The Real Mom Hub
Welcome to the Real Mom Hub. We all do Motherhood differently, and thank goodness for that. We’re here to talk about life. Let’s learn and grow together.
The Real Mom Hub
Episode 26: The Kids Are OK: Creating Family Culture with Sweaty Cheese & Shared Water Bottles
It's the age-old question: "what do we recreate from the parenting of our childhood, and what do we choose to leave behind?". Cally & Emily spill the tea on the family traditions and the childhood experiences that still make them laugh, cry, and sometimes cringe. This conversation is a relatable trip down memory lane for anyone who suffered through (entirely reasonable) Saturday chore lists with their siblings and survived family road trips with parents who refused to stop for fast food. Whether you're a mom who swore "I'll never do that to my kids" or someone who finds yourself accidentally recreating your parents' quirky habits, this episode will have you nodding along and laughing at the universal chaos of family life.
Main Topics & Discussion
The Shared Water Bottle Saga
The sisters reveal their childhood horror at being forced to share water bottles on family road trips, complete with Cheerio backwash and questionable hygiene practices. This traumatic memory sparks a heated debate when one sister confesses she's now making her own kids share water bottles on hikes. Fellow moms will relate to the moment we realize we're turning into our parents despite our best intentions. Family quirks become lasting memories, for better or worse!
Saturday Chore Day Confessions
Nothing bonds siblings like collective trauma, and Saturday chore day was prime bonding time. Between getting up at the crack of dawn, hauling wood for the stove, and the shocking revelation that one sister was secretly helping create the chore lists all along, this conversation was... illuminating. The sisters even call in a special guest mid-episode for confirmation, leading to accusations far and wide. Moms everywhere will laugh at the contrast between kids' dramatic reactions to chores and how these experiences actually shaped their relationships, and ultimately added positive values.
Tent Camping Rules & Family Road Trip Survival
The sisters share their visceral reactions to camping faux pas like wearing shoes in the tent or leaving the zipper open (the horror!). Their two-week family camping trips featured sweaty cheese picnics, car sickness galore, and a military-like efficiency for setting up camp. Any mom who's attempted family travel will appreciate these unfiltered stories about how a family of six managed to survive extended close quarters without losing it completely (most of the time). Their memories of finding ways to "survive" these trips together will resonate with anyone who's ever rolled their e
Host & Show Info
Hosted by: Cally & Emily O’Leary
About the Hosts: We’re real moms and real sisters. We may look and sound alike, but our motherhood journeys are uniquely ours. We all do Motherhood differently, and thank goodness for that. Let’s learn and grow together.
Podcast Website: https://therealmomhub.com/
Like what you hear? Let us know!
- Rate & Review on Apple Podcasts & Spotify – Help others discover the show!
- Join the Conversation – Join us on social (Instagram, Facebook, TikTok), or send us a message at therealmomhub@gmail.com to let us know what you'd like to hear more of.
- Share this episode – If you enjoyed it, share with a friend, tag us on social media and let us know your favorite takeaway.
(...)
Hello. Oh, hi. Happy Friday.
Happy Friday. We're recording this on a Friday.
(...)
I have a friend coming into town. I should say we-- Life is good.
That's so good. We have no plans this weekend. Nice. That's not true. We have one or two.(...) I'm stoked. I'm so thrilled about it.(...) Could not be happier.
Basically free weekend. You say that and it's different with kids, but that's great. Yeah, I hear what you're saying.
(...)
I feel like if I think free weekend, I still do this where I'll assume that I can get so much done.
(...)
I need to instead think free weekend, so much quality family playtime.
You're so weird. When I think free weekend, I'm never like, "Oh my God, I can get so much done." I'm like, "Oh my God, what are we going to do?"
That's why you're better at the early motherhood stage. I swear.(...) It's a personality thing. I don't think it suits me, frankly.
(...)
I'm loving it. It's hard, whatever. It's good for us. I think who knows.
Feel the burn as Charlie says now. Charlie says that? Oh, it's really funny.
(...)
Oh my God. Today,
(...)
a theme that's been popping up with our guests recently is creating family values, family culture, family identity, being really intentional about
(...)
how you're parenting, the family that you're crafting with your partner. We decided that today we were going to go through the things that we each(...) felt really shaped our family's culture.
(...)
I'm very excited to get your take on this because I want to know if ours are the same, different, opposite.
(...)
For those of you just tuning in, we have the same parents.
(...)
We do, but similar childhood. We were there for each other's childhoods.
Similar, but not the same.(...) Same, but different. Also, I thought it was a slightly different topic, so I'm going off the cuff a little bit, which is actually probably funny because the things swirling through my head right now are all in the moment, "Oh my God, I can't believe you're making me do this." Now I'm like, "Oh, yeah, that was character building." I'll have to think of the really intentional, warm, fuzzy ones because those are top of mind for me.
(...)
I don't know if I had any warm, fuzzy ones. Okay. Yes, let's go. I also want to know which ones you are hardcore, "Yes, we're doing this,"
(...)
in your family with Kevin. Which ones you're like, "Well, maybe we'll let go of that." We're different people.
(...)
Anyways, before we dive in,
(...)
shout out to listeners. Thanks for being here.(...) We love showing up for you guys and hearing from you. If you are just tuning in or if you've been listening for a minute and you have not yet hit that subscribe button, that follow button in your podcast app,
(...)
please do so. It actually really, really matters(...) and it really helps us out.
(...)
Please make sure that that's happening for you and for us.(...) If you're feeling like you'd like to do some extra credit, feel free to leave a review. It helps others find us and then it'll help us bring you more diverse stories from women.
(...) Thank you for saying all that slow enough for me to finish my bite.
(...)
We're doing great. I'm eating my snack.
(...)
Okay, what are you loving about motherhood?
(...)
Oh, I gave BBK a haircut a couple of days ago. So freaking cute. It's his first one. It's so cute.
(...) Not going to lie, it took me a long time to work up to it. I mean, it's the first one and I was like, "Oh, then you're not a baby."
Wait, here's the question we're all wondering. Did you keep the hair? I didn't.
