Hoxton Life

Football, Financial Planning, and Finding the Right Fit: Stuart McDonald’s Story

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"I Didn’t Realise How Big This Could Be Until I Joined” - Stuart McDonald’s Story at Hoxton Wealth

In this episode of Hoxton Life, Sam Oakes heads to Liverpool to sit down with Stuart McDonald, a financial planner who made a bold move after 14 years in the industry.

Stuart left a comfortable position at a traditional firm to join Hoxton Wealth - and within just one year, he's now Director of the Liverpool office. But this isn’t just about a new job title. It’s about stepping into an environment that finally matched his ambition.

In this episode, Stuart opens up about:

  • Why he left his old firm after 8 years
  • How he built a niche working with professional footballers, coaches, and club executives
  • The growing demand for international financial planning - and how Hoxton makes it seamless
  • Why intrapreneurship at Hoxton beats going it alone
  • What it’s really like building a practice inside a fast-growth, supportive business

“There’s a lot of noise around athletes - my job is to help them tune it out and focus on their future,” Stuart says.

This episode is for financial planners who feel stuck. For those who want the freedom to grow, but not the stress of going solo. For the entrepreneurial thinkers who are ready to build something bigger - with the right people around them.

Watch the full episode now. And if you're curious about what intrapreneurship looks like at Hoxton, search Hoxton Life on Spotify, Apple, or YouTube.

Ready to start your international financial planning career?

Hoxton Wealth is looking for ambitious individuals ready to take their careers to the next level. Whether you're interested in international financial planning, compliance, client servicing, or marketing roles within the financial sector, we offer unparalleled opportunities for growth and success.

Don’t miss a beat! Subscribe to our YouTube channel to watch full podcast episodes featuring insights from those that work for Hoxton and some of our special guests and partners. Stay connected by following us on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, and X for more exclusive content.

Curious about our career opportunities? Visit our website to explore open positions and learn more about joining the Hoxton Wealth team. Your journey in international financial planning starts here!

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Speaker 2:

You are a big Everton fan. Liverpool's a big football city, right? Does that mean you work with footballers?

Speaker 1:

The key is that they are publicly exposed individuals, if you like. So how it's dealt with with confidentiality, with vulnerabilities, with all that type of stuff, and the way it's dealt with as a business, particularly around their finances it's one of the most private things that anyone can keep quiet. Small regulated IFA businesses may take on a member of staff a year.

Speaker 2:

This place does not move slowly. I describe Hoxton as an intrapreneurial environment. How is the Hoxton intrapreneurial?

Speaker 1:

environment benefiting you and how you work. It's nice to see how the international market works and with the budget and the announcements around people leaving the UK, I'm having more of those conversations than ever. I think the migration of wealthy people abroad will drive that sort of desire to be internationally focused.

Speaker 2:

So on the other side, looking in before you joined to what you know now, what's the biggest thing that's really made you go? Oh, wow, I'm in the right place, stuart. Thanks so much for joining me today on the Hoxton Life podcast in sunny Liverpool, so I've obviously brought the sun with me from Dubai you must have. So thank me for that one mate. Yes, thank you very much. I was just admiring that beautiful view of the Merseyside. I've never seen the Merseyside. It just reminds me of that ferry across the Mersey.

Speaker 1:

That was quite a massive hit, wasn't it with the old?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, back in the day. Yeah, definitely, right, okay, so you're a big football man, though, aren't you?

Speaker 1:

Well, I'm an Evertonian, so it depends what you call big football. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Now have Everton had a good year?

Speaker 1:

I don't follow football, no, but they've had a few poor years recently, just about survived on a couple in the Premier League. So yeah, it's been a difficult time to be a Blue, but you know long suffering, as you say.

Speaker 2:

So yeah, just behind that wall there is the Anfield Rap. Yes, and that's one of the top podcasts like, I think, a fanzine type podcast for Liverpool it is. And I met Emma and Emma offered to allow me to use their podcast studio with a great big Liverpool side in the back, so I didn't because of you.

Speaker 1:

Thank you, mate. Yeah, appreciate it, you're welcome.

Speaker 2:

Right, great stuff Enough about football, because that's about as much a football chat that I've got. So tell us a little bit about you then. So you're here at Hoxton. You've been here for how long?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, since October, so five months now.

Speaker 2:

Fantastic.

Speaker 1:

What were you doing before? Same sort of thing Financial advisor. I've been advising for eight years prior at my previous firm. Been in the business now since 2011. So yeah, a long time really. It's gone quickly. Strange to say that I've been doing this job for 14, 15 years altogether, really. So I started when I was 20 years old and I'm now 34, going on 35. So, and this is all I've really done professionally, okay.

Speaker 2:

So yeah, that's awesome. I've got a last question then. So eight years and then move to Hoxton Wealth? Yes, why.

Speaker 1:

Good question, definitely some serious pull factors from Hoxton which I'm sure you start to know. And I got to a point in my previous firm, as you do with smaller businesses, where we came to a bit of an impasse between me and where I wanted to go with the business and where the business was heading with the ownership at the time. So, yeah, decided to look elsewhere. I've known JJ for a couple of years so he reached out at the right time. We sat down, had a coffee, explained it, did a little bit of digging into the firm itself and, yeah, looked like a great opportunity. As I sort of went through the process and since I've been here I didn't really realize what the opportunity was and how big this thing can go and where we're heading as a company. So I'm very pleased with the last five months and what's gone on really.

Speaker 2:

So on, the other side looking in before you joined to what you know now. What's the biggest thing that's really made you go? Oh wow, I'm in the right place.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, the environment we're in, so the people that we're in, so the people that were in, the energy, the enthusiasm, all that kind of stuff. It's infectious and I realized I knew at the time the environment you're in matters and I'm probably looking back knowing it for a while.

Speaker 2:

Um, but yeah, definitely the environment that we're in is key. Did you feel like a bit of a big fish in a small pond in the, in the other environment, or was it like a? Was it a big, large corporate where you had to do certain things to climb the ladder?

Speaker 1:

No, not necessarily that. It was just probably a difference of opinion in terms of the direction of where we wanted to go, I'd say more than anything. So it was a smaller, independent firm. So, like many, you know, 90% of firms in the UK are individuals, one or two advisors, whatever it may be. It's a very traditional firm and I suppose all the things that get done here and where Hoxton is going is kind of was on the radar. But again, we were such a tiny player in that sense we couldn't really go and achieve those things and there was a difference, I say like a difference of opinion, between me and the owners of the business. So, yeah, just got to a point where I had to move on and find another opportunity. Another opportunity had a few conversations with a few other firms as well, which was interesting but this was a really different proposition and I really liked that.

