Like Whatever

Ode To The East Wing

• Heather Jolley and Nicole Barr • Episode 57

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A Monday mailbox note sets the fuse, but the story grows fast: two best friends unpack modern impatience, real-world logistics, and why a noon delivery isn’t a crisis. That everyday friction becomes a gateway to bigger questions—how we normalize danger, how schools script safety, and how mentors step into the gaps. The mood swings from rant to reflection and lands in a textured tour of the White House East Wing, a place that has quietly housed public access, a family theater, and a hidden wartime bunker.

We trace the East Wing from Jefferson’s colonnades to Theodore Roosevelt’s democratic redesign and FDR’s expansion, spotlighting how it evolved into a genuine center of First Lady power. This is where restoration projects were run, literacy and mental health initiatives took shape, and media strategy matured alongside a growing public spotlight. Ceremony and symbolism matter, the hosts argue, not as window dressing but as a lever for cultural change—especially when the West Wing holds the policy pen.

Between a chaotic blood donation tale and a 1984 diary flashback, the conversation keeps its footing in lived experience. We talk about language and harm, call Monica Lewinsky what she was—a victim of power imbalance—and demand accountability on trafficking without partisan blinders. The final stretch examines the East Wing’s demolition for a new ballroom, preservation scans, and what is lost when process and transparency trail the bulldozers. It’s personal, funny, informed, and unafraid to draw lines where they count.

If this mix of history, honesty, and Gen X resilience speaks to you, tap follow, share with a friend who loves a good deep-dive, and leave a quick review so more curious folks can find us. What part of the East Wing story surprised you most?

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SPEAKER_04:

Two best friends, we're talking fast. We're missing two arcades, we're having a blast. Seeing these dreams, me on screens, it was all bad. Oh you know, it's like whatever.

SPEAKER_01:

Welcome to Like Whatever, a podcast for, by, and about Gen X. I'm Nicole, and this is my BFFF Heather.

SPEAKER_02:

Hello.

SPEAKER_01:

So I'm not even gonna bother to ask you about your week until January. Good idea. Because it's just gonna be working cold and dark and windy.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

And it all sucks. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

If you have anything good come up, you can just let me know. Well, I probably you're pretty much gonna work and sleep all the next two months.

SPEAKER_00:

Can I just vent about this one lady personally? I love it. I know. Please do. None of you care because you don't. But listen, there's this lady. The last two Mondays, okay, Mondays, period, are behind anyway.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, because there's Sunday.

SPEAKER_00:

So Mondays are are behind anyway. Now you add in the Christmas season and you add on top that we no longer come in at 7:30, we come in at 8. So I'm already a half an hour behind where I used to be. And then on top of it, so anyway, now Mondays, I'm usually like about an hour, hour and a half behind the rest of the week. Because it's Monday. Um, I don't know if you're new to the planet, but Monday is post office, it's gonna be later. Yeah. So two Mondays in a row, this lady has left this note. The first Monday, it was a note. Um, hi, I was supposed to get this package today. Is it in a different box? Can you check?

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, go knock on all your neighbors' doors and find out who has it.

SPEAKER_00:

First of all, you know I haven't been here yet.

SPEAKER_01:

If you've left me a note saying that's exactly what I was thinking, and not yesterday. Number one. Just a little passive aggressive.

SPEAKER_00:

Second of all, it's 12 30. It's not 5 p.m. It's not 10 p.m. It's 12 30. I usually get to her box around 11, somewhere in that neighborhood. So, yes, I am behind. So the last Monday I wrote back on the back of her note because she did have three packages that day. Is it one of these packages? And I never got a response. So I assumed obviously it was one of those that I had not been there yet. This Monday, same note, exact same note, because when I turned it over, my response was still there. And I was like, this bitch. Okay, so last Monday we did this, and then you went to your mailbox at noon and opened it, and there was not it was hello, hello, hello, empty in there. And you thought to yourself, Oh, she fucked up again this week. I'm gonna write her, I'm gonna leave the exact same note.

SPEAKER_01:

Like it's so weird she didn't throw the note away. Like, why would you hold on to that?

SPEAKER_00:

And are you gonna put it in there every Monday? No, you are not, because I took it this week. Nice. You are not next week. If you leave me the note, you're gonna have to think about it while you write it.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

And next week, if you write me a note on Monday again, I'm gonna it's gonna get passive aggressive. I'm gonna passive aggressively tell you Mondays, I'm behind. And if when you open the box and there's not a stitch of anything in there, you don't have any map, there's nothing. There's it's it's empty.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, use the brain God gave you and think, hey, she hasn't been here yet. And was your pri was your package scanned? No.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and at like noon. Do you know how many days uh like I get a notice that I'm gonna get a package, and then it either comes at eight o'clock at night or the next day.

SPEAKER_00:

She is halfway through my first neighborhood. So on Mondays, I leave that neighborhood at one o'clock. So it was probably 12, 12:30, somewhere in that neighborhood. Because I don't get there until 11. So and it takes me two hours to do that neighborhood. So I mean, when you went out there and looked and there wasn't any mail in there, and when you came back later to check, just because you probably got the notification that the packages you were expecting have now been scanned. Like, what do you think happens? Some package fairy comes, and then to do it the next week. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01:

Like your spidey senses are gonna be like, oh god, she left me a note. I better hurry up and get there.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, if we're doing this every Monday, then it's about to get passive aggressive.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it's gonna have to.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, because I'm not yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Your job's stressful enough without dealing with that. Oh, I'm not dealing. And it's noon.

SPEAKER_00:

It's not even like it's 4 p.m. Mm-mm. Calm the fuck down.

