Listening Leader: Lead Large But Love First Ep 33

Pressure tests our leadership, but it also reveals where we’re rooted. We sit down with marketing executive and servant leader Tammy Ousley to unpack what it really means to become a listening leader—someone who can hold big goals, tight timelines, and complex relationships without losing alignment with God’s will. Tammy shares how reading the Bible cover to cover transformed familiar verses into context-rich guidance, and how those scriptures echo back during the day in surprising ways. From choosing translations that clarify meaning to marking up a physical Bible, she shows how simple habits build a resilient inner compass.

We dive into the tension between bold planning and faithful surrender. Tammy is candid about loving plans A through Z, then learning to pause and ask, “Am I within God’s will?” That humility shifts everything—how she prioritizes under pressure, how she resets after missteps, and how she navigates conflict at scale. Prayer becomes a real-time operating system, not a last resort, and love becomes a leadership strategy: seeing her team as God’s people, protecting dignity, and building partnerships through empathy. The result is a culture where clarity rises, collaboration deepens, and outcomes improve without forcing them.

Tammy also speaks to women leading in secular environments. Her counsel is practical: keep scripture present, work as unto the Lord, and find your tribe—the colleagues and mentors who help you stay grounded. When promotions or breakthroughs arrive, the credit returns to God’s hand rather than human gatekeepers. If you’ve been craving a way to lead large while listening deeper, this conversation offers tools, stories, and hope for the road. Subscribe, share with a friend who needs encouragement at work, and leave a review telling us one listening habit you’re trying this week.

Stay in the flow—subscribe wherever you listen, watch on YouTube, and download free devotionals at iamkelleyjohnson.com.

YouTube https://www.youtube.com/@iamkelleyjohnson

Instagram: instagram.com/iamkelleyjohnson

Looking for leadership community?
RAYAH is my Spirit-led leadership cohort for Christian women who want to grow in both spiritual authority and executive excellence. Learn more and join the interest list here https://www.iamkelleyjohnson.com/rayah

EMERGE! Rise-up, Be Fearless, Take Possession of Your Purpose https://a.co/d/hrZWQGr
Kelley's book about overcoming trauma to find your God-given purpose.

INFINITE: The Power of Love https://a.co/d/51Fy4eq
A six-session Bible study about diversity, equity and inclusion.

Kelley Johnson is a creator, builder, and catalyst who helps leaders achieve breakthrough—personally, professionally, and spiritually. She spent 20 years in corporate leadership before founding KEIRUS, a learning and talent management firm serving thousands of leaders worldwide. 

This show is not a substitute for professional therapy or advice. If you need professional support, we encourage you to seek a qualified mental health, medical, financial, legal, pastoral or other accredited professional.

---
Keywords: Christian women, Spirit-led living, Holy Spirit, faith podcast, women in leadership, working ...

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Welcome to In the Flow, a podcast for women pursuing God's Spirit in life and leadership. I'm Kelly Johnson, and this season we're exploring what it means to become the listening leader. Because clarity and alignment with the Lord create a more impactful leader. Each conversation invites you to slow down, lean in, and lead from a place of attunement with the Lord so that we can grow in spirit-led wisdom and authentic

Setting The Season: Listening Leadership

SPEAKER_00 0:36

power. Let's get in the flow. I am so excited to share this conversation with you today with Tammy Owsley. I met Tammy almost two years ago through an executive coaching partnership, and it has been such a privilege and honor to journey with her as she leads her team as a chief marketing officer for Guidestone Financial Services. Tammy is a wife, a mom of two boys, and an executive with big scope. And so today's conversation around being

Meet Tammy: CMO And Servant Leader

SPEAKER_00 1:17

a listening leader provides us a little bit of a peek into what it's like to lead when the pressure is high and the scale is large. Tammy is a marketing maven, a data storyteller, but more importantly, she's a servant leader, and I think that you will see that come through loud and clear. So join me as we get in the flow with Tammy Ousley. Well, Tammy, I am excited that we are getting together finally. I know it's been kind of a work in progress to get this scheduled for us to talk about your journey of being a marketing executive and how you listen to God in your day-to-day. So thanks for being on In the Flow.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. Glad to have the opportunity to share.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

So let's kind of start with the basics. Um, if you think about being a listening leader or aspiring to be a listening leader, how have you personally come to recognize God's voice?

