Vegans Talking Shit

The Mailbag (July 28, 2026)

• The Tofu Trio • Episode 89

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0:00 | 41:30

After dodging listener email in the last episode, The Tofu Trio actually manages to stay on track and read emails this week. First, they read a listener's message that expands on the stories Vanessa shared about riding horses, and another calls out Jon for defending Kim Kardashian, which leads to Joey delivering a mea culpa of sorts. That turns into a conversation about where they draw the line when it comes to supporting problematic celebrities, which somehow ends with Joey dropping a downright awful Matthew McConaughey impression. A third email from Poland triggers a deep philosophical debate about whether or not animals have souls. Finally, they wrap up the show with free plugs for Chunk plant-based meat and Tuno plant-based tuna. In the end, listeners get a rare treat as the three hosts mostly stick to the agenda, even if the horrible Matthew McConaughey impression nearly ruins the whole thing.

Visit https://bitesizevegan.org/is-horse-riding-cruel-is-it-vegan/ to read the article on the ethics of horseback riding that was cited in today's episode.

Buy some Vegans Talking Shit merchandise! Visit https://vegans-talking-shit.myshopify.com to buy Vegans Talking Shit t-shirts, hoodies, coffee mugs, and more.

Vegans Talking Shit is hosted by Joey Di Girolamo, Jon Missirlian, and Vanessa Silva. Main podcast image artwork by Diego Orellana. Theme song "Flying" by TrackTribe. Visit @veganstalkingshit on Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube and @vegans.talking.sh on TikTok. Send questions, comments, and topic ideas to veganstalkingshit@gmail.com, and you may get your email read during the show.

SPEAKER_02

Hey everybody, welcome to Vegans Talking Shit. I'm Joey. I'm John.

SPEAKER_00

I'm Vanessa.

SPEAKER_02

We went a little bit long on our in our last episode. Uh it was initially supposed to be an episode with us reading emails uh from our listeners, and we spent like, I don't know, 35-40 minutes uh bullshitting about uh my trip to Florida Supercon and various other stuff. Uh, I think we even had a World Cup off that's it. Thank you. We had a whole World Cup thing happening that took up uh a lot of time as well, and then I uh started uh giving some props to uh Zevia Soda as well as uh HH German, the creator of the uh calico comic book character. Yeah, uh the first vegan anti-hero. So, with that, we're just gonna take it away and carry on with the episode. Now we can actually get into our episode the actual point of the episode. Uh, we have a couple of emails we'd like to read. Um, Vanessa's read them, I've read them, John has not, so it's kind of cool that uh we can get uh John's reaction. But um, I'm just gonna read the emails and uh comment on them. The three of us will comment on them. I'm gonna start off with uh one we got about horseback riding. Uh, we recently had an episode, I think our last episode was about horseback riding. Uh the controversy of being vegan, you know, is it vegan to ride a horse? That whole thing. So we had some uh what's her name? Marty Fernandez. She writes, hey team, I appreciate this week's topic. It was really interesting. I wanted to share some additional info I learned about horse muskuskeletors. Yeah, muskeletal. Let me try one more time, musculoskeletal structure, which I think further strengthens the case against riding on their backs. I heard of Vanessa mention that she doesn't believe the small person on the horse's back was much of a burden on them. It's a common misconception that horses have strong backs which can bear heavy loads. Their backs are actually incredibly sensitive. Their bodies are around their bodies are incredibly strong, but optimized for pulling heavy loads and not for having 100 plus pounds bouncing around on their spines. The linked article cites many sources for the various harms caused by riding on horses. She then has a link, which I'm gonna actually put in the episode description. So she just said thanks again for platforming this important topic. So, Marty Fernandez, thank you so much. Uh, I appreciate the link. I actually did read it, and it's yeah, I mean, it's heartbreaking.

