Hoxton Life

Scaling To $3.5 Billion AUM: Hoxton Wealth's Q3 Update

• Hoxton Wealth

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In this latest Hoxton Life episode, Chris Ball, Jonathon Jay, and Jacob Hall reveal the strategy behind Hoxton Wealth's incredible growth, including hitting nearly £1 BILLION in organic revenue in just two years.

We pull back the curtain on the challenges every scaling business faces, emphasising that success is built on resilience, a relentless focus on AUM, and a culture of collaboration, not competition.

Key insights covered in this episode, especially for Financial Planners, Leaders, and Entrepreneurs:

  • - Why investing in infrastructure and key talent is essential to scale.
  • - How we shattered the myth that July and August are "quiet months" (they were our biggest!).
  • - The strategy and targets we're pursuing to hit £4.3 Billion in assets by the end of the year.

If you're looking for a transparent roadmap on building a high-growth, globally compliant advice business, this is a must-watch.

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SPEAKER_02:

So let's start with where we initially positioned ourselves in twenty twenty five.

SPEAKER_01:

Ultimately, I wanted to kind of dispel a few myths about the UK. In two months in July and August, we did more than we'd done any quarter before. So it's almost kind of a short term pay long-term game with that stuff, and it's good to have healthy amounts of competition, but you get the balance right between composition and collaboration, and it works really, really well. Making a lot of sense it causes it collaborating. If we're gonna go again, what do we need to do better? How can we do it better? Um the things that we're getting in the way that we could change that, you know, it's quick and easy win.

SPEAKER_00:

We live in a world that way, we've got possible all over the place, and it makes it a much smaller company, and it means that people do work together. But where do you want to get to at the end of 2025?

SPEAKER_02:

What are your goals for the end of the year? So, welcome back to another episode of Hoxton Life with myself, Chris Bull, CEO of the Hoxton Wealth Group, Jonathan J, who's CEO of our UK business, and Jacob Paul, who is our global director of advice. Welcome back. And today is really about giving everyone an update of 2025 so far. So, as you know, we've always been super transparent with what goes well and what doesn't go well in the business. So today is a recap of where we've got to in 2025 and setting out our aspirations and till we get to the end of uh 2025. So, full open uh under the bonnet chat with you guys, which I'm really looking forward to. Uh and I'm looking forward to everyone hopefully uh getting up to speed with uh with where we are. So let's start with where we initially positioned ourselves in 2025. Where was that for you, JJ? Where did you want to get to with the UK business by the end of the year?

SPEAKER_01:

Um, obviously, super, super aspirational, lots of big, lots of big plans. It was interesting to start the year with um, like last year was very much get the team in position to have a really strong year. Uh, and then we obviously we we had a an interesting start to the year with a bit of restructuring and a few uh a few personnel changes. Um and ultimately I wanted to kind of dispel a few myths about the UK with what we were doing. Um there's if you go to any financial planning conference in the UK, it's a lot of um lots of business struggling struggling with organic growth, struggling with being able to win new business. That was a key objective for me to change that uh and to build belief into our team and kind of change the belief system of the whole UK team to achieve really, really good things. Um that was how that's what we set out to do. Obviously, we had those challeng challenges with uh with some changes we needed to make at the beginning of the year. Uh, and it was about rolling with that and uh and using that as an opportunity to sort of identify further gaps and try and fill those.

SPEAKER_02:

And were there any targets in terms of assets, in terms of figures that you wanted to achieve? And where where are you against those you know targets that you set for the UK business?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, so um UK in turn so we've got an inorganic and organic strategy. So the organic strategy is to um is to take, I think it's 430 million of uh inorganic assets, so through acquisition, yeah. Uh which we'll come on to has been um has been interesting, challenging uh in its own right. But then organic, uh, as I mentioned, is has been a big focus as well. And we wanted to achieve, I think it was 90 million of organic assets, and we've exceeded that already so far this year. And that's been through uh recruitment and uh through winning new business and new clients, which is fantastic, and obviously it's been another stellar year for organic growth in the in the global business.

SPEAKER_02:

But are you where you are where you wanted to be on target, Jake?

SPEAKER_00:

In in certain areas, yeah. So, I mean, we had 2024, so last year was a challenging year, changing our model away from pensions in 23. We then started to focus a lot more on the international US business. We were obviously doing a lot more with US assets. End of 24, we started to see that really come to fruition. 25, we set out with some quite large new revenue goals and also some massive assets under management goals. And I think the pivot towards assets under management at the beginning of the year went a little bit too far. So everyone was just focused on AUM, which is what we want. But then we also took our foot off the gas with new revenue and business there. But we slowly clawed that back. I think I'm a little bit behind on new revenue at the moment. I think our target this year is about 9.7 mil of new revenue. And then obviously we've got our service management fees and and ongoing revenue, and our AUM target was 450 million, which we've absolutely blitzed. I mean, we'll I think we'll go through our total year target by the end of September. So it's been a really, really positive year. Other areas that we've really done well with this year is we brought in uh a new manager for our trainee wealth manager course and our pathway advisors. He came out of the UK, um, who's but recently been on the podcast, and that's been a great success. You know, we've integrated him into the uh the UAE business. He's really, really working well with the guys, and that's been uh huge for us. And then of course the DIFC license, which was a felt like it was never coming at one point, but we finally got that over the line as well. So yeah, there's been ups and downs, but we're on target in one area, slightly behind on the new revenue targets, but I'm sure we'll claw it back by the end of the year.

SPEAKER_02:

