Ep. 76 / Ethiopian Evangelicals and the Women's Commission with Seble Daniel

The story of Christianity in Ethiopia is older than most nations, yet its churches are leading through modern pressures that test unity, identity and hope. In this episode we sit down with Dr. Seble Daniel to hear what faithful leadership looks like when a country carries deep Christian heritage and has to navigate ethnic tension and political upheaval.

Dr. Seble shares her journey from growing up in a close-knit missionary compound, to serving the global church as chair of the World Evangelical Alliance Women’s Commission. Along the way, we explore why Christianity in Ethiopia feels culturally woven in, how persecution under the communist regime strengthened evangelical unity across denominations, and why relationships between evangelicals and the Ethiopian Orthodox Church can be both strained and collaborative.

Our conversation becomes intensely practical when we also talk about women in ministry and women’s leadership in the church. Dr. Seble names the realities of patriarchy, the misuse of scripture to marginalize women, and the importance of acknowledging more than one faithful interpretation of difficult passages. She also explains the Women’s Commission’s advocacy priorities, including confronting violence against women, and why silence in the name of protecting the church only protects perpetrators.

If you'd like to learn more from Dr. Seble Daniel and the Women's Commission you can go their website and follow the WEA on Facebook. 

And please don't forget to share this episode and join the conversation on YouTube! 

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Transcript

Welcome And Big Question

Brian Stiller 0:10

Hello and welcome to Evangelical 360. I'm your host, Brian Stiller. What does it look like to lead faithfully when your nation carries a deep Christian heritage and the added pressure of rapid change? Today in Evangelical 360, we welcome a thoughtful and influential voice within the Evangelical Church. In a country where ancient faiths and emerging movements meet in striking ways. Sibyllist leadership has been shaped within a context where Christianity is not peripheral, but woven into the life of the nation, even as political tensions, social shifts, and generational change test its resilience. In such a setting, leading the church requires more than conviction. It calls for discernment, courage, and a steady trust in God's purposes. In this conversation, we explore how she understands the calling of the church in Ethiopia today, how leaders are formed in times of uncertainty, and how believers sustain faith under pressure, and how the gospel speaks into questions of unity, identity, and hope in this very diverse society. Her perspective offers something essential to the wider church. It reminds us that the gospel is not confined to one culture or continent, but is being lived out, often with remarkable vitality, in places where faith must engage both history and hardship. Sebla Daniel brings a voice that is grounded in Ethiopia's rich Christian story, yet attentive to what God is doing now, inviting us to consider how we too might lead with faithfulness in our own moment. I'm delighted to have her with us today. And please forgive me for my growly voice. I picked up something on route. Wonderful to have you on Evangelical 360.

Seble Daniel 2:06

Thank you for having me.

Brian Stiller 2:08

From Ethiopia. But where did all this begin?

Seble Daniel 2:22

It began in a rural village, not village, but small compound, used to be SIM's missionary compound. That's where I was born in the southern part of Ethiopia. My parents are both Christians. It's my grandparents who came to faith in Christ from Orthodox Christianity. So I grew up in a loving, small missionary compound. Of course, we didn't have many missionaries by the time I was growing up, but that's where I grew.

Brian Stiller 2:54

And what was your education like?

Seble Daniel 2:56

I went to public school. We had school in our compound, which was started by SM, of course. So that's where I went. It was a walking distance. It was so fun. I had such a happy upbringing, surrounded by a community. We had families living together. We had a big common field in the middle of the houses. We played together. You know, the kind of context where our friends' parents would watch us or discipline us. That's a kind of community I grew up in. Very loving, very responsible, and of course, very strong evangelical Christian community.

Brian Stiller 3:40

Now Ethiopia is in Africa. But after being to visiting Ethiopia many times, I have a feeling that Ethiopians feel themselves as being connected more with something more north and east rather than south. What is there about Ethiopia that gives them this connection with the Hebrew and the Middle East?

Ethiopia's Ancient Christian Identity

Seble Daniel 4:07

I think partly because we were never colonized. We were occupied for five years by Italy. And earlier than that, Christianity came to Ethiopia in the fourth century. So Christianity and Ethiopian culture has assimilated for the past 17 centuries. So it has created a unique culture where God's name is invoked for everything. And also our emperors, they traced traditionally their roots back to Solomon. We have a legend that says King Solomon had a son, was the queen of Sheba. You know, we claim that she was Ethiopian. And Minelik I was born. And from Minelik I, all of the Ethiopian emperors traced their descendancy from Solomon, who's that was that lineage. So that gave some strength for Judeo-Christian connection. And Amharic is a national language, widely spoken. It's a Semitic language. Of course, uh, it's the Oromo, which is the largest ethnic group, but Amharic is much more widely spoken. So we have this unique identity because we were not colonized and we received Christianity much earlier on.