SPEAKER_00

I actually want to make a post with her her email. Of course, I'm not going to share her name in the email, you know, the information. We just said her name in the well, we said her name, but I'm not going like uh, you know, maybe sometimes people can yeah, people can search, but doesn't matter if we can they can search, yeah. Probably has so many of them, like Vanessa Silva, you know, probably has a bunch of but um normally I should just cover her name or whatever, or just bleep. Even though I'm super against, you know, that's why I don't ride a horse anymore. Uh for in my mind was more about everything else than the horse has someone light in their back. For me, I was like, Well, they are so powerful, they they probably don't feel. Uh, and I was I was surprised with the information. Thank you very much for sharing this to us. You know, take the time to send an email and share this with us.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so the next one I think is pretty funny. It's from uh MSDG. She writes, Please inform John that Kim Kardashian did not go to college or law school. There's a program in California that if you study for the bar exam and pass it, you can practice law. She took the bar exam three times and failed every single time. Also, she didn't get people out of death row. She has worked to reduce or commute a couple of people's sentences who she felt were given excessive time in jail for drugs. Trump is one of the people she has worked with to reduce those sentences. People who pass the bar are not able to defend anyone in court, though. So definitely not a Kim Kardashian lover.

SPEAKER_03

Um well, I'm I'm gonna need to fact check this because I I remember explicitly, I explicitly remember them talking about Kim K, Kim Kardashian helping Kim K or a Kim King people out that were on death row. Yeah, we saw we saw any more than that girl just has done in her life. So she can complain all this person that just emailed us, she can complain all she wants, but that is a lot, it's more than I've done. I've never gone to a prison and listen to someone's story that was on death row, and you know, maybe believe they were unfairly treated. Because as we know, a lot of the poor population, a lot of the African-American population in in our country has been very unfairly treated, and we know that they've uh not not gotten fair trials, right?

SPEAKER_02

Oh, that's absolutely true.

SPEAKER_03

Kim Kardashian has has been a voice for those people. Um, I don't remember ever saying that she actually went to law school. Maybe I did, but I that's that's maybe that's neither here nor there. I do know that she was um studying for the bar. Um, yeah, other people failed the bar as well. Like Robert Um, you know, JFK Jr. failed the bar back in the day.

SPEAKER_02

Vincent LaGuardia Gambini. He failed a lot six times.

SPEAKER_03

A lot of people failed the bar.

SPEAKER_02

My cousin Vinny reference, by the way. Uh from my cousin Vinny.

SPEAKER_03

I mean, I failed the real estate test and then I passed it.

SPEAKER_00

You know, there are so many people that failed the real estate test.

SPEAKER_03

It's hard, and the bar is obviously harder, you know, to pass. And actually, the California uh bar is I think the hardest in the country. They say like California and New York are like the two hardest. So I just you know, I'd rather give people their props versus judging them. Like when we hear something that someone does that's nice for people, that's you know, but let's let's kind of glorify them and put them on a pedestal. There's I I don't see things that she does that is that are just that are terrible either. Just because she's you know, in in you know, just because she's kind of a facer in social media, and there's been you know, she's one of the first reality stars, and a lot of people don't like her because of that. But what has she ever done to that person that emailed us, right? What has Kim Kardashian ever done? What did Paris Hilton ever done that was that bad? Like, and other people that we jump on, you know?

SPEAKER_02

I will say this uh, as someone who once devoted an episode telling people to be kind, um, I do feel bad. I like in listening to the episode that we recorded a while back where I was trashing Kim Kardashian. It's like, why did I do that? Like, what did she do to me? Um, now my issue with her isn't necessarily her per se, it's more about how people tend to celebrate people when I don't necessarily feel it's deserved. Like Paris Hilton. Um, it's not that they're bad people, it's just that you have I think that you're promoting like why not promote a woman who is a scientist, but is that her fault?

SPEAKER_03

And why is it any different that we're promoting athletes? Like we're pinning, we're promoting Lionel Messi every second.

SPEAKER_02

Well, well, he has a talent, you know, he has a talent.