I'm sure, I'm sure we will indeed. I'm sure we will get there. Um, yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? Because obviously, you know, a lot of people always focus on the hires, but it's also important to focus on the challenges as well. And I think it's really important for people that are watching this that no business is plain sailing. Whatever business you join, wherever you are, anyone that paints that full rosy picture all the time, it's just that's just not that's just not the case. And we'll come on to some of the challenges because I think it's important to always discuss the challenges and then discuss what you're doing about them. It's great identifying a challenge, and you are going to have them that's just inevitable. But really, what makes a great business is how you overcome that challenge and make sure it doesn't happen again. Because if that challenge keeps on rearing its head, then you uh then then you haven't got such a great business and you haven't got such a great management team. So kudos to obviously you guys and everyone else that's in the management team for making sure that we we overcome it and we and we build on. One of the highlights, you know, we're coming and get onto that now. So we've got our aspirations start the year. We've I think we're pretty much on track global globally with with the business. I think we're kind of 5% behind in terms of revenue on where we um on where we thought we was going to be. And I think obviously that is due to um structuring fees. So the initial fee that we would typically charge clients when we structure a a plan or or you know provide them with some advice, uh be that tax, be that illegal, be that financial planning, or whatever that is, uh, has been slightly behind. But actually, what I'm most proud of is the amount of AUM that we've onboarded this year. And we know that that's it's almost kind of short-term pain, long-term gain with that stuff. And that's really how we've positioned ourselves as a as a business, you know, half a billion, which we'll come on to in a bit, of assets. And I think we've done nearly a billion of organic revenue over the past two years, um, which is you know very, very different to a lot of our peers, to a lot of UK domestic businesses. Even, you know, I'm out talking to people in the US uh in, you know, on their businesses as well. And it feels that organic growth is actually quite low across a lot of these businesses. And, you know, you can grow uh you can grow your revenue line if you go and take on things that will generate 10, 15% fees up front. But obviously a lot of the stuff that we do is not uh, you know, is not that or a lot of stuff, nothing that we do has that has that level of of fee built in. So really we, you know, focusing on building those assets has been you know, it's making us a really strong business overall, which I'm which I'm super, super positive about. Key highlights for me this year that I really wanted to make sure that we got uh sorted though was the pathway at the start of the year. Really wanted that to be a focus. Um US, which we'll come on to, which has not gone on to plan uh as much. Um, and also making sure that we're continuing to grow and provide our advisor base with um, you know, with with with an easier way to do business. Too many firms, as they get bigger, clutter the advice process in and making things very difficult for their advisors, extra layers of bureaucracy, extra layers of check. You know, yeah, I don't think you can ever have too much compliance, but we get you know, you should it shouldn't be a compliance-led business, it should be a commercially led business that is compliant. Uh, we've talked about that a lot in the UK. So for me, it was really trying to smooth that out. And I, you know, it has been bumpy, but it definitely uh definitely working with all the online tools and everything, which again we'll we'll come on to um in a bit. But you know, the conferences that we held in the UK this year, I meant I remember when that we took that picture in the Italian restaurant and we were looking at, you know, that kind of just reminded me of how far we'd actually come. And then obviously the one that we'd run in the UAE was um, you know, was was amazing as always, had some great speakers, and we actually instead of doing it over two days, we did it over one day this year, and I think that worked really well as well. So yeah, I think the conferences were were a highlight for me. Has there been any highlights this year then that you guys are um you know proud of, or you know, you think that actually at the start of the year you didn't really expect that to be uh kind of a you know a key moment?

SPEAKER_00:

I think I I can definitely go there because when we sit down at the beginning of the year, we obviously we've done a really good job of budgeting and looking at our year and basically trying to look at the years before and the seasonality and all those sorts of things. And we we had set targets for the summer, and this year we we dug in in the summer, and we really last year we spanned the rhetoric that the summer isn't quiet, and we really pushed on that, and not as many people travelled, more people stayed from the business development, more people stayed from the advisors, and it was a it was a great success. This year we did it exactly the same, but we pushed harder, you know. We reminded people, we ran um, we ran uh awards across the summer to get people going, we did some dinners and things to make it make people, you know, so people were getting out and about, and in two months in July and August, we did more than we had done in any quarter before, which was amazing for me because it just means that we've basically completely dispelled that myth that the summers are quiet. I mean, that was a huge, huge success. And to be in an office the first week of August and there not be really many empty desks is a great feeling, and it really helps with that momentum. You and I have talked about this before. When people all disappear off for the summer, it's quite hard to keep yourself motivated when there's only a few of you sitting around at the desk and stuff. And that I think that was a big, big success from my side this year.

SPEAKER_02:

100%. And I think operating a global business as well, like you know that not everyone in the whole world downs tools for eight weeks over the summer and kind of goes and chills out on a beach somewhere. That's just not how life works. Yes, obviously, have a couple of weeks off, you know, normal to take, you know, two weeks off, go away, recharge, refresh, spend time with your family, enjoy. But if you are working, you need to be working. Uh, and I think that you know, the the um conference that we put on in France um was fantastic, and I think it gave some people things to aim for as well, which will which again we'll come on to in in a bit. But that was obviously uh uh a massive, uh massive growth, but definitely dispelled the myth that August is a quiet month.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, for sure. For sure. For me, it was actually um so we we obviously had our conference at the beginning of the year, which was great. Yeah, we'd we'd achieved a lot in 2024 around building out the team. Um what I've come to realize this year is the the three pillars for me to to build and scale a business is people. We've got really great people now in the UK business, processes, which we worked really, really hard on this year to make sure that there is a process for everything and then people can follow it. Uh that's a challenge to get people to actually uh embrace that, and uh, and it's a it's a constantly moving uh feast. Uh and then infrastructure, having a right compliance team in place and having the infrastructure around people to help them be successful. Um so we kind of set out that stall at the beginning of the year, but it was a challenging start to the year, and with like Q1 this year, I think we did 43,000 pounds of new business total. Um and then you came over to the UK. We spent a lot of time with the guys in April. We kind of did a bit of a road show around the offices and built some of that process out and sort of helped them understand what it takes to be successful as an advisor. Um, I know we've spoken about that on another podcast and uh and what it actually takes to be successful as a financial planner. And that started the ball rolling and building the momentum. The really proud moment for me was when we had the summer conference in in at the end of June. Um it was really good and it was great. We shared successes, we we got everyone's kind of collaborating and giving us feedback about the things that we can improve and the things that they come across day to day. But what was really cool is following that, as Jacob's mentioned about uh July and August, they were by far our biggest months. Um we did, I think it was about 300,000 pounds worth of new business total Q2. We did that nearly in in August alone.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

And just building that belief. And we said when we came away from that conference, if if there's anyone that's unclear uh about what's expected and what is uh what is required for us to achieve what we need to achieve this year, um they clearly weren't paying attention at that conference in the wrong room. Yeah, yeah, but everyone did, and everyone left the conference feeling like super excited and buoyed about what we can go on and shoot on and achieve, and that momentum's carried through. Uh, and then obviously seeing a few of the UK guys uh enjoying themselves in South France with the wider group being really a part of that group was a very proud moment for me.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I think that's it. I think the the word that struck me there was that collaboration. Um, and actually, you know, in a business, it shouldn't be you pitted against someone else, it's you collaborate and all work together. And you know, that France was definitely a big uh, you know, was definitely a big um reminder for me of how powerful it is to get everyone together and to give people something to aim for. So, yes, obviously you had some really high-performing advisors who had worked really hard over the summer to get there. We had some really high-performing business development managers that had worked well to get there. We had some really high-performing power planners that had worked super hard to get there. We had some people from our tech team, we had some people from our admin team, we had some people from our operations team. So it wasn't just kind of a jolly up. It was very much a team session where we could get all of the people that had worked really hard. And that's not to say that other people in the business hadn't worked so hard over the summer, but it was just these people had just shone really, really brightly and uh and had done really well. And you know, for me, it was people like Jemima, um, who is new to the business, young, super energetic, wants to become an advisor, starting her career off in paraplanning, like experiencing that and being around all those people and seeing that whole kind of the other side to the business, um, I think is really important. And also, you know, from the international side, some of the guys meeting the you know, people from the UK business and getting to build relationships there and understand what they're about and understand that they're not just being given inorganic clients, you know, clients that we're buying uh uh to service and that you know they're they're doing a fantastic job as well.

SPEAKER_01:

It's you know, and it's I found out yesterday there's been meetings that have followed it. So Mo's been on a call with Jack talking about what he does in the UK because Jack's obviously uh nailed the UK uh and doing very, very well. And they've obviously had a chat while they've been in uh in France together. And look, how what can we learn from each other and that sort of thing? And that that's where it's collaboration, but it's also no egos. And we talk about competition, it's good to have healthy amounts of competition, but you get the balance right between competition and collaboration, and it works really, really well.

