Revving Up Ducati: Insights on Performance, Passion, and Evolving Maintenance

Join hosts Justin and Jeff in this episode of the Throttle Stop Moto Podcast, brought to you by Pandora's European Motorsports. They welcome back Ducati enthusiast and service technician Justin Gay, who shares his passion for Ducati motorcycles and insights on their evolving maintenance and performance standards.

The discussion delves into Ducati's transformation since the Audi Group acquisition in 2012, highlighting improved reliability and maintenance intervals for models like the Panigale V4 and Multistrada V2. The episode addresses common misconceptions about Ducati's maintenance needs, citing advancements that make these bikes more accessible and manageable for everyday riders.

Listeners can expect a deep dive into Ducati's technical features, including ride modes, engine specs, and the impact of the six-axis IMU on performance. The hosts also reflect on the balance between cutting-edge technology and the pure thrill of riding, emphasizing Ducati's commitment to rider experience.

Justin, Jeff, and the special guest dork out over the intricacies of Ducati's offerings while pondering the joys and challenges of motorcycling. Whether you're a long-time Ducati fan or new to the brand, this episode promises valuable insights and entertaining banter about the world of Ducati motorcycles.

Tune in for an engaging conversation, and be sure to check back for more episodes!

https://www.pandorasmotorsports.com/

Transcript

All right. Welcome to the Throttle Stop Moto Podcast brought to you by Pandora's European Motorsports. I'm Justin. I'm Jeff. And today we have another Justin with us. Yep. Jeff, you want to introduce him? Yeah. So this is Justin Gay. He is our service technician for Ducati specifically. He's also been helping us out in sales. So if you've seen him on the floor, that's likely where you have seen him. But yeah, I mean, he has been a motorcycle and specifically Ducati fanatic for a very long time. And that has translated into how he's worked. He worked with us a while back and was moved around a little bit, but that's where he ended up was in the service department as a technician. Eventually he cheated on us and left for a while. And I still haven't gotten over it. But he's back. Where did he go? I'm not going to plug those guys. They're not going to open up old wounds. But no, he went. No, honestly, he went to an Indian dealer and like, you know, what made you come back? What was it? Passion for the brands. Yeah. It was a good opportunity, but really it's the passion for the brands that we carry at Pandora's. Whenever I was talking to him before, it was, you know, he could go home at night and not care. And that was one of the good things about it. But it's hard to be involved in something, especially something that's so passion driven like motorcycling and not have something that you genuinely care about. Yeah. So, you know, that was a little bit hard. And being back with the people here at Pandora's, I'm sure, was a big part of it because, you know, it is a family over there. And we try to treat each other well. I think that we have we've grown a lot. We have some new faces, but all the changes that we've made have been really good. Yeah. Every time I go in there, you get to my new. Yeah. But I brought him in because it's the it's the Ducati brand that he really embodies in our showroom when he's up there. And it's a it's really a passion for him. And if I want to really talk about Ducati, he's the guy. Like if I have a question, he's the guy. You have a KTM question, come to me. But, you know, he is equally that for Ducati. So I wanted to kind of bring him in here and play devil's advocate because, you know, you know, Ducati for a long time, they are the high maintenance, high performance, just Italian junk that breaks down pretty quickly. So I guess without lack for lack of anything better. How do you answer that? So the biggest thing for me with Ducati is and I've owned them since about 2008. So 2008, I bought my first Ducati. It was a 1098 analog, no ABS, no traction control, throttle by cable, all the old school technology. And at the time, arguably, I probably would have agreed with you. 2012, the Audi group stepped in, Volkswagen Audi group. And since then, the focus has really been on maintenance, reliability, the customer experience and getting rid of some of those negative connotations everybody has for the brand. In that same year, 2012, we had the first 1199 Panigale come out. It was a step away from the timing belt driven engines, which saves on some of your maintenance. It also kept the previous structure of the 15,000 mile Desmos service. So spreading things out, and I know you have the multi-straddle before, probably the pinnacle at this point of the maintenance side of things, you've got oil services every 9,300 miles or two years by the book. And your valve services are spread out to 37,000, which is just kind of insane. That's literally the only reason why I actually went to Ducati. And that's an answer. I was like, oh, okay. Because I'm not a maintenance guy. We've talked about this several times. When I have a bike, if it needs anything, I just drop it off at the shop. I'm not doing the maintenance myself because I don't have time. And so that's why I've stayed away from bikes like Ducati's. That's why my supermoto's are never converted dirt bikes because I don't like the maintenance and stuff on them like that. Literally that one thing is what brought me over to Ducati. Not everyone's performance driven and performance oriented. So it's nice to have bikes like the multi-straddle, the Diablo that have that grand trismo engine. And it's easy for us to quote the highest maintenance intervals that we have. But what about a bike like this? So sitting behind us is our first 2025 Panagli V4S. That strategy is an initial service at 600 miles, 9,300 mile or two years on oil services. And then our Desmo service is still at 15,000. So still on par with a lot of its competitors. I mean the BMW I believe is 18,000 miles. So a few thousand extra, but we're not talking the old days of my 1098 being in the for a valve check every 7,500 miles. Yeah. And so we end up with a bike that is fast, reliable, pretty low maintenance. And the one thing that you can't get with that is cheap. It's not a cheap bike. I mean Ducati in general. Ducati actually comes from the word ducat. And it's just a plural form of ducat. So if you hear someone say Ducati's, well Ducati is already plural. But yeah, so you're not getting a cheap bike. What beautiful, beautiful. Yes. And that's the thing. These things, you know, they do have some German influence. I think that's the part that kind of met with the Italian part of them and made them a durable, reliable bike and said, yeah, I feel like, you know, Audi group came in, Volkswagen group came in and said, you know, I know you like to make fast bikes. I know you like that you have this passion for beauty, the speed, all of that. But we also have to sell some because you can't just go racing every Sunday and not have any way to fuel that. So I feel like that's kind of what happened in that 2012 era. And we're way past 2012. I mean, we got 10 years on that. 13 years on that. Welcome to now. I know. Right. Come on. I'm rounding. But yeah, all of that kind of comes together and produces a bike that you can't have fast, durable, reliable. You just can't have it cheap. Yeah. You got to pick. Yeah. To go off of that, though, I think we have a strategy that's coming through with the new V2 engines and the two new models that that's incorporating where the pricing strategy is fairly aggressive. Just a couple of notes. If we look at the current Panagale V2, you're at $18,795 plus your freight and prep and whatever taxes go on in your area. And they put it on a diet. Yeah. They put it