SPEAKER_03

Lionel Messi has a talent. Kim Kardashian and the Kardashians have a talent to bring people get people to watch TV, right? And they have the talent to bring in money for their sponsors and for the e-network, and that's a that's a freaking talent, too. Just like just like the one different talents. I don't know. We clearly do not have that talent. I do want to say one other thing on her. She has been a very, very big voice for the Armenian genocide. A lot of people have no idea that a million and a half Armenians were killed by the Turkish Empire back in the day in the 1915 to 1925. Um, also, the Turkish killed a lot of Greeks, they killed a lot of um uh some other uh they killed other people too. But the Armenians, this was back before World War I, but before there was television, before there was, you know, back then it was just radio. I actually I don't even know if there was so much radio, but a lot of that time was forgotten so much that Hitler has said famously, they're not gonna remember the Jews, they didn't remember the Armenians. Well, Hitler was wrong about the Jews, because they clearly remembered. Um, but the Armenians they kind of forgot about, right? I didn't know about it. Did you know about it? I mean, until I just said that, is it's the first time you heard about it? Yeah, it's crazy, right? So, unless you're in California, because there's a ton of Armenians there, or unless you're Armenian, or um a lot of people don't still don't know about it, and she's been a big voice for it just because she's famous, right? And she's one of the only famous Armenians out there. So I think, you know, and her sister too, Chloe, and like other other, you know, Jerry Tarkania, and there's other some other famous Armenians, but there's not that many, and she's been a voice.

SPEAKER_02

She's probably the biggest other than maybe Cher.

SPEAKER_03

Cher is um, she she's bigger than Cher, you know, unfortunately. Unfortunately, I guess, because Cher's is you know, Cheryl.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, Cher is more the old old people our age that know her. Kim Kardashian, basically, everybody knows her. So yeah, but when you don't know, you have a hero her name.

SPEAKER_02

So that's right. Well, I just wanted to uh say that I do regret saying anything negative about Kim Kardashian. She never did anything to me. And as someone who's always saying be kind, I literally wear clothing that says be kind, I'm a fucking hypocrite.

SPEAKER_00

I think I was just jealous about I was jealous about uh she's dating loose handsome.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, it's all that's right, that's how it started. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

No, to be honest, I don't like her content, but in other hands, we really don't know her. That's the reality. We know what she sells, but she sells because has someone out there that wants by that with the uh the you know the influencer or the product or whatever, you know, and she sells what to give money because uh the other things normally don't give too much money, like if we're gonna be able to do it. Louis Hamilton makes her read intelligence, uh, women that is you know, scientists, like a right, who give a shit for that?

SPEAKER_01

Nobody does, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

That's the reality. This is like what you're right public want, and she sells what they want. So we remote.

SPEAKER_03

Well, we're just really quick to judge. We all are, yeah. And actually, I was gonna talk about that like earlier, like um you know, I I'm having I think this is like like I don't like jumping on someone because they're um not vegan, or because they're you know, quote unquote an animal abuser, right? Like because I was there, I used to be there, you know, and like um like I have friends still that that hunt, right? Other than that, they're nice people, they just don't see the light. I didn't see the light before. I never hunted, I was never like but but back then I had nothing against it at all, right? I probably didn't like it, right?

SPEAKER_00

But like I I didn't so it's just I don't know if I would be able to be friends of a hunter.

SPEAKER_03

Well, that's yeah, I mean like our conversation this is coming actually from me and Vanessa had a conversation about a um a famous football player, his name is Erlen Holland, and Erline is a he's a Norwegian, and he's a seems like a really nice guy, and he and he and he's very friendly and like everyone loves him now, right? But Vanessa pointed out that he has like a line of bags of like leather bags with Hermes, and and also what I didn't tell you, Vanessa, is I did a little more research, and this guy's a big guy, he's like a Viking, he's like 6'5, like 230 pounds. His diet is like um it's all meat, it's like raw meat, raw milk, and uh but I still have to.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I saw basically uh hurt, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

But but where do you but where but it's but where do you draw the line, right? Like, do you then not root for your your you know like like are there comics that are there are there comic book creators that you just wouldn't wouldn't read, Joey, because you found out they hunted, or are there movies that you would just never watch or directors and like they're gonna draw the line for me?