SPEAKER_01:

She's gonna be real upset in a couple weeks when all the Christmas stuff starts rolling.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh my god. And she gets packages like every single day. She got one today. And like, and sometimes she leaves them in there. And every time she does, I want to leave a note. And it's like, why didn't you get this package? We've been riding my ass.

SPEAKER_01:

I delivered this package yesterday.

SPEAKER_00:

Why didn't you come get it? Ride my ass about the goddamn thing. Get it.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh my. So I was driving down here today and listening to NPR. And um I'm reaching for my she is. I don't know why she doesn't just stand up and get it. Because I don't want to create. Go ahead. Oh, okay. Anyway, um, so there's a new documentary, I think it's out today on HBO about gun violence and how to protect yourself against gun violence. So the idea behind this documentary is if we aren't going to implement any gun control, sure, we need to figure out how to live in a country where gun violence is a real thing and normal. Guess what they named it.

SPEAKER_02:

Like I can't.

SPEAKER_01:

I mean, you are the queen of titles, but this one blows it out the way. I can't venture a guess. Thoughts and prayers. Oh, I love that. I know. I love that. It is so great. It's just the perfect title. It really is. It really is. Yeah, because that's about all we're doing right now for uh anything. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Literally anything.

SPEAKER_01:

And then they were talking about how kids there's literally no kids left who haven't grown up with the fear of school shootings. That's crazy, right? Shooter drills, all that stuff.

SPEAKER_00:

And you know, the thing of it is, is as Gen Xers, we know the fear of having a nuclear bomb dropped on your head, and we had to get under our desks, like, because that was gonna help. But so now you're doing that to a whole new generation of things that actually can happen.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, and that's the thing. When we were little and they were talking about nuclear bombs, we're like, we don't even have a concept of what that is. We don't know what you're talking about. And so it's just get under your desk. You know, but now these kids, they see guns, their friends are bringing them to school. I mean, it's everywhere, so that it's very tangible for them. And it is scary. I was in a high school a couple well, I'm in high schools every all the time, but I was in one a couple years ago, and they had a power outage. And the poor I was in the room with some kids, and I was the only adult in the room. The teachers had left the room. No, thank you. And these kids instantly started talking about there being a shooter in the building. That was their very first thought. And they're all trying to hide, and I was just like, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00:

As part of your training, because you go into schools, do you have to know the shooter drills? Because when I was a mentor, we had uh an orientation at the beginning of the year, and they went through the shooter drills. We had to we had to take part in a shooter drill.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm surprised they don't make me do that. If I'm there, I've never taken part in a shooter drill. I've been in the schools when they have fire drills, and I have to go stand out in the parking lot like we did when we were kids. Yeah. Um, and now they don't even they make them go like 10 feet from the schools. Yeah, it's like nothing. We had to walk out like three fields across.

SPEAKER_00:

I I I when we had a in our orientation, they gave us a um a sheet that had all the different um what they say over the loudspeaker, so you know what's happening, and like underneath it tells you what what you are responsible for. Wow. Like you're as a mentor, your job is to hook up with another class so that you can say, This is my, you know, so and so. And um, can I just say for a second, if you have never if you're looking for a volunteer thing to do, call your local elementary school and ask them or middle school and ask them about their mentoring program. It's a fun here, I don't know about anywhere else, but I know here it is an amazing program. And you, if you want an ego boost, like okay, I'm not gonna lie, it was a purely selfish endeavor. Hi, Alina. Um, but you feel like a rock star. Like when you walk into that building, they all know who you are, they all know you're a you're I volunteered at my niece and nephew school, and my nephew just could not understand why I could not be his mentor. And the um I knew the the guidance counselor from when I was a kid and stuff, and she she said, Well, you you don't need a mentor. And we're not gonna give you your aunt because you see her all the time.

SPEAKER_01:

But um, yeah, there's even a non-profit, at least one nonprofit here in Delaware that I know of that helps you to connect with those things. Like that's what they do. It's they are they're kind of the connection from the community to the schools to help mentors.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm also gonna say this too, because in this day and age that we are living in, in the current situation that we're in, um, Big Brothers, Big Sisters, I know I have touted them, does not discriminate. In fact, um really would like LGBTQ bigs. Um, it's very important for them because they would like to match up LGBTQ children to a mentor who has been through it and um yes, I know probably people think all it's a children's thing, and you know how everybody is an asshole these days, like I can't do it because XYZ. Um, at least here I can't speak for the rest of Big Brothers, Big Sisters, but I do know here they had an active campaign to try and bring in LGBTQ couples and um and individuals, especially, especially if you're young. There's a real lack of younger people, period, doing it. Um, and these kids, people of color and LGBTQ are are very important in the Big Brothers, Big Sisters organization. Yeah. That's what I'll say about it.

SPEAKER_01:

I'm so proud of you for that. While we're talking about doing good deeds, I have a bad story. Uh-oh. So I am needle squeamish. Yes. I know it's silly. She has tattoos. I have tattoos, which is a total bullshit thing to say when people, really is there's a very big difference between scraping the surface and ramming something into my vein.

