Old Castle Rock

Two weeks feels like Two Years

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Its been a difficult 14 days supporting Heart Of Midlothian but the lads are going to recap and discuss everything that has happened from the last day at Parkhead to the captain leaving for Ibrox.

Then a chat about other departures today and the signing of MJ Kamson-Kamara

SPEAKER_03

Hello and welcome to Old Castle Rock, the podcast that talks everything hearty medlothing and everything suffering over the last 14 days. We're back last week, was a little bit emotional with everything that was going on and being on holiday and everything else. But we're back this week, and I'll be honest, there is absolutely loads to talk about, and I am joined by both Gavs. Uh, how are we doing, boys? Greetings, commiserations. I know we're not quite no one is quite as chirpy as the last time we spoke and everything else, but um this is a little bit a little bit of therapy of everything that's happened, um, and we'll see how we go. Um, obviously, it's Neil, it's a little bit in the past now. Um, we know what happened at Parkhead. We obviously talked about it last wedding the the last time we recorded on what happened at Fur Park. I'll be honest, I haven't watched the game back. Um, I don't think of any intention of watching the game back. Um Gavin Fleming, you look like a man that likes torture. Did you watch the game back?

SPEAKER_02

I didn't watch the game back, and I watched uh when I came in on the Saturday afternoon after what happened, um, just after um popping down to the plaza, I did watch the highlights after um driven in my sorrows and diggers with a couple of individuals who I can't quite remember their names, but um we gave each other quite a good little kind of therapy session. It was decent. And I watched the highlights, um, but it was actually basically just to see Shanks's goal again and then just really just to get um an overview of the penalty and the offside goal, just to see that you know they weren't genuinely a pen and um uh an offside, and unfortunately, yeah, the the two of them were stick on pens and stick on onside, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I mean that's the thing, is like I'm only watching everything from from obviously my perspective, and just remembering that back on the day, I had no issue either the my either decision. Um it was a penalty, and it was it was it was on side.

SPEAKER_02

Um was extremely cutting is we hadn't actually given away a penalty all season, apparently.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

I know I read something about it like the day before or the morning of the game. I was like, oh that's brilliant. Whoever shared that, thanks very much, because we've not actually conceded a penalty the entire season, and then you get one that's actually quite unfortunate, where like Tizzy is actually to his credit just trying to defend the situation and trying to defend it quite well, and it literally is just accidentally hit his hand, but because his hand is out like that, it is a penalty. Um it's a horrible, it's a horrible law, it's a horrible rule, and it was just a bit of bad luck. I can't even really really criticize anything. It's just bad luck, it's just bad luck.

SPEAKER_03

Yep, Kennedy, you've obviously what are you did you watch your thoughts then like a little bit of uh obviously in regards to these decisions.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I mean I was the same as you guys. I've uh there was no arguments for you or the officials that time, unfortunately. At the end of a game, I was pretty drunk and I was pretty angry, and I really was convinced it was offside until I actually realized yeah, she generally wasn't. Um when I seen it like on Facebook and stuff like that, you know what I mean? And I thought to myself okay, he wasn't, so that's really annoying. Um and uh the penalty he knew it was a penalty as soon as he did it, and you're just like it's such a shame because like I've said it wasn't intentional in a way, but it's just a stick on rules that way, so you just have to accept that one and try and get hold of it, which the hardsplayer tried to do. They really tried to contain it with her as long as he did, and um I it's just got in, mate. Absolutely got in to be honest with you. So that's not doing that.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no, absolutely. Um again, Fleming. What was your day? Did you go? Did you say you were down at the plaza?

SPEAKER_02

I did, mate. I I bet um if you're gonna be asking me for an accurate timeline and time stamp of events, Andy, I I'm not maybe 100% your man given the given the quantities of ethanol that was.

SPEAKER_03

No, I well, I was on the obviously I was on the plaza as well. So um and what I was was how did you feel down on the plaza, right? Because when I went down there, right, because obviously we I went up to Gorgie, didn't get in anywhere, went back to someone's house to watch the game, and then got a taxi back into Gorgie. And at the time, I remember thinking to myself a couple of obviously as you're building up to the week as the game was going, I was like, is this gonna happen? Are we gonna it's how's everyone gonna react with if we don't win the league? Is are they just gonna turn up to an empty plaza and fans furious everywhere? Are they going to get this this kind of welcome? And I thought with everything that's happened, I mean, for me personally, over the over the whole year, I was like, I felt it was quite emotional being on the plaza. Now I couldn't see any of the players. You could obviously you you kind of knew they were there because people were singing, and I could see topsy heads and stuff, so you couldn't see the emotions of any of these players getting off the bus or Tony Bloom getting off the bus or anything like that. But being on the plaza and speaking to people, I felt it felt quite emotional, and it felt a little bit of maybe just a little bit of closure about the whole season and the way there was.

SPEAKER_02

But no, it it wasn't the the the the players and the the the club and the management 100% deserved to have some kind of you know um what's the word I'm I'm looking for, just you know, crowd, not the celebration, but you know, people being there just to kind of give them a uh you know a clap, a cheer, a sing song. And like you say, Andy, it kind of brought people together. I think people that you know, and it was just a case of you know we'd done so so well, but we'd fallen at this last hurdle, the people were still grateful for the season that we'd had, and I think we just maybe wanted to share that with others, friends, yeah, family, uh, and everything, and it was more like a kind uh act of defiance, as in, you know, you know, we're hearts, it was a great season, you've you've done your best, lads. That that's how I felt anyway, mate.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no, that's what I was. I mean, that's that was how I was was kind of thinking as well, and I was thinking, it was that now. I'll be honest, I didn't see the any of what happened because obviously, when we take that free kick, um actually I'm gonna come back to that as I wanted Kennedy quickly. Obviously, you didn't go to the plaza. How is it maybe different for you then? Obviously, I because I came home on the Saturday, and I was going on holiday the next day, but I came home on the Saturday and I was quite not content because I was devastated, but I was I felt a little bit uh as I said, I felt I had that wee bit of closure because I had been around around that speaking to people, and I think I don't know if I'd I'd had a few beers, but I was convinced at that point that this is only the start, and next year it was, and I was like, by the way, I I we are gutted at the moment, but I think that we have got so much to look forward to. And how is it maybe different to you than who always jumped back on the train over to confirm and was like and maybe in a a bit of a furious rage with this maybe?

SPEAKER_00

It wasn't a furious rage, mate, it was more of a sort of like genuine disappointment and got gutted, you know what I mean? So it's like I've been all like bad cup finals and like bad UP games and stuff like that, as you know, and like it's like it doesn't get any easier that no matter what the the sort of like situation is, and that I was you know how long in this podcast I spoke about this is ours, we're gonna we're gonna win it. I mean the most vocal on it, and to follow that in the last hurdle was just like the Bull Rise of the Air. They were actually blown up in arts by the end of a game in that, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So by then I was just like I was just at the stage, I was like, I just need to go home because I was drinking quite a lot for like early hours doors for me, you know. And then I was just like uh place was empty and I was like, I knew there was folk going to have buzz and stuff, and I was just like not in the mood for that because I was just like I just like hate busy places and warm like climates, as you know, mate. So I was just kind of like uh to sort of like my idea of help. So yeah, so you know what I mean? No, so and I was just like, I'm definitely going home, get my train, have a McDonald's and have an early night, it's exactly what I did.

