S2E3 - 12 Years of Growth, Friendship, and Understanding

In this episode, we explore the nuances of friendship, neurodivergence, and personal growth through our candid stories about our friendship journey, communication styles, and the importance of understanding and acceptance.

Chapters and Timestamps

00:00 Introduction and Friendship Dynamics
02:49 Exploring the Origins of Our Friendship
05:40 Memorable Moments and Shared Experiences
08:38 Understanding Each Other's Perspectives
11:28 The Impact of Time on Our Friendship
14:27 Navigating Communication Differences
17:33 Reflections on Growth and Connection
24:33 Navigating Memory and Trauma
29:30 Communication Styles and Neurodiversity
34:37 Healing from Childhood Experiences
39:40 Understanding and Defending the Inner Child
53:45 Empowerment and Advocacy in Neurodivergence

RESOURCES

Mental Health Resources

• 988 Suicide & Crisis Lifeline
• Therapy for Black Girls
• Inclusive Therapists
• Clinicians of Color

Neurodivergent Resources

• ADDitude Magazine
• Attention Deficit Disorder Association (ADDA)
• Association for Autism & Neurodiversity (AANE)
• The Color of Autism Foundation
•  Understood
• Job Accommodation Network (JAN)

CONNECT WITH US

Fan Page: Fanlist.com/BGBGSquirrel 

IG: @BGBGSquirrel

Threads: @BGBGSquirrel

Email: BGBGSquirrel@Gmail.com

Transcript

Speaker 1 0:00

Hey, hey, welcome to Black Girl, Brown Girl, Squirrel, your go-to spot for women of color that are neurodivergent. We're your hosts, Shai and Alexis, two neurodivergent sister friends just trying to figure it all out.

Speaker 2 0:14

So grab your favorite snack, sit back, relax, and let's squirrel together.

Speaker 0:22

Hey squirrel. Hello, Shai.

Speaker 2 0:29

How you doing, Lex? I'm doing pretty good. I got my nails done. I'm fresh, you know. I've I feel better.

Speaker 1 0:40

And they cute too, y'all. They real cute. Well, I I glued mine on last night and polished them.

Speaker 2 0:51

That counts. It counts.

Speaker 1 0:54

So yeah. Uh yeah, that's that's what I did. So, but yeah, your nails real cute, real cute. So you're doing all right today, huh?

Speaker 2 1:04

Yeah, I feel pretty good. I gotta go to work tomorrow. I don't really want to think about that, but I feel pretty good.

Speaker 1 1:11

Look, let's let's turn that let's turn that frown upside down.

Speaker 1:19

You're getting paid. I'm earning that check. Yeah, but but you know what? You're gonna have a check. You're gonna bring it home.

Speaker 2 1:30

Okay. At some point. In all honesty, yes. I have a job because people don't. I'm just not for lack of trying, so you're right. Let me check that. Let me check that.

Speaker 1 1:45

Okay, you know you made me think of NCT fact check, right? Check those facts, but check that. I hate that song. Song stresses me. You hate all of my NCT. I can't sting. I don't.

Speaker 2 1:57

I don't hate all of NCT at all. But that song is noise music.

Speaker 1 2:02

See, so for those of you that don't know, we're both into K-pop, and NCT127 is one of my favorite groups. It is my favorite group. BTS is Lex's favorite group. But she doesn't always like the music that my group puts out. And I pretty much like everything that BTS puts out. So I think her devotion is just as a friend is a little lacking. I'm just saying. I did go see BTS's. Well, I mean, I I have to say, I I I do love me some BTS. She's like, I think you like I'm the I'm the one who stands BTS and you got all the BTS things. I'm like, yes, yes, I do.

Speaker 2 2:39

She has so much stuff. I was like, I didn't know you could buy that. I didn't know.

Speaker 1 2:44

Yeah, I did.

Speaker 2 2:45

Also, you trying to talk about me. I'd have been to two NCT concerts. I've only been to one BTS concert. Matter of fact, I'm lying. I've been to three if you consider that there's different iterations of NCT.

Speaker 1 3:00

So you saw NCT 127 and NCT Dream?

Speaker 2 3:04

Uh-huh. And I saw 127 twice.

Speaker 1 3:07

Yes.

Speaker 2 3:08

And not to mention Super M, which is NCT Taemin. So how to see it all.

Speaker 1 3:17

Oh my God. The clips from Taemin at Coachella have been like.

Speaker 3:24

Yeah. He's like, I haven't even seen it.

Speaker 2 3:28

I gotta like.

Speaker 1 3:28

I thought I oh, well, I sent it to you guys.

Speaker 2 3:31

Just because you sent it. Don't mean I sent it.

Speaker 1 3:33

Don't mean I seen it. Because you be like, she done sent the most stuff in the group chat. I'm done. So you know what? Today's topic, our topic for this episode and the next one is talking about our friendship. So now you see how our friendship works. She don't be respecting her older friend. No, I'm just kidding. But I do. She she she really tunes out again. This shows you how our brains work, right? Because I show my love and I'm like, oh, this is funny, or this is cute, or my friends are like this. And she's like, nope, not looking at it. Done. Unless I specifically say it has something to do with a member of BTS or specifically about something that I know she will be super interested in.

Speaker 2 4:18

You still have to catch me on a good day. Because just because, you say it's about something I'm interested in, don't mean I feel like watching something.