SPEAKER_00:

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. Um, you know, I've had kids, I have had all s I I have had a lot of needles in my life. She's not a drug addict. I'm not a drug addict. Normal needles, like be out in the front every single time. I turn my head and I wince, and I'm so anyway, I hate donating blood. But for whatever reason, I think because when I was in high school, the blood bank came and parked our little van in the parking lot and I donated blood there. That didn't go well either, but it made me feel good. And I always think, you know, one day I might need it. Yes. So I would hope somebody would have donated somewhere so that I can get it. I know they are always short, they are constantly texting, calling, emailing me that they need. And I also have very common blood, so they always need it. Um, so anyway, I went to get blood last Friday. Oh boy. Oh yeah. It was like a comedy of errors. Like so I get there. Um, and the reason I this is this is why. Um, I get the text all the time, and I'm like, meh, meh. And then I got one that said they were gonna have a um coffee food truck out in the parking lot, and after you donated, you got free coffee, fancy coffee. And that's why. Yeah, and uh I got punished for it. So, and it's part of the story. So, anyway, um, yeah. So, firstly, um I go in and they set me up, and the TV is usually HG TV when I'm in there, which I'm not a fan of, but it's not so bad. This time it was a game show network, and I love a game show. I can't fucking stand Wheel of Fortune. Me either. That's what they had on. I know. That's what they had on. So ding number one. Um, so then um the girl, she was very very, very, very nice. But I'm the type of person, if you don't say a word to me, I love it. Right. I'm not offended, I don't want to make small talk, I just do it and get me out of here. But she was very sweet, very, very, very sweet. She didn't do anything wrong. But she put the needle in and the thing kept beeping. And they're making me squeeze the ball constantly, and I have arthritis in my hands. So doing that motion like the every seven seconds they want you to do is one thing, but when they're yeah, like a lot of pain. So the machine keeps beeping. She's like, I'm gonna go get my supervisor. So she goes and gets her, and she comes back. She's like, No, you've got it in there perfectly. It wasn't pumping out. Oh, so they are steady wiggling this needle around in my arm. And so anyway, then the little girl explains to me the valves and the veins, and sure. They might have backed the needle right up to one and all that. So the other lady puts it in a little bit further. We think it's going, it's not. Um were you dehydrated? They asked me that, but I drink water all the time. Like I always have that water with me. So I don't think so. Uh they kept turning my arm, they dropped my arm, had me squeezing that ball. My hand went totally numb. Like I literally couldn't, I was like, I can't squeeze this ball anymore because I can't feel my hand. So they gave me a smaller ball. I mean they keep doing it. Um so then the supervisor tells her, Well, just get her bag to the minimum, whatever that is. Um and it keeps beeping. She has to keep coming over, keep adjusting. I was there for two hours. Oh boy. It usually takes like half an hour. The truck is leaving.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh no.

SPEAKER_01:

So the front desk lady comes in and is like, Do you want anything? You thought, yeah, I want something off the truck. That's the whole reason I'm here. So I have to dig my ticket out of my back pocket that I'm sitting on, give it to her, give her my order. She goes out and gets it, leaves it at the front, so it's cold by the time I get done and come out. However, the snack lady did warm it up for me in the microwave, so that was very nice. Um, so then the little girl comes over and she just starts taking taking it out. And I was like, Oh, good. Did we get to the minimum? She's like, No, but your blood's starting to clot, so we can't do it anymore. I was like, is that blood still good? She's like, Yeah. Pretty sure. Let me take it with me then. I was like, seriously, like, it was the worst. I mean, I it wasn't the worst. I have passed out. I have puked on myself. I have had all the things, and I keep going back. I need to find something. I never can give blood.

SPEAKER_00:

I never can. Is your thing too low? The iron too low?

SPEAKER_01:

No, mine used to always be too low.

SPEAKER_00:

I never go long enough without getting a tattoo. They're like, when was the last time you got a tattoo? Oh. This one still has scabs on it.

SPEAKER_01:

It but anyway, I mean, I still encourage you to show it. Other people go and have no problem. So now I'm thinking maybe I should do platelets. It's the same experience, my understanding, but you're in a much loungier chair. Uh-huh. And you it takes a couple hours, yeah. And you just lay there and you can watch a movie or listen to the page. They put it back, they put your blood back. Right. But then my friend told me that one time she afterward, she had this long streak down her arm because the needle had come so when they took the blood in and put it back in, it was just pumping it under her skin. Oh my god, jeez. I don't even know what to do. You get paid for plasma. Yeah, that's true. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00:

It's not very much though. But you can do it like two or three times a week.

SPEAKER_01:

I only do the blood thing like three, four times a year.

SPEAKER_00:

My dad always goes. They they're constantly my dad has good blood. Whatever blood he has is the good stuff because they call constantly. And he goes every time.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it was awful.

SPEAKER_00:

They like the hippie blood. They make gummies out of it, I think. For vampires.

SPEAKER_01:

All right. I just wanted to whine about my traumatic experience. A little humble brag with a wine in there. Just because if I can do it, you can do it. You can do it. You can do it. All right. So before we get started this week, like, share, rate, review. Yes. You can find us wherever you listen to podcasts. Please. Follow us on all the socials.

SPEAKER_00:

All of them.

SPEAKER_01:

At Like Whatever Pod. We are on YouTube at Like Whatever. And you can send us an email to likewhateverpod at gmail.com. Please. All right. So this week I decided we've been doing a lot of like music, movie type things. So I want to do a little history. Um, so nerd. I know. Uh let's fuck around and find out about the East Wing. So I got my sources this week from Whitehousehistory.com. Oh, no, dot org. Sorry. Um, mccbeacon.com, ghostsofdc.org. Ooh, and NPR. I'm actually surprised White House oh, because that's not the White House.gov. Official. Yeah. Yeah. I I thought the same thing when I saw it. I was like, hmm, this is anyway. I I promised myself I wouldn't do it.

SPEAKER_00:

Nope.