SPEAKER_02

And then an interesting we story. So um then met like a cup, you know, as you do when you're just at one of these little gatherings and you'll you'll bump into people and you'll start chatting. So started chatting to these um random boys that you know the one obviously down at the plaza and stuff, right? Just a bit of banter, and and and I can't quite remember how, mate, because again, you know, that's a level of intoxication, but they were able to get into diggers like without having to cure whatever, like so. I don't know if they had um seats or whatever, right, in the back. Yeah, so I can't. I think the boy's name was was Pete Pete. If you're listening, what a good guy you are, mate. Not not the Irish Pete, by the way, the other people I was gonna say, what a gentleman, what a gentleman you were, mate, because you took me to diggers, we had a great time, and you bought me a couple of pints, mate. But anyway, we we went up to diggers, mate, we were able to walk in, and then um, you know, we just met each other that day. It was her and this other boy as well. And the three of us were just sitting there, mate, and we were all kind of we'd been kind of separated right from the original groups that we were with. But the three of us were just kind of sat in that wee back room and diggers, mate, a couple of pints. Hi, but just talking about like the season and the highs of the season, and just you know how how good a season it had been, and not in a way that oh, you know, glorious failure or you know, Brave old part of the back, but just going over, you know, they were talking about being at Easter Road for the spittle game, and how one of the boys had been at um, you know, I brought for the first game, and you know, how just what I brought and and the three of us though, even though you know we were complete strangers though, just that talk into each other, it really, really helped. And just as I was getting up to leave, the boy actually came over to me and he was like, um, he was like, Gavin, he was like, Yeah, what and he's like, listen, that's absolutely good. You've actually made me feel a little bit better about everything just by talking to you right about the season. And I said the exact same time. I was like, I was I was like, Peter, I don't know you, I don't know your second name, but you made me feel a lot better about everything as well. I guess in a roundabout way, Andy, I'm just trying to say people coming together and just maybe being there, mate, can can just help in these situations. Unless you're Kennedy, you just jump on the train and you go home for a domino setup.

SPEAKER_03

Aye, basically, aye, is basic is how it goes. But yeah, I mean that was the thing, is that and even at that point, I pro it was I don't think I'd pieced together what had happened. So after that free kick, we take that free kick where we've got everybody in the box and they break and everything else. We turned it off as it before the ball before I think before it hit the net, and we just it was a case of just sitting there. So I don't think I had pieced together everything that had happened when it came to pitch invasions and how long the game technically went before whether the referee blew the final whistle or signalled or anything like that. So it that was more of a what has happened, and I think it was probably still re like piecing together what was happening in Liverpool Airport on the Sunday morning because again you picked bits and pieces up on Twitter and everything else like that about what exactly's happened, and you see the players coming in in their kits and you're hearing stories that had been that they'd obviously left straight away and had been advised to leave.

SPEAKER_00

What was what do you Kennedy Must have maybe applying more to you actually just because you've seen you were obviously not down there and you were getting on that what was that I left the pub early as well because like daily, sorry, should I say, because like we seen everything like that happened in the pub because he kept it telling his own, eh? And he showed like the fans running on the pitch and the players we didn't see many pictures of players get attacked, but you can tell we were getting like frustrated and pushing fans away and stuff like that, eh? Um quite concentrational on that, and that made us even more angry. And like when at the time we're just watching it, it just reminded me of a 2016 final of that fucking horrible day as well, when the Hims fans wanted to pitch start scrapping the Regis fans and that, and you're just thinking to yourself, just in there going, How is this happening again? And twice in one season from Eblock as well, and you're just like they've just got like a whole like a contingency of horrible like well, not the whole sport, but it isn't a minority because when you see hundreds on the pitch for Celtic with 50 pounds of stadium, that really is a minority, to be fair to him. You know what I mean? It's not like there was fans of the Celtic stadium, to be fair to him, that were booing the Celtic fans on the pitch because they wanted to see the like trophy parade and all the put the players get their trophy and all that, which is quite right. I'd be angry at that too, paying all that money for a season thing, I have all these idiots running about in the pitch of that, you know what I mean, and like people holding bears laughing shantons and stuff, eh? And uh honestly uh I'm just going to a big tangent here now, eh?

SPEAKER_03

But no, that's fine.

SPEAKER_00

You get what I'm saying no way, and it's just like between that and losing a game and just adding more salt into the winds, eh? And you're just like on that, I've got to deal with this emotion, eh?

SPEAKER_02

I think I think um, I think I think in isolation, right? You know, there's a wider conversation to be had maybe one day about pitch invasions and everything like that. We can maybe come on to it in the summer, right? And I think sometimes a pitch invasion, right, depending on the context of a game, can maybe have its place right now. I'm not for one second lads saying that they're acceptable, right? But you know that I'm not I'm not comparing Friggin' Celtic running on right on that last day of the season with maybe like you know, Peter Head scoring a last minute winner, right? And 20 guys run on the pitch, right? So you know what I'm saying. But I think Celtic have a uh Celtic have a repeat history of doing this, right? And uh and a trend of doing this, right? And it's not the first time this season, it's not even the second, it's not even the third, it's the fourth time, I believe, right that they've had pitch invasions, right? And that's after we've got the Rangers, the Rangers quarter final, which that investigation, by the way, has certainly taken its time. Um they were on the pitch, I think, after the last-minute winner against Killey, they were on the pitch at Motherwell. And again, in certain context and certain matches, right, I can understand, right? When you've got a team that does it repeatedly, and the way that they do it as well, and when you're running on like that, right, when the game is still going, when you're maybe gesticulating and you're threatening towards maybe other players, staff, everything like that, and when it actually leads to the team having to leave the ground, right, in their strips and get back on a bus, that's when you need to start asking questions, right? Now, Gav, to be fair, make makes a good point there, right? Yeah, this is a harsh podcast, right? But it would be remiss to say that every single one of those 60,000 Celtic fans, right, is a complete bell end, although probably not far off, right? And there was some of them that were there was there was some doing the guys that were on the pits, right? That they do continuously keep doing it, and it's the fact that they can't just show a little bit of accountability. And what annoyed me, Andy, was Martin O'Neill might come on to it coming on and trying to double him down, right, on it, and you know, oh, I never seen it, and oh, it was just hijacked, right? And Celtic security, where the frig was Celtics security, Chaglid in that, right?

SPEAKER_00

And he did fuck all. Chaglin had to push a boy away in that. You saw it. But if you look at the screen up, you were asking for a square call.

