Death Coven

Episode 18: Honoring The Ancestors - Braucherei

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0:00 | 1:12:31

Welcome back listeners! In this weeks episode we're kicking off a series all about honoring our ancestors and where we came from. Join us and listen to River yap about the Pennsylvania Dutch practice of Braucherei, folk remedies for man and beast, and their own candid feelings about modern day Christianity in general. As with all folk systems of belief it's important for us all the be respectful to those who practice. Always remember to be curious and be kind. 


*Sources*

https://www.glencairnmuseum.org/newsletter/2017/3/2/powwowing-in-pennsylvania

https://www.jstor.org/stable/533169?seq=45

Hex and Spellwork: Magical Practices of the Pennsylvania Dutch - Karl Herr

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Hair is a nightmare. No matter what length it is, it's a nightmare.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

easy to maintain now?

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

No, because they're in a process now.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

no.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

it

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

got a wild hair up my ass the other night as I was falling asleep to grow out my hair again. So it, it

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Is it because of Michael?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

That was part of it, but I also was like, I just kind of miss, I don't want like Michael length hair. But I do miss it just like being down to like my neck

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think you just came across a photo, like an old photo of yourself and, yeah. That happens to me sometimes too, where I'm like, Damn, I look so good with a cunty little bob and bangs.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

and I just miss like shaking my fluffy little hair around, and I want to actually like take care of it this time so it doesn't look like shit

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

When I saw them at work yesterday, it was like slicked back, and I was like, okay.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Ooh. Is it curly? I've never seen you with long

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

gets long, it gets curly, but when it's short, it doesn't have like the curl pattern. So, soon you will see, soon you will all see, in like six months to a year.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

By the time we get to Anahata's, you'll have your due. Or by the time we get to Squonkapalooza,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

palooza,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Lest we forget about Squonkapalooza. It's

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I am perpetually reminded by my own brain, and I'm like, Oh my god, I'm gonna get squonked this year.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

We're gonna get squonked hard.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

verbal stim just saying squonk over and over again.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

How the hell are you guys? How's it going?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I'm unwell. I'm not doing, I'm not doing

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Straight up not having a good time.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I'm feeling great. I got a lot of sleep, and I'm on my second cold brew, and I love seeing you guys. I love that we do this podcast. I'm in a great mood, so, you know, it balances out.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I got a chelada, like, specifically for this episode. I may or may not have it, depending on how I'm feeling in a little

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Now what is a chillata? Is it like a clamato?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

It's like a clamato, but without the clam juice. With beer.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

The things you

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

It's good.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

like a beer Bloody Mary.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

It feels nourishing. I know it's not, but it feels,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Marys do feel very medicinal to me. I do not love them, and I do not usually order them, but like, if I'm deep in the shits and I need

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

When you get a hankering for one they hit.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

don't think I've ever had a Bloody Mary in my life.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

You would love it, I feel like, you know,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I probably

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

you would love it. I think they're fine.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

chunky?

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

not always, but there's ice and vodka to dilute it, so it's not

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's usually not like pulpy, but it is kind of like drinking like a V8.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Cause I always imagine. Like, you know when salsa's really finely chopped up? Um, I imagine that. Okay. Okay. maybe I'll try one next

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I'll make you a Bloody Mary, because I have, I think, Is it Zing Zang that's my favorite? I don't remember, but there's some really good Bloody Mary mixes out there.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I'm really sneezy today. I'm really runny nosed today.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

You're really berry pilled today with your

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

This is all gonna make for a great,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

yeah,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

great listener

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

doing most of the talking.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, what are we doing today? Let's, let's move on.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, let's get into it. Let's get into the formalities of it all. Yeah,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

a podcast. We are a death coven and we talk about lots of different things. Sometimes they're death related, literal, metaphorical, uh, you know, spiritual. Uh, sometimes they're not. But I guess first and foremost, it is a witchcraft podcast.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

And today, we're going to be having a very special River Sode. It's River's Ancestor Special. So, I think, uh, eventually, the three of us, each of us are going to do an episode talking about, um, Well, I'm not sure what River's talking about, but like, the vision is like folklore, like magic practices.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

just ancestral heritage with whatever those, you know, magical practices might have been and like maybe talking about how it influences us.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

perhaps. Maybe all those things.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

do you want to give like an overview, like what, like what culture Are You going to be exploring?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

So as my two beautiful friends have already stated, what's up? I'm River. This is my episode today. Um, we're doing ancestral heritage lineage, etc. Maybe not deep dives. We're kind of just, at least I'm, I only, I only want to speak for myself on this one. Because I started getting more into ancestral practices and venerations a little while ago. I think maybe like a year or two ago, it's hard to tell. And I, like most white Americans of European lineage, I have a lot of things in my blood and in my body and in my ancestral line, so it's kind of hard to Concretely pinned down. It's not just a like, oh, it goes right to the source. It's kind of all over the place.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

You're not a Doberman.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

not, I'm not a purebred, hyperbred, like French Bulldog with breathing problems, you

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

You're, you're a mutt. You're the crusty, the

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I'm the crusty little white dog. I'm the crusty little white dog. Yes. But I got a lot of spirit and I got I got a funny little

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

do. Mm

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

The biggest part from what I have been told and what I have gleaned from my own family history is primarily German ancestry. Specifically from my mother's father. I believe he is, and I could very well be wrong, I don't know a lot about ancestry or my genealogy personally. I believe he's half German. It could be talking out of my ass, but that's what I've been told, that's what I believe. And there's other things in there, there's like French and Sicilian and Scottish and Irish.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

So you're potentially an 8th German.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Potentially. Couldn't tell ya,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Depending, I mean, you might have German also on your paternal side as well.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's very possible. I don't know jack shit about my paternal side, pretty much everything is coming from like my maternal information. So, what I was getting into when I was learning about ancestral practices and venerations and trying to figure out my whole deal and what that means for me and my ancestors, um, not that there's not a lot, but it is harder for me anyway to like find like Germanic folk practices. They're not as often talked about as like Italian folk practices and like Irish and Scottish folk practices. You gotta dig a little bit deeper for them. But I did find one that I think is very cool it's like an American German. what's the word, not syncretized, but like it's evolved from the Germanic diaspora of people that have immigrated.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

cultures like that kind of Americanize easily

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

When you come over to a new country, you're still bringing your history with you, but you are also like adapting to the new environment and the new cultures that you are surrounded by. So what I'm gonna be talking about today is the Pennsylvania Dutch practice of Brouwerij.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Woo!