SPEAKER_01 2:23

No, I grew up in church from very young. My uncle was the pastor. My family made up most of the congregation. We were there probably every night of the week. Uh Sunday, three services. Monday was choir rehearsal, Wednesday was prayer night, prayer meeting

Learning God’s Voice Through Scripture

SPEAKER_01 2:45

as we call it.

SPEAKER_00 2:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

And then Saturday was something for kids, for teens. And I was the teens for Christ president, which is something that we had in our association.

SPEAKER_03 2:57

Of course you were the president.

SPEAKER_01 3:01

And so, I mean, in doing that, I had a lot of opportunity to like speak all over Texas, right? Going to different churches and different congregations. And I actually could pull together a a speech and then utilize a scripture to fill in the gap. I mean, they were things that were more known, like for God to love the world, or uh God is not giving me the spirit of fear, and it would it would go to a point, right? And then it wasn't until maybe 2020 that I decided I was gonna read the Bible, right? Um, I got a little babble app and I was like, I'm gonna read the Bible for myself. And I read it, and then I had context for things that probably I'd never considered, right? Like there are these scriptures that you can just spout off, but actually having context for things really helped me, right? And I also realized in having context for things that were scripturally sound versus things that I could just recite, um, it also showed me how God was talking to me. And so it wasn't probably until these last four or five years that I realized that everything that I needed or everything that I had questions about was in the word, right? You often hear people saying, God told me, or God said to me, or uh he came to me in a dream. And I would often think, well, he's not coming over here. He ain't talking to me. Like, what are y'all doing differently? Y'all at a higher level of Christianity than I am. And, you know, it wasn't until I really read the Bible cover to cover that I realized this is how he speaks to me. Um, and it wasn't just reading the Bible and then hearing from God, right? It was reading his word, letting it seep in, having true devotion with it, and then realizing how it shows up throughout my day, how it shows up in a situation, how you know you write these scriptures on your heart for good reason because you need them when your heart is aching, or you need them when you're not, you're not clear on something. Sometimes the heart can lead us astray. And it always comes back in that way. So it's not like, you know, I learned it's not some, you know, booming voice from on high, right? That says, Tammy, should, you know. It is in his word bringing it back to me time and time again. And I've, you know, I've read the Bible now twice, cover to cover since 2020. And I'm actually starting again in 2026 because some things have gone down in 2025, right? And just a little bit, just a little bit. Just a little bit. And I realized, you know, that I needed to to draw closer. Um, and the best way for me to do that is just reading his word.

SPEAKER_00 6:10

Love that on so many levels because number one, I think that unfortunately a lot of us can rest on our laurels of I go to church. Right. And we rely on a pastor, a teacher, a Bible study teacher, whoever, to teach us the word. And then oftentimes many of us don't spend that intimate quality time in the word. So I love that you are starting there, that hearing

Seeing God In Everyday Signals

SPEAKER_00 6:40

um the voice of God starts with knowing his word, knowing the context. There's a scripture that says, faith comes by hearing, hearing the word of God. And I just love that you are starting there. And then also you're bringing in that element of it's not just reading and getting the context, it's also paying attention after you read the word. Observing, oh, someone else just refer to a verse that I just read last night in my Bible reading plan. Or, you know, there's a billboard that has the word sheep on it, right? And I'm or whatever, you know, like there's these little little cues. Um I remember one time I was driving behind a truck and they were a window company and I forgot the the the marketing slogan that was on the back of the truck. It was something about seeing clearly through the windows or something like that. And I'd been asking the Lord for like clarity, clarity. And I just it was like he was speaking to me through this window truck. On this truck. On this truck. But had I had How does that happen?