SPEAKER_02

If you're a convicted rapist, I'm not gonna see that's a little different, yeah. Yeah, like Roman Polanski. No, I'm gonna I'm not gonna give that man my money, he's a horrible human being. Quentin Tarantino is an asshole. I think he's a terrible person as well, but he's not a convicted rapist and he makes great movies. So I'll watch Quentin Tarantino's movies because it's one thing to be an asshole, it's another to be a convicted rapist, uh, who then fled to another country to escape the law. Um, so yeah, I mean, there are certain things where it's like, no, I'm not gonna give this guy my money.

SPEAKER_03

My my uh my favorite sport is obviously hockey. I've talked about it a lot on this podcast. And many many hockey players are Canadians, and many of those Canadians grow up on farms. Um, you know, it's more of a rural country than the United States. A lot of them hunt, and I see some of their pictures on Instagram, and I bet you there's guys on every single team that hunt. And I I haven't really thought about it until now, but like if it would if it was like my wife's attitude, if it was Vanessa's mentality, she would never watch any of these guys because of that. And it's like, where do I draw the line? I don't know. I'm just throwing it out there.

SPEAKER_00

It's not about it's not about like never watch it, it's about admire. I can't admire someone that really has a line of arm's bag that kills uh like it raise and kill animals that's not even for food, you know? Because sometimes you can understand, okay, they kill for food and they use the letter, but there is like uh they they raise uh little alligators in cages just to be killed and became uh a bag. One of these bags takes like a around two alligators, it's not a ligator, it's the small one. No, it's a it's an alligator, but not alligator. There is another kind of alligator, no? Oh, caimans, caymans, they're smaller than the alligators, the big ones. So they kill these animals just to become a purse. One purse in uh the average start at $10,000. Okay, so someone that promote is basically only exploitation, really bad, and it has other cute animals too, okay, guys. It's not only the elegators.

SPEAKER_03

I completely agree with you, but like, can you can you separate it and admire their soccer skills? Admire someone like you can't you can't admire their soccer skills, and and no, I can't I can't admire someone that hunts.

SPEAKER_00

I I can't because especially these rich guys, like the same way uh in Brazil is being like very controversial because many of these players are they are like uh with these bats um companies that in Brazil, if you sign with them gambling, gambling, gambling, and people people gambling with your code, as much more people lose, they gain. Okay, these people, these players, they don't need more money.

SPEAKER_03

It's so, but you know what? Like we have the master if we're talking about it's it's every athlete in the United States is promote now is promoting either a gambling site, an alcohol, a gambling company, an alcohol company, cigars.

SPEAKER_00

I I can't admire guys, sorry.

SPEAKER_03

I know, but and actors too, right? Like, you got like George Clooney, he's got like a tequila company or something. You got artists, you got like Sammy Hagar has a tequila company. So, like, if we're gonna do that, we're not gonna watch movies, we're not gonna listen to music, and we're not gonna watch sports because we're gonna have a problem with I'm I'm not saying you're water than that, I'm just saying, like, where do you draw the line?

SPEAKER_00

Don't watch it, don't don't don't, you know, it's not it's not about this about admire and cheers for someone that my values they are so low that I can't admire.

SPEAKER_03

Well, what's the what's the difference between where do you so you can watch it but you can't cheer?

SPEAKER_00

Uh it's not a kid. I don't admire, like I'm not getting excited to see. I don't think he's a good person. I oh, he's too young. Maybe one day he's going to see it. Maybe one day he's going to see it that he doesn't need more money than keeping in the exploring animals that's not even for food. Um, for example, I don't like Neymar. He cheats his wife all the time on the news. Like, this is this is someone that's completely against all my values. Like, how I cannot admire, how can I cheer? Wow, so sex for this guy. I I want his book getting fired. I don't care.

SPEAKER_03

Joey, where where do you? I mean, you're you draw the line on rape, obviously.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, also child rape uh like molesting that whole like there's a director named Victor Salva.

SPEAKER_01

Um, this guy who that's I don't know if you ever saw the movie Powder.

SPEAKER_02

The guy, yeah, his name is Victor Salva. He directed the movie Powder, Jeepers, Creepers. He raped a little boy, and he's still making movies for some reason. Hollywood is a gross place sometimes, but yeah, convict people who are convicted rapists, murderers, yeah, well, yeah, obviously.