Brian Stiller 5:35

The New Testament talks about Philip going down the Gaza Strip and meeting the Ethiopian assistant, uh treasurer to Candace the Queen. Does that connect to the beginning of Christianity in Ethiopia or does that predate the fourth century?

Seble Daniel 5:59

It predates the fourth century. Um traditionally, yes, uh, we claim that too. But Ethiopia back then was much larger than the uh geographic Ethiopia we now have. It included Sudan and all the rest in that area. So it was larger territory. But yes, in Orthodox Christianity, that is also uh traced as the beginning of Christianity in Ethiopia.

Brian Stiller 6:27

In the last few decades, Ethiopia hit the world news because of famine. Enormous starvation. How is Ethiopia doing now as a country of well-being?

Seble Daniel 6:46

It's such a diverse country. It's a huge country with more than 85 ethnic groups. Um we continue to struggle a bit. Usually uh in the Western media, what you hear is um our challenges and our shortcomings, and not the beauty, the beauty of people living together, um, the harmony, even between Islam and Christianity, we had such a unique harmony. Of course, we had um history of um conflict and trying to annihilate one another, but um, you usually don't hear about the beauty, the landscape, the people, the culture, the food, and all of that. Uh, we have our share of conflict, ethnic conflict, religious conflict. Um we still have that, but um, I think that's unfortunately that's what you usually hear about in the famine and um not the abundance and not the love and acceptance and hospitality.

Brian Stiller 7:50

But you recently had internal conflict, civil war with a uh a state in the north.

Seble Daniel 7:58

Yes, yes, yeah.

Brian Stiller 8:00

How do how does are those tribal conflicts?

Diversity Conflict And Hope

Seble Daniel 8:04

It's much more complicated. Um, so that this was a conflict between the Ethiopian government and um the party which used to be in power, TPLF. Um, so they had conflict. Of course, everybody was drawn into that conflict. It's complicated. So you uh depending on who tells the story and who you hear it from, uh, how the conflict started and how it continued and how it came to end, uh, depends on who tells the story, as all political story is told. Yeah.

Brian Stiller 8:42

Over the last few decades, we've heard in the stories of enormous numbers of conversion and to evangelical Christianity. Is that because the Ethiopian people are inclined to spirituality?

Revival Persecution And Evangelical Growth

Seble Daniel 9:00

There was, and there still is revival in the Ethiopian Orthodox Church and in evangelical churches as well. So the church is growing. The church is growing, and people are converting to Christianity. Um, it's true, the church is growing. We have huge churches. Um, it's because of revival and the centrality of the scriptures uh, which has contributed. Um, and um, I think our difficulties and challenges also draw us closer to the Lord. The church is growing and thriving. Um, you know, we were under communist regime for 17 years from 1974 up to 1990. During those um years of persecution, the church was underground, and I think that was when the church started to explode. So when we came out of persecution, we grew. Uh we grew um in number and in quality of life, I think. So that was the time where the church grew. And the communist regime, the persecution, it did not, uh, when they tried to suppress Christianity, they kind of brought us together, different denominations like Lutherans, Baptists, churches planted by uh different faith traditions came together and started worshiping together. By the time we emerged out of persecution, our number grew and we became closer to one another. In Ethiopia, you find churches sharing ministers, um, Baptist churches, Lutheran churches, Pentecostal churches. And in Ethiopia, we usually refer to ourselves as evangelical. So the term evangelical also includes Pentecostals. I know it doesn't include Pentecostals in other traditions, in other countries, but that experience of persecution brought us together and uh united us. So I think that's that also contributed to the growth of um the church.

Brian Stiller 11:12

The Orthodox Church is the most historic and the largest. How do the evangelical churches work with the Orthodox? What's the relationship between the two? How do you get along or do you get along?