SPEAKER_02

If you look back to the Hearts and Falkirk game, right? The Wednesday, the Wednesday before, actually. So the day before um the last recorded lads, right? A fortnight ago tonight, actually, right? Um, you know, there was obviously that moment, right, when it was maybe like Celtic were drawing and Hearts were winning 3-0. I think if you remember, right, the actual the perimeter of Time Castle, the security guys and the stewards started kind of going round the pitch, as it may be a bit of a barrier. Just in case, right? So this is part head with 60,000 fans, right? With a known support, the supporters base, right? You know, that have got uh uh history for doing that. So, where was the cover? Where was the barrier? Where was the steward then? Where was the security? So many questions, and I'm glad Hearts are doing what they can about it to ask questions, whether anything will happen, that's another story. Well, at least at least we're doing what we can.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, so this is this obviously something else that call come on to now is that obviously they had the statements and hearts released their statement, um, and then the SFA come up with their statement as well. And at that point it felt it just felt like I don't know, I don't know how it felt for you is because I was I'm away at this point. So you're every time you're looking at your phone, you're like, what is going on? Because obviously Hart's touch took all you well, it released statements, and they were they were very quiet to obviously to release what they to release everything that obviously came out, and you're like, they've obviously got something. Um and I mean do you yeah, I don't think you think me you need me to to read the whole statement out to you, but I mean what was your thoughts on the on the Hart statement and then the statement of the SFA?

SPEAKER_00

For me it was very tit for tat because like Hartz could only say so much due to legal reasons, you know what I mean? And but we wanted to be deemed to be saying something to reflect everything that happened on the thing, and like whereas the SFA just turned around and said, We've already provided you the evidence, which is absolute nonsense because it looked like a terrible audio, um, in my view. Um, but it was just like there's a lot more that Hearts have complained about, which the SFA haven't addressed, and that's what Hearts are obviously angry about, but at the same time, it's like the Rangers Cup game, this will take months and months for them to investigate because they won't want to make a quick decision on it, because you know what the impact of that decision will be ultimately be due to like Celtics like crowd and like the influence of the game and stuff like that, you know what I mean? So we're in a very catch-22 situation, in my view, and like sort of a legal standpoint. I'm no lawyer, but my hearts they can only say so much, you know what I mean, without damaging any potential like future cases and stuff like that. So you can kind of see why we said what we said, but at the same time, it's just like just say that this shouldn't have happened and they're gonna look into to see what you know what it could be done about the future, blah blah, do something like that. But we didn't. It was like we just said, no, it's okay because McKinnon's wanted the game to end. Aye, he wanted the game to end because he didn't want his players to hurt because the stewards were doing absolute nothing to protect his players. But the fact that he didn't even know the game was ended speaks fucking volumes.

SPEAKER_02

Exactly, and and even even now, Gap, they're all very, very good points, actually, mate. And and even now, right, we're nearly a fortnight on, right, from from the game. I'm still not a hundred percent certain there's been a definitive kind of categorical bit of evidence, right, that has actually confirmed when and at what time the game ended and how the game was ended, right? There's been as Andy says, as you said, Andy, there's been like you know, backwards and forwards statements, right? And it's been a little bit difficult to kind of reconcile everything, right? Because it's kind of gone from you know hearts back to the SFA back to hearts back to the SFP again. And I think hearts are just kind of getting their legal ducks in the road just now as well, like Gar says, right? But there hasn't been a definitive and I know there's been audio and there's been comments about that every giving a signal and everything like that, right? And folk are kind of going through Like the real books never did, right? But I'm still to be a hundred percent convinced, right, that someone has come out and said Don Robertson did this in this minute. This is how he ended the game. Hart and Celtic knew that the game had ended. This is the reason that the game was called. Now, in all likelihood, right, they will probably cobble some story together. And Hart suffered from this, right, during Covid, right? And it will probably come out if we maybe don't have anything that we can actually kind of get a claim on, right? But we're only two weeks on, two weeks on, right? And we still don't know where we stand with that. It's just terrible. It's a terrible state of affairs. It really is. In this day and age, in this day and age, it's terrible.

SPEAKER_00

To be fair, though, with like the thing is that most of like the footballing world take holidays at this time of year. So I imagine that's why maybe nothing's been done as much as it would have if it was like during the season, if you get me.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, but again, though, we always use the example, Gab, if it was the other way around, though, right? And if you had the team in Lovino White Hoops, right, against them, right? It would be all over the news, it'd be all over the back pages, right? It would be the story on every single podcast, right? Every YouTuber, every blog, right, they'd be talking about it, right? You'd be getting people coming out with the rule book and everything. I know there's been little bits and pieces by people. I know that, like, you know, your Gary Linekars and your Alan Shears and everything like that were talking about the incidents at Far Park and stuff, right? But for me, there's not been a definitive the game ended at this time. The pitch invasion started at this time. Does this mean the game was abandoned? What was the referee's signal? What did he do? Did he put his thumbs up in the air? What was his signal? Was it a whistleblown? Is the reason that McInnes said to end the game? Because McInnes was quite rightly at that moment, right, fearful for the safety of his players. So, like any normal human being, you'd say, right, just end the game. And also, listen, we talk about okay, 30 seconds to go, right? There may be been a couple of injuries and there'd be maybe like a bar check for Celtics for a goal or whatever. You know, and I know, right? Football is a very, very funny game, right? Because there's no incidents of Hart scoring two goals in 30 seconds in a certain 4-4 game against the hippies, right? So we know that strange things can happen in football. Hearts could maybe make it a 3-2 straight from the kickoff, right? You then get an injury, a guy's going, you know, a couple of minutes, whatever. Now it's unlikely, but you don't know. You don't know in football, right? So that's where hearts are within the race. Now, I'm not trying to say award us the league or veto the result or give us a 3-0, right? But it's understandable why there's questions that need to be asked.

SPEAKER_03

Well, the thing is as well, is the yeah, technically, he blew the he blew with like 20 seconds to go, but they spent a minute and a half apparently with the Celtic players in the pitch, right? And for everything that they said in that SFA statement, for him to speak to the VER room to relay everything that's going on, for him to speak to the fourth official, and for the fourth official to have that conversation with Derek McInnes, is about 45 seconds. So, how how does it take 45 seconds for all of that to happen? Bear in mind everything else that's going on, for them to clearly state that that's to say that this is this is the case. Now, you're right, McKinnitz McInnes are what his players off, just get them off the park, is obviously what he's saying. But why did the hearts manager doesn't get to decide when a football match finishes? Like, you know what I mean? So that there's one thing as well, and yeah, that everything it just stinks in regards to playing the game short. Now, at this point, I don't think I ever wanted it to be like all is like you said, reward it like to give it a 3-0 void result and replay the game because Fish would have needed it to play, but um I think that it's just been a case a bit of transparency, a bit of clarity, and we kind of know that this is this is a big cover-up, but I would say also that Hartz had this audio since Saturday, and I I think there is more to it than what they're saying because Hearts could have easily come out on Sunday or Monday and said, Look, we've had the audio, Derek says end the game, and they believe that there's obviously other issues as well. And that isn't even talking about the fact is that in theory, the Celtic players are the Celtic subs are stepped on the park when the ball's in play, which is then a free kick to hearts. So again, there's even more things that that need to be that need to be looked at and need to be clarified and everything else, and I think going forward is that it's right. And Kennedy talks about that football people are on holiday, but the lawyers are now on holiday. Um and the lot the lawyers and the Tony Bloom lawyers, because he's obviously involved in this as well, even though he's a minority shareholder.