Speaker 2:

What do you think about the whole international aspect of Hoxton?

Speaker 1:

Wealth. I was not concerned at first. I was intrigued by it. I had some reservations about it, because you hear about overseas investment management, you hear about overseas advisors, and you immediately, rightly or wrongly, go to ah okay, regulation, what you know? What's the setup? Um, I love it. Now. It's a great. It's such a great addition. I don't, I can't, I can't believe this. This time has come where we're having conversations with clients that I didn't think we'd ever have around, potentially offshoring or moving abroad and all that kind of stuff, and in previous roles I'd have been okay, well, I can't look after you anymore.

Speaker 2:

Well, that's really interesting. So, being in a firm that is multiple jurisdiction, it is international and you then are able, because we have that service, to be able to talk about it. What is the response from clients? What are they saying?

Speaker 1:

They kind of don't expect it, because I don't know, maybe see a financial advisory firm in Liverpool and having conversations for the first time you go actually. Yeah well, if you move to Australia, it's fine, we still look after you. Dubai, wherever you want to go, kind of thing we can look after you. And for several clients of mine now it's a case of their job, whatever that may be, can take them internationally quite regularly and with the budget and the announcements around people leaving the UK, I'm having more of those conversations than ever.

Speaker 2:

Do you find that people who are thinking about their retirement planning are they having conversations about moving abroad more than they were?

Speaker 1:

Yes, 100% yeah, without doubt, broadly more than they were. Yes, 100% yeah, without doubt. It's never been on the radar for some people I've spoke to over the years, but it's now coming up. Whether it's because of tax changes or general UK issues that they now face, whether it's healthcare or delays or whatever, or familiar issues, it doesn't really matter. But I think there's an attraction globally for people to either split their time or move entirely into somewhere new.

Speaker 2:

Do you feel that you have to explain the whole concept of international financial planning to clients to put them at ease? Do they have a negative view of international financial planning or are they quite inquisitive and interested to understand more?

Speaker 1:

I think it's a very positive response in the sense that, well, you don't have to leave a relationship with your advisor in the UK, we can just bring a member of the team into the conversation, somebody on the ground with an understanding of the tax jurisdictions and all that kind of stuff the legislation locally. It's important. Plus, we're not regulated necessarily to go and look after those clients if I was on my own doing it. So it's been really useful. I've spoken to a few of the international advisors already about basically working together on client work.

Speaker 1:

So again, I just wouldn't have had that opportunity. I've had to have found a for me. I always had a responsibility to find the client, the next firm, if it's not me. So I spent some time doing that in a previous life and it's a case of well, hopefully they're okay, because that referral then reflects on me in a way. If it's not the right firm and from the outside it's not always what it seems, um, but yeah, very confident, just saying well, as a member of our team, you can join the conversation in Tuesday we've got a chap called Mike Yule.

Speaker 2:

Yep um chicken Tuesday yeah, yeah, I know.

Speaker 2:

Mike yeah, lives over in Toulouse. Everyone knows Mike. We popped out there, we did a little documentary, yeah, and he's living a fantastic life out there. Chartered financial planner yeah, able to give advice to Americans those leaving the USA Maybe they're coming to Europe such as France. He can continue to advise those individuals because he's regulated there as well. Continue to advise those individuals because he's regulated there as well, plus the uk, and he's also got south african business as well.

Speaker 2:

Now he's such a prominent figure on on on linkedin. He's a very likable guy and he's well known within the financial planning community. One of the things that he started to generate is leads. So I think those within the financial planning community that once had a negative view of international financial advice and I understand why, because I did yep until I looked under the bonnet.

Speaker 2:

When I came, I was like, oh right, you're a fee-based financial planning company and I looked. I was like is this for real? And like I didn't believe it at first. Honestly, they exist, didn't think it, but he's generating upwards of nearly 30 leads a month from other financial planners from outside of Hoxton where they're passing their trusted clients across to him because they know he'll do a good job and they can't do it and that to me is a seal of approval and I love that. So I think again we have to position and I think this is what the podcast does quite well is that positioning us as a trusted company in the financial planning space that have international licenses, and I think other companies will start to follow suit a little bit?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think they'll have to.

Speaker 1:

I think the migration of wealthy people abroad into whatever jurisdiction it may be, will drive that sort of desire to be internationally focused.

Speaker 1:

It's going to have to, or else you're going to see a mass exodus of your clients. To a degree Maybe that's a bit extreme and maybe that's not the case for every firm, but effectively dealing with clients of a certain net worth means that they'll typically have options of where they want to go to, and they'll get pushed so far to the point where, okay, well, now these are the drives and I need to go, and as a business that looks after clients financially, that's a bit of a problem if you start to lose clients in droves as a result. Um, so yeah, I I agree completely, and I think firms like hoxton are required to sort of book the trend and say, okay, look, we do this differently and we can look after you the way you'd be looked after in the UK. So you're not going from this full hit lifestyle financial planning approach to what you and I may have viewed international advice as which is OK, somebody's ringing me to fog me another product, or whatever it may be.

Speaker 2:

Which is still out there. Oh, yeah, and there's a way to go. Yeah, I wouldn't class it as a profession on an international basis. I think we stand out head and shoulders above many, yeah, as being a trusted, true lifestyle financial planning business on a fee basis. Yeah, which was one of the unique selling points to me coming across yeah, you know, it was that.

Speaker 2:

And the fact, right, you could be a financial planner from the UK and this is one of the big ones for me Sitting in the. You know you could sit in that Dubai office, you could do your Series 65 qualification and actually start advising American clients as well. And if you wanted, to Australia, you know it opens you up to the whole world tax-free from Dubai. And when that dropped for me and I explained how you can do that to advisors, they were blown away by it. They didn't really understand that they could actually do that. You're selling me on it now. Yeah, well, this is it. It's, it's a hugely unique um proposition. It is, it is, and I thought that was quite, quite cool. So that's what kind of got me in, and obviously the international aspect got me in and also as well, the very fact that we have a UK business and it's been there from day dot. It's gone from 13 to nearly 50 in a very, very short period of time.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and it's that kind of thing that is one of the unique parts of this business is that small, regulated IFA businesses may take on a member of staff a year, may lose a member of staff a year. Two steps forward, one step back. It moves slowly. That's the nature of regulated business. This place does not move slowly, it's growing quick. It just brings energy with it. New people bring energy and enthusiasm and nobody gets stale. So the work if you look at the, the work, some of the work is a bit dry. The topic is a bit dry. Sometimes you can bring it to life for clients, but there is still a body of work behind the scenes we have to do. But everyone's pulling together to do that because it's you're not looking for the excitement in the business. It's there, the energy palpable in the, in the place, which is, you know again, a real attraction to Hoxton.

