Recovery Diaries In Depth
Welcome to Recovery Diaries In Depth; a mental health podcast that creates a warm, empathic, and engaging space for discussions around mental health, empowerment, and change. Executive Director and podcast host Gabe Nathan brings a unique combination of lived experience with mental health challenges, years of independent mental health and suicide awareness advocacy, and an understanding of the inpatient psychiatric millieu as a former staff member at a psychiatric hospital. This extensive background helps him navigate complex and nuanced conversations with a diverse array of guests, all of whom are vulnerable and engaged; doing their utmost to eradicate mental health stigma through advocacy, storytelling, and open conversation.
Guests who have previously contributed a mental health personal essay read their essays aloud during the podcast and then chat with Gabe about what has changed in their lives since their essays were published on the site. By engaging in deep discussions with people living with mental health challenges like bipolar disorder, trauma histories, addiction issues, schizophrenia, anxiety, depression, obsessive compulsive or eating disorders, Recovery Diaries in Depth further carries out Recovery Diaries' mission to #buststigma by showing people that they are not alone, instead of just telling them. This mental health podcast features guests from all over the world and, while their own personal experiences are unique, the human experience is what unites, inspires, and connects. Subscribe, like, share, and enjoy!
Recovery Diaries In Depth is supported in full by the van Ameringen Foundation.
Recovery Diaries In Depth
Burnout, Bravery, Breakthrough: A Conversation with Artist-Scholar Shumaila Hemani | RDID; 122
From her earliest memories growing up in Pakistan—where her dream of pursuing music seemed impossible for a woman—to the hallowed halls of Harvard University where overwhelming expectations led to debilitating burnout, Dr. Shumaila Hemani reveals the institutional and cultural pressures that shaped her experience. The expectations of perfection, unrelenting pressure, and cold academic warnings left her feeling bereft of direction, support, and purpose.
The turning point came through an unexpected source: a piece of 16th-century Khayal tradition music discovered in Harvard's library. This musical sanctuary became her refuge, reconnecting her with spirituality when rational academic structures had failed her. "The line 'Aapne Allah Ko Pehchan' (recognize the Allah within you) resonated so deeply with me," she explains, "pushing me to make this important shift from the world of reason that had betrayed me to seek refuge in the world of faith."
After leaving Harvard—a decision carrying its own weight of shame—Dr. Hemani rebuilt her identity through studying with an ustad (master musician) and emerging as a Sufi performer and ethnomusicologist. This transformation led to founding the Deep Listening Path Initiative, which now helps others overcome burnout through music, meditation, and deep listening practices.
Throughout our conversation, Dr. Hemani reads her powerful Recovery Diaries essay "Music is Sanctuary: Navigating Burnout in the Ivy League with the Power of Deep Listening," and shares how publishing this piece inspired her forthcoming memoir "Writing in the Wound." Her story offers profound insights into resilience, cultural identity, and finding purpose through pain.
Listen now to discover how sometimes our most difficult experiences become the foundation for our greatest contributions—when we learn to listen deeply to what they have to teach us.
Conversations like the ones on this podcast can sometimes be hard, but they’re always necessary. If you or someone you know is struggling, please consider visiting wannatalkaboutit.com.
Hello, this is Recovery Diaries In-Depth. I'm your host, gabe Nathan. Thanks so much for joining us. We're very happy to have you here. We are so happy to have on Recovery Diaries In-Depth Shumaila Hemani, phd. She is a multi-award winning artist in residence and creative climate advocate, and she leads the Deep Listening Path Initiative, which aids advocates in overcoming burnout.
Gabe Nathan:Each week, we'll bring you a Recovery Diaries contributor folks who have shared their mental health journey with us through essay or video format. We want to see where they are in their mental health journey since initially being published on our website. Our goal is to continue supporting our diverse community by having conversations here on our podcast to follow up and see what has shifted, what has changed and what new things have emerged. We're so happy to have you along for this journey. We want to remind you to follow our show for new and back episodes at recoverydiariesorg. There, like the podcast, you'll find stories of mental health, empowerment and change. You can also sign up for our mailing list there so you never miss a of mental health, empowerment and change. You can also sign up for our mailing list there so you never miss a new podcast episode, essay or film, and you can find this podcast pretty much anywhere. You get your podcasts. We appreciate your comments and feedback about our show. It helps us improve, make changes and grow and, of course, make sure to like, share and subscribe.
Gabe Nathan:Shumaila Hemani. Welcome to Recovery Diaries In Depth. It is so lovely to have you here. Thank you for being here with us.
Shumaila Hemani:Such a pleasure to be here. Gabe, Thank you for having me.
Gabe Nathan:You are so welcome and I'm curious. Everybody has these kind of like. They call it the elevator pitch for whatever it is for. If it's their job, you know they have like the 30 seconds to describe what they do. But I think people also have like elevator pitches for who they are. What's your elevator pitch? Who are you?
Shumaila Hemani:I'm an artist, scholar and a trauma-informed coach. I work on issues related with mental health, climate, justice and cultural heritage to bring forth more justice in the world.
Gabe Nathan:That is an elevator pitch if I've ever heard one, and such a beautifully shaped and hopeful and helpful elevator pitch. So I just want to thank you for the work that you do with people. It's pretty extraordinary. You wrote an essay for us. Do you remember when it was Do?
Shumaila Hemani:you remember when it was? It was published last year, I think. We started the poll process in February last year and then the essay got published in June or July.