(...)
I never thought I would. I just came across my little ziplock of Charlie's hair from his first haircut and I didn't throw it away. I was horrified. This is disgusting when I'm going to do it with us.(...) Because it's such a weird thing to keep, but I still couldn't throw it away. Okay, this is terrible.
I did think about it. And I opted not to. The horrible part is that I was like, "Oh my God, if anything happens to him, I'm going to really regret throwing this away."
Oh, isn't that awful? Yeah, that's not as cute as I was hoping for.
(...) Sorry to disappoint. No, I mean--(...) Yeah. Scratch that. I mean, I threw it away. Everything's fine. Everything's good.(...) And honestly, no emotions cutting his hair. I was just like, "Dude, can you please sit still?" So that to me,
(...)
I was ready. I was ready. He was a ragamuffin too long.
Yeah, he looks so handsome.
(...) He looks so handsome. I didn't like royally-- It's not my best work, but it's not bad. It's so cute. Thanks.(...) What are you loving about motherhood?
(...)
The kids are playing together more and more and it's just so funny.
(...)
So I will just kind of step away and I can even be on a different floor. And if I hear screaming, I run. But they'll be playing a game and Charlie can kind of start to understand. Nora's blabbering. There are not real words, but they just can do an imagination game together. And it's so cute. Wow. Yeah, it's really cute.
I've heard-- You know how some siblings can translate for their younger groups? Is that happening?
(...)
In Charlie's interest, yes. He makes up what she's saying. Oh. I'll say, "Do you guys want to do this?" Then Nora will shake her head and then Charlie will rephrase it for Nora. He'll be, "Nora, do you want to do this?" "Yes." And so then, of course, Nora says, "Yes." And Charlie goes, "See, she wants to." So funny.
(...)
I mean, good for Charlie.
(...)
Get after what you want, man. Make it happen. So funny.
(...) That's awesome. Yeah, so cute. Okay, what is hard?
(...)
It's not really hard.
If we're on a scale from negative, neutral, positive, it's neutral, veering towards negative.
(...)
He's just really pushing boundaries right now.
(...)
And I'm going to be honest,(...) I think it's funny. Yes, hilarious. It's healthy, it's developmentally appropriate. I'd be concerned if he wasn't. I'm going to be honest, I'd be a little disappointed if he wasn't. It's so funny. It's all well and it's all good. But it's so freaking annoying. We just house it on dad's house for a week.
(...)
And we just had to redraw all the boundaries and just a broken record(...) trying to make these scripts stick in this kid's head. And how do you discipline a 19-month-old? Somebody tell me.
(...)
How do you make it make sense to them?
(...)
I know. I was so good with Charlie about always framing it as a positive.
(...)
We sit on the couch if he was jumping on the couch. Honestly, that was more effective. But also it might have just been Charlie. I think it was just Charlie. I think it was just Charlie.
But with Nora, I hear myself. I hear myself grasps the concept and is like, "All right, whatever."
But it's when I'm like, "No, no, stop, stop." Then Nora, that's when she's like, "Hmm."
(...)
Versus if I do reframe it, we do this on the couch. She actually wants to do it. Wow, cool. I don't know. I feel like the language can be helpful, but I don't do it with Nora.
It's also energy. A reframe is energy. Yeah. Which I guess good growth up for me,
(...)
but...
(...)
Draining.
(...)
Yeah. What's hard for you?
(...)
Just trying to figure out how much of Charlie's desire for applause and acknowledgement constantly is healthy and okay and how much of it I need to redirect.(...) The key wants to be putting on a show all the time, and he demands applause. I've explained, people applaud if they like the show that you did, but I'm not going to not applaud because I always love what he does. You're going to be like, "Actually, I hated that." Yeah, that was stupid. Try again. No, right?
(...)
He's just getting this applause all the time, and he loves it. It's stinking cute, but at a certain point, I'm like,
(...)
"I don't know when I need to teach you that you're not the center of attention." I don't know where that line is because he just very much is
fully. It's so funny. Here's the difference between you and me. You're worried about external validation,
(...)
which we all need
at some level. Yeah, but my family thrives off of it.
These things would never enter my mind because I don't worry about it for Kyle and me.
It's just... It's not like your nature to crave it.
No, not at all, either of us.
(...)
It's just one of those things it's good to learn from you on because,
(...)
again, having different spouses, different family cultures,
(...)
the things that actually just don't pop into my head.
(...) That's good. If it doesn't need to, great. Sure. Don't worry about it.
(...)
Different perspectives. Good. Oh my gosh.(...) All right. You said something. Let's dive into our topic because you said something actually completely horrifying to me yesterday. Do you know what I'm referencing?
(...)
Okay. I was like, "Remember when Mom and Dad made us share water bottles?" It was the most horrifying thing ever. Yeah.
I need to paint a picture here. I refuse to use Neljeans for years because of this new water bottle brand.
If you're not a nerdy hiker.
Yeah. There's no straw. It's just like a screw top.
It's very functional. It's a plastic vessel.
Yeah, great for camping. Full of stickers. Yeah, great for hiking. Anyway, this is all we had. And Mom, we each had our own water bottle.
(...)
Yeah, we'd get more all the time. That'd be the best gift. Yes, my own.
Yeah, but when we were in the car, which we were often because our extended family was five, six hours driving, we visited them fairly frequently. And we camped a lot. We camped a lot for kids. So, Callie and I, I'm the oldest than Callie, two youngers.
(...)
If a baby starts squawking,(...) it's like demanded that the closest water bottle would be handed to the toddler.
(...)
And I mean, if dad's driving, that means there's jerky steering, the water sloshing all over the infant's face. The infant probably has Cheez-Its or Cheerios. Not Cheez-Its. We didn't get Cheez-Its. It's true. Cheerios goopy all over their mouth. So there's immediately backwash. You watch the water slosh into their face.
To me, it was the actual cheese. It was like the slimy warm cheese.
(...)
God, that's your perfect water bottle. Yeah. But you were required to shine. And our parents just never understood why that was vomit inducing for us. Oh,(...) and dad. So I think it's genetic.