SPEAKER_03

Um but that's like my line, too, right? But I don't know if I could ever get to the point where Vanessa's where it's like I'm gonna just not watch something because I know that person, you know, is a hunter, right? Or I know that person promotes something that I don't agree on.

SPEAKER_00

Um well, it's not that I'm not going to watch it, John, because if it was like that, I was not even watching movies because probably has a bunch of people there that hunt and everything else, but someone that I know that does this kind of thing, like a hunt for someone gets a gun, go out there and kill an innocent animal. For me, some of that I I can't admire, I know what's be a friend.

SPEAKER_03

I'm not arguing with you, I'm just throwing it out actually for our audience, too. It's an interesting topic because it's and and there are there are people, there's a lot of people like you, Vanessa, that are just like, I don't, I'm not gonna partake in any of this because all these people are bad. They're they're they know the issues with hunting, they know the issues with gambling and alcohol, and they still promote all this stuff, right?

SPEAKER_00

And and they don't need many of them don't need oh, they don't need it at all.

SPEAKER_03

Like George Clooney, who I think is a great actor, he's a cool guy. He doesn't need to have an alcohol company, he knows what it does. But then at the same time, you look at George Clooney and you think about wait a minute, he's one of the biggest supporters of recognizing genocides in the world, right? Him and his wife, they're like, they go to like and speak on like uh Daforer in Africa and all these issues, right? So it's like it's it's hard, it's a hard decision like to make. Like, is he a good person? Is he a bad person? I think just people are just not a hundred percent good or bad. Like you're talking about Neymar, Vanessa. Like, uh, so Joey, Neymar is like a really big Brazilian. Soccer player. Neymar probably gives a lot of money to charity, right? I think he does.

SPEAKER_00

But he didn't try make private beaches that was public. So I don't know.

SPEAKER_03

But at the same time, he's cheated on his wife.

SPEAKER_00

So it's like not only this. Cheat on his wife, he promotes gambling a lot. And also he tries, like someone that grew up poor, he tried open resorts and make some public uh like beaches, like private. So I don't know, it's a bunch of stuff, you know. It's not one thing or the other, it's just things that I do not admire.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it's hard, it's hard to draw the line though, because I just think these demons are flawed and like they're like it's not it's not black and white, you know.

SPEAKER_02

It's very difficult when it's something you like. For example, I remember when there was a whole controversy with Chick-fil-A, because uh I think I I don't remember this is like 15-20 years ago, but there was a controversy because the owner of Chick-fil-A uh like said he was against gay marriage, something like that. So uh there was a whole thing about people boycotting, yeah, people boycotting Chick-fil-A. I boycotted it because I was, you know, it was easy for me. I'm I'm I'm vegan. I remember uh I posted on Instagram a picture of a Chick-fil-A with me putting my middle finger up, but I mean I'm vegan, so what what's it gonna do? Me boycotting Chick-fil-A, yeah, right. Um and another thing is like the the owner of Jimmy Johns, he went to Africa and he's killing lions and elephants, and that's horrible. Like you're killing lions and elephants, you know, these beautiful animals, and I'm not gonna go to Jimmy John's, but I wasn't gonna go to Jimmy John's anyway. So it's very easy for me to again quote uh air quotes boycott uh these companies that do things I don't like, but it's much more difficult. Like let's say one of my favorite uh actors is Matthew McConaughey. I think he's a great actor, he was amazing in uh uh Dallas Buyers Club, Interstellar. He's just a hell of an actor. Oh my god, the first season of True. Yeah, but let's say uh Matthew, by the way, before you move on, Dave's that's what I like about high school girls. I get older, they stay the same age. Yes, they do. Oh my god. That was good that was that was a line from the movie. I'm not like trying, that's not like my my my life goal or anything. That's just a line from the movie to be clear.

SPEAKER_00

I get it.

SPEAKER_02

My very bad Matthew McConaughey accent. Um, but anyway, yeah. But if I were to find out that Matthew McConaughey is, let's say, uh, you know, he he raped a woman, like all of a sudden it's like, oh my god, this this actor who I think is great did this terrible thing. Am I gonna stop watching his movies? I I probably would, or maybe I'd do like what I did with Roman Polanski's movie Rosemary's Baby. I bought the disc used.