Gabe Nathan:Yeah, so it's been about a year since the essay was published and the piece it's about a lot of different things. It is about music. It is about a lot of different things. It is about music. It is about burnout. It is about stress, academia, faith, resilience. Can you talk a little bit about who you were when you were originally composing that piece, what was going on in your life, and can you talk about the decision that you made to send it to us?
Shumaila Hemani:I had recently founded my social enterprise, the Deep Listening Path, in January of 2024. And I was giving and sharing my course with potential people out there who had experienced burnout, and I was sharing my Harvard story in my masterclass in a few sentences, and that started spurring something inside me because there was something. There was so much more that was left unsaid. That masterclass was about the burnout, not the Harvard experience, but I was just bringing in the Harvard experience and something inside me was wanting to share this part of me that I had kept hidden for long, because I used to feel ashamed of my burnout, because I did not know back then, back in 2010 and throughout my graduate years, that this is what was going on in my body. I just felt like my body is betraying me and I had to cancel appointments and just say I'm not well, I'm not well, and people just used to wonder what that means. Even you know why does she always say she's not well? But I didn't know how.
Shumaila Hemani:I didn't have the vocabulary to describe what I was going through and once through the deep listening path, I found that I received that awareness that I was experiencing burnout. All this time, I felt compelled to share my story, share what I've been through, and the Harvard experience was particularly, very important because that's when a lot in my body had accumulated and, you know, it kind of impacted the rest of my graduate journey over the years, because the burnout kept rising, because there was a lot of buildup from the Harvard experience and its aftermath. So I really felt compelled to share my story and share this part of me that I haven't shared with the world, that I've been experiencing burnout for over 10 years, and that's why I reached out to OC Diaries.
Gabe Nathan:When you were in the midst of what was going on. You call it the Harvard experience, and, of course, we're going to talk more about that, and certainly talk about it when you're going to be reading your very, very fine essay on the subject. But when you were experiencing that, that in the midst of that, did you tell yourself a story? Um, I I think you know, as someone who lives with anxiety and depression myself and and has a lot of like self image issues and selfworth issues, I tell myself a lot of stories about who I am and why I'm a fuck-up and an idiot and incompetent and all of that kind of thing. And I'm wondering if you were telling yourself stories about well, you just can't hack it. Other people can get through this, can get through this. Uh, it's, you're the problem. Um, you know you're, you're weak, you're insufficient, you're this, that or the other thing when you were really struggling there. Um, I'm just curious about what was happening in your internal monologue in in 2010, 2011.
Shumaila Hemani:2011. Yeah, I think I will have to go back to that time in 2010 to 2011. So during that time, a lot was going on and one of the things that was that that is a story that I was not only telling myself, but I was also noticing, and that is a story that I haven't brought up fully in the article but I'm bringing it up in my upcoming memoir, writing in the Wound, because Harvard experience and the burnout that I experienced there was part of a larger trauma that was building up and has built up over the years. And one of the other things that was going on was I was noticing a kind of an academic jealousy from the Harvard professors towards the professor I had worked with during my master's, professor Regula Buk, very who has, who has maintained a very, very high, you know, status in the field of South Asian ethnomusicology. So I was, I was seen as her student. Even the librarian, who is a very prominent author, virginia Danielson, who's written a really amazing book on Uncle Thum, used to see me and say, oh, there, she is regular student, you know. So regular student was my identity marker and that did used to make others a bit nervous and I think there was a pressure on me to. There was more pressure on me than on the other students just for that reason, because there were some academic jealousies going on as well.
Shumaila Hemani:And I noticed the outcome of it because, despite experiencing the burnout, I did leave Harvard in good standing and I was eligible for a terminal master's degree. But I did not receive that and, in fact, what happened was my PhD project was plagiarized, my methodologies, everything was appropriated, and it's been 10 years I've worked with a master scholar and none of my work has gotten published. So this is something that has panned out over the course of 15 years, right, but when I was at Harvard in 2010, I was picking up on that. I was intuitively picking up that something was off here.
Shumaila Hemani:There is something more that's going on. It's just not Harvard structurally and the work that they expect me to do and all. There was something more beneath the surface that was going on and I had picked up on it. I was talking about it with my close friends, but then, of course, I was a graduate student then and it did sound like I was making excuses, right, because when graduate students pick up on so much information and then say that they are working against me or something like that. It just sounds so unconvincing, right so? But I was picking up on a lot of things that were happening beneath the surface that led to my burnout.
Gabe Nathan:And what kind of support did you receive then and after the fact? I mean, obviously you had your close friends, but I'm curious about other people who had similar experiences, not just at Harvard, but perhaps at other academic institutions anywhere in the world.
Shumaila Hemani:Yeah, thanks, Thank you for bringing up those questions, because it really kind of brings forward some of the trauma that I'm experiencing that whenever I bring forward my story, I encounter silence from my community.
Shumaila Hemani:I literally I encounter silence. Nobody speaks up, nobody supports, nobody reaches out, and I know that there is a whisper network behind my back, something that I brought forward in my recent essay Listening to the Wound because I've been noticing this whisper networks going on for years and so, when this article came out, the biggest thing that I was experiencing was on the OC diaries and their socials. I didn't experience much on my socials. Nobody reached out to me, everybody was silent, and that also speaks to the fact that when I was going through the Harvard experience, some of my earlier friends who had doing being passive, aggressive towards me. I think what was most helpful during the period that I was in was in the spring of 2010,.
