Hector Bravo UNHINGED
Official Hector Bravo Podcast
Hector Bravo UNHINGED
Jay Hands - From Gang Politics to Content Creation and Change
Jay Hands from Renegade Media take us on a riveting journey into the dangerous and complex world of gang culture and prison dynamics. Jay, a former Northern Rider gang member, shares his courageous transformation from a life entrenched in crime to becoming a content creator with a mission to expose the harsh realities of gang affiliations. His bold stance against gang life has not only put him at risk but also positioned him as a voice for change, reaching audiences far beyond his initial local followers in Tulare County.
Provides an unfiltered look into the structured world of Norteño gang politics and the internal workings of the Nuestra Familia. His narrative reveals the rigid hierarchy and the intricate web of operations that drive these criminal organizations, from street-level activities to prison politics. Together, Jay and Hector explore the shifting alliances and ongoing disillusionment among inmates, offering an honest portrayal of how power struggles and flawed leadership continue to shape lives behind bars.
From gripping prison term reflections to the volatile dynamics of state and federal factions, this episode uncovers the multifaceted challenges faced by those entangled in the gang life. We discuss the influence of corrupt officers, the struggle for identity and survival, and the evolving strategies for maintaining control and avoiding violence. As we navigate through these compelling stories, the importance of truth, personal growth, and the need for positive change becomes evident, demonstrating the potential for transformation and hope beyond a life of crime.
Hector Bravo. Unhinged chaos is now in session. Oh shit, you done put two America's most wanted. The same motherfucking place at the same motherfucking time. Welcome back to our channels, warriors. Today we have a banger right in the house. We have none other than 5'9 Jay Jay Hands from Renegade Media. What up?
Speaker 2:dude. What's going on, man? It was a pleasure to be here. You already know I wanted to do this podcast with you, the infamous Jay Hands man. Not too many people get to see me in public, not too many people get the privilege to interview me, but we've done two interviews together that did bangers over the internet, so why not make it official and just do this one in person, exclusive, and give the audience members what they want?
Speaker 1:some important questions I appreciate that, dude. So um fuck bro, how did it feel to be in southern california right now, dude?
Speaker 2:I mean, san diego is beautiful. I like the waters, I like the bridges. Went to a couple you know gang neighborhoods just to trip out on it. But my audience members and a lot of people that think that I'm in hiding don't understand is that I'm in California a hell of a lot more than they think. I just don't present my location and I don't brag about it. There's no need for it with all the shenanigans people promote about me wanting me dead. There's no need to showcase where I'm at, but I still enjoy my life. So, coming to Southern California, this is nothing new. I stopped in LA. Now I'm in San Diego for the first time and enjoying seafood and enjoying the hills.
Speaker 1:So you totally understand that there's a credible thread on your life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's disappointing to an extent, though, because you know I'm speaking about truth and realities that people were afraid to speak about, and it's only because they're inspired by other gang leaders and gang bangers to not hear me out or they disapprove of what I'm saying and my message and the realities of the facts that I present. Yeah, I understand there's a threat, but that just goes to show me that what I'm saying is true and what I'm saying is detrimental to their gang life and their gang culture, that they really want me dead. But I'm not just going to live in fear and just stay in the house all the time just because they want me dead. I have a life to live. That's why I promote one life, one chance.
Speaker 1:Damn dude. No, I respect that dude. I mean fuck, you're all in. I mean you're all in you, you're all in, dude.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, they don't like it. But you know, the truth of the matter is they always say everybody knows what they signed up for, right? In reality, we really don't. And they could be as hypocritical as they want when they say that I'm just utilizing my content, the information that I gather, the investigations that I do, the journalism that I produce, to show kids, like man, there's a lot more to it than just, you know, being part of a neighborhood Facts. If you want to be part of the neighborhood, this is what comes along with it.
Speaker 1:How long have you been grinding away on the YouTube spreading the message already?
Speaker 2:I think I hit my two-year mark. To be honest with you, and to be honest with you, I started off YouTube wrong. I was a little thug, a little Northern Rider gangbanger, really. I was just trying to start a different movement. You know, I was branching off from Snoop Maurice Vasquez and I was just telling prison stories. But there was an encouragement that I seen in a comment section like hey, we want to hear your prison stories. So I started telling little by little, like all right, I made them funny, somewhat educational, and I seen man. After I was monetized my first, my second week on youtube, I realized that I had something. And when I got to 20 000 subscribers in six months, I was like, okay, this is, this is really what I want to do now be a content creator.
Speaker 1:Who are the people that were following you at first? Was it like people from your area, former gang members, current gang members? Who did you see?
Speaker 2:initially, initially was a lot of northern riders were following me in the beginning, but a lot of people from Tulare County and Kings County because I was referencing a lot of names from a lot of different neighborhoods where people even knew these guys. A lot of my co-defendants, a lot of dudes that were on the streets with me, that put in work with me, that watched me do all those string of armed robberies, watched me work, work for the big homies. We're like man, this fool's, over here telling all the street stories. So it was initially my local area and with the algorithm just pushed out to a greater audience and next thing, you know, I'm talking to people from Japan and UK Like, oh my God, I'm in Mexico right now, for sure. But it was mostly my general area, the 559. What county did you grow up in? I grew up in Tulare County. Tulare County, the city of Tulare, tulare County, mostly Tulare, visalia, farmersville, and then I caught my cases in Porterville.
Speaker 1:Now Tulare is Central Valley, central Valley, right California, south Central North yeah, but you ran with the Northerners. You were a Norteño. South central north yeah, but you ran with the northerners, you were norteno. Yeah, where's that line? Where's that line?
Speaker 2:bakersfield um yeah, used to. Well, technically it's always going to be back then, bakersfield back then. But you got to remember delano now has nortenos, now you got nortenos in mexico, then you got a norteno trying to come up in the streets of los angeles. People don't want to talk about it, but I've seen the pictures, I've seen the tagging, I've seen the neighborhoods just like they are in Mexico. But back then Bakersfield was the dividing line. I would never go past Bakersfield. I had no business going down south. Were there.
Speaker 2:Sureños in Tulare oh, yes, that's a fact and that's the thing that I think stirred up a lot of emotions in the beginning when I first started doing YouTube is that I started talking about you know wicked ass Sireños that were in Tulare and how we beef with them and how they shot up homies and the Norteño mentality is man. They don't like that aspect and that's why I think a lot of Tulare County Norteños don't like me now is because I talk about Southside Kings. I talk about Local Park. I talk about dudes like sniper that got out of ya and his dad was a northerner and he killed two northerners and went back to prison. I talk about dudes in different neighborhoods ivanhoe. There's southsiders there, and they're actually more deep now than they've ever been in tillary county what eight?
Speaker 1:what uh? What time frame. What years were these when you were down there doing your thing?
Speaker 2:I want to say between 99 and 2005 god damn man that's when the that's when the war in iraq was kicking.
Speaker 1:The war on the streets was kicking yeah, I remember I was in a.
Speaker 2:I was in a group home on a yh suspension when uh 9-11 took place and it's funny that we're all. They made us sit there and watch 9-11 on the news like we're ready to go to war for this terrorist attack.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And then me and a homie from Woodlake started beating up a Southsider from Woodlake During that, during that exact moment, we were watching the planes, we were watching the footages, we were watching everybody panicking and we just got so bored and we just looked at the Southsider like let's get rid of this dude. We just like the matters of importance that are bigger than us. Things are taking place, a drastic change in American history, but me and this dude want to go beat up a Southside.
Speaker 1:So I watch your channel, man, pretty consistently and you strike me as an intellectual individual. Were you that intellectual back then, or were you just a youngster running?
Speaker 2:amok. I was a youngster running amok. I was a mean drug addict. By the time I was 15 years old I was on crystal meds. The life of crime was what I got involved with and what I wanted to do that's all I cared about was being on the block, being with the members. Their stilo, their demeanor, their presentation on the streets just kind of made me straighten up a little bit, like I'm dealing with some powerful people. Back then I didn't know what politics really were, I just knew the way these guys conducted themselves. I was in a whole different ball game. So I started changing my mentality a little by little, but it wasn't until I got to county jail and did. My years in prison is when you know that dictionary and that thesaurus was like weapons of violence, the way you can use them.
Speaker 1:When did you get your first glimpse of the politics of the Nuestra Familia type politics?
Speaker 2:I talked about it a long time ago. This was in 2000, 2000, 2001. I was in the city of Tulare. My neighborhood wasn't involved in politics at the time but there was a gang war going on between the east and west, where Tulare was going at it over red on red crime. An NF member named Cobra got killed in Visalia and he was a street regiment commander. Once he got killed, a lot of the politics that were coming out of Visalia that were connected to prison just flooded the streets of Tulare County.
Speaker 2:So I seen a bunch of big homies just show up in vans, come to Tulare and just told us hey, we're going to stop this gang while you guys are killing each other. For what? Because one dude slapped some youngster in the face and that youngster decided to retaliate. Yeah, he was young-minded, he grabbed a gun, he was embarrassed, he cried in front of the homies and killed the big homies. So we went to war.
Speaker 2:So we threw a meeting at a park it was like Wilson Elementary School in the back. And, dude, I'd never seen so many Norteños in my life. It was like a GUN city all over again. Fifty of them. A lot of the big homies talked and they presented this filter, the red on red crime filter, and it was basically saying body of warfare is not going to be tolerated, so whoever continues to indulge in a in red on red crime is going to be dealt with. Repercussions meaning that nf were sending hit squads to kill those that are being responsible in the continuance of norteños killing norteños. That's when I seen this the seriousness, like okay, there's something else that's going on in the streets other than a red rag and a blue rag, and I'm from the east, he from the west. That got introduced to me and I was about 13, 13 years old more than likely.
Speaker 1:Do you think that filter came from the state prison?
Speaker 2:yeah, because, remember, this happened like in 2000, 2001, the 2001 filter circulated no body of warfare. That's when black widow operation kicked in. And remember, quite the gerald rubicaba is from vasilya, so we had a lot of ties to it break down the rank structure on the streets, because I know you said street regiment.
Speaker 2:Okay so dismiss the penal system aspect. Correct. The regiment commander is either going to be an NF member that's present on the streets, which could be from Salinas, can be from San Francisco, san Jose whoever's present, that's a high-ranking member, a capitano, or lieutenant On the streets. I can start with Tulare. Tulare's Z-side had a regiment channel, which is the dude that pretty much controlled the hood shot caller for the hood. East and West had two regiment channels but then those channels had squad leaders and squad departments and manpower all that are assisting in the street regiment. Those two regiment channels are going to report to the dude that's going to run the whole city, which is a regiment commander. Those regiment commanders are going to reach all in different cities. There's going to be one appointed to control every city. All of them together is going to report to the regional commander, which is going to be an NF member.
Speaker 2:In or outside the prison system. Majority of the time they have to be out, but if there's none out we would. Back then Corcoran Shoe was responsible for Tulare County, kings County and Central Valley and then when she went up north to like 209, that's all Pelican Bay and up.
Speaker 1:So that's a rank structure? What about the soldiers, the tasks? Are there some that are shooters, some that have certain responsibilities?
Speaker 2:Some get assigned as murder squads but in reality it's who you give your consignments to. So, like I said back then from my hood I was answering to a homie named Steven Mraz that just got out of prison. He was the regiment channel so he was just burglarizing, stealing, burning up places, burning up houses, burning up garages, the taxations on legal businesses wasn't really his thing. That a silver from farmersville, the nf member that fell out of grace, that was his thing. So he had a lot of homies that worked for him that did that. But it all depends, like what you're capable of doing and what your extent you're willing to go. But in reality is, whatever they tell you to do is what you're going to do. So if they tomorrow they tell you to go kill somebody, that's your obligation.
Speaker 1:Now, realistically, were those dudes? Were you able to communicate with those type of guys? Were they people, persons, Were they they have authority issues, or is it kind of varied from individual to individual?
Speaker 2:It varies right. Most of the time when they address a crowd they're going to be open and freely, but then they always dismiss themselves and leave. So they never were present to hang with us and drink beers with us, and none of that. Or kick it at the football game and barbecues none of that. Silver was one that would. He was more hands-on, so he would go with you to go do something, but he would mostly stand outside while you did it. He was more hands-on.