on a diet. Everybody's talking about the horsepower. That is kind of the elephant in the room. But the new Panagale we have coming in at just over $15 for the base model and $18.9 for the S. And with the S, you're actually getting more bike than the current because you get the Olin suspension, which is a departure from their old strategy with the middle weight bike. Yeah. You're talking about the new Panagale V2 compared to the old what changes. So engine is completely new. We are losing weight. We are going from about the 150 horsepower mark to 120, which is kind of a-- So that's a 30 horsepower drop. That is true. However, earlier this month, there were some comments from a test in Valencia at the Espar circuit, I believe it was. Mark Marquez hopped on a bone stock Panagale V2 and did a one minute 12 lap around that circuit, which was matching their unofficial track record. On a race prepped current model V2, he matched that time. But we're talking about a motorcycle that you can walk in the dealership. Real exhaust, headlight, tail lights, all the weight that comes from that stuff. And he's able to put in a one minute 12. And of course, he's an alien. We all know that. Is that comparing that time just to the older bike or to competitive bikes? So the unofficial record of that track is in that 112 window across the Super Sport segment, I think was the comment that was made. The race prepped V2 that they used in World Super Sport this past year was the opposite bike that he got to use and then the road going. New model 25 V2. It's not all just about horsepower, not horsepower. Right. And you have tracks like-- I don't know that track. Is it a horsepower track? I don't know. But sometimes, saving weight is way more important. And I think that for the average consumer who's riding day in, day out, that's going to be more important than having peak horsepower, especially on the street. Because on the street, you're never going to get to that peak horsepower. If you do, you're alerting the neighbors, the cops, everyone who's around you because you're spooling up to 15,000 RPM. And a lighter bike is more fun, especially on the street. It's just easier to manage. And you're going to get up to those speeds quicker, even though you have less horsepower because that more horsepower, you're going to see most likely on the top end. Yeah. And where do we ride? Yeah, we don't want to go to jail. Day in and day out, you're going to ride the bike that's easy to get on and ride. And that's not going to be your full-on sport bike that's-- Trying to kill you. Trying to kill you all the time. And that's not to say that the Panagale V2 is not a fast bike. It's absolutely a fast bike. It's obviously getting close to track records. Compare it to the fastest bikes on the market 10 years ago. Well, yeah, it's no V4, right? But the specs on that engine, you've mentioned 120 horsepower, but it's also only 120 pounds. It's one of the few-- it's not a square because you're normally talking about more in stroke when you talk square, but it is square in terms of having equal weight and power. That engine also features a new multi-strata. Yes. But wait, before we do that, I had a question. Does it still have the Desmo valves? It does not. OK. So it is going to a spring valve system more like the multi-strata V4, the Gran Turismo platform. It is variable intake valve timing as well. So a little different strategy than what we've seen from Ducati in the past. That bike, I believe, based on what I've seen, is going to be on that same structure like the one behind us. It's going to be 9,300 miles for your oil services for two years and then 15,000 miles for its valve inspection. But I believe, based on everything I've seen, it's also going to be less labor intensive. Would it be 18,000 miles on valve inspection? You may be correct. OK. Because you've got the 9,000, that's what I was asking. And my update for that is next week, as you know. Yeah, that's one thing. Since he is also service tech, he's going to school next week, you said? Yes. And that's going to be all about the V2? So Tuesday and Wednesday, the class will be going on. We will cover the new V2 engine and the electronic updates that go along with it. I believe we'll also have some electronic updates and other things for the motorcycle behind us, which the engine hasn't changed a whole lot, but everything else is pretty much all new. Yeah. I'm still on the V2. Yeah. I've heard that the ergonomics are a little different. They change. From what I can tell from the-- In a Gully V2, to be clear. Introduction. Yes. From what I can tell from the introduction, if we want to think of it, current V2 and the Super Sport, it's almost like those two bikes are coming together. Similar to what Triumph's done with the Daytona 660, a little bit more relaxed in the handlebar position. The rider triangle was a big focus. Cool thing that Ducati's done is, even though we're going to have those more step up clip-on style, they are going to have a true clip-on as an accessory. If you're the guy that wants to be in the mountains, you want to be on the racetrack and you don't care for it to be a little bit more aggressive, you now have that choice. Oh, nice. I've heard that yet. That's cool. It's going to be pretty cool. What about the Super Sport? Have they changed anything? Super Sport, I haven't seen anything official, but I do believe it is going away. Oh, really? Oh. I should know more on that, and we should know more on that on the sales side, but I think that the ones that we have currently are going to be the last ones we see. Honestly, that's more what I have been looking at upgrading to a sport bike is the Super Sport 950, just because it's more comfortable. I cannot ride. I would die on this thing, just being cramped up and hit cramps and stuff. The last time I rode my 600, I literally locked up on the interstate, couldn't get my-- Don't lock. I was like, all right, I'm getting too old for this. I need something that's a little-- You're realizing that there's a big difference between what performs and what's comfortable. Yes, exactly. I've also gotten too comfortable riding the Multistrada. Oh, man. That'll get you relaxed. And Testa Strata engine on the Super Sport, right? Yes. Okay, he was schooling me on the different names on this. We got the Testa Strata, we got the Super Quadro, the Super Quadromano. Not Quattro. Quadro. Quadro. The D on the T. Yes. Then what's this one called? This is the Desmos Adichie Stradale. Oh, man. So you got to learn a little bit of Italian if you really want to know your engines with Ducati. Thank goodness we have someone like you that can kind of school you on it if you come in the shop. And so at least you don't have to know all the models, you just have to know what you have. And, you know, Ducati is really good about what you're into, that kind of family. They really do treat you well. And they have the app that they use. And if you don't have the Ducati app and you have a Ducati, you're missing out because they give you opportunities for like new bikes that are coming out. They give you opportunities for things like Ducati Island that is coming up from MotorGP. You learn about that stuff first before someone who isn't a Ducatista. Ducatista. Ducatista. There you go. I was stumbling and scammering through that one. But they really appreciate their Ducatista. Ducatista. So you've got to learn a little bit of Italian here. Invest in the shop. But I think Ducatista is an Italian. Ducatista. That just came from the internet. Oh man. No, that's what they call them because it's the plural form of Ducatista. But hey, no, probably it's not. But anyway, I just say all that to say like there's opportunities if you do get on Ducati that like they want you for that next purchase and they go out of their way to make sure you get it. And you've got like your garage