Shumaila Hemani:Some people I was living in the Conant Hall dormitory dormitory and I mentioned that I'll be leaving because of what was going on to some of my flatmates you know, roommates or whatever the floor mates and they said that, no, this is not right, you were not well and you shouldn't be leaving because of that. And they said OK, you know, we're going to fight for you. So the floor mates came together and one of my floor mates who was from China, he said I will come with you to the dean's office and we'll talk and if this doesn't work, all of us will come go together. So I went with him. His name is Lee. I went with Lee to the dean's office and he mentioned he kind of advocated for me. He said that you know we live on the same floor, she and he mentioned, he kind of advocated for me. He said that you know we live on the same floor. She was not well. I could see she was not well and she has books all over her room Like she's so studious, she's so hardworking you can't do this to her. So I think that that did help.
Shumaila Hemani:And the dean of graduate studies, garth McEwen. He suggested a number of things. He said I will advocate for you, but you also have to go through these. You know things that you have to speak with a graduate counselor to learn, to go deeper into your situation, to see how you can make amends. We also recommend you go to a psychological counselor. So I was taking psychological counseling in addition to graduate counseling and during the summer of 2010. And so that was a support that I received at Harvard and there was a time when I even went to ombudsman. But there's not much that you, that those resources could do in terms of I mean, there's only so much that they can help you and I have to say they were very, very, very helpful, but that couldn't prevent me from leaving Harvard after December 2011.
Gabe Nathan:11th. That's wonderful that you're able to receive that support from your floor mates. That's very special and I'm very glad that that was there for you. I mean, it wasn't enough, but it was something. I'm curious. Let's go back. I want to go back to your early life, because music has been so vitally important in your entire existence. I just want to know how that got started.
Shumaila Hemani:Yeah, I think for me, I sort of originate my music journey in this way, to the time when I was 15 or 16 and I was looking at undergraduate programs that I would like or things I would like to major in and it just came to me that I want to pursue music because it's had such a special place in my life. At that time I wasn't trained in western art music, I didn't play a musical instrument, so that was like a bizarre kind of a dream that I had when I was growing up in Karachi in Pakistan, and I voiced that dream to my mother and my grandma and they're like shh, no music no way I can imagine.
Gabe Nathan:Yeah.
Shumaila Hemani:Because music is kind of associated with showbiz and performing arts. Historically, there are professional communities associated with it, so there is a bit of a stigma there as well. So my grandma was like no, no, no, like that. But somehow all throughout my undergraduate I felt that there was a calling. I felt called to do that. It sounds very idealistic when I say but my heart said that this is my path, and it was hard to believe because my 3D reality said otherwise and I had no idea how this could ever, ever, ever happen that I would land in a music department. It just seemed out of reach. But I went through.
Shumaila Hemani:During the last parts of my undergraduate I came across the program in Islamic Studies and Humanities. I applied for that and they were very encouraging for me to pursue ethnomusicology and they funded my work and they supported me. So during my time in London I was taking courses in voice and in keyboard skills and all, and so that was all a prep that helped me to get into a music program at the University of Alberta where I did my master's, and from there I applied to Harvard and Chicago and UCLA. So 2010 was a great time. I received admissions in all the universities and in fact Chicago and Harvard were fighting to have me. So it was like a very, you know, encouraging time for me that a bizarre dream could lead me at this point, you know.
Gabe Nathan:It's fascinating because, you know, I had this thought in my head that you know, I was going to be asking you about the beginning of your love for music and I was just imagining like, oh well, I first, you know, touched the harmonium at age four and I just I knew it's so fascinating that it's really begins at 15 or 16. I had thought, okay, there would be this youthful history and this progression leading up to this, but it's quite a journey and I just you think of 15 or 16 as really almost like a late bloomer, but you seemed to really be on fire at that age and that it was just sending you on this path. And I wonder, when you look back now and you think about Chicago and Harvard kind of fighting for you, do you think about what would have happened if you had let Chicago win and you had gone there? Do you play that game in your mind?
Shumaila Hemani:Yeah, I played that game all throughout the time after I left Harvard, because I did apply to Chicago again and University of Alberta. So these were two schools that I applied to again in 2012. And I didn't get into Chicago the second time. And I still remember that point when I received my rejection letter, because at that time I was taking lessons from my ustad and he noticed that I was like my energy had gone totally low and I was very, very sad. And so this game, I mean I was playing that even till my second or third year of graduate study at the University of Alberta. I was I would blame myself, I should have gone to Chicago. I should have gone to Chicago. So I had that quite a bit till second or third year.
Shumaila Hemani:But I think there was just you know when that game gets played, when life is going smooth, I think, because what happened next was so dramatic. There was just so many dramatic changes happening in the department and things happening that was throwing me off course that whatever I had, I had to learn to protect. You know, I still was in a PhD program at the University of Alberta. I was studying with Regula. That was amazing, right? So I think life has a way of showing you to be more grateful towards what you have, and over the years.