Speaker 2:Bubbles, on the other hand, was the nf member I was working for and, um, like he, he wasn't a people person. I'll tell you that much. You, you couldn't really talk to him unless you were a squad member, squad leader, and you actually worked directly with him. He was the only one that'll work with his squad and people that would work for him. Every other nf member, like chante from selena's you couldn't go to his house, you couldn't accept, you couldn't call him direct. You're going to have to go through different types of people to get to him and then, when you get the message back, you might never even see that fool's face or breathe his air in his mouth. Some people are distanced but most of all when they have these meetings. They're real professional. They're not drinking, they're not smoking. They're not professional, they're not drinking, they're not smoking, they're not talking to nobody.
Speaker 1:They're just sitting there and just Do they have an entourage?
Speaker 2:Yeah, of course, of course. The meeting that I had in Porterville when I signed up to be on part of the squad was a backyard meeting. Had a couple cars in there and everybody's talking, everybody's smoking, but we're all confused, we're all like man, just kind of like did we do something wrong? The regimen was already out there. Then bart showed up.
Speaker 2:Bart brought the big homies and we seen these big homies and I just tripped out how everybody's demeanor was kind of like because I think everybody knew but everybody didn't know who these individuals really were. So when everybody cut the, it was the homie kukui. He cut the music and he told everybody to shut up. And then we just heard these political dudes start talking and what they wanted done and what was going on and the investigations that are being conducted. Because we had stabbed like three people that were connected to high-powered people, so they were trying to find out who was responsible.
Speaker 2:And a lot of us that were there that jumped, those dudes that stabbed those dudes were kind of like, damn they're, they're going to have us under investigation. And that's when they circulated the filter. It was Bart from Central Poros. His younger brother, wicked, was the one that walked around and was like hey, you want to work the squad, you want to be part of the squad, so if you didn't ask questions, you just put your name on it. They actually had a sign sheet. It was just a piece of paper like a composition book.
Speaker 2:But you had to provide, uh, like a number, cell phone number, your address, where they can find you, and like two other people, if they couldn't get a hold, you, those two people had to be the ones to be able to get a hold of you. But once you sign that little contract, you're basically saying that you're going to be available on call. So my dumb ass was like oh yeah, dude, what are we gonna do? What are we to do? And sure enough it wasn't about two weeks later, I was robbing everything moving.
Speaker 1:I'm not surprised that you put your name down, but I really didn't know whether you did or you didn't.
Speaker 2:man, yeah, I did it right then and there because I was already involved with a lot of shootings that were taking place A lot of violence and I was just like I live for that. A lot of violence and I was just like I live for that.
Speaker 1:It was the thrill of it. I can see the parallels between law enforcement and military, as far as like tactical units and the way that the NF conducted themselves out there in the streets.
Speaker 2:man, yeah there was a. It's really militant minded, so to speak, but it's the way they communicate. It's the structure, the form of communications. It's the structure, the form of communications and anybody that's involved in it, whether it's the relaying of messages, decoding messages, scrutinizing people's names, doing background checks it kind of just makes your mind question everything. Because I would go to places where they had these shoeboxes of bundles that smelled like cat litter, smelled like dookie, and it's bundles that people were hooping in prison and they'd be like, hey, who's these squad members names that were reported? I just run them through and I would sit there and these little scrolls, these little bnl bundles, we'd be looking for their names and I'm sitting here like free why not just go get hired, kick it with some broad? And I'm sitting there smelling some weird paper that smells like doo-doo and I'm like hold up, dude, wait a minute, man, you're telling me you're on the streets.
Speaker 1:You guys received bindles which pretty much have kites in them, and you guys, as norteños, had to go through them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we had to go through them. We had to go through them, check people's names. Did they come from the prison out to the streets? Yeah, people would parole like, say, if it was two norteños paroling from a certain prison and, uh, it had to be delivered to this location of this regiment and this regiment had to drop it off in this regiment, they would do that. So these dudes would deliver. They wouldn't have to even work for the regiment, they'll just deliver it. So maybe every three months we would get like a, a van full of homies. I'll show up at saleri county drop it off. And lindsey. Lindsey was the.
Speaker 2:It wasn't really the, it was like a database. They. They kept all the NF bundles and soul bundles and any kites coming out from there would be distributed to Larry County. So sometimes I'll be reading these kites or I'll be reading these names like nah, this dude's name ain't on here. It'll take like a two hour process and I just go back to getting high Like what are we here for? We were just scrutinizing anybody that was paroling or the members that are signed up for, if they had any bad names, if they're on a bad news list, if they were under investigation, if they're wanted for questioning. So we had to do all that. But I remember that first scent when he pulled out that little shoe box and he opened and started pulling out these bundles, I was like man, that smells like cat litter dude, like a cat litter box that sounds like a shitty job.
Speaker 1:Man, it was, I didn't even hand sanitize you ever catch any of the homies fucking up and biting the fucking thing with her teeth, you're like, hey, man nah they would already be unwrapped so they'd be unwrapped, just thrown around like already unscrolled. But that's a that's news to me, dude.
Speaker 2:I mean I went on potty watch in prison, I had to open up my own bundle and shoot it full of mierda. So I was like it's not a fun thing to do, oh boy, remind me to touch back on that story.
Speaker 1:Man, remind me to touch back on that one. So damn dude. Now, equipment wise, clearly, you guys need guns, you guys need vehicles, you guys probably need communications. Do the nf supply that to you guys? Does the regiment supply that to you guys, or is it up to each individual to get their own?
Speaker 2:equipment. The regiment is going to work. As in all the money that we accumulate, a third of it goes to the NF bank, which, whoever is going to be responsible for it ends up asking the penal system. The sergeant of arms and the treasury is going to be the people that are going to utilize the money for specific purposes, even though they document it on books, but in this case it's going to be on paper, mini written. Whatever money we make on the streets through drug sales, through burglarizing, through robbery, a third of it's always going back to the regiment to provide the sergeant at arms will use that to provide us weapons, guns. Man, I've been to houses where we lift up the mattress and there's a hole in the ground and it'd be stacked with you know, swap houses guns that we just had in the dirt. I've done shootings where I walked to some backyard I didn't even know whose it was and the dude was opening up the door escorted to the back, go to the shed, open it, we throw him in there, never even remember the location, maybe like two or three in the morning we just throw the guns in the shed, he locks the shed and we leave that spot. They have designated locations for that.
Speaker 2:Communication wise, they didn't like talking over the phone back then. Back then we had like little, I had like this little cricket. It was bull crap. So anytime you really wanted to convey a message, you were really going to talk to a certain person, meet the person at a certain location, verbal communication. They'd take it back to the person and just get reelected. That verbal communication was important and that's how they pretty much communicated.
Speaker 2:But when it comes to equipment wise, everybody was doing something different. There was identity theft going on, credit card frauds going on. I was more into like burglarizing, robbery. Robbery was my thing. Then you just have certain people that just wanted to go shoot stuff up. But the regiment, the nf, don't provide that. We as a collective collected all this money and we put it together and the regiment would hold that money and it'll be utilized for certain things, either to get these nf dues lawyers put money on their books, or if we wanted to like, say, if I wanted to borrow some money, they had a loan service so I can borrow like a thousand bucks but I had to get back like 1500 with interest, with interest. So you could do that as well if the bank was doing. You know it was doing well if it was good blossoming, but oftentimes no, no homies were borrowing that money because now you've talked a lot about burglaries and shootings.
Speaker 1:What about the dope game, man me?
Speaker 2:personally I wasn't involved in it, but it was happening. It was happening. It was happening. They were bringing U-Hauls from Delano all the way to Salinas. I know one got busted. The homie Nidal got busted driving one from Delano to San Jose. An NF member named Martin Martinez, he was from Goshen. He got busted. He set up like seven trap houses and he was bringing drugs from Southern California all the way to Northern California.
Speaker 2:There's a family in Visalia, the Palominos. They're well like indoctrinated into the dope game when it comes to heroin. So they produce a lot of the heroin. There was a tire shop in my town, fundy's. They had a lot. They moved a lot of dope behind that. So there was the dope game that was really going on. The homie Booger that got busted. He got life. Him and my uncle used to move a lot of dope from washington up to california. It did. That just wasn't my thing. I was more like I'd rather do the drugs and sell the damn drugs. I'd rather just go pick up a gun and rob somebody. But dope sales is where they get most of their money from how often were you smoking meth during that time frame?
Speaker 2:every day every day, every day. Dude, when I was once I hit that pipe when I was in ya and then I got out. I was just hooked and I couldn't stop so being up three, four days at a time with a pistol. And then I had reasons to gangbang, whether it was to shoot this house up, burn this house down or catch these dudes slipping, or if an nf member or big homie at the time would tell me to go do this. Dude, I'm already overly ambitious because I'm high on drugs where you didn't really have to tell me twice or convince me to do something. I was just doing it. The drugs took the toll on me the worst. That's why I made so much mistakes in my life, because I was just hooked on drugs, whether it was sleeping with a homie's old lady robbing the wrong person I've robbed old ladies and stole their purses. When I was younger, I made a lot of bad choices being on drugs and that's what got me more heavily involved, because I didn't really care. The drugs didn't let me care, did?
Speaker 2:you have a death wish at that time.
Speaker 2:I mean, when my grandma passed away, like I, a lot of people don't know about this, I never talked about it on my channel, but, like I, to end my life, my grandma was my everything. I didn't really have an important reason to live anymore. So, yeah, I was like I didn't care. I didn't care about getting shot, I didn't care about dying, I didn't care about nothing. I just figured if I die, I'm going to take somebody with me. I mean, there's Southsiders that put me at gunpoint, there's Southsiders that beat me after death and I was just like whatever, and I wake up the next day and I go, I'm gonna get my get backs.
Speaker 2:It doesn't really help. You change your mentality or or wake you up in this life like, yeah, bro, I almost died last night. I've been ran over by cars, I've been ran. I had a car hit me through a fence. So much stuff has happened to me where you know the death was there. Why hasn't it happened? It didn't happen, but it don't cross your mind when you're really out there. The shootouts that I've been in with southerners, even with northerners. It never crossed my mind like I could have died that night. I just bounced back the next day smoked some dope and forgot all about it ran over by a car, by a torta or by an aunt man?
Speaker 1:because, I know these bitches be crazy. Nah, I know they're doing that dirty bro oh, I've been.
Speaker 2:I've been almost ran over. I mean, I met some toxic women out there. Toxic women that threatened to keep my car and throw salt in my gas tank or sugar. But nah, this one uh was um, we seen some southsiders outside of their house. We did it. We did a back and forth shooting that day and I got mad because I got shot with bug shots. But he was so far away from me that the little pebbles just burned my face. So I had all these little dots on my face from the burns and I was mad. So I went over there to with the gasoline and uh and 40 ounce bottles and I was gonna burn it down.
Speaker 2:And we, we did not know there was a parked car right there. We thought it was just a broken down vehicle. They were in there just chilling and they started the lights and me and the homie panicked. The homie left me hanging. He, he jumped off the bike, jumped the fence, I went over the fence and then bam, the car hit me through the fence. They backed up. I got up and I limped and, thank god, somebody out of those apartment complexes there was three girls that knew who I was. They were like, oh, hey, how you doing. And I just ran towards them limping like let me in the, and then I wind up getting into it with the homie because he left me hanging. But yeah, they hit me and they seen people come out and they just drove off. They didn't shoot me. Thank God they didn't shoot me. But yeah, it was pretty much opposite, it was.
Speaker 1:Southerners from Wicked Ass, Sudan, you know some Southsiders climb the chain of command within the organization.
Speaker 2:Nah, not until I was 18. And when I was 18, when I really got involved with the politics, even then I didn't know what I was signing up for. The NF members presence was really big on the streets around that time where they were making us to become part of Northern structure. I didn't know what I was signing up for. I thought I was just going to be this goon that just shoot stuff down. And you know a name, kind of like. You know Armando Frias. You know that kind of person.