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

know nothing about it, so I'm listening

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

And that's okay, you're gonna learn So that, in a nutshell, I don't know if any of that made sense. I was kind of just like speaking for a while. So hopefully that is okay. That's just like today's preview. Yeah, so I'm going to be talking about Brow Harat today

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Beautiful. Alright. Are we ready for a little hypothetical game? So, I was telling River and Sky before we started recording that today's hypothetical I chose immediately before we began this call. I didn't spend a ton of time on it, this kind of comes from the fact that I'm having a lot of dental pain right now, my mouth hurts. really bad and so I can't really chew. so, you know the phrase, I could eat my weight in, blank? Uh, so what could you actually eat your weight in? And some, some rules, some parameters around this. Uh, you don't have to eat, obviously, because you would die. your weight in one thing, all at one time. Um, you can kind of spread it out. Um, but you can't eat anything else until you finish whatever it is you're, you're eating. and you can't just say like, oh, sandwiches, um, you know, that stupid cop out, everything's a sandwich. Is a taco a sandwich? Uh, you would have to be specific, like, I'm only gonna eat tuna salad sandwiches.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Right, like you order one thing, and it's as is.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

and it's as is, it's that no modifications.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

not like the pizza, and then you get the different toppings, and you make a dessert

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, no, no, no. it's one thing and real world repercussions still apply. You still have to

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

vitamin deficiencies. No.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

the health implications, yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

This is not as easy as I thought it was gonna be. My immediate answer was french fries, because I love french fries, and I would eat

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

you cannot eat

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

for every single meal if I could. I would want to, I'd be willing to, but the health implications of it all,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

mm hmm. But potatoes are a staple food because they contain so many

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

and, honestly, I can just take vitamins, like I already do.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

True. Yeah, I'll allow that. I'll allow the vitamins. Your supplements.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

With, with french fries, what's my dipping sauce situation? Am I allowed to pick the sauce, or does the base have to be consistent each time, or?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I would say, if we were going to be consistent with the rules, I would say you get one sauce that you have to stick to. But I'll be nice. I'll give you, I'll give you two

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

two sauces. wow! Living like a king over here with my two sauces. obviously, one would be ketchup.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Mayonnaise? Are you a mayo

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I am, but I'm specifically a spicy mayo dipper. I think that's it for me, y'all. I think I'm eating 150 pounds approximately of french fries and ketchup and spicy mayo.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

How many pounds of fri like, a day do you think you could eat?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

fries?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Easy, yeah. Easy, I could eat 5

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

fries?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

fries, yeah.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I have my answer. And I've thought it through. Now, as a hot IBS girlie, this is not good for me, but I've tried to make tweaks where I could to where it's not as bad as it could be, considering what I'm about to say.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Mm hmm.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

a fellow hot IBS sufferer,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Mm

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I understand the lifestyle.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

in addition to vitamins as well. the base, it is a sandwich, but it will remain the exact same every single time. I don't need extra condiments or anything like that. It'll just be as is. It is a fried green tomato and pimento cheese sandwich with lettuce and the bread is like a whole grain, whole wheat bread. So there's a tomato, like it, there's lots of breading, like the fried green tomato is breaded and there is bread. But I'm trying to get some grains in there to add some fiber. And a little bit of lettuce, a little bit of lettuce for a vegetable besides the tomato, which is technically a fruit, I know. And then pimento cheese just makes it like, doable. I love pimento cheese. What can I say? It's a real southern, southern meal that I

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Any fried

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, and the bread is toasted.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Naturally, it

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Naturally.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, so it's a fried green tomato and pimento cheese sandwich with lettuce on a whole grain whole wheat bread. I could probably do two, well I could probably do one for breakfast, two for lunch, two for dinner, so it's like five a day. I don't know how many pounds that is, it's not very heavy. Unless it was like a

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Maybe like

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

know.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

You get a thick tomato slice.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I don't know. The pimento cheese, if I really loaded the pimento cheese, could add some weight.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

But then you'd be so constipated from all the cheese.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

that's why the whole grain, whole wheat, I'm relying on that. And I may also be, be taking, yeah, I may also be taking like fiber supplements as well in addition to

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, you're just drinking smooth move tea with every single sandwich.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

what about poppy?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

My first instinct was Sushi, like specifically a rainbow roll, which is like, like a California roll and then topped with salmon, tuna, whitefish, and shrimp. And some of them have eel too, so you kind of get like the, the spread. However, I feared that I would get mercury poisoning

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I, seafood all the time is a bold choice.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, especially I think tuna in particular. has higher amounts of mercury, but then,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I also don't know if with shrimp if I know that you don't have an iodine allergy But I don't know if excess iodine would have any sort of negative repercussions

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

one

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

of

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I didn't know shrimp has iodine in it. Yeah, I mean, doing that might give me a shellfish allergy, just consuming so much. So I'm not gonna do that, you know, even though I feel like the rice would bulk it up and whatnot. So I think I'm gonna go basic. I'm gonna go for a chicken noodle soup that has a lot of vegetables in it. Yeah, so like lots of carrots, maybe um, maybe some like celery, maybe some tomatoes in

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Maybe even like potato that could weigh it down like if you added

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

yeah, you get the protein, you get the vegetables, I feel soup is like, soup is pretty heavy without being filling.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

it has weight Yeah, you could you would probably finish first If we were all starting at the same time, you

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

If you are just carrying constantly, like, a flask of soup with you at all times,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Sippin

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

need to drink that much

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

chewin Yeah.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

But there's salt also in chicken noodle soup, so you would need to

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

That's true. It would have to be like one of those low sodium brands. Maybe tomato soup. I might be able to do tomato soup.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

though.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

skin turns red from all the tomatoes in your body.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think that River wouldn't be able to finish with the french fries.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think you would be so constipated.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

fries.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

just think health wise, it would be months that it would take you. Not

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

How fast do you think it would take you to get, like, sick? Not, like, physically sick, but just sick of eating? Yeah.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

A week.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

yeah, I would say like a week, maybe a week and a half. But also it might be good for me in the long run, because it would quell my desire to constantly be eating french fries. It'd be like smoking a whole pack of

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah. You

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

you know?