Seble Daniel 11:27

That's a good question. We have a history of um not getting along because um people keep converting from Orthodox Christianity to evangelical Christianity. Sometimes we evangelicals are not careful in the way we address the Orthodox Church. We may not fully understand that we have these are two different traditions, and the Orthodox also look at us as um, you know. So we have received this Western form of Christianity. So for them, the Orthodox form of Christianity is authentic Ethiopian Christianity. It's difficult for them to accept us evangelicals as Ethiopian Christians. At some point in our history, when the Ethiopian Evangelical Church Mechanicus, which was uh planted by Lutheran missionaries, when the church wanted to be registered and they wanted to use the term, the title Ethiopian Mecchanesus Church, the Orthodox uh resisted because they didn't want evangelicals to use the title Ethiopian. So the the argument back then was we have one Ethiopian Orthodox Church, but others cannot refer to them to them as um Ethiopian churches. So we have our share of conflict, but there also is um collaboration on different fronts, collaboration, especially the Bible Society, Ethiopian Bible Society is a common platform. It brings us together. We collaborate in trying to eradicate harmful traditional practices, in bringing peace. We we try to collaborate, but we don't always see eye to eye.

Brian Stiller 13:21

What's the relationship like between the evangelical church and the political order of Ethiopia? I understand that you have a prime minister who is from the Pentecostal tradition. Does that make it easier or more difficult for evangelicals to relate to their governments?

Evangelicals And Orthodox Christians

Seble Daniel 13:40

In the history of evangelical Christians, there was a distinction between politics and Christianity. I think partly because we were persecuted by the communist regime. So we learned to um to stay away from politics. So when when the communist regime was overthrown and we had this new system, which seemed to be open for everybody, we struggled a bit because we still did not trust politics, and uh Christians, evangelical Christians were not keen to be involved in politics at all. But that started to change slowly. It started to change slowly over a long period of time. Evangelicals started to engage in politics. Of course, everybody, yeah, many people work for the government, but being politicians and running for offices is a later development. And when the current prime minister came to power, uh there was a lot of excitement, not only from evangelicals, but I can fairly say from everybody else. Um I think primarily because he talked about uniting the country and he talked about bringing down dividing walls, talked a lot about unity. If you know a little bit about our history, we were ethnic, uh we were divided along ethnic lines. We have federal states when the communist regime came down, the party that took power um not divided, but it it brought up the system of federalism, ethnic federalism. So that unfortunately divided us along ethnic lines. So that was not helpful. It was helpful in one sense because it gave um affirmation for minority ethnic groups, voice and space in government. But then I think, in my opinion, uh our division, our um uniqueness was emphasized than our unity. So then we divided along ethnic lines and started to say this land is my ancestors, and people who have settled in this land should go back to where they came from. So that that kind of divided us. So when the Prime Minister came to power, he talked about uniting us, one Ethiopia, one people, one nation. And the way he talked about um forgiveness and love made um his rhetoric attractive and we kind of rallied um around him.

Faith And Politics In Ethiopia

Brian Stiller 16:20

Obviously, your the the political machinations continue to uh break up and divide in Ethiopians in many other countries. But I want to turn to your life now. Uh you now chair the Women's Commission for the World Evangelical Alliance, uh, which is a uh I think a rather large responsibility given that we've got what do we've got, six hundred and fifty million people, which means we've got three hundred and twenty-five million women at least globally. Give people that are listening to us now, give them a bit of an outline as to what the women's commission is in the global body and what it does, what what you've inherited and uh what you now are responsible for leading.

Seble Daniel 17:14

Yeah, the women's um commission is comprised of um regional alliances. You know, we have uh regional alliances, each regional alliance under the WEE has, I think all of them has, have Women's Commission. And then the regional alliances have national alliances under them. So it's huge, it's huge. We focus on equipping women and advocating and also um connecting them. So the Women's Commission is a platform where women come together. So ideas and experiences from national alliances would go up to regional alliances and then to the global table. So we try to share experiences and we try to work on um helping them connect and collaborate. Um we also like especially about advocacy, we try to bring um to attention issues which hurt girls and women, um, like um violence against women and female genital mutilation or other traditional practices. We try to amplify the voices of girls and women. We also work on um promoting co-leadership, the importance of women and men serving together, leading together, and making space for women to exercise their God-given gifts. That's what we try to do. Uh, promote things which uh enhance women's development and flourishing as daughters of God.

Brian Stiller 19:04

Ethiopia coming back to your country. Uh is there a parity between women and men, or is it is Ethiopia traditionally a patriarchal society, and women have to press for their own equal rights?