SPEAKER_01:

All right.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm not allowed to do it. This truly is. This week's been a good week. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. Um, but this truly is just a history of the East Wing because it, I don't know, it's kind of neat. Um all right, so in 1805, construction began on two one-story colonnades extending east and west from the White House and the footprint of what would become the modern East and West Wings. President Thomas Jefferson worked with architect Benjamin Harry Latrobe to design the colonnades and base them off similar uh dependencies on his plantation, Monticello. Have you been to Monticello? I have not.

unknown:

I have.

SPEAKER_01:

Is it creepy? I don't remember. I always thought plantations would be creepy to visit.

SPEAKER_00:

You went, didn't you go to the one in um in Dover, something like that?

SPEAKER_01:

That is true. I guess as a kid I didn't know. Now I don't know that I would want to go. Yeah. Like I think it's weird when people have weddings at plantations, like a lot of really gross stuff happened there. That's true so uh the colonnades were designed to blend into the gradual slope on which the White House was built to hide them from view when standing in front of the White House.

SPEAKER_00:

Can I just say that I if have if you've never been to the White House, once you go, it's a weird experience because when you go to the one side of it, it's very far. You know, the front side, I don't know if it's the front or the back, but the the one side is the lawn is really far. And you look at it and you're like, where in the hell have I I've seen pictures of it closer. And then if you go around to the back of it, I assume it's the back. I actually have no idea, but you can see it better, but you're still really fucking far away from it. Yeah. And it is a weird it's weird to look at it, I th I feel like it's it's cool, and I don't think they let you go through it anymore. I think it's very hard to get a tour. They used to let everybody go through, but I think um after September 11th, and no, they've definitely done them since then.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, have they?

SPEAKER_00:

Maybe COVID. Maybe COVID. I don't I don't know. It's a weird building. It is, it is, it's when you see it from the the very far side, you're kind of like, eh, I mean, it's not.

SPEAKER_01:

It's okay. This looks like any other historic building.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, I mean, I maybe, maybe because we're jaded, because I don't know about you, but we went to DC like every year for a field trip. Every single year. And then when my kids were in school, I went to DC every year with them. It's two hours from here. You either go there or Philadelphia or Baltimore. Like those are the three. But Baltimore's pretty much out at this point. Yeah. I mean, you went to the harbor and that was it, to the to the aquarium, and then and then you're out. Right. But I don't know if it's just because you just go all the time to DC. I know that sounds like anyway.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. I mean, I'm sure people that live near the Grand Canyon think the same thing. I don't even live near the fucking thing, and I'm never going back. Uh the colonnades were designed to blend. Oh, I already read that. Uh the ambitious original plans were for the colonnades to connect the White House to the Treasury building and the executive offices, but excessive cost and political pressure forced Jefferson to scale back his plans. Uh, in 1808, uh, when construction of Jefferson's colonnades was completed, uh, they did not connect to any other buildings and instead served primarily as storage and workspaces for White House domestic staff, including enslaved workers. The East Colonnade also housed a smokehouse for meats, a privy or bathroom, servants' quarters, a hen house, and stables. So really they just built a barn and yeah. Well, the outdoor housing was probably less appealing than the barn. Um no doubt. Uh in 1866, after the original East Colonnade built under President Jefferson became dilapidated, President Andrew Johnson ordered it torn down. So this East Wing that we had is not the original. Well, it's the colonnade. Yeah. In 1902, President Theodore Roosevelt ordered the construction of the East and West Wings. While the West Wing housed offices for the President's staff, the East Wing primarily served as a receiving area for visitors and guests attending functions at the White House. It featured a circular driveway with a carriage gate where guests would drive their horse-drawn carriages up to the entrance and a coat room known as the hat box. Guests passed through the East Colonnade and entered the main White House through the ground floor.

SPEAKER_00:

The last time I was in DC, I went with my um stepdaughter. And um it was right after COVID. Right after everything, they hadn't opened up the um the buildings yet. Like federal workers were still not working in the buildings. But anyway, they had an area where they had um people lining up to go in, and it said federal employees only, and I was like, I bet I can get in there. I got my badge. I didn't try.

SPEAKER_01:

Last time I was in DC was probably four, four or five years ago. I remember we went for my birthday. I love the Smithsonian, so when I'm there, I spend most of my time in there. Uh and then we went to the zoo because the National Zoo is also free. Yes. It's a good free day once you get yourself there.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, oh yeah. It's a very nice the train system is beyond just beyond. It is an amazing train. It really is. It always has been. Yeah. And it's clean. Like we go to you can get the train outside the city, so you don't have to go in the city. You don't have to park in the city or anything. Just take it. It's like the the one, the furthest out one, right on 50, because that's the road that takes you straight in. Um, it's like a 20-30-minute train ride. It's it's nice, it's it's very safe.

SPEAKER_01:

It is. You never hear about instances on that. No.

SPEAKER_00:

You do not.

SPEAKER_01:

Nope. All right. Roosevelt's renovation was part of a massive$550,000 improvement project designed with distinctly democratic ideals. Uh, the Brandon News of Mississippi reported on January 8th, 1903, that the basement of the East Wing was created as what some might call a public comfort building with clock rooms, cloakrooms capable of handling the wraps of 3,000 people during receptions. The renovation solved a long-standing problem with the White House, with White House Entertaining. Before the restoration, public receptions meant standing in rows three or four blocks long for as many hours or more, often exposed to rain or snow. Uh, Roosevelt Solution provided proper shelter and facilities while treating all guests with dignity regardless of social status.

