speaker 1:Man, I'd love to see that. I had no idea that they would do that. I'd assume they're quartering, flushing and retrieving. I mean, it's not a super stylish point, but it's a point. So would you say, highly intelligent.
Speaker 2:Very Okay, very intelligent.
Speaker 1:Would you say more so? We don't want to offend people here, but would you say more so than even a lab? I know every dog's different right. I mean, it's like comparing people.
Speaker 2:I don't know It'd be close. Okay, it'd be close.
Speaker 1:So the only thing that you see more difficult in training them versus anything else is just getting that setting assembly just because they're such a fireball, oh yeah, okay, I mean you get a rare one.
Speaker 2:George High Plantation here has got one, and man, he just cruises right along, doesn't exert any extra energy, and when I say back, he's gone and he's putting those birds up for those clients.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, landon, I talked about this on the phone a little bit and I crane hunted back in January with a guy from South Carolina. And what I'm seeing from all my? I read a lot and follow the internet, so much about dogs. I see a lot of cockers in the South, a lot in Georgia, carolinas. It seems like that's where they're really just spreading like wildfire. Is that so? Is that what you think?
Speaker 2:Most definitely. You said it's raglan gundogs, right. Yeah, he's up's raggling gun dogs, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's up in Illinois, but I bet he sells a lot of dogs down that way.
Speaker 2:I mean he's helped the market grow a lot. And then what I tell people the queen of the English Cocker is Diane Gates, out in Grand Junction, tennessee. That's who my cocker came from. And that dog, batman, that was National Field Trial or National Champion, rocket man and all those other dogs all come from her lines and she's got some aces.
Speaker 1:You gave me her number. I'm going to reach out. Oh yeah, you know, man, I know Tennessee, especially East Tennessee, as well as I do Kentucky. Where is Grand Junction?
Speaker 2:I can't, it's about an hour, probably about an hour 15 minutes east of Memphis.
Speaker 1:Okay, is it off of 40? Or no, I don't remember.
Speaker 2:I was in Arkansas when I left and went and visited. I don't remember I was in Arkansas when I left and went and visited. So where I actually left Arkansas on the way home from duck hunting and stopped in and went to the Bird Dog Hall of Fame that's where they have the nationals every year. But when I got, when I met Diane, I got to meet John Rex Gates, which the statue in front of the Bird Dog Hall of Fame is of him. So and his, his brother, was robin gates, which is the all-time points leader of in the hall of fame.
Speaker 1:so man, what a heritage there. So I drive a lot from memphis coming out texas. A lot of times if I drive home I'll drive memphis to nashville. I'm 40, I'm just trying to figure because I drive through there a lot.
Speaker 2:Right, I have to look at it on that, okay. Yeah, I mean you should definitely stop in. Yeah, talk to Diane and John Rex.
Speaker 1:Okay, Okay, you know, I guess I was trying to think what there's so much I could talk to you about. I guess let's talk about. Do you think you'll probably take the Cochran and do tests and stuff also and compete with her too for him?
Speaker 2:I've thought about it, but I've got a young lab in training. I'm trying to get her. We're working on T-work right now and then hopefully within about another week we'll be transitioning to pattern blinds.
Speaker 1:So I'm trying to get her ready and hopefully run maybe some season tests this spring, maybe some finish tests, if I think she's ready, and then maybe so when you're buying a pup line and like a lab you've talked about, you search for the point, even the long hair, the wire hair what do you look for? Tell the listeners what you look for when you're trying to get a pup.
Speaker 2:On labs. I look for a super hot female, just an absolute, just fire breather. And then on the male side, I mean fire breather but still, you know, still is intelligent, um, and you got to have some brains about you if you're a fire breather, um. But on the dad side, I want something that's going to be cool, calm and collective, tall. I want something that can stand up at the line and look out there and be able to mark something at 400 if it needs to, or you know whatever, because essentially I'm looking for something that I'm going to run in the SRS one day.
Speaker 1:Okay, so you're looking for athleticism, absolutely. And then you know, I tell her, you know, like you're talking about the female, I always call it managed insanity. You know, like I want a dog, that's when her tailgate drops she'll do what I say. But it's managing insanity. She's just ripped up, ready to go, or he?