Shumaila Hemani:you know, when I learned that regular student Kaylee left Chicago to go to another university, then that was my moment where I was like, oh my gosh, if I was at Chicago and I wouldn't have finished my PhD by that time and he would have left, it would have been such a nightmare, you know, finishing my PhD in a department when I lose my supervisory support. And then there were other things that happened where I realized that the people who were showing me a lot of support then were only showing me support because I had gotten into Harvard and they didn't want me to go there. So I was picking up on that as well, that Chicago was showing me so much, that as well, that Chicago was showing me so much. You know, they I mean they had given me a package, but it was not a full package. I couldn't have come there in the first place. But then they had special meetings for me and they got me a competitive package in, you know, in comparison with Harvard. But I really felt like they were doing it because I had gotten into Harvard, not because they valued me.
Shumaila Hemani:So that was something I picked on, even in 2010. And I think I picked on even later. I, just I. I, I had my reasons for not choosing Chicago. Sure and um, although I, the game continued in my mind. I also think I made the right decision then by going to Harvard and then by choosing the University of Alberta.
Gabe Nathan:And the game can go on forever and drive you crazy, and so I think it's so important, like you said, to not wallow in what's past but be grateful for what's present and all of the doors and windows that opened because of past decisions.
Gabe Nathan:It's a really healthy outlook. Can you talk a little bit about burnout in the context of academia and the feelings that go along with it and the repercussions because we hear about it, I think, the most in terms of first responder professions, in terms of nurses or law enforcement or any of those fields, and I think and you alluded to this earlier too that there really is a stigma that if you're experiencing this, it's because you can't cut it. And that's a paramedic instructor who talks about that really archaic belief, even in emergency medicine, that if you're struggling it's because this isn't for you. And what he says is we need to change that culture and the attitudes of leadership that you know if someone's struggling, it's most likely for institutional reasons and there need to be changes addressed there to help people, not just cut them out and get rid of them. So I'd love to hear you speak to that a little bit.
Shumaila Hemani:I think I would like to speak about burnout from the perspective of an international student. So, an international student, when they have to, you know, when they come in another culture, it's not only institutional culture, it's culture of the country, city that they are in and they're away from home there's a lot of pressure. There's a lot of pressure to perform and because the, I would say, epistemologically, the knowledge creation and you know it kind of differs from the context that they come from, there is a pressure to also conform to, you know, the trends or the hidden rules of the space that they are in. In my case, in addition to all of that which international students experience in international universities. I was coming from a non-Western art music background and I was thrown into a culture of music departments that predominantly are Western art music focused. So ethnomusicologists have sort of resisted that culture by bringing in other world music traditions and you know, giving space for that. But within the world music traditions I wasn't coming from.
Shumaila Hemani:At that time when I was at Harvard, I didn't have years of training in Hindustani art music. I didn't have that access. So I didn't have the access to the world music traditions. Either I was coming from a very folk, folklorized or, you know, local music that I had learned from religious music from my own community and I had a lot of understanding and, you know, passion to work to do this. And this is something that one of the professor who advocated for my admissions he picked up on that we had met at Society for Ethnomusicology meeting and he saw the how driven I was because this was my calling, this was my path. So I was even more driven to work harder because there was this thing in me that I'm not enough. You know, I don't have this, I don't have that, I don't have that, but I have critical acumen and I need to merge this with this and this and this and I need to keep working. So there was that institutional pressure and cultural pressure. But in addition to all of that, that was that internal pressure as well that I wanted to succeed because this was my path and I could not do with less. You know, I had to be more all the time.
Shumaila Hemani:Even when I was writing my master's thesis I had done some really original and amazing work. But there was this pressure to conform in the sense that my mentor, regula, she said you've done amazing work. But then there were peers like my male friends in Pakistan or my male friends in the other in the ethnomusicology program, other in the ethnomusicology program, and as a woman, they would trust my authority for what to say anything to represent South Asian culture. So I was pleasing too many people as well. I was not just happy with my supervisor saying you've done amazing work. I had to please so and so, so and so, so and so, and I know that I wasn't able to please them at the end of the day, but I worked so hard that I knew where I was at.
Shumaila Hemani:I had really crossed a threshold when I defended my master's thesis and so that authority, that confidence, I mean I built it deep down. So you know, and that also kind of led to my burnout because I was pushing myself in ways that nobody else in my program was doing it. I mean I did four to five months of fieldwork when we were only supposed to do one month of fieldwork during our master's and that did impact my health when I came back to Edmonton. So that's where it all started, because there was this internal, there was that sense of not being enough, but there was also that sense of insatiability. You know, I was so driven I wanted to do everything, and really well. So I think they both contributed.
Gabe Nathan:We have received and published multiple essays by individuals from India, from Pakistan, from other countries in Asia that have talked about academic pressures and pressures from parents from very early on pressures about grades, pressures about performance, pressures about achievement and about how the worth or value of the parents or the family is really dependent upon how well the children do in life and by how well they do, and that can be anything from academic performance to jobs and things like that. Did you feel any of that growing up? Was that part of your experience?
Shumaila Hemani:I think growing up I actually felt that most of the attention was towards my brothers, that my family's worth really came from how my brother was doing. So he was the he was. When I was a kid I was, I was very laid back as a student. I was a, you know, adventurous kind of a kid. I didn't really care about studying. I had all these bizarre dreams I'm going to travel the world and all of that.
Shumaila Hemani:And then I noticed that my brother was getting so much praise and attention and so much love because he was standing first in the class. Like there was so much happiness my parents felt when he he, you know he stood first, like there were garlands that were brought for him and I didn't receive any standing at that point and that I think it was in grade two that I told myself I have to work hard. I can't let me be just this nobody who doesn't get you know any, who doesn't get any ranks in class. So it was from grade two that I started really working hard on myself and really focusing on my studies. But what I have noticed over the years is that even when I have stood first in class, I've almost consistently stood second.
