Behind the Curtain: Honest Conversations about Foster Care and Adoption
Each episode will feature a conversation between host Rebecca Harvin and foster/adoptive caregivers or members of the community who support foster care and adoption.
Behind the Curtain: Honest Conversations about Foster Care and Adoption
Rebecca Unedited: Answering Questions from Our Listeners
Rebecca and Courtney answer questions submitted by listeners. This episode is off the cuff, unedited and offers an unfiltered view as Rebecca answers those questions. We discuss various aspects of adoption, including timelines, processes for domestic and international adoptions, advocacy for children, and ways to support families in this journey.
• Exploring average timelines for different types of adoption
• Practical ways to support foster and adoptive families
• Sharing lighthearted stories from the foster care experience
• Advocacy tips for parents of adopted children
• Advice for road-tripping with large families and children
Hey guys, thanks so much for joining the podcast today. I'm Rebecca Harvin, your host, and today we have a new kind of episode for you. I've got Courtney here with me and we are going to start a series called Rebecca unedited, which could be good and it could be bad, but we won't know until we get to the end. And Courtney has a series of questions that we kind of polled listeners and friends and said if you could ask any question of a foster or adoptive parent, what would it be? So Courtney has some of those questions she's going to ask me and I am going to answer straight from the cuff, like I have not thought through my answers to these questions yet. I'm going to go with gut instinct and we are going to see what kind of magic happens.
Speaker 2:All right.
Speaker 1:Let's do it.
Speaker 2:Let's do it, okay. The first one we got was what is the average amount of time it takes once you decide you want to adopt, before you actually have a kid in your home?
Speaker 1:That's a fantastic question.
Speaker 2:It's probably one. Maybe you like answer that and then kind of go through why it takes that long, like what the process looks like.
Speaker 1:So, okay, this question I've gotten asked several times over the last God knows how many years, and it has a multitude of different options for the answer.
Speaker 1:So adoption is all about which path you choose. There is domestic, infant private adoption, there's adoption through foster care and there is foreign adoption. There's adoption through foster care and there is foreign adoption. You could also it's extremely rare but you could adopt an older child or like a toddler, at one or two sometimes. I mean extremely rare that children from their biological parent will go up for adoption at that age. So each path has a different amount of time and once you pick that, once you pick your path, you're kind of locked into that timeline. So let's just take it like one at one at a time. Okay, um, the Ooh. Well, it's unedited. The easiest path to adoption, um, could be argued, is a domestic, private adoption. Okay, um, people listening to this might have failed private domestic adoptions and they would say 100%. This is the most heartbreaking way to adopt.
Speaker 1:I have friends that have failed private domestic adoptions and it is heartbreaking. So, without making light of that, there is kind of a rhythm to this. So you would decide that you want to adopt, you would get a home study done with an adopt, you would pick an adoption agency, you would get a home study done and then, once the home study is done and you're you are approved to become an adoptive family, you would kind of create this like book about you and your spouse.
Speaker 1:Okay, typically, speaking if I mean, let me back this up, if you're single, you would just do it about yourself, okay. But speaking, if I mean, let me back this up, if you're single, you would just do it about yourself, okay. But if you're in a relationship, you would do it, you and your spouse would do it and you kind of it's kind of like an ad book, like why?
Speaker 2:Try and sell yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, why you would be a great family for this kid, why you would be a great family for this kid. And then your adoption agency takes that and they have birth moms that are coming that want to place their child for adoption and they have those birth moms have a set list of criteria, and so the adoption agency and I am giving you such a high picture of this, like this is such a macro picture but the agency would take the books that match the criteria and they would show it to the birth mom and then the birth mom would choose from those from those books.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Sometimes she might narrow it down to like two or three some different things and they there's a wide variety of what they want and they each have an opinion, they each have a say and ultimately it is their choice who their baby goes to. So it's a really big choice and it's not to be taken lightly. That can happen at any point in the nine-month period that that mom is pregnant. So it can and has happened for my friends in month eight.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:In which case, if you're chosen, you're becoming a mom next month, right, and you could have just gotten your home study. You could have a home study in June, be picked in August, be a mom in September. It's crazy, that's fast, fast, that's so fast. And like that's not hypothetical, like that has happened, right, you could have a home study in January and your book be shown to five, six, seven, ten birth moms. Yeah, moms and not be picked, and then be picked at month three.
Speaker 2:And have six more months to go.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:And they can always change their mind.
Speaker 1:And they can always change their mind. So, while it is the most kind of known process, it doesn't. Adoption is hard, like that waiting time of am I going to be chosen or not chosen? Yeah, are they going to change their mind or not change their mind? I don't care if it's two months or if it is 15 months. Those two months can feel like 15 months. It can be excruciating. That time is excruciating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, until that baby's in your hands.