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

fries for a year after that. A

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, and I would, uh, can you imagine the life I could have if I wasn't plagued by the desire to eat french fries all the time? Alright, you guys are ready to lock in and learn.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I'm

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

mm hmm,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Class is in session. Everybody sit your ass down and turn your phones off. That was aggressive, I'm sorry.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

As you said that I got a text message and I was like, oh no.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

You can have it back at the end of class. Put it in the box, thank you. so. Like I said, minutes ago before we started talking about french fries and sandwiches, uh, we're doing ancestral, not necessarily history maybe, but. Just, you know, where you come from. Cause I feel like you get older. I'm almost, I'm gonna be 30 this year. And I feel like it's a very natural state of being when you're gonna be 30 to be like, What's going on? Where did I come

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Who am I?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Who am I gonna

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Who am I gonna be? Where did I come from? Who, uh, who made me what I am today? Hundreds of years of people. You know, thousands of years of people having babies and now I'm here and I'm like, damn, how the hell did that happen? And also like, I feel like in, again, only speaking as a white American, that's my, my personal herstory and my experience. I feel like there, because America is such a melting pot of cultures and ethnicities, it's like. Once you reach like a certain generation of your family being here, you're like, I, I don't know what the fuck my history is. I don't really know what my culture is that

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Cause at that point it's

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Cause it's so much. Yeah, like I am American first and

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

history. Mhm.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah. But America's such a baby of a country.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah. Truly. And that's why I feel like also there's not real, like there is an American culture, but it's not like established and,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

That's why you like french fries so much.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

love french fries. That's my American culture, I love french fries. So like I said, I'm going to be talking about a folk practice today of a, of a culture that I do have ties to, but I do not practice and I would not call myself a practitioner. It's just The closest thing I could find to an ancestral practice that maybe my family could have at some point practiced,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

have direct practitioners within your family

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

As far as I am aware of, no. As far as I am aware of, I am one of the only people that practices witchcraft in my family.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

In this modern day, at least.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

In this modern day, at least.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

that you haven't gone over it. yet, but is this sort of a spoken, like, word of mouth, secret kind of practice to where maybe there could have been, but you wouldn't know?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's not secret. It is primarily an oral tradition and oral teaching. There's not a lot of written materials about it. it. is often passed down in families. As far as, like maybe way back when, when my family came over at whatever point they did, maybe there were like flavors of that. Cause there are layers to it also. In folk practices there are just like home remedies that you do. And, you know, little superstitions and things you do for like bountiful crops and protections. And then there are more. Not extreme or advanced, but like

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Well

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

There are there are varying degrees to it. Yeah, like there are people who like this is Every facet of their life is this thing and it is

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

they might be the medicine person in the village or something like that.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yes, and we're gonna talk about that You're locked in that juicy little brain Let's see i'm i'm going off notes, I don't even know where I started in my notes It's gonna be messy. I already know today is gonna be messy and like very stream of consciousness. I'm gonna try to

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Hey, history is

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

History is messy and crazy and it's not ever straightforward because there's a million things going on at all times.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Walk into that intuition, babe.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I I do feel like first I have to, I have to mention something about the practice. I, again, I need to start out by saying I am not an anthropologist. I am not an expert. I am not a linguist. I am not a historian. If you want to know more about this stuff, do your own research and read things and listen to things from people that are more educated than I am. Don't use me as your primary source for information, please. But, especially in the Pennsylvania Dutch community where this is practiced, It goes by two names. What I will be calling it today is Brauerei, and that is like the German word for it. But the Pennsylvania Dutch word for it is powwow. So it, you'll find these names used interchangeably. Uh, I don't like calling it powwow. It leaves a weird taste in my mouth because the word was appropriated from the Algonquin languages by English missionaries. And I just don't like using that for reasons I cannot, in this moment at the very least, like, intellectually articulate. That's just my deal.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Understandable.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I feel like if, yeah, if you get it, you get it. I feel like I don't really have to explain colonialism right this very second. I feel like we all know it was pretty bad and fucked up. So. You will find them used interchangeably, so if you're going to look this out, just be aware it has two names. And even though the practice today, specifically that I'm talking about, is focused in Pennsylvania, specifically in the southeast area of Pennsylvania, it is not limited to the states, it's not even limited to North America. It has, well, I guess this, specifically, and other similar folk practices, you can find influences of them all over the place, wherever the Germanic diaspora has spread and, like, taken root in places. You can find it in Southern Appalachia, Appalachia Mention. You can find it in the Ozarks, the Midwest, the Dakotas, Ontario, you can even find it in Brazil and Russia. So it's all over the place, but I'm specifically focusing on the Pennsylvania Dutch practice of it. A lot of folk practices are. Comparable to each other, like they sort of have a similar essence and not always like similar systems of workings, but the end goal is usually the same, you know, you have it in Italian American practices, you have it in root work, you have it in Santeria, granny doctors in Southern Appalachia, etc. It's always about helping the community. Doing what you can, trying to gain that prosperity and that healing and that protection. It's sort of like the core of it all. Breaking hexes, especially, is very big.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

So if breaking hexes is big, are hexes big?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

not in the sense that you are doing the hexes or that the people that are practicing Brow Harai are doing the hexes, but There is, you know, that light work versus evil work. There's that, like, dichotomy of,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

a belief that certain things can hex someone, not that you're actively performing a hex.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Some people are actively performing hexes. I will say that. Some people are actively doing bad works that need somebody