Shumaila Hemani:But even when I've stood first in class, there hasn't been much happiness or joy or a sense of achievement that my parents have felt from my side. It just doesn't matter for them whether I've come first or second or not come. You know, that hasn't really helped and it used to bother me. It sometimes still bothers me. But I think it also gave me a kind of freedom that most South Asian students do not get otherwise, that most South Asian students do not get otherwise. But I find also that pattern kind of is repeating within my network or community now that whatever I do I publish this essay or I publish something else or I give a talk or give a keynote just nothing matters. Nothing matters. And it's a childhood pattern that's just coming in my adult life. Someday I'll write about it.
Gabe Nathan:And in the end, really, I mean, this may sound naive, but it just has to matter to you really, and kind of fuck everybody else If they don't care or it doesn't resonate with them or it doesn't feel like a kind of salient achievement, that's kind of their problem Really, it really does just have to matter to you. You can hang your own garlands for yourself. So and I, I, I think this is a it's a nice way to move into your essay, because you mentioned earlier that you know when this was published it was it was really silence for you in terms of the response of writers and contributors and readers here, because I think that this is something that's not talked about enough, and one of the things I love about what we do is we try to gain perspectives from people all over the world and talk about things that aren't talked about enough. So at this point, I would love to hear you read your essay in your own voice. It's called Music is Sanctuary Navigating Burnout in the Ivy League with the Power of Deep Listening Whenever you're ready.
Shumaila Hemani:Music was my refuge. I could crawl into the space between the notes and crawl my back to loneliness, writes Maya Angelou. Music has been a powerful refuge and a calling for me since my teenage years. Initially, I resisted its pull, aware that women within my culture were not typically encouraged to pursue it as a career. Despite the barriers and uncertainties that loomed before me, I couldn't ignore the undeniable truth this was what I wanted to do. The path ahead was unclear. Little did I anticipate that it would eventually lead me to the University of Alberta and then to Harvard University, to Harvard University.
Shumaila Hemani:Harvard University's motto Veritas, meaning truth embodies the pursuit of knowledge and integrity. Yet during my PhD studentship at Harvard, from fall 2010 to December 2011, layers of deception veiled the truth and I felt like I had lost my way. Beneath the surface lies a deeper truth Harvard mistreats individuals who challenge the status quo. My experience prompts me to expose the institution's efforts to manipulate and erase dissenting voices. Another motto nothing is impossible echoed through the halls of Harvard, a mantra meant to inspire resilience and determination. Yet as I embarked on my PhD journey in music, those words felt more like a dismissive refrain whenever I dared to question the overwhelming workload in my first semester Studying at the University of Alberta between 2008 to 2010 was a life-transforming experience because, under the mentorship of the distinguished South Asian Studies scholar, professor Regula Bukhad Kureishi, I embarked on a journey to study the history of state patronage of music and dance in Pakistan, culminating in my master's thesis and, eventually, my doctoral dissertation on Sufi poetry and sounds in Sindh. During this time, I found myself reconnecting with the musical cultures of Pakistan. So when I started at Harvard, I was excited to begin what I thought would be a similarly motivating journey.
Shumaila Hemani:Although my studies at Harvard only lasted a year and a half, they initially opened vistas into new cultures. My arrival in Cambridge introduced me to a vibrant community of scholars from diverse disciplines, each boasting remarkable achievements and intellectual prowess. Conversations in the graduate dormitory reverberated with tales of astronauts, fiction writers, zoologists and artists, igniting a mixture of awe and intimidation within me. During my first year, this excited the explorer in me. Every conversation opened new doors. I experienced many new friendships, but there were times I also felt emotionally isolated. In those days at Harvard, there was a great emphasis played on new students not feeling like imposters in the Ivy League community. With an emphasis on equity, harvard did attract students from diverse backgrounds and despite the impressive atmosphere, I never felt like an imposter. My supportive classmates helped provide a solid foundation to navigate the intellectually stimulating yet sometimes overwhelming environment. In my courses, my ideas and critical thoughts stood out and I felt appreciated for participating in class discussions.
Shumaila Hemani:But as my graduate studies continued, my academic plate overflowed with a staggering workload counteracting the invigorating collaborative atmosphere I felt at the start of my studies. Balancing multiple graduate music courses and a language class proved daunting enough. The true test of endurance, however, came with the unexpected addition of an undergraduate music theory course. Even more, I was tasked with learning a musical instrument from a culture new to me, that was the Persian culture, fieldwork in another culture, which was Ethiopian culture, as well as independent study of cultural and religious traditions from outside my own background. It began to feel overwhelming. While I embraced learning these things as great cultural exposure, the expectation to immediately excel felt impossible. After classes finished, each day I retreated to the practice rooms to study cadences and work on homework.