Speaker 1:And papers are signed, and papers are signed yeah. Like it is not until papers are signed that you breathe. Yeah, okay, that's that route. I hope I did it justice. It's the one route that I have no experience with yeah, the one you haven't done. Whatsoever. Foreign adoption you pick an adoption agency that works in the country that you want to adopt from, and then you go through that process and each different country has a different timeline, and when you pick the country, you know your timeline.
Speaker 1:You kind of know what you're expecting in terms of how long it's going to be? Yes, Unless the country changes adoptions in the middle of it, changes their process, shuts down. Which is gut-wrenching.
Speaker 2:I mean it's just it's brutal when this happens.
Speaker 1:This is what we experienced. This in Ethiopia kind of to a degree. That's not what shifted our, that's not what ended our adoption in Ethiopia, but it did affect adoptions around ours. We have friends that this just happened to in China.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It is gut-wrenching, but let's pick a country Guatemala.
Speaker 2:I have no idea if.
Speaker 1:Guatemala is doing adoptions right now or not? I don't either. Okay, so let's say that we pick Guatemala is doing adoptions hypothetically or not. I don't either. Okay, so let's say that we pick Guatemala is doing adoptions hypothetically, right, I don't know. And you pick an adoption agency that's working with Guatemalan adoption agencies.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:You pick a domestic American agency, so they're here they're working with the government and adoption agencies in guatemala and orphanages in guatemala, again hypothetically I wish I could have picked, like named, a country that we knew for sure was yeah, like I had a cat named genovia from the princess diaries like let's call it genovia, actually not, not guatemala.
Speaker 2:If we're being hypothetical, anyways, we might as well just call it what we want.
Speaker 1:Okay, rebecca, unedited, here we go. Okay, so when you sign up they'll tell you it's going to take you six months to get your home study here. Then your home study goes through. You have to go through like immigration here. Okay, and I am so far removed from the names of the things that we worked with, but basically our adoption dossier went to Florida's State Department, okay, where it was approved at the Florida level, and then it went to America's, like the U S state department.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Gosh, I am pulling things from like the recesses of my memory, but I feel like our paperwork was in Texas at one point and then it got sent back to us and then, anyhow, once, once it is approved at our state level, our, like US government state Department of State.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Then it goes to the Department of State in the country that you're going to and then you're in that country's system. Now, once it gets approved there, then you are matched with a kid. No, you could get matched. Once it's approved at our state level, you can get matched with a kid.
Speaker 2:Before they approve it in the other countries, state level Okay.
Speaker 1:And then you are yeah Cause, then you're what you're doing. It basically, when you get matched, is you're like you're getting that kid, that, that child, so you could potentially get Approved to be an immigrant in America.
Speaker 2:Okay, but you could potentially be matched and then the government or state level of another country could say oh, by the way, we're not doing adoptions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 100%, okay, yeah.
Speaker 2:So you could have like a child in mind and maybe have started a relationship with this child and then.
Speaker 1:You can have pictures. You could have celebrated birthday. I mean, you could, yeah, 100%.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:It is devastating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, when that happens.
Speaker 1:Because you start. On your end, you start on our, on your end you start bonding yeah, and your body, your brain start bonding with this kid. Yeah, um so, but in a really established like, let's say, genovia was an established adoption country, hypothetically, um, they would tell you, from the time that you start this till you, till you get called to travel is going to be 18 months. Okay, and it's a well-oiled machine.
Speaker 2:It might be a longer timeline, but it's a more known timeline than domestic. It's a very known timeline You're going to travel two times.
Speaker 1:The first time you go over there you're going to meet. Danielle was on the podcast she adopted from Ethiopia. She knows when she gets matched. She has to go over to Ethiopia. She has to meet her kids. She's going to come home.
Speaker 1:She's going to go back six weeks later or two months later and it's just like it's so laid out for you. It's not even funny. You're going to pick boy or girl mild to moderate. We had said I mean I'll just tell you like our requirements were like boy or girl mild to moderate. We had said, I mean I'll just tell you like our requirements were like boy or girl mild to moderate. Special needs and you kind of pick off of a list of special needs and then you also say what you won't take and it's like the weirdest thing that you could possibly do. And then you go Like you go pick up your kid, and then you go Okay, you go pick up your kid, you go before the court. There you come here. There's some immigration stuff that you have to do, depending on the country that you adopt them from. They either are or are not a US citizen upon adoption. Okay, so you might have to do like a citizen thing here, right, so timeline varies based on the country?
Speaker 2:Yeah, but it's a known timeline.
Speaker 1:It's a known timeline, okay, and I would say if you're doing foreign adoption, you should expect a timeline between one and three years. Okay, it's a long time and that is off the cuff, and I have not looked at foreign adoptions in a long time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sure a lot's changed, but Ready for my favorite.