SPEAKER_01 7:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:56

How does that happen? So randomly. Because I think I was praying in the car at the time. I think that's what it was. I think I was praying about clarity, and then I see this window truck talking about clarity. I'm like, okay, Lord, I hear you, I see you, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Yep. Yeah. I mean, it's it's just amazing how, you know, out here as a kid, or, you know, if you're in some Southern Baptist church, he's an on-time God, right? Like that's nowhere in the Word, right? But when you read the Word and you you understand the Word and you get closer to Him in prayer, you definitely understand that He's an on-time God. On-time God in answers, on-time God in listening, on-time God in helping you prepare for things that sometimes you don't even know that are coming. But that's how I've I've learned to listen and to get closer uh and uh have direction that's not my own, or resting, as you said, on my laurels of what I think I know versus what I do know now.

SPEAKER_00 9:04

I'm just now about to finish. I've about 40 more days left in my read the Bible in a year plan. So I'm close. I feel like I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. For me, this is only my second time going from kind of cover to cover chronologically. And but the first time I read the Bible all the way through, it's been a good like 10 or 15 years ago. So there's been a big gap for me. And I'm just curious because you're now about to enter your third time of reading the Bible. Did you notice anything

Reading, Listening, And Translations

SPEAKER_00 9:40

differently about the way God spoke to you through scripture from the first time to the second? I did.

SPEAKER_01 9:47

Um, and I will say the first time was eye-opening, right? The second time was, let me do it again, because I really enjoyed it. But I may have listened more than I was reading. And that made a really, really big difference in reading his word and listening to his word are two different, two different things. And so in that first one, I read cover to cover. And the second one, I was probably a little bit more on my Bible lab while I'm watering the grass or whatever. Um, and I was probably doing more listening uh on the second round. And I don't think it was, I don't think I went as deep. So I don't know if I learned uh the context in a different way. I don't know if I, if I learned, you know, here's another lesson or another nugget in this passage of scripture than maybe I missed because it was a little bit more disconnected from it. Now, going into third round, I am actually physically reading a Bible, right? And so I take what's coming out of the Bible app of what it suggests that I read for the day, but I'm physically reading from the Bible and highlighting and making notations and putting little sticky notes here and there, which I think is making this experience. I mean, I'm a month and a half in, way better than even the first one.

SPEAKER_00 11:17

Wow. Do you ever like alternate translations or read it in one and then go read it in another?

SPEAKER_01 11:23

You know, I think the Bible app allows you to be able to do that easily. But I grew up on the new international version. That's what we used in my church growing up. And so it's probably my go-to. And then I went to later in in life in my 20s, I went to a African-American Episcopal church, and they used the the American standard, I believe. And so I got, you know, kind of that way. Right now I'm actually reading from the CSB version, the Christian Standard Bible. That's often what we use at work. And so I've started in on that. I think it's it's different, but it is the same exact word, and it's allowing me to see it in a maybe in a different way, in a different context. I also will go and and look at the message because I feel like it's as plain as day. I feel like when I read the message version, it is likely talking directly to me and makes it so incredibly plain uh and removes all the speak. As I, as I introduce my kids to the Bible, I realize we probably couldn't start with King James. Um, even though that's what we grew up on. Exactly. Exactly. You know, they know John 3.16 for God to love the world that he gave his only begotten son, right? Like it's, you know, it's those kind of words that they're like, what? Huh? Um, so even for them, I've had to like switch it up and and make sure that it's it's explanatory. We were going over Psalms 23, and uh I think I was teaching them the NIB version, and you know, we'll be saying it together, and I'll realize that, you know, I'm saying you prepared a table before me in the presence of my enemies, you anoint my head with oil, my cup overflows. Surely, goodness and mercy. And they're like, We're not, we're not, we don't say it like that, right? Um, and so it's but I think it allows you to see it without some of the language that maybe is comfortable, but not fully explanatory and always readily applicable in in thinking about the different versions.

SPEAKER_00 13:37

Yeah, yeah. It's funny. So my grandmother in her house, she had the Lord's Prayer, like a plaque in her house. Of course. Yeah, who did? Who didn't? And the Ten Commandments. You know what? She didn't have the Ten Commandments.