SPEAKER_02:

Mikhail Arteta calls it collaboration.

SPEAKER_00:

But I think what you said there is that you've got people, we had people come from all over the world, right? And they're all meeting up together and getting, and and Mo mentioned that to me, he's been speaking to Jack and a few other people. They've built relationships with people in other offices around the world. We live in a world now where we've got offices all over the place, and it makes it a much smaller company, and it means that people do work together on stuff. You know, Mo said to me, I've got clients in the UK that Jack's actually going to help me with on those cases because he he obviously is based in the UK and he can do so. That relationship is so, so powerful. For sure.

SPEAKER_02:

It's super important, and it means that people don't operate in silos, and obviously the bigger you get, the more difficult it is, but it's also the more important it is as well. I mean, you know, with 350 headcount now across the business, I think it's 363 across the global business at the end of Q2, and it's very difficult to make sure that everyone feels connected, like it's super hard, um, especially, you know, um but the UK is its own hub and it could just operate as its own business. But the power of the two businesses combining and taking the best bits from this one and the best bits from that one and trying to use them, like we use some of the stuff in the uh from the UK business internationally now, and we're gonna roll out some more organic uh stuff that we do in the international business into the UK, you know, over hopefully get that in place uh really so we're kicking off in January and nailing that next year. And that doesn't happen by sitting in your office just you know with your uh with a you know, just staring at your own business and looking at your own PL.

SPEAKER_01:

No. No, and we like as a group, as a leadership team, none of us think we've got it all sussed. Uh so we're constantly figuring out what what we can pull in from one place to another, sharing best practice. Super, super important because not one single entity will always get it right. Yeah. Um, and if you're not sharing that best practice, you're just leaving stuff on the table.

SPEAKER_02:

100%.

SPEAKER_01:

And uh it's very difficult to um to get better.

SPEAKER_00:

Definitely on having that. I mean, you've you've done a number of sessions with the guys when you've been over here on lifestyle planning, you know, really changing the way that we do things with regard to full lifestyle strategy with the with the client, and having you being over here able to do that in a UK-centric manner has really upgraded some of the skills of the international guys as well. So it's uh it's just about helping from both sides, really, and learn taking the good bits and and lucky learning from what we've uh the mistakes we make and making sure that we go forward.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, 100%. And I think the other key thing that we've done this year as well was invest heavily in in uh staff as well. So this isn't just invest in getting more advisors. Actually, what we've done a really good job of is recruiting really good people within the business to assist the advisors and make their life easier and help them, realizing that there's three of us, we can't be everywhere all day, every day. And actually, if it is it's like having clients and then you just trying to service all of the clients yourself, naturally the service to those clients would decrease. So you have to invest in your team to be able to take on more clients and provide a great ongoing service. It's no different with advisors. I see the advisors as our clients, so I see them as you know, they're the planners, advisors, whatever you want to call them. But you know, they are Hoxton's clients. And if we do really well by them, naturally, because they are great, they're gonna do a great job for their clients. So in the UK, obviously we bought in Jamie McNish, uh, I think it's a fantastic hire from um from uh obviously St. James's Place, he was heading up their Knightsbridge operations. Right. Obviously, Stuart has moulded into that manage, uh, senior manager role for the you know north of the UK and met a Midlands, which is which is going really well. And you talked earlier, uh Jake, about you bringing over Matt for Matt Morgan from the UK, who was at Succession and was at Evelyn before, and bringing that into the business, and that's helped you you go. Um, and we're you know, we're not gonna stop there, we're gonna keep on investing in in the teams.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. That's where the infrastructure part comes in for me, uh, and putting the support around advisors to be able to be successful. As the UK team built out, and you've obviously experienced this, Jake, in terms of uh building out a bigger advice team, you get stretched and your time gets stretched, and you need to keep a focus on the operational stuff and making sure that yes, you're giving the advisors support in terms of uh the sort of interpersonal uh support, but you're constantly uh giving feedback to the tech team about the solutions that we can provide and the tools that we can provide to the to the team. So having that extra layer of management to day in, day out, spend time with them, figure out what their problems are, their challenges, what objections they're getting from clients, sitting down with them and building out their business plans and keeping them to their business plans, super important. And you you as you grow, you need to slot in these people at the right moment to continue to support them. Definitely.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and when you're bringing in those people, you know, you've got to make sure that they know what they're coming into. We did a great job when we did the recruitment for Matt. We wrote out a really long document, explained the role, talked about, as we do today, talked about the good, the bad, and the ugly, you know, things that may be a challenge, the things that we need him to help with. He's come in. That accountability is what you just talked about there. So he could he's come in now, he sits with all of our pathway advisors, which are our advisors going through the training program. He sits with every one of them on a weekly basis, looks at how their week's gone, looks at their challenges, then comes up with strategies for the following week. You know, we've got we've got 12 people now in our junior advisor phase who do all doing fantastically well. We've had a couple move into that phase this year, and we've got 29 people now training to be advisors at different stages.

SPEAKER_02:

That's crazy, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00:

We went through the numbers this week to look at the dates when we might step them up over the next three to four years.

SPEAKER_02:

I mean, we've got nearly 30 new advisors are going to come through that will be ingrained in our methods purely because we've we've invested in that time, so and I think that's the other it's the other key as well, is where a lot of firms will try and buy assets and they will try and lift advisors from other groups, which is great, obviously, you know, kind of vanity metric, you look and you've taken on a load of assets. But are those people really ingrained in your business? Are those people really singing off the same hymn sheet? Obviously, you want people to want to join and you know that are experienced because obviously that helps lift everyone up. But for me, this next wave, this new gen of advisors that are coming through, that's where that's the lifeblood of what we're doing, and they are gonna be the people that will take the uh their profession forward. Um and uh I'm very, very proud of the fact of how many when you look at our 20 top performing advisors, how many of them were actually how many have actually come from that route? I think it's something I I was doing an exercise the other day, it was 16 out of our top 20 had come from the pathway or the pathway equivalent that we used to kind of run before, which is um which is which is crazy. And I'm really looking forward to to doing that in the UK as well.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, 100%. Not there isn't very, very few firms that do this and give people opportunity and give people the right structure and support to be able to be successful. And there there are there are examples where it's sink or swim. Um lots of them. We don't do that. We give people guidance, support, a salary, you know, we it's not just um see what sticks. Yeah, there you go, there's yellow pages, get calling. Yeah, it's and look, yeah, we've all three of us have been in that situation in some way, and it's and it's difficult, it's challenging. Yeah. Um, and to put that level of pressure on someone, you could lose good people.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, you do lose good people. It's like not could, it's almost a definite. And you know, Jake and I were saying actually a while ago, how many good people that we saw that just couldn't, you can't unless you have a significant backing or you had a really good advisor that was behind you, you would not be able to support yourself. And that that's that's one of the issues with these single swim programs, is they are great and they are getting more people in. And throw you know enough at a wall, then some will uh some will stick, but I it's like really weird in 2025. Like, you really want to operate like that on an ongoing basis? I mean, for me, no. I you know, I'm super passionate about this pathway program, and we've re-jigged it because it wasn't working how we'd how we'd had it, uh, how we'd had it going. So now we've moved them over to Dubai, we give them a salary, we give them them. Give them accommodation for the first six weeks, we give them training, pay for their exams, they have Rebecca coming in once a week to sit with them to get them to where they need to be. I mean, like, there's not much more that we could do for them. You spend time with them, Matt spends time with them, I spend a bit of time with them. And I'm super excited that next year we'll have seven. That's what we're gonna go for, aren't we? In January, we're gonna recruit another seven more. And then in the UK, we're gonna try and take on our first two or three as well and start growing that out and building that out, which is really a really exciting proposition as well.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes. And the opportunity there, you know, we we've talked about this. I mean, people go off to university to do degrees. I mean, we've got a number of people between the ages of 18 and 21 now with us that are starting on that program. Yes, okay, they might be on the program a bit longer before they become advisors, but then age is just a number. You know, I'm quite looking forward to having a 21-year-old advisor because we will have soon, you know. What an opportunity, 18, 19, 20 years old in the UK or internationally, rather than going spending 30,000, 40,000 pounds going to university if it's not right for you to get into a profession, like a working apprenticeship, really, and be a qualified advisor by the age of 21, 22. I mean, it's unbelievable.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I'd have absolutely chomped at the bit for that, yeah, at that age, if I'd have been given that opportunity, but it just didn't exist.