Speaker 1 4:23

Well, that's true too, because Lord knows. Uh yeah, I got texts I got to get caught up on from last week. I've had a thing where every few weeks I would check in on a group of friends. Um, I have a a list of friends that I just check in. I called my sister check-in list. And so last week I sent messages and then I got messages back, and I was like, oh, I forget I get all these messages back, and now I gotta read them.

Speaker 2 4:46

So that's funny.

Speaker 1 4:51

So yeah, that part. So, and I like to make sure I give everybody their due attention, right? So, yeah, so now I gotta go back through.

Speaker 2 5:00

So, for this episode, part of what we wanted to talk about.

Speaker 1 5:04

That means she's trying to get me on track.

Speaker 2 5:06

Go ahead. Hey, most definitely, y'all don't understand. I have a short timeline before I shut down and I'm like, I ain't got no more words, so what you gonna do? Um I was trying to think, how do we even become friends in the first place? Because first of all, I don't remember. Like, I remember meeting you, I remember the first impression I had of you. But I don't really remember our progression into friendship. Do you? I don't remember none of that.

Speaker 1 5:34

That's so funny. But it's it's just, you know what? Um, in all honesty, I don't know what it is with I don't know if it's the ADHD brain, I don't know if it was everything that I had been going through in the last few years, and I just I just don't remember some things. Um, you know, like it's just as a quick sidebar, there was um someone who she was friends with a a friend of mine, and um you know, we saw each other and she's like, Don't you remember me? And I was like, I kind of remember your name, but I don't she was somebody I knew from way back home. Here I am in Atlanta. I left home when I was 27. So I left California at 27. So here she is showing up in the late 2000s. Like, I remember her, and I'm like, I mm, okay. And I was like, you know, she was like, we used to hang out all the time and do this and that. She thought I was slighting her, and I wasn't. It was just that at the period of time she was hanging out with me, I was going through some trauma, and so there's parts of that, those few years of my life that I completely blocked out. I remember certain, certain things, but I don't remember all the people. If I wasn't around you, like literally almost every day, I probably wouldn't have remembered that person. And she was kind of offended, and I was like, mm-hmm. So I mean, honestly, during that time when we connected, I know um my favorite red Phoebe was the one that connected us. That's how we met, was still a mutual friend. But um, I don't recall us really hanging out that much. I don't recall how it progressed. I just know that it did. And then we ended up going on a trip together a couple of years ago, and I was like, not you jumping all the way to the beach trip.

Speaker 2 7:38

That's so funny.

Speaker 1 7:41

So you know, and that means so we've known each other and been in each other's circle for what 10, 12 years?

Speaker 2 7:52

Probably about 12, because yeah, I would have been around starting 2014. So yeah, 12 years.

Speaker 1 7:57

Yeah. So yeah, we've been in each other's sphere and circle and hung out and all that stuff. I just don't remember the overall progression. I just remembered that at some point, like we like kind of adopted each other somehow, and the and the trip kind of like solidified it in a way.

Speaker 2 8:21

Um I find this happens to me often that the moment when other people feel like our friendship was solidified, in my mind, it happened before that. Now, I do know that often people with autism, their understanding of friendship sometimes is a little bit different, and understanding when people are just being like regular, polite, and friendly, and like actually being full on in a friendship with them. Uh-huh. So, like, ain't no way in the world I would have went on no beach trip with you if I didn't think we was already locked in. If I didn't think we was already that close, I ain't going to the beach with you.

Speaker 1 8:59

That's not happening. It's crazy. I just, and and you know what? And I'll be perfectly honest, and maybe because that was just a memorable something for me, right? That that was because, okay, so let me let me let me throw this out there. So we always talk about like right when the pandemic hit, um uh Alexis was supposed to go see BTS with a friend of ours. They had tickets to go see. And the pandemic hit and they couldn't go, and I think that's why you couldn't go.

Speaker 2 9:30

Um that tour was on hold, and then it finally got canceled. But for a while, the tickets were still valid. The show was just kind of postponed until further notice.

Speaker 1 9:40

Yes, and our friend had to have surgery. So she sent me an email and everything, and she said, Shy, I don't care what you do, make sure Alexis goes to this concert. Here go the tickets and everything you need to know. Make sure she goes. And I'm like, Oh, okay. I wasn't into K-pop at the time. So I was like, Okay, fine. She wants to go see BTS. I knew who BTS was, but I was like, all right. And so that when I think back on that, I'm like, somewhere prior to that, that that connection happened. Otherwise, she wouldn't have entrusted me with that, right? To say, take our little sister to the concert and make sure she has a good time. And that just wouldn't have been entrusted to me. But I can't remember where that final bond came. And it and for me, a lot of times when I feel that way about people, it feels like you were just always in my life. And I don't necessarily remember the before so-and-so. It was just, you know, like you were there. So I know we had to have hung out and done things, but I when I remember pivotal when I have pivotal memories, things like core memories that get unlocked. Our first beach trip together was a core memory that was unlocked. Yeah. And it was something that was. Oh no, no, go ahead.

Speaker 2 11:02

It was something that what now?

Speaker 1 11:04

I was like, I think it at that time it was something that we all needed. Mm-hmm. And I know for me, it allowed me to just breathe, to be away from everything and just breathe because so much had happened. We went on that trip in what 22, 23? Uh it was we went 23-24 and we didn't go last year.

Speaker 2 11:33

Okay, 23-24.

unknown 11:37

24-25.