Speaker 2:I wanted to do the bloodshed, I wanted to kill people, I wanted to rob people, I wanted to be known for that. But when they gave me my status on the streets, they didn't interpret what it was. So I had a misconception that I was just this soldier. But when I got to county jail and there was like nine admonitals there and they started showing me education, what did I need to learn? What was my growth? What is my educational level to look like? What am I responsible for? Is when I realized in county jail like damn, I signed over something I'm not really unsure. I'm unsure of like I don't know what the hell this is. What does this all mean? And the more they expose me in county jail, the more I realize like I'm involved in something a hell of a lot bigger than just a street gang.
Speaker 1:When you got to county jail did the Norteños do their own strip out on you? I say that because now I talk to sheriffs that work in Northern California. Like bro, we strip them out, they go in the tank, then they strip out their own.
Speaker 2:People make sure they ain't got no, yeah, I guess you could say, like law enforcement and correctional officers and county, you know, whatever facility you're working with, you guys have a protocol on how to strip us out. You guys don't know the hidden points that we do, where we hide stuff. So, yeah, we get stripped out as well. You got about 30 days to be under investigation to receive a proper clearance to program with Northerners. So until that day, every time you come out your cell I'm going to make you strip down butt naked. I'm going to check the areas that I know you're going to hide razor blades and weapons. I'm going to make sure your cell monitors you on the toilet so that way you're not hooping a weapon. And, yeah, I'm going to make you walk with your hands out. I'm going to keep hooping a weapon and, yeah, I'm gonna make you walk with your hands out. I'm gonna keep your hands on the table if you even put your hands in your pocket, that's, that's an immediate threat.
Speaker 2:We strip out in a way because we're gonna check the boxes, because we know where we hide stuff in the boxes. We know we hide stuff in the pants. We know how to make secret pockets, those things. Sometimes a correction officer and a regular peace officer is gonna miss. We know how to find them, so we have to. So we have to get stripped out by our own people. What?
Speaker 1:about workout routine? Was it mandatory, mandatory, mandatory?
Speaker 2:You get a three-day grace period when you go to county jail because we know everybody's coming off the streets all drugged out or eating good and being fat and chunky and ain't worked out a damn lot. But after them three days you better complete that workout or you will be disciplined until you complete that workout or you will be disciplined until you complete that workout?
Speaker 1:Are they group workouts or individual?
Speaker 2:In my county jail we couldn't do group workouts because that would validate us. So we had to do groups of two. So it would be you and a partner, like two feet over you and another partner, but we kind of work together without administration or like knowing that we're communicating, but we look at each other down and we all go down. We just kind of separated just a little bit and we all go down. We just kind of separated just a little bit. Group routine workouts during my time in prison was forbidden because that was a validation point to show that that form of unity was displayed as gang unity and the IGI could validate it. It's real easy for that. So we had to keep that separate.
Speaker 1:How many prison terms did you serve Just?
Speaker 2:one One, just one. See, on paperwork and CDCR they consider your YA term as a term Because they got me down as a second-termer, but in reality I only been to prison once. My YA term is something totally different.
Speaker 1:What was your commitment offense that landed you in prison.
Speaker 2:Second-degree armed robberies. Like a lot of them, I confessed to five, but I uh charged with 19 uh gun enhancements. I got caught with a shotgun glock 17, a 38 special and a mini 14 with a 30 round clip, and then gang enhancement is one that got me the 10 years so they hit you with the gang enhancement, they hit you with the gun enhancement, and then 19 freaking robberies yeah that's what they.
Speaker 2:That's what they, that's what they had on me. But, like I said, I did a lot more stuff out there on the streets. But now I confess to five how long?
Speaker 1:how long was your court proceeding? Um nine months, I took a deal. Did witnesses show up and say ask a dude, right's a dude right there?
Speaker 2:No, no, no, and it's crazy because I had maybe nine witnesses, including a confidential informant who dropped an anonymous tip that I was the one that was doing a lot of the robberies on behalf of the big homies. None of them came forward and it's crazy. In my paperwork that I still have at home I have a list of the names of the witnesses, two of list of the names of the witnesses. Two of them happened to be northerners that were tweakers on the streets. The rest of them were people at the scene of the crime that were by the scene of the crime that watched me run and watched me do this and none of them showed up for court.
Speaker 1:Ultimately, did you get caught in the act or did that? How did you get caught?
Speaker 2:my co-defendants told on me they got caught doing something.
Speaker 2:They told on me that sense. And then I came out, all over the news. I got the copies of the news releases of my names in my face, like in my paperwork at home, and then they were just looking for me. So I got caught in the midst of a. I was trying to do a home invasion that morning for the big homies. I was going to rob somebody. So I was getting everything ready. I had the guns on the bed, the ski masks on the bed, I had the gloves. I was like, all right, we're going to hit this spot for the big homies. I dropped my coat. I told my co-defendant we were running a train on some girl, or we were about to run a train on some girl. But she was in my way and I was like, hey, drop her off, gave her my car, drop her off.
Speaker 2:He ran a red light, cops came, was chasing him and he decided to park in front of my house, jump my fence. And I seen him jumping my fence. Like the hell is this tweaker-ass fool doing, bro? Like he jumped my fence. And then I heard a knock on the door like please get down. And I was like this fool, what the f—. So I was going to shoot it out with the cops. Hella, bad dude. The only reason is the woman I was with at the time. Her son was asleep on the couch, so I didn't want to shoot the cops, because the cop bent the corner and I already had the 30-round clip ready. Kind of saved my life a little bit, because I would have shot it out. Cops are better shooters than me. I would have probably died in the process, but I was so drugged out that I just wanted to shoot the cops. I didn't want to get caught. That's how I really got caught?
Speaker 1:How much time were you facing prior to that plea deal?
Speaker 2:30 to life God damn dude 30 to life. And you know what's crazy is that the 30 to life didn't scare me. It really didn't. I was just kind of like the mentality that I seen in county jail, where there's people facing life without for murders. I was like, no, my crime ain't as severe as theirs, so I shouldn't have to worry about none. They have more to worry about than I do. But didn't have to worry about none. They have more to worry about than I do.
Speaker 2:But once you start getting involved in politics and the removal aspects or were you killing your own people and you're going to war? We were going to war with the blacks like I forgot about it until my court date would come up then I'm like, oh shit, I'm facing 30 to life. First deal was 27 years. I denied it. Then it was 20 years. I denied it. And because no witnesses showed up and I was trying to fight to suppress any admission to the robberies, it was just kind of taking a toll whether they offer me a, you want 15 years. I was like, yeah, I'll take that 15 years.
Speaker 1:Did they give you more than one strike? They gave me two strikes.
Speaker 2:Damn Two strikes. So I'm a two strike felon.
Speaker 1:So that's why I come. Two strikes. So I'm a two-strike felon. So that's why two strikes 15 years. But now I'm thinking ahead. You get caught with one weapon in prison. That's another strike. They strike your ass out kind of.
Speaker 2:But they didn't start picking up cases on weapons charges till maybe after 2010 or 2012, because I got caught with weapons before and I didn't even get da referrals and I had them in my bank, I had them in my, probably the county that you were in, because down south they were prosecuting dudes, centinella Calipet, striking dudes out for possession of weapons, yeah, Tulare.
Speaker 2:I mean, this was in Kings County, I was in Corcoran side F. They weren't picking up nothing, dude, Especially if you had life and you stabbed somebody, the deal wasn't picking it up. So did you get the L or?
Speaker 1:just 15 years. I got 15 years and you thought to yourself what did you think? Oh, that's cool.
Speaker 2:I could do that. I was like, damn, I can get my boneyard visits bro, Hell yeah. So that was like that's all I'm saying, Like I didn't really care, I was 18 years old, I didn't look like too.
Speaker 1:A lot of time, a little bit of time, that's all nothing. It's 15 years, 15 years.
Speaker 2:I was like cool, 15 years, I'll be out when I'm 32. That's all I said. It didn't bother me that's the part that I kind of trip out on now that I think about it that I'm 37. I've been free for four years. You didn't care back then about what the hell happened, because once you go to prison, bro, like you're not worried about that release date.
Speaker 2:I remember when I first walked into a sad fc yard, the homie shoots me a kayak. Hey bro, we're going to war with the whites. It's a half 60 right now. We don't know. We're waiting for solid dad or solano to get at us. I'm like all right. So he gives me a banger and I was like well, where are the whites at? He's like your neighbors.
Speaker 2:I was like all right, I'm just gonna stab these motherfuckers. And that's how fast it was easy for me to adjust. Like I don't care about my date, I'm gonna stab this dude next door because he's gonna stab me. But I remember there was a moment I sat there and we were on lockdown. We're on lockdown the first three or four months and it was just oh, you know how cdc all the lights are off, it's dark, it's gloomy, it's quiet, everybody's just in their cell and I was just sitting there like damn, I got 13 more years to go. Damn, like I felt it. There was a point in time when I finally got there, when I was like 13 years bro from here.
Speaker 1:So had there already been an altercation between the white whites and the northerners? Or yeah, they happen in.
Speaker 2:I always forget this aspect. People always tell me when it happened, but I believe it was a solano. But a white northerner got put in a white cell because he is labeled white. They didn't know he ran northerner. So when they sell them up with a skinhead, a northerner can't refuse and a southerner can't refuse a man. So they wound up going in there pulling out weapons. Well, the northerner got the best. It kicked off on that yard. So it started a statewide war between the whites and the southerners, I mean the whites and the northerners. And then I just left reception, got there when we were on half 60. So we're at war with the whites.
Speaker 2:Explain the half 60 to us Half 60 is when northerners are saying get ready for war. A full 60 says we're going to war. So on a half 60, that means we're not going to do workouts, we're not going to walk the yards, we're not going to play handball, we're not going to do pull-ups, we're not going to do nothing other than patrol the yard in groups of three. We're going to go to yard, we're going to drop our weapons at our anal cavity and we're going to be prepared because in the event, you see the yard posts. Hat turn around backwards means full engagement. Go blast them. So we're on half 60. But, like I said, we were on half 60 on a lockdown so there's really nothing we could do.
Speaker 2:The doors on open right. Oh, they opened up my door and my neighbors. They're asking us for showers and them white boys gave us the business. They did. They beat me and my sally bad. Did they have weapons? They didn't have weapons because we didn't know. We didn't know that we were. They were going to pop our doors out. Like when does the cop make that mistake? It really doesn't. So we both we were going to pop our doors out. Like when does the cop make that mistake? It really doesn't. So we both. We were getting ready for showers, they were getting ready for showers. So when both our doors popped, we all walked out with our shower rolls and our slippers, like, and we just seen each other like, oh damn, it's going to happen. And it happened.
Speaker 1:Were those doors one that just pop and then the inmate closes it, the inmate closes it, or the one that the control booth officer can open and close.
Speaker 2:The one of the open and close, yeah. So they opened theirs, said you guys want to come for a shower? They said, yeah, they're getting their stuff ready. Then ours opened and like you guys want to go for a shower? And I'm like, yeah, but I didn't hear that their door had opened. Me and Marcelo were doing something and we had CL what's up shower time. All right, we get our stuff and we just simultaneously we both walked down. We just looked at each other and them dudes. I'll never forget that dude's tattoo on his back. It said arian resistance on his back, hella big. And that dude was. He had glasses, bald head, huge country, bad white boy and that just beat. I think most of the time I was fighting just to defend myself. I wasn't even fighting to win because their dudes were cornbread fed. They were big boys and they beat me and Marcelia pretty bad. Did you go to the hole for that Went to the hole for two months and then we got released back.
Speaker 2:To the same yard To the same yard, to the same cells, and it was just the tower cop messing up. But we already know, when it comes to CDC they have a good way of just kind of like deadening that issue, throwing it away. So we me and my all four of us got loss of privilege just 30 days. And then my celly well, not my celly the chain of command around that time was investigating me and my celly, like why'd you guys engage on them? I'm like I we're at half 60. I was like well, their door popped open, our door popped open and we had like a standoff, like what did you expect us to do? The only reason that me and my cellie at the time didn't use weapons is because we have to have them hoop during the day. So I ain't dropping no weapon in a matter of 20 seconds, like this dude's going to punch me by the time I'm dropping it. So we just started fighting.
Speaker 1:Now, what's the weapon of choice for a Norteño? A stabbing instrument or a slashing instrument?