(...)
Dad and the four of us. Yeah, this is the one that's more memorable for me.
Dad and the four of us just,
(...)
I don't know, there's like water scarcity issues.
(...)
I mean, we're constantly chugging water. I don't know if we just don't process it efficiently. We're like the opposite of the camel.
(...)
Like I couldn't tell you, but like I see it in my marriage today. I'm like, Kyle, you're not bringing a water on this like 30 minute drive. You can't share mine. I'm going to need it all.
(...) Inevitably, like my husband doesn't either. And he's like, I don't need it. And then he still ends up drinking mine. And I believe that he doesn't need it. But if it's there, he's going to drink it. But yes, I always have it.
Okay. We, so I went recently to Ohio with mom six hour drive.
(...)
I bring it like I fill up my 40 ounce Stanley.(...) And she's like, Oh, I forgot a water bottle. I'm like, Oh, cool. Like I can go upstairs and get our analogy and actually contain water. She said, no, that's okay. She took like a little, like a 20 ounce. Does she still have that little blue one? I don't know. She forgot it. Whatever it was.
(...)
She picked like my smallest thermos and just threw some water in there. And I'm looking at her like,
(...)
are you kidding?
Are you going to be okay?(...) I'm going to drink all mine. Plus a few look like, hello.(...) She's like, I'll be fine. She was. I don't even think she finished that thing.
Well, she doesn't sweat. First of all, it's not like I'm sweating in the car. Yeah, that's true. But we're just always in a depletion state from the amount that we sweat. I swear.
Here's my other theory medical professionals writing in after this episode.
Yeah, this isn't what we meant to talk about, but it's relevant. I really think that we need more electrolytes. So I've been trying to do like an electrolyte pack a day and I swear it helps. Wait, I'm doing that too.
This is, um, element. So very nice. So good.
Element is so good.
It's a little too sweet for me. I'm not going to lie.
Oh, I love it.
But it's good flavor with a salt.(...) The salt is great. Anyways, this whole tangent is to bring it back to Marco Leary or dad.
(...)
Inevitably, he would finish off his two Nalgene's.
Like 32 ounces. Like we're looking at 64 ounces down the gullet.
In like two hours. We're not halfway through them. And then he's demanding for any one, like panic in his voice. Did you ever hide them?
Are you kidding? Totally. Stash some water. Like the one time that we were going camping, um, and it was took a glacier and we were bringing another friend. So it was like five kids, two adults, one vehicle driving out to Glacier. So when he decreed that we weren't allowed to bring pillows. Oh, my God. Camping for two weeks. No pillows. And every single person brought a pillow besides.
(...)
And then every night or every morning we'd wake up and he would have stolen someone else's pillow. Yes.
(...)
And we somehow we were so good at stashing things that it was decreed. We didn't eat on these trips.(...) Somehow all of these pillows were hidden in this packed car.
That might've been the year I decided I would start packing the car.
(...)
Because remember I started taking that roll on. I wonder if that was the year.
I remember that, but now I do. Yeah. Anyways.(...) Oh, my God. This is all to say. Oh, wait, you're trying to roast me. Okay.(...) That's how they started. Well, four of us can all bond. And there's a visceral reaction to discussions of shared water bottles in this family.
(...)
And you told me yesterday.
(...)
You only have two children, okay? I have two children and I just said, you're going to hate to hear this. I have recently only started bringing one water bottle for them.(...) Yeah.(...) And that's it. That's what you want to roast me on. But they're so-- I'm not roasting. I'm just horrified. They don't care right now. When they start to care, then they're going to be old enough to carry their own water bottle.
(...) So then Charlie's going to have his pack, his water. An example of something that is baked into our family culture. I know. You could have Sadie on here. She'd be horrified. You'd have Naomi on here.
And I actually swore I would never do it.
Yeah. One of those things as a kid, you're like, "When I'm an adult, I have my own." Yes.(...) Never gonna behave this way.(...) And here you are.
(...)
Here you are.(...) I don't do it on a road trip. It's when we're hiking. It's when I am hiking with the kids. One adult, two kids, one water bottle.
I hear what you're saying. Horrifying.(...) Here. So I'm going on record and saying, "This is not going to be a part of my family culture."
(...)
Shared water bottles. Shared water bottles. Are you kidding me?(...) Ciaran is allowed to use my Stanley sometimes, but only when he hasn't eaten in a long time. And there's no possibility of backwash.
Yeah. Oh, wow. Okay.
(...)
This one's deep for you.
(...)
So deep.(...) I was the oldest.
(...)
Yeah. I mean, you're four years older than I am. So like, yeah, you really saw the toddler gross. I probably didn't care as much.
(...)
It still makes me want to vomit. Okay.(...) So one of the things that's relevant though that I hate to do, and I think it's so good for families, is those long car rides.(...) Horrible. Why is a car ride good? I'm thinking through this today. I hate it. Oh my gosh. Because you and I have an approaching car ride that's going to be you.(...) It's going to be us and the kids, no dads.
(...)
And- Two kids, two adults. Yeah. I'm like half dreading it, half anticipating and sort of like a hysteric, this is going to be hilariously chaotic sort of way.(...) Oh yeah.(...) When you're all stuck in that car, you just like have to figure it out.
(...)
True. Like you just really do. And we even had so much car time because we had to drive like half hour one way to get to all of our like activities growing up. Yeah. So we were in the car constantly.(...) So like you have to set the ground rules.
(...)
Yeah. I mean, it's not fun. It's not one that I'm like excited to do, but I just think it's good.
(...)
Was it you and Sadie? I just remembered this.(...) When mom at one point, I think we were in the Woodstock house, she started sneakily just timing when we were fighting in the car.
(...)
Oh, and then we had to stay that amount of time. And then we would get to the destination and she would say, okay, you're being obnoxious for X number of minutes. I'm leaving the car. You're actually just going to stay in the car and continue fighting for this amount of time. I'll come get you what it's done.
Yeah. And then it actually changed to we could collectively decide when we were done.