Speaker 2:

I've gotten to know you a bit. You're a strong business developer. You like building relationships. Yeah, it sounds to me like you like to get out there and win clients, right? Yeah, it's exciting to do that. Yeah, it's an exciting part of the role and that's the bit that you're drawn to. I describe Hoxton as an entrepreneurial environment. Would you agree on that? How is the Hoxton entrepreneurial environment benefiting you and how you work?

Speaker 1:

Great question. Yes, I do agree Absolutely. I think that's a really important part of the market that needs to develop Right now. There's the owners of the firms, then there's the employees and effectively, that doesn't work for people like me. That's why I got to this point I got to in my career where it's like, okay, I need autonomy to build something, but do I necessarily want to sit on my own and do that and just be me? And if I was really honest with myself, no, I don't. I want to be in an environment with other people.

Speaker 1:

So this worked perfectly, struck the right chord with me in terms of being able to have the autonomy to build out what I'm building in a supportive environment with other people, with energy, all those types of things. So all the things I've mentioned in terms of that environmental side of it is key because it is a lonely place, trying to run your own thing and sitting at home. And we had periods everybody working at home and for me, I think, after the novelty wore off of of doing all that stuff, I think, well, you're never really at work, you're never really at home, so you can't have this blended approach. I have a young family, so that's an extra complication of okay, if I'm working from home, there's distractions all the time. You know two young children, um. So so for me it was. It was all about okay, finding the environment where I can do those things and build from.

Speaker 1:

It's nice to see the likes of mike pushing on and getting leads in a different way, doing something different. It's nice to see how the international market works and picking up ideas and and I thrive on that kind of thing is is what? What's working and how can we do it, and how can we do it better and how can the team progress? Look at what we're doing this week for the seminar, for the farming seminar. It's supported by the company. If you go with an idea and say this is how we're going to go and build it. Spoke to the marketing team about how do we run some events locally for introducers, for law firms, for accountancy practices. How do we help with their clients then? And we're coming up with ideas of how we can do that in a different way and you know again, I can't ask for any more.

Speaker 1:

No, you know and we support.

Speaker 2:

You know theresa, for example, um we've had her on the podcast and I'm here this week to um film a small documentary with theresa about the work she's doing with the agricultural community, bringing together experts to advise farmers and those that work within that industry about some of the upcoming changes, especially around inheritance tax, legacy planning. But not just that. She has a network of experts that can advise on other areas of farming and how they can add value to their farms. So she had a great idea and she wanted to be able to put that into practice as a seminar. But on her own she would have never done it. So as soon as she brought that idea to the table, we rallied around her to make it a reality. And when I heard about it I was like right, I'm coming over, because I love the idea of really championing this One, because it's very popular at the moment. It's a big conversation. You know your Clarksons, et cetera, are all involved.

Speaker 2:

I grew up in an old farm. We had, you know, a small holding and I grew up in the countryside. So my memory of living in the countryside is one that I cherish as a child and to think that farms and that type of area could be under threat and people have to give up their legacies and their livelihoods and their family tradition. That's been going on for so long. I think it's sad, yeah, um. So I thought I've got to get behind this. But kind of, from my perspective I'm a creative and I'm and the way they kind of brought me in is to add more value, yeah.

Speaker 2:

So I thought, well, let's wrap a documentary around it, because with that documentary we can then promote the event, we can promote the services we offer and promote our allegiance with, with farmers. Yeah, so then you take that and then you go to another community in all different parts of the country and instead of saying I've got an idea, you can physically show them a video and then when you go and do another seminar in that location, you record that again and you might create another part of the documentary. So it becomes this sort of thing that just gets better and better and better over time. And then who else is doing that to to the level where you're creating? So not only that, but people can find it online.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, you can send it to people. Yeah, you can use it as landing pages. You can create podcasts yeah, my ultimate goal right is to get clarkson on it. Yeah, I want to go to diddly squat, yeah, and I want to be next to clarkson talking to him about his farm right, um, and us having a community of experts that then he sees great value in right. I just why not have a goal, big, audacious goal like that?

Speaker 1:

it's, and that's the kind of thing that historically we you know, we so went on the get clerks and on, haha, probably will yeah this is.

Speaker 1:

This is the thing about this place is, you know, you say these sort of outlandish things to a degree, um, but we all do, and we have these big area audacious goals, as you say, you know, and they've started to become more like okay. Well, that's more of a when are we going to do this, as opposed to yeah, is this just a pipe dream, you know, and um let me ask you what would you?

Speaker 2:

you've been talking to the marketing team, right? You're talking to me now. I'm a creative right. If you, if you could choose to do something with the types of clients that you work with, what would it be?

Speaker 1:

Good question. I was speaking to Jay about this recently, so an idea I've had a few years ago and again, without people like yourself probably would never come to fruition. And I did speak to a couple of clients about this and they said oh yeah, I'll come on and have a chat with you. It's doing something like this actually running a podcast locally with local entrepreneurs. There's some really good businesses here and some really good stories that have gone nationwide and very few people know they've come from Liverpool. There's a lot of creative businesses, a lot of tech businesses, all the way through to sort of established law firms who are doing something a bit different, who we've all got connections with in some way. I'd love to hear the story behind it. So talking about the entrepreneurial side of it and looking at the individual and saying, okay, well, what is the story, how did you end up here?

Speaker 1:

and just shedding a light on that, because I think, locally, if that existed, I'd be interested in listening to that yeah you know, because it's, it's here on my doorstep and what's going on in the city, yeah, and the surrounding areas across merseyside, yeah, um, that's what I'd like. That's what I'd like to do from a creative perspective, because it shines a light.

Speaker 2:

So that's not a difficult thing to do. And you could run events, says the king of podcasts. Yeah, but it's actually not a difficult thing to do. I say that because I've done it.

Speaker 2:

I had a recruitment business and recruiters aren't exactly everybody's best friend. How can I curry favor with directors of the financial planning company who make the decision as to who, if they hire or not, who they use? Yeah, makes sense. And for me, I had to be able to have something that added value to them and create trust, and that was there was a problem, right, so you find a problem, and it was the advice gap. It was the lack of new people coming in. Problem, right, so you find a problem, and it was the advice gap. It was the lack of new people coming in. Right.

Speaker 2:

And when I identified there was no content out there that was actually even talking about careers within financial planning, what is actually like the good, the bad, the ugly, the ups and downs, the realities of working in it. Why would somebody stumble across what it's like to work within financial planning if there was no content? No, so I was like, right, I create the content. Knock on the door of a financial planning company. Do you want to help me fix the advice gap?