SPEAKER_02

Imagine some the only do you know what you make a lot of good points here, right? And I know I know I know some people like would maybe like listen to hearts fans and say, oh, it's just so our great the better team won and everything, right? I'm like, listen, I understand the Celtic government 2-1, right? I get it, right? And I know it's highly, highly unlikely, right? That everything might happen, right? No, but no, but the football, the the reason that we all love football, lads, is because football is such an unpredictable game, right? And even in over the course of our lifetimes, right, absolute shenanigans has happened in the last minutes of matches when you completely unexpected Oscar. Do you know what I mean? Stuff can be well, stuff can just happen. Stuff can just happen, right? So again, just ending, right, with maybe a little bit of time, okay. Yeah, it might not have made a massive bit of difference, right? But if I set a precedent, what happened? We've got the Champions League final this Saturday, right? Imagine I'm in a similar situation, right? Um what the PSC fans, right, just made the picture or whatever, right? But maybe like a couple of minutes ago. Jim Carson just turned round and go, right, no bother. Or is it going through the courts? Are they demanding audio, are they demanding visuals, are they demanding that you wait for a president releasing a statement? And this is this is all hearts are trying to do. Hearts are doing right by hearts as a club and by their fans, right? Yes, nothing would give me a bigger erection, right, than in a couple of months' time. You go on DDC and it says hearts awarded, league through, whatever, right? But it's not gonna happen. But we need to do what we can, right, to maybe punish Celtic or at least get some kind of sanctions or some kind of clarity as to how the game ended. And that's all hearts are saying. That's all they're saying. It's not summer grapes. Imagine it was you, if it was Hibs, if it was Aberdeen. Do you know what I mean? If it happened to these teams, they'd want the exact same. So that's all he's doing.

SPEAKER_00

I also wonder what kind of case hearts are building, because not only is Tony Boob and his lawyers and all that, George Phelps is involved in it as well. And that was the one.

SPEAKER_02

George Bouts is involved. Oh yes. That was before what happened on Saturday.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that was before what happened on Saturday. That was after the VAR decisions.

SPEAKER_02

I've never trusted George Bouch since he came out and said that Vlad left because of irreconcilable differences, eh? So listen, we'll see how that one goes, mate.

SPEAKER_03

Well, I and I think uh I think there is maybe there is obviously could be a wee bit more to this as well, but it's hearts and you it's this SPFL and the SFA, I should say. So again, this could be just swept under a really, really, really big uh carpath.

SPEAKER_02

It's not it's never a boring one, is it, Andy? It is never a dull moment in a gamble mate that is always that honest. I I was thinking this mate, just trying to tear myself up, lads, right? We could imagine you supported like honestly, stuff just happens to hear. Every single season that is something that happens. If it's not a court case, it's a relegation, it's not a relegation, it's a championship season. If it's not that, it's get back up. Honestly, it's it's it's never a dull moment, and then it's never a dull moment, boys.

SPEAKER_03

And then it gets to a week later, so everything's calming, everything's calming itself down, right? And then I'm enjoying my family holiday. It's my last full night, right? And I got a text message for Ken. I got Kennedy puts in the group chat, and it the the conversation went along the lines of, and I'm gonna just grab it now. Where is it? Because basically, Kennedy puts in the group chat, ruins everybody's Saturday night.

SPEAKER_02

Hey, do you notice that? Ruins everybody's Saturday.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, about half six on a Saturday night now. He goes, Shanks rumors to Rangers, and I text him back going as strong as the Egyptian watered down beer. And Kennedy goes, I sounding it, trying to claim it's a clause, what he signed last year. And then I picked my phone up and opened another group chat, and I was like, ah fuck, there's definitely more to this. And at this point, I felt like somebody had just ran up and booted me in the nuts. I was like, This has only been a week. What is go what the fuck is going on?

SPEAKER_00

It's like when you're uh when you're married and your marriage was over, and then you find out that the wife was uh cheating on you afterwards as well, eh? That is exactly how that fucking season felt like.

SPEAKER_03

I get the feeling, Kennedy, this could you need a therapy session if you're this is what we were talking about on the fucking thing.

SPEAKER_02

But I have to say, I am I'm I'm very, very interested to hear from from Mr. Kennedy on on this actually, because he's um he was very Sunday morning, especially he was very, very animated on the old um the old group chats like so. I'd like to hear Gavin's genuine thoughts on this this sad.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, so well I'll just recap it before we we obviously we go on is that Lauren Shankland, the Hearts Captain, probably the best striker we've had since John Robertson. 88 goals in the four seasons, decided that he wanted to leave, and it was a break contract a break clause in his first in his contract that had to be activated by the 3rd of July, apparently. Now, this is this bit's the rumours, and no one's ever no one's confirming that, but this is obviously what you hear on the good the on the grapevine, and he wanted to go to Rangers, and that was confirmed yesterday. So, Gavin Kennedy, take us away what you think, first of all.

SPEAKER_00

Rat, absolutely right. Um seriously, um really angry about the whole thing, eh? I mean, I know Hearts have done their best of a situation, and I kind of see it from her point, but see, this is what annoys me about the whole undisclosed nonsense pitch that annoys me season upon season. We've spoken about this many times on the spot. Whenever you see undisclosed for like transfers or contracts or anything like that, it's a way to be disconnected from your fans, right? And that's my view. I normally try to do it to protect themselves from other clubs or whatever, but the fans don't know what's going on, and we're meant to be a fan-owned base club, and that's what it gets to me because we had no idea about this clause whatsoever, you know what I mean? And uh it was brought to us by the if it I don't want to advertise them, eh, but it was brought to us by the bloody son of all people as well, eh? You know what I mean? So that made it even worse for me. Hey, it's like finding out about your XG and from like her best power or something like that, eh? It's like it's just a cool kick in the nuts. And then on top of that, it's just the way it was all manoeuvred. Now, I don't know who initiated it first, uh, must have been his agent, but at the same time, he must have given him some sort of signal if Hunts are interested, let's go for it. Because why else would they have gone for it knowing that clause was in the contract? And I just feel it's absolute disgusting behaviour. The way Eberkin's brought him back from a dead from a season of shit seasons when I was screaming at him at foaming at my mouth at uh Fur Park for a nil-nil drawing putting us into the bottom six to actually almost us win in the league is absolutely disgraceful, eh?

SPEAKER_02

Gap, Gap, Gab, can I but Gab, to just ask you, right? Just um like to like see your should should you think do you think it's fair, right, that your anger is solely directed at Shanklin, or do you think that the club deserves maybe a little bit of the anger as well?

SPEAKER_00

A wee bit of it, but not as much. Because I the club and I can get why McClure put that clause in the contract because he wanted him to sign and he wanted to make McKinnon's happy with his first signing and stuff like that. So I do get it, but at the same time, the club should not have announced that the statement was a three-year deal. That's on them. You know what I mean? And they need to show out the communication better with the fans because like it's things like that, like I say, which over time fans will stop trusting what has been told to the bay. And I've already had a re charter thing about the bay, and I've said from day one with James on analytics, analytics won't work because hearts are using it. Um use other stuff before and it's never worked.