Speaker 1:Okay, let's hear your favorite Foster care. There are people who get licensed to foster and they get licensed immediately as foster to adopt. They know that they do not want to foster in the traditional sense of the word. They want to foster to adopt. So I have friends in like every single one of these.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like we've all adopted from such variety of places. So my friends are licensed. Let's say they're licensed in August. They're matched with a kid before or with a sibling set before they get licensed, because the children who are available to adopt are listed their social circle is adopting them. The department does not know. They don't have a viable option for adoption and they're like now available to anybody that's licensed, okay, so it's really easy.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:If it's just foster to adopt and if you are okay with an older age and or a sibling set, you could go from zero to five kids in the blink of an eye. It's like stupid fast how this can go. So let's say my friend is licensed in August. They are matched with a kid before their license is approved by the state of Florida. They start meeting them the week that their license is approved and they say, yes, we like this kid, we like this kid or these kids, we want to move forward with this. They make that decision. In a couple weeks the transition plan starts, kids are in their home, they've got 90 days before court and they're adopted.
Speaker 2:Wow, so they would still go to them as foster kids.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they would still be technically foster kids but they would be placed in that home, Like that is an adoptive home Right and the purpose is to adopt the kids.
Speaker 2:Cause the rest of the process of foster care has already happened.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, exactly, so real fast.
Speaker 2:Yeah, very fast.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Crazy fast.
Speaker 1:Crazy fast. Alternatively, you can foster with reunification as a goal Right and find that the kids in your home need to be adopted and then that there is no timeline.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's no, it's so all over the place it's all over the place.
Speaker 1:But I would say, even in that timeline, like if the goal was reunification, you're still looking at between our friends that just adopted like three years Long time.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Long time to be in the middle.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's the not short answer, but it's a little bit complicated.
Speaker 2:It is complicated, it is. There is no like easy answer.
Speaker 1:No yeah.
Speaker 2:It looks very different in different scenarios.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, fastest route foster to adopt kids in the heart gallery.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Done, yeah, like they're looking for homes you are looking to adopt. It's a direct answer to a very immediate need.
Speaker 2:Right yeah.
Speaker 1:But you will not get. Most of the time you will not get a baby, right you like? I mean, unless they're a sibling set, you likely won't get a toddler.
Speaker 2:Okay, you're looking at teenagers, mostly older kids, nine year old, 10 year old, 11 year old.
Speaker 1:Okay, you're looking at teenagers, mostly older kids.
Speaker 2:Nine-year-old 10-year-old.
Speaker 1:11-year-old. Or sibling sets.
Speaker 2:Sibling sets Okay, real cute kids, yeah, that just want a family, yeah, okay, all right. Well, our next question that we got was what can we do to support your family? We don't want to foster or adopt, but we want to support you. How can we do that? So I think this is a great question, like for anyone who I mean. We just released an episode not long ago about Sarah Graves on here, about you know.
Speaker 2:She knew she didn't want to foster or adopt, but she wanted to support foster and adoptive families. So this is how do people do that?
Speaker 1:How do people do that? You know, somebody else asked me that question recently and I answered them. You should go talk to Sarah Graves. She does it really well, so go ask Sarah Go talk to Sarah, and part of why I said that was because you'd be hard-pressed to find a foster or adoptive parent that advocates for their own self.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, it makes sense. It takes a selfless person to enter foster and adoption. Yeah so it's yeah, makes sense.
Speaker 1:So, and we're just really tired of advocating, you know, like all of our, I don't want to have to tell you what I need. I want you to just know Like I'm so tired from telling people what my kids need all the time, um, that I don't advocate well for my own self, which is a problem Like, let's be really honest, okay, um, okay. First of all, can I say uh, I will go to my grave saying that not everybody should be a foster or adoptive parent, I agree.
Speaker 1:How many times have you ever heard me? I mean, I say this all the time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, it's true that not everyone was made to be a foster or adoptive parent, but we all are made to support foster and adoption in some way.
Speaker 1:Yes, in some capacity, we are all made to support vulnerable children.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:And there's not a single foster or adoptive kid that doesn't fall into that category. Right? So how to support? Okay, assume that we need it. Okay, assume that we need it. Assume that, no matter what, no matter what we look like when we see you, no matter what, no matter what kind of mask we can find to put on our face, when we're in public assume that it is that that mask, when that mask comes off, that we need help.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That our worlds can feel and oftentimes do feel like they are falling apart.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:And there is not a single person in the foster care or adoption world that I have ever talked to. I'm like racking my brain for an example of somebody that was like no, I basically have it all together.
Speaker 2:Oh, maybe in the beginning stages right.
Speaker 1:I mean in the beginning stages. You're like my first placement. I'm like I should write a book.
Speaker 2:Yes, I should write I do this so well, or like you're, you just got, like domestically adopted a newborn baby and you feel like this is, I got this, this is good. Yeah, I think things will come, things will come.
Speaker 1:There might have been some in utero trauma that that right pops up later on in life and it's hard, it's much harder, to tie a line between private domestic adoptions and some neurological differences that that child might have later because you're like oh, I was in the hospital room, I got them from birth, but we're diminishing the fact that there's still a primary wound. Have right later.