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think that, in my mind, I think that they likely thought. That even someone just giving you, like, a jealous look could be a hex or something like

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

certainly could be. It could also be like, you know, burying a baneful item on somebody's property. You know, taking somebody's like, hair or something that like, is tying to them. There were stories about Um, people, like specifically a woman who was making other women infertile because she had lost a child and like, through her grief and her like, anger, like, she didn't want anyone to have a baby. So it, it can be anything, really, truly.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

that's heinous. I

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's heinous.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

That's horrible.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's really bad.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Some hexes are truly diabolical.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Hexes, they can be, it can be like a little, just a little ick, a little imp, or it can be like, yeah, like you stub your toe or something goes missing, or like you're late for work, or like, oh my house burned down, oh

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

my leg, oh my cow died,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

my crop's burned.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

withered. So while, how do I say this? I say this a little bit later in my notes, but I'll, I'll say it again now. Some of the things that you will find in the practice. They may seem very antiquated, they may seem very silly, because it's not something that you're familiar with, and some of this stuff is like hundreds of years old at this point, but there are real living people practicing this today. This is a living folk practice that we should be respectful of, so don't, you know, just because it seems silly, don't make fun of it.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I allowed to laugh or is that rude?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Sometimes, I sometimes we're allowed to laugh. I might cut this out, but there is, um, an old book about this where a lot of the remedies involve making water, which is a euphemism for pissing, you know? So there is a lot of urine based remedies for things. And I think sometimes it's important to laugh.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

fine. I

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I think it's fine, but it's also like, don't, just don't be a shithead. And I do, I have some sources from the Glencairn Museum because they did an exhibit on this in 2017. A little while ago. And they say, Brauerei cannot be separated from the communities that it sustains, and therefore any efforts to engage or encounter this tradition as an outsider should begin by establishing meaningful connections with the community, which I think is true for all folk practices. Even if you come from that lineage, like I do, like I am German to some extent, I am not. In this community, I am not practicing these things. I would not just roll into Pennsylvania and be like, What's up, my people? I'm just like you, let's do this together. No, because that's crazy. You gotta, you gotta learn from the source and be respectful. So, what does brow harai look like in practice? What are you doing? What are you getting up to there? In Pennsylvania, largely. And this, I want to make a note, this is not a comprehensive list, don't come for me. I am barely scratching the surface of this practice and these, these folk charms and prayers and rituals. If you want to learn more, I'll I'll put more resources in the description. like I said, it's composed of a lot of rituals, charms, and prayers for healing, prosperity, and protection. It is, not even largely, it is specifically a Christian practice. You are pretty much constantly invoking God and Jesus and sometimes various saints to help with whatever the predicament is at hand. Not all practitioners work with saints, because not all Christian sects recognize or work with saints. It just kind of depends on the region and the people that are practicing. So even though there is, like, how do I say? I lost the metaphor

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Well, I think that, uh, like you said about Catholicism previously, that it's primarily Catholics who recognize saints. And Protestants mostly don't, really. Shoutout

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

it really just kind of depends on the group. There are certainly some practitioners who do work closely with saints. It really just depends on like your family and your teachings and your, honestly, your own personal feelings about saints. And like I mentioned before, there is a very old book that was published in 1820 by Mr. John George Holman, called The Long Hidden Friend, that you can find for free on JSTOR. org. I love you, JSTOR. org. You are one of my best resources.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

JSTOR. org. Not a

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Shoutout JSTOR. org. A free academic resource. I owe you my life. Um, and it's full of all kinds of remedies for man and beast, including, but not limited to, verbal charms and prayers to help break fevers, remedies to help a cow that has lost her milk, rituals and prayers to curse a thief and make a thief return stolen goods,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

hmm.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

and prayers for the protection of the house. So really whatever you needed at the time. Oh, here's where I mentioned that. This is just me again talking about, like, practices maybe seeming antiquated, etc. etc. because they were from so long ago when people's lives were different and you had different problems you needed to fix. I'm not I'm, I'm, I know thievery does still exist, but I feel like it's not like no one's coming to my farm in the middle of the night and stealing my crops these days, you know?

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

back then.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

No, they didn't have ring doorbells. So while not all of these things are Regularly being practiced, you can still find a lot of things similar to this being practiced today. You know, I'm sure when you were younger and you got a sunburn, at least my grandma did, she like rubbed aloe and honey on my sunburn to help it feel better. There's people chewing cloves of garlic to help reduce fevers and fight infections. You can even use it to clear up a little sty you get on your eye because it's, uh, anti bacterial. You can deter cockroaches from your home by sprinkling little tobacco bits in the kitchen

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Oh,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Oh, yeah. You gotta keep that, those stores safe.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

those pests away.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

And I feel like it's less, I see less of it now, but I know it is still like a big thing of like applying poultices and salves to like bruises, strains, muscle injuries, etc. So there are still these things in practice. It's not completely gone out of favor and it's not all, you know, making water to make a thief return stolen items. Oh, there's also a whole thing in Brow Harai that I didn't really feel well educated enough or I feel like I didn't have enough time to get into about working with the moon phases and its force of influence when it comes to magical workings but that is a big part of it especially for planting crops. So I at least wanted to bring that up because it is very cool and it's like opposite of what you would typically find in information for like the phases of the moon where like

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Growing.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I feel like in most magical circles like the waxing moon is like you're building something and you're like You're trying to like draw something to its fullness and like manifest something because It's the moon's going to be full soon, but the waxing in Brow Harai is to like disperse something because the moon is like taking on whatever it is. So like you're dispersing an illness to the moon. there's a lot of stuff for like the removal of warts or like the wart is being taken on by the moon. So it's pulling it away from you,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

So were you reaping during the new moon?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

the waxing, not the waxing, the waning is where like things are being sent to you because the moon is like releasing them and like pushing things back down