Speaker 2:

Well, yeah, how well you know you're a business owner. I'd love to hear your story, and so would so many other people. Yeah, by the way, a byproduct of that is people will know about your business and might want to join you exactly. Um, I'm going to charge you for that. By the way, I've got a big audience and I've been doing recruitment for 16 years within financial planning. Yeah, but really, my main mission here is to attract new people to the profession. Wow, I love that. I get behind that, yeah. So you have that initial conversation and you book them in for a pre-podcast chat where you get to know them on a deeper level. Then you have the podcast, where you they've probably never done a podcast before, so at that point they've gained some experience and skills and they feel like you've helped them, yeah, to gain that experience and spirit, because not everyone does it and it's a big deal for some people. It's like being micro famous for a bit right, yeah and then afterwards you have a post podcast chat.

Speaker 2:

But they'll always remember me as the person who recruit but does it differently. So, when it came to then vacancies. It was a lot easier to get vacancies and I could then pass them back into the guys in the business to work on them, right, yeah, it's a win-win, isn't it?

Speaker 1:

It's a win-win Across the board and I think, exactly as you've just described it, there's a different view of that company as a result of the owners I mean, how Diary of the now as a result of their ownership in terms of what's that individual all about? You know, with social media and everything, everybody gets a personal brand idea and it's okay. Well, you like a brand, sometimes because of the individuals behind it, and I think, well, obviously, that can work in the the opposite way as well. But from a business perspective, in terms of that individual you're interviewing or you're speaking to on a podcast, they're getting a, they're getting the public and they're getting their potential customers to see them in a different way.

Speaker 1:

um, and I think that's you know what other medium does that really, without getting the story out? And you just hit the nail on the head, knocking the door, this free exposure you know for us as a business, commercially okay, well, same sort of thing in a way, in a roundabout way, we've got an association with this firm in some capacity and you know, purely from my point of view, in terms of ticking the box for me personally, as you were saying, what would you want to do? That's what I do when I sit down with clients is I get the story. You can sit for an hour, an hour and a half, two hours, and we don't talk about money for a while. I'm just understanding the individual.

Speaker 1:

Their journey, yeah, their journey, and that genuinely engages me and I'm very interested in what's going on with them. And I suppose that, again back to your early question, entrepreneurial side, that's my entrepreneurial side of me, you know, wanting to know, because that's part of who I am as well.

Speaker 2:

You could create like Startup Liverpool, where you talk about successful startups that came out of Liverpool.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, at all different stages, right Startup, now through to exit. Exactly, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2:

So you then start to get, you can get into those entrepreneurs. Entrepreneurs know other entrepreneurs. Other people want to listen to their stories because it's interesting. Therefore, more people will hear about it. So it's like you know startup, startup Liverpool, powered by Hoxton Wealth Precisely you know, and wealth, precisely you know, and you factor in some of the financial planning that they didn't do and wish they did or could have done yeah, you can touch on areas of the world where we're in as well yeah, so it's like you know, a byproduct of that is they share it to their network.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and that's that podcast marketing element. Yeah. So, like when you talk about networking events, right, you might have 60 people turn up to a networking event. There's a lot of energy, a lot of effort that goes into that. Yeah, you might record a podcast, get 600 people listening. That's quite niche. And then you've also got the ability to then use that on your social media to post videos or clips or blogs or articles. So when I say it's not that difficult to actually do to be able to start to establish yourself, and then what comes off the back of that are events.

Speaker 2:

This year I'm going to do the first Financial Plan of Life podcast live and I want to bring like 250 people to come and watch a podcast live. Like they're all sponsored and everything like that, right, yeah, yeah, that comes a bit later on. Don't underestimate the power and the ability that you have, which isn't that difficult that you can now tap into because I'm here, yeah, yeah, so all you've got to do is come up with the idea. Yeah, come up with the idea. Yeah, come up with a niche, the idea and the blueprint. I have all I can put that in your hands, yeah, and off you go, precisely.

Speaker 1:

And again, that's the, that's the power of hoxton, isn't it? Clients ask me well, you know why have you, why would you move? And people, you know what we're doing before and all this kind of stuff. Um, you know new people I'm speaking to now. Where were you and what talks and what's different? I said, like any small firm, you have to wear six hats in a business regardless of what you're doing, there's teams of people that do that here.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

And effectively. I can just focus my energy on the things that I want to be doing, which is speaking to clients, helping clients achieve their goals and objectives, finding new ones, working and helping the team. You know, these are the things that give me energy. They don't drain energy from me. So you know, I'm now here five days a week. I mean, I was in a day a week at the old office, right, you know, and it's not necessarily a reflection of the old place I was I think everybody was. I just want to be here and I want to be amongst it, and you know that energy just perpetuates you and moves you forward. So, yeah, yeah, to your point, things that would never have happened you mentioned theresa before um doing this. This event would never have happened without the force and mechanism of you and others in the business to say, okay, let's drive this on um, and the same is true of this podcast.

Speaker 2:

I'd be talking about this in five years time, but now you've said this, I'm gonna have to bend you here after this I will happily sit down with you and if you have the energy and the enthusiasm to make it work and you want to do it, yeah, there is nothing stopping you. It's one of the easiest forms of marketing. Yeah, and it doesn't cost an arm and a leg either. No, you really really, really, really don't. No, um, I genuinely think it's something that can be wrapped around individuals. We have a podcast as a business, yes, but that's the business podcast. Yeah, each individual within our business could have their own podcast which is their own niche and their own brand and everything along those lines. Yeah, that is talking to the audience that they want to talk to.

Speaker 1:

It makes utter sense like you say, powered by hoxton, wealth, everybody benefits. Again, it's that win-win scenario, isn't it? You know, in terms of tapping into theresa's expertise and niche, same with me and others. You know, again, hoxton as a brand can't be all things to all people, but the individuals within it are quite deep in their niche and quite, you know, understand that. Well, and again, if you, if you're bringing the right people in the right personalities, you've got the desire to do that. And again, recruitment side of things has been great on that front, because that's who's coming through the door, yeah, 100% one of the things I've done recently, which I'm I had before I got into finance planning.

Speaker 2:

I always had the idea of the fact that we should things like partnerships and building relationships with introducers. Right, yeah, you have to have something that adds value. Yeah, and I brought on a company called French Connections.