Speaker 2:In reception, it's always going to be slashing instruments. That's the best effective way. You don't really get a hold of a lot of metal material. But on level 4, 180s these I mean, I've always now that I think about it, they were just ineffective weapons. But it's just a VO5 bottle melted to a tip and usually with a box staple or a nail, whatever we can get, even a paper clip, I can sharpen it to a point. But those weapons are only effective if they're not wearing clothes. If they're wearing clothes, bro, I'm artificial wounds, artificial wounds. I got to hit them in the neck and the face just to even get some damage done.
Speaker 1:What about homemade handcuff keys?
Speaker 2:the face just to even get some damage done. What about homemade handcuff keys? Oh the, they're made out of uh inhalers. The ones that do that the best are southsiders, to be honest with you, because, remember, northerners don't go to war with cops and I'm pretty sure throughout history I've never in my prison history I've never seen northerners even sanctioned green light on cops. So there's no need to get out of the handcuffs the only time if we're going to war with the southerners, which is most of the time, getting out of the handcuffs, like during uh medical services or you know whatever type of escorts. But even then, like northerners didn't really promote getting out of the handcuffs like that because it's a breach of security. I mean, I'm secure with two cops escorting me.
Speaker 2:I should be all right, so I don't have to worry about being engaged by a southerner when I with two cops escorting me I should be all right, so I don't have to worry about being engaged by a Southerner when I got two cops right here escorting me Right, so there was nothing that we really even worried about.
Speaker 1:Well, that's good to know, man. I mean, yeah, and I'd agree with that 100% At that time was well, fuck, at that time was the not the end of all hostility? Peace treaty At that time it was.
Speaker 2:Was it on site with the southerners? No, um, before the end of hostilities took place, it wasn't on site at all. But it was you guys programming together we programmed.
Speaker 2:I programmed with southerners in different prisons for a long time and I tell you what my mentality changed once you're up, once your back's against the wall, against a bunch of the southerners that all use knives, that all have metal flats and bone crushers that really kill inmates. But the respect level before the end of peace treaty is a lot different than what it is now. I think. The end of hostilities, peace treaty. They're more disrespectful to each other from all the stories that I've heard. They're just able to get away with it because they're big homies. I want them to go to war back then. Girl. One sign of disrespect, bro, we're going to go to war. So we kept everything at a como estas, how you doing? Mucho gusto, you need anything? All right, we didn't talk much, we didn't engage in conversations, have all these friendships and selling up with each other and busting spreads and drinking together.
Speaker 1:It was like you stay on your side, I stay on my side, and if we go to war, you already know what's up so I can confirm that, as a result of the end of all hostilities, the disrespect level on all races, some more than others, has has increased.
Speaker 2:Yes, and it's because they know they're not going to get fucked up yeah, you don't know how many times I heard about, you know, mexican mafia members punking northerners out of a shower or showers talking smack to us. I mean something northerners talking smack to a southerner through their doors while they're drunk. And a lot of it gets, you know, swept under the rug until it becomes a serious matter. You know, swept under the rug until it becomes a serious matter. And now it's you killing your own people, them killing their own people. Back then, dude, one sign of disrespect you're going to go to war. So why even cross that boundary with an enemy when I'd rather keep them at a distance?
Speaker 1:no-transcript. So you were general population GP level 4-180. Yeah, right.
Speaker 2:Majority of the time.
Speaker 1:Majority of the time. At some point you went out of state.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I went to. I dropped points after that little fight because that fight only boosted me up four points the fights with the whites. So I was still under After my annual cameo. I was under just like by one point. So they were like yeah, we need the bed space, we're going to transfer you to Susanville. I was in Susanville for about four to six months. It kicked off with the blacks and then they decided to say all right, the northerners were responsible for this riot. We're going to send all the northerners out of state. Got to Arizona.
Speaker 1:Real quick, real quick. Did the administration ask you if you wanted to go out of state? Tell you you were going to go out of? State Nah, it was involuntary, we had no choice Did they give you a briefing like hey, this is what's going on. Or just hey, pack your shit.
Speaker 2:You're out of here, pack your stuff, get on that bus. We already had heard about out of states and that we're overpopulation of California prisons, but we didn't think we were going gonna send northerners and gang members over there. We thought we're just gonna be just regular paisanos or dudes from the county that were overpopulated. No, they snatched us off the yard. 60 of us took us to arizona uh, compound three by bus, by bus from susanville, from susanville, that's fucking high desert yeah high desert area, uh, eight hour drive.
Speaker 2:And then we got there, dropped us off, had us segregated and that's when I probably seen the worst hell of my life by southerners. They were shitting in our food, pissing in our food, because they served. They were already there prior, so they were. They were the kitchen workers, so they were serving all the food. We were isolated. We were getting our food with duking it, pissing it, spitting it. They were disrespecting us. So we had a 602 dad. We had a hunger strike, dad. We had a stand like refuse to lock it up and get shot by, uh, paintball guns with pepper sprays. Everything bro to fight for our rights, that. So they finally took the southerners out of the kitchen, put regular individuals and we. It kicked off between us and the southerners. What?
Speaker 1:facility, was it? Oh man, was it a private facility? Uh, cca corporate. So I mean you, you're very familiar with california prisons, the models, how the doors work and stuff like that. Was it similar or was it like old school or different or janky? What this?
Speaker 2:it was plush dude, it was plush. Sows were big, the bunks were at the end of the wall, modernized, um, I wouldn't say um, we're modernized, bro, but it was just like Disneyland. The bunks on the bottom we had two barracuda boxes. The table was towards the end of the bunks, so we had a lot of space in the cells to do whatever we want, like work out together, go down together, fight, if we wanted to, video games, yeah we had Xboxes.
Speaker 2:We had man. The ccs were more corrupt than california penal systems, to be honest with you. To be honest with you, we had plush. We had xboxes, playstations. We can get packages once a month. We can go to canteen full draw every week. Once a week, four times a month, instead of like first draw, second draw, third draw. We were going to store every week and then the cops alone right there were trying to make money. So we were having sex with the cops, bringing in phones with the cops selling dope, doing everything with the cops. Dude, it was not even prison at that point no more.
Speaker 1:Could you tell the difference between a California CO and one of those COs?
Speaker 2:Yeah, because when it kicked off between us and the South and we got into this big old riot like they had no idea what North and South were and it was a trip that we had to explain it to them, sometimes Like yeah, they're from Southern California, we're from Northern California. Two different colors, two different gangs, we go to war with each other. They just seen a bunch of Mexicans jumping on each other. So they were confused, dude. They were so confused at politics and they couldn't understand why we were fighting each other, why we couldn't program.
Speaker 2:And we're talking about one dude, one female officer, a male officer, just with a little spray can and a pair of cuffs, no tactical gear to protect themselves from getting stabbed. They're just walking in with just regular pants, a tucked-in shirt and a little spray can and some handcuffs. So every time we did a stabbing in that building man, they would just run out the building and lock the door and just leave these victims to get butchered. They didn't know what they were doing. They had no idea. I've seen private securities at the mall probably had more business than these guys. Damn. It's unfortunate they put them in those predicaments.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, private. What, yeah, yeah private with private? I mean, yeah, we built a contract that out, we contracted. Were you only in arizona or did you go to another state?
Speaker 2:from arizona. We had, uh, we were there for like eight months and then they packed us to send us to oklahoma, where we actually got the program with southerners, and we were all scattered everywhere. So we had established different cocs, different forms of programming, same thing. Cops were corrupt. Everybody has cell phones. Everybody's bringing in dope through the cops we're getting.
Speaker 1:We were getting so much stuff mailed to these cops over there in oklahoma and they were bringing it in I think I watched one of your episodes where you said you got in trouble yourself because you were receiving true information, one from the fed fact uh, fed faction and then from the state.
Speaker 2:Yeah, see, what happened was these private companies, these corporations. They were barely getting established with California inmates. Now, southerners are faster at it than we are. So when I get to Arizona I contact, you know, nf member Bubbles before he gets indicted. This is in 2008. Bubbles gets indicted like in 2009. So we made contact with him and we were like, hey, who do we report to? He was like good question, I don't know, this is out of our jurisdiction.
Speaker 2:Now, mind you, the realignment filter by the NF came out that we couldn't have no contacts with a list of NF members that were indicted in Operation Black Widow and were sent to the feds in these different federal penal systems. So an NF member that was a sleeper shows up. He's like I can't expose what I'm here for, but you know, just, I'm going to make, I'm going to help you make contact. So he gets a letter from some NF member from Arizona. I don't even know this dude's name and I'm familiar with a lot of NF members names. He's like, yeah, he's saying we got to report to him and I'm like, how we california inmates, this is still california jurisdiction, just because we're in a private facility. I'm not in arizona prison, I'm in a private facility. So that was the big debate. So we get at bubbles, and bubbles is like you ain't reporting to nobody in the feds, you're gonna report to the state. I'm just trying to figure out who's going to be the regiment commander from california state prison, who you guys are going to report to. Don't worry about those dudes in the feds. So I was like all right, bubbles gets indicted by the time I go to Oklahoma. So for about a good year and a half almost two years we didn't really report to nobody. That was the biggest problem under my investigation is that I went freelance for two years without reporting. But the thing is nobody provided me with information who to report to. I'm not going to sit there and write just any carnal and be like, hey, who do I report to, when in reality I was too busy setting up chains of commands. I was. So we're drafting up weapons and manufacturing weapons so the homies are secure. But I think what we all got distracted with is that do we have so many ceos on the payroll man? We're bringing in dope by like streets quantities the hell. We worried about writing a letter to an NF member. We're just going to make the money and we'll send it to them when they're ready, when they make contact. We just got so busy with Xboxes and PlayStation and smuggling and having cell phones all day where I just totally forgot about it. Like they can figure that out when they get back to me. They can get back to me.
Speaker 2:So they allege that you went rogue when you went out of state Rogue for two years and I had the money for them. I blessed a couple Once I got the C payroll, which is a list of C's that we have to give money on their books to, like $200 a month. Yeah, I gave each and so which is Norteño Solado, what that is? Hey, man, you send him 200 bucks, you send him 200 bucks. So, my him 200 bucks. You sent him 200 bucks, so I, my chain of command, was obligated to send all these guys 200.
Speaker 2:Now, I wasn't supposed to keep it all documented because that's their obligation as being an end soul. Yeah, you take care of your business now, whether they did or didn't, probably bit me in the butt later on because these dudes are like where's all my money at? I'm like, bro, what money these guys are supposed to send you money? I didn't keep a log of it because I'm keeping logs of how many people we got stabbed, that we stabbed, how many northerners got validated at the time, what was going on, how we established it, how much money we were making. Is it a secure and safe environment? I'm doing all that but I'm not really focused on getting receipts from all these guys. And hey, did you bless the big homie or not, did you? That's the obligation, that's.
Speaker 1:That comes from the carino, the heart right so was there anybody with you that threw you under the bus, or people that were out of state with you, like, yeah, going against you my celly did.
Speaker 2:Uh, he reported me because at the time he was my oversight and he was the one working with that nf sleeper that got validated and all basically he said was hey, you need the responsibility and the experience to take over these prisons, become the authority in charge and establish your own facility. I'm like, okay, he goes, I've already did it, so go ahead. If you ever need help, just let me know. While everything that was taking place, he was just jotting it down and he's the one that reported like like hey, he was the one making the money, he was the one that was supposed to send you the money. I was his oversight, I outranked him, but that was his obligation as the authority in charge. Some reality, he answers to me. But because he just played the sideline, he reported everything.
Speaker 2:I think it was only because when I went back to california, when I got caught with that weapon, that's when they started really making contact and they were like, hey, bro, you guys been gone for two years. What's been happening the last two years? Oh, he was running the facility. He's on his way back to california, all right, what was he doing? He was doing this, he was doing that, he was in that. All right, where's our money? You're gonna have to talk to him. So that's how it pretty much played out. So when I got to california amino investigation, where'd you touch down? When you got back back to sad fc yard back to sad fc yard, the same place I started right back into another war zone. Who were they at war with? Southerners? Southerners, I was like man dude like I had buzzer luck.
Speaker 2:My whole prison time, like every prison I went to, was a riot or stabbing or now.
Speaker 1:At that time had they already got into an altercation or it was brewing.