Speaker 2:Right, I love that. You know, growing through the hrc training with my friend colt simmons, uh, his dog, piper, um, she's a big red female and I always wanted a dog out of her and he finally decided to breed her and, uh, end up going to steve eric's dog scratch actually just passed away several months or a few months ago, um, big black male, just cool, calm, collective, went out there, hammered his marks, ran his blinds and you know just he could do it all. Um, and then piper, is that fire-breathing dragon?
Speaker 1:I've heard, I've seen that dog on some stuff. You know, I've got my first American dogs. I've had all British. We talked about that a little bit.
Speaker 2:But I've got a son of.
Speaker 1:Floyd, floyd, yep, that won. I think he won the National this weekend.
Speaker 2:He just did he sure did.
Speaker 1:And that's his second US and he's won two national champions in Canada. He's a Canadian national champion, won it this year and last year. Right, you know, I've got to hunt this dog upland, you know, in South Carolina, Dakota. I'm going to go up one more time before season's over with him and do it again, but he's got a great off switch. But gosh son, when it's birds on the ground, I mean he's really good and I guess maybe I'm used to my British labs, which I love, but he's a giant, I mean he's. Oh yeah, my male, my British male, can almost walk under him.
Speaker 1:I mean I've never seen the lab that big and I haven't weighed him yet, but I think you would like him by what you're describing. He can jump run. He's huge and he's not heavy. No, he's not blocking. Yeah, he's lean. Matter of fact, I'm laying a groceries to him, got him on 30-20, feeding him like crazy, supplementing his food with sardines and stuff, and I can't. But my buddy, who's got some of them in South Dakota, said until he gets about a year and a half old, that's how it is. He said you can't hardly keep weight on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, if you get that dog food switched over like we were talking about, you might be able to Hopefully me and you will have another go on here and we can talk about that dog food Right.
Speaker 1:Hopefully, me and you will have another. Go on here and we can talk about that dog food Right. Yes, I hope so. So you got a cocker and a kennel, more than one wire hair and a lab. How many are you running?
Speaker 2:And then I've got my oldest dog, riggs. He's a lot of people's favorites out of mine, just because he's a personality of his own.
Speaker 1:Is he the half and half?
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's half German Shorthair, half Lab.
Speaker 1:Now, that's what I want to talk about. I'm glad we accidentally got on that topic, because that's something I definitely want to talk to you about. So you've got a half breed, half and half and that dog's got hunt titles correct. Yeah, he's got a season title, so tell us about that. I mean, I assume that's extremely uncommon in the hunt test world.
Speaker 2:I think there's not many and I think there's only been one mixed breed that's ever ran the grand um. Now I don't know if riggs will ever run the grand um, just because he's. He's mostly a setup dog um. When we hunt here at home you know we're little wood duck holes and stuff like that I take rigs a good bit. He goes on my personal upland hunts because he will point and he will flush when I say his name and retrieve. He does agility work, he does dock diving and he shed hunts with my whole crew. So he's all around. Just man, he's an awesome dog.
Speaker 2:And how he doesn't get the uh he is. Let's see, he'll be seven in February.
Speaker 1:And how'd you end up with that? Was it accident, or?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was accident, um, the last short hair I ever had ever had. My neighbor and I's communication got lost one day and dogs got turned out and got gone. Oh, okay, a while. And then I wanted something to where, um, I took him on a swan hunt and he, he brought me my swan, but it was difficult for him to get that almost 30 pound bird back to me, jeez and uh. So I wanted something that was big and, you know, could do the job consistently and but also, and at that time I didn't even know he could point, it wasn't until I started running harker in you know upland training, and I just let rigs run around.
Speaker 1:He just started pointing birds uh, I didn't when you said that swam's that heavy. Is that bigger than a crane?
Speaker 2:height wise, no, I would say wingspans, probably a little bit bigger. They're almost eight-foot wingspan.
Speaker 1:Wow, and probably a little bit heavier, maybe or no.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'd say average crane is probably 25 pounds.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean I've hunted a bunch of cranes. I'll sit north of the way. They're big birds.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've never hunted cranes.
Speaker 1:I'll tell you what won once you holler at me let's. I've tried a couple places, but to me Lubbock, texas is, to me it's like the Huron South Dakota pheasant it's loaded with cranes, loaded. I mean yeah, and I've found a really good guy up there that I really like and he uses retrievers and doesn't use. You know, a lot of those dogs have goggles because they'll lose their eyes to cranes. His dog doesn't. I was like man, why in the world did you have that?