Speaker 1:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

Now French Connections are a business that helps Americans move from America to France, but there's quite a lot of bureaucracy. It's very difficult. The chap who set it up grew up in France. He understands the French legal system and he's built a process and a structure that can facilitate that move for that American. And then they built a YouTube channel and they drive most of their leads in from americans searching how to move to france. They go to his page, his youtube page, and they'll watch a lovely video and they do little stories like we're doing, documentaries of people that have moved and now live in france. He answers all most frequently asked questions. Now for me, when I see that, I think well, well, they're going to need financial planning Now when he goes through that process. Financial planning is not part of his process but it should be. The individuals are paying him sometimes up to 70,000 dollars to move to France. He does from start to finish. Right Now, with the relationship that we have, we deliver financial planning within that Right Once they're signed up. I see.

Speaker 1:

So it's not costing them anymore.

Speaker 2:

No, okay, it's just part of the process, almost like you know.

Speaker 2:

So you're just value, stuck in with what he was doing yeah, and it's going to be absolute value for his clients because they're getting the right financial advice. Because they're moving from America. Their existing advisor in the US might not be able to deal with them or understand anything about France, but we've got people on the ground in France and we're regulated there and we understand the US market, so it makes total sense. Now the kicker for me is well, if that's the case and you've got a lovely, then you start co-content to create. So last month or last week sorry, I just released an episode with Richard Hammond not the Richard Hammond, but Richard Hammond from French Connections.

Speaker 1:

I was going to say there's your steps to collapse and that stuff isn't it. Yeah, well, there you go.

Speaker 2:

And he was on our podcast talking about why Americans are moving to France. So we start to co-content create. We drive leads to each other through our YouTube connection. Yeah, so that's how we can do it. Yeah, and it's not a million miles away, so I'd happily sit down with you and talk about it. You are a big Everton fan. Liverpool's a big football city, right? Sure Does that mean?

Speaker 1:

you work with footballers. I do A few. Yeah, I've worked with a handful of people in sport now for for a while, probably since I've started. Um, so yeah, predominantly around football and players, managers, coaches and senior execs within clubs. Um, very unique space and it's, you know, comes with its challenges for sure, in terms of short career and, you know, high earnings, lots of influence, good and bad, around an individual and so all the things we do in financial planning and then some effectively just to mold that individual and the all the things we do in financial planning and then some effectively just to mold that individual and the family and make sure you know you become the trusted source and not the other influences around them that may not necessarily have the best interests at heart, let's say, um, but yeah, I've been really lucky in the space because you hear some, some horror stories of working with sports people or people who are exposed in the media and I deal with a group of really solid individuals, good family people, the right morals and have done the right things and followed the advice, so really got good outcomes and good stories to tell.

Speaker 1:

It's something I've never pushed, if I'm totally honest from a business perspective. I've never gone and tried to market that in any way. It just happens kind of organically with with the people that I originally had. Um, yeah, and it's again. It's something that hoxton as a brand and as a setup as a global business. It makes a lot more sense for a footballer, um, or a person in sport who move around globally it's a globalized sport now um to to be involved with the firm, like us over any any other, effectively, because we have a real unique approach there.

Speaker 1:

I had one recently. It was a client who was um, potentially looking to move to spain and to play in the spanish league and um, again, it fell apart in the end but it didn't go ahead and I'm sitting there normally scratching my head going, okay, well, how do I continue to look after this person? But it's just not an issue anymore because we just have a member of the team join, as you were saying, and and uh, continue to look after them I love the idea of creating like a global football podcast with, with hosting.

Speaker 2:

Well, because obviously we're over in the uae in saudi arabia, yeah, right, and they're paying big bucks. Yeah, yeah, they've got Ryan, who's based over in America, so I found him. He's. He's just finished professional football out there. Liverpool didn't let, right, yeah, but he lives in New York. He's not coming back to the UK because he's got a family there now. Now, he's just done his, he's just joined us. He's now done a series 65. He has really good close connections to the football uh clubs out there, not just football, but also basque, when american football. Okay, each of those types of types of teams out there have like a specific amount of visas. Right, it's like seven visas, I think, and it allows um for uh like international transfers. Okay, yeah, or international imports or whatever you want to call it. Right, let's call them international transfers so they can bring on seven people from the UK.

Speaker 1:

Right, okay.

Speaker 2:

Into their business. Now they get a specific amount of visas, it's like seven, I think. Now, if they don't use them, they can trade them between clubs and everything right. But what it means essentially is, across every sport every sport, not just football there are seven international people playing within those clubs. He has really strong access to it so he can go in there and on two fronts really, one being he can say I've played professional football and I'm now a financial planner and this is what you need to know, so he can go in there on the basis of the international side of what he understands, the UK, and he's regulated across the world, or their friend or their Spanish or French or whatever, right, but he can also go in and he can then start to deal with domestic. Plus, he can then also, for us, attract people that are exiting sport.

Speaker 1:

So like life after sports, yeah, and that's an interesting yeah really is you know, you, you speak to players and the advocates of of players and the attributes of them as well, you know, in terms of their work ethic, their mentality, their discipline. These are all translatable skills into business and there may be, in my opinion, needs to be more done in terms of attracting those people into into good spaces, into good businesses. Ours would be perfect because those those things whether or not that's working with players, even it's just that I think a lot of players who've been through that, a lot of sports people have been through that process at the highest level are huge attributes to businesses. You know, in terms of the all those, all those factors that we're talking about there, um, and yeah, I just I just think that as a, as a space and again as a business, we could definitely look after more than just football.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, um, you know american football, basketball, these, you know, the finances sometimes are, you know, eye-watering in terms of the money these guys are on. But again, the influence. How many horror stories have we all heard around footballers going back to all this kind of stuff, whether that's poor advice or poor decision-making, you know we can solve for a lot of that you know in terms of how they're looked after. But again, like anything, it's about building trust.

Speaker 2:

When is the best time to introduce financial planning, or when do you introduce financial planning to those that are in professional sports, when you know, when do you, how do you do? Yeah, when do you do it? How do you do it? What's your approach?

Speaker 1:

yeah. So one thing I did do was I went into a couple of clubs locally for the premier league clubs and did some education sessions at the under 17s, under 19s, and it wasn't things like here's an investment solution and here's some insurance things you might need, or whatever it may be. It was financial basics. It was what does your payslip mean when you see this line on your payslip that says tax? Who gets that? Things that are just you come about a normal life, if you like, a normal life, a normal work, and you get to understand what these things are by proxy.

Speaker 1:

But whereas players are never taught that, they're plucked out of education to a degree very early, or traditional education, the clubs do the best in terms of getting the, getting the lads out to college and things like that locally. But there's a gap there in terms of their life experience and maybe they go from that to earning crazy amounts of money and they've got a vulnerability there because they've got a knowledge gap. So I think, okay, the sooner we get this into even a curriculum and this is one of the things I spoke to the head of education Everton about is can we make this almost like a qualification? You know where it's yeah, where it's like it's I love that yeah, where it's accredited, and then effectively across the league. You've got financial levels one, two and three, and every club can roll out some sort of course as part of that.