Speaker 2:I got there in November 2010. And then we did good until January 2011,. And it kicked off with the Southerners. So we were on lockdown for six months. It was working. It was Artie from King Cobra that ran the yard. They took his power. Thudy from Cucamonga took his power, removed that whole chain of command. Then we started programming with them again.
Speaker 2:After they had stabbed four northerners, put all four of them on life support, and then, when we were going to retaliate, there was an NF member named Sombra. He reached out to me and he got in contact and he's the one that linked me up to Mondo from NF. He's from Delano. He was like, hey, hold up, before you guys go to war. I'm like why? And then they explained this whole story that they're in talks with Thudy. Thudy's going to overthrow and take it and he's going to clean up the house and he's going to fix everything, rectify the situation. So they had their own little peace treaty talks back there. So we didn't kick it off, but back there. So we didn't kick it off. But I was ready to go to war. So I let it happen and I seen it.
Speaker 1:I seen I seen the power that them dudes have. Yeah, but that was back then when they were in the shoe. Who was in the shoe calling the shots for the north at that time?
Speaker 2:this was mondo. Quinn was the regiment commander but he didn't have three-way contact to the facility. So the nf member, sombra, who's actually now a dropout, he just recently dropped down out. He's in a THU debriefing. Sombra was the one that got at me through his wife. His wife was Lisa From the Bay.
Speaker 1:No, from Corcoran Shoe, from Corcoran Shoe. So you got, the North had dudes in Corcoran and in the Bay, correct yeah?
Speaker 2:But you guys were getting your intel from. Corcoran is responsible for it. So sad f is in kings county, central valley so they report to corcoran shoes.
Speaker 2:So corcoran shoes, that's where they get their money from, correct and uh 3d, and already were at corcoran yeah, corcoran too, and they were beefing. They went to war, they took over each other's property and their that prison yard and so on, but on them were like we rather let them do it, then let's do it. That's how I looked at it, like we're just gonna pass the buck. So they established whatever it is that they established with duty from kookamonga. And then, dude, I was a tripped out day because I had already got in some weird encounters with these guys.
Speaker 2:But a south sider goes hey, um, he comes up to my celly because he had communication my celly for a few years already. He's like I, I got a kite for you guys. It's a homie that runs the yard. So Masali's like yeah, I'll get it to him where he's going. Really, I think Masali was the one that was running it. He goes yeah, I'll get it to where it needs to go. So the kite says Troy on it. So we bust it open.
Speaker 2:What it was is they had everything scripted from a phone call ad made to these guys to deliver to us. And so we're reading a kite from Thuri, a Mexican mafia, and I remember the excitement me and my son had. We're like, oh shit, we made it to the big leagues. We're talking to a Mexican mafia. We're reading this kite and the way he phrased everything. Like me and my son, we were just serious for about two hours, just like rereading the kite, rereading the kite, making sure we're not misinterpreting anything.
Speaker 2:But he's like man, you guys are more than welcome to pull up a chair at my table on my front porch if the light's on. Basically, like anytime, my door's open to communication. If you ever want to get at me about anything that my people are doing, you can go through me. And he's like allow me to clean up the house and replace it with my own mess up. I'm going to get rid of everybody that was responsible for putting your homies in the hospital. And I'm like okay, and then so on. But our contact says like hey, just abide by the message, just let it be. So I'm arguing with myself Like hey, bro, why? Like? We just seen four homies get airlifted on life support. You know, they got stabbed, bro. They're going to want to see retaliation.
Speaker 1:And we're supposed to just bite our tongue and let these dudes just take care of our dirty work, like we in k hey guys, consider becoming a patron, where you will get first exclusive dibs on the video before it airs to the public and you'll get to ask the guests special questions that you have in mind. So that's also another way to support the channel. Thank you, guys, appreciate all of you. Keep pushing forward. Make sure you hit that link in description below winning just because what?
Speaker 2:we're only 18 deep and they're 120. I was like, isn't that what the cause is supposed to promote, defend and protect? This is our chance to defend our honor with our brothers. And my side is like hey for the big homies at Charlie's, so we had to let them clean up the house and it left a bad. That's when I started really questioning politics. Like why, bro? Like when the hell do I need a Mexican mafia member or a southerner to do my dirty work? That's what I'm here for. I took the oath as a brother to retaliate on behalf of my brothers and my soldiers and people that I call my people, and they weren't allowing me to do it.
Speaker 1:That's when I started questioning a lot of stuff that's the first that I hear about that, but that's like a peace treaty in itself, like you said, and the only thing I can think about is money, money, priority dope well, yeah, you could say that, because the next letter somebody got to me was, you know, establishing uh production and revenue.
Speaker 2:They needed to get money back there. They're asking us to get them packages. If there was any northerners out there that were fortunate enough to provide a package and extra money and to start establishing a pipeline, that was their main concern, because at that time when I got there, there was only two northerners that were bringing in dope and only one of them had a phone. So we weren't making hundreds and thousands of dollars or even thousands of dollars. They were probably making a couple hundred dollars around that time. When I showed up, it wasn't like out of state money, we're making thousands of dollars weekly. They weren't producing a lot of money yet. So why? Why bend your rules and bend your honor and compromise your honor for a couple hundred bucks that even out of that couple hundred dollars that's being produced on this yard, you're not getting none of that yet no, I'm saying already, not wanting his people to go to war because it'll be a lockdown.
Speaker 1:Lockdown equals no money, right, dude? Thudy sent you the frickin'-. Yeah, thudy did.
Speaker 2:Thudy already had took over the yard from Artie.
Speaker 1:Right, right right.
Speaker 2:And then I just seen Southerner after Southerner after Southerner get smacked, get their throats ripped open. Did you Bad dude? It was the whole OC car got removed.
Speaker 1:Well, that's showing good faith. Then I mean, if he's taking out a loan.
Speaker 2:Yeah, one of the Southerners got killed on a lower yard. Goddamn dude, they killed him. I just remember we were getting ready to go to the yard on the upper yard and they were like back on lockdown. I was like, wow, they're like a Southerner just killed some fool on one block.
Speaker 1:I was so as a Norteño technically the enemy of a Sureño. What kind of feelings goes through your mind when you're watching them butcher their own?
Speaker 2:My first removal I seen from a Southerner was in 2007. And yeah, I was like bro, all that stuff. I used to talk about these guys like they ain't nothing, they ain't crap. I had to just have them on the run. We used to gun them down, chase them down. Yeah, I seen three of them stab a native, blast somebody from another car and they butchered. This dude in the day room Was a reminder, because my celly was one of those cellies that had all the GUN CDs, all the Norteño music, and he was just hardcore Norteño music and he was just hardcore northeanio effa southerner, this effa southerner that. But when we seen that I was like bro, we ain't just playing with no regular dudes like from tillary county. These guys are really murderers, bro. And seeing that native get butchered like that, with no remorse, they didn't hold nothing back. They shoved some of the biggest knives I've seen in this dude's body. I took it serious after that. So seeing all these dudes get butchered from Thudy's angle, I was like bro, you can't underestimate your opponent ever.
Speaker 1:Not just that, they do not stop, even when the COs are spraying them with pepper spray, shooting them with a .40, hitting them with a baton. That kind of leaves an impression like fuck man Muggers, don't stop.
Speaker 2:They don't, bro. Their policies are a little bit different. And look, motherfuckers, don't stop. They don't, bro, like their. Their policies are a little bit different.
Speaker 2:And look at I think, the vast majority of the murders this year alone have been by southern hispanics. So they're the ones doing the most murders and the most killings, and northerners do it once in a blue moon. But like I said they're, I think they're a force to be reckoned with because of their numbers, and a lot of them dudes, go to prison with life bro. They ain't got nothing to lose, no more, and they're they're more inspirational in a sense where they want to be the next big homie, so they want blood on their hands more than anybody so this.
Speaker 1:So this time we're talking about you guys were on the verge of a war with the south, and were you under investigation yourself at this time?
Speaker 2:yeah, I was being questioned, but communication back then, with no cell phone, was very limited so I I'd have to wait for a letter. Try to code the letter. Answer questions really briefly as possible. Once in a while somebody from Corcoran she would come out, bring a bundle of a list of questions. Here are the facts, here's your allegations. Can you communicate back? A northerner would be going to the hole, so I'd put him with a bundle and send it back. Answered the questions. So the communication was taking about all the way up until July of 2012, like over a year, and how were you feeling during that time?
Speaker 1:Were you feeling uncomfortable, comfortable, annoyed that you haven't answered so many questions?
Speaker 2:Because the question always came down to this when did all that money go? And I was like, bro, you're not asking me about the Norteños that I deem no good in that facility. You're not asking me how the Norteños were doing. You're not asking me what the establishment looks like, how we establish it. Is it a strong foot? Is it a foothold? You're not asking me nothing other than where did the money go? How come we didn't get this amount of money? How much money were you producing? Why the hell does that matter? They only asked.
Speaker 2:The only other question they were adamant about was how come you were able to get 43 northerners validated. I was like, because I let them get northerner tattoos. I didn't give a shit. Like f the administration, bro, like you're letting these dudes dictate every aspect of their lives that we're starting to lose our identity because we have to change everything that we do as a northerner, when we're defined as a movement, not a prison gang. But since you guys started us in prison, we're paying for those repercussions every single year when administration decides to draft up something new to isolate us, to solid, put us in solidary, confinement. I'm tired of it. Like the homies could be proud to be a nortenio the homie could be proud to represent that star, represent that 14 why not? We're in out of state. That shouldn't apply to us, but it did because, just like we were California residents and under California jurisdiction, igi was jurisdiction over there. So they came swooped in like, oh you guys got fresh tattoos.
Speaker 2:Validation validation that was the other question. But, like I said, when it takes so long to communicate, I would answer get it to where it was going and I forget about it. Because I'm watching Southerners get killed almost every month or get removed. I'm trying to establish communication with them to keep them in line so they don't bug us. But in reality so much was going on at that prison that they don't know about that I haven't talked about yet. Every day I felt like I was going to go to war. Every day I felt like I was gonna go to war. Every day I felt like I had to stab one of my own. I had to worry about my own. Every day them doors could have cracked and something unexpected was gonna happen. I was too focused on securing my establishment then, where I didn't really care about how they really felt.
Speaker 1:I really didn't you would eventually make your way to sny sensitive needs yard. Was that in that, or did some stuff transpire prior to that?
Speaker 2:A lot of stuff transpired after that. We went to war again with the Southerners and Northerners and somehow, someway, that became my fault, even though I was the second in command and my cellie was the authority in charge. But in reality I was just neglecting the investigation that I wasn't reporting why we went to war, because I didn't have enough time to. We went to war, we went on lockdown, plain and simple. Well, my salary is the one that made the decision to say, hey, man, he's the one that made the shot, he's my in-house security. I'm the authority in charge. I'm only responsible for this, responsible for that. He took the initiative to do it and I'm like reality, bro, that's your decision, I. And I'm like reality, bro, that's your decision. I told you about it. You just said go ahead. And I said all right, let's go. And we went to war with the Southerners because they were just doing grimy stuff that I didn't want to tell Thudy about. They were just burning homies, they were throwing weapons underneath the homies' cells, they were getting homies caught up for bull crap and they were getting hold me accountable for it, and I was like hell, no, these dudes think they can just punk us now just because we didn't go to war with them before, because they stabbed four homies, hell no. So we went to war again.
Speaker 2:During that war, a homie from San Jose got paralyzed from his waist down and I got held accountable for that, when in reality they just Southerners booked him while he was there in escort. So he got paralyzed I mean he couldn't defend himself. He's in the waste chain southerners booked the cops, moved the cops out the way, booked him and I got held out. I got held accountable for all that, as well as the investigation reaching the conclusion that he's not responding. He's not giving us all the answers we want. He's not telling us where the money went. It all just bundled into one and my son, he raised his hand to take care of business and I was like all right.
Speaker 2:I just felt after a while like they were just getting tired of my crap because I wasn't telling them where the money went. In reality, I didn't have an answer for them. I was like, bro, we have money there, reach out to Arizona or reach out to Oklahoma and get the money. That's there. I left with this amount of money and this amount of the household bank and these are the norteños that were responsible for taking care of these carnales. Now, whether they shot the money or not, I don't know. They just were adamant about where's their money, where's their money, and at that time I wasn't producing money for them, so I was keeping these dudes starving and broke and I think, like I said, I think they just got fed up with it after a while and they ultimately chose your salary to take you out nah, my salary raises hand for it because Because I allowed Marceli to establish communication with someone.