Speaker 2:I'm going to have him on there one day.
Speaker 1:His dogs. You know all he does is hunt them, so they'll duck and dive and they know to watch that fish.
Speaker 2:They figured it out. Yeah, yeah, and I watched them.
Speaker 1:Like you know, you shoot because them cranes man. They're about like Rambo you have to shoot one, eight or nine times, right? If they're not dead, they're a fierce mess to reckon with oh yeah, Anyway. So I definitely wouldn't pick up a crane that's not dead.
Speaker 2:Right, I have no desire. They're going to go for your eyes every time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but no, let's do that. I enjoy it and the meat is worth every penny that you have to spend to go pay nothing.
Speaker 2:I've had a piece of that now and that's where it's at as far as the waterfowl goes, that is where it's at.
Speaker 1:And I've not had every type of waterfowl, but I can't imagine anything better.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't. The duck don't come close to that.
Speaker 1:Now down there at the plantation. What all birds do you get to hunt there?
Speaker 2:We're just quail Okay.
Speaker 1:Don't do pheasant.
Speaker 2:No, we did do a pre-release of some trucker this year.
Speaker 1:There's been a few. We've seen around, but we haven't killed any.
Speaker 2:Well, the ones you released. You didn't kill them at all. No, we've seen some feathers and seen them running through the edge of the woods but we haven't killed any Nice.
Speaker 1:Now you also are a pro trainer, correct? Yes, sir. So I guess you compete in the pro trainer side, not the amateur side, obviously, right. Okay, landon, tell people how if they want to. I know you're probably limited on your training because you're a busy man, but if people want to get in touch with you, look up your you know contact, whatever. How do they do that?
Speaker 2:So, as far as social media goes, you can find me at Wirehair Outdoors Facebook or Instagram. You want my personal page, landon Poplin, on Instagram or Facebook. I only I am very limited to the dogs that I take. I take a maximum of six client dogs at a time. Just because I have a formal obedience session every day, we have at least typically a land and water setup, depending on the weather. I try to have three formal sessions of training, typically a land and water setup, depending on the weather. Um, so you're, I try to have three formal sessions of training every day. That's a lot.
Speaker 2:And there's some days we don't. But you know we, we might do a land series and some drill work after that. Or you know what, what have you? Just depends on how the dogs are doing and what I think they.
Speaker 1:They might need a little tune-up on something yeah, okay, um, and then so you want to come out there and hunt with you at the plantation how they do that um, just give us a call on george high plantation.
Speaker 2:We're here in garland, north carolina. I Just talk to Nancy over in the lodge and she'll try to get you penciled in. We're pretty slam full but there's a few days here and there we can pencil people in.
Speaker 1:Okay, I've not got to check that website out, so I'll go do that. But what all do you get when you hunt there? Is it lodging?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you can kind of make it however you want it. You can have half day hunts, four day hunts. We have lodging in the main lodge. We have small cabins and a quail cottage you can rent out as well, and then you know. We have our five star meals three times a day also if I was out there I I'd look like Junior Samples.
Speaker 1:I'd be about 350.
Speaker 2:If you leave here hungry, there's something wrong. Oh, how do you?
Speaker 1:stand it. Well, I guess you're walking all day long.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I probably average 10 miles a day here at the plantation.
Speaker 1:Okay, that gives me another thing to talk about. What do you wear? What kind of boots you packing?
Speaker 2:um, man, this year I've always wore crispies and um, hoka come out with a new fully waterproof boot and I've been trying it out the last week and I like it a lot so far. So far, which I mean, the ground here's not rocky or anything like that. Um, you know, it's just sandy and and grass it's hilly, but other than that, I mean I don't need something, a super stiff boot. But, um, the crispy Laponians, that's, that's my go-to. And then, man, I don't remember what series these hokas are, but it's, it's the only waterproof boot they make. Okay, um and I, I'm liking them pretty good.
Speaker 1:You know, I saw is it called on cloud?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:On clouds, got a waterproof boot. Now I saw that. I tell you and if you I don't know if you listen to my first episode with scott knee, neighbor up in south dakota. Yeah, so I didn't know what a crispy was and I'd hunted with him for two years and he'd made a post and we talked about on there. But anyway, long story short, he uh he posted about the durability of those boots and it even got some of the guys on there. So it's like, hey, man, don't tell all these people this stuff, you know, we'll give our secret away. So anyway, I was like, and I've learned that I got a pretty good discount through military, through GuideFitter, and so I've got the Laponius and I didn't know what to buy because he didn't tell me which ones and I don't think he knew the model he had at the time. But uh, I just got in there looking, reading, looking and and so I got to hunting them. Uh, last month for three days, you know, up there walking you know six miles a day roughly or something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so far I love them, man.