SPEAKER_00:

Weird in the people's house.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh, to sum it all up, those who appreciate the honor of the invitation which is extended, which is extended to people at large to pay their respects to the head of the nation will no longer be treated like a mob assembled on the street, but will be shown the courtesy that is accorded guests of any American home, whether they are miners from Alaska, bankers from Wall Street, or lumbermen from the piney woods of Maine. The approach and carriage gate on the east cost$65,000 of the total project budget, reflecting the importance placed on creating a proper entrance that honored Jefferson's architectural vision while serving practical needs. Even after Roosevelt renovated, presidents continued struggling with space limitations. In 1914, President Woodrow Wilson demonstrated this ongoing challenge when he set up a tent in the White House Garden. The Madison of Richmond, Kentucky reported on May 26, 1914, that Wilson pitched a headquarters tent in the old-fashioned flower garden lying just south of the one-story annex, which forms the east approach to the White House. Wilson's makeshift office served his summer work hours needs because Washington's heat made indoor work difficult. The newspaper noted that Wilson was somewhat tired and has determined to do that which he will overcome, the tired feeling as much as possible. So he worked outside for practical reasons.

SPEAKER_00:

It's been done. Nobody is saying it's horrible because one person is renovating the historic building. Nobody is saying that. Speaking of not gold and not gaudy, did you know that I I have to We have to keep an eye on this. The last five pennies were just minted last week in Philadelphia. And they all bear the Omega symbol on them. And they're saying if you get any of these pennies, they're like worth like millions of dollars. So I'm going to try and keep because Philadelphia's right there. I don't know what how they if they're probably going to ship like one over here and one. I don't know, but keep your eye out.

SPEAKER_01:

It's been cracking me up how they're interviewing people on the street and they're like, what are stores going to do? And what about change? And blah blah. Do you know how many years it's going to take to get those pennies out of circulation that we already have? There are like billions and billions of those things. This is one thing I actually agree with this administration on. It cost four cents to make one penny. That's stupid. The penny should have been stopped a long time ago. And we like I said, we have planned out I'll bet 20, 25 years from now, people are still using pennies. I mean, they're not going to go anywhere. We go digital.

SPEAKER_00:

You just don't you take it to the five.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

You don't like to make things$19.99.

SPEAKER_01:

No, and you know what's funny is some stores are rounding in the um uh consumers' favor, but McDonald's will round up and they will charge you more up to the nickel. I'm like, that's that's pretty screwed up. Just take the nine cents off of your menu.

SPEAKER_00:

I just things don't cost$19.99 anymore. No.

SPEAKER_01:

And you're not fooling anybody. We don't know that that's$20. Like I always thought that was the weirdest thing. Like, just make it$20. Like, do people really look and like, oh, it's only$19.99? It's not$20.

SPEAKER_00:

No, I feel like some people do.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, you're right. You're right. What I'm sorry. Yeah. All right. All right. In 1942, President Franklin D. Roosevelt expanded the East Wing's footprint and added a second story. He originally intended it to house a White House museum, but the space became filled with offices and support staff. During the expansion, an underground bomb shelter was constructed as the United States had recently entered World War II. President Roosevelt also converted a room previously used as a coat room into a movie theater. The East Wing underwent its most significant structural change in 1942 under President Roosevelt. The Washington Post reported on May 1, 1942, that an East Wing is being added to the White House, officially described as office space to help relieve the present congestion in the White House. The public explanation was truthful but incomplete. The real purpose behind FDR's expansion was to conceal construction of an underground presidential bunker. Secretary of the Treasury Morgenthau had insisted on a bomb shelter, though Roosevelt initially resisted the idea because he felt that there was little chance of a German air raid. The expansion created the two-story East Wing structure that existed to this day, built directly. Some of this was written before October, I think, 15th, 12th. The former cloakroom from Roosevelt's era was converted into a White House family theater during the renovation. In 1965, First Lady Lady Bird Johnson dedicated the Jacqueline Kennedy Garden in honor of the former First Lady. The garden adjacent to the East Wing and Colonnade was designed by Rachel Bunny Mellon, who also designed the Rose Garden outside the Oval Office during the John F. Kennedy presidency and intended the two gardens to complement each other. She's been shaking her head. I was waiting for her to.

SPEAKER_00:

And now it's pavers.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Um so you don't get your shoes dirty.

SPEAKER_01:

On Valentine's Day in 1962, Americans tuned their TV sets to CBS and watched First Lady Jacqueline Kennedy walk down the East Wing's colonnade while Reverend Music played. This was the opening segment of a tour that she was about to give of the People's House to the people on live television. For many, it was the first time they'd ever seen the inside of the White House. The East Wing was still the house's guest entrance since the 1902 terrace and was where First Ladies would host official guests. In 1977, First Lady Rosalind Carter, Jimmy's back, Jimmy's back, back again, moved her office to the East Wing, becoming the first presidential spouse to have her own office there. A year later, Congress passed the White House Personnel Authorization Act, creating the official office of the First Lady. Since then, all First Ladies and their staff have worked in the East Wing, or had worked in the East Wing. When First Lady Rosalind Carter made the East Wing her official office space in the 1970s, it set a new precedent that all future First Ladies would have their own place to conduct business. Before that time, the wives of presidents were relegated to working from the family quarters on the main house's second floor. Along with the First Lady's office came new offices for her staff, press spaces, and rooms dedicated to the state projects a First Lady would work on during her tenure. Mrs. Kennedy was the first to use the East Wing for this purpose by housing the headquarters for her restoration of the White House there. The East Wing also featured recreational facilities for the first family, such as the movie theater.

unknown:

Movie theater.

SPEAKER_01:

Everything I read was big hype on the movie theater.

SPEAKER_00:

Everything I have seen, they really pushed that movie theater.