Speaker 11:39

Yeah. Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

Speaker 1 11:42

We did go last year. So it was 24-25 because that's when Jazz and I found out we were going to Jakarta. Was on our way to the last trip. That's right. Well, at any rate, we went.

Speaker 2 11:55

No, okay. Yeah, but what I'm I think so much had happened during that time that Yeah, the the the time period between 2019 to current has been just an onslaught of foolishness for bookwork. Everybody. Like I know personally, yeah, I know the things that you have been through, our friends, our family. It has just been constant. So it has been sort of a blur in some ways. So it would make sense that as our friendship got closer, we didn't really see it happening. It just kind of did. Um, now I do know in the beginning of it, like you met me, I was a baby. I was in my early 20s. So it's also probably you seeing me as like truly like a younger sister because I was a literal baby. So our dynamic might have been different anyway. Like, I think in recent years, it might have been more reciprocal. Like, we might be both getting friendship out of this as opposed to maybe what make looks more like a mentor mentee sort of thing. Um, as we've gotten to know each other better, and I've even had time to mature in various ways, and just us getting to know each other better and being able to add something to each other's lives. And I also think that in a lot of ways we were close to people around each other. Like I had friends that were your friends. Okay, I was friends with your mama. Your mama is my home. Yes, you were. Very much so. She has helped me with a lot of different things, like growing as a woman spiritually, just being my friend, being my other grandma, being my other mama. And when I moved to my first apartment by myself, all my dishes, your mama dishes. I didn't buy them dishes. They came from your mama. I still got a pot that she gave me. I'm like, that's my good pot. I like that pot.

Speaker 1 13:53

You know what? And you're right, because my mom told me to help her pack up the dishes because she was giving them to you. And it was so funny because when I was over at your house one time, I was getting something to eat and I looked in and I was like, I know these dishes. And you go, um, they're your mama's dishes. And I was like, Yeah. So I do remember that. I do remember the the time the one thing that stands out that I think for me that kind of started bringing us a little bit closer was um your grandmother took ill at one point. And you were crushed. And I remember um we were at our place of worship and you were in the bathroom and you were crying. And I just I wanted to grab you and hug you, but I was like, well, she's got these people around her. I just so I just said a little something to let you know I was thinking about you. And I think after that, I started texting you, and from there I felt like that's probably for me where it grew. Because I'm like, I'm thinking back on different things. And then, of course, once I started getting into Korean dramas and and K-pop and stuff, you gave me my whole checklist of listen to these groups and listen to them in this order. And I listened to one group and I just went down a rabbit hole and I listened to all the groups, and you're like, how do you even know those groups? Those are like Gen 2, and I'm like, Gen what? He was like, I don't have time to go through the PowerPoint. I don't did it. Just know you went further back in history than I did when I first started. I said starting one group and you don't went through 20 of them, and then I ended up with 20 boys as my bias group, but that's a whole nother story. Um, but it's so to me, I think it's interesting because, like you said, um when I think back to like life pre-COVID, like 2019, I did a whole lot of stuff in 2019. Like I remember trips I took, I remember parties I gave, people I hung out with, different things. That's when we did our little makeup thing at the house with, you know, our friends. We had the little sister day with the makeup thing. Um, I don't know if you were able to make it to that one. I didn't.

Speaker 2 16:11

I didn't go, I didn't go today. I didn't go to that.

Speaker 1 16:14

Uh no, I think you might have been. No, no, no, no, no. I think you were out of town because I think we did it like around like one of the holidays or something where everybody was gonna be there, but I think you went to Augusta. But um, but I just remember like that year, it seemed like everybody was like living life to the full that year for some reason. Like everything, everybody was going everywhere and doing all the things that year.

Speaker 2 16:36

2019 was I was having a good time.

Speaker 1 16:40

I had a blast in 2019. I had a ball. And then all of a sudden, everything shut down. And I think our our I think our relationship and connection to time definitely changed because of that. Not liter just literally because everything shut down and you had a hard time keeping track of stuff because you're like, okay, I'm not going into my usual routines, but I still gotta remember to get up and log into work. Um, I still have to, you know, remember to do grocery shopping. So I might have to do Instacart or whatever the case may be. But it was just weird. And so, and for me, be also because that was only a couple of years after I had, you know, my husband's mother and then his younger sister passed, and then we full-blown charged into uh illnesses and all kinds of things. Like we managed to avoid COVID for years, but other stuff was going on, you know. And that just warped time. But the beach trip for me was when I felt like I felt like I truly stepped into my my place, if you will, because I'm the oldest in the group, so I stepped into my place as Uni, as the big sister, as the, you know, I'm gonna make sure y'all eat. Jazz made sure we have sufficient things to drink. Jennifer made sure we have plenty of sunscreen and all that stuff. Protect her.

Speaker 2 18:13

That lady, that lady got so much sunscreen. We will never subscribe to the lie that black people don't need sunscreen. Not if you around Jen. You're gonna put the sunscreen on. You're gonna protect her. And I thank her. I thank her.

Speaker 1 18:30

She had every kind of sunscreen. Yeah, she had every kind of sunscreen for every kind of skin type, um, from the expensive to the not so expensive, the stuff that's not gonna make you look ashy. Um and and then Lex was like, look, I'll okay, I'll clean up because I'm not trying to do nothing. And we was like, bet. And that was just that that was we each kind of fell into our little roles without even having to say it. That that's the other thing that made it so comfortable. So, you know, even thinking about through the years, I don't feel like there was a hiccup to our friendship.