Shumaila Hemani:In my first semester, downtime was non-existent. It was a continuous cycle of academic and personal demands, making it difficult for me to absorb the experience of being at Harvard. At first there was a flicker of doubt regarding whether this demanding workload was indeed normal within the academic context. I couldn't shake off the nagging feeling that perhaps I was pushing myself too hard. There were moments of quiet apprehension where I questioned the feasibility of maintaining such a rigorous base while excelling academically. Amidst the socially vibrant ambience of Harvard's Dudley Lounge and coffee gatherings with peers, my formidable course load became a topic of incredulityley Lounge and coffee gatherings with peers. My formidable course load became a topic of incredulity. Even classmates and professors whom I saw as the brightest mind on campus expressed astonishment, questioning the sustainability of such a workload and its impact on academic performance. Isn't it affecting your grades? This question served as a constant reminder of the delicate balance between academic ambition and personal well-being. Initially, I reacted with a blend of surprise and introspection. I found myself oscillating between a sense of normalization and a creeping feeling of anxiety.
Shumaila Hemani:There were graduate students at Harvard who had opted to take seven courses in a semester by their own choice, but then they were receiving extra time to complete their assignments and turn in their final papers. I did not receive any accommodations, even upon request. While I voiced my concerns about the unrealistic demands to my mentors, the prevailing sentiment echoed the institutional's ethos Nothing is impossible. At Harvard, the unrealistic workload and expectations did impact my performance and grades, and, while I was an A-plus student at the University of Alberta, at Harvard, I received grades that I felt did not adequately evaluate my caliber.
Shumaila Hemani:At the end of the semester, while I was exhausted and trying to recuperate, I received an unexpected letter which was unlike what I have ever encountered before. It was a disciplinary warning and an ultimatum to improve performance or leave. It felt more like a gun on my head and seriously impacted my mental health and wellness. From there onwards, I was not only working with a heavy workload, but also with difficult emotions around the threat of being removed. This zapped my energy significantly. It is incredibly traumatic to grapple with the letters of warning that Harvard sends to students. These missives, often laden with implications of underperformance or poor fit within the institution, can have profound psychological and emotional effects. They serve as false constructions of one's perceived shortcomings, fueling self-d and amplifying the already existing pressure to succeed in an environment renowned for its academic rigor. Overcoming the weight of these warnings requires resilience, support and a steadfast belief in one's abilities amidst adversity. I spent the Christmas break of 2010 grappling with the consequences of the latter and found the courage inside me to begin another semester at Harvard In the spring of 2011,.
Shumaila Hemani:After I'd returned to school, I found myself experiencing extreme exhaustion. Prior to this, I had never encountered burnout. My mind, once ablaze with scholarly fervor, now lay dormant, unable to muster the strength for even the simplest of tasks. The demands of my schedule were relentless Waking up at 7 am to attend Persian language classes at 8.30, followed by a music theory class, a graduate seminar and instrument class. In addition, there were graduate students talks and guest lectures to attend in the department. I attempted to adjust my schedule to prioritize rest, but any social event I missed resulted in repercussions. This was often interpreted as a lack of interest in the program, further complicating my efforts to prioritize self-care. My efforts to prioritize self-care when I sought help from a doctor at the medical clinic. Their positivistic standpoint towards well-being minimized my experience, leaving me feeling invalidated. Doubt gnawed at my resolve. Was I fabricating illness to evade the rigors of academia? Burnout experts Emily and Amelia Nagoski astutely liken burnout to a wound, emphasizing the lengthy recovery process akin to healing from a broken bone or severe infection.
Shumaila Hemani:Back in 2010, harvard selectively avoided the issue of student burnout and considered those who could not handle the workload as unfit for the institution. In April 2011, I faced a pivotal moment at Harvard. A second letter arrived signaling my departure from the institution. It was a tumultuous crossroads. I still remember that it was around my birthday and I found myself grappling with what my future would become, contemplating my future. Doubts crept in, urging me to abandon my musical aspirations. Standing before a full-length mirror, I whispered words of encouragement Shmila, you're brilliant, you can achieve anything. With those words, I made the difficult choice to set aside my pursuit of music and to leave Harvard. But little did I know that I was revving up for a spiritual awakening. As I strolled through the historic Harvard yard that day, heading towards Dudley Lounge to meet my friends towards the end of my last semester, a sudden stirring within me ignited. I realized the pressure of Harvard was not the only avenue to pursue my dream of Harvard was not the only avenue to pursue my dream. My heart whispered vows. I will not relent in my pursuit of my calling. I will stand firm in my resolve. I will embark on the journey to resume my PhD somewhere else and, should the opportunity arise, I will seek mentorship in the realm of Hindustani art music to refine my musical craft.
Shumaila Hemani:I had arrived at Harvard University identifying as an atheist, convinced of the absence of divine intervention in the affairs of humanity. Little did I anticipate that, within the ivy-covered walls of this esteemed institution, I would encounter betrayal and disillusionment that would shatter my preconceived notions and lead me on a profound journey of rediscovering faith. In the depths of despair, I found myself adrift in a sea of uncertainty, grappling with existential questions that eluded easy answers. It was amidst this existential crisis that I stumbled upon a piece of music from the 16th century Khayal tradition at Harvard's Lamont Library. The composition was a contemporary piece sung by Ustad Fateh Ali Khan from Pakistan's Patiala Gharana and Indraag Biragi Bheru. When I played this piece, I found that an inner sanctuary enveloped me, shielding me from the vulnerabilities that surrounded me. Amid the chaos, this musical piece became a refuge, a source of strength and clarity amidst the uncertainties of life. The line Aapne Allah Ko Pehchan recognize the Allah within you from this piece resonated so deeply with me, even as I write about it, sending goosebumps down my body. This spiritual message touched something really profound within me, pushing me to make this important shift from the world of reason that had betrayed me to seek a refuge in the world of faith.