(...)
Fighting. Yeah. And then we could get out.
I didn't remember that.
You might've been in high school by then. That might've just been Sadie and I.
(...)
But like the fighting was not coming in the house. So if we weren't done, we were staying in the car.(...) Yeah. See, character building horrible. Not fun.(...) Super character building.
(...)
I think I'm more about like, you know, the destination after the end of the car ride.
(...)
I mean, yeah, that's way more fun. You're here for the car ride though. I'm not here for it. I just like can see it as valuable.
(...)
Huh. Okay. There's a reframe for me.
(...) Well, remind me of this this coming weekend. Oh, I will be losing my ever loving mind. Yeah. No, I.
(...)
I need to get your thoughts on room temperature, cheese and crackers.
Oh my gosh. Sorry. I just muted myself to eat, but I have to unmute to say puke in my mouth.
(...)
Yeah.
(...)
So this, whenever we went on these road trips or whenever we went on a hike, if we were leaving the house, there was going to be a meal outside the house.
(...)
It, it was inevitably cheese and crackers and like maybe some summer sausage, maybe some grapes or veg, likely just the cheese crackers and summer sausage. So that was the meal.
(...)
And on these six hour car rides, we would pass. I mean, we would stop at rest stations that smelled like fast food. We would pass all the fast food. Mm hmm. And for whatever reason,(...) Mark and Anne,
(...)
our parents decide like they,
(...)
I want to be clear that the coolers were invented. Yeah, I swear when I use them. No, it was always sweaty, sweaty cheese, room temperature, sweaty cheese.
(...)
Sometimes when I leave food out too long in my house, I think to myself,(...) huh, but I didn't die during my childhood and I still throw it away.
(...)
Like food safety here, people. Well, cheese is fine.
Like the sausage.
(...)
Why? I don't think they opened it. Like I think we would open it after we were.
Yeah, then we eat it the whole car ride and then we'd eat the rest of it on the car ride home.
(...)
I mean, it would go in the fridge like at our destination. If it was like grandparents, if we were camping, we did have a cooler.
I have, okay, I have, I have to do, hold on.
(...)
I got to call dad real quick.
Oh my gosh.
(...)
And ask if he used a cooler.
(...)
I just need some clarity around this.
(...)
All right.
Bummer.(...) Well, here's what I wanted to know. I wanted to know why they didn't use a cooler.(...) Second of all, I needed to validate a story so I could swear in college. Dad at one point told me, man, whenever we were road tripping or going somewhere with my parents, they always used to just make us eat cheese and crackers.
Oh yeah. Yep. No, I've heard this. Okay. So it's not, so he, you
know, he said I'm, he hated it and then it got some sort of sick enjoyment out of inflicting the same on us. Yeah. And to be clear, he also ate it with us. It's not like they had different food.
Although they did get coffee, which like they deserved it 1000%. But like, just to like really paint our childhood, like we would roll through the Starbucks and mom and dad would get coffee and we did not like all get a hot chocolate, like very occasionally maybe.(...) But like road trips, yeah, they got their Coke and their coffee as they should. But I feel like a normal American family, like you go through fast food, everybody gets something.
This is not another thing.(...) Okay. So the sweaty cheese and crackers, I'm going to be honest. I love a charcuterie board. When I travel now, I get nice cheese and I actually get a bag. I love it. Okay.(...) It is not cold temperature. Yes. I keep the appropriate things cold. Some cheese actually, like if it's a very nice cheese is better room temp. Absolutely. So it's just, so I guess I kind of do the same thing.
(...)
I don't really know what I'm going to do when I travel, but I think I want there to be some more enjoyable snacks. If I'm shoving my offspring into a car forever,
(...)
TV on that one. I go hard with the snacks. You do actually have seen it. Yeah, you do. You do.
(...)
But you just brought up an interesting point. I think with our friends and the average American family, yeah, they would stop and get fast food or they would,
(...)
the kids would participate in whatever the parents were doing.
(...)
And something I really appreciate about mom and dad is it was always
(...)
the parents on one level and the kids on another.
(...)
And they, I know it was intentional. They made a point of putting their relationship first,
(...)
which we now have data that suggests that that creates much more security for kids. Kids don't want their parents to be their friends.(...) Emotionally, developmentally, that's actually not appropriate until you're adults.
(...)
But as kids, yeah, parents should be the parents and put their relationship
(...)
at the top of the hierarchy,(...) which mom and dad, there was no question. Sure was not. There was no question of unconditional love and care.
(...)
We can have as much sweaty cheese as we want.
But that is, that was a priority for them. And I think I know that created more bonding with us between the kids.
(...)
Because sometimes if they were making us do stuff we didn't want to do, it was very much us versus them.(...) I think it's healthy for sibling relationships. That's true. Yeah, I haven't thought about that. And very much want to implement.(...) Yeah, Kyle and I, our relationship's top of the hierarchy.
(...)
We're investing in it. We're putting time into it. We're making sure it's strong and stable.
(...)
And not only with Stan's children, but thrives.
(...)
Which ultimately is better for the kids. Okay. I heard with Stan's children, I was like, who is Stan? Okay.
(...)
With Stan's.
(...)
Anyway, there's a pro for mom and dad.
(...)
Wait, which not the sweaty cheese.
Not the sweaty cheese. The higher. Yeah, exactly.
(...) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I still have to work at that for sure.
(...)
I don't think it's quite applicable to me yet.(...) With my 19 month old, how do you have to work at it?
Um, like very specifically, Charlie wants to talk all the time.
(...)
And Kevin is keeps having to remind me, like, you are talking to me right now. And like, he needs to wait. Because I will always like, make sure to say, okay, you need to say, excuse me, buddy, and wait. And then I'll wait like two seconds just to make him practice. And then for sure, my intention is on him. Or even if I'm like, he needs to wait longer right now. I'm still purely thinking about Charlie, even while Kevin's talking at me. I don't like tune them out. Well, okay. So that's like a very specific example that I am working on because mom and dad for sure did do that. And like my husband has reminded me of it. And that's really hard for me.(...) Go Kevin. Yeah.