SPEAKER_01:

It has been a space of female power and a female niche in the White House, said Elizabeth Reese, a historian and research fellow at the University of Virginia's Miller Center. With the West Wing being a traditionally male-dominated space, the East Wing was a unique physical space for women to work and provided them with their own environment in which to flourish. Hmm. Yeah, yeah. Kind of picking up on why the East Wing's not really that important. I swear I wasn't going to do it. I knew I wasn't going to be able to. Since 1977, the East Wing has served as the traditional base of operations for the First Lady and her staff. The space houses the social secretary, the graphics and calligraphy office. Excuse you. I know. That produces White House invitations and serves as the main visitor entrance for foreign dignitaries. The wing also includes the White House Theater.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't know if you guys know this. I know. There used to be a theater there.

SPEAKER_01:

In the East Wing. I think I'm more devastated that the theater's gone now than I am that the East Wing Rose Gardens are gone. Very important theater. And it provided the route most tourists take when entering for public tours. During the Kennedy administration in the 1960s, the First Lady's staff expanded rapidly. As mass media is on the rise and there's enormous press interest in this young glamorous First Lady and her small children. That interest necessitates that there is a press arm for the first lady to cover her activities and to spread all this information to the press, said Elizabeth Reese. Jacqueline Kennedy's flagship project as a first lady was restoring the White House. That move inspired a trend for First Ladies to foster at least one key project. First ladies thus needed bigger staff, but they lacked sufficient office space. Betty Ford and earlier First Ladies were pretty much working out of their bedrooms. Uh, said Marianne Borelli, author of The Politics of the President's Wife and Professor of Government at Connecticut College. You can pause. Okay, so this week we are traveling back to April 4th, 1984. It was a Wednesday. So today I went to Mrs. Fox's again for the 80th time. Oh just kidding, apprentices. Oh yeah. JK. JK. But I actually wrote it out. We didn't see JK yet. I remember Mrs. Fox's. I was in Girl Scouts. And I think she, I think she and my mom were troop moms. And I remember her daughter was my friend. And I do, after looking at this, I did I didn't think I'd read this, but I do remember reading that line. Um I do now remember going to her house in the morning. So it must have been one of those things where mom needed somebody to watch me until I went to school. Right. Kind of things. Um all right. When I got to school, Mrs. Bailey, apprentices, homeroom teacher. Home room teacher. I'm glad I left a lot of detail in here. Like I can you can just picture it. Um we had a substitute again.

unknown:

Oh fuck this.

SPEAKER_01:

What the fuck is happening? For real. Is it flu season or something? Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

This is ridiculous. Goddamn public school system, I'll tell you.

SPEAKER_01:

Today we had a new student in Homeroom with a substitute teacher.

SPEAKER_00:

That's a great way to start. And why in April are you starting in a new school?

SPEAKER_01:

Her name was Mindy. Mindy. Mm-hmm. In Miss Irwin's, we had a science quiz. Mr. Eschenman, which was my math teacher, we called him Mr. E, um, was being weird today. Oh, in parentheses, math teacher.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. I mean, math teachers are kind of weird.

SPEAKER_01:

Very weird. Yeah. That's actually what I went to school for when I first got in. She's weird. Yeah. Um, when I got home, I practiced my flute. Good job. And went to Girl Scouts. Right. At Girl Scouts, we had a party and did a craft. Oh. Mommy told Daddy a joke and told me she'd tell me when I was 21. She promised.

SPEAKER_00:

So she was telling dirty jokes.

SPEAKER_01:

You know what? I remember this joke. I remember that conversation even without seeing that diary. And here's the joke.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_01:

How can you tell when a chicken has had oral sex? And then you have to have shred of paper up in your hand up in your hand, and you go and you blow the paper out like it's feathers. I remember it. I didn't know what it meant at that time. All right. But it's funny that's in there.

SPEAKER_00:

It's funny that your mom told that joke. Yeah. All right. All right then.

SPEAKER_01:

If yeah, so that's this week's uh uh little page of uh I love Nicole's diary. I know it.

SPEAKER_00:

Teachers are weird. It's the thing. They are, it's so funny. It's Girl Scouts, craps, dirty jokes from my mom. Well, it was a day. It was you know, I'm outraged though at this this lack of a permanent teacher situation this whole week.

SPEAKER_01:

And the funny thing is, like I work in schools now, and it's weird to me. Like the first time I got to go in a teacher's lounge, like as an actual professional adult, I was like, ooh. And um I see that teachers take off, or I talk to them, I know they're going on vacation, or I know like whatever, and I see them taking off. But I felt like as a I would think nowadays, like, I don't think teachers took off this much when I was a kid. I feel like they were always there, but apparently not in 1984. Lots of absenteeism back then. It's just ridiculous. I know, I know. Maybe she got chicken pox. It could very well be. Probably shingles because all kids had chickenpox.

SPEAKER_00:

She's listening to this right now and be like, I had the fucking shingles.

SPEAKER_01:

Little assholes. Yeah. All right. She probably needed a mental health week. Yeah, no doubt. She didn't know it at the time. No. She just knew she was done. All right. Next, back to the story. In 1978, a law gave more funding for the First Lady and her staff to carry out their duties. Under First Lady Carter, Reese said the staff became formally known as the Office of the First Lady, a professional unit within the executive order of the president. From there, Carter focused on mental health initiatives. Uh, among her successors, Laura Bush launched a literacy campaign. Michelle Obama promoted Let's Move, targeting childhood obesity. Emmelia Trump backed Be Best, which advocates for children's well-being. Yep. We're both being so good. I know. Um, even though women in the White House made big strides in the East Wing, some had reservations. The West Wing is the seat of power in the White House, and it's all about proximity, said Kate Anderson Bauer, author of First Women: The Grace and Power of America's Modern First Ladies. There's a built-in Siberia nature to the East Wing, uh, added Bauer, who covered the Obama administration for Bloomberg News. Hillary Clinton was the first to have an office in the West Wing, steps from the president's Oval Office. She saw the West Wing as the policy-making locus and the East Wing as more ceremonial and symbolic. And I think over time she became aware of the power that comes through ceremony and symbolism, said Borelli.