Speaker 1:because you're like oh, I, I was in the hospital room I got them from birth, right, but we're diminishing the fact that that, like, there's still a primary wound, that happens and yeah, that there was a lot of stress, okay, anyhow, that's not the question. Um, that's a soapbox. That's not a question. Um, okay, assume that we need help. Assume that we need help. Assume that, um, that our lives are spent. They revolve around the, the healing for kids in our home and like helping them get to a place that is, like you know, like you know, functional. I'm like searching my brain for a way to say this nicely, but just assume that, like, there are days when, for instance, like I'm in a meeting for one kid, I'm at therapies for a different kid, I get called to school for a different kid. I get like that my whole day can be hijacked by the needs that my kids have, in addition to the standard needs that I meet on any given day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and we see this happen in the office right Like we see a whole day get hijacked by maybe one kid, maybe multiple kids, I don't know, but yeah, you see it happen so like I would say that, that to show up, to be like, hey, you didn't ask for it, but here's a meal yeah like I'm sending your family um, I'm sending your family food tonight. Do you want it from chick-fil-a or do you? I? I'm like what? What's like a universal restaurant?
Speaker 2:around, or do you want?
Speaker 1:it from like Chili's Right, like, um, I'm, I'm, I'm ordering dinner and I'm it's going to show up at your house at six o'clock. Um, I have cried, I have cried literal tears in my kitchen.
Speaker 2:When it just shows up, because I think it's like's. Like you're saying, assume that every day can be a hard day, and even if it wasn't a hard day, it still means something yeah, I had a friend this summer um ask what they could do to help.
Speaker 1:when I took my family out west, they said what can I do to help you get ready for school?
Speaker 1:um, and this particular friend like loves to shop and I said Can I give you my school supply list and could you buy these things for me, assuming that I was adding it to her school supply? Like anyhow, I show up after the trip and I she's like hey, come pick up your school supply. She has them, we're standing in her garage. She has all six of my kids. Five out of six kids started at new schools. She has all six of my kids with their school supplies like organized in boxes, with their lists on top of it, double checks, triple checks, like it's the most organized my kids have ever been.
Speaker 1:And I said, okay, great, how much? How much do I owe you for this? And she looked at me and she was like, what are you talking about? This was a gift. And, Courtney, I sobbed.
Speaker 2:I bet. I love that it's so practical.
Speaker 1:It's so practical.
Speaker 2:And maybe wasn't like a huge deal to her, super easy, maybe probably fun for her, and it meant so much to you.
Speaker 1:It meant, it meant the world to me Like that, not only like it just was completely removed from my plate. It was completely removed this immense stress completely removed. You know we just had Christmas, christmas. Assume that parents with lots of kids have a crap ton of um wrapping yeah like yeah, and I mean I think just call show up.
Speaker 2:Be like hey, I'm showing up to wrap presents, yeah this is, and and maybe you're a friend that can afford to say, hey, send me a wish list for your kids. I want to help buy some presents because, that's hard, oh my God, but maybe you're someone that can't afford to do that, and so showing up to wrap, you show up with your time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you show up and you say like hey, I've got time on Thursday morning. Leave your laundry in the living room. I'm going to come and I'm going to fold all of your laundry.
Speaker 2:I think we try to like make this harder and more complicated than it is. It's just practical things right. It's like I can think I'm not a foster or adoptive parent, but I can think of the things that are hard as a parent and be like, okay, well, this is hard for me. Yeah, surely this is really hard for someone that has six kids that have all sorts of things they're bringing into the home.
Speaker 1:Surely this feels overwhelming to somebody else At Haven, like I think, one of the easiest ways to answer this question and maybe I should have started it with that. But at Haven, when we're talking to people that we're doing support for, we say what brings you the most shame.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:What ball are you dropping that brings you shame? And you could ask your friend that that's a kind of vulnerable question. But and you could ask your friend that that's a kind of vulnerable question but I promise you that your friend knows what brings them shame.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, they know it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they know when they feel like a horrible parent because they can't figure out what's for dinner.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or because they're kids? It's a great question to ask.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think Take out for the sixth time that week, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, yeah, I think, take out for the sixth time that week.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, right. So I want a home cooked meal this time. Yeah, right. Or like and again, maybe maybe you cook for them, or maybe you just say like, hey, here's a gift card.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like. Use it when you need it. Dinner's on me. Use it when you need it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Call it in. Yeah, I like that question.
Speaker 2:I do too. I think it's always good to hear from the other side of it. What are things that I can do that are going to help make a big difference?
Speaker 1:Pick up one of our kids. Yeah, come, be like, hey come. Same friend that did the school supply shopping on Christmas Eve this year, that did the school supply shopping on Christmas Eve this year. Brad had a very sudden, minor, very minor eye emergency.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And we found ourselves at the Retina Institute on Christmas Eve morning and our 8 o'clock appointment turned into come spend Christmas Eve with us Uh-huh, of course, all morning long and we had left our teenagers at home to babysit and when we realized that we were going to be there for far longer than any teenager one sibling wants to babysit for I called that friend and it didn't matter that it was christmas eve, it didn't. I knew that I could call them and I could say can you please go to my house and pick up two kids?