SPEAKER_03

If he raped a woman, maybe I would stop. I mean, I I I stopped watching talking about past movies.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, future movies, forget about it, right? But as far as like past movies, because I wouldn't be able to get it out of my head. This dude's a fucking rapist. You know, Kevin Spacey stuff. Kevin Spacey? Yeah. It's a lot easier when he's the villain, like in the movie seven, because you kind of hate the character anyway, so it's a lot easier. But if it's a movie where you root for Kevin Spacey, like in uh, you know, American Beauty or uh um, oh, what's that movie? Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil and House of Cards, it's very difficult for me.

SPEAKER_03

I haven't brought myself to be able to watch anything Kevin Spacey since that came out, but I also had firsthand knowledge that he was a total creep. So yeah, we have me and Vanessa have a friend named and ex-boyfriend was an assistant director on house.

SPEAKER_00

John, you should not mention their names.

SPEAKER_03

That's okay, like a hundred people that watch this.

SPEAKER_00

So Joey, if you can't, I don't know, cut. I think it's bleep out the name, yeah. I've leaped the name, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

I I've heard from the assistant director of the show that he was a creep, yeah, and that he was just what came out was the truth, right? So since then I've I've had this in my head, and like I just don't want to watch um Seven again, and I don't want to watch uh American Beauty again, yeah, because I just think of him in that way, you know. I guess like but but will you watch another Harvey Weinstein film? You will, and it's because Harvey Weinstein's not in the film, you don't see him, but you know, in the beginning of the film, it's it still says Weinstein, right? Or Weinstein production or whatever.

SPEAKER_02

Don't forget, I have this vast collection of movies on disc, so it's it's like I can watch a movie, and knowing that he wasn't really part of the creative process is very different from let's say Roman Polanski, who is the director, you know, um, or an actor, it's very difficult when they're in front of the camera, especially. But when it's uh you know, like an a guy who's just basically the studio executive, that doesn't really like I wouldn't see a future Harvey Weinstein movie, not that there will be um that dude's riding in prison as he should be. Um, but yeah, if he were, you know, if he were to for whatever reason get out of prison and start putting movies out again, no, I wouldn't watch it. Just like I wouldn't watch a movie directed by Victor Salva or Roman Polanski. That's but I I think I think finally Roman Polanski's getting the the the blacklisting that he deserves. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, but anyway, you know, we still have one more email to read.

SPEAKER_00

Oh yeah, go for the next.

SPEAKER_02

All right, Alexandra G from Poland writes, right? Right? Yeah, hi Vanessa, Joey, and John. I just wanted to say that I really enjoy listening to your podcast. I found it only a couple of days ago, and I'm catching up with the older episodes. I'm currently listening to the one about vegan restaurants adding meat to their menus, and I have some thoughts related to what you were discussing off topic. I consider myself to be a left-leaning Catholic, and I'd like to clear up the issue whether non-human animals have souls. Then in parentheses, she writes, I don't know if the people who are using this argument had the same view on that as me. Those are these are just my thoughts. End parentheses. I personally think they don't, but I'm defining a soul as the thing that allows you to distinguish good from evil, have moral values, and encourage you to seek something or someone bigger than yourself, e.g., God. The lack of a soul doesn't justify the torture and murder that we subject the animals to, though. Their sentience, so the ability to feel emotions and sensations, including pain, and their personalities are something separate from the soul and are purely biological central nervous system. In my opinion, killing an animal is still better than killing a human, but why do either when it's unnecessary? I hope it helps you when you consider arguments like that. It always depends on one's definition of a soul. I'm surprised when I hear that Christians try to justify abusing non-human animals with this argument. I found veganism as perfectly aligning with my Christian values, such as avoiding the violence and just trying to make this world a better place. As I already said, I really appreciate the work you put into the podcast and can't wait for another episode to come out. All the best, Alexandra G, listening all the way from Poland. That was awesome. Yeah, Alexandra G, you're awesome. I really appreciate that email. We all do. That's really, really cool and very thought-provoking.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, well, she's a left, she's a left-leaning Catholic, so that's yeah, she feels that way. If she was right-leaning, you know, she'd probably feel a little different. Yeah, but it's interesting. I mean, it was a very well, I don't know if AI helped her at all to write that, but if it didn't maybe Google Translate, or maybe she's actually an English speaker.