SPEAKER_02:

And I think that the the the only thing that annoys me is that we can't do it for 200. Yeah. We're not there yet, but I'm sure we I'm sure we will see. Yeah, this time actually. That worries me a little bit. Yeah. We will be uh with a few more mats. Yeah, exactly. We will be, we will be at uh we will be at some point. But that's the way that that's the way that we need to prepare. And you know, I think what we said is these people are super ingrained in our business and you know they're doing really well. That being said, though, we have brought in some really good organic advisors into the business as well this year. Um so I know obviously in the UK we've had different people join at different stages. So, like we had um obviously Adam join us from how many years was it he worked on his own?

SPEAKER_01:

It was 10 years, I think, on his own in a network, literally sitting at home on his own, not working with a team. He outsourced admin, power planning. Um, and he was desperate to reinvigorate what he was doing and work within the team.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, I think that's that's it's so hard. It is hard, it sounds amazing. Like what you've described, some people will look at and go, buddy, that's amazing. Like outsource their power plan, outsource their admin, they're just working at home, you know, as and when they wanted. That's great for a for a for a period, but it's very difficult to grow. Like a rising tide raises all the ships. Yeah. Like you can't like you can't be operating in your own pool and expecting to grow, learn, unless you're constantly out there in other people's businesses.

SPEAKER_01:

My experience is not that people actually do it for those reasons as well. People don't go and set up as a an AR within a network because they want to be from home and they want to have full flexibility and they want to. That's not the driver. The driver is actually that they're typically more entrepreneurial than um some of the places that you could go and sit and be an advisor within a business. And the business typically doesn't align with them in terms of being aspirational and entrepreneurial. So they kind of want to build value, they want to build their own thing. Um, and not many organizations give them the opportunity to kind of build their own personal legacy and um, you know, be entrepreneurial and have the support of a team and that sort of thing, which is what we've tried to tackle in the UK, tried to tackle that problem. 100%.

SPEAKER_02:

And you've done a great job of it internationally as well.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, it's funny you mention that because you know, people have this thing that if I work for a company, I'm gonna be chained to a desk. I'm expected to be in a. I mean, don't get me wrong, for younger guys and people that are growing, we want them in and they need to be in and they've got to learn because you need to be around people. But we had we've had Lloyd join last year, Lloyd came over, Lloyd's a super successful advisor, and you know, got a very, very large book, and he just wanted to be reinvigorated and he just wanted to get back into an office with people that were like all like him that wanted to do really, really well and have that collaboration again. But, you know, Lloyd doesn't, we don't make Lloyd come in the office at 7.30 and work till 7.30 every night. Don't get me wrong, I'd love him to. But you know, he'll come in for three, four hours, spend time with his team, then he's out seeing meetings. Some days he might work from home or he might work from DIFC. You know, it's not a you have to be in, but you will get the difference is the reason he comes into the office where he didn't do before with other other firms is what he gets from being around those people. You know, if you've got a challenge with a client or you've got a particular case, because we work across multiple jurisdictions. You might have a client with US, UK, European, and Australian assets. You can't just work that out yourself. You've got to speak to professionals, and we've got those people available in the office.

SPEAKER_01:

So it does make it he's a very good example. Yeah. Like he doesn't just come to the office for FaceTime and just to kind of show his face. He comes in, he's office. Yeah, and he spends plenty of time speaking to people, understanding what people are doing, seeing if he can pull from people for resources. Um he he's constantly picking my brain when I'm in the office about UK uh business as well. Uh it's a really good example.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, great, great example. And I think that's also trying to dispel that myth as well, is that we make everyone come into the office and they must be in at seven and they must not leave till seven. I know I harp on about that quite a lot on my on my socials about the power of the office. And that's because personally I do like coming into the office every day. And I I, you know, when I travel and I'm away for a few weeks, I find it really difficult being away from everyone. Um, and I'm not as productive. However, I think I've mellowed uh over the past few years. And actually, now throughout the business, I mean, some people we do operate a uh work from home policy as well. We have hot desking in the offices now uh that people can book a book on the app and choose a desk if they want to come in or if they don't want to come in. The senior advisors, it's not mandatory for them to be in if they don't want to be. Um for some of the you know support staff, it's typically four or three days a week. We expect them in the office. Um, and then for the junior advisors and the trained E wealth managers, we do want them in the office. Because it is, you know, you're on a steep learning curve and you're not doing that, sat in your bedroom on your own. Um, so we are a bit stricter with with them, but ultimately, if that's not for you, then that's not for you as well. That's fine. But I think with the senior advisors and the people who have earned the respect in terms of the work from home, we have developed that out to be more flexible on that.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, but they still come in the office. Yeah, yeah. You know, so you're giving them the flexibility. I mean, they come in the office and they spend time with the guys. So maybe not every single day. And that, you know, it it does make sense when you're advising. If you've got 12 meetings in a day, like someone like Tommy will have 12 meetings back to back, he'll text me and say, Listen, mate, I'm not coming in today. I'm busy from eight to eight. Well, he's just gonna be sat at his desk doing the meetings anyway, so he may as well be in his home office. But but they are all still coming in three, four days a week, which is fantastic.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, they're the culture, the culture and the vibe and the energy and whatever it's it's infectious. Uh, and I remember when we first spoke um when we were talking about building out the UK business and replicating that and making sure we had that vibe in the office that people wanted to be there. And you've got to create that. It's your responsibility as a leader in the business to create the environment that people want to be in, not just you've got to be in the office for the sake of being in the office. Why? Yeah, and we've got plenty of reasons why.