Speaker 2:

That's a great idea who have you pitched out to?

Speaker 1:

a couple of people and again similar sort of response, but again in terms of delivery, when a couple of years ago, when we were having this conversation, it was a case of, well you know, resource and time and all the rest of it.

Speaker 2:

But, like I was saying before, maybe that's something we should pick up as a Should be something that's covered by us, really Like, almost like you say it's, like it's a qualification. It doesn't have to be a really difficult thing to get. In fact, the last thing you want to do is make it too technical. It should be a financial wellbeing qualification.

Speaker 1:

Think of it along the lines of what they do in school. Now, yeah, you know, bringing those concepts to you and you have to adapt it for the stage of life. Yeah, so essentially, if you're going from that 17s to 21s, 23s, you're not going to be having this. You know very different issues. First car, first house, you know all those sorts of things, maybe children, you know that sort of thing. And then going from earning next to nothing, potentially, or you know 150 pounds a week, you know, and your entry level at some of these top clubs all the way through to you know tens of thousands of pounds a week, you know, at less than 20.

Speaker 2:

And it also is where it's really very important to set realistic expectations. Not everybody who signs a football contract goes on to make millions. I think the average earnings from professional football, if you make it as a professional footballer, is the equivalent of a train driver over the lifetime of playing football. If you're lucky to get a full career out of it, it's only a very small percentage to go on to earn millions and millions and millions. Clubs are actually quite surprisingly good career out of it. It's only a very small percentage to go on to earn millions and millions and millions and millions.

Speaker 1:

Clubs are actually quite surprisingly good at keeping their feet on the ground with that. So with my experience in terms of being in those environments, it's all guys, you're going to need these life skills, because not everybody in this room is going to be playing next to so-and-so in the first team anytime soon. So they've always been quite upfront about that in the environments I've been in and a few of the lads will come up afterwards and just ask a few questions and I love that Because it's like, okay, and it was, you know, the right sort of question. So they'll come up and ask you know you said this and you know how does that work if I did that. And you know you get some funny answers.

Speaker 1:

To be fair, so 40% tax bracket. So if you earn over 50K give or take, you're going to start paying higher rate tax. What do you mean? Yeah, so everybody's, I'm doing this, you know. Well, that's it. Then I'm never going to earn more than that because I don't want to pay.

Speaker 1:

They didn't realize it was like a graduated tax system. So you don't start paying 40% on all all your earnings and all that kind of stuff. And they were just gobsmacked that that's how much tax you end up paying and I think, just framing that for them again, the behaviors of it. Okay, look at half of your wages as yours. If you just did that, you can't go far wrong. So it's just about giving them little tools to survive the transitions as they go through that and they start to become more and more successful and things like just keep your circle small. You don't need 10 friends and 10 family members and 10 other professionals around you at every game. You know mum and dad, brothers and sisters fine, you know have a good financial advisor and have a good agent and you know the rest of it will take care of itself. What's it like working with?

Speaker 2:

agents.

Speaker 1:

Good and bad. Really. I've experienced both. Again, I've been really lucky. Most of the people I've dealt with over the years have been solid, want the right thing for the player, do the right thing, look after them. But again, I've heard stories through others where it's turn up at deal time and disappear for three years. Turn up at deal time again, know and and there's no aftercare.

Speaker 1:

Um, one of the sort of gray area services we've talked about um a bit is doing that stuff between contracts and finance and legal and accountants is sort of life admin services for players. So, yeah, you know they've moved, moved house and their credit scores drop. Well, you're not on the electoral, like simple things that like why would they bother thinking about this stuff? Or it's never come up before, or um, paying bills, booking holidays, all these types of things that need to be done in a in a way that doesn't put you in trouble like a concierge service you could create for that yeah, for the families as well yeah, from the simple boring stuff all the way through to the bloody glamour things.

Speaker 1:

When you're booking you know flights or whatever it may be but it's like a tit, maybe like a tiered system.

Speaker 2:

So you would come, you know, if someone's going in to say, if they get accepted to an academy and they've got a contract for however long, yeah, then at that point you could offer them something which matches them at that stage of their life. Yeah, then also as well. That's great because parents are probably some parents probably haven't got, maybe they're not financially to themselves. Their kids are going into football.

Speaker 2:

All everyone can think about is the fact they're gonna be a multi-millionaire yeah and I think at that stage it's also about kind of being able to communicate with the parents that we need to think about this. We need to think about johnny's future. Yeah, because he might not make it, yeah, um, but if he does, this is what could happen. Here's some percentages of. What actually happens is how much people can earn, yeah, and this is how many people go bankrupt. Yeah, you've heard the horror stories and stuff like that.

Speaker 2:

So it is is about kind of saying what we want to do is run alongside. What we want to do is create a system that runs alongside his career or her career, depending upon which professional football it is, and then it can kind of grow in tiers, can't it? And as they go, it grows with them. Yeah, yeah, quite like that. Do you deal with any outside of football? Do you deal with any kind of entertainers or anything like that? Because that's kind of like a normal transition like football, professional sports, and then dealing with entertainers. Do you get stuck into that side?

Speaker 1:

Not at this point. We're dealing with a couple of partnership potentials who have that sort of clientele. So again they're asking is that something that works? I mean, it's a very similar approach. It's no difference. I think the key is that they are publicly exposed individuals, if you like. So how it's dealt with with confidentiality, with vulnerabilities, with all that type of stuff, and the way it's dealt with as a business, particularly around their finances, it's one of the most private things they're going to want to keep quiet.

Speaker 2:

If you interview footballers that are further on in their career that have money stories like football money stories, you know and then you interview them and younger footballers would naturally look up to the person who's five years into their career. So their likelihood is they'll watch that or listen to that one, yes, and learn something from it. So it's like, yeah, it's like you can have horror stories and there are things to avoid, and what I wish I did when I started out in football. You know that kind of thing and I feel it captivates an audience, but, at the same time, those that are in the game would respect that.

Speaker 1:

Totally the challenge you always find. The dressing room chat is real. That is a real thing. So what goes on the dressing room is everybody asks each other and gets opinions on what's going on, so people only really share their successes. In most walks of life, they shy away from saying that didn't really work out. So I've had people get in touch with me and say should I buy crypto, should I buy this, should I buy that? And I have to just give an honest opinion and go okay, well, calm out 10% of your money and treat it as having a punt if that's what you really want to do, because I know their finances inside out to say, well, that's okay, but you have to limit it there.