set up and you have like the different bikes that are in that garage and you can kind of keep up with your maintenance intervals and your schedule on that. Yeah. And that actually helps too whenever you go to sell that bike. You can actually show like hey, I've done all my maintenance. And it makes a big difference on value because if I have a bike that you've had like a hyper motard for more than five years and it hasn't had belts, well I'm going to look at that and say, okay, I'll trade it in but I know I've got to do belts on this thing because it hasn't been done. But back to the V2 here. Sorry to get off track there. But you've got the Panagoli V2 and we also got the multi-shot of V2 that I was trying to go to earlier but we kind of had more to talk about. What about it? Tell me about it. All new, completely different, lighter, more approachable. Again, a pretty aggressive pricing strategy. So the current model, we don't have a base version. We only get the S model here in the States. So we're looking at a $19,000 bike currently. With the updates, we're going to have an option for one that comes in just below 16. And then the up spec S model is going to be at that 19.2 mark. So it still saves a little bit of money. And I made a little noise there. But like if you think about that $19,000 price point and you compare it to what else is out there, that's pretty in line with what everything else is. Whenever you talk about the fully upgraded suspension, all of that stuff. And with the new V2 coming out, I don't know what Ducati strategy is. And they kind of have the back end stuff that we can't advertise all of that stuff. So it's always important to call and talk to us because we can always see what's available as far as financing promos and things like that that can help us. But yeah, with a new Ducati, with a new multi V2 that's coming out, you do have some options if you want to get into a lower price point. How's the seat height on it? Are they lowering it at all? Or is it? I don't know. I'm not 100% sure. I didn't look up that specific. And it's, sorry. So to be clear, the only models for the V2 multi-strata is just the V2 and the V2S? Yes. Okay. So there's no rally or? As far as right now, they're releasing it as just a base and a S. A rally version of the V2. And I think this kind of puts the multi-strata V2 squarely in that mid-size category where before it was a V2, but it had horsepower that compete with some of the big four stuff. Yeah. And it was close to 1,000 cc engine. I mean, 937 and then new one is 890, I believe. Yeah. The new V2. So a little bit smaller displacement. How much power does it make in the multi-strata? Still that 120. So that engine. Yeah. Yeah. Compare that to like a Tiger 900. Yeah. About 90 mid-90s on horsepower. I don't know. Probably a heavier bike. Yeah. But we talked about the multi-strata V2. The engine doesn't have the desmo valves. So one of the reasons that they did that was to smooth out that engine, particularly at low RPM. And that really helps when you're talking about an adventure bike that may not be on pavement all the time. That kind of will smooth that out a little bit. Anything else before we move on? Because I mean, the multi-strata V2 is exciting. We just don't know as much about it versus the fast stuff that we're used to selling. And the multi came out, the information came out on that later. So we're a little bit, don't have a ton to talk about on it, but we definitely have a lot to talk about on this Panagale V4. You were telling me yesterday just the screen itself was impressive. It's very different. It has so much functionality. There's a two menu button strategy with this new bike. So you actually have your main control to get through your different screen layouts. And then there's a secondary control. So you have access to all of your electronic graduates at the press of a button. So on the fly, you can make a change to traction control, ABS, the slide control, all the things that go along with that. It also incorporates a throttle outline. So it shows you how much throttle input you're actually giving it as well as your brake pressure. So it has two different little bar graphs that'll show you that stuff while you're riding. Not that you want to be staring at the dash, but it's like a TV screen on this thing. Is that stuff you're really going to use at a track day? You could. And with the DDA, I believe all that stuff's going to be tracked. So Hunter and I were talking at the shop, obviously with his race experience, for a guy that's looking for that little bit, having the DDA being able to see all those parameters, you can kind of see where you're missing out and kind of target as far as making yourself better. But it's very, there's so much tech. And I only had a few minutes to go through some of that. That thing came in yesterday morning and we were like, let's get this out and get it ready. And are we still looking at like a six axis IMU or have they gone further than that? I still believe it's six axis. So we don't have anything beyond what the previous did have. We do have a new strategy within all the systems with the Ducati Vehicle Observer. Right, yeah. So one of the crazy things with that is I believe it's in the race modes and in the road mode. It is actually able to apply the rear brake for you. So not only a combined strategy where it's adding rear brake with the front lever, but on corner exit and the track mode, it'll actually drag the rear brake to help square up that corner. Oh, wow. So it's going a step further than what we've seen from a lot of the Superbikes. Justin looks flabbergasted. My Sportbike's a 2006. Why would I want- I'm lucky to have ABS. So why would I want a computer telling me when I want the, when the brakes should be applied? I do. Let's just be honest here. So one of the things that Ducati was looking for with this bike from all the information I've seen, having seen it in person now, it's all about making it easier to ride quickly. Yeah. Everybody's talking about the swing arm. The old swing arm was heavy. It was very stiff. It's beautiful. We all can agree on that. And I think that really was why people wanted the single side swing arm. I mean, yes, there's the idea that you can just get on one side and zip, zip, zip, take off the wheel. But, sorry, I'm sorry. There's one big nut on that one. My bad. Wood zip. But it looks really cool on Instagram. It looks really cool on Instagram. And that's kind of what people were focused on with that bike. But now we have the dual. Yeah. And honestly, I know we can't really see it in the frame, but the swing arm itself is still very pretty. Oh, yeah. The new wheels that Ducati developed, and they're no longer Marchesini's on the S model. They're actually a Ducati-designed forged wheel. Okay. So they in-housed that bike. They in-housed it? Yes. And we're talking about the S specifically, because that's the one we have. But we have that update to the wheel with the swing arm. And I think it still looks great. Is it a single-sided swing arm? No. But there's also reasons for it. And I think for anybody, if they can get on one of these and actually go ride it, they're probably going to come back saying that thing is really good and have a smile on their face. Well, and you know that's not a decision that a company like Ducati would take lightly, because they are typically the company that if it makes an aerodynamic difference, they're doing it. If it makes a speed difference, they're doing it. They make changes, but on something like that that's so-- it has been so iconic for the Ducati brand that they had to really think about it before they did that. It's more about stability than anything, the way I interpreted it. Stability and weight, because you can have stability with a single-sided swing arm, but it's not going to be light. And that thing was beefy. And