SPEAKER_02

Not everyone is like us, John, only knowing one language. Vanessa's the only one here who knows more than one language.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so yeah, I I need help. And after after AI, I have to tell you, I became lazy because before I need to take time to try put all together, but to be honest, even taking time, many times I was right or wrong. So it's just like, whatever, let me use what the tools I have now. Uh, you know, people are using for so much worse stuff than I do, so whatever. Anyways, uh, you know, I think uh I think being Christian, uh Christ is love. So yeah, maybe that's why she can see in this way. It doesn't matter if she believes or does not believe that the animals have souls or not, it's still Christ is love and uh just shared love. So we cannot think about uh making some animal suffering in a good way, you know. Uh she she's totally right in the sense that yes, they send they feel pain, and if you don't need kill, then we should not. Anyways, people do.

SPEAKER_03

I think the word soul is it's a human word, it's not an animal word, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Um yeah, because people say that animals doesn't have soul, uh, because in the for the Christians, uh, just humans has a soul. Uh, I do not believe that. This is not what I believe, because I really believe they can understand everything, and that there is something inside them. It's not just in reflection, you know. I really believe there is something else.

SPEAKER_03

They have something that we have.

SPEAKER_00

This is my faith.

SPEAKER_03

What they have something that we have, whether it's a soul or whatever, I don't know, but they definitely, right?

SPEAKER_00

If you look at um even if it's like a religious concept, you know, right? It's a human, we even don't believe that.

SPEAKER_03

If you look, even if you look at my cats, right? The cats, like they're if you really look at a cat, it's not that much different than us. It's got two eyes, it's got an ears, it's got a nose. Um, we didn't evolve from we didn't evolve, they hear, they smell, right? They're not like some alien compared to us, you know what I mean? Like uh we didn't evolve from cats, but uh we weren't too far away. So when like they die, we die, we have we both have bones, you know. We're we're similar to cats and dogs and gorillas and elephants and you know, they're all a little different, I guess, but but we have a lot of similarities, and I think that's for me. That's like I I I think about that, and it's like, how can I eat and kill any anything that is alive, right? That that that is a sentient being that has that can but plants are alive. Oh, plants have feelings, that's why I said a sentient being, you know, plants are I couldn't, I couldn't, don't don't make it. They want to live, they all want to live, so do we. We want to live, right? Like that's that's I think the main thing that defines us all.

SPEAKER_02

Well, you see these horrific videos of you know, cows literally screaming when their child is taken from them, you know.

SPEAKER_00

They fight, they really try to fight and they run after the baby. It's pretty sad. And actually, in the morning, I saw some news, I think about Jennifer Anistr.

SPEAKER_03

Anniston, yeah. Armstrong, Armstrong.

SPEAKER_00

No joke, can you please say her last name? Anniston, Anniston, and one of the Kardashian sisters, but I don't know which one was it, I don't remember the name. They are promoting now the first as the first milk that the cow give when have a calf for skin, like hot.

SPEAKER_03

What are they promoting?

SPEAKER_00

It's like a gold. Let's see the name. Let us see exactly the name. And you say the name. I was I was like, no.

SPEAKER_03

It's definitely not Kim Kardashian.

SPEAKER_00

Uh one of the evil. Let's see, let's see. I can find it here. Um blah blah blah. Where is this? Here. Uh cow's first milk. They are paying one hundred dollars for cows first milk and they are promoting this is Courtney Kardashian. Is it Courtney Kardashian?

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

As a cosmetic thing.

SPEAKER_01

So it's called better, Joy.