SPEAKER_02

I think um no, I actually it's a bit it was a bit of a strange one, eh? Because I think if you take our if you take us all back 12 months, right, when we were doing this, we were a bit we were a bit ambivalent, right, about Shanklin coming back. Like let's be let's be 100% honest about it, right? But when he did sign, we were also very used, right? All three of us, right? We we were because we all knew deep down, right, that he he could be a big player, right? And he and he went on and he didn't. So if you look at everything tight, if you look at it objectively, you think, right, Harts had to do whatever they had to do to try and get him back, right?

SPEAKER_00

So you do get what I'm saying, they do have to be out held accountable for something.

SPEAKER_02

I do, I do, but I'm just thinking, so we all got together. So Harts is a club and going, right, Lawrence, this is what we'll do. McInnes is also applying pressure to the board as well, saying we must sign Shankland, we must, I need him, I need him. So the board's then going, right, okay, what do we do? So Harts have then gone into those negotiations though with Shankland and his agent as well, his agency is apparently a little bit unscrupulous as well, from what I've been hearing, Cat, right, in terms of what they do and how they how they deal with people, right? So from the club's point of view, I think the deal, the deal is actually semi-sensible, right? Just trying to take the emotion away, right? Because they're thinking we get Chaclin for uh another year, if he's not very good, he's there for another two years. If he is good, well that means Harzloff had a good season, and then yes, he can potentially go to Rangers, right? It does open up the question of did McKinnis know about this squause 12 months ago? That that would be interesting to know.

SPEAKER_00

But that's the thing we won't get told is because it said in our actual statement uh he was only there for one season and he's exited his contract on undisclosed terms, and that was not the statement that they gave when he signed us.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, Cat. So it but so I'd be amazed because you've got to think about this from a relationship point of view with McInnes and the board. If McInnes did not if McInnes didn't know this, this is why I'd be amazed if he never, because if McInnes never knew about this, right, McInnes would be raging. Imagine he's on his holidays and he gets the same message that we get on Saturday. By the way, Shankro's away. So I think McInnes would have been aware of this, Shankon would have been aware of this. What what what is a kick in the balls is that Rangers were maybe made aware of this last summer as well, right? Do you know what I mean? As in through the agency. That was the thing about Hurts, right? That's maybe how they that's maybe how they've been able to come in, though.

SPEAKER_00

So that is what Hart would be saying is that Russell Martin didn't fancy him last season whatsoever, and he turned him down on a free. And uh, they would have expected Russell Martin to still be there next summer, if you know what I mean. So that would have been the expiration of his contract. So surely Rangers won't come in for him again, even if he does have a good season. So that would be my argument to that.

SPEAKER_02

I I feel I feel like Hart's within the reason, okay, maybe about 80% of that deal were correct and that.

SPEAKER_00

But but I mean as far as 90%, mate, to be fair.

SPEAKER_02

In hindsight, though, right? It does seem I'm thinking to myself, right, because he was gonna leave anyway, right? And hindsight's amazing, right? You think imagine it hadn't re-signed with Jamestown, maybe got two or three different kinds of players, maybe spread the goals around, right? Blah blah blah, right? But yeah, the club need the club, the way they communicated that deal, Gab, you're right, because everybody thought it was a three-year contract, right? So we've all been thinking that Shanglin here for probably the remainder of his best years, unless someone comes in with a couple of million, and and and also to happen the week after the league, that that's just taking the Mickey, like, it's taking the Mickey. So it's a tough one. Part of me is thinking the deal did make sense, but Hartz should have communicated it better, but I'm not so sure because if it said it wasn't said underscore's terms, because that riled me up even more.

SPEAKER_00

If he actually turned around and admitted to what actually was on the deal and said this is why it's I'm just thinking, no gap.

SPEAKER_02

See, last summer, if they said it's a year with a two-year option, right? Or do you know what I mean? We'll we'll we would we would have spent the season saying, Oh, are we gonna leave? Who's he talking to? And then, like, if he didn't play very well, we'd be saying, Oh, he's he's keeping himself for Rangers. Now, to be fair to Shanglin, he has had a brilliant season, right? And he is trying in every game, he's scored four goals against Rangers this season, so he hasn't done anything in terms of um you know down and tools, right? But he has been playing maybe to the pinnacle because he knew he had a chance to go to Rangers, right? But we know there's no loyalty in the game anymore, mate, and we know he's a Rangers fan.

SPEAKER_00

So But loyalty doesn't even bother me as much, to be fair. It's more how he went about it.

SPEAKER_02

It's the way that we're not getting sweet FA like my the pun from uh maybe the club, maybe the club gave him maybe the club gave him too much, maybe the club gave him too much. So to go for I don't know to go for free, to go for free is is is just a clip in the store.

SPEAKER_00

I don't see how Hart's gonna said like you can leave uh without us uh but it has to be like at least 10% of what we might have made of here, something like that, you know what I mean? Someone even something, even like a hundred grand would have been nice, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02

Just to like say, but Harts were maybe thinking off the back of his poor season under Trixley Rogar. He maybe has maybe if he has a season when he maybe scores 10, right? He'll he'll still stay. But Shankland has gone and had this really, really good season, right? So Shankland has used that to spur himself on.

SPEAKER_03

I see I see well that's the thing though, this is this is the thing, right? Is that I get what you're saying. Like he might have an okay season, but at the end of the day, he's had that that's his third good season in four and four.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

And he's having a manager, a proven manager behind him. And this is the thing, is to me, the bit that doesn't make sense, and this is where the club should be should be criticized, is it never ever makes sense because again, we know that he can leave for free. So we have a year where we know that this within this year that he we are not gonna get a we are not gonna get a penny for him, and it's probably why nobody would have came in from in January. Well, one the everybody thinks he signed a three-year deal, so they think that they're gonna have to spend money on him, and then I reckon, and I'm gonna use the word allegedly, that his agent will have informed Glasgow Rangels that if you do want Lawrence, you're probably better waiting till the summer because the clause is there, and you can go and get Lawrence for free as long as you do it by the 3rd of July. Okay, so at that point there was no safeguarding against a against sign about signing Lawrence Shankland up for a long period of time because you had this point where you could get him for free, where there was no way of selling them, unless somebody had offered four million pounds for him in January and away he went. There was no way that you were going to get him once the first of February turned up, you're gonna get any money for him, because if it was any sniffing about the first bit of contact between the agent and it the agent and the club uh the the buying club, all the agent has to say is by the way, don't he bother Lawrence is Lawrence can be free up until the third of July, and then basically you can sign him for you sign him for free, you can give him a wee bit more money, you can give me a bigger cut and Boom and the the club have just been screwed at the best the best striker in the last in the last 20-30 year.

SPEAKER_02

So do you think he still would have gone if we'd won the league?