I'm sure you've put a few of those on. Like, you really have to-- They're beefy. (Laughter) And they have to be, right? There's a lot of forces going through that. I wouldn't want it if it was a beefy. Yeah. And we have to make sure that everything stays together. And it does what it needs to, as far as giving the rider some feedback and giving the chassis dynamics that Ducati designed into the bike as well. On the Superbike side of things, you have to go back to, I believe, the triple nine to have another dual-sided swing arm. Middle weights, that's a little different than some of the monster models and other things that have come along. But it's been a long time since Ducati threw a standard swing arm, I guess we could call it, at one other Superbike. Do we still have the 24 model before? We have one left. Yeah. (Laughter) If you really are after that, it's all about the beauty for you. Have at it. Here's your last chance. Yeah. So we have a 2024 Panigale V4 standard model available and on the floor. But it is our last one. And I believe it's the last one in our region. So now's the time. We should check the price on that. You heard it here first. (Laughter) And you were talking about this. We mentioned the six-axis IMU. I don't think that everyone who's listening to this podcast or watching it on YouTube, I don't think they all know what that is. So I know that we have the inputs of lead angle, pitch, and then yaw. We also have yaw. Yaw is the one that throws me for a loop here. Because if I'm going straight, I shouldn't be kicked out. Right. (Laughter) So with the Panigale V4, and this was true on the previous generation as well, you have what Ducati refers to as Ducati slide control. You also have within the ABS algorithms, slide by brake. Slide by brake. Wow. You can use the rear brake to turn the rear end of the motorcycle. You can also use the traction control strategies to allow the rear end to be out of a straight line, out of alignment. Yeah. And there is-- Until a turn, you're not going to be in a straight line. And on corner exit, you may be hammering down. And I'm not brave enough to trust it. But there's guys out there that are that are going to crack the throttle open and just let the controls do what they're supposed to do. The guys in MotoGP, that's how they get around the racetrack. They're looking for a certain amount of slip to keep temperature in the tire and for everything to work together. So it's a trickle down effect from that stuff. And that's something we probably, I at least as a rider, shouldn't be thinking about going into a corner is how much slide do I need to steer with the back end going into it. You get on a track, you're doing track days, and you're listening to coaches. They really think two dimensionally as far as going into the corner. You're just following the line. But whenever you're talking about-- if you had any dirt bike experience, then you learn that there is some steering that happens in the rear end and on corner entry and on corner exit. But that is so hard to think about for people who have only ever ridden street bikes. Still hard to think about for me. When that came out on the V4 in 2018, we were all like, what the heck? Because who average rider on the street, let's say, even an advanced rider on the racetrack, some of them are at that level. But I know I'm not. And most intermediate guys aren't. But to have the support there that if you get in that situation, there are some systems to help. Some safety measures, if you will. And I've always appreciated-- if you ever look at the people who have really made it far in road racing, those are people who have had dirt bike experience or people who have had flat track experience especially. Because flat track is a spot where you have more traction than you do with typical dirt bike with loose silt because of blue line forms. And that's what you end up riding on. But it's still way less than you get on asphalt. So it's a little bit more of a forgiving training ground. But you look at some of these flat track crashes. If they crash, it's a high side. You hardly ever see a low side or a collision. But that's where it gets kind of scary. These legends-- I think about Colin Edwards because I did the Texas tornado boot camp. And there were Shefushek there and some other guys that-- I can't remember their names. But the guys that were really, really fast, Colin Edwards being one of them, were people who had flat track experience. And that really did translate well into the racing. So this kind of makes it so you don't have to have that experience to experience it for the first time. But I do know one customer that has been brave enough to be fooling into a corner and just grab it. And that was Casey. But he did that on a Super Duke. And it protected him. I guess he said it did slide like it. But that's scary. I'm not doing that. I'm not that guy. It's just an average rider that rides like an old man. I'm glad to know that it's there just in case I do screw up. I come in too hot or something like that. Because I'm not going to be riding trying to push the limits. And if I do a track day, I'm going to be the slow guy that's out there just learning how to be a better rider, not a faster rider. So for me, it's not about using it to the full potential. It's about it being there just in case I need it. Because at the end of the day, we're riding a motorcycle. If you go down, it's going to hurt. You're not sliding into a ditch on a car where most likely you're going to be fine unless you're going off a cliff or hitting somebody head on. But for the most part, the bike's being safer and it's having those-- and call them nanny aids or whatever. But for your average rider, it makes you feel better knowing that that's there just in case. Because I know people say, oh, what happens if you don't have it? You're not learning how to ride. It's going to encourage you to ride past your limit and things like that. But nine times out of 10, I don't think that's the case. I think it's people that just want to enjoy the bike and they like knowing that in case they screw up, there's not a chance that they're going to die. There's something there to kind of-- it's a little bit of a safety net. You're also, whenever you're talking about these fully analog bikes, I mean, you had maximums of 160 horsepower back when that was the going thing. I think now that we're in a world where we're talking about bikes, this is 209 horsepower back here. When we're talking about bikes with that kind of horsepower, you get to a point where for the average rider, that bike's not rideable. It's not something that you can handle. Think about 209 horsepower. When we were in high school, a Civic with 200 horsepower was fast. And that had a lot more weight. Yeah, and that's almost 3,000 pounds. This is a motorcycle. I'm sorry. It wasn't fast, but you at least felt like it was. Like for those days, it was fast. That was fast back then. I remember hearing about 500 horsepower cars and being like, oh, wow, that's impressive. Exactly, yeah. It's insane now, like your average car has that, especially with electric cars. If it's less than 250, I don't want it. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, my GTI is 220. Holy cow. So I mean, we're... That's low nowadays. Yeah. We're like, oh, that's in a comment box. And it's fun to drive and it gets a good mileage, but it's, I mean, it's... Yeah, you put that amount of power in a bike. So were you a Volkswagen fan before 2012? Yes. Are you sure? So I was a Volkswagen fan. I was an Audi fan. I grew up in a household where German cars were around. So when those got married, you're like, yes. In a way, yes. And they did have a short time where they had a sponsorship with AMG on the Mercedes side a few years before that. But I guess that ended. That did end and then Audi stepped in and here we are. But speaking of that six axis IMU, that thing, you're talking about the yaw, it'll step out, what is it, seven degrees? It's seven or nine. It's somewhere in that single digit range. It's not letting us go completely wild. That's still when you think about it, that's still a fair bit where your front wheels here and your rear wheels. Yeah, it doesn't sound like a lot, but whenever you're on the bike, it's like, that's the I'm not, I don't feel good. You're feeling that. I guess the... You're feeling like you're on a dirt bike. Yeah, exactly. I guess in that situation, you just need to make sure you don't do anything that's going to cause that bike to react. I mean, obviously you still have to ride the bike. Yes. Yeah, it's not going to save you from everything. If you got to that point and just chopped the throttle, of course there's still a chance that you're going to have a high side event. That's the, on the braking side, that's the better high side. But yeah, I mean, it's crazy that we have this technology, right? Yeah. 2008, when I had my first Ducati, is really not that long ago when you think about it. And like you said, that was 150 horsepower and none of the electronics. And now we're all the electronics and 59 more horsepower. With the exhaust even more. Yeah. Yeah. And so we have that, it incorporates the yaw control, it incorporates, you know, they have all the different acronyms. Unless someone is like, someone like you goes over the dash with a customer who just bought a brand new Ducati, you go through all these acronyms and you get a lot of questions like, what is that? What is that? Well, and Ducati likes to make theirs mostly named Ducati something, right? So we have DTC, Ducati traction control. Because no one else has that. DSC is your slide control. EBC is one separate. They don't put a D in front of that. DTC traction control? Yeah. I thought it was dynamic traction control. It can be for you. It can be either technique. I actually had to talk about it being Ducati on mine when I see that. And Ducati is proud of it because they were the first to bring it to the average person, you know, first to bring it to market on a Superbike with the 1198. And I know back then you're talking about, I'm not saying that, did they have like the six axis IMU back then? Or so? They were purely using wheel speed strategies. And that was the old school way to do it. And there's still some Japanese bikes out there that are doing it where you just have two wheel speed sensors. And if the rear goes faster than the front, you know your slide. I'm sure it's more complicated than that, but that's the basic setup of that. So it's really nice to see that that has gotten a lot farther. I mean, it's using a bunch of sensors. Just going through some of your acronyms that you brought up. We have the DWC wheelie control. Yep. EBC is the one that doesn't fall in line. Let's break there. Yes. Wheelie control. Are we talking about, I can say I want it to be at 45 degrees and stay there? No. Why not? It doesn't work that way. It does. I tried it. It doesn't work that way. So it is a strategy to help keep the front wheel down. It is not a strategy to limit where you can get with it. So I have a, you know, I have a, my dad, he's the wheelie king, right? Like he can wheelie anything and keep it there. I've got a name to live up to. I do not. I don't have the skill. It's not made for riding wheels. From my experience on the Multistrada, it's what, one through four? You can... One through four or one through eight, depending on the model. And so you can turn it down to where it's less control. And as you're accelerating, it'll let you come up a little bit higher. And not cut the power a little bit. You turn it all the way up. It's pretty much going to keep the front wheel completely on the ground. So yes, I did experiment with it and it is not made for riding out. We're riding at 12 o'clock on your Multistrada. If you want to ride a wheelie, you've got to turn it off. On a closed course, right? Yes. Yeah, exactly. Now... In a parking lot. No, and it makes sense. There is one exception to that with Ducote. On the mono, the 9.8 mono with the exhaust. So if we do the full exhaust, that strategy is different and the wheelies are limited, as it were. It's still not a training tool, but it's... Don't rely on that. We need to come back to that 6.8 because it's also a new model we can talk about. But yeah, with that exhaust, it's 84 horsepower and it is closed course competition use only on that. No, no. No, no. We have to follow the law here. But yeah, anyway, sorry. Ducote wheelie control. We're going with that. So wheelie control, and I haven't looked specifically into that, but it's either four or eight settings for the range. Of course, the higher number, the more it's going to keep the front wheel down. Right. The lower you go, the less resistance to wheelie it's going to give you. And wheelie is for show. It's not for go. And the reason it exists is to make the bike accelerate, you know, to not waste energy on pulling up a wheelie. Well, if you have it turned all the way up and you're in a situation where the front wheel is going to come up, it's going to limit power. So you're not going to be accelerating as fast. It's going to slow you down to keep that front wheel down. Yeah. You're going to keep it down enough because if you're wheelieing, then you're actually losing that momentum that you're driving forward. If you watch MotoGP, like even five years ago, you see a lot more wheelieing than you do today. And you'll see a wheel get that far off the ground in MotoGP, but it's not far enough to affect their aerodynamics. And it's all about aerodynamics with them. And that's the same for bikes like this because as long as you can keep that down, that front spoiler is doing its job. Apparently I've been told that it's more likely to come up if you have a passenger and gear with you. You've been told? I've been told. Yeah. Okay. Not tested. Just smacked on the back of the head. Yeah, you do get smacked on the back of the head. I got smacked so hard. Oh man, I remember I was on the back of a Goldwing 1500 and dad was wheelieing that up the street. And I'm like, why are we going over 100 on a Goldwing? Obviously he wasn't wheelieing at 100, but there's a lot of different times that I've just been like, I'll be behind him. He would wheelie. And then I look over at the dash. I'm like, what? Whenever I was a kid growing up, that was just part of it. Like you just round motorcycles, you're going to experience things like that. You're doing this more time on one wheel than two. Yeah, probably. Yeah. And I'll tell you that like riding with somebody like that growing up, it really made me like I felt what the bike was supposed to do. I felt like, you know, what it was like to go fast. And you know, it wasn't always legal. It wasn't always on close course or ever. That was back in the 90s. Yeah. That was a different time. Statute of limitations. He has, we can talk about all of it. He was running from the cops. And he's a rat of book. Yeah. I mean, including some of that running from the cops, but they didn't have bikes like this back then. It depended purely on rider skill. And we talked about it in our podcast. We do with him is that that that rider element has gone more and more out of it, but it has made us a lot safer and made motorcycles appeal to a lot more people. We have things like the BMW now with the automatic shift assistant and KTM is coming out with the same thing. They're making it more approachable to more riders where, you know, we talk about I used to sell side by side. You had all these automatic side by side to come out and then Yamaha comes out with this YXZ. Like that's a sequential shift and you have to use a clutch and use all that. And like nobody bought it because everyone, you know, the skill set that you have to