Seble Daniel 19:22

It is traditionally patriarchal society. Um so there is a strong culture of male dominance, and it's given, it's given. Um, so in in churches we see that a lot. Sometimes we confuse what is cultural and what comes from the scriptures. So sometimes I would think culture dictates how we read the scriptures, how we understand the scriptures, and how we apply the scriptures. So there's a lot of controversy around women's leadership, not just leadership, but leadership over men. I think that's it's controversial in many, many contexts, and um it's controversial in Ethiopia too.

Leading The WEA Women's Commission

Brian Stiller 20:05

And how did you come to understand women and men, the role of women in ministry in the church? Was that a bit of a journey for you, or did you understand it from your own childhood?

Seble Daniel 20:23

In my childhood, um, I did not grow up seeing women um being in top leadership positions in the church. I grew up seeing mothers, my mother and other mothers and grandmothers serving, usually being at the back, supporting their husbands and men. That's what I have I saw growing up. But um childhood, I remember asking questions. It did not make sense to me, because my father, my father was very egalitarian. Um, he we we are six in the family, three boys and three girls. So he did not show any favoritism. He did not favor my brothers over us, as the girls. Because at home I was empowered, and our father would listen to us. He would, you know, we had this equal standing with our brothers, but in the society I don't see that. So it did not make sense to me. I grew up very empowered because of my father and also my mother, who was very intentional about dividing the house chores between us. You know, traditionally, there are some chores which are reserved for women, but she would force my brothers to work alongside us. So that was what I had at home, but all around me was different. I would say now, looking back, because I had that role model at home, um, because we were empowered, listened to, and never looked down or shushed. I think I grew up very empowered and confident. It has affected me, even though all around me was different. The way my father and mother modeled girlhood or boyhood, do you say that in English? Womanhood or manhood made a difference in me.

Brian Stiller 22:19

So then you go on to do your education, where did that lead you?

Seble Daniel 22:24

For my primary school, I studied back home in the rural part of Ethiopia. And then starting from grade eight, our parents moved myself and my older sister to Addis, the capital city. So we lived with our paternal uncle because they they wanted to send us to better school. Because the high school for my sister was a bit far, about five kilometers back then. So it was difficult for her to go. Girls and boys in the countryside do it all the time. But our uncle talked to them and he said it would be better for us to come to Addis. And we had attachment to him because when he was younger, he lived with my parents. So they decided to relocate us to Addis. And that's where I grew. I went to grade eight and high school in Addis. Then to college. Yeah, I never went back to the rural area permanently. But I used to go to visit my parents. But later on they moved to Addis. And yeah.

Brian Stiller 23:32

So you go to college, and what was the what were the steps to ministering there?

Seble Daniel 23:41

So the college I went to actually is a Bible college, uh, Evangelical Theological College. In Addis Ababa. In Addis Ababa. In Addis Ababa. I said, I want to know more about the Bible. That's all I wanted to do, you know, just wanted to know more. I was really interested in the scriptures. I used to read the Bible, and I was interested. So then she said, okay, I'll pray about it. So when this opportunity came, the elders didn't even know that I had interest. They came and they talked to my father. So traditionally, it's the father who gives permission, right? So they they talked to him and they said, you know, we've been praying and uh there is this opportunity. We think Sabler should go. And then my father said, Okay, I'll talk to her. He didn't know my interest. So he asked me and I said, I really want to go. He said, Are you sure? I said, Yes. So that's how my journey in theological education started.

Brian Stiller 24:40

Are the issues of women differed in Africa than they are in the rest of the world?

Seble Daniel 24:48

That's a good question. Maybe in terms of education, if you're comparing the West and Africa, in terms of education awareness, I think there might be a difference. But in terms of rights, I'm not sure. In fact, some African communities are egalitarian, because traditionally what matters is this spiritual leadership. So traditionally, in traditional religions in Africa, um, it doesn't matter whether the medium or the person who serves as spiritual medium, whether they are a man or a woman, what matters is the spiritual authority they have. So some communities can be egalitarian based on that. Other than that, I think the issues we are faced with are different, but the male dominance is there. I think it's there. It just the way it surfaces, the way it's applied, and the way women respond might be different in in Africa, um, especially in rural areas. Um, women accept it, they say, because it's usually justified. The scriptures are used to justify um males, male leadership. So women tend to accept that in the rural parts of um Africa. In urban um places, in cities, um there is some pushback, I think. And I think there are things which are similar to what you have in the West, um, but there are things which are different. Yeah.

Brian Stiller 26:35

Sometimes the scriptures are used to marginalize women. Uh how have you dealt with those texts that are used to diminish the role of women in ministry?