SPEAKER_00

They is lately. I I you know, I I had more hope in the past. Unfortunately, I've been losing my hope. Because the thing is, it doesn't get better for the animals like at all. They always come up with something new, stupid, like this, you know. Yeah, uh, and always have someone saying about that, and someone buying what they say, you know, and everybody running, find a cow that just has a baby to get the first meal can pay $100.

SPEAKER_03

I just think because change change takes a long, long time.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I don't think we are going to see. Sorry guys, I I used to be more optimist.

SPEAKER_03

I think by the time our, you know, by the by the time by the time we're done on earth in our lifetimes, I think we'll see changes.

SPEAKER_00

I think there'll be more people that are vegan, but um yeah, we will see not vegan, but I think we will see many people eating the lab, grow meat, because these big companies is already investing a lot of money, uh, like Tyson, this these companies, like uh the animal abusers. Now they won't invest because probably they make more money. So that's why.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I and I said that a few a few times on episodes. I think that is what is going to be the change because it costs Tyson and these other big manufacturers so much money to keep a cow alive on the farm and to feed them and all the water it takes. So they're gonna make it, they're just gonna make it in a lab. And if that's what it takes to to make people become vegan, then that's what it is. Is that considered vegan or no?

SPEAKER_00

No, I don't think it will be considered you don't think so. I don't know. That's in the future, John. For now, they are not even selling this.

SPEAKER_03

Well, it's banned in Florida, don't forget.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, but it's banned in Italy, too.

SPEAKER_03

Where else is it banned in the United States?

SPEAKER_02

Do you know? I I only know Florida since you know we live here.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I can buy online from another state and they will deliver it just, yeah. If you win it, I don't really want uh eat that.

SPEAKER_03

So well, guys, you know what's a great, you know what is a great not an alternative, but but chunk is amazing, yes.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, it is so good. It's unbelievable.

SPEAKER_01

I resell, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

I I the store that's walking distance from me, uh, it's a health food store, has a bunch of them, and they have different types. They have the the chunk slab, chunk steak, chunk uh uh pullet shreds, pulled, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Pulled pork.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, pulled pork. Uh it's it's incredible. It's texture. What is that? Tuno plant-based. What is that? It's basically vegan tuna.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, plant-based tuna.

SPEAKER_02

Look, plant-based goodness. I didn't buy it, I didn't eat. We haven't tried that yet, right?

SPEAKER_00

No, we're going to try today. Nice. I make a tuna sandwich with this.

SPEAKER_03

We'll see if it's better than your tuna. That's gonna you, it's gonna be tough to beat your tuna, though. Your tuna's amazing, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, but I was super curious to to see it might be good, you know. I used to like installads and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_03

So for those for the listeners that have not had chunk before, try it. It's not cheap, but I think it is a lot cheaper than like a filet mignon.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's cheaper than real meat for sure.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, or a new york strip steak, it's still cheaper. So if you can find chunk, try it, especially the ones that are listening that are you know trying to go vegan or are not vegan at all, just you know, humor me here. I've been curious. Like, try chunk and let me know what you think. Because it is the closest to the real thing I've had. It is amazing.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, so we've recorded for an hour and a quarter. Uh, I'm gonna have to split this in two, and but it's kind of cool because we have a clear delineator. Uh, basically, uh 35 minutes of us bullshitting and then another 35 minutes of us uh getting into the emails and then responding. Um, so yeah, I think now is a good time to. I'm sorry. Oh no, not yet. Not yet. Uh, I have to do that thing. Uh well, first I want to encourage all of you to email us at vegans talking shit at gmail.com. You might get your emails read, just like these uh last three emails were, and uh also visit us on social media at vegans talking shit at you know basically all the uh all the social media platforms, but not Twitter. Fuck Twitter.

SPEAKER_00

If you want to support our podcasts, go in our Shopify store.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, the link to our Shopify store will be in the episode description. So please uh buy some vegans talking shit merchandise like coffee mugs and hoodies and t-shirts and a teddy bear. So for vegans talking shit, I'm Joey, I'm John, I'm Vanessa, and we are out of here. Bye, everyone.

SPEAKER_00

Bye bye bye.

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Joey Di Girolamo

Host
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Jon Missirlian

Host
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Vanessa Silva

Host