have to drive a side by side as you drink enough beer to have the guts to hit the throttle. Because you want a more comfortable four wheeler. Yeah. You're not supposed to drink and drive, but that doesn't stop them from doing it up on the mountain. You're not on the road. Yeah. You can still get in trouble, but anyway, again, we're getting off topic a little bit. So, decalibiliy controller, then you got to EBC. Yeah. EBC is the one that doesn't use the D in front of it. But you have a strategy to open the throttle plate to limit how much an engine braking is. Right. So, it's easy to look at that and think about it backwards, I guess. So the more, the higher that number is, so one through three is the general strategy. On three, it is going to be the least amount of engine braking. Oh man, that is backward. It is actually opening the throttle plate to help with that. Two and one are going to give you more engine braking and then... You think about it at a speed. The higher the number, the faster you're going to keep it going. Yeah. If you run a three on, say, my 959 that's in the garage, it allows the bike to freewheel a whole lot more than if I put it in one. One allows it to feel more like a traditional Ducati twin where you drop the throttle and you have that sudden feel of engine braking and that assistance to your braking, especially in a racetrack. So it's, depending on your riding style, you can kind of fine tune. So it's not doing the same thing as like a slipper clutch that's trying to keep your rear wheel down and prevent that hop. It's actually just limiting the engine braking going into a corner. So you can actually control it more with the rear brake if you have the skill to do that. I think that for me, I like engine braking. But if I get to a corner and I don't want as much, I can open the butterfly myself by hitting the throttle a little bit, which is a scary thing to do going into a corner, but you really have to know what you're doing if you're going to do that. It'll make it more fuel efficient. Yep. Yep. No. Maintain your momentum. Yeah, maintain your momentum. Yeah, maintain your momentum. Sure. But you still have to accelerate out of the corner. You were not worried about fuel efficiency on the track, that's for sure. No, I am on road trips though. Yep. And you're talking about 209 horsepower. What happens to it if you put the exhaust on it? So with the exhaust, I don't know the exact figure, but it is a pretty substantial jump. I know in the previous generation, like the R's, they were claiming 240 with the race exhaust and the tune. If you used the shell oil with that dry clutch. In this case, I don't know the exact figure. It's going to be a sizable jump with the full exhaust. There's also a slip on that does have an up map available that's also close competition use since we mentioned that. They also have a homologated slip on. So if you're just not into the style of the stock exhaust, there isn't a Kropovich option that is fully street legal, no paperwork, no worrying about legality, depending on where you live. And you're talking about paperwork and the things that we have to do as a dealership to put that exhaust on your bike. And I'll let you talk about that. Yeah. And part of it comes from our general emissions laws in this country. Some of it is tied to CARB. So some of it is based on California law as well. But we do have in the case of doing a full race exhaust or one of the race slip on options, there is a form that we have to have the customer fill out with us. There is also proof that needs to be made of it being used in a track setting. So in the case of this Panigale, if Mr. Customer came in next week to pick it up and wants to buy that full race exhaust, that is totally fine. But we do have to submit to Ducati certain pieces of information to prove that it is using in a track setting. So license plate removed, headlights taped up, things like that. Turn signals, no errors. Photography. And then there is a form from Ducati that is to cover us. It also is to cover Ducati. Ultimately everybody has a hand in the legality when it comes to emissions stuff. So is that a blanket thing or is it a state to state? So we have to do that stuff for Ducati on our end with any bike that is going to leave with those race parts. So when it leaves the dealership it has to have all of that covered. Basically it has to be track prepped. And we have to take pictures and prove that it was track prepped before it left the shop. Now you can go out and you can untrack prep it. And then after that it is up to the owner. To an extent. I mean you can untrack prep it, you can put the mirrors, blinkers and untape the headlight and all of that and put the license back on. You are taking it in your own hands at that point. And you all can't be responsible as the dealer if somebody does that on there. We have to have all the plausible deniability possible. You can do that. It is. There's no people going to do that. People are going to do that. Absolutely. But what we don't want to happen is that we don't want EPA to start cracking down on it. Because we haven't gotten any notices but if we did we would have to prove that we did all this going forward. And if we don't, if we are not able to prove it, it is a $30,000 fine to the customer. It is a $30,000 fine to the dealership and it is a $30,000 to the technician who did it. So we are covering our butts as much as possible and not recommending that you go out and do that. And we are, we're lucky. We're here in Georgia as we sit. Dealership is just over the line in Tennessee. We don't have as stringent emissions regulations as Southwest. In the case of Lake California, those bikes have to be registered in such a way that they are planned non-operational. So they don't get a tag in a title that says it's street legal. They have to prove to the state that they are not using it on the street to get those parts. So we are pretty lucky here but we have to do our part and educate customers and work with the customers to make sure that everybody is doing their part as far as that stuff goes. There are a lot of diesel shops going through the same thing. That's why you throw the wink out there, I've got to put that off. That's not me, that's him. It's only because I live in Georgia. He doesn't work at the dealership. I'm just on the podcast. I'm just a customer. Just a customer. Oh boy, but what did we get through all the acronyms? I think we got through most of them. I don't even know where we were. We got the wheelie control, we got the trash control, we got the EVC. I do think that we should talk about ride modes on like most of this stuff has ride modes available. So talk about that for a minute. And I'll talk about it specifically to the one behind us because it's different than what we've seen from the Panagoli before in the past. So we have a new wet mode. So there is actually a "rain mode" built in. You have a road mode, a sport mode. So sport being your let's go have fun in the mountains, go to the Cherry Hall of Skyway, whatever we want to do in our local area. And then you have race A and race B. The race modes are different in that you have torque limiting strategies in both of them for your lower gears. Race A is going to be more designed for your big open tracks. So for us here, we don't really have too much of that. I guess you could argue Atlanta. But really you're thinking of our Kota's, our Road America's, really big open flowy type tracks. Race B is going to limit your torque in the first couple of gears. So that you have a more usable bike when we're going to Barber or if you were to take this big thing down to Jennings and have fun down there or any number of other places, NCM, just as another example. You said big thing, but it's not that heavy, is it? It's not heavy. It's just very powerful and more suited to those big tracks. Not that