(...)
Yeah.(...) Um, Sunday dinner. Yeah, that was a good one. Yeah.
(...)
I mean, it was like kind of annoying in the moment, sort of, but only for scheduling reasons. So like, okay, to clarify, our Sunday dinners were sacred.(...) And actually Sundays in general, like we were not supposed to work on Sundays.
(...)
We could have people over to our house, but we weren't supposed to like leave. Like Sunday was supposed to be family day at home with whoever else wanted to join.
And doing stuff on Sunday. It was really church and dinner. We're non-negotiables.
I was not supposed to like leave much.
We are not remembering.
They might've, yeah, I don't know. Maybe they buckled down for us. But I mean, it was hard, but I don't ever remember being like that frustrated unless I was feeling really like pushed by a boss.
(...)
Then I was kind of like, yes, that was hard. But honestly, that was really good to navigate too. Like, no, my family is more important. Like you can be mad at me. Like that was something I had to learn.
(...)
And I should say also just because we're talking about Sundays and we can tie on why Sundays were sacred in our family, we were raised very Catholic.
(...)
And so I do want to be clear that that shaped so much of our family culture and values. True. It was very much at the heart of it. It was absolutely the foundation.(...) And that's not featured in any of my items for discussion today, but only because I know our listeners are all over the place. So I don't know that it's applicable.
(...)
But I don't think we can ignore that.
(...)
No, I think that was so important. Just like having a day. I mean, we were talking to Brooke the other day and she's Jewish and they have their Shabbat like Friday night to Saturday. Yeah. I mean, talking about how that's their sacred day. Like, I think there's really something to be said for having that standard of there's this day, whenever it might be for you, that is really important for us to be together. And like, it might not be, it's not like we were doing crazy activities.(...) You know, it wasn't like we were like going to a water park every Sunday. It was just to be together through better for worse.
(...)
And I remember dinners like almost always being fun.
(...) They were always fun. Well, mom and dad were always funny. Yeah.
We're like laughing, telling
stories like they were friends. They are, they are great friends. They've always been great friends. Yeah. But we would participate equally as kids, if I'm wrong correctly, in that we often had friends over, like it was often a very full table on Sundays. It was not just us.
(...)
And we were participating equally with the adults in conversation.
(...)
I'm just already like starting to get bogged down with activities somehow. You know, like I'm getting all this pressure for like Charlie, who is going to be for in May to be participating in these things. And so that's why like Sunday dinner is top of mind for me because I'm realizing that's going to be a fight like in the very near future. And not just for Charlie, like Kevin and I are too busy in extracurriculars as well. But that's just something like that. I do want to continue. And it's going to be hard and very countercultural to have a night or a day together.
(...)
So Sundays were for families, which meant that Saturdays were all just pure fun for us, right?
(...)
I am undecided if I'm going to continue this one. I'd like to hear your thoughts.
(...)
Okay. So Saturdays,
(...)
I'm tense.
(...)
I need a drink. So
we always had Saturday morning chores.
(...)
Saturday was always a work day. You're getting a little red. Yeah. You've got some, yeah. Oh, your forehead and your nose is red right now.
(...)
Why don't you tell me what you're feeling right now? What's going on here, Kelly?
(...)
Honestly, out of the four of us, I would see you carrying on this tradition. I know.
(...) And I probably will. And I hate it. Are you serious?
Wait, okay. Why are you red and red right now?
Like what is, tell me what is happening. So like my inner conflict is like high school when I was involved in a lot of stuff and I wanted to do everything to the best of my ability. And I had really good friends and I like wanted to go hang out with them. So I would freaking wake up at like 6am. And the reason that I'm pissed right now is because sometimes the list of stuff that we had to get done wasn't created. And I would have to be like, Hey, I'm going to get my stuff done, but I actually need it on Friday, please. Because I need to understand how early I have to wake up to get it done so that I can move on with my life. Because this is living hell having to do chore day every Saturday.
(...)
So that just wasn't always possible. And we were supposed to start chores by like 9am I think was the deal, which I mean, dad would have said seven. Yeah, nine was like nine was a concession.
Yeah, it used to be dad with bellow and just wake us up and make us get out of bed.
That's probably mostly why I'm red.
Oh, yeah. I mean, this guy is a morning person. He's been up since 5 36 for he's like 7am. What are you doing? Oh my gosh. And then we all had a list of things that we had to get done before we did anything else that day. Yeah. And so mom and dad are just like, why wouldn't you just do that immediately? And then you have a whole day in front of you and the rest and I Sadie and I were just like, are you? No, it could be like 6pm and you wanted me to do what this is ridiculous. So why do I need to do this right now?
(...)
And I would probably last week.
You want me to do it again? It looks fine. And I was like, this is child labor and I have better things to be doing, but I'm still going to do it. Yeah, because I have to.
So you're like, I need my money on Friday and I'm all like, Oh, I'm sorry, you didn't make a list. That must mean we're off the hook.(...) You want me to hold up my end of the bargain. You better hold up yours. I'm sorry. And you're just like, can you please get it to me earlier? I needed it in a time.
(...)
Yeah.
(...)
Yeah. I mean, it would be things like clean out the car. That was like a frequent, right? Clean the bathrooms. It was just like house maintenance.
(...)
But my other confusion is like all of us were able to do chores and we're expected to do them throughout the week throughout the week. So how was there so much to do?
(...)
I don't know.
I think it was so many of us. It really stems from the Woodstock house because that's when, so we lived on 32 acres
(...)
and it was gorgeous natural habitat.(...) But part of the deal was mom and dad were maintaining this land and there was always a lot of work to do there.
(...)
So Woodstock was where it really became ingrained, I think, because they were also,
(...)
we did, they didn't use heat. It was a fully wood fired stove. We did use heat.
(...)
No, it would pop on in the middle of the night. Sometimes it existed. Yeah. Yeah. Like when the house was built, I think the stove was put in as a nice to have
and mom and dad decided they had a fireplace. I think they put in the stove. Oh, I think you're right. Actually. So the heat was very attainable. We just didn't use it. Yeah. It was a choice, which I I'm all for that sounded snarky. Yeah.