SPEAKER_01 13:50

It was we had a plaque with the Lord's Prayer and the Ten Commandments, and it had these little doodads around it. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 13:57

Actually, you know what? I take that back. I think she might have had the Ten Commandments, but I didn't pay attention to that one. It was a little rebellion in me. But the Lord's Prayer was in her house, and it was, of course, King James,

Humility, Love, And Team Leadership

SPEAKER_00 14:10

because back then that's that's all there was. And to this day, when I recite the key uh the Lord's Prayer, it's always the Hallow would be that day. Yes, like Hallow would be that day. Hallow would be that like it's still there, and it just speaks to me, even though back then as a kid, the thou's and the thines didn't make sense. But I love, again, just what you're saying about being rooted in scripture, because I think that can also prevent us from going astray. You know, the scripture says that my sheep hear my voice and the voice of a stranger they will not follow. If we don't recognize God's voice, because he's only going to say things that are from his word. Yeah. So if we don't recognize the word, we won't recognize when he's speaking to us, even though he will also use other methods beyond scripture to highlight scripture. Right. So something somebody says, a window truck that you're behind, or whatever it is, uh, he will use other things. He even used a donkey in the Old Testament to speak, right? So he will use other things, but it's always going to be rooted and grounded in scripture.

SPEAKER_01 15:32

Exactly. There are other amplifications that we see throughout life, right? Throughout our day, throughout situations that we're going through, but it's always rooted in Word.

unknown 15:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:43

So let's make this even more practical. You lead a marketing team. You have a lot of competing deadlines, a lot of competing stakeholders, and different projects and programs that could be challenging when you have the context of all the other things that you're juggling as a team. How do you hear from God when the stakes are really high?com and click on the resources section to get your free copy today.

SPEAKER_01 16:51

You know, um, I think you know this about me. I am always a woman with a plan, right? I've got plan A, B, C, D through Z. Because if one thing doesn't work out, I always want to be prepared. And I think that has sometimes contributed to me not pausing to listen to God in high stakes. But what I've learned over time is, you know, I always have to come back. He's always going to bring me back. Whether the situation gets out of control, whether someone's unhappy on one end versus the other, he's always going to bring it back to him. And a lot of times it is, Tammy, are you within my will? Are you operating within my will? And sometimes operating within his will is not my plan that I've laid out. And so it has been, I will tell you, it's something that I struggle with because I always want to put my plan out front and then I want the Lord to bless it, right? Like, yes, you know, Lord, here's the plan. Now you'll tell me whether or not, you know, it will work, right? Because I'm gonna walk up to this door and you'll let me know whether it's it's a good plan because you'll open the door. But then I also realize that sometimes I go ahead of God because I feel like he's put me in this situation before or I've been here before. And what worked then, you know, with his blessing, I expect it to work now. So bringing old tactics into a new season where he's probably trying to teach me something in this new season. I continue, you know, to kind of be bullhorned, you know, with my own plan. And every once in a while I have to stop. And and not every once in a while, probably every single time I try to apply an old tactic to something new, it doesn't work. And I'm like, Lord, but I've been here before. You've got me, right? And you did this thing before. Why aren't you doing it now? Um, so somehow I end up, you know, back at the father's feet. The other thing is full-on prayer, right? I am, I am nothing without prayer. It is where I feel calm. It is where um I

Parenting, Community, And Discernment

SPEAKER_01 19:30

probably let my inhibitions down a bit, to where sometimes as I'm praying, right, I can hear God seeping in to say, Well, Tammy, you know. And I didn't ask you to do that. So it's prayer, you know. My grandmother taught me very young, and I I used to think this was always so strange until I got maybe young adult, where she said, Go and find your prayer closet, right? And castrate yourself, you know, that King King James version, castrate yourself before the Lord, right? And and then you will hear from God. And sometimes don't leave that closet until you hear from him. So those are ways that I do try to slow down and and and listen or be intentional about listening. And when I hear from him, everything else, whether it's work, whether it's deadlines, whether it's people, whether it's competing priorities, usually fall in place. I also think that I am probably somewhat of an empath. I lead with people first, um, people first mindset. And what I realize is when I do that, when I when I try to think about people first, it allows me to see myself as purely a couldn't do it. That God has given me this opportunity and the authority in this place with these people that are also his people. And so um it it it grounds me in a way to say, Lord, you have given me this team, you have given me this project, you have given me, you know, this cross-team responsibility. How do I ensure that I am leading your people in a way that you would have me to? Because you care about them more than I do. And you have put me in this place, right, to be a conduit of your love. We don't often talk about like loving your team, right? But I have found when I lead with that, Kelly, it has helped me tremendously to win people over, to create better partnerships, to build relationships with sometimes the most difficult of partners. Starting from the basics of truly loving people keeps me grounded and keeps. Me on track. And when I'm able to do that, we are together as a team, able to win. We're able to flourish in relationships. And I can rest knowing that I did right by God's people.