Speaker 2:They're tough. This is my now I wear insoles out quick. I mean I'm 6'2", like 280. So I mean I'm a big fella.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And you know the boots they're. This is my third season hunting those boots, no way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay. Well, you know, and I don't know how, I know you hunt a lot. Scott was telling me he does 105 days and it's all up. You know you are too, and he had his mileage on his watch. I can't remember what it was, don't quote me, but like 600, between 600 and 800 miles, something crazy.
Speaker 1:And you probably do that too, but now I'm, I wore them at the ranch here. I was walking an hour and a half in them for about four weeks before I went hunting, right, and there wasn't really to break them in because everybody said you don't have to break them in. No, but man, I'm a fan. I went in that we don't have it down here in Texas and y'all don't have them in North Carolina. At least I don't think those shields Texas and y'all don't have them in North Carolina At least.
Speaker 1:I don't think those shields, we don't have shields. No, I need a sponsor there too. Listen, that's right, you talk about redneck paradise. It makes Cabela's and Bass Pro look empty. And those guys told me that I was going to run to Cabela's up there in Sioux Falls because I was driving up with dogs and there's, like buddy, there ain't nothing there. You go to Shields, oh my gosh, but they. There was people by all the hunters is a day before opening day. Man, they was in there buying them crispies, it was. It was like somebody buying a half price of cheeseburgers. You know Wendy's or something.
Speaker 1:It was just, it was just going out the door, it was crazy. So everybody's buyingpland clothes, but I think you can buy stuff from Shields Online. I don't get paid by Shields, they don't even know me, but man, I'm a fan. That's a cool store. I have to check that out. Oh man, dog stuff I grabbed a leash in there. Their prices are good too. Everybody's nice. I'm telling you, I've never, ever been in an outdoor store hunting, splying, sporting good stuff that big in my lifetime. And that was just one of the stores. I mean they're all like that. They say Right, but yeah, daggone, yeah, and like GuideFitter, you know we get those big discounts, but a lot of times we're limited on the models, you know, but a lot of times we're limited on models.
Speaker 2:It might not have this model. Well, they got the new stuff that Mountain GTX they come out with this year. Sucker sold out literally in three days.
Speaker 1:I tried to get it on GuideFitter.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sold out on GuideFitter in three days.
Speaker 1:Says notify me. Yeah, those look nice. Is that the gray one? And then one had gray and had like a red on the bottom.
Speaker 2:that's what I'm talking about oh gosh, yeah, that's what I wanted plus, I just thought it looked cool.
Speaker 1:You know, and I'm an old school kind of guy with colors, but man, I kind of like that gray and a little flash.
Speaker 2:But yeah, anyway. Now those hoka boots. They're a little flashy, they're kind of like a yellowish tan kind of color. Yeah, but they make a black one too. But I mean, with all the stuff I got to wear here, the black don't really go too well with it.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, I just wonder, like them and the On Clouds too, and I've got On Cloud tennis shoes, but I just wonder if they're durable. Know, like crispies, those they're made for the mountains. I guess it's yet to be seen and they might be the best thing ever, but I just wondered how they'll be.
Speaker 2:I'll let you know how the hokas do. I mean they're gonna be, I mean walking through this broom straw and and all that all day long. I mean it's it's tough on a tennis shoe type made boot. Um, I imagine it's gonna be tough on it, but shoe type made boot, I imagine it's going to be tough on it. But I'm going to say just how tough they are.
Speaker 1:And that's what I was thinking too. And you know, I was in a shoe store, got the one was REIs or something. I was traveling somewhere and I tried on those Hoka's and man, they're like platforms. I felt like I was Gene Simmons the kids, you know with the big boots on. I was like man, these are odd. Are those sort of the boots that thick, Like those giant thick soles? Very close, Okay, Very close. I just thought it looked funny. I got the own cloud.
Speaker 2:I mean you feel like you can run forever in them, that's for sure I feel like you're barefoot.