So there were also, there's a lot of maintenance to do on this land. So we would take the tractor and this trailer all over these acres, black trailer. It was fun, which was fun. We'd ride in the trailer, but then we'd be hauling all four of us plus mom and dad. And I will say mom and dad were always doing this work with us. And on Saturdays dad always did a lot more work than we ever did. Yeah. It wasn't like they were just cracking the whip at us.
(...)
We'd be collecting this wood. And in the summer, it was all about making sure we didn't freeze in the winter. Direct quote.
(...)
Okay. I don't remember that at all. Cause I was always like, we're not going to freeze dolly. Everyone knew the heaters freeze,
(...)
but we'd have to stockpile this wood and dad would have to split it and dry it and whatever. And Oh God, it was just hours. And then all week long, we're just hauling wood to make sure we're not freezing in the winter. So I think Woodstock really solidified the hours and hours and hours of labor possible.
And I have to just even clarify, I don't even mind hauling wood. I like the physical labor.
(...)
I hate the, I can feel it right now. If there's fancy wood chips down my shirt, I'd be in my pants by the end of a Saturday. And then we had that terrible carpet in the living room. So then we'd be like trying to get all the wood chips off cause the job wasn't done until the carpet was clean. Oh my God. Yeah. But this may point, what, what were we doing after we didn't live in the country anymore? I lived in a subdivision. What were we all doing all of Saturday?
I don't know. I really think the emotions just still remain from hauling wood at Woodstock, which anyways, so my point is I just don't feel like doing that myself. So I'm probably not going to make my kids do that, but CBD.
(...)
Also it was very bonding for the four of us because that was very much an us versus them moment. And we'd like, are you crazy?(...) These insane people right now who are our parents who are giving no quarter, completely unified front.
(...)
Okay. You know, what's funny. I used to help mom make the list.
(...)
And this is how we get confessions from Cali years later. Okay. You know, it's funny.
(...)
You're putting chores on our list.
(...)
It was literally like, that's probably where the CEO started.(...) Mom like tapped into me for like, who could get this job done faster? She I would be better at this. Yeah. I was like, I was like her project manager.
(...)
You know, both of our parents are working.(...) Yeah. I'm calling Sadie. Oh.
I'm on
the real mom hub right now. I need to know this is Sadie.(...) Cali just said on this episode,
(...)
you know, it's really funny. We were talking about Saturday chores.
(...)
She used to make our lists.
No, I didn't make them. I can't even hear me. Yeah. I'm in your headphones. Yeah. Tell her. I didn't create the chores. I distributed the chores.
(...)
Yeah. I'm going to need a minute to recover.
(...)
Yes.(...) I just distributed to our strengths. My gosh.
Cali is saying she didn't create the trellis. She just distributed to our strengths.
(...)
Such a monastery mom way of saying she made our trellis.
Yeah.
I'm absolutely my guest.
(...)
Yeah. Hey, wait.
(...) Can you
please tell Sadie? I did not ever put her on painting the ceiling.
(...)
Oh my God. Mom was totally ganging up on us.
(...)
Cali would like you to know.
(...)
Yeah. No, same. And I'm so sorry. She's in my earphones right now. So you can't hear her. She would like you to know that she never tasked you with painting the porch ceiling though.
(...)
You know what, Cal?(...) That's really good because I have such initiative and I'm such an entrepreneur that I just took it upon myself.
(...) And it was bad people.
(...)
Sadie, wait, ask.
(...)
I'm still clearly speechless, which is not something that comes down easily.
No, I know.
I just needed somebody else to know. Can you quick ever tell the audience what happened with the porch?
(...)
Yeah. Yeah. I think our relationship with Cali is forever changed.
(...) It's irreparable. I think maybe can you tell her to make my 27 year old list now instead?
(...)
Can she get me to get my life together now? 27?
I mean, she can hear you. So I'm sure she'll try.
Wait, what color did she paint the porch?
I just feel like maybe a little bit of
(...)
restorative justice is on hand here.
Yeah. No, you and I are going to be talking after this episode. We will think of something.
(...)
Yeah, Cali's really stuck on the porch story and would like you to, what did you want her to tell the listeners?
What color did she paint it the first time?
Oh, what color you painted the porch ceiling the first time?
Well, I painted it brown, which was exactly the words that my mom said out loud to me. She said, "How did you not paint the ceiling brown? I won't love you." That's what she said.
(...)
Thank you. I'll finish the story after she.
Cali said she'll finish the story. We'll definitely have you on the show later to defend any fallacies Cali lays at your feet.
You could, because it sounds like she's really on a smear campaign.
Yeah, a little bit. She's the audacity to bring up the porch ceiling after she just confessed that she orchestrated our entire childhood chore, thrall-like existence. Oh my God, I did not.
Thrall is such a good, yeah, no, that's 100% what it is.
(...) Yeah.
(...)
Anyways. What a bully.
I know. We should probably move this along because I have some more items to check off my list with Cali, but yeah, you and I will be talking after this. We need a clue in Naomi. Yeah.
I was going to say we need to bring in the third and final victim. That's wild.
Well, she's in Japan right now, so I couldn't call her. But anyways, thanks for picking up. Thanks for your cameo. We love you.
(...) Love you. Bye.
Bye.(...) Okay. Mom said paint the porch roof and Sadie moved the white ceiling paint off of the can of brown porch paint and painted the already white ceiling brown.
(...)
And then Mom came home and was like, WTS. Except for she never would have said that. Sadie was so mad. I had to mediate. So I'm telling you this story.
You're a meeting between mom and our mother. Between our mother and Sadie. Yes.
Because they were both distraught.
(...)
At the ceiling choice? Yes. Because then Sadie did have to go back and repaint it white.
(...)
Well, obviously it looks terrible.
(...)
Wow.
(...)
All right. Let's move this along because I don't like being roasted.
Okay.
(...)
Something did just pop up with Sadie.