Speaker 1:because just picking up two kids changes the dynamic in my house and I don't care which ones you pick up, yeah, but just like they're like yep 100, we are there and I was like great and and the breath of fresh air that that was. Um, it was, it's so needed having people in your life like that so needed. They went out of town this weekend. They told their babysitters, like call the harvins, they will come pick up whoever you need to just change the dynamic in the house. Yeah, it's good to have. Okay.
Speaker 2:Next question All right, so we'll break up the seriousness a little bit. Okay, one of our listeners would like for you to tell us a funny story from foster care.
Speaker 1:A funny story from foster care.
Speaker 2:I know you have them.
Speaker 1:Oh, Okay, Okay, Okay Okay. One of my jobs as a foster mom in certain placements was to like, um like, teach social skills. This is this has been true in most but not all of our placements is like how to go to a restaurant, how to go, how to drive in a car for two hours.
Speaker 1:Things that they probably have never done before Sometimes, sometimes things that they've never done before how to go to the movie theater, how to go to a park, okay, okay. So I have a friend who's flying down. She lives in Indiana Katie, if you're listening, the story's about you and she loves Universal. She loves Harry.
Speaker 2:Potter.
Speaker 1:And so she's going to be in Orlando and she says, hey, will you come bring your kids and we'll stay in this hotel, and just so I can hang out with you guys for a day, like before she goes to Universal. And I say, sure, we have a sibling set, that is, two brothers and a girl. Okay, at this point and I am for the sake of the innocent, I am not going to say which one of the children Okay, all right this story belongs to, but they had not as a sibling set, they had not um gone to a hotel.
Speaker 1:they um, we walked in, well, we didn't make it through the parking lot like. I opened the doors and the youngest took off just running. And my friend Katie, she's at the door to the hotel. She hasn't seen these kids, she hasn't met these kids.
Speaker 2:Oh, so she has no idea?
Speaker 1:No, she just sees this kid running and she's like, oh God.
Speaker 2:This kid's running and.
Speaker 1:Katie starts taking off through a parking lot and she collects this kid and she starts walking back like who's kidding, are you holding?
Speaker 2:and I'm like hey katie, so she didn't even know that it was yours uh-uh no she just is like not gonna let this kid yeah yeah, yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 1:So, um, I'm like well welcome like this, like this is the level that we're dealing with. Okay.
Speaker 2:Aren't you glad you invited us so glad.
Speaker 1:So we get into the hotel, and this hotel that Katie has booked for us is like so nice.
Speaker 2:Okay, it is not where I would have chosen, not where you would have chosen for kids. It's not a holiday inn.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, it's like. It's like it's all open to the courtyard, like it's open to the enclosed courtyard.
Speaker 2:Okay, right.
Speaker 1:With like I mean just it's, it's really really really pretty. Okay, we decide that we're going to take the kids to the pool because these kids love water.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:And so we all get changed and we all go down to the pool. Uh, and within like 20 minutes, my the youngest does not do well in um social settings at all, doesn't do like, doesn't have like any kind of like like big in like big groups or just around new people. And has like a ton of anxiety that comes out in like wild and crazy ways.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so this starts, and I start using every technique that I possibly can to like bring this down, because we are imploding at the pool that is indoors and it is very loud, very, very echoes in there. I don't know if you've ever been in an indoor pool. It is very echoey so loud I still have the other, like the boys are still there, and then Zoe and Slade are also there.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:It's all I think. Oh God, I don't. I don't want to get my like stories mixed up, but I like, okay, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter if another kid was acting up or not, and like, brad and I are like on man to man defense and Katie's like what is happening right now, like on man-to-man defense, and katie's like probably were what is happening right now and it gets, I take, I take this, um, I take the kid, this kid, to like a little like one of those lounge chairs and I'm like trying to hold them while their body is like freaking out and they are it's.
Speaker 1:We're just escalating past the point of return and I look up at Brad and I'm like I have to get them to the room Right and without thinking I mean just out of pure necessity I stand up. I am like fireman carrying this kid. Like it's somewhere between a sack of potatoes, Like they're not over my shoulder but're like they're not act. They're not like willingly being right, right they are. They're fighting it, fighting it and I walk barefoot in my bathing suit to the glass elevator.
Speaker 2:That faces the hotel In this very fancy hotel In this very fancy hotel While this kid is losing their damn minds in my arms.
Speaker 1:It was somewhere between I am kidnapping this child and mom has lost her mind. Nobody knows which one is actually happening, but I know that I am soaking wet from the pool and in a fuchsia bathing suit standing in a glass elevator.
Speaker 1:Well, everybody is watching me and I was like like, oh my god, and I get to my door and I open it and we walk inside and the kid, this kid, goes. Oh my god, all I wanted was for you to just take me back to the room. Oh my god, oh my god, like what just happened to me oh man man, okay, that's my funny story. I was like I like backtracked it in my like you know, when you're sitting, then you're like did that just happen?
