Trusting your instincts: How Kayleigh Hall designed her own path

Angela Lyons sits down with Kayleigh Hall, a brand and website designer who transformed a "naive" leap of faith into an 11-year thriving freelance business. From accidentally discovering graphic design weeks before her uni interview to her obsessive love of typography, Kayleigh's journey is both inspiring and relatable. 

Kayleigh opens up about experiencing workplace microaggressions as the only Black woman in her agency and how that painful experience led her to build a business where she chooses who she works with. She shares her advice to her teenage self: "Go where your skills are, not where you feel like you're allowed to go." 

Packed with practical wisdom, vulnerable moments and plenty of laughs, this episode celebrates authenticity, resilience, and trusting your gut.

Connect with Kayleigh: 

• Website: hallcreative.co.uk
• Instagram: @hallcreative
• LinkedIn: hallcreative

Black Ballard

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Transcript

Angela (00:00.12)
Hello and welcome to Creatives Like Us, where I speak with creatives of color who share journeys and stories and ideas and how they can inspire and open up avenues in creative industries. I'm your host, graphic designer Angela Lyons, and with the help of my guests, I will bring you insightful interviews and compelling stories that can inspire you to think about things differently or shape your next move. Being a creative of color can bring us challenges, highs and lows and in-betweens.

But this podcast is about amplifying our voices and celebrating together. So are you ready? Let's get started with creatives like us. Ready, Kayleigh? I'm Thank you so much for joining me today. Can you tell people who you are and what you do?

See you

Kayleigh (00:43.842)
I I can. I'm Kayleigh. I'm a brand and website designer. I help purpose driven business owners, small business owners make more impact, reach more clients, attract more people that they want to work with, the people that they feel aligned with. And I do that through pretty websites, not just pretty, strategic as well. Strategic is most important thing. And visual branding that aligns with their own personality and uniqueness.

That's beautiful. And whereabouts are you in the world?

Oh, well, I was going to say not very sunny Warsaw, but it's actually really sunny today, which is rare. Yeah, it's beautiful today. It wasn't yesterday, but it's nice today. Yeah. So I mean a very sunny corner of the Midlands.

Nice, nice. So as I said, thank you so much for joining me today. And do know about Craves Like Us? We're into season two now. Yay. I'm so glad we're here and I'm so glad you're joining me today. So I'd love if you could tell people how you actually started and how you got going and where you are, how you've actually ended up where you are today, because sometimes, you know, people always like feel inspired or want to hear about people's journeys. Don't have to give me the long details, but give us the highlights of how you got started.

Yes. maybe around almost 11 years ago now, actually, I was working in a design agency and I just felt really far away from the client. You have sort of the account manager and then they speak to your design manager and then the design manager speaks to you and tells you, know, they delegate the tasks, but you don't ever get to kind of have that connection. You don't get to see the clients, you know, when they speak naturally about the struggles they face in their business and

Kayleigh (02:25.976)
what they need to do, what their goals are. You don't ever get to see that, the body language and have like a real authentic conversation. So I decided very, I don't know how to put it, but it was a bit naive. was like, I'll just start myself. I'll just start my own business. All I have my hands, I have my computer, I can design. I don't need like lots of, know, overheads to kind of start my own business and give this a go myself. So I...

decided to put a call out on Facebook and I said, I'm going to be freelancing, doing print design, signage design, just visual stuff really, just any visual creative stuff.

Kayleigh (03:08.91)
Yeah, that came out five years later, which is really, really interesting because I love that now. That's probably what I lead with now. So I just started freelancing and I was doing a lot of print design. I was doing a lot of brochures and corporate, what are they called? They're almost like white papers, aren't they? Where they kind of just talk about what their company's done, the charity goals and how they've been spending the money. So I used to do a lot of those.

then decided to branch into website design because I felt like people were wanting to kind of communicate what they do, but they only wanted to do that when there was a huge problem in the business, maybe footfall was low or, you know, they weren't kind of reaching the right people. And a flyer or a brochure or something like that doesn't quite kind of cover that issue. So I felt like they needed to have a better online presence. So I started to, I experimented a little bit with website design.

I that I loved it so much because you get to immerse yourself in the business. You kind of get to see more of that business than you would have done if you kind of were just doing a smaller bit of design, if that makes sense. So yeah, I just really loved getting in people's business basically. Up in their business, all up in it. Absolutely.