Wrestling With Restrictive Bible Texts

Seble Daniel 26:52

Yeah, passages like uh 1 Corinthians chapter 14, women should be silent, and 2 Timothy chapter 2. Those passages are usually used, and um Ephesians chapter uh 5, where Paul talks about uh wives, the need for wives to submit to their husbands, it's usually emphasized and amplified, um, and it's it's overemphasized, I would say. Um so I used to feel uncomfortable reading those passages, and then I would scold myself, I say, no, this is God's word. Why am I questioning it? So I tried to silence myself, saying, No, no, this is God's word, this is God's word. But I could not hold it. I just did not understand it. So when I joined uh seminary, that's when I started to study them, uh, openly ask questions. But we had professors who were complementarian, most of them were complementarian. And complementarian means means those who believe that women should not lead men or women should not have authority over men. Um but we had some egalitarians who believed that it doesn't matter whether you are a man or a woman, what matters is gift. So I had a few egalitarian professors, but most of them were complementarian. Um so I tried to to keep it, um, but I I just couldn't accept it. So I started reading and praying and reading more. It used to make me really angry. So that's what um uh I I could I didn't want to to have a discussion with people because I would get worked up. I would get really angry and then I would take it personally, you know, I'd get really upset. So it was very difficult for me to have a conversation with anybody about it. It took me a long time to have a conversation, to listen, and have a meaningful conversation with complementarians. It took, it was a long journey for me. I think it's because at home that that was not the case. Of course, my my mother did most of the work. My father uh worked outside of home, but the way he treated her and the way he treated us um did not cause me to believe in complementarianism, so it conflicted with how I grew up, and it was so hard to accept.

Brian Stiller 29:24

But now you hit up the world body, and your responsibility is not just Ethiopia or East Africa, it's the globe. Things are changing in many places. Yes. In some places, uh the church growth is with young men between the ages of 18 and 27. Uh, in many cases, women now are the majority of students and in some professions. So there seems to be a shift for women either taking equal place or even dominant place. Is that just in some sectors or are you seeing this trend move globally?

Seble Daniel 30:09

That's a good question. Um in secular contexts generally, um in Ethiopia and secular contexts, women tend to go up the ladder depending on their uh profession. Uh when they get married, then it would be difficult because they have to care for their children and all of that. Um, there is some level of discrimination, but not as strong as we have it in the church. In the church, um there is some change. I praise the Lord for that. There is um some level of openness, some openness to uh for women to participate in leadership. For example, in my church, women sit in the board of elders by by representing women. For the women's, the representative of the women's ministry would sit in the board of elders. So it's by representation. They don't get elected, so they represent women, and so they would be part of the elders' board. So that's that's a big thing. It has been going for a few years now, more than 20 years actually, but we don't get elected as elders. We we would be there representing uh women. That opens that opens doors and for um younger women, seeing others serving as elders, being part of the elders' board, it means it means a lot. I think it brings a lot of change, yeah.

Brian Stiller 31:46

What are some of your goals as chair of the World's Women's Commission?

Goals Advocacy And Ending Violence

Seble Daniel 31:52

It's amplifying, you know, it's it's not that women don't have a voice, but our voice doesn't get heard. Or somebody else speaks on our behalf, which is which is not a bad thing. Um but my prayer is that we get heard, that women get heard, that they get to tell their story, um, they get to tell how they feel about it, and they get to tell what limitations they have, they get to tell how they understand the scriptures, especially the passages which are used to limit women's ministry. How do we understand them? What do those passages mean to us? How do they speak to our hearts? How do they make us uncomfortable? And how do we find liberation in the scriptures? So our voice matters. And um it's my prayer that the Women's Commission would bring women's voice to the global table and that our voice would be heard because we can contribute and we have a lot to say, and we are the majority in many churches, and it's time to listen to uh women, and also it's time uh for men to make room and for leaders to make room for women to participate in the growth of um the church. Traditionally, um evangelism is open for everybody. Um I serve with SIM primarily, so within SIM, we have many female missionaries in the history of SIM. There were many female missionaries, so they were going out and planting churches. But once the churches are established and once leaders are discipled and trained and they can take leadership, then sometimes women would push, would be pushed aside. So um that's that doesn't make sense. If if they are the ones who train and disciple and establish churches, they are leading. They are training men and they are teaching men. So once the church is established, pushing women aside um doesn't make sense. So I I strive for a holistic approach where everybody's voice would be heard. Not just because we are women, but based on merit and gift. And gift. I want for women to come forward, not just because they are women, not to say we have representation of women, but those who are gifted in leadership, just like men. Those who are gifted should come and lead. Um we wouldn't want any man to lead. We want gifted men. The same principle should apply to women. Gifted women, women, gifted with leadership should come, gifted with preaching should preach. So we should serve according to our gift and we should not be limited. And also, um, I also want us to address violence against girls and women. And that violence sometimes is hidden and ignored, and we don't talk about it because we think it would dishonor the name of God. So women endure a lot of a lot of violence, and they don't talk about it for two reasons, I think. Uh primarily, they think it would bring shame to the church and to the name of God. And secondly, if they talk about it, they can be ostracized. So they would carry that shame for the rest of their life. So they don't talk about it, they they suffer in silence. So I want the church to talk about what's happening, um, how women are suffering, how they are enduring suffering. Um, and the church should be a place where women would be free to serve, free from violence. And the church should speak up when there is violence, and perpetrators need to be held accountable, whoever they are, and there should be restoration. Um, when there is uh brokenness, there should be healing and there should be accountability.