Speaker 19:08

I will say that I felt very close to you when we went to go see Epic High.

Speaker 1 19:18

One, because we loved Epik High. And you were like, you need to go see Mothragen in person. Mithra Jin. And I was like, don't call it meaning Mothra. Mithra Jin.

Speaker 2 19:31

Is it Mothra from something else?

Speaker 1 19:35

Yes, Mothra is Godzilla. See, that's that brain with stuff don't collect, don't connect right. No, Mothra is the is a creature in Godzilla that Godzilla falls in love with. That's a whole other story. Mithra. Yeah, that man was fine. He was worth going to see. But that's when you and I had some of, I felt like our deepest conversations around just you and understanding you. And you were explaining to me um what it was like to be um a person with autism and what like how sometimes some of the things I say you really didn't understand. Like when I said your house felt very warm, you was like, I don't understand that concept. And I was like, oh, okay, so how would I explain this to somebody? Um, and it kind of makes me go and think about like when I was very deep into um deaf culture and deaf studies, that's D-E-A-F people, um, and doing sign language and stuff. Um, you know, a lot of times there was colloqu colloquialism. See, I can't even give my words right, and I'm trying to use my SAT words, but there were colloquialisms or there were different things that we use in everyday vernacular slang language that they didn't use. And we might sign and I might sign and say something, and they're like, huh? And now you gotta explain it. And you're like, and because their language is a visual language, so it's based on your facial expressions, your body, and your all these different things, you're like, okay, so how do I like if I were to say bet, well, bet to them means like I am betting on something, and I'm like, so how do you explain this? So that's when we had that conversation, that's when I started really thinking about our connection and our communication in that way. And that's how I knew flash forward these few years, like because it was that was only a couple of years ago, maybe what, two years ago.

Speaker 2 21:52

Um that's barely, because it was actually like almost a year to the date of of the show of this show. Show started because I remember I um I took a screenshot. I was like, hey, the day that we had this conversation, could we like sent a text after we got home from the show? Just like thank you so much. Yeah, cool conversation. And like I think we finished like the fourth episode of season one, like to the date of that show. And at the time of that conversation, I was not supposed to be on this show. I was not supposed to be hosting this show. So so much could change in here, y'all.

Speaker 1 22:25

No, because I had somebody else in mind, and unfortunately, there was things that went down there, and the only other I say I know I say this often, but it's literally the only other person I said I can envision doing this show with was Lex because I refused to do it alone. I felt like this was not a show, um, a topic or anything that I could talk about alone because there's so we all know there's so much in our community, our neurodivergent space. There's so much to be in a black woman, there's so much to be in a woman, there's so much to be in black. And so we're talking about these things, and I'm like, I can't do this alone. I just can't.

Speaker 2 23:03

Um you say that there's no, you can't think of any like hiccups to our friendship. One thing that I think is a hiccup that happens for me in all friendships is the fact that I remember everything. Because when I just told you that, I said, hey, it was like a year to that we had a hug. You're like, what? And like you genuinely are like, this is the first time you've ever heard this. And I know did you send that to me through text? Yes, we had a whole conversation about it. So here's the thing I know that for one thing, ADHD be kicking your butt when it comes to memorizing stuff. You don't be remembering, you don't be remembering. It's okay, friend. But also, I remember conversations I have with people, communications I have with people, like word for word, verbatim. And I can usually like replay it out pretty perfectly. So that's why the number of conversations I have with people, well, I feel insane. I be like, what are you? We talked about this. We literally talked about this, all of this, and the number of times that people be like, what are you talking about? And I figured this out at a young age. I remember being 14 with my friends and then being like, girl, your memory is crazy. How do you remember that? And I'm like, how do you not? So, like, when people say, How do you expect me to remember that? I'm like, how do you expect me to forget? For me, it's the same difference. I can't, I so even when you're talking about that that person who was uh like in your friend circle from years ago, that scenario happened to me enough times that I stopped bringing it up to people. Do you remember me? Because I realized I remember almost everybody. And people not remembering me is not always personal, but it's hard for it not to feel personal when you're just like, no, we did this, this, and this. And they're like, I don't remember that at all. You look crazy. So I'm like, nah, I'm just it's okay. So sometimes I give other people a chance to remember me first because I'm like, mm-mm, it's okay. I don't want to be in this very awkward conversation where I'm just like, I remember you, and you don't remember me, and I remember everybody. So it yeah, just thought that was funny. And I'm like, yes, girl.

Speaker 1 25:31

It's so funny because with you saying that, it is wild because when I growing up as a kid, I I shared this, I think, in the last episode. I could, I had a photogenic memory, so I could remember stuff that I saw, read, I can remember a room. I and to this day, there's certain things that I do very clearly remember. I actually had to work very hard in therapy when it came to like childhood and stuff, not to solely remember the traumas, like to put forth the effort to truly remember that there were some good things that happened in my life, and the trauma was a like a small, you know, it's a big deal, but it was a small segment of my life. It wasn't my entire life, right? Um, but there I remember I could remember books and pages. I could literally see it and be like it was here. I used to be able to remember conversations the way you did and say, this is what you were wearing. You were standing over here, you were doing it. I used to be able to do all of that. The only thing that I still have close to that is I know, and I know that there are people out there that could probably relate to me. The chaos that I have, that is my room, the mess, I know exactly where everything is. If you were to turn off the light, I can walk into my room in the dark and I know exactly where everything is and can put my hand on it, even if it's in a pile of papers. I and I kind of I felt like I developed that awareness because um, not just because ADHD you can recognize patterns. Now I understand that I can recognize patterns, but also too, like I said, when I was growing up, um, we had our house broken into like three times in a row. So I just learned to quickly assess if somebody's been in my space or not.