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

So you're receiving the moon as it's sort of fading away. That makes sense. Well, they had like the farmer's almanac and stuff.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, the farmer's almanac is like huge, especially because it is such like an agriculture based, not society.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

saw the 2025 Farmers Almanac in a gas station yesterday.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I want to get a Farmer's Almanac so bad. I just can't, yeah. I just have a hard time understanding them because I have a hard time with like charts and numbers and like longitude and latitude so I'm like, I don't know what this means but thank you for the

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Well, you're not a

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I don't know what to

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

It

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

and I never will

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I feel like the website's pretty good.'cause there is a, like farmers almanac.com. And it's accessible for us non farmin folk.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Let's see. Oh, here's an important note that I feel like no matter how many times I say it, I'm never gonna stop saying it. Uh, these were the best medicine people had at the time.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Mm

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

So, you know, back before modern advancements in medicines, this was all you had. Especially if you're living on a farm in the middle of nowhere. You got no neighbors. The closest town is eight miles away. You're on foot. You don't have a car. So you, for sure, like, you can still use them today, but they should always be used as a complementary tool and not in place of you know, proper medical treatments. I will never not say that. So. You, let's say, let's play a fun little game. Let's say, I guess this is less of a game and more of a segue into what I want to talk about next.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Oh, okay, okay, okay.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

let's let's say you have, uh, maybe a spiritual or physical malady. Maybe you're getting a lot of tummy aches, maybe you're getting a lot of eye pain, maybe you've got a toothache. Maybe you've got a persistent toothache.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

My brain went to rash immediately for some

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Maybe you've got a rash, who knows? Uh, who, who are you gonna go to in your town? Not even historically, like these, these exist today. is the person, perhaps, the person you want to go to, especially like, if it's a big problem and you feel it's out of your hands. Sometimes, Sometimes, you know, personal power is very important and sometimes you can solve your own problems in a folk practice. Sometimes you need to outsource your help. And you're gonna want to go to a Hexenmeister if it's a big problem.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Love that.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

gonna want to see your local Hexenmeister.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Master of hexes.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

or a Spellmaster. And a Hexenmeister is a trained and skilled practitioner in Brow Harai, often being called on by the people in their area when they're afflicted with spiritual or material woes. And it can really be anything. It can be like financial troubles, it can be like period cramps, whatever you got going on. And they are also generally preferred by old order Amish and Mennonite communities because a Hexenmeister will never require you to disrobe and in many cases they don't even need to physically touch you when they try for an illness.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Question for you.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yes.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Related, were these people also Do they also sort of stand in doulas? Were they assisting in child labor as well?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I genuinely don't know.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Child labor.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Well, sometimes children were giving birth, but

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, sometimes 12 year olds were giving birth. Um, I would say not out of the realm of possibility.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Just because they're in that health, they're the go to health person. Maybe they help you to get pregnant, they help you with pregnancy symptoms. I just think that it would make sense that they would also be there, perhaps, during the birth.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I would not say no. But I would also not say exclusively that is one of their roles, because they are more

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

you know, women in general, yeah, women in general were probably just having kids all the time. Your sister, your mother are probably there because they've had children, et cetera, et cetera. Probably a lot of women were just experienced in knowing what to do when there's a birth.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

So I guess that's a question, too. Did you say, is this? Is this typically, like, a woman, or a man, or

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

can be, it's, it's pretty evenly dispersed throughout the sexes. A lot of teachers, at least in the past, historically, it switches. So a woman will always teach a man, a man will always teach a woman. It's not, it's not that strict these days. There are teachers that will take on somebody of the same sex. But it's pretty, like, you can have a Hexenmeister of whatever sex, whatever gender. You know?

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, I only brought up women because I know the birthing process was typically

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

only sort of

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah. And there is, there is not necessarily like, um, a tradition, but because so many Amish and Mennonite people do go to Hex and Meisters, if a Hex and Meister is male, he will teach his daughter specifically, like quote unquote woman complaints so that they're more comfortable and like, you know, a man is not helping you with your period cramps, you know? So it's, it's a very like sensitive and considerate of like people's comfort levels, which is very important. And we got another banger quote from glencairnmuseum. org on their exhibit.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Give it to me. Hit me.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Despite obvious contrast with modern biomedical healthcare, these traditional healing systems are used in the present day as alternative and complementary medical practices that are blended with conventional care for the benefit of those who wish to engage a healing system that is sympathetic to religious and cultural values. Finger snaps. Finger snaps for sympathy. We love to see it. So what is trying for an illness? Any thoughts? Yeah, what is trying for an illness? A Hexenmeister will only try for an illness. So what is, what the heck is trying for an illness? Well, that's exactly how it sounds. Uh, Hexenmeisters and people that practice Brow Harai believe only God can heal and they will never promise a cure or an improvement for a ailment. A Hexenmeister is just the passive instrument of God's will. So they, they're never out here selling snake oil, they're never out here promising nothing to you, just that they're gonna try.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

They're like the

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

gonna do their best. Yeah? Very much so.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Do you pay them?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

n

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

paid service, or they're just kind of like

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

not, it kind of depends. There are things that I'll talk about later that Hex and Meisters will accept payment for, but largely, especially in trying for an illness, a hex and meister will never accept money. You can't, there are like little donation boxes sometimes where if you feel so inclined and you have the means like you can donate for their service.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Mm hmm.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

a Patreon, you know?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

sure people are bringing them eggs and

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Very much so. Yeah. It's more, it's, it's more trade. It's more barter based. You know, you give what you can. The Hexenmeister will do what they can, but it's never, uh, alright, I'm going to try for your illness. Give me 15, please. And maybe nothing will happen, but give me your 15. So it's a very community healing based. do it for the love of the sport, you know? yeah, piggybacking off of what I said about, payment and such. Some, there's not like a golden rule of brow hurry and being a Hexenmeister. There's not just one way of performing. It depends on who taught you and the region you're in. There are some, you know, quote unquote Hexenmeisters who are not doing it for the best intentions and they are taking money from people and promising them things and maybe they're not delivering