Brian Stiller 36:08

What are this the sustaining factors to your own faith and to your own responsibilities and leadership?

Sustaining Faith And Advice For Women

Seble Daniel 36:17

I grew up in a very strong Christian family. So I I was attached uh to Christ from childhood. I have this very strong attachment uh to the Bible, um, to God. So this trust in God has always been part of my life. I don't have a specific time where I converted. It's like I grew. I grew in my relationship with Christ. So that has held me, you know. I know I know I have experienced the power of Christ, I have experienced his love. Um, so when people say otherwise, I always come back to what I have experienced, this personal relationship with God and what the Bible says about this. And that um there are different ways of interpreting the scriptures, those passages which seem to restrict women's ministry. So sometimes the voices which limit women's ministry or restrict women's ministry, especially leadership, make it sound like that is the only, the only orthodox way of interpreting the scriptures. But it is not. Um all we ask for as women, usually, is that other ways should be acknowledged. And there should be an acknowledgement that there is a different way of interpreting the scriptures, and that way of interpreting or the egalitarian way should not be labeled as liberal. It they should be complementarians and egalitarians should be placed on the same, on the same, um, how do you say that?

Brian Stiller 38:02

Basis.

Seble Daniel 38:02

On the same yes, yeah. One I I understand if if complementarians don't accept women's ministry, they understand. And I also equally want them to understand and accept that there are egalitarians who believe otherwise.

Brian Stiller 38:18

Say what someone is uh someone is watching you. Maybe a younger woman, maybe a middle-aged woman, and feeling contained, captured. They feel their gifts are retained are thwarted. They have a desire to be used of God, and yet they're in difficult circumstances. What steps would you advise them to take to feel the the freedom to serve God in ways that are suitable to their gifting and calling?

Closing Thanks And Ways To Connect

Seble Daniel 39:02

I would say um they should continue to serve wherever the Lord gives them open doors. I believe God opens the doors. He does. So they should continue to serve. Wherever God opens doors, they should keep on serving, keep on trusting the Lord, and they should keep on pushing just a little bit. It's always good to speak. It's always good to speak. The Bible says we should speak the truth with love, and we should keep speaking the truth with love, especially those who are empowered and who have positions, who avoid the topic altogether because they don't want to be labeled as you know feminist. That's a strong term. Um, we should we should keep speaking up. And those who feel limited, I would say it is not easy. I know it is not easy for me, because I I come from an empowered childhood, I wouldn't say I have experienced um being limited or pushed aside because I was in theological education, which usually is open for women. I did not have the gift of being a pastor, so I never uh pursued that. But I understand those who have that gift of uh serving as pastors in the church or leaders in the church would feel limited. But God opens the doors, and it's always good to start those conversations as gently as possible and also continue to serve wherever God places them, faithfully serve, pray, and wait upon the Lord. And if their church is so limiting and restrictive, and if they are not thriving, maybe they can consider joining another church where they can exercise their gift and thrive.

Brian Stiller 40:56

Thank you so much for joining us with Evangelical 360 today.

Seble Daniel 41:00

Thank you for having me.

Brian Stiller 41:01

Thank you. Thanks, Sebla, for telling us your story. And to you, I thank you for being a part of the podcast. Please share this episode with a friend and join me in conversation on YouTube. If you'd like to learn more about today's guest, just go to the show notes for links and info. If you haven't already received my free ebook and newsletter, just go to BrianStiller.com. Thank you for joining me. Until next time.