Speaker 27:31

And that's just never left. It's just never left me.

Speaker 1 27:38

But yeah, but trying to remember things, and I I find too, and this is now this goes into being a woman, y'all, and getting older. I didn't had the hysterectomy and the menopause and all that stuff, your mind does start to go. You don't remember as well. If you have autoimmune illnesses, you're adding on to something else that causes you not to remember as much. And then as you start taking medication to kind of manage your symptoms for all these other things you're dealing with, like your ADHD, like your anxiety and depression, that will also cause your mind to go in some cases. So, no, I don't always remember things quite as well because I remember too, like I was watching a Korean drama. Uh She Will Never Know. And I was like, Y'all, who is this fine dude named Rowoon? And you was like, friend, we already warned you about Rowoon. And I was like, What? We ain't never talked about him because girl, he is fine. Like, he's my ultimate Korean bias, period. This man is just fine, and so Lex was like, she texted me and was like, here's the receipt. Literally, it was a text from like a year and a half before when they were like, Okay, as you go through and you start learning about them, just watch out. Because we were talking about um Korean singers, they're called idols, but Korean singers who are also actors, and how you'll come across them. And you clearly sent me a text that all y'all was like, you Jazz and uh Jen were like, watch out for this one because he's gonna wreck you. He wrecked me, but yeah, I I didn't even remember that conversation. And Lex was like, Hold on, picture sent into discussion.

Speaker 2 29:38

If I remember correctly, it was like you already said you liked him. You were like, Who's this? And I'm like, we talked about this already. You already asked us who this is. We already told you you already said you liked him. You forgot your own man. That's crazy.

Speaker 1 29:54

I was reintroducing myself to him. Okay. No, but honestly, this I will say that's one of the things that I do appreciate about you. I I understand how some people um, you know, they find certain things annoying about people. You know, they find those of us like myself that talk like you talk too much, you're getting on my nerves, shut up. That can be annoying. I get it. Um, but I appreciate that because I know that if there's something I need to know, um, if there's something that I um I just know I can rely on you and you're gonna be able to provide me the accurate information, period. And I appreciate that. Okay.

Speaker 4 30:40

I'm glad I trust you. You appreciate that.

Speaker 2 30:43

I also think that me understanding um just different kinds of neurodivergent communication styles just in general helped me to maybe reframe some conversations we've had over the years. So listen, we being wrong, we being honest, we being for real. Yeah, um, there were times when I was first getting to know you that I said two things. I said, this lady thinks she knows everything. And the second thing I said was if you tell a story, she got a story to one up your story. What I know now, what I know now is that you don't think you know everything, but if um if we're talking about something and you know anything about it, you're super excited to share. You're really excited to share everything you know about it. And I'm like, got it. So she's not trying to show off that she knows all of this. She's so happy that we're talking about it. And she's like, I'm gonna talk about it. That's number one.

Speaker 31:53

Now, I I don't know how to feel about that.

Speaker 2 31:56

You gonna you're gonna feel okay about it, friend. It's gonna be okay.

Speaker 32:00

No, because um I say that, you know, I was I read an article once. You know, the ironic thing is is that I uh focus on helping people to communicate and lead communication and leadership skills.

Speaker 1 32:26

Um, but of course, that's using a neurotypical brain. And I've since changed my framework and my business to focus on communication and leadership skills for a neurodiverse environment. Um but I read an article that said for those of us that are empaths and AD and have ADHD and things like that, we don't always tell a story or say something, you know, to make it seem like we know everything, or to try to be like a um, you know, because there are people out there that do that to one up. Um we try to do it as a way of connecting because we don't always feel understood. And I felt that way a lot throughout my life. And I think that's one reason why there was always the challenge of people saying, You are talking too much, you're too verbose, you're too this, and you're too that. Because I often felt like I wasn't heard and I wasn't understood. And that goes back to all the way to childhood trauma on up. So it's something I really try to be cognizant of. And then as a trainer, you know, I my job is to stand in front of a room and talk. When there's a topic that I I'm interested in or I know a little something about, or I get excited about, I do want to talk about it. That's why when people start talking about cruising, I it takes everything I have not to talk about cruising. I was in the cruise industry for a long time, absolutely loved it. Um, but I also had to really work hard because I didn't want people thinking I was dominating a conversation. And that can happen too.

Speaker 2 34:14

Um sometimes what can happen is if you're like, okay, I want to share all of this, and if there's any, whether it's conscious or subconscious, trying to connect by like saying all this you know, it can almost come across to me like you're trying to defend and like prove that you know, or like prove that you have something to offer to this. And I'm looking at it like, I already think you're one of the most intelligent women that I know. I already think that you're incredibly smart. You don't have to prove anything to me. You're welcome. The very first impression I had of you, I was just like, this lady is fabulous. Who is this woman who is so well spoken because sometimes get so odd with talking to black people, but this lady is really well spoken. She's in these flowy, bright colored clothing. Sometimes she's got head wraps on, she's got these huge earrings. This lady is so fabulous. She seems so smart. I think she's awesome. So I'm like, you don't have to prove anything to me. You've already shown who you are by just being yourself. You don't have to do anything extra.