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

gonna be people wherever you go. I

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

People are gonna be people. People love power and money, but a real, honest, true Hexenmeister is not going to try to get anything out of you.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

The way God intended.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

it because they like to. The way God intended, and that is a very big part. They're trying to live their life in a way that pleases and serves God, and sometimes people forget that, and they get corrupted.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

So there's, I feel like there's less of a, at least historically, they're less likely to be tried for witchcraft or something because they are enacting the will of

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I was gonna say I feel like some people could view it as, maybe not blasphemy, but like, as if they're trying to utilize the power of God and say that they're claiming the power of God. And I feel like people outside of that culture, I could see putting really harsh judgment on that

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah. There There are definitely, like, more magical aspects to being a Hexenmeister, where, like, you are doing spells, and you are, like Like on paper, you would think no one would have an issue with it because it's like, oh, they are like praying and asking God for help. And they are, like, doing what they can to, like, support people in their community, and they are, like, being good people generally. But again, with, like, the infighting of Christianity, like, someone will always find a problem with it, because it's not their version of Christianity, it's not what they are practicing, so it is wrong, you know?

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

People love a witch hunt.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

love a witch hunt. Truly, truly. So, to get into some of the more magical aspects of Brow Harai, and what things that a Hexenmeister might charge for, because these are a little bit more time consuming, and these are a little bit more, not intentional, but they have a more, how do you say,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

effort put in.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

more effort, definitely more effort for both of these. So I'm going to be telling you guys about himmelbriefs and hex signs. And we actually, I'll get into this more when I start talking about hex signs, but we saw a couple hex signs when we were going to Anahata's last

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

We did

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

did, because we were in Pennsylvania, baby. Mm hmm, mm hmm. I'll start with himmelbriefs because it's shorter. you certainly can find a lot more than what I'm going to tell you. There is like a long history that I, I just truly did not have the time to get into for hymnal briefs, but they are a very long practice. So a hymnal brief is a heavenly letter it can be written to a spirit of someone departed or to God to gain assistance in many matters. A lot of the times they were carried by soldiers to protect from injury and death. A lot of people, they swore by it being the only reason they came back. They were like, I carry this on me every day. Did not get shot one time. Came back just fine.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

it's like a written prayer?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, it is literally Like a physical piece of paper. It's like a prayer in the form of a letter. So you are like writing to God, but it is at its core a prayer for assistance and intercession. It's really, it's a petition. Really, truly, if I'm being honest.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

It's like your lucky penny.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, my lucky penny that I keep forgetting about and finding in my pocket. Yeah, I love that guy. Um, a lot of old Himmelbriefs are passed down through generations and families and they are considered very lucky and powerful talismans. Very cool. You can also find more generic printed copies in a lot of tourist and curio shops in the Pennsylvania Dutch area. You know, you go to, like, an old Amish, what, I've never been to one, but, like, you go to a little Amish town and you go to the gift shop and you can buy, like, a stool, a handmade stool or something. And there's also, like, little xeroxed copies of, like, little Himmel briefs you can carry for good luck and such. I would say they're not as powerful because they're not, like, being intentionally written for one person and, like, one

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

hmm.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

but

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, if you had a handwritten one from like your grandfather from five generations ago that he went to war

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

it would blow my tits clean off, dude

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

And it's been seasoned like through the

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

are so, like, you have to be really careful opening it because it's been opened and closed a million

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

disintegrate. Yeah,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

iron pan.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

yeah. Seasoned. I will say, I'm sure the, the, not mass circulated, I guess is the wrong word for it, but like the generic printed ones, I think they can still be powerful, because I think the belief you put in things give it power. I think it just depends on the

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think you could make the argument that because it is so cool. Widely used and known, that adds sort of a power to it that so many people have

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I think it does. It's, yeah, it definitely, like, the history of usage of things give it, like, a cumulative communal power to it. it's all very vibes based, in my opinion. Most of witchcraft is vibes based, in my opinion, So, like I said, you can carry it on your person, you can have it in your breast pocket at all times to protect you. You can also dissolve the ink from the paper in a glass of water and drink the water to imbue yourself with the spell. Or, if you don't want to do that, cause that, because it may be it tastes yucky, you can also dissolve it in a bath and then bathe in it if you don't want to drink the ink.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I would probably do that rather than drink the

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

you can, you can adjust and you can adapt it to whatever suit your needs and you don't, you can even think of a fun fourth way to utilize a

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Burn it.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's really up to you. Maybe burn it.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Although I feel like the fire element in Christianity is too negative.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I think if you're trying to like just put something out there or like manifest something I don't think it's bad But if you were like specifically asking like for your person in your home to be protected I would say like keep it intact keep it nearby. It just depends on like what it's for So now we're gonna talk about hex signs and again This is barely scratching the surface. There is a deep rich history of hex signs. Please look into it yourself if you want further information on it. I already mentioned anahatas, hex sign spottings. I wish I could remember what they looked like. I wish I had taken a picture of them, but we were also like going so fast.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

looking, right?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yes.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

They look like quilts to me.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

look like quilts. They can take on different

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

They're kind of like X's with triangles.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Not always. It depends on what The purposes and what like the symbolism is very important to the intention So sometimes it is like a 6, 8, or 12 pointed star Sometimes it is birds and hearts and tulips, but they are always very like a geometrically balanced

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

It's like a mosaic.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

beautifully. Yeah

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

There's one right down the road for me. I'm going to try to get a picture of it and I'll send it to you. Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

it. Please, please, please, I would love to see

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

ones? Like, ones that are standardly used? Or are they all

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Um,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

to families or

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

mean, there are common shapes. There, you'll see a lot of, like, twelve pointed stars or eight pointed stars or, like, the four pointed wheel of the sun. But, for the most part, they are all very individualized to, like, what the spell itself is.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

there's different colors and stuff that I assume have different meanings and whatnot.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yes, yes there are. So if you haven't figured it out, a hex sign is literally just a painted spell. That's what I was, I was circling around. I was dancing around the big reveal that is a painted spell. They're very beautiful. Um, a lot of the imagery comes from, I think it's called Fracture, I might be wrong, which is elaborate illuminated Pennsylvania Dutch folk art. So you'll see like a fractor piece online and a lot of the symbolism is used in current day hex signs. But it's very beautiful. It has a very deep, rich history that you can and should look into, because it's gorgeous and stunning, and I feel like if you don't, even if you don't know what it is, you know it when you see it, you know? You can recognize it when you see it.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

emotion.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, even just like the shapes and the colors and the symbols you're like, oh that looks like I feel like a lot of the times you think it's like, oh old Amish and old Mennonite Paintings because that is the area where you find them, but it's like, oh, that's Pennsylvania Dutch specifically not just like Amish