you can't take it to our local tracks. But that's where the V2 comes in. If you are doing track days and you're only going to Barber, Jennings and Titer tracks, I think that V2 might be a better purchase. That mid 100 horsepower, 120, 150, somewhere in that range is a really usable track bike. My previous track bike was my 959. The current bike I have in the garage, as you know, is my dad's 959 Corsa. He's given me the grace to do what I want to do with it. So it'll go to Barber a couple of times this year and hopefully down to Jennings at least once. I like the middle weight bikes. The bigger bike is not always the fastest. Motorcross all the time. There are a lot of tracks where the 250s are faster. Did you see timings last weekend? I haven't watched it yet. The 250s were getting into the... If they had competed qualifying on the same track, same day, they would have been fourth place. Yeah, it happens all the time. Yeah. There are certain tracks where the 250 winner is actually running faster. Absolutely. We see that more and more. But we're talking about ride modes. You've got race A, race B, like a sport, a street, and then a wet. Are they adaptable, changeable? Yes. So in each of those modes, you're going to have a base setting from Ducati, how it comes from the factory. And you can always get back to that. You're always going to have an option to go back to default. But each mode has a specific strategy for what the traction control is, what the wheelie control is, what slide control is, all those different options. You have the ability to go into each one and fully customize them. So let's just say, and I'm not saying that we're going to advise this as a starter bike, but let's just say that guy did walk in the dealership. It has happened. Similarly to Superbike School, using the S1000 and using the rain mode and different things to limit the power. You could go into this bike and set up all of your ride modes to be limited power, boost your sensitivity on all of the different safety controls so that you could make it more approachable. It's still not going to say that that's going to be my first bike that I walk somebody over to that's just getting into motorcycles. If you want to pay for the insurance and you want to ride this thing, you're allowed. I won't prevent it, but I will advise against it. We're not going to encourage it. So you can really play with it how you want. If you don't ever plan on riding in wet, you can just use the wet mode as another road mode and change some of those levels of sensitivity to suit your riding style. The cool thing is if you ever get to a point, and I say this to customers all the time, if you get to a point in any of those menus where you're like, "Crap, I don't remember what I did," you just hit default and you can start from fresh again. So with BMW, you do have a couple different maps that you can change on the S1000 WR, where with Ducati, it's pretty much every mode can be adapted to what you're specific riding. It's almost an infinite number of total setups. That's pretty universal on most of their bikes too, because I know you see it on the V2, or we'll see on the new one, but on the old V2, you definitely see it. And then Super Sport, Monster, and then Multistrada, you can change all your ride modes. The Desert X, you can change all your ride modes. All of those are the bikes that have the same IMU that we're talking about. Now on the Scramblers, is that still the same? Scramblers have a limited amount of change, but with the new second gen models, you do have ride modes, so you do have the ability to go into those and customize. You just don't have as many of the systems. So you're not going to see a list of eight different things to change. You're going to see three or four. And that's fitting, because you get into some of this... You're talking about a $30,000 bike right here. You should be able to change anything you want to change. But when you get into a bike like that, obviously it's a $10,000 bike. You can only put as many features into it that you can afford for $10,000. And then I will say that with the Scramblers, you do get a heck of a lot of value for what you put into it. And that's kind of what their MO is on that bike. They want to get somebody into Ducati, and they're not going to put something out there that is cheap and janky, because that's going to represent Ducati to that person going into the future. But yeah. No, and I mean the Scrambler, as of the models we have today, is probably one of the most classic Ducatis, right? Yep. It still has a trellis frame. Have your Desmodue as we were talking about this morning. Desmodue, not the Tesla Strata. So a two-valve air-cooled engine. With that, you do have maintenance intervals that are a little bit shorter than some of the others, but they still have tried to move things apart. The stories of the 5,000 and 6,000 mile valve services, you're now at 7,500 miles. Which for the average rider, especially on that bike, not to say you can't go on a cross-country trip, but for the average rider on that bike, how much time is that really? That's three years of riding. Two to three years, probably, of riding before you're doing that first valve service. As much as we get worried about, there's a lot of maintenance. With the second gen especially, easier to work on, so your labor times are down a little bit. It's a little bit more simplified in the valve train. It's a two-valve. You have an opener and closer times two per cylinder instead of times four. So there's less things to mess with as far as that goes. And it's not a mythical thing. Desmo, come on man. That sings of $2,000 maintenance. Come on. And some of them do creep up there. When you talk about the old Panagali V2s, not the new V2, but the old old V2, or the predecessor to it, I guess I should say. Like the 848s. The 848s. The old Testistretta Evolutione, which was still better than some of the ones before it. But I've heard about it on the 848s particularly. It was a 20-hour valve service. And that's what people hear and that's what they remember about Ducati. So 20 hours is probably a stretch. Ducati is pretty transparent. In fact, any of our customers can go on Ducati's website and on the service tab there is a full checklist that is the exact checklist we are supposed to use at the services. I like it. So you can see exactly what is supposed to be done. And you can even ask. If you would like to see it, that should be something that is supplied to you. Not every dealer is using it. I will be honest with that. As far as filling it out and handing it to the customer every time. But those things are what should be done. It's out there for you to see. They have times published for the dealers internally on what they call their transparent maintenance posters as well as their introduction materials that they send to us anytime a new model comes out that tells you what Ducati expects for each service. And you just kind of make sure that your dealer is following that and they are not overcharging you for something. Like if it's 30 minutes different, I mean I obviously wouldn't make a stink about it because maybe they spend a little more time doing it. But if you are looking at something like that and you see four hours difference, then you know like hey, this is what Ducati says that should take. So they need to justify that four hours. As long as it's justified, that's a conversation to have with them. And there are situations where a maintenance does end up taking more time if we get in there and find a problem or just replacing brake pads, things like that. Simple things. But again, that's not four hours worth. We need to be able to justify it. And granted I did it at home and didn't time myself, but I just did my multi-strawders Desmos service at the house. The time that they give us is for checking, right? So it is disassembly, get