Speaker 1:Well, that's what the guy selling shoes there told me. He's like man. But yeah, I'm dying to see what your review is here in about six months. Oh yeah, well, landon, I guess I've probably talked your head off about every subject we can think of. I'd like to get you back on here and stuff. I want to see you know how far you end up taking Parker. But man, now he's the one that you sent me some really great pictures that I posted on my social media and I give you credit for those, so everybody knows if they see my Tik TOK or my Instagram or Facebook page. Uh, man, that's beautiful pictures. And we got to talk through you. I got to meet Kenneth Laird, the artist, for he's the official artist of Delta Waterfowl Right, and, uh, I'm, I can't wait to see him. Do your dog?
Speaker 2:Yeah, he, we're trying to come up with some type of I don't know if we're going to try to get a picture of all of them together or just give him a collaboration of pictures and he's going to paint all of them, you know, as a group.
Speaker 1:Oh, oh, wow.
Speaker 2:So I don't know how he's going to do that, or we might just try to get them all together and get a picture of them. But like I said, getting that cockerel to sit still for a picture is tough.
Speaker 1:It's tough. You might have to sedate it, right, man? I forgot this too. I was really impressed and I found out who the awesome photographer was. It was you, yeah, so no, seriously, that was some great. I try really hard to take good pictures and I think I'm doing good. Then I saw your pictures went, man, I need to go back to school or something, but you did some awesome photography. If that'd be your next side gig.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can't afford another side gig.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, tell me about that.
Speaker 2:I got enough for right now.
Speaker 1:Man, you sent me some. I've had so many people bragging those pictures you sent me. I mean, I still brag on them still, you know, commenting on this stuff and my son just kind of my youngest son, just kind of took control of my TikTok and you know he knows how to do all the little hashtags and stuff. So it's blowing up and your pictures, that one. I've used several of your pictures but one of them, well, they all do well, but one's blowing up too. Well, hey, hopefully me and you get to meet in person. I go to East Kentucky a lot. My kid's still there, I'm home a lot. My kids are still there, I'm home a lot. I know it's still probably a pretty good haul from you, though I might be better off trying to meet at one of these trials.
Speaker 2:I want to go to.
Speaker 1:Wisconsin. I want to go to that one.
Speaker 2:That's going to be. They said that the Wisconsin grounds are absolutely gorgeous.
Speaker 1:What part of Wisconsin? I've been up there a lot Whistle Wisconsin. How close is that in reference to like Madison, like the University of Wisconsin town?
Speaker 2:That I'm not sure of it. I mean, it's like that southeast corner and we might have another first at that grand. My friend Tyler Mize runs a wire hair pouring Graffon in HRC. He's only a few passes away from getting his HRCH on his dog. He's going to the grand. When he gets that dog a finished title, oh man, then that will be the first Graffon to ever go to the Grand.
Speaker 1:Now I've been up in that part of Wisconsin southeast. If you're saying it's southeast, so yeah, no, that's, it'd be cool to see it. We might have to get him on there now and have a new breed yeah.
Speaker 2:He and I talk, shoot probably three or four days a week, but all different kinds of stuff. I mean that breed is part of what helps make up long, long time ago, to help make up what is now the German Wire Borner, deutsch Drathar, whatever you want to call it.
Speaker 1:Let's discuss that one second. So the Drathar, is that how you say that correctly?
Speaker 2:I've never known how to say that correctly uh if you try to pronounce it in german, it's drothar okay, like the jagd terrier is a yog terrier, that's right.
Speaker 1:Okay, so let's tell the listeners about that. I think it's interesting. So what's the? And genetically, you and I, and DNA-wise, know there's no difference. Tell the listeners the difference.
Speaker 2:So the Deutsch-Trithar registry has their own certain standards. You know their bloodlines that, I mean, are the true original bloodlines of the breed.
Speaker 1:And that's in Germany. Correct In Germany. Correct Okay, Correct Okay.
Speaker 2:Correct. So to have a breeding approved, there's many, many steps and months of waiting to find out if your breeding is approved. Basically, from the local, like your regional breed warding, to all the way back to Germany, like your regional breed warding to all the way back to Germany they have a certain set of standards of height, weight, coat. I mean, if their teeth are, I think it's, it could be wrong. I'm pretty sure it's a two millimeter leeway, you know a two millimeter overbite. They're out. They can't be bred as a Drathar ever. They can still be in the registry, but they have to be. If you were to ever breed them, they have to be bred as a German Wirehair. Wow, their standards are extremely strict, even color. If they throw a white dog, they cannot be a Drithar. The Drithar registry does not recognize the color white.