Speaker 2:But I didn't have to do it no more, because I was tired of writing the letters and tired of, you know, redrafting codes for them and sending them to court. I was like here, you're the authority in charge. This is not my responsibility, but in accordance to the chain of command position, it is my responsibility to communicate with the back my authority in charge position that Marcelli's in. He's supposed to be quiet. He just makes a decision. If a North Indian has to go, if we have to go to war, be in contact with the NF, establish street regiment contacts and just make sure I'm doing everything right. So I play as his buffer, so to speak. But it was Marcelli's decision. So when Marcelli started communicating with them, they had their little communications, we went on lockdown and sure enough, my son was like I'll blast this fool.
Speaker 1:Because they were like bro, he gots to go already. What time of the day did you get blasted Morning?
Speaker 2:No, it was after count time, 2 o'clock count. So it was like we're doing showers again. They were doing modified lockdown showers and that's when he decided to remove me. It was crazy because we just did mail call and I was writing a letter and then the cops remove you from the cell. Cops remove me from the cell, took me to the I was in.
Speaker 2:This was in C-section at the time. So you know, on C-section to your left is the cafeteria like the end of the, where you go to go eat when nobody uses, and that's where they put me right there. Blood everywhere. They escorted me to medical. I got the staples on the top of my head and my lips and they escorted me to the hole trying to get me to get information out of me. And I was just denying it, denying it like bro. Nothing happened, bro. This was a burpee routine and they just laughed at me. They just knew I was full of crap and there's nothing I could do, asking me questions. And I remember the was like bro, I've never seen a burp routine like that happen. He knew I was full of crap, Just wasn't ready to give it up just yet.
Speaker 1:So you didn't give it up then.
Speaker 2:No, I stood on an investigation for about eight months, then I went back.
Speaker 1:Hold up, hold up, hold up. You got hit and did you go to the hole as a victim of a battery went down an investigation as a victim of a battery, right, no weapons were found.
Speaker 2:Okay, I mean, my sally flushed him and, uh, he didn't say anything. I didn't say anything, so it looked like a mutual combat fight and you said, send me back. I said send me back, but I had to go to classification first and you know classification warden and all that. They ask you all those series of questions. Igis right there, like sure you want to go back. Right, I'm like, but see there's, there's occasions where igis will receive information like hey you're, we got a kite that you're deemed no good we can't send you back there was nothing that was confiscated here.
Speaker 2:So they said but you got hit? I got hit, but they don't know I got hit. I said I didn't say I got hit.
Speaker 1:But all they see, yeah, I got hit. Yeah, the cops are not a good idea for you to go back.
Speaker 2:But I know politics. I know that certain things you know. You got redemption. There's room for redemption and I know my people. They'll investigate it. An NF member will approve it. An NF member will just strip me of my status and say you can no longer have status as long as you're in the penal system and I'll go back to being a foot soldier. Is that what happened? No, what happened?
Speaker 2:I went back to the cell and as they escorted me to a different cell not that one in particular to a different building, but there was other Northerners there and as soon as I got up to the door and opened up the door, I mean my cellie started getting down and he was a bigger boy. So I couldn't I couldn't take that fight. So I was getting pretty whooped on top tier. I fell and when I fell I grabbed a hold of the bar. You know how there's two bars on the top tier, yeah, like the rails. Yeah, I grabbed a hold of it because I was afraid I was gonna get thrown off it and he pretty much beat me till we got sprayed. And then when I went back, that's when igi and the warden was like we knew it was gonna happen. So we'll see you at committee. So I waited seven days, went to committee and that's when I was already discouraged Because I remember I was in the hole for almost eight months before I went back before administration and the warden let me back.
Speaker 2:I was already talking to the Norteños back there, including Marcelo, that removed me. He got validated and I was like do I got a chance? And one of the northerners was like nah, you don't got a chance, bro, to be honest with you, it's over for you. Like, nah, you don't got a chance, bro, to be honest with you, it's over for you. I tried, didn't work. So I was already discouraged. So that's when I went to committee in the next seven days and I was like I just spoke up and I was like yeah, I'm done, I'm done with the politics. They were like so you're willing to disassociate from the gang? I'm like, yeah, you, you got to sign that chrono to relinquish your mainline status, go SNY. And then you got to sign that part where it says you won't join a what is it called? An SNY gang if you go there. Yeah, but I was like where are you from? And I'm like Tulare County. He was like yeah, you'll be a Nolan rider, you'll be a.
Speaker 1:Nolan rider. So they transferred from me to CR to DR. Now were and isu trying to press you for information. Yeah, all the time. All the time. Um didn't give them no information. What they did. Some people got the gift of the gab. You know what I mean. You know how to talk.
Speaker 2:No, they, they? What they were doing is they were trying. They were coming up to me with these confiscated letters. Right, not the actual letter per se, it was, uh, you know how you like grab a letter and you like scan it, so it's like black and white. You scan it on the printer and they were like, hey, who's elizabeth, who's christine? And those were the coded messages that the nf utilized to pretend like their wives communicating. Yeah, but these fools, the communication was all the general hospital names of the fucking tv show they watched. It was all their names. All the women's names in that show were different coded names of different nf communicating to things.
Speaker 2:So we're like who's that? Is this Mondo right here? And I was like I got nothing to say, bro. Like you know, I fucking locked it up Like what more do you want from me, bro? There's nothing. So they were always trying to get like what those letters were about because the coded messages, how we were utilizing the codes to communicate. Then they transferred me to I don't really think they really wanted anything from me. I think they had everything they needed on Mondo. That's who they were investigating, because that's all they were questioning me about. Was Mondo, this Mondo?
Speaker 1:that. And where was Mondo? In Corcoran Shoe. Mondo was in Corcoran Shoe. So then you went from C-Yard you said, which was GP to uh, one level 4 270 dude. Now tell me, tell the audience, bro, you get you a s and y when you look around, is it? Can you already tell you're not in kansas anymore? Yeah, bro, like start seeing good dudes with titties no, I didn't see that just yet.
Speaker 2:I didn't see that just yet. Um, I seen, uh, a gang of two fibers, a gang of two, five. My celly, a gang of two-fivers. My celly was a two-fiver. When I walked in he was from Fontana and I was like so I thought it was a Southerner, but I wasn't aware that they were going to sell me up with Southerners. They didn't see that. I didn't tell me nothing like that. The administration, the warden, was like hey, we're buddy.
Speaker 1:Well, it's SNY and that's the way that green CDC looks at SNY as SNY. That's the way they look at it, but you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:As mainliners, we only know small bits of information about what the SNY looks like, we know about the SNY gangs and we know there's trombos and pedos on the yard. That's all. I'm oblivious to everything. So I get set up with a southerner who just bangs on me like a southerner, like hey, homie, what's up, where you from? I'm like I see his tattoos, three dots. I'm like hell, no, you ain't selling me all this food, what the hell. So we started talking and he was like yeah, I'm 2'5". I'm like what is that? He explains it all to me. He's like no, I'm not. I'm like you're a southerner and all your homies are southerners. Let's make you guys southerners. He was like we ain't southerners, bro F the suit. I'm like I'm so confused, bro, I'm really so confused right now. So I was in Selly for a little bit. My neighbors were Zapatistas. I seen them do a removal like ASAP.
Speaker 1:I seen the two fibers do removals and I was like, but at the time I'm trying to get at like, are you seeing dudes on the day room, barefooted motherfuckers laying down on the yard like they're sunbathing? And I say that, man, because maybe the S-Y yards at Donovan are wild man, I seen that on the S-N-Y level three.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but not on the level four, not on the level four. No, level four.
Speaker 1:See, I don't oh yeah, I have worked the level four, s and y, but even that was off the hook, man, no I didn't see sounds to me where you at was still structured yeah, it was structured because the gangs controlled everything.
Speaker 2:The two fibers are like 50 deep. Damn the sapatistas, they had just started, they were already 20 deep. The northern riders were like 30 deep. Snoop had just left there. So they had the yard really orchestrated in a certain way where certain pull-up bars, certain tables belong to certain really sny. Like the northern riders were by I think it's four block or five block, they're by no five block that had their own table, they had their own pull-up bars, the two fivers, the sabatistas and then the blacks had theirs and then everybody else just kind of walked the track. You, you really couldn't use nothing and it's a trip. But how it's divided and structured the way it was, the politics were just the same, like the main lines, the communication don't cross boundaries, the levels of respect.
Speaker 1:Dude, I don't know if that's because it was that year, 2012, or that location, that prison, because I don't know. Fuck you, fast forward in time, it's a free-for-all, dude.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a free-for-all now because the games got so big, but this was around. Remember, Northern Riders didn't come to the SNY until 2008. So this is 2012. They've only been there four years, established in three prisons. The two-fiver's been established since 99.
Speaker 1:So, right off the top, was there more dope accessible on the GP or on the SNY?
Speaker 2:Well, because on the main lines we didn't indulge like that. I can't speak on the Southern faction because them fools are always strung out on dope. But, dude, I would see people in the day room on the SNY with a spoon in the middle of it and like four people using the same syringe, slamming cops not even watching. Yeah, dude, I see my son come back with a paper every day from school like a Fat 50 paper. There was so much dope on the SNY. It's ridiculous the free-for-all that goes on when it comes to the drug game. I became an addict.
Speaker 1:Bad. Now we're dudes doing scandalous things on the SNY yard.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah. We were running in people's cells, stealing their property, stealing their canteen. When I got hooked on drugs there inside there, that's what I would do. I'd wait for people to go to medical because you know I had open doors 270. Like the door opens and you can shut it on your own Right, I'd go in there and take his food, take his property, take his cell phones.
Speaker 1:Now, you mentioned to me there was some type of structure and some type of politics. How are you able to do this type of behavior?
Speaker 2:with that, because we're not doing it to SNY gangs, we're doing it to regular non-people.
Speaker 1:Oh, so we're doing it to non-affiliates, we're extorting non-affiliates.
Speaker 2:We'll target the blacks because the blacks were unstructured. We'll target the Asians. We'll target regular Mexicans that get in debt to us If we wouldn't do it to each other, because you know, obviously it wouldn't start a gang war, so would it suck to be a non-affiliate on one of those yards back then, yeah, but now, like non-affiliates now are actually, they're really blasting two fibers.
Speaker 2:They're blasting stuff about these guys. They actually form together. Now, where I get stories from current valley left and right, or just the other day I haven't even talked about it on YouTube yet I'll tell you guys about it here. The two fibers got transferred from Hatchaby. They're no longer into Hatchaby, they got transferred to Kern Valley. Eight block on D yard and it's eight, and seven has the Zapatistas and then the middle yard has some level ones, level twos.
Speaker 2:Well, they released the gates for education and all the non-affiliates from one and four block rushed all the two-fivers, started stabbing all the two-fivers because they're just tired of the extortion tactics. This recently happened. It was a 50-man riot. Back then non-affiliates weren't really having a heart or dedication to really defend themselves like they do today, because back then we were just punking everything. If you weren't a Northern rider, an independent rider, a South Bautista, a two-fiver, I didn't have no respect for you. Nobody did. You were a non-affiliate person that you can get took advantage of and nobody's going to be there to defend you because you're not going to defend yourself. Bounce in a great while you'll see a non-affiliate step up and get beat up, but most of the time every SNY gang they're doing all the so is it in the best interest of a non-affiliate to join a gang?
Speaker 2:I say, from when I got there in 2012 up until 2017, it was wise to. It was wise to, but, like I said, after, 2017 is when ATF started, which is against 2-5. Once they led the example and they banded together with all these non-affiliates and started blasting two-fivers, it sent the clear message that hey, these SNY gang members can get hit too. And they started—they fight back.
Speaker 1:So that was the scantiest behavior. You were talking about getting high on fucking dope, running into fucking non-affiliate cells jacking their shit, where you're slapping motherfuckers around the whole—.
Speaker 2:Me and my cellie—me and my cellie were talking about these stuff. The whole Me and my cellie were at San Bautista. We were doing that when we would get on drugs. But you'll see that a lot. You'll see a lot of people get punked, get extorted, get threatened.