Speaker 1:

It's like gambling effectively, and I know there's loads of success stories now in, like the Bitcoin and things like that, but at the same time, so-and-so has bought this and done really well. Have they told you about the fall of Kontonofen? Probably not. So you're right. You need an honest individual who's been there, done it and is willing to share the failures as well as the successes. Yeah, I think, because you know the dressing room will be. You know, I've done this well. Ah well, I've done that better, you know, and it's, you know, it's kind of that competitive spirit you get in sport but in all walks of life. So, again, the young guys who are impressionable, looking up to their sort of heroes, if you like, or people that they want to be like, effectively, can take the wrong path if they're only listening to them.

Speaker 2:

And there's some plenty of footballers, like in every profession, where they do look after the money really well and they're super duper successful, like robbie fowler, right, yeah, like he owns loads of houses, got property business. I think michael owens a bit like that as well, isn't he?

Speaker 1:

I think he's yeah, he's been sort of done well with his investments and things like that.

Speaker 2:

Yes, yeah so it's also. It's not like, oh, trying to tell them about the horror stories. It's also about sharing the successes that people have in sport, where they have diversified and they've developed investment strategies and good financial plans and it's paid off, yeah. So then that is also tying into their, because footballers are ambitious, naturally ambitious people, right? Sure, so if they they're always probably thinking about how can I get better? And if they've got other footballers talking about things that they've done yeah, there's the. It is relatable to them, so money would be relatable, for example then they're going to watch that because they want to know how. Yeah, and that's a great way of doing it. So you don't want to be scaring people all the time.

Speaker 1:

You want to be educating them it's like if you go on youtube now you go on any social media channel, you get anybody giving you some form of financial advice, you know, regulated and often not regulated and most of it is nonsense. You know a lot of it is nonsense. And you know how did I make my money? Well, I waited for the stock to go down, then I bought it and then it went up and I sold it. Okay, well, it's not exactly useful information, but impressionable young people will look at that and think, okay, this is possible. We've all been there where we think, okay, there's a shortcut here or there's something that we can do.

Speaker 1:

Um, and it's about weeding out the good, the good advice from the from the pretty poor advice. Really, um, and again, these guys are young. They haven't had the life experience to understand how to do that. They're relying on people who maybe also haven't been successful or haven't necessarily given them those experiences. So, again, our responsibility towards these players and these individuals is to bring that to the table. And it only happens once you've built trust with that person. That tends to happen when you've built trust with one of their teammates. I love it.

Speaker 2:

What you're doing now. I'm just actually. This is how my brain works. I'm actually looking for the name of a podcast, because I come up with a name which I think would be brilliant. No, and there isn't it. I'm not going to tell it on here we'll keep that, we'll keep that one to ourselves.

Speaker 2:

Someone might someone might steal it, but we'll talk about that afterwards. I absolutely love it. Well, you're a very ambitious individual, right? You spent eight years at that other company, but it wasn't the home for you. It didn't fulfill your passion and your ambitions, right? Yeah, you come into Hoxton and you've got some great news.

Speaker 1:

What's that great news? Oh yeah, okay, you told me on the back foot then. Yes, so I'm about to become a director of the company, fantastic. So yes, and I'm going to lead the Liverpool office.

Speaker 2:

So that's going to be announced shortly. First off, congratulations. Thank you very much. When this podcast goes out, people will know it won't go out beforehand, trust me on that one. But what does that mean to you then? Because you're passionate about delivering financial planning to your clients. This is different, yeah.

Speaker 1:

Why A big part of what I enjoy doing is seeing other people progress. So I remember the beginning of my career. I was this ball of energy and I wanted to be pointed at something and I needed somebody to go do this this way and almost get the blueprint in a way, and it was a bit more ambiguous, it was a bit more unstructured and it didn't really give me that sort of channel. So I went on a bit of journey of discovery, which took, took me longer, which I'm in hindsight glad of in a way, because I think when you learn it and go go down that route yourself, that's, that's good. Um, but I want to be able to, I I remember that feeling.

Speaker 1:

And when we're bringing in younger people who are joining us, maybe para planners wanting to be financial, financial advisor, financial planners um, I know what that transition is, I know, I know what you have do, I know the challenges, I know the three moments, I know the highs and the lows of it all and I love sort of guiding people and seeing them become more confident. So to leave the office and see this business here, you know, in my sort of home city, and be part of driving that forward is personally, you know, brilliant for me Fantastic.

Speaker 2:

Well, I'm really pleased for you. Congratulations. What does the future look like then? What are the discussions? What are your plans? What do you think the next six to twelve months will be like for the Liverpool business? I?

Speaker 1:

think it'll be massive. I think we've moved office already in this building. So we started with seven desks in a small room to get us going. I was the fourth person in this office. So we started with seven desks in a small room to get us going. I was the fourth person in this office. I believe we're now by the summer we'll be close to 15, which is just bonkers really in nine months again in a regulated business. We'll outgrow this office by the end of the year and we're probably going to be looking at okay, with the next 12 months we might have another 10 or 15 people in the business. That is just going to happen. You can just see it. Obviously there's an acquisition strategy with the company which gives us big leaps forward.

Speaker 1:

But again, I'm focused on the organic side of the growth. You know partnerships with local firms, working on some marketing ideas with you. Now the next big podcast in Liverpool is coming your way. So things like that really sort of get me out of bed and get me moving forward and my ambition for the next 12 months, next five years, has moved every month since I've been here just gets higher and higher, because you just see what's possible and it's a self-limiting side of it that needs to adjust. So, again, you think you come from an environment, or whatever environment that's in, and you're limited by what you were used to. Yeah, and it's okay. Well, maybe I can get to this level, maybe I'll get to that level of revenue or this level of assets or this size of team, and it just keeps growing.

Speaker 2:

Interesting. You say that, like you know, I was running a business for 16 years and I was kind of hitting my head with a hammer and wondering why it hurt. Yeah, when I actually finally sold it and left and put myself into a different environment, I've five times what I was earning. Yeah, you know, my opportunity is so much greater. Yeah, from leaving something that I thought I couldn't leave I, because it was mine, I had to build it. Yeah, when I left it and I became that entrepreneur here in oxton and I've been treated that way. Yeah, I've become way more successful in a shorter period of time. So you've had that same experience.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and it's kind of odd because you kind of like, oh my god, like it's like I've gone into an environment where it's super charged. So the idea is that I've been banging my head against a brick wall at over there or working with the wrong people in the wrong environment. Yeah, trying to make it work when people didn't want the same thing that I did. Yeah, and I move over here and it's more almost like people expect it. Yeah, yeah, and you know, and you're chasing up. You know, chasing them. When you got somebody that I'm reporting into chris ball. It's. It's completely different cat out of fish. Yeah, you know, and you're like, oh my god, like my aspirations but it brings the best out of you, doesn't?