Shumaila Hemani:As I pushed through my last semester, sympathy from professors remained elusive. In the face of adversity, my old advisor, regula, stood by my side, defending my reputation. I felt blessed to have a distinguished mentor by my side who also believed in my high capabilities and was willing to see me through as a scholar finding her place in the academic world. Buoyed by Regula's unwavering belief, I pressed onward, navigating the treacherous waters of academia with courage and resilience. I concluded the fall of 2011 semester with original research in Chinese opera during the Enlightenment period for a Harvard exhibition, a contribution I felt was overlooked yet significant.
Shumaila Hemani:Leaving Harvard carried its own weight of shame. Without language to articulate my burnout, I endured the judgment of former colleagues who saw my departure from an Ivy League institution as a failure To shelter myself from negativity. I made the difficult decision to cut these individuals out of my life entirely. Yet, amidst this turmoil, the university unveiled a new path my dream of learning music from an ustad, a master musician and teacher of the esteemed Gwalior Khurana, one of South Asia's oldest musical lineages. Guided by this ustad and supported by mentors at the University of Alberta, I discovered a new career identity, one that I've nurtured through graduate and postgraduate years in Canada.
Shumaila Hemani:I became a Sufi performer and reached new heights as I gave my inaugural performance at the Canadian Centre of Ethnomusicology in 2012. At the University of Alberta, I received a scholarship to study music with Yustad, and I went to Pakistan again in 2014 to study with Yustad, and I went to Pakistan again in 2014 to study. Three years later, I had the honor of participating in three performances at the Banff Arts Center of Creativity as part of the World Music Residency. Later, I received the Cultural Diversity Award that supported the creation of my debut album, manat, which addressed climate justice in the Global South with sung Sufi poetry of the 18th century Sufi mystic, shah Abdul Latif Bita'i. At the University of Alberta, I also served as a music faculty in 2016 and for the semester at sea in 2020, during which I traveled across America, asia and Africa teaching ethnomusicology courses. My scholarly and artistic trajectory culminated in teaching courses in ethnomusicology in the music department, as well as my present artist residency at Mount Royal University as an artist changemaker.
Shumaila Hemani:Along this journey, I've learned that when one is experiencing burnout, there is a high leaning towards self-doubt and diminishing one's own self-worth. The key to breaking past. This lies in taking your power back and holding integrity in the face of burnout. By befriending burnout and accepting its presence, we're able to see the systemic factors that causes it and address them adequately. My experience inspired me to create the Deep Listening Path, a music sanctuary course, and the Resurgence Path, a music sanctuary course and the Resurgence Program, which support changemakers to break free from advocacy burnout with practices like deep listening, music and meditation.
Shumaila Hemani:Harvard's facade of academic excellence often conceals its oppressive tendencies, prompting me to speak out against the injustices I experienced, prompting me to speak out against the injustices I experienced Even after I had left the institution.
Shumaila Hemani:I have experienced Harvard to continue unleashing its wild hounds. As we strive to uphold truth and accountability, it's imperative to confront the institutional barriers that stifle genuine discourse and perpetuate inequality. Only through acknowledgement and action can we hope to cultivate an environment that embraces diversity, equity and inclusion within academia and beyond. Harvard ultimately taught me to develop resilience in environments where I may be the only person of color. Even today, when I encounter situations where I feel rejected as a member of an underrepresented group, memories of my experience at Harvard resurface. I use those experiences as armor to navigate and overcome challenging situations and push through, finding ways to preserve myself and break inner glass ceilings, unleashing new pathways to build safe spaces for dialogue and creativity. There is a famous quote attributed to Rumi as you start to walk on the path, the way appears, and with my new endeavors connecting music to burnout recovery, it feels as if my journey as a compassionate warrior for social justice has only started. Thank you, Thank you.
Gabe Nathan:Thank you for writing that and thank you for reading that and for sharing that with our community.
Shumaila Hemani:My pleasure.
Gabe Nathan:So you're about a year out from publication. How does it feel returning to that piece? What's coming up for you? As you looked at it again, as I'm sure you did in preparation for this interview and reading it aloud, what were you feeling?
Shumaila Hemani:I must share here, gabe, that for the past one and a half month I have been very rigorously writing my memoir, which is upcoming Writing in the Woon, and that memoir has been inspired by this essay that I wrote, because the process that I went through in writing this essay and then going through the editorial processes with Ethan and he helped me to go to places in my memory that I had really pushed really down and I went in those places and I wrote about it.
Shumaila Hemani:So even at that time last March, april, when I was in that editorial process, it just kind of cracked open something in me because I had suppressed some of these memories really really deep, deep down. And so my memoir kind of opens up these wounds and memories even deeper. So I find that what I am feeling is wow, I made it through this essay, like I did it, I wrote it, I was able to access these parts and that has become, I find, like that was my stepping stone for writing this memoir, because it gave me a lot of courage to go into difficult places in my memory. I don't know if I've answered your question, but that's what's happened to my mind right now memory.
Shumaila Hemani:I don't know if I've answered your question, but that's what's coming to my mind right now.