Speaker 1:yeah, like did I just walk through a hotel in my bathing suit. You did.
Speaker 2:You did, you really did.
Speaker 1:I did yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh man.
Speaker 1:Okay, what's next? Okay?
Speaker 2:All right. Next we have how do you advocate for your adopted kiddo?
Speaker 1:kiddo. How do I advocate for my adopted kiddo? You know, I think that there's like a variety of different ways to do this. Some moms are really like gung ho and upfront, and first week of school that teacher is getting like a detailed playbook of what their kid needs.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I have such respect and admiration for those people. They're on it, they're ready, they're like listen, like we're going to come in, we're going to, we like I know that you need to know, we're going to start it off the right way we're going to start it off.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm going to, I'm going to give you every support system that you could possibly need and when you have, like a team of people around your, your kid, yeah have like a team of people around your your kid that sees that they need more help for different reasons. Like like my kid and somebody else's kid could do the same thing, but the motivation for my kid is different.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And when you have somebody that really sees it and acknowledges that and and understands like all kids need safety.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But children that have been adopted need safety even more.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 1:Okay. So you have those parents who start like they have a playbook, yeah, and then you have parents that um, kind of don't like. You have the other end of the spectrum where they're just like, they're just normal, and it's hard to see, um, it's hard for them to acknowledge, like that there's any lasting effect from, from adoption or anything like that and there's denial.
Speaker 2:I think it's like you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm trying to be nice, okay, but like you could have like, there are parents across the board that are in denial about their kids needs and so advocating in that sense becomes really difficult because, you have other people advocating for your kid and you're like, nah, they're fine, yeah, just, I think it's just you have to think about for your kid and you're like nah, they're fine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like just. I think it's just. You have to think about it in terms of like stages of grief, right? Like you get a diagnosis for your kid and you're like they're fine, they seem normal to me, this is just how they are.
Speaker 1:It's just that denial stage of it, yeah, and like I mean, I am guilty of that with one of my kids. Yeah, I mean we all are, we all can be. Yeah, One of my kids is like I didn't want to ask any of these hard questions. I want what's going on to be something that is more fixable to me yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I have put off for years a certain amount of testing that would answer some me. Yeah, and so I have put off for years a certain amount of testing that would answer some questions. Yeah, and it was. I had a good friend that kind of very patiently, very lovingly, kept questioning my inability to face this, and there was just one day when she did it and I was like, oh, I'm not answering this question Doesn't change what is. Yeah, it just changes my resources.
Speaker 2:It changes your resources and your ability to advocate yeah, okay.
Speaker 1:So here's what I'll say from that um. Labels are great sometimes yeah um to me, in my experience, labels can be a really good thing. I get all of the cons. I understand it, but labels come with resources.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a tool.
Speaker 1:It's a tool, and so I'm not all willy nilly with a label but, I, do not mind one being applied to my kids.
Speaker 2:It opens doors.
Speaker 1:It opens doors.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:This particular label I didn't want, right. Yeah, it opens doors. Yeah, this particular label I didn't want, right, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, of course not, because you don't want that to be the reality for your kid. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So how do I as a mom and this is just me I let the student, I let my kid take the lead and I let my kid tell me through behaviors in class what level of advocacy they need from me in that year. So when my kids start a new year at school, that's a fresh slate, right. Like you might not, they might not react to that teacher the same way that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's different kids in the class, it's a different environment.
Speaker 1:So for me to go in and be like oh my gosh, like my kid might be throwing chairs across your room.
Speaker 2:Well, my kid might never throw chairs across this room and now you just like scared. And now I just scared the teacher.
Speaker 1:So it's like I kind of view it as let's just sit back and let's wait and see. Now, on the flip side, yeah, there have been times where I get a little advocacy, hair lit on fire, right, and I, and then I go into like powerhouse. Yeah, I come in with whatever I need in order to, in order to convince the people that can support my kids better, right, that there's a need to support my kids better. And I, when I hit that mode and I would say this about any mom any like fierce protector of their kids.
Speaker 1:When that mode is activated, we are a force to be reckoned with, and so I say like, use that mode lightly.
Speaker 2:Not all the time, don't lead with it.
Speaker 1:Not all the time. We don't need to lead with that mode Be as kind as you can for as long as you can and then be as direct, as you need to be to get the job done. Yeah, I like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there we go.
Speaker 1:That's how I advocate. I'm as kind. I take a back seat until.
Speaker 2:I can't.
Speaker 1:And then I respond yeah, so I don't know. It's not always well Last year. Okay, to be fair. Last year there was one time when it just was not being handled well at the school that my kids were going to and I got one too many phone calls about it.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:I had been trying nicely through the proper channels and the assistant dean called me one day and we had a good working relationship and so I was here, were you here that day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was here when I was in the back room.