SPEAKER_02:

And I think that's another, you know, another area that's gone obviously. There's so much when you start reflecting on what's happened in the years so far as well. But London going moving into central London from St Albans. Um, that was a that was a challenge in itself uh in terms of the whole office move experience and not the move, it was things got changed on our contract at the last minute that we weren't overly happy with, so we had to hot foot and try and find another uh another office fairly quickly, which we did, and Charlie did a fantastic job of going back to the UK and and sorting that out, obviously, alongside yourself and also my dad, big tone, uh trying to trying to trying to get that done. But it was um, you know, it having that central London presence now and being in an environment where we can grow out that office with Jamie is you know, it's like pinch me moment for me.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it's an injection of life as well. So Jamie coming in, obviously, uh big um has has had a big influence, but just St. Albans was a lovely place, really, really nice town, lovely, but uh relatively quiet. It's not like a it's not there's no real hustle and bustle. No, you feel the energy as you're walking through London, Liverpool Street, you go to the office, you're around other businesses, there's plenty of opportunity for people to network and collaborate with other businesses, and we're talking about you know, going into other businesses and talking about what we do, that sort of thing. That doesn't exist if you're not in that environment. So it's been massive for us.

SPEAKER_00:

I think we've learned on the office thing, haven't we? That you've got to be central. You know, you've got, you know, we've done the new office over in Mexico, right in the middle of Mexico. We have a Dubai office in the middle. You're great, and it yeah, it might be a bit cheaper to be 45 minutes outside, but the people that you want in your business, they want you to be in the middle of it.

SPEAKER_02:

We're our business is the people, yeah, and attracting those ta and attracting that talent is is super, super important, and therefore investing in good spaces for them to work is is great. I mean, the office we're in in London, uh have you been to it yet? Not yet, no.

SPEAKER_00:

Hopefully, it's it's really cool.

SPEAKER_02:

I mean, I I landed in, and I'm I'm not saying that you've got to do this, obviously, but I landed in, I landed into uh I landed into Evro, had a shower in the airport, um, in the in the lounge, and then was on a train. I was in the office before eight o'clock. I was like, God, this is amazing. Yeah, exactly. A disco wash in the airport and then uh and then go uh and then go back. But it's um it's it's just great being so central and like you said, that hustle and bustle uh with it as well. Um so you know, obviously, look, we've got um we've got a lot of successes in terms of what has happened. Asia is another one that we'll talk about, but let's let's just pause before we get on to Asia and let's talk about maybe some of the areas that have um that have not gone so well. And for me this year, you know, I was quite bullish at the start of the year talking about the US uh and really wanting to grow that out. Um and that for me was really an area that I wanted to have accomplished this year. Personally, it was kind of like a personal target to to make that US domestic presence. And I think what you learn as you start trying to build these things out is that number one, you have to have someone who is focused on that area all day, every day, and it has to be the right person as well. So obviously, we'd hired a person to come and help us grow that business, and for one reason or another, it didn't work out. Um you know, I'm a big believer, I believe. I'm a big believer, I believe. I'm a big believer of if you say you're gonna do something, you need to do it. And as I tell my kids, there's no point in rizzing me up, like, you know, giving me all the sizzle, but not, you know, tell you know, if you're gonna give me the sizzle, you need to you need to deliver on it. I think we can both vouch for that.

SPEAKER_00:

I learned that the hard way last year when I was obviously trying to keep Chris happy and I'd say to him, Yeah, we're gonna do this, and he'd be like thing, and then he'd write it down, and then uh throughout the year he'd come to me, he'd be like, You said you're gonna do this by this date, and I'd be like, Did I? Sure, you know. So I've learned be careful. I've learned now, don't get me wrong, you've got to be aspirational, you've got to have goals, but they need to be realistic goals because otherwise, and one thing we've done really well this year, I think, is our budgeting and our planning, we've really, you know, nailed it because you when you're growing a business, you've got to think it's right. And I think when I was getting a bit excited last year, I'd be like, No, we're gonna do it because I believe in the guys and all that sort of stuff. And then when I got basically pulled up on it a few times, I was like, no, I need to really write starting.

SPEAKER_01:

But that's important, it runs right through the business. Yeah, accountability runs from top to bottom. 100%.

SPEAKER_02:

I mean, ultimately, the the thing with any business is you base your numbers off what people are gonna tell you you're gonna do. So it's not like we all look at revenue and we look at AUM. Really, we run a cost base off that revenue and off that AUM, you know, and it's Rule 101. If your revenue does not match your costs, then your business becomes in proper, you know, you have uh you have problems very quickly. It's not like we're a sleepy old business where it's just a cash printing machine. All the cash that we make, we reinvest. We go and buy more businesses, we go and try and recruit more talent. It's that compounding effect of doing that over years and years and years, which we've all bought into and which we're going for. So, you know, with the US, that was a that was a tough moment. And I think that also made me pause and reflect as well when we've when we figured out that that wasn't going to work, was uh you know it's actually don't rush like if it takes 24, 36 months instead of the six and a half months which you gave yourself, that's not necessarily a bad thing because actually the US is a huge, huge, huge opportunity, but could also buckle your business if you don't get it right. Um you could do serious long-term damage to the business if you rush in and don't do a good job. Um and you know, we've we've learned that with we've learned that with um we've learned that across the business, and you know, that's that's a learn, that's a learning uh curve.

SPEAKER_00:

We've done a good job now of realizing things quicker. So we used to just let things bumble along. Like if somebody was in the training wealth manager role, was doing okay, it'd be like, well, they're okay, they might get it in the future. Whereas now we've obviously set our high our expectations out from day one. We now look at it every month, we score the guys, we look at how they're progressing, and we look at if it's the right thing for them. And if it isn't, you know, we have that conversation and deal with it. Because one, it's not good for morale if you just let that bumble along, you know, and two, you know, it's not fair on the people either, you know, just letting them sit there and and not do what's thing. You know, one thing I'd say that we've done all of us have done better this year is if something's not working, we talk about it and we basically finish with it and deal with it. 100%. It's not let's not kick the can down the road, you know.

SPEAKER_02:

It's important you have to have awkward conversations sometimes. Not every conversation is blowing smoke up each other's backsides and telling each other how great you've done. We know we're doing a good job, we know we're all progressing in the right direction, but actually how you build real success and true greatness is looking at the things that aren't going right, either cutting them and getting rid of them, or repairing them and making it uh and making it stronger. Because sometimes there's things you've just got to cut and not not necessarily uh not necessarily put back in in place. Um and it takes you know a strong set of individuals to recognise that and not to chase your towels, which you know, I'm I'm really I'm really pleased. And I think that that's another reason that you know we've had such a such success is the strong management team that we do have in place uh across across the whole of the business. You know, another another uh another challenge that we obviously had this year was in the UK. At the start of the year, um we had to rejig, you were talking about infrastructure, rejig our compliance function. It wasn't working. It was slowing down the amount of business that we could do. The the person that we bought in with the role um was great, but the role wasn't for them and it wasn't for us, and it wasn't working. So we had to make a change. Yeah. And I think, you know, the person that we bought in, Catherine, um, now that was, you know, a few months of you and Charlie really rolling up your sleeves and getting involved, which probably you wouldn't have wanted to. But again, that's the sign of great leaders, is they're not, you know, they don't just kind of dash it off, they roll up their sleeves and they get involved when they need to as well. Um, that shouldn't be all day, every day, but you know, there are times when it needs to get done. And and we moved on. But that was a challenge.