Get out of the-

Angela (04:24.718)
And then start designing for a living a business

When I've got my slippers on, in the house. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Brilliant, brilliant. That's so cool. So did you approach them to say like, do you need a website or did they, was it a bit half and half?

A bit half and half. The first one, what was the first one actually? After mine, I can't remember the first one actually, the first website I did. But sometimes people just asked, are you able to help me with a page or are you able to help me make some tweaks? And I just kind of started in that way. And then I think one of the early websites I did was for a salon, a local salon. And because I knew them on a personal level, I was kind of able to.

take my time and be a bit more experimental and try some of the things I maybe wouldn't have tried because I didn't have the experience. So was kind of a bit of mutual trust, really. Yeah.

Angela (05:18.478)
suppose also because you know them, you can give them above and beyond. I suppose you could do it all your clients give above and beyond, but with them it's something more special because they're local.

Yeah, absolutely. think that knowing that I had maybe tried a few new things, I felt like it was a lot more, a bit more fruitful, if that makes sense, because I that now I've kind of, you know, gained these new skills. So yeah, it was fun for me, very fun for me.

Brilliant. So from there, so that was what five years ago, start doing websites.

Yeah, maybe 2015. Oh my God, how long is that? 2015. that 10 years?

10 years ago. 10 years ago. Would you be not to be celebrating some anniversary now? Have you checked the actual date?

Kayleigh (05:56.014)
It's definitely 11 years. When did I start? 2014. Maybe it's actually not that. No, I think my first website was that, was 2015.

Wow, congratulations!

thank you. She didn't even know it. Definitely like, you know, going to secondary school in terms of business years that one, so I love it.

Clean it

Angela (06:15.744)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's funny because I just said I've got into 13 years and I said my teenage years.

It's

So you've you've accrued all your wisdom now. You're definitely like wise, wise teenager.

I know about that. Maybe the wise teenager, maybe the one that's still going a bit crazy sometimes. So what is your current projects right now? So you said you've done, you've been working for the last 10 years in website design. Is that what you mainly focus on now or is it you still do a bit of branding or do you do the print work or is it a bit of both? And yeah, just tell us about maybe what you're up to now.

That was a whole bunch.

Kayleigh (06:48.91)
Yeah, I do a bit of both now. I do, the last project I did was a beautiful website. Not because, you know, not just because I did it, but just because the energy that the client kind of helped put into the production as well. It was for a coach who supports black women, of, you know, growing their life, career and love and all their relationships. And she is in London. Quite close to you, isn't she? Yeah. And I just helped her kind of, she kind of, you know, has...

where she wants her brand to go, but they needed more connection. She just struggled to kind of communicate the good bits about her business. And I like to do that. think sometimes when business owners are just kind of, know, they're doing all the day-to-day stuff in their business. Sometimes it's easy to overlook the magical bits that you actually bring, the golden gems, the things that clients say about you that maybe you think, you you've taken it for granted because it's just something that you do. Or maybe it's special to your personality. It's unique about you, but you don't see it. So that's...

is what I think makes projects really special for me because you're able to bring things out in people that they don't recognize themselves or they haven't taken appreciation for. So I had a lot of browns and purples and lots of, know, squishy fonts. I know you fonts, I understand. You do, love fonts. Lots of cool squishy fonts. It's very like sort of earthy and maternal in sort of, know, matriarchal kind of way.

You know what I thought.

She vlogs, I love that.

Kayleigh (08:16.654)
and it's quite contemporary. I just really enjoyed working with this particular client because she just trusts me and we have a good relationship. We speak quite openly about things. All of the feedback and all of the reviews are kind of done on Zoom call. it's all kind of, you know, we're working together on how to refine things or if she's not sure, you know, how she wants to communicate a particular thing, I can offer that on a, you know, in a, like a conversational way. So it doesn't feel like heavy work. It doesn't feel like I'm just trying to pull things out of the air.

Just come into that. You don't obviously do it with desire, it's all visual. You're actually helping her with the wording and the tone of voice.