Speaker 1:Yes, we were all like, like, uh-oh later I found out that that had circulated the school oh yeah, it wasn't going well for that it was not going well for the person on the other end of the phone. I told her exactly what I thought about someone for teachers, which I would say is not a great way to advocate, but it was needed that day because this one particular teacher like absolutely refused to work with me, so but she kept calling me to pick up my kid. Yeah, of course. Okay, anyhow.
Speaker 2:next question before I get myself in trouble here. All right, the last one we're going gonna go into today is how do you road trip with big families?
Speaker 1:how do I road trip with big?
Speaker 2:I love this question, yeah you're, you like to road trip and your family is big now, so my family is large. How do you do?
Speaker 1:it okay. Um, I start small. Okay, that's my. That is the first thing that I do. I think that this could be actually like a much bigger. I think we could do a whole podcast. I have lots of opinions about about road tripping with our family.
Speaker 2:I mean I don't have a big family. I have lots of opinions about road tripping with kids in general.
Speaker 1:Well, you, okay, you and I should do this podcast. We should, okay. Summertime yeah, summertime is coming up. People are going to road trip.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:Um and like. Honestly, you should listen to this, even if you're not like fostering or adopting, because we're tripping with kids road tripping with kids, um, okay, but what and this is what this started with Zoe and Slade when they were little. I start small, okay, so I'm all about practicing when there's no expectation for success. So what that means is like, yeah, like that hotel, yeah, we were there because there's no expectation for success. Katie's going to be there, brad's going to be there. We had a three to five ratio for kids, it was wild.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, as we heard.
Speaker 1:Right, there's more stories from that trip, but we didn't have to be successful. We weren't. We weren't packing up and going to Disney world the next day.
Speaker 2:You weren't spending, we weren't spending thousands of dollars.
Speaker 1:We were doing, we were practicing driving in the car for two and a half hours to Orlando.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Spending the night in a hotel, coming home the next day, that's actually a lot for a kid Like if they're not used to that, that's actually a ton. So to do it on our, on our um timetable instead of a need-based timetable Right Changes the game first of all, Okay, so then, when they can do that, um and I just did this with my kids um, cause we were going, we wanted to go out West this summer, right, so we started last year with hotels.
Speaker 1:yeah, then we did a trip to um, north carolina and back yeah then we did a trip last year to um, new york philly dc and back, so 15 hours in the car and I did that. I did that time intentionally, because that's half of the time to the Tetons, yeah. So it's a lot like you need to know what your goal is, yeah. And then you back off of your goal and say, like what chunks can I do? Right, so start small practice trips, practice trips where there's nothing at stake. There's no big family memory that's being made here. We're just going to this hotel.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And the hotel is four hours away. Okay, that's how that's. That's step one. Yeah, I think you know setting up expectations of. Before all of that, when I knew that we were road tripping, I set up expectations of a road trip in the car.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:So like that level of volume is not allowed, Like I have very specific rules. Also, like it's a sensory thing for me. Yeah, right, so I have rules about cars, but if your kids are young, um know that one person is going to be the driver, and one person is going to be working and your job, if they are young, is to entertain them yeah. It's it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like you have a bag of stuff and we can get into all of that stuff, like in the in the actual podcast. But you have a bag of activities, you have a bag of snacks. We can get into all of the different ways that I organize that Timing. I don't oh, here's a fun thing I don't let kids do any road trip activities for the first hour that we're in the car, cause we drive around Jacksonville for an hour in the car.
Speaker 1:They can just be, you can be, you can be in the car for an hour. That's a standard Right Every week at some point you're in the car for an hour. So, um, and if we're going West, like and hitting 75 into Georgia, then I'm like when hitting 75 into Georgia, then I'm like when we crossed the Georgia state line, uh, sometimes I'll push it if we're growing up 95 and I'll be like when we stopped for gas in Georgia you know the first gas.
Speaker 2:you guys seem fine. We'll push this a little further, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, because that bag of activities is going to get really boring. Yeah, um, we are a tablet family in the car. I don't let tablets not only tablets for our younger four are only on road trips.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So it's like a novelty. Oh, this is the best thing ever. Yes and um. Also, once I allow an activity, I don't remove the activity from them for having an option, so I choose tablet time wisely on a road trip. It is not handed in the driveway Right. It is at the back end of that day's worth of driving. Okay, Pack, I mean I could, we'll get into packing and all that stuff.
Speaker 2:Well, I think, yeah, I think that's a good like starting point.
Speaker 1:My advice is to know where you want to go on a road trip and to back it up and practice small.
Speaker 2:So lots of pre-planning, like the ultimate goal is for us to get to New York this summer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's 15 hours from Florida.
Speaker 2:Then we're going to do some small trips. Yeah, just one night, yep, somewhere close. Stay in a hotel Okay, yeah, yeah, because I need you to know what close Stay in a hotel.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, yeah, because I need you to know what to do when we get to that hotel. Yeah, we're going to have been driving for 10 hours or whatever. Right, I need you to know how to stand in that lobby correctly.