Speaker 35:30

Thank you. Oh you're welcome.

Speaker 2 35:32

Man, hey y'all, season two wasn't supposed to be the cry season, but apparently apparently it is, my bad.

Speaker 1 35:41

It's okay because it's something I've struggled with um all my life.

Speaker 35:50

I struggled to I've always struggled to be heard and to be seen. Um and it and to be understood.

Speaker 1 36:06

I didn't feel like people saw me or knew me or understood me. There's times and and so I do want to say this for a lot of us that are out there because when we when we talk about masking and how we cover up things, a lot of times we use different things in order in order to mask. And I think for me, perhaps that was um you know, like in elementary school when when a lot of the kids just didn't seem to take to me, or whatever the case may be, they never challenged me when it came to knowledge, and they never challenged me when it came to um like when you know, being in dance class and things like that. They they wanted me to be the lead dancer, or they wanted me to be the spelling bee champion or whatever the case may be. And I don't know if that's because they didn't want to do it or they felt like they were gonna win if I did something, but I think that's where part of that comes from. And then as I got older, I just learned that I could use words.

Speaker 37:31

I could use words to hurt you. That wasn't a good thing, and I don't condone that at all.

Speaker 1 37:42

But when you read the dictionary as much as I could, I knew I could speak rings around people at that point. I can't do it so much, so now I'm more I ended up becoming more sarcastic as I got older, and that was not a good thing either. But I could use a vocabulary, and it would be standard like, what did you just say? And I'd be like, see, you just stupid, you know, kind of thing. Um a lot of it was defense mechanisms. I didn't know how to protect myself. I couldn't fight off my abusers, trigger warning. So I couldn't fight off my abusers, and I couldn't fight off the kids that were bullying me at school.

Speaker 38:22

But anyway, so I appreciate what you said and it um it just I didn't expect that to hit to hit a spot.

Speaker 2 38:35

Well, I also did not expect it to hit a spot. So I'm sorry if it hit the wrong spot.

Speaker 1 38:41

No, it's okay. Because, right, you said we're we're here to be honest and to be real and uh speak the truth. That's what we're here for, you know. Um, because I'm sure there's other people out there that feel like you, and it's like I didn't understand why I'm feeling like this around the people that I'm around, and now they better understand it's because you know, like you told me, if I like a scent, I really like it, and if I don't like it, I'm going to hate it. There's no shades of gray with you, it's black or white, right? So for you to tell me that when I saw you, I thought this, this, this, this, and this, and this was somebody I knew I wanted to get to know and have in my life that says a lot. Because I do try to be I do try to be an open and warm and welcoming person. And I try, I'm I really have worked hard to make sure that who you see is is that's who I am.

Speaker 39:43

Flaws and all, right? Um and so that's that's helping to heal a piece of me that still sometimes feels like I have to overexplain. Yeah, I can see that.

Speaker 2 40:01

Over-explain might be it. Cause you know, friend, sometimes explaining something we ain't got to to everybody. Everybody isn't need an explanation, everyone isn't owed an explanation, everyone isn't old your time and effort, your mental energy for that for that explanation. And sometimes it's not that they don't understand, they just still ain't on the same page as you.

Speaker 40:25

You're right. Ooh, that's a whole other.

Speaker 2 40:32

But if you have been struggling with from the time you were a child, with not being heard, not feeling seen, especially with situations we're talking about can be like danger, like your your health, your well-being, right? You feel like you do have to explain, but no, you have to listen to me. No, listen. I'm trying to tell, and and I just want to say that in most situations you are not in danger. So in most situations, you don't have to over-explain. In most situations, you don't have to defend there's nothing being defended, you're defending the shy from years ago, and to somebody else who's listening to this being like, ooh, why this feels so personal? You are defending that young person from years ago because nobody defended them when they needed to be defended, but you're not always in danger currently.

Speaker 41:33

Yeah.

Speaker 1 41:36

You know, um, that is so true, and I'm glad you said that because there's actually um Antoine Fisher actually, if you guys are familiar with um the movie Antoine Fisher is actually based off of a young man who had been in the military, um, and him healing himself. And I think that's one of the things we don't necessarily talk about within um the neurodivergent community is we we actually have to do a lot of healing. Healing from being misunderstood, healing from not understanding ourselves, forgiving ourselves for making decisions when we didn't know something, or if we were in a manic state and we were just doing the things and didn't know that they were detrimental, um, healing from um others not understanding us, healing from all the things. And one of the he wrote a poem that said, Who will cry for the little boy? And I'm not gonna read the poem because it always makes me cry. But the last line of that is who will cry for the little boy who cries inside of me. And I always thought that was so powerful. And you're right, we we do, you know, when you spent your entire life masking, when you spent your entire life trying to fit in and not knowing why you didn't fit in. Um, when you've spent your entire life, you know, doing all the things that many of us in our community have experienced, some of us have been punished for it, some of us have been um challenged, some of us have been celebrated, um, some of us have been held up as gifted, and we're like, I'm not gifted. I had just been able to read well, you know, things like that. And then you add in that we're women and that we're women of color, we have a lot to heal from. A lot. So that's one reason why I do recommend therapy. Um, and even if you've graduated from therapy, like Lex and I have, so to speak. You still realize there's times when you need to go back and get a little bit more and to get some help. Like I didn't even realize that that was something that was still inside. I may have to go back and work through some of that, you know? But um but thank you for those words and the encouragement that you gave to me and to the audience today about we don't have to keep defending that child. The child was defenseless. Now we have the power to stand up and just be strong for ourselves, for both of ourselves.