SPEAKER_01:

It was a serious challenge, but it was also a massive opportunity. And you you you realised that very quickly. Being honest, before that moment happened, I didn't have as much of a grasp of compliance and what was needed, what things we needed to do, how it impacted the advice team, what the processes were and what things we could change. Me and Charlie getting stuck into that and figuring out how it all looked and the things we could do to make it better, massive opportunity. So by the time Catherine came, she actually came into a obviously this it's kind of it's it's I hadn't we hadn't sussed it all and figured it all out, but she came into a much better situation than when we'd started that process. Um so you know, it was it's all of these these things, it's so easy. And it's the same with the US not quite going uh the way you planned it. It's an opportunity to sit back, reflect, and go, okay, so if if if we're gonna go go again, what do we need to do better? How can we do it better? Um, are there things that were getting in the way that we could change that you know it's quite an easy win? Um, I think any any challenge is an opportunity.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, but I think on that, it's it's amazing when you do get into a thing where it's where it's tough. So, like you mentioned about the compliance, you go in, you learn about it, and actually it makes you stronger as being able to work with the team in the future. For sure. You know, one thing I've always, you know, you've always done really well is you understand the technology, you understand the marketing, you understand the thing. Like since I've been working in more of a management role, stupid stuff like now I'm more involved in the phone systems. I mean, I never even knew anything about phone systems, but I'm dealing with the people the phone operators looking at you know the systems. All of these things that you learn strengthens your ability to be able to work with those people. And I think as you say with the compliance, yes, it was a pretty, probably a pretty tough time going through it, but now at least you've learned a lot more about it. It's made us better at what we do, I would say.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, for sure. I think as long as these things you come come back stronger, everyone has problems, no matter who you are, no matter what you do. It's a true test of your business, how you come out the back of it and what you actually do, what you actually do to solve it as well, which is which is really important. Um, you know, another test no doubt is gonna be Asia. Um, we've obviously acquired a business in Asia now. Um that's been, you know, that was uh that took again slightly longer than we anticipated. I think one thing I've learned with regulation and with uh MA is things will always take longer than you expect them to, and you cannot you want to push and drive to get things done, clearly. And I think I'm pretty good at good at good at that part, but you also need to realize that you don't throw your toys out the prime if it doesn't. Um, mercy of other people. Exactly. You are, and also you need to hold people accountable. Like you said you were gonna do it on this day, why is it not done? Or why we said it was gonna be done by here, why is it not done, and making sure that it, you know, what is in your control is done, but also not throwing your toys out the prime if it's not, and you know, trying to push to to get to get the result. But Asia took slightly longer than we anticipated and we'd hoped. And you know, acquiring Infinity was um was a stretch in terms of we'd never acquired a business that big. We'd never actually acquired a business up until that point where we were integrating all of the staff. So we obviously acquired businesses where we were gonna integrate the clients and get our great client servicing team to service them. But, you know, now um, you know, now with Asia um trying to integrate all the staff, that that is gonna be a challenge in itself. But it's one I'm actually really relishing because I think number one, we're gonna learn a shitload from doing this. Like that there is gonna be huge learning that we're gonna do. Uh, and number two, what I'm really excited about is actually bringing those people up. So we've got a group of people. We've we've taken groups of advisors that have come in and we've lifted them up from doing, you know, and we'll talk about this in a minute. The you know, the guys from uh from the company that should not shall not be named that came in. Um, but you know, Asia, we've really got this chance to now elevate these guys, help them, show what we can do with them. And I think that can be a real, you know, proud moment for us, hopefully, when we come back and sit at this at the end of the year that, oh great, they're all fantastic and you know everyone's rooted in. But you know, that's that's uh that's a really interesting business.$230 million of AUM, some big clients that they have as well. I think one of the biggest clients they have is like$40 million, um, which is, you know, which is which is great. Um, so yeah, really exciting times. And obviously, you are heading that up now, um, the age of operations and and working on uh you know growing that business out.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. Yeah. And I spent time there last week um really enthusiastic about what we can do. They've got a great platform for us to sort of build out that Asia presence. I I love this stuff. So it's like when I walked into the UK business, kind of doing your fact-finding, figuring out what's there, what they do well. And there's plenty that they do well, they've got good people, you know. Trevor's got a huge amount of experience, Ben's got a huge amount of experience, they can help us kind of uh they've got that local knowledge that we'll need to tap into. Um, but we know how to sort of inject life into a business. Uh, and it's about, you know, pulling, pulling all of that together and giving it that life that we know we can give it. Um, and it's the start of something I believe will be very special in Asia.

SPEAKER_00:

I think, you know, when you are going, you know, we talked about the US, right? You know, going into a new market without having local knowledge is is tough. Yeah. You know, we've seen that and we've seen that multiple times, even with the UK, really, you know, like obviously JJ was came into the UK and had been working, you know, came as a manager of the UK. I think going into Asia and having a good platform of people that we can add our bit of touch to and we can look, but I think we'll learn a lot from them as well, because it is a different market. Yeah, yeah, and it it means that we've probably cut out two to three years of mistakes, at least, you know, and time and ups and downs and all those sorts of things. And it's really it's exciting to see just with a bit of our sprinkle of you know, drive and what we can do from growing a business. I think they'll do really, really well.

SPEAKER_02:

100%. And I think look, that kind of transfers across the rest of the business as well, because what inspires or gives me confidence that we can go and do that is the advisors that we have bought through. So, you know, we mentioned Lloyd before. I'm not saying we bought Lloyd through, but we've definitely well, I'd hope Lloyd would think that we've definitely enabled him to go and do more uh and helped give him the activity to go and go, you know, done the things we said we would. George, when he came back to us, obviously he left us and then he came back, and I'm sure people are bored of my uh this you know how many people uh that you know resigned when I was on the flight. Um uh, you know, and that's been um that's but that's been really good. But then there's also been people that didn't have books of business that, you know, or books of clients or AUM that you know, Declan, Oscar, Aaron, you know, we've got all of the Wadia, all of these people that have really focused on it. And, you know, internationally you've done an amazing job at you know giving them the activity and building it up.

SPEAKER_00:

The thing was, they were some of the guys that joined us last January, they were really, really talented advisors. Like they they knew the job inside out and like were impressive when they first came in. They just had no structure, they had no process, they had no way of generating activity, they just just basically were bumbling along and we just plugged them in, stuck them around people, gave them structure, gave them process, set out business plans, accountability, which we talked about. I mean, I've talked about this on the podcast before, but I remember sitting with Oscar six months in and he went very heavy down the US route and he was like, it's not working because the other guys had gone down the GCC route and we're bringing on clients quicker. He was like, It's not working, it's not working. I said, stick with it. I mean, I think as of last week, he's just passed 35 million of assets under management in 19 months. That's it. You know, and now he's getting his service management fees on that, and he's not, you know, he's not changing. Again, 35 million dollars 35 million pounds last month in since January 2024. From a standing start.