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

It looks very German too, I will say. Like it looks like German illustration.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

much so

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, they feel very intuitive. Like, I feel like you can see it and you're like, I don't 100 percent know, but

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

even if you've never knowingly seen a hex sign as you're listening to this right now, if you google image search it right now, you'll be like, oh, that's what it is. I have seen that before. Oh yeah, like what Skye was saying earlier just moments ago, the color associations are very important and symbolic in hex sign paintings. From what I can tell, it really is like a one to one comparison to other magical interpretations of like the color theory of it all, you know?

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Like, blue is calming,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Blue is calming, and it's, it's for emotions. Brown represents the home and the earth and animals. Yellow represents health and joy. Violet and purple representing, you know, the higher chakras and like the spiritual

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

and white being purity,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Very much so. Black being protection, yes. So it's really It's, it's pretty much the same as you're going to find anywhere else, et cetera, et cetera. But where you get to get a little bit fun with it are the symbols and the things you put in the hex sign. So a lot of it is nature based. You'll find a lot of them that have birds and oak leaves and acorns and tulips. It's very, it's very beautiful. Y'all know what a distal fink is? Okay.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

A distal fink. It is a stylized goldfinch that you find in a lot of popular hex signs. It's so cute. It's really so precious looking, dude.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

a goldfinch, they're

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It brings good luck and happiness wherever it's displayed. And sometimes what's even cuter is when you make a hex sign for a married couple, there will be two distal finks and their necks will be crossed over each other.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

oh. I'm looking at'em

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's very precious. It's very cute. You have a lot of dove imagery, which represents purity and peace, and it's a common symbol of the divine. Hearts symbolize everlasting love. You will see them in a lot of hex signs for engagements and marriages, so maybe you'll see two little distal finks with their necks crossed, and they're surrounded by little hearts on all sides. It's very precious. The oak leaf and the acorn. Oak leaves are representing strength and endurance, and acorns may be used to symbolize children or the number of children a couple wish to have. maybe you've got six acorns.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Damn.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Maybe you want six kids. That's really, that's truly all the concrete information that I have for you today. Again, like I said, I can't say it enough. I am barely only scratching the surface of this, and there are so many other, uh, knowledgeable and articulated and much more well educated people that have written books about this, so go seek them out. Always continue learning. Don't just listen to one podcast episode and leave it at that. I'm begging you

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I have a question for you.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

practice this specific Folk practice, but I don't know if you were already going to but if you would can you Discuss what you already do in your practice that maybe overlaps with some of this ancestral Practice, you know, are there certain things that you do that maybe mirror or reflect? Maybe something instinctually that you do that could be passed down ancestrally In your, because I know that you do sort of, uh, folk practice esque things in your own practice, so you want to talk about that?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Uh, there are whispers and echoes and flavors of this in my practice. I would not call myself a practitioner of Brow Harai,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

no.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I also, I, I was looking into whether it is a closed practice or not,

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

It seems

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

cause that's something I try to be, it's like a soft no, soft yes, depending on. what your own personal feelings about it are. And also, again, there's not really like a concrete one way of learning it or teaching it. There are teachers of it who are like very strict and they have their own set of rules that they follow and they will not teach to anyone who is not Christian and does not have the same faith as them. There are teachers who will take on anybody regardless of their background and their faith. So it, it really depends on where you are and who you're learning it from.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

No, my real question was just like, when you were doing your research, what things while you were researching did you think, I already naturally kind of do this?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I would say a lot of, the, you know, everyday granny remedies for like ailments. I already do apply like salves and like aloe to burns. I do a lot of, you know, gargling salt water when your throat feels kind of icky.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

I just did that this morning.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

so good, dude. It's so good.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

with saints and

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I do work with saints, I do, I write petitions when I have a specific thing. There's a lot of, especially for Hexenmeisters, there's a really strong emphasis on like personal contemplative prayer and like reading psalms that I was already like getting into myself. That has been very helpful. So, a lot of it has just been like, sort of putting the things I have already been feeling into a proper avenue and framework, where I like, I've had all these, these impulses and these urges to like, try something, or like, thinking something is missing, and then finding actual like, concrete ways I can put them into practice, which was very helpful.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think that that's what folk magic is.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Absolutely.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

It's just kind of grabbing around and using what you got and

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It's very much using what you got, yeah. You, a lot of the times you did not have a lot of resources. Sometimes all you had was a glass of water and a prayer. that'll do it.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

more than enough sometimes.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Sometimes you can do much more with that than You know, not to be disparaging, but like, 50 worth of magical supplies from Etsy. You know, I feel like sometimes we get I'll just, I'll, again, I'll speak for myself, I'm not trying to throw anybody under the bus, but I get I get too zoomed out, and I'm like, I need all my ingredients to be perfect. And I need eight different herbs, and I need three different colored candles. When you really don't, you just need, like, the intention. And, like, the focus. And, like, you have to, like, really, in your heart, believe it. You