Speaker 1:Same with German Shepherds. I've imported German Shepherds. It's the same thing. Well, that sounds a lot like this too, and you may know some about this Lane. I tried for about two years because I was real into tracking dogs when the game because I you know, obviously I need them here at this ranch, but because I've got a hunting ranch right.
Speaker 1:But I was just doing it for fun and I would track for people anyway. I was trying to get the long-haired dachshund, the wire-haired dachshund, and there at that time there was a lady in canada could get them, but they would not release any in the United States. They wouldn't even sell one to you in the United States. So there's very limited ones here and I don't know if that still exists. This is around 2016, 17, 18. But do you know much about those?
Speaker 2:No, I know a little bit about the Teckles, which are very similar, very similar, yes, but that's a vicious little dog.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I tell you, I know you've probably been around over in your neck of the woods, but man, I've had some Jagd Terriers. I don't know. I don't know that there's another dog on the planet with hunt drive that high. They're almost feral. Like you can't hardly domesticate you know what I mean. Like they don't want to be, petted.
Speaker 1:really, they don't care if you pet them, feed them. You know they're just hunting. I think they're 100 pounds, yeah, yeah. And I know guys here that try to hog hunt with them in texas and you can't because they're just like a kamikaze. They're suicidal. They'll go in and get to us, kill them. It's over, because they don't have no quit anyway, they're a neat, they're a neat hunting dog.
Speaker 1:But you, you can't, you can't make one a household pet at least if I can't I don't know, maybe there's people that can but but mine were hunting dogs.
Speaker 2:I mean, if they would ever consider them a retriever, I'd probably dabble in trying to get one through HRC, because that's one thing Tracy Hayes always gives me a hard time about. He said the next thing you go and run, it'll be an Irish Wolfhound. So he's always thinking I'm going to pull something exotic out at a, at a hunt test.
Speaker 1:so I'll tell you this if that jag knows that there's blood, it'll get it. I don't care what it is, I'd like to. Yeah, I'd like to see. That'd be cool as heck, because, uh, like I said, I mean there's, there's, I can imagine. I've seen high drive dogs in all breeds, but man, those dogs are insane.
Speaker 2:They just want to kill something. Yeah, yeah and they're gamey like kill anything.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, they're funny, but they're just not to. They'll never be a lap dog, no, so yeah, so those now. So you just told me something I didn't know the Drotharn for lack of me. Something I didn't know the Drotharn for lack of me not pronouncing it correctly in Germany. If they don't make the registry, they also refer to them there as a German wirehair pointer Is that what you were saying.
Speaker 2:As far as breeding, yes, okay, they can still remain in the registry, but they't be bred um through the registry.
Speaker 1:Okay and then so no dog in the us that's registered akc can use that name. That droth are no, okay.
Speaker 2:So when once harker uh was registered through uh united kennel club and he's also AKC registered now, which was an act of Congress, but the Deutsch-Tratheur registry only recognizes NAVDA in the States as a registry, okay, anything outside of that will void your VDD registry.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:So does AKC void it.
Speaker 2:AKC avoids it, ukc voids it. You know Field Dog Stubbook when it was its own entity that would void it. So you could have them in NAVDA. And I won't go down that road because I don't test in NAVDA or anything. The closest thing I get to nabda is, um, my, my friend charles, um, uh, mr guyer, that I told you about, um, we uh he brought the saint hubert's field trial from the UK to the United States back in 2022, I think was that yeah, I think it was 2022 or 2021 was the first ever St Hubert's trial here in the United States.
Speaker 1:And it's still ongoing.
Speaker 2:It is ongoing, yep.
Speaker 1:I love to see that. Yeah, he's, and it's still ongoing.
Speaker 2:It is ongoing? Yep, I love to see that. Yeah, he's, and it's like a. The best way to describe it is like a practical hunting dog trial. You're limited on shells you can take into the field, you're quizzed on the hunting season, the hunting limits, your dog breed, that you're hunting with your gun, that you're hunting with hunter safety. They're asking all these questions just walking out into the field and it doesn't necessarily diminish your score if you get something wrong. Now you start shooting at birds and missing your dog's breaking or goes in on a flush doesn't make a retrieve, all those things. Start adding points so the lowest score wins and you and your dog working together in your own style will help you win also, which ended up being the decisioning factor with Harker and I when we competed in the first trial here in the United States and actually won the pointing championship.