SPEAKER_01:

You won't see that in many places globally.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, I sat down to do targets with a number of the advisors from this year. You mentioned there, George, um Ravi, Oscar, and we'd set pretty lofty targets so uh for the beginning of the year, and all three of them have increased their targets for the end of the year, you know. And I mean, I have to tell Ravi to stop increasing his targets because he's probably getting a little bit ahead of himself. But you know, these guys, and that's just because they're following the structure, they're following the process. The other thing with that, and I don't think we talk about enough, is our brand. Our brand now is is so good that when we we we're getting bigger client inquiries. I mean, we have so many inquiries on a daily basis, but they're not just a hundred thousand pound pension, two hundred thousand pound four okay. I mean, we recently had marketing leads come in that are four, five, six million dollars.

SPEAKER_02:

We had someone who downloaded the app, yeah, yeah. Someone who downloaded the app um had uh for whatever reason the app he was using. I can't remember which one it was, um, but it it they'd stopped basically offering it as a service. So the the the the service levels have gone right down. So he's looking for someone else. He'd been referred by someone else to our app four million dollars uh of assets that we now manage because he's now downloaded our app, he could see it as a great way to track his assets. I think guys went like$50 million or whatever it is. I mean, it's you know, it's a but it's a big client, a big potential client. And that all came through brand, investment in technology, uh advisor enablement, all of that kind of you know, all of that good stuff that we that we harp on about. And it's great to see, like you said, you know, that that stuff starting to shine through. I think, you know, another I think another you know reason for this as well, and it's not to be overlooked, is I'm not s do as I say, not as I do. Yeah. We've all been advisors. Yeah. I mean, in my biggest year, I was looking at this with Kane. We took on 60 million pounds of assets in one year. It was going for it, you know. Like we've been there, we've done it, we understand. And actually the people that we're bringing into the business have also done it with other people and understand. So the you know, this this next tier of people that we're speaking to, these aren't people that are just pretenders, no, you know, or saying I can do it and have never actually done it. And I think, you know, again, that's maybe in some of the regions where it hasn't necessarily worked, why? Because they hadn't done it, and that's been a lesson to me. But it's really you've got to focus on people that have, you know, lived it, breathed it, walked it, and you know, that's them. It's like there's there's real substance behind what they do.

SPEAKER_00:

Also leave from the front, right? You know, like you can you can tell people to come in the office at 7.30 in the morning, but if you're not there at 7.30 yourself, it's not very fair, is it? No, no, you know, we brought Matt Morgan in. I reg, I mean, I I get in between 7.30 and 8, but sometimes a bit earlier on most days, and he's generally sat at his desk. Yeah, you know, I see Teams messages flying around 6.30 at night, and that's not because we told him he has to work to 6.30 at night, that's because he believes in the growth of the business and helping people. I mean, he was doing a training session with the US guys last night at 7.30 after we'd had a full day of planning. You know, you've got to lead from the front. And, you know, as you say, do not do as I say, do as I do, and you know, make sure people can see you doing that because they will follow 100%.

SPEAKER_02:

Stuart in the UK has been a really successful advisor in his own right. Jamie has seen God knows how many billion flow through the Knightsbridge office and has helped enable some of those people. Like these are high quality individuals that are in the business to help people grow.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and you see the you see the influence that they've had. We've had advisors that have um struggled to convert a client, and Jamie sat down with them and said, Well, have you tried this? And have like have you what's your approach and listening to how people are positioning things and presenting things? Because they've got that experience, they can say, Well, why don't you try this?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh, which goes a long way, but also they've got the credibility um where they will be respected and listened to because then it's not someone that hasn't been an advisor or hasn't, like Jamie's worked for providers and worked at SJP and and whatever and worked with some super successful people. Yeah. And Stuart still is a very successful advisor, goes a huge amount, carries a lot of weight.

SPEAKER_00:

Still walking the walk. Yeah, you mentioned that then, though. You know, like the other thing is these guys aren't scared to ask for help. We used to work in businesses where you did your own business and no one talked about what they were doing.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

You know, Ravi will come to me on a regular basis saying, I'm speaking to this client, I could really do you coming on the call, having a chat with him. He's got a few questions that, you know, I could do with your help. You know, I don't know all the answers. I'd rather than come to you and go back to him. Will you come on the call with me? Mo speaking to Jack in the UK. You know, that's collaboration. But that's these are some of our best advisors. I mean, Mo is probably one of the most successful advisors I've ever met internationally, and now in the UK. I mean, he does a lot of business in the UK. Jack's just started with us and he's ringing him up to ask for advice. I mean, that's amazing. It's great.

SPEAKER_02:

That's exactly what you want. It's exact, it's exactly what you want. You want people working together, helping each other and talking. And it's that, like I said, it's that focus on advisor enablement. Like, you know, one of the things that we said at the start of the year that we really wanted to focus on was one day client. Like, how can you, as an advisor, compliantly, of course, take on one day client? And over the past few weeks, we've really started to see all the work that's gone into that start to come through. It's not right, it's not perfect. None of these things ever are when you when you roll them out. There are tweaks and things that we'll be changing to do it, but we have 25 developers in-house. It's not like we've given someone the project and now we're kind of out of credit with them. Like we will be reiterating this and making this as uh as as good as possible. You know, one of the things that we're really focusing on at the moment is obviously the EKYC. So electronic know your client. Now that might seem basic to some people, that's global. Like that's very, very difficult to do right, but that also takes off a lot of burden from our compliance team. It means when you go and see a client, you've not got to wait for us to upload it into our system to then, you know, see if there's any sanctions and pep checks. You know, pretty much instantly whether there's going to be be an issue or not. We've obviously got the online fact find, which we've rolled out, and then we're bringing that onto the app as well. And then we also have um the attitude to risk questionnaire, which we're rolling out globally as well. So getting to the point where you can just do everything through the app.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

You talk about challenges, right? You know, September, busy, busy month getting going again. We've rolled out three new processes to the whole company, which obviously are gonna make their jobs easier and it is the best thing happened. And we've just done it, right? All at once. And it's been a challenge, it's been hard word get hard work getting it all going, but the guys have come back, there's been okay, some people are like, and people don't like change, let's be honest, you know, even though it's making their life easier, it's a challenge, but we've just done it, you know, and you just got to get on with it, and it will continue to pose challenges because it's a new process. But how much quicker is that gonna be for us all?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and I think that there's two things that I think drive the behaviors and this collaboration piece. One is that um they constantly see that the amount that's been invested into tools that will support them and make their life better and easier. Uh, and then the L tip as well goes a huge amount of way. People will benefit collectively from our group effort in trying to grow the biggest and the best financial planning business. So it constantly brings people back together. Um, that reinvestment constantly into improving an advisor's life and the whole team's life. Yeah. Like paraplanners will be able to do their jobs easier, administrators will be able to do their jobs easier. They haven't got to do all these manual processes. Everyone feels like there's a constant evolution and improvement in what they can what they can do and what we do.