Speaker 1:

it you think well, there's areas of of your ambition you didn't know you had, there's areas that you didn't know you could go and achieve these things, or this was even possible. Like you say, um, being in this environment it does supercharge you, it does, it does give you okay. Well, the goal posts have moved and next week they'll move again and effectively, we're just constantly pushing that boundary all the time, and it's it's that's what's so exciting about it, because my view of, and what kept me sort of in an environment longer than maybe I should have been in hindsight is the fact that I thought the only alternative of me going to do these things was if it was me on my own, running my own firm. You know, and I know for a fact that so many people I know, there's so many advisors who've already made that leap and gone.

Speaker 2:

Oh, this is tough, you know, because it's just me that's really interesting and it's the part, it's the drum that I'm banging as well, which is there are plenty of people sitting out there and think the only option, yeah, is to start their own business. But what they don't understand is the amount of headache that actually comes with that and maybe, just maybe, it's the environment they're in. If they found an environment where they could be entrepreneurial, but on an intrapreneurial basis, start there first, have a go at that first, before you go off and start your own business, because you could actually put yourself backwards. You know you could take all that energy that you had that you thought well, thought well, I could do this myself could actually be detrimental to your career.

Speaker 2:

Yes, it will be a learning curve yeah and I would never say to somebody don't do it yeah go and fail. Do what you want to do, yeah, but remember the starting something on your own. You have to fail. Yeah, right, it's a lot harder to fail on your own than it is to fail in an environment where failure is almost kind of expected and almost encouraged because that's part of the growth mentality.

Speaker 1:

Such an important point. Failure came up last week. So I was talking to a couple of the guys here in the power planning to advisory track, if you like, in this office, and pushing yourself outside the comfort zone is all part of it. Yeah, you don't want to get to a point where you're just crashing and burning but that's not the, that's not the plan. So we can go bit by bit on the on the plan and go, okay, this is all the things we're going to do, this, how we're going to go over the next 12 months. But you have to fail, you have to stop, it has to go wrong.

Speaker 1:

You know, I remember my very first cringe now if I, if I saw myself doing this, um, my very first. It's cringe now if I saw myself doing this, my very first appointment with my very first client. I got myself mortgage qualified in the first six months of me leaving university and I went with my paper Leeds Building Society application to a local solicitor's firm to sit down and go through it and I just like I can't do this because I don't know everything. So they're going to ask me something I don't know the answer to. I say to the guys now, one of the most common things I say in client meetings is I'm not sure.

Speaker 1:

Let me come back to you, and getting comfortable in that not knowing everything is part of the journey, and the failures that you experience along the way. As long as you don't take that on board and go, that's it now I can't do anything different. You have to learn from every single one. Then, effectively, that was just part of the journey. Who's who's ever been successful? Who hasn't failed along the way? Yeah, you know, it's a prerequisite.

Speaker 1:

In fact, you have to do it yeah and getting that into the mindset of some of the younger guys is going to be part of the challenge it's the fear of failure. Yeah, you know it's the fear of failure, but but we're in a safe environment where you know I'm leading. I'm leading a meeting. They're sat with me and they'll do a bit yeah, and if they crash and burn that in the in the meeting, so what?

Speaker 1:

yeah, doesn't matter, go to the next meeting and get a bit better yeah you know and that's that's the opportunity here is you can be part of that and grow at your own speed and no one's holding you back?

Speaker 2:

yeah, you know that's the key, like, if you can create an environment that supports growth and if somebody's keen to push forward and they're in an environment at the moment where they can't seem to do that, make that leap, come over to join us. We've got so much going on, yeah, not to mention all the technology we have. We're light years ahead of most companies out there.

Speaker 2:

We're only going to get better and better with our app, with our in-house technology with our international financial planning and, of course, with all the marketing and brand awareness that we're creating. So, if you have that entrepreneurial spirit and this is the interesting thing, right, if you look at like going self-employed, you've got networks. You've got nationals you name me a network or an international that will wrap a marketing strategy around. You have consultations from somebody who's built like a top 10 podcast, for instance, and also has technology that will support you properly, support you, and you can plug and play into administrators and power planners that are managed on an internal basis and, right, you get a buyout option at the end. Most of them, obviously, offers will offer buyout. Right, you know, but to get a basic alongside that plus a buyout option, it doesn't exist.

Speaker 2:

No, so you get the security which most people want. Right is, you know, people want the security they want to be able to buy their house they want to have. They don't want to be stressing about money and most people like regardless, like you're in your 30s, 40s, you might be earning a decent amount, but your outgoings are quite high. Yeah, so most people really relying upon their basics yeah, so if you've got that aspirational dream, you know you can go out there and self-junk clients on your own. Why risk it on your own? And real, really. I speak to a lot of people. It takes a year to two years to get your income up to the levels you think you you need them at at least. So come in, take the basic yeah wrap yourself.

Speaker 2:

Let's, let's get everything wrapped around you to be the best version of yourself that you can actually be, be the best business that you can actually be, and let's build almost a mini practice underneath Hoxton and like that. To me, if I was a financial planner, I'd be like that sounds really, really interesting, it's unique and it's different and it just gives you a clear runway to being a success.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I'd say don't get too wrapped up in the way you are today with it. You know it's a case of comparing this split versus that split or whatever. Whatever environment you're coming from, the reality is having this brand behind you and having all the things we've talked about the technology, the recruitment, the, the environment it'll take you way further as part of that team than you could do on your own. In any event, yeah, you know, if you're running through a muddy field in wellies, you're not going to do a 5k the same pace as somebody in some running shoes on the on the pavement are. You know you just need the environment and the equipment that you have is key to the whole thing. So I think I was probably guilty of that a little bit in terms of it has to be all mine and I kind of built this up in my mind as the only way to go and then, through circumstances and knowing Jay and the opportunity at the right time, just okay, let's have a go at this.

Speaker 2:

Being on your own. You have to be very careful because you become quite limited in your thinking. You don't want to step outside of yourself because there's almost a pride thing attached to it and you can lock yourself in and your learning can actually decrease because of it. So it's definitely worth it. Look, you want to go. What was it? Go fast, go alone, go far, go together exactly, and I think that's really the motto for today. But thank you so much for sharing your journey so far at hoxton. It's obviously been a huge success. Congratulations on the promotion. Thank you very much. There's no doubt that you are a shining example of what can be done. So if anybody's listening and thinking you, you know I need something like that. You're hiring.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, exactly, just call me, I'll tell you the truth. Yeah, so yeah, thank you very much for having me, sam.

Speaker 2:

Brilliant, and thanks for sharing the truth. Thank you.