SPEAKER_03

Yes.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, but actually. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah. And this is the thing, mate. This is here's the thing, mate. So he is a Rangers fan, and you totally understand why he why he would leave, why he wants to go and play for Rangers. For me, the bit it's the kick in the nuts because of how highly I had him I have him had him on a pedestal, how good he was, how much of the heartbeat of this team he was, and how many goals he was. And you what you actually seen is you've seen that obviously he had a really bad season under Neil Kitchley. Okay, and this is a man that told Lauren Shanklin that he could leave, and the World Cup probably screwed him over as well, and then everything else. And he did have he had he had his bad season, the fans were on his back, Nick really wanted them. We gave up we gave him that chance. McKinnis came in and he turned it, he got back to back to his his form, and they asked Failures as well when he got injured. Because I believe if he hadn't got injured, he probably would have been he probably would have scored 25 goals. Oh, easily. And we probably would have been champions and everything else, but that's who what's in whatever. Right? And then did they when you once you got over that you think okay, fine, like he's away. It means that we're not having the we've no we've there's any speculation now. He's left. Also, if the claims teams knew about the break clause, if it was a one-year contract, we are plus two at the end, we would have spent January right through to whenever we'll probably pay his injury and depending on whatever saying, right? Well Shanklin can go on a pre-contract, and then that might have destabilised the whole thing as well. So the club their defence would have been that they've tried to give this three-year deal as the way to try and as a obviously to fend people off, but all it takes is what's happened is that the agent has gone and let because it must have has let Rangers know, because there must have been six people that knew about that. Two or the two or three people that have been in the in the meeting negotiating that contract, McKinnon, Shankund, and the agent that would have known about this clause and then basically has allowed this to then happen, which is fine. He's no our player anymore. We'll get it.

SPEAKER_02

So that worked for that's interesting, Andy, because I wonder if it's almost like if another club had had come in. Anyone, anyone just aye.

SPEAKER_03

It's not, it wasn't it wasn't a Ranger-specific clause, it was a clause, a break clause after one year.

SPEAKER_02

But what I'm saying, Rangers, like you say, Rangers would be the club, right? That the agent would be having the discussions with to give them the heads up.

SPEAKER_03

I I and like, and that's the thing is you can't you can't accuse him of doing tools because he didn't. He's he he was scoring goals right up to the last game. Okay, so you can never ever accuse him of downing any tools. The bit that maybe sits in the back of my throat though is that at some point within this title running he's instructed he's instructed his agent um to go and say to Rangers, by the way, I'm free. So at what at what point has that happened? Because that's not happened that's not happened. I don't nah, I think it's I don't know if it's happened pre-split. It's maybe happened the pre-split because apparently Danny Rowland Rangers have come out and said that the it was around the split time is when they decided they wanted Shanklin. So I don't know if they've then contacted Agent to say what's the Lauren Shankland's availability, and it's happened then, and that's when they've been informed he's free. Um but um that's the thing is and the the heartbreaking thing is that Lauren Shankland over the last four years has given me some of the best moments supporting hearts and god knows how many of out with cup finals that goal at Easter Road, the goal at Easter Road, for example. Um some of the other goals again, some of the other goals that he has scored, like and this is and this is the thing, and it will it'll probably will take time to to be able to watch those goals again and to enjoy them because again, as a I especially after what happened the week before, it definitely just feels that little bit raw. But does it does it then allow us to maybe change the way that we play? Because I think that James I think that Jamestown has had we talk about Lauren Shanklin's replacement, but I think Lauren Shanklin's replacement was signed last summer and has scored nearly one or two goals less than him last season and was named play the player of the year um over all the all the different awards because I think they used what they wanted in a player, they used the analytics to sign Claudio Braga. Yes, um, so and that's that's well not but aye because he kind is because he's a different player though.

SPEAKER_00

So you've got Braga there is what I'm gonna say is uh it's a type of player that was suit playing alongside Shaglin, yeah. So that's what would love to be analytics, so that's how the players were sort of designed for.

SPEAKER_03

But what we also did as a team, I thought I felt last season is that because as Braga started to show what Braga could do, I thought that we had we became to a point where we thought we were basically playing formations and ways to make sure that Braga and Shanklin played both played, and sometimes it might have it might have stopped us maybe being a bit better in the midfield.

SPEAKER_02

And I know that obviously I I I I agree with that, Andy. I I think and just listening to you the other mate, like for for four four seasons now, hey, we basically the the the kind of the cornerstone of the team has been shampled, right? And quite rightly so, right? There's no reason for it not to be, right? Because he's a he's a brilliant player, right? But there he has got, and this is not me just saying this now, but like because he's got the Rangers, right? But we have kind of you know, we know he's got he can be quite slow, you know, he's got a tendency to maybe put on a couple of pounds, he's not that you know not the pace, yes, physicality and everything, right? So it does mean not that he is not gonna you can't replace him because he's such a good player, you just you can't replace that level of goals and you can maybe change the style that you play, and especially now with our midfield getting a kind of reject as well, like Kame and Benny moving on, right? It might allow the club to change its style in terms of kind of pace and width and the kind of strikers that we have. But um, it's it's still it's I think I think the start of next season, though, I think it's gonna take a little while just to kind of transition away from you know Shangland being the school club because you know, even for McKinnex, you know, everything kind of geared, and even you see it now, Black guard gets the ball, where shanks Kenya gets the ball, where shanks, you know, it's like their instinct, we're shanks, you know what I mean? Yeah, but it might take it might take time, but in a way, that might be why it's maybe an advantage that quite a few of these kind of legacy players are moving on because it allows a complete a complete reset, a complete reset, you know.

SPEAKER_03

Well, that's it as well. So you've obviously got um obviously Shanklin's leaving, and then obviously Benny, Frankie Kent, Alan Forrest, and uh Lewis Nielsen have all announced today that they are they're they're leaving the club as well because their contracts have expired. No mention of Cammy Devlin and no mention of Cake Gordon yet. Um and I think I wonder if they'll be maybe until after the World Cup.

SPEAKER_02

I wonder if in Cammy's case is just as simple as they're maybe still in discussions with him, mate.

SPEAKER_00

I think it's just because they're at the World Cup, to be honest with you. Before we announce anything. Because thoughts are that it's gonna be Gordon Marshall, is it not? Is that right?

SPEAKER_02

Right, okay.

SPEAKER_00

Apparently so. I because Paul Gallagher's left, eh? Um and it was Venvi, uh, Gordon Marshall is replacing him, but is there maybe thoughts that could be Gordon? I don't know.

SPEAKER_03

No, I think Gordon wants from what I heard this day, Green Gordon still wants to play another year. Um still wants to be involved for another year.

SPEAKER_00

I wouldn't be asking that to be unfair.

SPEAKER_03

Um I think though it's gonna be Gordon Marshall because I think McKinnist wants his own man in there as well. Um the Devlin one, I think Hartzov went back with another offer. Um, so I don't know what's what with Devlin, I don't know if he's waiting for maybe to see how his World Cup goes as well.

SPEAKER_00

Uh partly but sort of USA teams, so if he's over it anyway, he might call two birds of one stone while he's there, eh? You know what I mean? Yeah and happy as well.