Speaker 1:Now, so is that trial any breed or just?
Speaker 2:Any hunting breed, okay, but there's a pointing side and then there's a flushing side. It's like labs, all of that can go. Compete on the flushing side, okay, cockers, brittany's can go either way, and then Boykins. There was Boykins there as well.
Speaker 1:I've never heard of that. I know you gave me a little bit of talk about it, but I'm just not familiar.
Speaker 2:It's a lot of fun. It was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1:I'll definitely please keep me in touch with that too. Well, I'm going to get an education this week. I'm flying to England Friday and I'm going to go to the IGL. It's three days, Ask them about the St Hubert's.
Speaker 2:I bet they know about it.
Speaker 1:I will and I'm slowly making friends there honestly, mostly through the podcast, but I've got some of the big. A couple people I've like idolized over there and followed are now listeners and that's so cool to me, you know, because I just Right.
Speaker 1:I had one of them message me or two. Well, I've had more than that. But uh, and I was like, oh my gosh, I didn't think you knew who I was. But I'm going to go over there and get to meet people and hopefully meet more people and learn and and I honestly I'd like to see some other breeds over there besides Retrievers. You know they got great springers and cockers and you know Now there's the, the short, the wire haired and stuff. Are they Very popular in England? Do you know?
Speaker 2:I'm not sure about In England, you know Germany, lithuania, romania, turkey, I think where else over there, I mean basically just rugged country, okay, especially places that have bear and hogs. Now, those overseas, they truly use them. They might go on an upland hunt that morning, go hunt hogs that afternoon. I mean they, they're utilized to the t for exactly what they are bred for and that's why you got it absolutely.
Speaker 1:I mean, it is the most versatile breed in the world so you got me so interested in that and I just wonder do you think it's a very similar to the, to that german long hair I was with?
Speaker 2:um, I mean, from the looks of that and I read a little bit on it um, I can't remember what all they're bred with, but it almost looked like that german long hair was more on the retriever side versus. You know, it looks like the true versatile side.
Speaker 1:Okay, I see what you're saying and to me, every time I looked at that dog and it's a beautiful dog, obviously, but it looked like it had a spaniel head, the ears, the face like a Springer, like a Cocker just bigger.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it looked like a giant springer yeah, that's what I thought.
Speaker 1:And uh, and there's even some colors, there's some variations, not many. Uh, there's there's like a roan which they call a shekel or a shimmel or something shimmel or something like that, and uh, they were gorgeous, but they're just very rare.
Speaker 2:It's a beautiful dog.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh gosh it was just and it's just. It almost looks majestic, but you got me really interested in learning more about these wirehairs. I mean, I see them all the time, and are they basically the same dog as a short hair pointer? German short hair.
Speaker 2:So short hairs were bred into them further, like not that long ago. Oh okay, so that's where your white and livers and stuff like that's coming from is, when they bred the short hairs back into it. But mostly it's your what is it? It's a German word I can't pronounce. It's like Stichel, stichel, something like that, and Pudelporner. And then they bred Griffons in and then they bred the Wirehairs or, excuse me, the Shorthairs in Shorthairs were the last that was bred into them.
Speaker 1:Well see, I was completely wrong. I thought that the Wirehairs were just a different coat of the German short hair, but that's not the case. Is it Completely different breed? Wow, I did not know that. Okay.
Speaker 2:If you look at a wire hair beside of a short hair, even the DKs, which are like the original bloodline of the short hairs, all that good stuff like a wire hair is going to have a broader nose, a long bigger snout, way bigger head. Now you get some short hairs that are just going to have a wide nose, big blocky head, but it's pretty rare. So I guess a big difference.
Speaker 1:Correct me if I'm wrong. So the short hairs are more of a traditional he had, but it's pretty rare, so I guess a big difference and you correct me if I'm wrong. So the Shorthairs are more of a traditional pointing dog Right, and your dog is more of a versatile game-getter, houndish traits, retriever traits I mean that's crazy.
Speaker 2:And most people, I would say in the United States, probably where I'm from, most of everyone uses them. They use them as some upland, but mostly retrievers. Okay, water, waterfowl.