(...)
I feel like there was very much this like kind of thrall mentality even outside of Saturday chores.(...) And I don't know if I'm going to recreate this in my family, but I kind of as an adult love it. So it was very clear. We were homeschooled until high school, most of us Sadie and Naomi went to school a little earlier, but let's just say like our elementary school days, it was very clear to us that we were doing fun, interactive, engaging things during the day with mom while dad was off working very, very hard to put a roof over our heads and flute on the table.
(...)
And that's true. So I just want to be clear that we didn't have the, oh, I worked really hard at school all day. And, you know, I was on some other adults schedule, whatever we had autonomy to do our school as long as it got done, whatever. We had a pretty great childhood when dad came home. I mean, he could ask us to do anything at any time. And this was true for the weekends and we just had to do it without asking.
Yeah. Without questioning.
Without, without questioning. Yeah. So, which is, I didn't see that in our,(...) like in our friends home and it could be girls. We need more one.
And I wish he had a tone of voice for sure. And I was never upset about the request. I was like, I get it. To me, it was 1000% about the delivery. I'd be like, Oh, he's so mean.
(...)
He could at least say please. And she was probably like, she always like listened when she was probably like, shut up and go get the wood.
(...)
Yeah. I mean, if it was past the hour is 6pm, it's like dad's relaxing. Yes. We always cleaned the kitchen without, I mean, that was just, and that was a thing. Yeah. You don't question it. It's going to happen.
(...)
I, I think that's really appropriate. I don't know.
(...)
I do. I still don't need to say please. Yeah. As much as I'm making fun of myself, I mean, as an adult, it's funny. It's hilarious. It was totally character building. I don't think I'll have that in me. And my husband for sure does not. Yeah. To like demand it like that. But I do think like expecting it is. Yeah.(...) Sadie just texted. Oh gosh. I'm going to stop listening to Cal's book recs now because have I ever made a choice on my own before?
(...)
Then she said, no, I won't because it's invaluable. Thanks, Cal. But this is illegal. Yeah.
We have some unpacking to do after this episode.
(...)
Okay. I feel like I probably did it like two times. I shouldn't have said a thing. Oh, and we're backtracking now. Okay. Sorry. All right. You go. You go.
(...)
So anyways, yeah. They're all mentality. I don't know if we'll do it or not, but kind of here for it. I'm like good on you guys. I don't know. We should know our place in a way that is contributing to the family good, the family household.(...) And I liked the realization that we knew that they were working for us and sacrificing for us. It put their work into perspective for me as a kid in a way that I think is really, really valuable. So I actually appreciated what they were doing for us more had my attention not been drawn there.
That's the key because like I think about like that's training us to be obedient, right? Which can be really controversial. I think the key is we were somehow somehow they raised us to understand when it was appropriate to be obedient to someone or when it's totally unnecessary. That's true. Somehow we were raised to be able to suss out like is your boss or is this government figure someone worth giving your obedience to in which case yes, if they're not, don't do it. Like I think somehow I don't know how they did that, but I think all of us have that sense of like when to do it and when to not.
Critical thinking was huge. I was really celebrated.
(...)
And I think a lot of that comes from mom explaining to us the why behind everything. If there was a punishment, if there was- Which dad would usually make the call. Yeah, dad would give the call with no context. Like I'm going to do it. Just do it.(...) Mom would always give us context. She would give us the why.
(...)
But dad and mom together, I remember punishments when I was older, I could always argue them and sometimes they'd adjust. If I was getting in trouble or if I didn't like something they'd done, there was always open discussion for both of them. And actually dad was great at talking through things and arguing through things. Yeah, no, that's very true. And sometimes they would say, okay, I see your perspective. We're still right, but I'll take that into consideration. Let's adjust your punishment a little bit or let's-
(...)
So it was very much, it was not, there were authoritarian moments that I think are funny now because it was not truly authoritarian. Yeah, that's true. It was actually very respectful of us as individuals.
(...) How about we had to write a persuasive essay to get our ears pierced?
(...)
Oh, God.
(...)
I love it. I think it's so freaking funny. I think it's really funny. I probably won't do it purely because I'm like,
(...)
I'm just struggling with like, actually the arguments of getting your ears pierced. Like they were always going to say yes. I don't know. I just don't care at this point. It's so funny. But it's hilarious.
(...)
Also, we were 13. We had to be 13 and we had to write a persuasive essay.(...) Yeah.
(...)
Do you think that's why Naomi never did?
(...)
She had her ears pierced after turning 18.
I know. No, she would have probably(...) outdone all of us. Yeah, that's true. With her essay.
(...)
It was a good exercise. I remember quoting a lot of Bible verses. Me too. Oh, this will make them happy. This will get them.
(...)
Okay. Well, mine were really like travel related. So is there any more like that you can refresh my memory of just our home life? We haven't even covered camping trips.(...) Oh, yeah. I literally wrote tent camping. If you know, you know.
(...)
Yeah, but we did do group camping trips with families who did it differently than us.
(...)
I mean, they weren't tent camping. No, some of them were.
(...)
Huh? The St. Catherine's group. Yeah, we're younger. They're a mix of campers and tents.
(...)
So for listeners, we would do a two week family road trip camping trip every single year. Mm-hmm. Which dad really prioritized like two consecutive trips. Of all of us very much together all the time, which is amazing.
(...) Mm-hmm.
And when I look back at that much more hard work for our parents than I ever.
(...) Mm.
Even I didn't clock it at the time.
Mm-hmm.
(...)
But man, we would start these trips fighting in the car.
Mm.
Just being annoyed eating sweaty cheese, water bottle backwash. Puking. We had much carsick kids. Puking. Puking. Puking. Puking. Puking. Puking. Puking. We had much carsick kids. No, just you and Sadie.
(...)
And Naomi.
(...)
Yeah, yeah. No, you're right.
(...)
And by the end, we were a well-oiled machine. From my memories, we were like Mark's militia. We would get out of the car at the new camping spot. We each knew what our task was, who's unloading what, who's setting up this, who's getting the kindling, who's finding the other fireworks. We never bought firewood. We always scavenged it.