SPEAKER_00 22:13

Yes, that is fire. There's there were so many nuggets in that, Tammy. And I have to kind of rewind a little bit. So, yes, you are a woman with a plan because I've seen it, but you left out a little detail. Okay. So I'm I'm going to tell on you right now, oh, to all the listeners. It's not just plans A through Z. Yeah. They're going to be nicely curated and aesthetically designed slides. I think it's important. You go have your packaging. There's probably gonna there's gonna be a production element, you know, some video content.

SPEAKER_03 22:50

Just pins.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

Which is why, I mean, you know, you and I speak that language. And it's one of the things that I love about you and can appreciate. I know the Lord, in many of our sessions together, was probably laughing at us as we partnered on things. But jokes aside, one of the things that I loved about working with you was it was very clear early on how much you cared about people. And I've coached a lot of executives, and many of them with their mouths will say that they care about their people. But few demonstrated it at the level that you do on a day-to-day basis. And I think that you're not actually saying this right now, so I'm going to say it. You're saying it without saying it, which is this listening to God, listening to his voice requires loving people. And it also requires humility.

SPEAKER_03 23:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 23:53

And I think that's the part that you're not explicitly saying right now, but I want to just pull the string on that because I have seen you many a times work through and wrestle with challenges and opportunities from a posture of humility, asking questions like, well, you

Faith At Work In Secular Spaces

SPEAKER_00 24:15

know, did I say that okay? Or could I have handled that differently? That requires humility. And also asking questions is how we hear more from the Lord. Yes, he's going to speak through scripture, but but scripture also says David inquired of the Lord. And David didn't just ask one time.

SPEAKER_01 24:41

Why are you doing this to me? Why? Why? And uh It was a sermon, this is probably 20 years ago, that I had heard around it's okay to ask God questions, right? But it's never okay to not expect to hear from him. Right? Um and so I am, I probably look inward first, right? I think you've seen this. I will always ask, is it me?

SPEAKER_02 25:09

Yes. Could I have was it me? Could I have done something differently?

SPEAKER_01 25:14

Could I have influenced this situation in a different way? Or did I get us off track? Or, you know, was there a different response that I could have given sometimes in in testing or trying times? I also think about you mentioning the humility is I never want to be seen as too high and mighty. I am a servant who is serving others. And I come and I sit in that posture quite um quite often of I am yet a servant that is serving God's people in this role as a marketing executive. And you have placed me here to be a servant. And what I do with that is a reflection on you, because hopefully you'll see that I am approaching this with a certain amount of humility and asking and seeking and not to do it on my own will when I get to the point of being able to abandon my plan, understanding that uh you're the reason that I am here for such a time as this.

SPEAKER_00 26:27

Yeah, yeah. So, what has helped you over the years, not just even in the current role you're in, but just as you think about your life, even as a mom, as a wife, as a daughter, what's helped you to really fine-tune your discernment, right? So you hear from the Lord, but then sort of like, okay, I think I understand what you're saying that you want me to do. Are there, is there anything that has really helped you fine-tune how you hear from him, how you understand and discern what he's saying?