SPEAKER_00:

Um let's just say I also wanted to say this. It's kind of late into this. I should have probably said it, but anyway. With all of the uh current events that is in the news, um I feel like we should just talk about um Monica Lewinsky, okay, who was a victim.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

She was a victim. She was. She's not the butt of a joke. She was. She was, but she should not be. And I'm guilty of it. It is and unfortunately, that's come back because of recent stuff. Um and it's unfortunate because the woman was a victim. She was. He was a powerful man in a position of power, and she was an intern.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. And which means she was around 20, 21.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Also. The Epstein files. I don't give a fuck if my own fucking father is in the Epstein files. Release them. They should all go to fucking jail.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Even if Jesus Christ himself is in the files. They should all have to pay for what they did. Yes. Because it's not okay. I don't care if you're a Democrat.

SPEAKER_01:

I don't care if you're not a political issue.

SPEAKER_00:

It's not. It's a human issue.

SPEAKER_01:

It's a human issue. It is a child abuse issue. Yes. And please stop calling them young women. They are children.

SPEAKER_00:

Children. Children. I don't care, Megan Kelly, what you have to say. If they're under 18, they're a child. I mean, let's fucking be real. If you're under 25, you're a child.

SPEAKER_01:

For real. Like it it skeeves me to see a 30-some year old with a 19. Like Leonardo DiCaprio, what are you doing? What do you have in common?

SPEAKER_00:

Like, what do you talk about? Right. You can't pop like I never under like I know we've talked about this before. I never understood the cougar thing. What the fuck do you have to talk to? That sounds awful. A 19-year-old boy.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Nothing. I have zero things to say. Yeah. Six, seven, I guess, is what you would say. I don't know. I don't get it. I don't understand the appeal. I don't find them attractive. I don't think. I mean I don't want to be graphic here, but I could snap your ass in half. Like what?

SPEAKER_02:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't want to have to teach people new. I don't want to teach anything.

SPEAKER_01:

No.

SPEAKER_00:

I don't. I just anyway. Leave poor Monica alone. She was a victim. The fact that everybody is bringing all this bullshit back up and it's just a big fucking joke again. It's not a joke. The woman was a victim. And she has continued to be victimized year after year after year. And then just when she thinks she's getting out of it, boom, this happens, and she's brought right back into it.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. I wonder what her life could have been. Because I'm sure it wasn't anything she thought it was going to be.

SPEAKER_00:

It's just leave the poor woman alone. And release the Epstein files. And release the motherfucking Epstein files. I don't care who's in them. I don't care. This is not a witch hunt for one particular orange person. No. It's not. I don't care who's in them. Everyone in them should have to be held responsible for their part.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, because we keep hearing Epstein files, and I feel like that's just a cover and nobody really thinks about it. This was a whole entire island that was stocked with underaged girls for the sole purpose of rich men to fly down there and fuck them.

SPEAKER_00:

And they were being trafficked. They weren't, it's not even it is about them being young, but there's also probably 18, 19, 20-year-olds that were trafficked.

SPEAKER_01:

Right. I'm not just saying the underaged ones as well. There were also ones because some of the men preferred them a little bit more developed, I suppose. So they did have some 18, 19, 20-year-olds down there. But none of them were there by choice.

SPEAKER_00:

This is this is a this should be a bipartisan issue where everyone should want to know. And with this whole, oh well, you know, Bill Clinton's on there. Yeah, no shit. No, we all know that. We all fucking know that. And he should be held responsible for his actions. Every person who stepped foot on that island.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Because you knew what was happening there.

SPEAKER_01:

That's exactly right. Even if you can claim you didn't for whatever reason.

SPEAKER_00:

Everybody knew what was going on there. And don't give me this bullshit of oh, he was a billionaire and all billionaires know each other. Come on. Come on.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Epstein had one purpose in life. It was to own an island with sex slaves on it. For old men to come.

SPEAKER_00:

Of course they're not releasing the oh the Democrats had all this time to release it. Of course they didn't do it. You know why? Because they know who's on it and they know they're on it too. But if you go and run your fucking campaign on the fact that you're going to release them and get everybody all Twitter pated about it, and then you don't and then you take Maxwell and you put her in a a minimum security prison where the shit that's coming out about that right now, where she's getting all kinds of special treatment, and you know f I swear to God, if she gets pardoned and the people who do not believe things, if you do not see, then there is no seeing. Then there is no. They're never gonna come around. They're never okay. End of rant. Leave Monica alone.

SPEAKER_01:

So much for keeping the politics on this episode. It's my own fault. Wait, well, I I mean no, no, no.

SPEAKER_00:

I'm just I tried to keep I went, I know I yelled at a Democrat and I yelled at a Republican.