SPEAKER_03

Well, I as I say that's it's it's all it's a weird one, and you're right. I mean Clemens right, some of these players that have been um have been there for a while, that it they are leaving. We are getting a wee bit more of a clear out. I think we are going to get we are going to see some more rumour is Chesnikov could be another one that's maybe out the door. Um there's a lot of paper talk about that, although there I still need somebody in the record to do that.

SPEAKER_00

But at the same time, I'm I've done find I'd be sub, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03

Right. I mean, but he's only has only been there for six months, and a lot of these players need do need time to bear down. To be fair, I've seen somebody in Kazakhstan on in the record. I don't know who I think he was a I think it was an extra, but yeah, yeah, I mean telling him not to go and tell him to stay where he is because he's it'll be a failure basically if he if he comes back to his tail between his legs already. And I think that it is going to be a big pre-season uh for a lot of these people. There is going to be um there is going to be lots of other lots of changes as as we are well. I think we've seen quite a few today in regards to that. You see, Gallagher's leaving, Golden Marshall probably will be announced very soon. Um we've got our first signing of the summer confirmed. Obviously, we do know that James McPeak is coming in, but has that'll be um it's not officially announced yet. I don't well it has technically, um and then MJ Campson Kimara is coming up from York. Um six figure some apparently um from what defender as well.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Um obviously I think that's probably Craig Halkett replacement because I don't think Craig Halcott's going to be playing anytime before uh February. Yeah. Um so it's Tamara, you've got uh Tom Renault, and I think they're waiting for just to him for him to be announced uh quite soon as well. Um what are you thinking about this rebuild coming up then, Gavin Fleming?

SPEAKER_02

I'm looking I'm looking forward to it. I I I think as much as um some of the older players had had really, really good seasons uh last season, Andy. I'm I'm quite especially with um Benny and Cammy, like I'd be really happy if Cammy got a new deal, right? But part of me wouldn't think it's the end of the world if he never stayed, because part of me is excited to see what the Hearts of the Field could be like with a totally different style. And I just mean with maybe you know, more forward-thinking progressive players that can maybe not that Benny and Cammy's I mean what they do is phenomenal. Cami was having an amazing season until his injury, um just slightly more progressive players, maybe they can play a bit more of a forward pass, everything like that. So I'm I'm actually looking forward to it. I think we're gonna have it's maybe gonna be up there with like oh five, oh six, I think, maybe ten plus sign-ins, you know, looking at a right back, centre back, centre mid, wingers, a couple of forwards. It's gonna be it's gonna be interesting. Um if we get Calvin Miller, I like the sound of that. I think he'd he'd be decent. But there's gonna be quite a lot of names popping up all over the place as uh Jamestown goes into overdrive, I think.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, so there was who was the one Kennedy shared one today, and then you shared it, and Kennedy got Kennedy got a bit snippy because you didn't read it, but he'd already shared that.

SPEAKER_02

Um strikes, uh French, a French striker is it? Uh Amadou Basi.

SPEAKER_00

Uh you had a screen here somewhere, but I've lost it.

SPEAKER_02

Amadou Basi with all these names, aren't we every day, and it's gonna be it's gonna it's gonna be uh it's gonna be it's gonna be a busy summer. Like I think I'll even through the World Cup, I think it'll be a busy summer with names popping up left, right, and centre. Sorry, I got mixed up.

SPEAKER_03

So Campson Kimara's come through LinkedIn, and it's a Fagan Walcott as to the they're bit they've had a bid turned down already from York City.

SPEAKER_02

Um so and again, like you know what's interesting, these these are maybe not the most exotic sounding clubs uh as well, Andy, right? But but we know this is what the Jamestown model is. So, you know, seasons gone by, you might be like, Oh, we're trying to sign a boy from like York, you'd be a bit like you know, I'm brilliant, do you know what I mean? But we now know though, you know, Jamestown has obviously done its work and the body of evidence is there. Now, listen, we know there's gonna be duds. You you mentioned Chesnacop there, right? But not even Brighton or USG have got a hundred percent success rate with the James. Cabori might have to be. I like him, Dav.

SPEAKER_00

I'm saying difficult.

SPEAKER_02

Five goals, five goals last season. I think he'll be alright. So um, yeah, no, I'm I'm actually quite I'm I'm quite looking forward to the summer rebuild, and that's when you'll start putting the disappointment at the end of the season and Shank will leave him behind us, right? When the the players, the names start to drop, the more exotic players come in, there might be a million pounds plus spent again, AJ might come back from injury, you know, the Champions League draw, be finalised, and it'll all start to kind of fall into place again. It will all be rare to go, it'll be rare to go for every season.

SPEAKER_03

And this is one thing. Do you think there's an Evan Ferguson-sized gap in our team? So Ferguson obviously very highly rated that he's been very highly rated at Brighton. He started off quite well. Injuries have taken him a wee step back a bit. He went to Roma last season, didn't hit the ground running. Celtic were tried to sign him last pre-season, but Uncle Tony said no and sent him to Italy. Instead, now everything that happened last year and our top goal scorer leave in. Do you think there's maybe a wee possibility that Uncle Tony sends him up up here for a season?

SPEAKER_02

Right, but I think he said I think he said for the right I think he said for the right deal, Gab. I don't think he 100% ruled out players being loaned from from Brighton.

SPEAKER_00

I think it was talking about Hart's players going down there as well, possibly.

SPEAKER_03

He owns he's a majority shareholder of one, he's a minority of the other. I mean, you sell it, you sent Elton Kabangu over to USG when we needed a striker. So you never know if he's got the bit between his teeth, and he thinks and the analytics look that Ferguson could be a could do a job in the SPFL, then and we've lost our best striker for for plums, then you you never know. Like this is the thing I'm thinking is that the laddie needs the laddie's gonna go out and loan because he's probably not gonna get a game for Brighton next season. So it's uh it's well, I think it's well within the possibility. It's in my head anyway, until he goes somewhere else, and I'm feeling a bit disappointed. I'm all in on Evan Ferguson. Um, but I'm not gonna give us some right. Let's bung four of them up here. Let's see how it goes. But um you mentioned Killer Noenhoff, nothing's happened for him yet. Like, and I've got to go and listen to all the predictions for next week's next week's one to do the roundup, and I know that I picked him to be the most improved for this season.

SPEAKER_02

So mate, you could listen, mate. You you you you predicted second as well, or you got second, so you can just sit back and you can take the acclaim, you can take the acclaim the predictions champion.

SPEAKER_03

I we've taken no acclaim for that, thank you very much. Um, but yeah, just to finally round off, then obviously the world cup's coming up. This is probably might be all probably go a bit more intermittent through the World Cup, but obviously K Gordon's been called up to the World Cup. Uh Devlin is going to the Australia Initial Squad, and obviously James Wilson's been training with them up until they go away, and Leon McFarland is actually going to America, so there is some harsh representation, and we'll also get a percentage of any money should roll be called up, so that's not too bad in regards to that. Um and Kizzy got his first Greece call-up, um, and then the usual Chesney and Kobore got their normal cause up call-ups for Kazakhstan and Bukhina Faso. But Mattle's been called up. How is he getting a call-up? Is you're telling me there isn't a like a player playing in Uganda more regularly than the five minutes that Roger Mattle has played since he signed for Hutts in January.