SPEAKER_01 27:00

You know, um, I have two boys. And uh being a parent, you bring this baby home, and I don't really know what to do. I I don't, I don't know about those people with night nurses and all that good stuff, but I was lost, right? I was lost in trying to figure out, you know, when the baby should be fed and when they should be napping and how long they should be napping, and you know, when was it okay to bring the baby out? You know, so all of these things were kind of questions that I had. But those were very basic, I found out. It's as the kids got older, how do I

Finding Your Tribe And Belonging

SPEAKER_01 27:40

ensure that I am passing on, number one, a love for the Lord, but that I am being the parent that I should be in accordance to who God would want me to be. That probably straightened me right up, right? Because I couldn't do things out of both sides of my mouth. Kids are very black and white, right? Like you said yes today, you said no, no, to, you know, tomorrow. I don't understand. And so seeking that kind of guidance out in his word from the Lord probably helped me to attune to parenting a lot quicker than I did in the workplace. I would say the work that we did together last year in 2025 was incredibly helpful, um, not just for me, but hopefully for my team, of being able to look at things through God's lens, right? Um, you know, if there is conflict, why? And what should we see in between this, which is love for each other? I have uh I introduced a new scripture this year for our team, and it is to love one another humbly. And if we lead with love, if we lead for with caring for each other, if we lead from a humble place, right, then that likely alleviates a lot of maybe consternation or conflict on the team, or it also leads to hopefully better collaboration, a deeper understanding, putting yourself in someone else's shoes. And then I have the blessing of having some good girlfriends. We had gone off to see Beyoncé, it was me and two of my other really good friends in May in Chicago. Every lunch, every dinner that we had came right back around to how good God is. And it's having those kind of friends that will stop you in your track with something that's so commonly said of, girl, pray about it. Right? It seems so common, you hear it often, right? It's words that you used a lot, but it will literally stop me in my tracks and say, you know what? I haven't done that till its full extent for this situation. And so it's it's nice to have those reminders and also to know that I'm not alone in this. A girl, I'll be praying for you. Um, I'll be praying that you get the clarity that you need. I'll be praying that you, you know, you you find what you're looking for. And so I think a mix of having to jump start in two feet, you know, um forward with with children allowed me to kind of say, you know, wait a minute, am I doing this right? Right. And seeking out God's word on how I'm guiding those that he has blessed me with. But also, you know, the work that we've done, uh, that was probably life-changing for me. Um, because maybe I had done it in spits and spats, or I pray to God about a particular situation, but looking at it through his lens, whatever the goal was, the priority, the hurdle we're trying to jump over was incredibly powerful for me. And then just understanding that this is a team sport, right? So having some friends around me and family and mentors that can guide me spiritually as well.

SPEAKER_00 31:31

Well, thank you. Thank you. It working with you and the team for, you know, the time that we did was was incredible for me and life-changing for me as well. Um, so I'm super grateful to thank you for helping us.

SPEAKER_01 31:47

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 31:48

Well, thank you for letting me help. Uh, it was, yeah. It's it's not about me. It wasn't about me, but I was grateful that the Lord allowed me to get something out of it inwardly. So anyway, that that's a conversation for another day. We're about to wrap up. And I would love for you to maybe just put on your mentor hat. You mentioned mentoring. Yep. Speak to the women who maybe are in a workplace where it's not a Christian organization like Guidestone where you work right now. Maybe they can't send a scripture to their team and say, hey, this is our scripture for the year. What counsel, what mentoring or advice would you give to women who want to still love the people that they work with, but maybe they gotta be a little low key about it. Or maybe they're new to even trying to listen to God at work, like on a daily practical level. Any advice?

SPEAKER_01 32:48

You know, um, the advice that I would give first and foremost is that you are not alone. I worked for a secular company for most of my career. And just like I brought God and good Jesus to this current organization that I'm a part of, I brought them there too. I remember in in 2020, it was COVID. Uh, I'd started a new role uh where I thought it was gonna be one thing, right? And it turned out to be something completely different. Number one, COVID hit.

SPEAKER_02 33:24

Right.