SPEAKER_01:

So I was keeping I was keeping my anger bipartisan. Yeah, I suppose actually we weren't discussing a political issue. Leave her alone. God okay. Yeah. Okay. All right, we're almost done. Uh in 2025, uh July 31st, 2025, the White House announced plans for construction to begin on a new ballroom, citing the need to host major functions for world leaders, dignitaries, and guests. The White House stated the site of the new ballroom will be where the small, heavily changed and reconstructed East Wing currently sits. White House public tours were closed by September, and demolition of the East Wing began on October 20th. Two days later, the White House Historical Association announced that it had supported efforts to digitally preserve the East Wing and Jacqueline Kennedy Gardens with comprehensive scanning and photography projects.

SPEAKER_00:

So ends. Um I mean, I suppose the current administration agrees that they need a whole room for balls. So there's that. Apparently extremely necessary that we have more ballroom.

SPEAKER_01:

I mean, they could have put a bunch of gold in it without tearing it down. And has anybody seen a floor plan for this thing?

SPEAKER_00:

Because I just because they didn't they didn't submit one, and that is my whole fucking issue with the thing. That is my issue with it. First of all, it's too big. It's ridiculous. It's gonna be gaudy as a big thing.

SPEAKER_01:

Because I just picture one huge, ginormous room.

SPEAKER_00:

It is. You can look it up. They do show you. But they never submitted it to the through the proper channels.

SPEAKER_01:

So they don't have permits or there's no there's no attention to the historical Yeah, because it says here the White House Historical Association agreed to whatever, but who knows who's heading up that organization at this point. So I also heard on the way down here today that butter was good for you, and I got excited till I found out it was Kennedy that said it. Oh well. And I'll just be back to guilty eating.

SPEAKER_00:

I mean, he thinks it's perfectly okay to cut the head off of a dead whale and strap it to the roof of his car while his children get whale juice all over him. I don't know what timeline we are living in right now. Just don't understand. And I know I'm not gonna get political because I can't, and nobody's here for that, but you know.

SPEAKER_01:

But we are gonna share our points of view. Yeah. Especially on things that we feel strongly about.

SPEAKER_00:

And this is something I feel not the white the ballroom. Right. No, I know. I I mean my issue with it is not that you're putting a hideously unattractive ballroom because whatever. Right. But the fact that you first have said you're not gonna touch the east wing, you're just gonna take down the awning, and then we watch on television as the entire thing is ripped to shreds. That's a little dis and I get it. You're allowed to do whatever I mean. Obama, you know, he put the whole basketball ring up on a tennis court and redrew lines, and then when he left, he took the tape back up. But whatever, you know, it is very intrusive. Yeah, extremely, you know, you're allowed to do that shit. It makes sense. It's modern, you know, at some point you had to modernize it and yeah, of course it's not gonna look the same as it did in 1800. It's it's that's fine. But the fact that you tore things down exactly, like you could have put it, like I said, the whole front of the fucking place is just grass. Like for for forever in front of it. You could have put a whole big ass gaudy ass gold ballroom in the beginning. Ugh. Well, that was lovely. Take care of the history of the thank you.

SPEAKER_01:

I did, like, I had the idea, and I was like, oh, that sounds boring. But when I was researching, I was like, there's actually a lot of cool stuff that went on in there. And the fact that it was um the space for the first ladies and all the initiatives and the work that that those women got done happened in there, like that was really good to read. Um it's where all the guests used to come. And you see the old black and white pictures of people just partying, hooping it up in there, and it looked like it was a very lovely space. Um but I did have fun learning about it, and I hope you all did tutor.

SPEAKER_00:

Dude. There was a pool in there, too. I don't remember. It was one of the Rose Belt's FDR, I believe, had a pool in there because it was polio. So I guess the bunker's still intact, right? I would assume so. Yeah. Because I imagine that's where they their war room or whatever. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, they have that I I don't know, maybe they moved it underneath the it's hard to say where. I mean, I don't imagine the letters will hold that. Town under all things. I think so too, and I don't think we get to actually know where the we're not supposed to. Yeah. I mean, who knows? Somebody will probably tell us. Oh, I'm sure in a drunken text chain to the pole. With the nuclear codes.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, you see, they took him out of the spotlight after that whole fiasco. We don't really hear much from him anymore. I can't do it. All right, let's wrap up this episode before you lose your job.

SPEAKER_00:

I lose my job. Um, thank you, Nicole. That was lovely. Thanks. Um, sorry for all getting riled up.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, but y'all know how we feel.

SPEAKER_00:

It's been a week. That's the issue. The week, it's uh every week is a week, and this one was a week.

SPEAKER_01:

It does build up and it gets exhausting, and you you try to just keep your head down and keep going, but sometimes it piles up.

SPEAKER_00:

Especially when you have people in your life that are the diametric opposite. See, we can bury it at this part because nobody listens this fair. I love it. Yeah. We get called a demon a lot.

SPEAKER_01:

Like that's an insult.

SPEAKER_00:

Like for real demon. Um, anyway. Boop boop. Thank you for listening. Thank you for giving us the the East Wing. Yes. Um, like, share, rate, a review. Please. Uh, you can find us where you listen to all of your podcasts. Please. Um, the like, share, rating, and review, it really helps small podcasts out grow to grow. Like you can get really on a list. Have you like share rate review?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and I actually got, I don't think I told you you might have seen it though on Facebook. We got a notification last week that um we're reaching more people, so they're sharing our stuff out further. I don't know what that means, but cool. Yeah, so you guys like share rate review, it does help. Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, you find us where we did that part. Um, follow us on all the socials at like whatever pod. Please. Like the the face, the book of face. You can send us an email about your favorite part of the east wing of the White House, including the theatre. To like whatever pod at gmail dot com or don't like whatever. Ever bye.

Contributor

Heather Jolley

Host
Contributor

Nicole Barr

Host