Speaker 1:Really Mm-hmm, do they seem to take to that as natural as a lab Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:Do they seem to take to that as natural as a lab, I think, if you can see any instincts where they're shying away from it early and then, obviously, you know, get them in warm water, they pick right up to it. Yes, I mean I've had one, I've had one wire hair in my training program that you know we went through forced to water and he wasn't going to do it. Yeah, so not to say he was a bad dog, but as far as waterfowl goes, he got washed out. Great upland dog, yeah, phenomenal, you know he just, he just don't like water. I mean there's just just like labs. I mean there's a lab, every once in a while, hates water.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know I've got labs that I usually try starting a shallow creek, just letting them walk around. I don't ever try to force them, but I I may have said this on one of the podcasts but I've got a pup but I've got a pup. He's about six months now, from Ireland, from Keith Matthews Copper Birch, and he's a son of a 2023 IGL from Ireland, Ireland IGL they have a different one, right?
Speaker 2:It's smaller.
Speaker 1:So got him at 10 weeks, because that's when you time, that's when you have to get them, and we just beat the deadline, you know, the August 1st deadline. So anyway, I got him and I had walked him on a dock at a lake and I turned around I heard something splash. He took off and jumped in. Well, I thought, well, I started putting my phone down. Here goes, you know, start taking my stuff where I had. I thought I was gonna go pull him out because the dock's so high. He couldn't, you know, I couldn't have reached him out and he swam like he'd been swimming all his life. I I messaged keith and I was like no, you know, no, never been in the water he followed.
Speaker 1:He followed me all the way down the bank and and I got him out, got on a boat and come back and he jumped off a boat and it pitched dark and he's black. I thought, oh hell, I've lost him. You know I've lost him. I started calling him. This is a puppy, just barely, doesn't hardly know me, barely had time to bond with me and he swam, came out to me again and now he I mean I've never seen a pup and I'm I've fooled a lot of labs uh, never seen one. Do that? You know like just seen it, seen the water just went to it couldn't. And when he got in it, you know he wasn't like just top pawing it, you know, like a dog who's not swam before?
Speaker 1:uh, they'll try to swim with their front feet. Don't know what to do with the front feet, don't know they can use their back legs. They swim like what's that dude in the Olympics, michael Phelps.
Speaker 2:Michael Phelps. He looked like Michael Phelps man. I was like this is crazy.
Speaker 1:I'm really liking that dog.
Speaker 2:It sounds like a nice one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's real athletic. If you see him right now you'd think he's a son of my Floyd dog, you know. You know that tall and lanky and I like it. But now Copper Birch is known. They're in Ireland, they're known for producing very athletic retrievers. I mean very fast, very high drive, very athletic and man. He's the epitome of that. We'll see how it comes out. But, landon, I know I've talked your head off, man and I could talk to you all night long. That's why I do this podcast and, seriously, I am going to get you to give me some education. I start trying up these higher levels or testing, you know, with these my own dogs. Yeah, absolutely testing, you know with these mom dogs.
Speaker 1:Yeah absolutely. I'm trying to title a.
Speaker 2:Doberman in PSA, which is protection sports.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to be, you know, overwhelmed, right? But yes, so let's touch base Me and you will talk offline about the crane hunting. Oh yeah, landon, it's been a pleasure having you and I'm so glad that you talked to me on Facebook. Oh yeah, landon, it's been a pleasure having you and I'm so glad that you talked to me on Facebook. People like you is why I enjoy what I do, just because I genuinely want to hear what you've got to say you know, absolutely.
Speaker 1:I mean, I've learned so much tonight and that's the beauty of what I do I learn so much. But hey, you stay dry there in North Carolina. I know you all had some bad storms there, uh, did it hit you?
Speaker 2:no, I was just a little bit east of of the mountains there, so we were, we were in the clear. We had some flooding on the big river but, um, we stayed pretty clear man.
Speaker 1:I saw a lot of videos. Me and my daughter had gone to Biltmore in August. My youngest daughter Come to the daddy-daughter trip and she showed me videos of that. It's unbelievable, it's sad. And Asheville is, you know, that's western North Carolina. That's what I never would have dreamed. No, it'd get over that far. But anyway, man, well glad you didn't get hurt down there and we'll keep in touch. But thank you so much for being a guest on here. It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 2:Yes, sir, I appreciate it, I appreciate the opportunity, all right.
Speaker 1:We'll see you, thank you.