Oh my gosh, we have to find a picture of Naomi. She's like four years old and she has her legs braced on a log. She has a hand saw and she had figured out how to saw using her legs to brace this log. Kept her occupied for hours.
(...)
She's probably like seven. I probably exaggerated two young Deva saw.(...) So funny. Or was she?
Because she was fine. Yeah, it was great. She's always been really careful.
Yeah. Yeah.
(...)
So funny.
But there are certain family culture. Actually, I think it's genetic.
(...)
If you're camping with friends and you see that they're tent doors slightly unzipped.
That's a turn.
(...) No immediate thoughts, feelings, concerns from you. Like you idiot. Yeah, it's visceral for me.
You just wore shoes? Actually, I wasn't even judgmental the first time I saw someone wear shoes in the tent. I was fascinated.(...) I was like, I didn't know it would work.
(...)
I just heard like eating snacks on the tent. I was like, wait.
Oh yeah, no eating, no shoes on the tent. Do you zip it immediately?
(...)
Dad would just go apoplectic.
(...)
If any of these things, if you even thought about not zipping the tent quickly enough. He would know.
Yeah. Sort of like when it was windy and you didn't hold your door.
Of the car. Yeah. I swear to God it's genetic. I behave exactly the same way when we're camping with friends.(...) I will want to explode internally if I see them bring food in there. If I see that, yeah.
I will say like after doing some college backpacking, like sometimes there's just bad weather and it actually just makes sense to eat in the tent.
(...)
That one I have. That one I've let go of. Shoes in the tent holding strong.
(...)
No, I mean, I've had to undo some of these behaviors. But the shoes and the zipper still remain for sure.
(...)
But these camping trips, I would say were pretty formative and I'm so grateful for them. That's something I absolutely, I think the length of time was really important as well as the activity.
(...)
Yeah. I still am learning how to vacation. That's the only thing that it's mostly a personality issue. But like we didn't really vacation. We went on trips.
(...)
So I'm having to learn how to relax because it's not easy for me. And I don't know how much of that is nature versus nurture.
(...)
That's the only thing that I'm trying to juggle. Like I want this camping experience for my family, but maybe I also want like a little like vacation or, you know, just like let's learn how to not do something. Relax.
(...)
Yeah. I remember us all reading around the fire a lot.
(...)
We woke up, dad would always have this awesome. Chocolate. Oh, you have hot chocolate ready for us. And this awesome
spread.
(...)
Mom with the snacks on the hike. For sure that mother now. Yeah, she'd break them out strategically for sure. Charlie's already started like learning where to look.
(...)
Like the other day's little head popped over the stroller and he's like, can I have one of those? And I said, Charlie, let's wear a secret. And he just like giggles and he like, no, we'd get out later.(...) It's so funny.
(...)
Honestly, there's so much more that they did throughout the week that.
(...)
We'll probably uncover as our children get older.
Yeah. These were just the ones that were slightly cringe or incredibly viscerally cringe when we were kids.
(...)
That bonded us, I think. As siblings.
(...)
Yep.
(...)
And what a blessing.(...) Yeah.(...) It's amazing.
(...)
Because also, I mean,
(...)
yeah, there were moments when we were annoyed at them and we're like, God, people are crazy. Why? Why? Why? Why? I'm never doing this when I'm an adult. Why would you do this?
(...)
And I'm really, I am grateful for actually all of them now. Pretty formative.
(...)
Yeah. Yep.
(...)
I should also stress for listeners,(...) our parents are really fun people. We had a great time with them also.
(...)
I feel like that's clear. I mean, the fact that we're laughing about it. I mean, if it's not, yes, you're absolutely correct. Play our parents listening to this. Know that it's all it's mostly fond memories.
(...)
I have one realization. So we, when we were housing from dad, they came back from their trip on Tuesday and we had a little afternoon evening. Hangout was lovely.
(...)
I realized like this, you know, we were talking about like the thrall mentality. Like when we were really little as in, okay, y'all, y'all can take care of the things. Go do the thing.
(...)
It's really uncomfortable. Mom and dad came home and I had, I thought organized our snacks, which we had for the week because I wasn't going to just go through their pantry. Brought a lot of food. I thought I had it organized on the counter. Okay. We had to baby proof their house a lot. So their house, which is very orderly all the time, was not that way when they walked in because I have a 19 month old and their house is not baby proof. And I was watching dad quietly, which is not his MO, assess the situation and have like an internal mental breakdown about his home that he'd been away from from a week and a half being disorderly.(...) And I just watched him quietly, like setting everything to rights. But there was just a vibration coming off of him.
I would have had to leave the room.
I was just like so uncomfortable because I felt like I should be doing it all.
(...)
But I was also like, well, we're here another night
and(...) and I don't want my baby breaking your stuff.
I don't want my baby breaking your stuff. Sorry about it. Yeah.
(...)
It's so weird now being an adult and going to their house and they're just like, what can I get for you? What can I cook for you?
What can I-(...) I know you struggle with that more. Like such a flip. Well, I'm the oldest.
(...)
Yeah, I don't know. I don't sit well when they're taking care of me as an adult. I haven't adjusted to the flip yet. That's funny. But they both do.
(...)
And they love it. They love. Yeah, I love it. It's great. I think it's just a funny reflection moment for me.
(...)
I mean, I've only noticed it since having kids. Yes, that's true. And I'm like here for it.
(...)
So fun. So fun.
(...)
Well, I'm going to go finish cleaning my house for our friend that's coming.
(...)
Oh, yeah. Have so much fun. Thank you. My house is supposed to be terrible weather. It's okay.
A war zone, but I'm looking out and it was terrible this morning and rainy, but now it's so gorgeous. Oh, I'm going to walk. Leave it and
go do something fun. Yes. Take that boy to the park. He's sleeping. But yeah,(...) I'll go to your nails by yourself outside.
(...)
Oh, that does sound nice, actually.
(...)
So nice to chat. Love you. Love you. See you soon. Bye. Bye.