Speaker 1:Let me ask you about this real quick. Drug debts, drug debts on an S&Y yard. You ever see motherfuckers just get high, ring up a drug debt and then bounce All the time bro, they locked it up on meapa.
Speaker 2:These styles too, fireers, that's the best, because it's weird. Right Now you don't see prison administration really acknowledging like if somebody wants to lock it up and disassociate from the gang. But on the SNY you could literally go up to people and just go up to the administration and be like, hey, I got to go. Man, I owe a drug debt to this dude. He's going to kill me. All right, we got you. Who is it? All right, they'll go tell IGI hey, man, this fool owes this guy a bunch of money. He's going to lock it up. So IGI would go out, target this dude, put him under investigation and put this dude wherever he wants to be at. Just gets transferred wherever he wants to go. So they were favoring victims on the SNY. They didn't really care, bro.
Speaker 1:Like people were locking it up left and right just to go to certain yards. Right say, if you say if you wanted to go to a level three because your family lives in the area, lock it up. But I want to know from your perspective I mean from a ceo's perspective it's annoying. It's annoying having to lock these dudes up that have a consistent past of ringing up drug debts and bouncing. I want to know from your perspective somebody basically robbing you guys. They would get green-lighted. You feel anger towards that person.
Speaker 2:No, you really can't get mad because we're all there, we all locked it up at some point. Kind of pisses you off because you're kind of counting that money. But it's part of the business, like on the main line, it's more like oh damn, this fool locked it up. We ain't never gonna see this again. But that fool can lock it up all he wants. I'll see him in like five years or I'll see him in three years or my boys will see him. Where did he go? Because I can.
Speaker 2:I can easily talk to somebody that works the program office like hey man, can you see the transfer list? And where this ma went? Oh man, he went to kern valley. Cool, shoot my boys a letter. Hey man, if this dude gets here, his name is cdc, he owed me money. Take it or beat him up, and then I would get kites like that where I can walk because you know how they have the pictures on the doors. You know, yeah, I did. I'm looking at doors. Okay, it's the name is. Oh, this is this for here. Hey bro, you such and such. Okay, you're my boy. Money, blast him.
Speaker 1:It's real easy to get a hold of somebody on the smy so right now, the generation we're talking about, the time frame is when there was handwritten kites, little wheelas, transfer. You're asking the CO where this will transfer to. But fast forward to 2024. There's fucking cell phones on every yard, cell phones in every cell. You got the inmate locator website on CDCR. You got Megan's Law. How much more dangerous or faster is it for these inmates to be in possession of information instantly?
Speaker 2:well. I mean, if anybody that watches my youtube channel, I get all my information from prison, and these are dudes that have phones that are contacting me on the unders, like underneath their bunk or something. It's far more dangerous, it's far more effective, and all the administration did was play into the hands of these prison gang leaders. Like you just gave these dudes the world by allowing them to be released, by allowing them to get access to these phones and you know, these guys all have possessed phones. There's so much phones on that yard now and you know what they're capable of doing with those phones. Communication is easy. Now they're having conference calls where you got five different prisons, five different gang leaders in different locations in the state of California all on the phone together sharing information. It just got way more dangerous now and all they did was play right into the hands of these organizations that are probably causing the most violence right now as we speak these organizations that are probably causing the most violence right now as we speak, From your perspective.
Speaker 1:why do you think CDCR administration did that, their motive, their angle, their thought process from your perspective? I?
Speaker 2:don't think they had a choice, because I've seen a lot of the protests that the CDCR, the correctional officers, were having with Sacramento, and I remember seeing this video. It was a woman that worked correctionals officers were having with Sacramento and I remember seeing this video. It was a woman that worked correctionals and she was like see, all you guys didn't come and sign and speak up on behalf of your loved ones. Now look at them. You guys are doing non-designated yards and releasing all these dudes. It wasn't administration's fault, it was the courts. What it is is these guys sat there for 20, 30 years and figured out how to way to manipulate the system, as they always done, and they utilize the court system to really beat them Administration. I think they just utilize the solitary confinement and indeterminate suit to them and they thought that was going to be effective till the end of time. They weren't drafting up new measures on how to really keep these dudes isolated and restricted to their power until they lost, and now they have no choice but to abide by it.
Speaker 1:You're 100% correct. It was the courts, federally court ordered, ordered mandates. However, it was the execution that CDCR did, with the incompetence. That's why you're seeing such a disaster. I mean, you give somebody a mission but they're incompetent and they don't have you know the knowledge to carry it out and they're gonna create, they're gonna shit the fucking bed, bro. They're gonna shit the bed and they weren't. They're not, they're not prepared for that I don't think they were.
Speaker 2:I don't think they were prepared because I don't think they knew the extent of the power that was gonna happen in the vacuums and the power struggles and who these people really were, I think if they would the execution, if they would release them in a certain way, kept them designated and really modern, I really think administration right now I don't really care what these guys do I don't they're not.
Speaker 2:I think they're not paying attention to them. I think there's a lot of correctional officers that care, but as long as they're subordinates or they're higher ups not telling them what to do. They're just kind of left, like you just put. You know, a bunch of chickens in the wolves den. These wolves are going to take over. They're going to demolish these uh correctional officers because these guys don't know no better and they're still waiting for guidance and direction. You're not teaching your correctional office how to really monitor and investigate these guys. I have no idea.
Speaker 2:Back then, igi and isu used to be on us left and right bustas. We wouldn't have cell phones longer than four months in cdcr and we'd get caught, so we had to make the best of it. Now I mean, look at the indictments that are happening and look at how many people are getting killed, and we all know it's coming from the possession of cell phones, the possession of narcotics, the possession of what these gang members are really doing on behalf of these prison gang leaders. Like. Back then you used to be able to stop these dudes. Now you're so incapable of stopping these guys. Why Isn't that what your guys' training and protocols and exercises and seminars are for?
Speaker 1:Isn't that? The only fucking job of CDCR is to.
Speaker 2:Protect the safety of the inmates, and doing so it's investigating these gang leaders. Like you may not be able to put him in an indeterminate shoe again, but I'm pretty sure you can snatch him, take his phone, shake things up a little bit, disturb the peace.
Speaker 1:Nothing's happening. I was not even going to bring this topic up, honestly, not in this interview, but I might as well. The California model man where you're going to be playing as an inmate with sports against the CO foosball fucking cornhole. What's your take on that man?
Speaker 2:How would you like to play sports with a SEAL? I wouldn't have. I mean, their job is to monitor me. My job has always been to monitor them. How to beat them? I'm not trying to beat them in a game of basketball, I'm trying to beat them in a game of power. So what you're going to do is you're going to cause these guys to become overly friendly, and that's what you want.
Speaker 2:As an inmate, once you break the barriers of a cop, you just need a cop to tell you no. Once and you open up the door because they're not even supposed to acknowledge that they're supposed to report. You get you off the yard what is it called? Too close to staff, overfamiliarity, overfamiliarity, and you get you transferred, if I can ask a cop after playing a couple games and I'm like what's up? Man, you feel like making some extra money, hypoth, hypothetically. No, I'm good, I already got him where I want him because he didn't report me. If he didn't report me, then he's not going to report it. When I do show him this money and I do show him this green down, I do show him how much money he can make. You're just opening up the doors for these inmates to really communicate better with these cops. That's why I think it shouldn't have even been allowed, because in reality, the inmates are bending the rules for themselves too.
Speaker 2:Because for longest time, our struggle has always been against prison administration, the indeterminate shoes, the gang investigations where they lock us up for eight months and just investigate us. No 115, no, only a 114D lockup order, just investigations and no disciplinary hearings. They can keep you isolated. They could put you on potty watch and make you eat your dump. They could do so much stuff like that. They're not utilizing that power. No more. Like where did all the power that the prison administration used to have on the inmates? How they used to overpower us? We can get away with certain things like a stabbing here and there or cell phone here and there, some dope here and there and no buses. Now it's like they don't even care what. Just like what. Where did the mentality change? Where did all that power go now? Because you guys used to be so much powerful against us?
Speaker 1:Well, that happened from a period of time from the year of 2012 and on, and that was a shift in the changing laws, agendas, word of mouth, directions hey, we want you to do this now. And that was just word of mouth. It was going against what our actual policy said, and then, eventually, you would see the policy change. But yeah, that's how we got there. Dude, what's your take on the current peace treaty? End of all hostiles between nuestra familia and the Mexican mafia?
Speaker 2:What people are feeling and realizing is that it's only benefiting them in the process, because who's dying? Northerners and Southerners. Who's doing the most stabbings? Northerners and Southerners. These Mexican mafia members ain't really stabbing each other like that and you just put a bunch of abusive people that overexert their power, that love their power, that thrive off their power and a general population where people that are going to be taken advantage of. So that's why a lot of people are losing their families, a lot of people.
Speaker 2:I got to do these documentaries and do these videos about inmates dying and dying and dying. You've seen what these guys are capable of and what they care about the most. A lot of these dudes want drugs and they want money. They want money because nobody's taking care of them on the streets. They want drugs because they've been drug addicts since day one, since they've been prison gang leaders, even though them being out there on the main lines revealed who they truly are, unmasked, who they really are. So many people have been scared of them for so long that they're incapable of doing anything towards them. No resistance, no rebellion, no speaking up, no questioning nothing. I think it's a big old fraud. The peace treaty is only in alignment of their pockets, not for the best interests of inmates, but they were able to convince the courts that it's in the best interest of inmates. It's in the best interest of you know. No more violence in prison. There's been a lot more violence since they've been out.
Speaker 1:How much percentage of Norteños and Sureños do you think are currently unhappy with the politics of the organization? More than half.
Speaker 2:More than half, and I talk to a lot of Northerners. I mean, why do you think I got so much in-depth information? They come from active Northerners. They're just fed up. They're fed up of getting punked by their big homies and their big homies getting punked by Mexican mafia members, because Mexican mafia is really dictating the whole aspect of California prison period. Oh, bro.
Speaker 1:they're slapping around CEOs, slapping around Norteños, slapping around blacks. I know I'm going to get some get back on that. It's true, I heard the same story.
Speaker 2:I heard the same story Mexican mafia A Mafia. A Mexican Mafia member in High Desert State Prison literally told a Norteño get the fuck out of the shower.
Speaker 1:And a.
Speaker 2:Norteño got out of the damn shower Like. That's how easy it is for them. Another Mexican Mafia member, terrico, is literally in debt to Norteños, owes Norteños thousands and thousands of dollars and all the money that he collects from taxation and his dope game from his Sudeños pays off his debts to the Northerners. Look at the hypocrisy that takes place amongst everybody. The mexican mafia is really in control. The nf is just abiding by it because they're lack numbers and they're having their own power disputes and you know their vacuum system where they're trying to. You know all the vacancies and what they're trying to do and fill up the seats and they're going to war with each other where they're not really paying attention what the the M is really doing. That's all it really is.
Speaker 2:Everybody's disappointed in their big homies because they've seen who they really are. They weren't the people that everybody believed in the last past 30 years. All these guys, this that I remember I used to look at. These guys like these guys were perfect people, like the idols you know my Hercules or something. Oh man, these are big homies, bro. These guys set the tone for us Only to hear about them now like man.
Speaker 2:They're just drug addicts. They're strung out. They're done dope most of the time. They're not even supervising their people. They have no remorse for the people. They don't care about the people. They're not trying to lead their people. They're not really gang leaders in the aspects that we once believed they really were. Now we've just seen what they really were and now we see that they're just slapping. I mean, how are you going to slap your own people that work for you? Just slap them in the face on the yard because you don't like what he said, or you're conducting yourself. Or grab a steak cup and beat him in front of everybody and still tell him you're solid if you don't lock it up. It's just a bunch of hypocrisy going on and everybody's disappointed in it.
Speaker 1:How would you say the quality of leadership skills are with the nuestra familia members of today? Because from what I've gathered, especially the whole fiasco that was happening a couple months ago, maybe a year ago, it's like, oh, this dude man, he ain't really a good leader. He doesn't have the experience it takes um. Is that the case? Man is a lot of inexperienced no, it's, I think it's there.