Gabe Nathan:It's really lovely to hear that and to know that the one is inspiring the other. And I think that as we get older we do push a lot down and we push a lot of what is painful to feel and to revisit. We kind of put it in a drawer or a closet and lock it away. And I think revisiting those things, even while it can sometimes be painful and hard, it can ultimately be really cathartic and helpful and you know, as was the case with you, spur a whole new creative enterprise. So that's really wonderful to hear. I'm glad that that was your experience. What would have helped you stay at Harvard? Do you think what could have been different that would have helped?
Shumaila Hemani:I think I had reached a point by fall 2011,. I had reached a point where I tried everything, everything possible, to stay, because I didn't know what lay beyond leaving Harvard. Didn't know what lay beyond leaving Harvard, so the gut was like just stay, you know, because that felt safe, safer than what lied ahead. So I had really tried everything and some of my friends there it's interesting that they consulted wise women for me and they told me that don't worry, your path ahead is much more amazing than what you have experienced here and to them. When I used to hear that, I didn't used to feel very convinced because I was latching on to the safety of the present, but that proved to be true.
Gabe Nathan:I mean not what more could you have done.
Gabe Nathan:I mean what more could they have done as an institution?
Gabe Nathan:So like, for instance, I'm thinking about a guest that we had on our show, one of our early guests.
Gabe Nathan:His name is Peter Lehman and he's a professor in Utah, and they had a suicide on campus and he did not know the student, but he was profoundly impacted by her loss and he is someone who has lived with depression and with suicidal ideation as well depression and with suicidal ideation as well and he decided to make a change in his classroom and decided to begin every semester by talking to his class about his personal mental health and about his struggles with depression and to say if you need something, if you need something, if you have special needs, if you are struggling, come to me. I want to know, and I want you to know that you are being taught by someone who is also struggling and that I'm not always okay. So I think that that's an example of someone in the academic world who really gets the need for empathy, who gets the need for being real and putting some things ahead of academic rigor. So that's really what I'm asking you what could have been done on the institutional side. To keep you there.
Shumaila Hemani:So there's a lot that I can say there, I think what's important to bear in mind and again I'm going to reassert that, even though I was experiencing severe burnout in the spring of 2011, I pushed through, gabe. I pushed through, I submitted my work. But the professor who gave me a C she gave me just a C because I had missed a few classes and she took it out on my paper. My paper did not deserve a C my grade in that course did not deserve a C minus. I had done my presentation, I had done my critical review, I had finished all the work and they couldn't value that. I think there was not just a level of high level of injustice there. If there was, it's a level of cruelty. I would say that those professors showed to me and on top of that, it was my ethnomusicology professor who gave me that grade. All the other professors on campus like the course that I was taking in anthropology, the course I was taking in language, they were very accommodating. I received accommodations. I was able to finish those courses.
Shumaila Hemani:I again would like to say I left Harvard in good standing. But my ethnomusicology professors they did not give me a terminal master's degree and I left without with just questions. People just used to ask me questions about what did you do there? What happened, what did you do there? What happened, what did you do there? And because I didn't even have a degree, you know, a person coming, a woman coming from Pakistan, pursuing music which is so stigmatized and then experiencing burnout and then going through, but doing all the work that's required. There's some grace that you could have given, and I'm not even asking for grace here, I'm just asking for justice. There was none and in my, in the fall of 2011, one of the actually used some because I didn't come from a Western art music background. They use that as an excuse further to undermine me and it's just.
Shumaila Hemani:It's just a level of academic cruelty that has continued, because even after I left Harvard, they took my PhD topic, methodologies and a Harvard scholar has made a name in the field based on my work. And nobody, because Harvard has such a you know, a mafia-like presence that you know you can't say anything against Harvard. Even at Society for Ethnomusicology, the plagiarized work gets awards, gets crowned, while my work is made it to feel like, oh, we're doing you a big favor by even letting you in our circle. You know that is the attitude, and none of my work has gotten published. So in terms of what could they have done better? Oh my gosh, there is just so much to say there. I think they were brutally cruel. These are very respectful names in the discipline and I have to say that they were very unjust and they continue to be very unjust and very cruel towards me.
Gabe Nathan:So I rest my case there and yet, in spite of that, here you are not just surviving but thriving and doing extraordinary things for the world and for human beings, and we're just so, so grateful that you're doing that work and pursuing that with brain and with heart, and for being a part of our community and having a new essay in the pipeline as you're working on your memoir. I'm very excited to be working on that with you, and so I just want to thank you for everything that you're doing and for spending time with us.
Shumaila Hemani:It was a real pleasure to be here and I really appreciate the space that you have created and the work you're doing. It is so, so important.
Gabe Nathan:Thank you. Thank you, Sharmila, and wishing you all the best in everything.
Shumaila Hemani:Thank you for having me, Gabe.
Gabe Nathan:Thank you again for joining us in conversation today. It's beautiful to see the progression of our contributors. Thank you again for joining us in conversation today. It's beautiful to see the progression of our contributors. We are so, so grateful to Dr Shumaila Hamani. She is the author of Music is Sanctuary Navigating Burnout in the Ivy League with the Power of Deep Listening. She is also the founder of the Deep Listening Path Initiative, which aids advocates in overcoming burnout. Before we leave you, we want to remind you to check out our website, recoverydiariesorg. There, like this podcast, you'll find additional stories, videos and content about mental health, empowerment and change. We look forward to continuing to grow our community. Thank you so much for being a part of it. We wouldn't be here without you. Be sure to join our mailing list so you never miss a podcast episode, essay or film. I'm Gabe Nathan. Until next time, take good care. Thank you.