SPEAKER_02:

It's an investment in them, isn't it? I mean, you know, I kind of the the the way I describe it is is that as an advisor, really a lot of your revenue is derived around um how many clients that you can manage effectively. The more clients that you can manage effectively and provide a great service, then the more revenue that you will derive over the longer run, be that a salary, you you know, you can manage more clients, you can demand a higher salary, or be that if you want a fee split, you can do more. So, um, but without having to constantly increase your team as well. So at the moment, my kind of thing is 200 clients to 250, an advisor, power planner, and half an admin. And actually, what we want to get to is 500 clients, one advisor, half an admin, and the power planning is only picked up for really complex cases, like like we said. That that that is the North Star, and that is what we're trying to aim at. The other thing that I think has been really good great as well now, that you know, what we've we had it in place historically, which is the buyback, which is where we would take the income from, you know, we would buy the income from the fee split advisors and move it into our servicing team, and they would manage it on an ongoing basis. Um, that has proved super successful. And actually, what we're now starting to see is advisors go, do you know what? I actually I've progressed my career and I have um, I have, I'm, you know, the type of clients that I'm dealing with now are not the same clients that I was dealing with when I was younger. Still want them to receive a great service. It's not going to be through me. I don't necessarily want to have many junior advisors underneath me managing them. Great, can we transition this into the client servicing team and can they pick that up? And I think Simon's doing a great job of putting that in place. And obviously, we've got it in place in the UK already. But that's that's that's really interesting as well.

SPEAKER_00:

That's a huge opportunity, that's you know, obviously, and people move, right? You know, you may focus on one market and then decide I want to move somewhere else and do another market. And rather than those clients, and I'm not saying our advisors ever do that, but rather than those clients maybe not getting the same level of service, the client the advisor's willing to go, okay, well, I know that I can't continue to give that level of service, so I'm gonna pass that back to the business, I'm gonna get rewarded because I brought those clients in and I can focus on bringing on better clients. And obviously, that links in. We've obviously brought in our NPS score this year, where we rank all the uh pieces of advice uh goes out to the client and they basically write, rate, rate our um, they call it net promoter score, where they would they recommend us. And you know, our rate rankings are really, really good because our service levels are high, and we can continue doing that if the advisors either take on more um support, have more technology, or pass those clients into the client services team, which they've been doing.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. It's a great opportunity for advisors to kind of, you know, not only earn great income during their lifetime, but also um to have capital events along the way. So you don't just have to sell all your clients and then just dump, you know, move and that's it, you're done. Like actually, you can receive some capital events during your lifetime. Um, and then also with the L tip as well, as the business grows, that you have a chance to be part of that. So it's really giving you that reason why a lot of people set up on their own, which is to achieve some kind of capital value at the end along the way, and also at the end as well, should they not wish to. You know, it's like it's offering, it's trying to make a platform that you can feel comfortable bolting into, that you get to do the bits that you like that you're not focused on doing the bits that you don't like.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, so removing those glass ceilings as well. Every advisor gets to a point of capacity. Not everyone wants to get to a point because some if you're a really good business writer and you're really good at looking after your clients, you'll hit that capacity point pretty quickly. And you don't want to get to that and then go, oh, I can't do more. We give you that opportunity to constantly do more. Uh and the investment in technology and uh and whatever feeds into the L Tip as well because it means we can manage headcount, the L tip can increase because our valuation increases because we're managing costs and things like that. So the whole thing just constantly feeds into we're a scaling, growing, super aspirational business.

SPEAKER_02:

It's the flywheel, isn't it? Yeah. Right. So, you know, we've obviously talked heavily about what's gone on in the business and what we're excited about. Where do you think we're gonna get to with, you know, where do you want to get to at the end of 2025? What are your goals for the end of the year?

SPEAKER_01:

Uh, plenty more of acquired businesses, uh acquired assets into the UK business. Uh, we've got a decent pipeline and hopefully something to be announced pretty quickly. Fingers crossed. Fingers crossed. Uh so plenty more of that, growing inorganically, continuously growing our organic uh team as well, bringing in some more experienced advisors with their own books of business as well. Yeah. It's got a very young team, uh, and we've seen the benefit of having Stuart, Teresa, Adam around some of the younger servicing guys, kind of uh kind of kicking everyone on. Um, and look, I want to be the best, the biggest financial planner business in the UK eventually. So continuously moving down that that track. And I think I think the team that we got in the UK could be looking over at over a billion uh in assets under over management, hopefully, very, very soon. Very, very soon.

SPEAKER_00:

Jake? For me, more of the same from the advice point of view. I want the guys to continue going at the rate we are, continue growing the rate they are. But I suppose the goals that I have are slightly different to you guys. I mean, our trainee, wealth manager, business development team are doing an absolutely unbelievable job, you know. And one thing we've focused on really heavily is obviously their development and training, but also they're a big part of generating the activity for our guys on the front end. We currently average between 150 and 200. New meetings a week that we create through the marketing leads that come in and through referrals. I mean, I want to get that moving because that actually feeds the rest of the business. Like if I can get that to 250, 300 meetings a week, which I can't, I'm not committing to by Christmas, by the way. But if that's what we can get that to, because that's what we need for the amount, especially with Asia and everything else. You should write that down, shouldn't I? Yeah. Um, and then my next one is I've got the four new trainee wealth managers that started in uh in May. Yeah. So by the end of the year, they'll be starting their examinations. We'll start to partner them up in May next year with advisors, but it's to get another seven of the quality of what we got this time. I mean, recruitment is tough, yeah, right. You know, I interviewed 60 people. I pushed probably too many through to speak to Chris before the uh before we brought them on. We ended up with five really, really good candidates. And now we're doing that all over again. You know, and but I think every time we do this, we get better recruits coming in. So yeah, it's more activity for the guys because that's what that's what drives the business forward. Um, continue doing what we're already doing and and recruitment. Hopefully, a few organic advisors come in along the way. You know, there's a lot of people in the market that are super, super uh advisors. So hopefully there's a few more of those guys that want to come in, and we've got very good at integrating them as well. Same as same as in the UK.

SPEAKER_02:

So yeah, for me, it's 4.3 billion of assets by the end of the year. That's where I want to end up. We're at 3.5 at the moment. We've got some decent acquisitions coming in. We've got a good run rate on our organic business as well. So I'm super, super sure we can get there or we will get there by the end of the year. Um, so that that's where I'd like to end up.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, well, I've got a target by the end of next year for sterling assets, but we won't we won't shout about that one yet.

SPEAKER_02:

But yeah, we'll we'll save that for 2026.

SPEAKER_00:

2026.

SPEAKER_02:

Awesome. All right, great. That was really good, guys. Thanks very much, and thanks for being so open and honest as always. It's all it's always important to discuss our flaws as well as our positives and strengths, and hopefully that gives you a good idea of where we are as a business, you know, kind of mid Q3 or the end of Q3 2025. Looking forward to coming back and doing the year wrap up and where we're going to set off the the new year. And thanks very much for your time, and I hope you enjoyed the episode. Thanks very much.