to the valve covers, get valve covers off, check your clearance. They aren't allowing for replacing shims because they can't, you know, what we're going to run into. Like I ran into on my vertical, it only needed one shim, but on the horizontal, pretty much every single one of them came out. So you know, they can't justify that. So I think it's key too that you have the right people working in the service department that are able to communicate with the customer. Hey, we got into it. This is what we found. This is how far out we are. And this is what we need to do to fix it. And then that time can be accounted for exactly like you said. If there's a justification for removing three closers and doing the extra work, we should be doing it. But we need to make sure that we're very open with the customer as well. Right. And that's not a huge job on something like a scrambler. I mean, whenever you have a lot of plastic covering things, I would tell you most of the labor that goes into a lot of this stuff is getting to them, not even doing the job itself. That while you're doing all that, it does behoove you to look at things like air filters, spark plugs, like the auxiliary things that you don't think about that need replacing. Like go ahead and get that stuff done. And like we're obviously going to be the dealership that recommends that up front or goes ahead and says, hey, this is your interval. We're going to do it. But not every dealer is like that. Not everyone. Every dealer is going to say, oh, you want a valve adjustment? We'll give you a valve adjustment. Come on. The most important question. Does it have tire pressure motors? It does not. But I do believe they are an option. I do have to look at this one. I know they've changed some of that with the new models. To backpack off of that, we have a customer that is not wrong in asking this, but has asked us, is it coming with a fuel gauge? Ducati's strategy has always been their sport bikes, their performance models. They're not putting fuel gauges in them. So unfortunately, we don't have them. What's the deal with Ducati and not having tire pressure motors? Because I'm not multi-stride. That's literally the only thing it doesn't have. It has adaptive cruise control, but I don't know what my tire pressure is while I'm riding. You don't need that. Yes, I do. No. When you're traveling across country? Yeah. No, it's definitely nice to know. Do you up with 300 pounds of gear? Yeah. It's definitely nice to know if something happens. It gives you some indication if something's going on, hopefully before it's completely flat. So in your case, you can add them. Yeah, the multi-shot, it's an option. If you want them, you got it. Is it a factory option that you can get? Yes. So in the Ducati Performance Catalog, they do sell a set of sensors that will get paired to the ECU. I don't know on the new V4. I know on my 1260, they only read in bar. So you would just have to keep mental note of that. I don't know if that's changed on the V4. I haven't done an install on the V4. Because I bought an aftermarket set, but I'm afraid of putting it on to make sure it doesn't add too much weight to the valve stem. Let's put the factory one on there. It was like 20 watts. It wasn't that much. It was a battery-powered thing. And for a long time, the GS didn't come with that. We have a bike right now in the showroom right now. It's reading 10 pounds of pressure this morning. But it's probably beeping the whole way. It's beeping the whole way as we're pushing it out. But it actually, it was like an aftermarket monitor that they put on the dash. And that was kind of just the workaround for a while. But eventually all these manufacturers start putting all this stuff on there. We can have a bike with every single feature out there. On something like the Panagoli V4S, it doesn't make sense to put something like a fuel gauge and tire pressure monitors on it. Because you're adding weight without any real performance value. And that's the focus on that bike. Yeah, you should check on all that stuff before you start riding everything. And on the Multistrada or a GSA or-- When you're traveling, you're just on and off the bike. Yeah. The Tiger 1200, the KTM 1290S, all these bikes are long-term touring bikes. And KTM takes a little bit of a different strategy in that they're not just putting all that on there from the factory. You can add all that stuff and make the KTM 1290 just as expensive as a GSA. But the GSA is that expensive and it comes with everything. So it's all about thinking about what your focus is with the bike. And thinking about what features are customers willing to pay for and what really adds value. And if you're willing to pay for it, the factory option's there, which is the tech that KTM takes with everything. But if you're not willing to pay for it, you don't have to. So yeah, it just depends on what you think is valuable. We got a few minutes left. Let's quickly cover the hyper-mono before we head out. Oh, yeah, you've been begging to do that. You know, I mean, that's-- You've mentioned it just about every episode. That's my goal this year is to add that to the-- We have a demo if you want to come check it out. We do have a demo right now. Open invitation to-- We should do a review. We should do a review. Yeah, yeah. I mean, you come in and review it. You guys come on. But yeah, we've got a demo. We also have an RVE that's 25 model. The demo is actually not in a state that we can sell it yet. So we'll have it for at least the next couple of weeks, at least. But yeah, come put some miles on it. But yeah, let's talk about it. I mean, you get the Super Quadro Mono, not the Super 401, but the Super Square one. I kept calling it the Super 401. But he's correcting me all day this morning. But what's the weight? What's the weight in horsepower on that thing? I didn't come prepared. The weight is light. The power is a lot for a single. The weight is light. The power is a lot. It's like 77, something 78. And the exhaust is like 85 or 86. 84. I do remember that. And it's half of a 1299. So if any of our customers remember-- and I know we have a few that still have them, the 2015 model 1299-- it's essentially half of that engine put in a frame that is much more true Super Moto dirt bike. Whatever it is, it has the record. Most horsepower for a single. Yes. Production, I should say. Production. Yeah, production. Eating ATM, right? Yeah, that's a big. ATM was like the one that had that record for the longest time at 72. And so now this one coming out-- and I think you're right, 77, 78 horsepower, of course, it's going to be different on different dynos. But that definitely holds the record now. And I will say that the Hyper produces that power more and more. And I think the exhaust balances that out a little more. But the KTM is going to be more for keeping the bottom. I'll tell you what. Y'all have got that as a demo. Let's bring that in for the next episode. We'll talk about it. We'll see what we decide to focus on next episode. Because we try to represent all our brands fairly. Even if you bring it and whatever. It's been Ducati twice. I mean-- You know I don't mind. Yeah. Since we have one Ducati fanboy, we might as well match the energy a little bit. Hey. Yeah. And yeah. Ducati-stee. Ducati-stee, yeah. Ducati-stee. Ducati-stee here. All right. And if you don't have the app, get the app. Yeah, I've got it. I've got it too. I just need to check it. All right. Well, with that, Justin, thanks for coming in. Thank you. I appreciate it. Jeff, we will see you in two weeks. So thanks for tuning in. Leave us some comments and some feedback. See you on the next one. For the Throttle Stop Moto Podcast, I'm Justin. Jeff. Brought to you by Pandora's. And Justin. This was the other Justin. See you on the next one. Thank you.

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