Speaker 2:There has never been proper leadership. We just always believed that there was proper leadership, because their leadership back then was a communication. Are you doing this right? You're doing that right? You're doing this right? Did you conduct this investigation properly? Why did you blast him? How much money you're making? What are you doing for the people? They were so easy to question our contributions and what we contribute as assets and sources of interest to this cause. Remainers believe, like man, these guys are a level of intelligence, a level of integrity that we need to aspire to being, but then you come out and you see them stabbing each other because they want this yard, or they want this city, or they want this money, or they didn't like that. The generals are over here and they're over here taking their positions, and the generals want California for themselves. You see all the power struggles that these guys are, but they're supposed to call each other brothers. There's never been proper leadership.
Speaker 1:We just always assumed that it was good leadership when that Norteño was hit in Pelican Bay or the Anzol was hit in Pelican Bay by those sureños and the north did not retaliate.
Speaker 2:What kind of thoughts were you having? That's when I knew, like, the realities of it, because I didn't know the details until recently about that investigation. I just knew the story when I had heard about it. Like they left them hanging and then we didn't go to war. Yeah, there was a small incident where they disacknowledged some filters, when they were told not to do anything, that they were going to bring it up to the big homies. Yeah, a couple northerners engaged and got deemed no good for for disacknowledging direct orders.
Speaker 2:I heard about that situation. But just hearing about it that's when I realized man, the n they've, they've lost, they're pretty much bending over at this point. And for a long time these dudes made us go to war, made us hate Southerners, made us hate Mexicans, mexican Mafia members, only for them to come out and say, hey, bro, we're not going to do nothing because we don't want to lose no respect or we want to have business endeavors with them, and they just bent over and just took it like that. They're really scared and we've seen that with that situation alone by saying you know what we're going to? Let this Northerner get blasted, we'll feed them to you guys. They just fed their own people, their own foot soldiers, to their enemy their so-called enemy of 30, 40, 50 years, didn't do nothing about it. That just goes to show you that there's improper leadership on that yard.
Speaker 1:I had no idea that those uh norteños got deemed no good. So when did the little um you know their little get back?
Speaker 2:over there in the bay. Yeah, I talked to one of them, the one of them that disacknowledged the filter, because, uh, he said specifically, he said it was like this is what we're supposed to be doing, bro, like we're supposed to defend this dude, and we didn't. They were telling us not to do it. They sent us two filters. He circulated a filter himself, he wrote it up saying get ready for war, right, and they took his filter, threw it away and then recirculated the filter saying disacknowledge that last filter. We are not going to do anything, we'll bring it up to the big homies. The big homies are going to resolve it with the enemy. And he didn't like that. So he went on ahead and sanctioned it. So we're like now we're gonna do something about it a little quick, little, whatever it was. I think it was a two-on-two during like shower time, something like that was two inmates and he got deemed no good for that.
Speaker 1:So the federal faction was not happy about the peace treaty or the current situation. How much influence do the feds have over the state?
Speaker 2:They have a lot more influence than I thought because, speaking to a lot of people from Northern California, they give me a little bit of information. A lot more people on the streets are siding up with the federal faction because these are dudes that we've known about, we've heard about that, we've talked about for years. These newcomers like Conejo, like dc and then, uh, chuko. They weren't high-ranking nf members, they were just known for what they did in 1992 and what their controlling cases consisted of. So there were, there were, uh, you know, high profile people and aspects that we knew who they, where they were, but they weren't high-ranking members like Cuete, skip Stort, mad Dog, you know Conejo, I mean Corny. We heard about those names. They're always going to be the generals in accordance to Norteño politics.
Speaker 2:So it's kind of hard to turn your back on them, to try to side up with these guys, but in reality you can't say no to these dudes. All these dudes did was just find positions of authority that were vacant, took them over. In the same essence, the feds want to take over because they want california to themselves. You got your big homies that you look up to for all these years, fighting for you, fighting for your blood, for your sweat, for your tears, for your contributions, for your sacrifices to benefit them in the long run. So in reality, like, why would you look up to something of that kind of leadership? Those kind of caliber of men who really would slaughter each other just to have you in their possessions, to own you?
Speaker 1:that's all it really is do you believe that some of those state members, if they were to touch down to the feds, they would be deemed no good?
Speaker 2:I think, uh, I think there's going to be another war for that I think they will. If you read the truth filters like I have and really just dissected them and read the— If you understand how Norteños and NF members really word stuff, you'll see the anger, you'll see the aggression, you'll see the determination, you'll see how they're just inserting that in somebody's head like no, they did wrong. They weren't supposed to do this. He did this wrong. When they start referencing the Constitution or, like Norteños would reference the bonds, they're trying to prove a point that whatever these men did were strict violations of the Constitution, of NF protocol.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I think if they make it to the feds, there's going to be a lot of disputes. I don't think all three of them would die, but I think if they make it to the feds, there's going to be a lot of disputes. I don't think all three of them would die, but I think, for the most part, dc is going to be the one that's going to answer to it the most. So C was the highest ranking and the oldest ranking, uh, nf member. That kind of started all this.
Speaker 1:Now, are they currently um federally indicted Recode or no, yeah, Operation Choir Storm.
Speaker 2:So you know, I don't know if they're going to make it to the feds, because look what happened to the AB. The AB was federally indicted and they beat it and they're not going to the feds. So the NF might have a possibility of beating it and not making it to the feds, and I honestly think that's what they'll fight for the most. But in reality, Matt Rocha testifying that boy's going to seal the deal on a lot of stuff and if his testimony alone can get these guys convicted and send these dudes to the feds, he just pretty much gave the federal faction all these dudes in a gift basket.
Speaker 1:That's what I think is really going to happen if his testimony holds up in court? What kind of feedback do you get on your channel and what you're doing Positive, negative all around.
Speaker 2:Believe it or not, I get more support than hate. I acknowledge they hate a lot more because that's what I use for my youtube channel to combat it, because you can hate me all you want. You can be discouraged by my channel and my information, but I'm showing the depths of prison politics and what they look like. I'm not. I wasn't the first one who started that stuff. I mean, I out to prison and looked up prison channels and I heard about Converse Perspective and all these other guys and they were doing it years before I was.
Speaker 2:I don't see why I'm the most hated, because why I have intimate details, because a lot more people came forward to divulge information with me and speak the truth and allow me to speak the truth. Reality is people were doing it before I was, so I don't see what the disappointment is. There's a lot more supporters, but they'll do it in silence and I respect the silence because they don't. I don't need everybody to acknowledge that I'm supported by a vast majority of my subscribers, because all the haters do and all the criticizers and the commentators do is target those that don't need to be targeted. They'll go after my supporters that support me and talk smack to them like no, it's my face, it's my youtube channel, I'll bite the bullet. I got the thick skin, for it took me a well a long time to develop it, but like no, your, your battles with me.
Speaker 2:So a lot of my content really comes from just disgruntled people that hate my, my, my content, and they'll leave stupid comments and I'm like you know know what. I'm going to reverse this on them and I've been doing that and that's what. Hey reality, they just gave me another video to do and another video to do, and I do that on a daily basis, reading these negative comments and showing them that I can destroy you with my intelligence and my maturity and my growth, because what I'm doing, if it's really pissing you off that much, because it's truthful and because it's me something if it was bullcrap and it was a fake story, you would just laugh at it and walk away. But for the simple fact that you can comment on it and be and feel harassed by it, feel betrayed by it, tells everybody else that what I'm saying is truthful and that is exactly how I feel about cdcr management telling the ceo not to talk to me or watch me, because it's factual and fucking truthful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is. But the correctional officers need to understand too that they're in a world full of politics of their own, and I've seen it. I've seen just the whole. You know what is it called. When you guys uh, like vote for like different positions, like, I think, every couple of months, you guys post in bed where you get a post in bed job every three years, you would think that you know you have an equal opportunity to get those bids right that thing is manipulated by higher-ups.
Speaker 2:Fuck yeah, because I hear CEOs complain like man, there should be no reason. I'm not over there and that dude is, and I'm exactly. I don't know what. You guys go through same shit.
Speaker 1:I think administration learns from our politics and then they, they execute it worse, man Worse or grimier, because you guys got a badge to back it up.
Speaker 2:Fucking cutthroat dude. Yeah, and you guys can't retaliate like us, like we'll start a mutiny, we'll go to war with our people. I'll remove him and answer for it later. Yeah, it's your guys' job, bro, it's your guys' livelihood.
Speaker 1:So so where do you see?
Speaker 2:yourself and your channel in the future. You think you can maintain this pace or do you plan on expanding? Look, I can only, you know, beat a dead horse so much before everybody understands it's a dead horse. I was passionate about it for a long time. I do want to still do a bunch of documentaries on behalf of these kids that are going to walk the same path as me and end up just like me or worse. But there's got to be a change. There's going to be some more growth. I've grown this far and what I can tell myself is I've done everything that I could to convey a message to these kids. I'm not telling the kids to stop gangbanging. They choose to. By all means, bro, I'm proud of you for that. There's so many people that told me they quit because of my channel or somebody. People. So many people told me that their kids watch my channel and they'd be like man. I don't want to ever get involved in that.
Speaker 2:I reached people in ways that I never thought I could. But, like I said at some point, you know, prison is going to sound the same. It's going to be redundant. It's going to be the same story, the same politics. Yes, I'll contribute as much as possible.
Speaker 2:But I can honestly say at this point I'm proud of what I've been able to accomplish. I'm proud of the message that I was able to convey. I'm proud of the information that no law enforcement gave me, subscribers gave me, people in prison gave me. I reached a lot of people with a lot of in-depth information and provided it to the world, to the audience, to my inner, to entertain people. Most importantly, to show everybody prison ain't just prison. You just ain't going in there being a gang member. For all these gang members that think that it's cool. Oh, it's not, bro. Stop telling everybody it's cool. Stop telling everybody. You got to be proud to be active. We got to start sending the different messages like you got to be proud to be free again, proud to be a former gang member, proud to be a former parolee being on parole, proud of being from a gang member to a supervisor at a job. There's other things to be proud of than the aspect of the prison life and sometimes I get that I don't like talking about prison no more, like I used to.
Speaker 2:Sometimes people give me information. I'll make the videos on behalf of them, but I've even reached that point where like, hey, bro, enough's enough and it's time to grow and expand and, you know, do something different. My audience members gave me a channel and made me great to this day, and I'm always going to be thankful for that. Now I'm just going to take on this new year to think about what else I'm going to do with this channel and just prosper it, bro. This is I'm only. It's only. The only way is up from here. So it might be a little bit of gang aspects here and there. I'm trying to get it all out as much as possible, yeah, but once I'm finally done, hey man, I'm just gonna thank my audience and tell me I did everything I could. Hopefully the kids learn from this. It's time to move on to something different, right?
Speaker 1:so man, that's powerful dude. So, for those that don't know, which I'm sure you already do renegade media on youtube, dude. Um, I'm sure this video is going to get a lot of views, man, you're a popular guy, dude, especially right now, more so than not. So, as we close out, dude, do you have any final words you want to say to the audience? Man, the floor is yours. Dude, like I said, there's going to be a lot of eyes watching this.
Speaker 2:My message has always been simple. You know, I lost a cousin in his lifestyle, a cousin that I wanted to see so many times before I came home that I got killed by my own gang. A lot of people are always going to call me a disgruntled employee because of my own removal. I'm none of the above. I'm just a person that took something that was a tragedy in my life, something that all the adversity that I went through, and I just turned it to an astonishing thing. I became something of myself. I came home with nothing.
Speaker 2:A parolee Did 15 years, two strikes. I'm a two-strike felon. Anything else is life without the possibility of parole again. And I learned to change, I learned to grow, I learned to expand my mind, I learned to become self-educated and I learned to mature. My message has always been to everybody else is the same If I can do it, you can. You only got one life to live. You only got one chance to do this. Do something great with yourself. I did something great with myself, despite all the hate and the discouragement of others that want to see me fall. They ain't gonna see my downfall anytime soon, and I promise you that. So I always remember it's one life one chance. We only got one chance to do this. Try, let's get it done. Renegade Media.
Speaker 1:With that love you guys, Make sure you hit that subscribe button. Keep pushing forward Peace. You've been listening to Hector Bravo Unhinged. Follow for more. We'll see you next time.