SPEAKER_02

Maybe the international manager has seen something that Daniel McKinnist hasn't, mate. You know what I mean? We don't we just don't know. We just don't know.

SPEAKER_03

It's wild that he's got his call up, but good luck to him and uh obviously good luck to Kizzy as well, especially if it is he's one that maybe does go in the summer having an interca international cap in there as well can probably bumps up some of the some of the prices as well.

SPEAKER_02

Anything in regards to the internationals before we Kizzy, what what squad has he been called up for Andy? Is it like a couple of friendlies before it starts? Um not what not the actual what the actual is actually what the World Cup squad, not just like friendly.

SPEAKER_03

So he's he's been called up just for the two friendlies that they're international friendlies before they they break. But aye, um which is good. Um another Hearts player that could be at the door um again as old Kenneth Vargas, but he has been told not to come. But basically, he's been involved with like somebody had a gun, and basically Vargas and another couple of his teammates have been um have been told not to uh that they've been banned for playing against England in the first friendly or something as punishment for some incident where a gun.

SPEAKER_02

Oh I love stories like that. We send out a boy alone and he's he's not he's not allowed to play because he's getting involved with like shootouts and stuff and handling firearms.

SPEAKER_03

I think he might be because obviously I think he's gonna be leaving again on loan, so I don't think he's gonna uh uh I don't think he'll be playing for hearts ever again.

SPEAKER_02

Gary Bardas, he looks like the kind of guy that associates with people that carry handguns no way, he's just got that look about him, mate. You can just kind of tell. You can just kind of tell.

SPEAKER_03

He'd have fucking missed anyway, so that he's need absolutely no danger with it. But uh yeah, so basically photos, I'm just reading it now.

SPEAKER_02

The photos in the local pressure one very one very quick thing I was just gonna say, mate, is just um the the World Cup is obviously coming round in uh in a couple of weeks, and um it was actually it's quite hard just now to have any sort of real enthusiasm for it just because of everything that's gone on the last couple of weeks, right? But um for Mr. Mr. Gordon, I am actually delighted that he has managed to get his call up and because he deserves it, and I really, really hope that he gets to start against Haiti because he really deserves it after the way that he's been treated in the previous couple of Euros. Um, you know, I as much as I'm a little bit ambivalent about the World Cup just now because of what's going on with the Jambos, I'm delighted, delighted.

SPEAKER_00

I didn't get injured in the first game at Haiti as well. Would that be too much how?

SPEAKER_02

How do you mean?

SPEAKER_00

Well, if he gets like, you know, uh uh hamstring or someone that keeps him up for the game for like six months or something like that. Well yeah.

SPEAKER_03

But as for Gordon, I don't think unfortunately I don't think he'll play, but I've got a whole different opinion on that and I don't want to get make Steve crack to make me even more angry than I normally do. But uh yeah, I'd like I think Gordon's the best goalkeeper in the squad still. Um but I don't think he'll I don't think he'll play. Uh unfortunately, um but yeah, it's good that he's going, he probably he should be going. Um I kind of got up for the World Cup at the moment, but asked me in about two weeks' time. Um and I certainly I probably will be. Um but yeah, I mean is there anything else, boys, before we we wrap that up?

SPEAKER_00

Uh well done to the woman for winning the league and late for men. To be fair, we deserve his help, even though we lost to him for the last game of the season. I think uh we had a really good season and he did deserve as well. Eh?

SPEAKER_03

We nearly blew it as well because obviously they got beat for Habs, and the luckily the Rangers got beat P.

SPEAKER_00

Right, but we needed to give Eva a good uh a good send off by uh future ex-wife. So um I'm quite happy that uh they did a job at the end day. So fair play to build ladies. Yeah, there we go.

SPEAKER_02

No, it's it's a really good achievement. I think it was a little bit kind of lost a little bit in the the aftermath of everything that was going on with uh the men's team, but they obviously deserve enormous credit for doing that. So a big well done. Big well done.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, absolutely. Um but again, this is probably gonna be our last proper pod uh before the World Cup next week. We will um go ahead and recap our predictions that we made at the the start of the season. Well bumps well this is what I was just gonna say is I'll pop up we I will take nominations off used to in the next day or so, and I will pop up the nominations on the social media for the awards. I don't know if I I don't know if I still want to call in the balloons, or the way I'm feeling about the moment is to refer them back to the Kitchleys. But um we will we will see we'll do that as well for our uh player uh for our for our awards as well, and just to recap the the season and if I get time I might make a quiz because I know how much Fleming loves quizzes.

SPEAKER_02

Um a question ages, mate. I'll be well up for that, be well up for that.

SPEAKER_03

There we go, we'll see we'll see how much we'll see how much time I get over the weekend as well. But yes, um again, thank you for everybody that has been listening to us for the whole season. Um, as we're not quite over yet, um you can get us on all your social media sites, you can get us on X, get us on Facebook, get us on Threads, Instagram, and Blue Sky.

SPEAKER_01

Um get us on as well.

SPEAKER_03

Absolutely get us on all your social media sites. Uh I've just said that because KND's put me off. Get us on all your streaming sites, the good ones and the bad ones as well. If you bumped into Gavin Fleming and the Diggers and bought him a few beers, hope you have been enjoying listening to him. Um just give him a message, he'll definitely be back in the diggers and he will buy you a pint as well. Um, and again, it's been a tough, it's been a tough week, tough two weeks for me. And I've been on a family holiday where with a good support network. Um, so I I can imagine that it has been tough for everybody else. And if there is people that are still devastated from what's happening, whether it be the way what happened at Parkhead, the build-up prior to that with playing against Motherwell and things that this other decisions, whether it's Shanklin Lee Van, whether it's that you're devastated. Alan Forrest isn't he going to be there next season as well. Then as much as don't but as much as a do joke, if there is something there that is bothering you, reach out. If it's something that you're building up, reach out to us, reach out to the professionals as well. You've got the Andy Mans Club, they're where they meet regularly over different locations, you've got breathing space, there's other places as well, there's people that will be happy to listen to you. Um whether it's you want to talk to us about football, we'll happily have a chat to you. That's not an issue as well, anonymously. Whether it's whether it is anyone else, do that, please reach out. If you've not heard from your friend, normally you do talk to the footballer about reach out to them. They might be suffering, and they're suffering in silence and they don't want to feel that they're bothering you. And just let them know that you aren't bothering any they're not bothering anybody because it will a real relief off your shoulders as well. So again, guys, please don't bottle it up. It is good to talk, honestly. Just let it out. And again, that's something that we do, it's something that we all we all we've all gone through over the last two weeks. We've been through the emotional ringer. It's been two weeks, but it's felt like two years. So again, please reach out and again, thank you again for listening. We've enjoyed doing this. We get a good chat, please do that.

SPEAKER_02

And again, thank you very much.

SPEAKER_03

And it's a bye for me.

SPEAKER_02

Uh year for me, and it's a good night for me.