SPEAKER_01 33:25

And a role that I thought uh I would get lots of FaceTime and ability to thrive and and maybe put my skills on display and to show everybody why I was selected for the role. Um, that didn't happen. And I think what happened that changed the game for me in that moment was leaning on his word. So I would keep, and I changed my my office setup, but I would keep scriptures with note cards on my desk, and I would flip through them probably every morning. Remind me of the fact that I am not doing this alone, alone. He is with us everywhere we are, right? Whether you're sitting in a faith-based organization or a Christian organization like I am, or you're at a company that uh would look at you twice if you said, you know, to your employees that you love them, right? And so I I think it's important to remember that regardless of where we are, he is there also. And and then something else that I would I would encourage you guys to do is find your tribe. They exist at every company, right? Find your tribe somewhere that you can seek encouragement, somewhere that you can sort of let your hair down in a sense, um, somewhere that you can also get sound advice, right? Me finding my tribe was super, super important because sometimes those were the only people that would get me through. Um I would also say that you can be Christ-like in a in a place that is not, because that is who God sent to this particular role, to this particular project, to lead this team. You can always lead with a Christ-like attitude, even when others don't even understand it.

SPEAKER_02 35:29

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 35:31

And using that as your compass and as your censor I think furthers you along the path than leaning on anything else ever would. I I think even in spite of now being blessed to work in a Christian organization, I always thought I'm taking God to work with me. Right? It's it's me, it's me and Jesus. And I I realized having that attitude helped propel my career. Because I wasn't depending on man. I walk walked in every day saying that I'm working as if I am working for the Lord. And with that comes the rewards that only God can give. So the promotion that you didn't see coming, the extra bonus that you didn't see coming. It's not because man did it, it's because you were following in line with his word and his will, and he blessed you. I think so many times we can look out at the people that we work with or that we work for, and we think it's those people that have us in their hand, right? Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. We learned from a very early age that God has me in his hand. And in keeping that in mind and keeping that at the forefront, like I said, I think we'll will will further your career, will, you know, advance your career in ways that, um, you know, seeking mentorships and a sponsor and, you know, all of the language that people use, you know, to have someone to speak on your behalf. I think Carla Harris always says, you know, you want someone to bang on the table for you, right? God can do it too. And God does it, right? So I think sometimes it's not, it's important to not just focus on the things that are around you and focus in on God who has everything around you in control.

SPEAKER_00 37:38

Yes. Yes. Whew, okay. This was so good. I know at first you're like, what? You want me to come on your podcast? Yes. But listen, you you were dropping nuggets so much, like you you gotta come back. I don't know what we're gonna talk about next season, but we might even need a part two for this season because I think, especially the tribe part. I hear a lot of women, I meet a lot of women, high capacity, high achieving. Yeah. But I have had women one-on-one, sidebar like Kelly, I don't, I don't have friends.

SPEAKER_03 38:17

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 38:17

I don't have, I don't have my tribe. And even women who go to church. Like I've had women who are active in their church where perhaps the makeup of their church, there's not a lot of working women or women in leadership. And so it's like, we all love the Lord, but my day-to-day life experience is different, is different. Um, and then maybe at work, if you're sometimes you're the only woman in a room. Yep. And then if you add in a woman of color, sometimes you're the only woman of color, right? And so I just meet a lot of women who feel isolated in their walk. Yes. And it's hard to find women who are sold out to Jesus, who are high capacity, high achieving, and and and and, right? And has a tribe. And and has a tribe. So anyway, this was great. Thank you so much. Is there anything any way that you want people to maybe connect with you? LinkedIn or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 39:25

You know, I'm on LinkedIn, LinkedIn slash Tammy Owsley, uh O-U-S-L-E-Y. I think it says Adams Owsley, but that's where you can find me. I'm not always great about posting, but I'm trying to do better. Uh share. I have shared probably three times this year. I'm very proud of myself, Kelly.

SPEAKER_00 39:46

You know what? The algorithm didn't show it to me, so I gotta go look for it. Go look forward because I did it. Okay, okay. I'm proud of you. But yeah, that's it. It only took 18 months, but okay, I'm proud of her.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

Look at me, three in 45 days. I I think I'm winning. I think I'm winning. I think I'm winning, Kelly.

SPEAKER_00 40:07

You win it. You win it. I'm so proud.

SPEAKER_01 40:10

All right, thank you so much for having me. Thank you. I really appreciate this.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

Thank you for flowing with me today. If this episode strengthened your spirit and leadership, be sure to subscribe and share it with a friend. Remember, deeper clarity starts in community. Visit IamKellyJohnson.com for free devotionals and to learn more about Raya Circles, where faith and leadership truly go together in the flow.