Speaker 1:I need you to know how to walk to an elevator, like all of these things that, like you, actually do have to teach kids, yeah, all of these things that, like you, actually do have to teach kids, yeah, um, I need you, I need you guys to know immediately what the bed setup is going to be in the room right like our four littles all fit still mostly, um, depending sometimes. Okay, back that up. Uh, our four littles can sleep on the pull-out couch in a suite. Right, if I?
Speaker 1:they go horizontal on the bed right they're so tiny, um, sometimes that's not great. And then the younger two will sleep like we'll make, like little pallets right ever um. Zoe will sleep with me, slade will sleep with brad right, because they don't like sleeping yeah okay, so like, yeah, but know your sleeping arrangement, practice your sleeping arrangement, right? Oh, okay, god, I'm telling you I could talk about this forever Okay.
Speaker 1:My other tip and this is like just a freebie it doesn't. I don't care how big your family size is, I don't nothing. I care nothing about your family size when I tell you this have pack a hotel bag. Yep A separate one Separate one, and in the back of your car that hotel bag is so easily accessible. You're going to park your car, you're going to open the trunk, you're going to grab your hotel bag. That hotel bag has every single thing that your family needs for that night.
Speaker 2:Yep, we just did this. When we went skiing, we had a hotel bag, because that first night we stayed in a hotel halfway up and that's it. One backpack had everything in it we needed.
Speaker 1:Yes, it has all of your toiletries. It has pajamas. If your family is asleep.
Speaker 2:Clothes for the next day.
Speaker 1:And clothes for the next day. It's all that it needs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great one.
Speaker 1:It is a game changer, yes, game changer. And then, um, pick a hotel with a good pool. That is, if you're traveling with kids, yeah, pick a hotel with a good pool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love it tory.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a yeah, that's a good one, mandatory. You're gonna get those kids to the hotel room and if there's any time in that day, I will take my kids to the pool at nine o'clock at night that's where we're gonna get our energy out. Yeah, I'm in the pool, okay and if they can swim before we leave the next day, I have been known to allow that as well. Just go get that energy out, yeah smart we move our bodies on like car anyhow ihow.
Speaker 2:I could really talk about this, we will, we'll do it, we'll go into laps, into gas stations, I mean. I think this is a. I think a lot of people are like how do I do this without regretting? All the money I spent in that Well you still do have your regrets but there's regret, but I do think there's ways to like prepare yourself for that the fall. But there's regret.
Speaker 1:But I do think there's ways to like, prepare yourself for that. The fall doesn't have to be so hard. That's correct, and like you can just know, like, yeah, this is a trip for me, this is a vacation for them. Yes, this is a trip for me.
Speaker 2:We listened to some, like there was some writing someone who did about like a trip versus a vacation and it, it is hysterical.
Speaker 1:Kelly Rippon said that Are you taking kids?
Speaker 2:This is a trip. This is a trip. It's most definitely a trip.
Speaker 1:This is a trip. You're just parenting in a different location. It's so funny, it's so true, it's so true. Okay, and knowing that, and knowing that, like, at the end of the day, this is so important because you're building your kids memory banks.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And kids remember these trips differently. They do yeah, there's and and you're creating like a family code, a family DNA of like oh, remember that night.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Remember when we were at I mean mean we were in moab four years ago. Zoe and slade still talk about that yeah they like zoe was six the first time she went to um washington dc. And like two years later she's like do you remember that burger that we ate?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think, like I'm like I know, I remember that thing. We paid a lot of money to go, do you? You remember that burger that we ate? Yeah, I think, like I'm like I know, I remember that thing. We paid a lot of money to go, do you? You remember the like right, the pool that was free back at the hotel that we stayed at?
Speaker 1:yeah, but they do, they do, but they do. I mean, we stayed this summer. We splurged one night on this really awesome hotel that had a really awesome pool, because the kids needed it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:They needed it that day, and so it was great. Okay, any other questions, or was that it?
Speaker 2:Nope, I think that's it for today. So I guess I liked this, I did too, and I guess anyone that's listening. If you like, you're like. Oh, I have questions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, send them. I'll answer them. Yeah, they yeah Send them.
Speaker 2:I'll answer them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they might not be the right answer, but it's going to be an honest one.
Speaker 2:Is there a right answer? I don't know. Yeah, okay, yeah, so send us any more questions you have and we'll record these occasionally. How do they?
Speaker 1:send it to us On our. Oh, we have an Instagram account.
Speaker 2:Now we do have an Instagram account, hey, hey hey, hey, hey, hey, behindthecurtain underscore pod. That's right.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:So you can find us on there and send us messages. We'll probably post question boxes on there occasionally, so follow us there and we'll try to answer them.
Speaker 1:If you get a question, we want to answer it.
Speaker 2:We do or try.
Speaker 1:Or try.
Speaker 2:Or find somebody who can, okay, okay.
Speaker 1:Bye. Guys, Bye.