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah, I think that it, those things can come in handy. Depending on what you're doing, because sometimes the environment and the atmosphere can put you in a certain mindset. However, yeah, but at the root of it, it truly just comes down to your power, your belief, your intention, and the work that you do from that.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, very much so. So this was, uh, this was very helpful for me, especially when I was just getting into looking into my ancestral practices and a lot of, uh, reestablishing what Catholicism means to me and for me in my practice. So maybe it'll be helpful. I did also, after all this, I wrote like a stream of consciousness paragraph about Christianity that I don't know if I want to read anymore.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

you can read it then cut it out if you don't

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

It was just a lot of, how a lot of Christianity today is very externally based, and a lot of it is about. externally judging people who aren't living the right way that you would consider it. And a lot of condemning people for things and it's less about your own personal intimate relationships with the divine in whatever way you want to call it. And I feel like so much of it, It's not, maybe posturing is not the right word, but maybe it is the right word. But, uh, it just feels bad and I feel like people are just checking off boxes of like, Oh, I went to confession. Oh, I went to my Sunday service. So I'm a better Christian than you are. And they're not developing or exploring things. They're just doing things the way people are telling them to do.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

it definitely seems kind of more social and not actually spiritual deeply.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

yes, it feels like you are, you're going to your weekly club and everybody is on the, you know, the same page. And if you don't agree with something, you get kicked out of the club.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

just say, look, I have the Christian hat. I wear my Christian hat.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah. Look at, hey, fellow Christian hats. Yeah. And it, it just, I don't want to say it feels inauthentic, but I feel like. You should have curiosity, and you should be able to ask questions without fear. And I am still doing that. I am not, I'm not pretending to have it all figured out and be like, I know how to do Catholicism the right

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

really

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Mm hmm. Mm

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

I think it is str Have you ever met This is gonna sound rude, and I don't really want it to sound that way, but I don't really know how else to say it. I have met very few What I would consider true Christians in my life Where I meet them and they have a spiritual holiness about them. They have a peace within them And I feel that They are truly Walking in jesus's footsteps and they are open minded and compassionate and sympathetic but they love God and themselves and others and it's just when I meet a what I And calling a quote unquote true Christian, I'm like, oh,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

This is so different from everything else I've experienced up until this point.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

people.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

And you feel so safe.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah. Few and far between. I have not experienced many.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Yeah.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Most of the ones I, well, I don't know if, I guess Mormons aren't Christians.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I don't know the specifics

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

know if that counts.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Mormonism.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

mean they, they celebrate Jesus as the Son of God. So, All I'm saying is the, I mean, the nicest, like, most genuinely, quote, Christian people I've met have been Mormons.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

say they are very nice. They are very polite people. So that's really, I don't know, I kind of just lost it towards the end. And I've been thinking a lot about, like, Christianity in general, in ways that are hard for me to concretely articulate, but I'm having a lot of thoughts, as we all should.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

to keep bombarding you with questions, but I'm deeply fascinated.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

is, this is the, the open platform now. I

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Open floor.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

to say.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

After this research that you've done, and how you just said that you've been pondering Your relationship with Christianity and being a folk Catholic person and everything. After you've done all this research, is there any sort of restructuring or things in the future that you now feel like you want to try? Is there any new, are there any, like you were saying earlier, holes that you've now noticed that you, Maybe have more of an idea of an avenue that you want to go down after doing this research? Or are you still, just after this research, realizing that there are more possibilities? Like, how are you feeling now?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

I feel like largely most of my restructuring and deconstruction and reconstruction has already kind of been done in the way that makes sense to me. This was a very, like, affirming thing for me. There are still, I'm, I'm always constantly feeling like something's missing, just generally speaking. I always feel like there's something else that I could be incorporating. But I, it does, cause I still have like a weird feelings and relationship toward like capital G God. So that is something that like, I'm trying to unpack a little bit more and like, integrate into my practice in a way that doesn't make me like, twinge a

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

that that is probably largely due to we were talking about, your view on Modern Christianity, and the Christians around you, and you probably internally don't want to associate with your perception of them, you know?

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

cause I'll even like, I'll, I'll read a prayer or a psalm or whatever, and this was written like hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years ago when Christianity was very different but I'm still reading it in the context of today where like sometimes, like I'll hear it in like, what's that fucking mega preacher's name? Like Joel, Joel Osteen? Is that Joel? I think it's Austin, I think. But like, I'll hear it, like, in his voice and his cadence and I'm like, ugh, yuck.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

It

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

It's just like an echo of a memory that you've

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah, it's just like, the things I would hear growing up where I'm like, oh, that feels bad and I feel like I need to unpack that more so I can have like, a better relationship to capital G God.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

the narrative.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

Yeah. Which takes It's a very long time, sometimes it takes an entire lifetime. So the work will never be over probably. So thanks for listening I guess, I don't really have anything else. Thanks for, if you made it this far, thanks for sitting through it. Uh, always be curious, always feel emboldened to ask questions and not just listen to what people tell you because they told you to. I think you should be, uh, you should, you should be an independent thinker and use your big juicy beautiful brain for

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Especially within your own practice, I think it's easy for us to limit ourselves within our own practice. And say, well, this is who I am. This is what I do. When there are opportunities always for us to expand out of our comfort zone.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

you had told me even like three years ago I would be Catholic again. I would have laughed in your face. Absolutely. And, but I am. And I do, I feel more fulfilled by it. So, Life is funny like that. It is not a concrete thing. It is fluid. It is always moving. I feel like especially now, in the current day and age, A lot of folk practice is centered on community and helping each other and I feel like now more than ever that is very important for reasons that are very obvious. So, look into your own. If you feel so inclined, look into your own folk practices. Figure out what your people were doing. And just be good to each other. That's all I got.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

Beautiful. I love this.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Well, listeners, if you have any experience with This practice, or if you just wanna tell us about your own ancestral practices,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

you know way more about brow hurry than I do, please, write in. Um,

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Coven pod@gmail.com. Death as in death, coven as in coven, pod as in podcast@gmail.com, and we have an Instagram at death coven pod. Any other announcements business. Pleasures.

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

pleasures, well now we're talking. I think I'm gonna watch a movie today, I think that's gonna be my pleasure.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

Alright, so, by the power of three,

river_1_01-26-2025_101229

And so it is.

skye_1_01-26-2025_101142

And so it is.

poop_1_01-26-2025_101142

and so it is.