Speaker 2 44:37

So we gotta we still got a few minutes, friend. There's gotta be something that you had an impression of that got better. I can't be the only person who's like, I thought this, and then it got better.

Speaker 44:50

You know what?

Speaker 1 44:52

Um I feel like I understand you better. And I will now I will say this, and I know this is gonna sound really strange. Um I appreciate knowing you and understanding you better.

Speaker 45:11

Yet it also changed my view of you in a way because you were my funny friend Lex, you were um straight shooter Lex.

Speaker 1 45:27

Um and now, you know, like when you said, you know, uh and you you will call me out on it, and I appreciate you're just like, I don't know why you're laughing at me. And I go, oh crap. She wasn't trying to be funny. Okay, well, this is why this was funny, or this is why this came across funny, right? And then there's times sometimes you'll say something and you'll start laughing. I'm like, okay, is she really laughing because she thought it was funny? And I can tell now when it when it is, or certain things that you do, and I go, okay, she really thought that was funny. And then there's other times when I'm like, no, she's saying that and she's she's kind of laughing to soften the blow of what she said, but she really does mean this. Um so it kind of changed that about you for me, and I kind of missed that innocence that I had of you in that's really funny. You know, I do because it was it was it was kind of like uh that sweeter, innocent time, and now it's like okay. And so I say the yes, I missed that, and I appreciate where we are now because, like you said, we've kind of we've settled into our roles with each other. I feel like I can come to you and talk to you about things. Um I know you're gonna be honest and straightforward with me. And I also it's not seeing you, I still yeah, because you're you're still kind of my you're like my little sister niece.

Speaker 2 47:12

Listen, there's a part of that we can't avoid just because of sheer math, right?

Speaker 1 47:16

Is it it is what it is. Yes, yes. So my little sister, niece, daughter. Um but but um I feel like I don't know, it's kind of like like when I look at my niece, my my biological niece, and I'm like, she's a grown-up. So that that side of you that I knew wasn't that you were a kid in that sense, it was just our my innocent view of you, and I was like, she's so sweet and she's funny and she's this and she's that and she's all the things, and then I was like, and now I'm like, no, my baby's gone. She's an adult, she's an adult, and she's adulting with her words, and I'm like, my baby's gone. But I will say this. Um, you know, I and I said this uh back in our first season at one point. I was like Alexis is like my excuse me, I'm sorry. Alexis is like my makeup guru. She's not doing all the cut creases and all that stuff. She's like my natural makeup guru. Like she wears the most beautiful bronzers that truly complement her skin to the point that you can't really tell she's wearing a bronzer, but you notice that she got a little bit of something, something going on. You'd be like, girl, your skin is looking. And she always has the best skin. Her skin is just as smooth as I'm gonna use a BTS song, smooth like butter. I know you hate that. No, but her skin is glowy, it's smooth. Um, and when she wears her makeup, like I'm not one, unless it's a special occasion. I don't like to have a ton of makeup on if I'm wearing makeup. I like it to look natural, but I don't feel like when I put mine on that it looks like pretty. It looks natural, but it looks pretty. And you notice that she got a hair on. And so I used to go to Alexis all the time. Like when I was trying to do my really trying to do my makeup, I ain't tried in a while. And I'd be like, look, Lexus, see, see, I was working on my eyebrows because because I have alopecia and stuff, I've started losing hair on my eyebrows. So I was working on trying to get my eyebrows, still ain't got them perfect, but whatever. And I'd be like, look, Lex, see, see, look, I did my eyebrows. And she'd be like, okay, yeah, they're they're they're good, they're good. And then I would go, oh, Lex, look, I put on, I said, see, look, I was I was trying to blend because I can blend my foundation, I can get that going. But I was like, look, I was trying to blend my eyeshadow, and and I tried to get a little blushing, and I had my little um my little highlights on and my little bronzer. And she's like, okay. Excuse. I was trying to do like you, you know, and you told me, and she was like, oh, okay. And I was like, and she was like, and so I remember one day somebody else walked up and she was like, what are you talking about? And I was like, I was just telling Lex that I really liked her makeup, and you know, and I've been trying to work on mine and this and they were like, Yeah, she wore some makeup real nice. And Lex just turned to her and just fly out and says, I don't know why she could come to me talking to me about her makeup. It's not like I do anything special or something like that. Okay, I was crushed. Now, this was before I knew about it. I'm so sorry, that's so funny. I was like, because and so to me, and this goes back to again being misunderstood. So I didn't overly explain anything, but it was like, I really like how you wear your makeup. And so when I look at you and I go into a mirror, I have taken classes with, I have plenty of friends who are makeup artists. I have taken classes with them, they've taught me how to do different things, and they'll be like, okay, just keep practicing, you'll get it. And I'm like, but I want to look like Lex today. And I know you didn't get to Lex today by like, so she crushed my little dreams, y'all. My little makeup dreams. My makeup sitting over there on the counter, my brushes nice and clean sitting over there, like, use me, use me, use me. I'm like, but Lex ain't gonna look at me if I you know you go to your girlfriends to get you all pumped up, right? Like, girl, did you like and nippy? Like, yes, boo, yes. Now you looking like a clown, but they're not gonna discourage you because they know you need a little work and they just gonna encourage you. Lex was like, why you keep coming to me? Why?

Speaker 2 51:55

So I have a couple of things to say. First and foremost, here's me.

Speaker 1 52:01

I'm in my pills now.

Speaker 2 52:02

You do care. That's why we talk about it. This is my formal apology for brushing you off about this makeup brush thing. This is my formal official apology. Now, let me tell you what's funny about that. You didn't directly say what you were looking for from me. So you just walked up to me and said, Look at what I did to my eyes. And I said, Okay. I didn't know what I was supposed to say in response to that. And then we were like, well, you said, well, you said, You're my makeup guru. I was like, Me, girl, I learned how to do my makeup. I it was like 2015. I looked on YouTube, I found a black girl whose skin was similar to my skin tone, and I said, What'd she do? Okay, now I'm gonna do half of that. Could them YouTube girls be doing too much makeup. At least they did a daytime period. It's different now. They it it depends, but back then it was like slather it on. And I was like, cool, I'll take what she's doing for her daytime look, cut that in half, and then that'll be what I do. That's it. That's all I did. I don't have very good dexterity, so I can't do like a whole lot of fancy stuff with eyeliner resistance. So everything is just blushes and bronzes just kind of swapped over my face in different ways, and it's like, ooh, look at that. It's like an airbrush, but not really. Like, I barely know what I'm doing. So I'm just like, oh, I don't know why she's saying that about me. I don't know anything. She just go talk to somebody who actually knows what they're doing. I don't know what I'm doing. So I wasn't saying, uh, while she asked me, I was like, oh girl, if you want to really know what you're doing, don't ask me. Go ask a better person for this information. But I didn't realize what you were essentially doing was making a bid for closeness, and I missed the bid. I missed it. I didn't notice what you were doing. Totally over my head. Had no idea.

Speaker 1 54:05

And I understand that now. And it was also my way of complimenting you, you know, because I I do say, I was like, oh, that's the nice color and all that kind of stuff. You you do wear really pretty colors that complement your skin tone very nicely and your outfits. Thank you. You know, you really do. But yeah, y'all. So she she asked, so that was it. And I was like, I was like, well, dang, she just crushed all my little, all my little hopes and dreams.

Speaker 2 54:29

That is so funny. And you ain't saying none of that to me about my makeup ever since that day. I remember that day. That's very funny. I had no clue.

Speaker 1 54:38

I'm sure you do remember that day.

Speaker 2 54:40

That's and that's the curse of my life. Remembering every interaction, but not knowing that some of them didn't go well.

Speaker 1 54:50

Oh, you know, that reminds me, there was a there's a woman, um, um I think in People magazine, she had the ability to remember everything that ever happened in her life.

Speaker 55:08

And I thought that's a horrible existence.

Speaker 1 55:13

To remember everything, and it was some kind of an unusual brain disease that she had that only afflicted like one in a bazillion people. But she literally could remember every single day of her life, and she was like, it is a blessing and a curse. You know, so I'm glad you can remember some things. I hope you'll forget some other things because I'm pretty sure there's some things that I would want you to forget, even though I don't remember what they might be right now. No, we're just not gonna worry about it. We're just not gonna worry about it. Not at all, not at all. She'll use it against me when the time is appropriate. Remember when? And I'll be like, nope, I don't. She's like, Well, I got receipts.

Speaker 2 56:04

Man, let's end this episode. I ain't fooling with you.

Speaker 1 56:10

No, but but um, you know, but that, you know, this also goes to show uh to wrap this up that you know we can be friends with people of all types. We really can. And it's just a matter of learning how to not us necessarily learning how to communicate with them all the time. You know, when we're neurodivergent, we get each other for the most part. We just get each other. But it really is explaining to other people how to understand us, and sometimes that takes time, um, especially with more so with the ones we care about or perhaps in a job setting than anything else. Take the time to help people understand you. I know we get tired as women of color explaining our very existence period to people. And many of us have stopped. We do need a rest from that. But when we're talking neurodivergence, um, some people really don't get it and don't understand. And unfortunately, it's costing us jobs because um you're talking about the creatives are being let go from a lot of companies. You have 600,000 women of color, particularly black women, that are out of work in the United States right now. Um, I know that number is also very large across the world. Um, friends in the UK have also expressed that. So we're we're the backbone of the workforce when it comes to creativity, when it comes to organizational development and skills, um, analysis, all of that kind of stuff. Um, programming. You know, it was a black woman who did the whole Spotify year-in rap, young black intern. And that one idea she had that she implemented is now spread to all kinds of other platforms, but you would never know it because she didn't get the full recognition she deserved until years later. So the point is that we we have to do the due diligence that we need to do to make sure that um I shouldn't say make sure to communicate to others the best way to communicate and work with us. And if they do it, great. If they don't, well, that's on them.

Speaker 58:18

And you keep being you. You know, I will tell you one time, huh?

Speaker 2 58:26

I said, and will will keep being myself.

Speaker 1 58:30

Right. So it's okay, but but make sure you give you check them at least once. And then they ain't got no reason to say, well, I didn't know. Yes, you did. And if they don't believe you, just tell them, go talk to Lex. She's got the receipts. Bye, y'all. Bye.

Speaker 2 58:53

Well, that concludes another episode. What did you think? Let us know on IG, threads, or YouTube. We can be found at BG, BG Squirrel on all platforms.