I yeah. So in, do like a really, I think it's quite unorthodox because no one's taught me to do it this way, but I, when someone is working on the website or if they come to me because they need a website, sometimes people don't always have the big budget for, you know, a really good conversion copywriter. So, and some people also feel like their business is so personal to them that they want to be able to write the words themselves. I think some people maybe are a bit fearful of kind of really increasing control in that way. I think it's a little bit, you know, they hold it close to their heart. So I,

kind of collaborate with them on the website copy. So I do a strategy session, which is a couple of weeks. I kind of asked them lots of questions about the business. have a few really long workshops where I kind of just, you know, try to pull out those magical bits that I mentioned earlier. And then I do a wire frame. So they have to come in to my tool, onto Figma, and they have to kind of write the words in themselves. They've got a few weeks to do that. And then we'll, together we'll work out how to kind of, you know, bring up the personality or if we need to.

injects a micro copy, like, you know, your email, sign up to that kind of thing. things that people forget to kind of, you know, sparkle a bit of their own personality. So I helped them do that. We do that together over a few weeks as well. Just so that they've got the space and not feel like they've got to write and rush, you know, stuff down and throw things, throw words out onto paper. They can kind of do it and it feels like it's coming out of their heart, out of their, you know, the part that kind of drives the business.

Angela (10:11.278)
That's a nice technique. That's a really nice technique. I hope people will learn from that too. it's fun. And also, it's really, I suppose it drags out, maybe drags the wrong words, but I suppose it extracts, should I say, from the client what they really want to get out. Because sometimes it's all up in the head and you can't really think about it. So sometimes you just have to get somebody else to give you those prompts to get it all out.

Dude!

Kayleigh (10:36.628)
Yeah, it's like when you're sometimes when you're having a chat with your friends, like you'll, you know, just be just, you know, I don't know, some the smooth it's happened in life and you're kind of talking it out with someone else. They're kind of really, the other person is really good at kind of just summarizing the points that you said. So it's like you're being fed back your own words, but in a more concise way. So I think it helps to do that.

Yeah, especially if think about it for so long, you kind of get stuck in your head and just keep on going around and around.

Yeah and like you kind of sometimes you'll focus on some things that are important to you but maybe not important to the bigger picture.

my god, those moments. I hate them so

Angela (11:13.41)
Especially design, because when you're stuck on for so long, you're just looking at it looking at it. And then you think, I'm just going to show it to them anyway. And they're like, we love it. And you're thinking about that for five hours.

Like a whole week of sleepless nights because you were focused on this bloody yellow and actually, we don't need the yellow. All the other stuff is amazing. I bet you see that all the time,

Totally, totally. I think we both do.

Yeah, you're I don't know about you, but like in an Illustrator canvas, you've got loads of stuff all over the place, but you kind of just zoomed into one tiny little thing and there's a whole, so when you zoom back out and send it off that you realize actually it's a complete piece of work. It's fine. It's absolutely, they don't know that you've, you you wanted to change that tone of that yellow, for example.

Exactly, send it. send it. That's the note we'll leave everyone. Just send it. Don't worry about it. Just send it. Be quiet.

Kayleigh (11:55.106)
Yeah.

Kayleigh (11:59.246)
What's the phrase? Don't is better than perfect. That's the phrase. I'm a perfectionist. So yeah, I tell that to myself all the time.

Yeah.

Angela (12:10.03)
I've got a pen stick though.

Angela (12:16.686)
I've one weird. My latest one is, oh, I've got a little note to myself. One thing today. And I put an arrow to another post-it note that says what I've got to do today. So like, it's like, look, it's got one thing today. So I've got to do that one thing today. Look at the post-it note over there. I won't tell you what one thing is, but that's note to myself. Honestly, because otherwise, you have endless lists all the time, don't we? So like, least if I have one post-it note, I've got to do that one thing. That one thing.

And then you feel like you've achieved something. Yeah, it doesn't feel like you've kind of, you you've chiven all the things into the next day and then you, you know, it feels like the tasks are eating you alive. It feels like you've actually done one thing. Yeah, it feels productive that way. I like that. I'm going to also adopt that. Do we just get a behind the scenes of Angela's creative life?

I'm achieved.

Angela (13:02.712)
Yeah

Angela (13:07.342)
Trying, trying. So I always ask people all the time, I guess, about the catalyst connection of how they got into the area, their field. Was there any one person that inspired you to get into what you're doing or did you do it for your own back? Because sometimes we don't have people around us, but, or we do. So is there anyone that actually inspired you? And that could be from even like secondary school, be honest with you. getting in, because I know when I was in college and yeah, I suppose, and uni.

certain stages that there was that one person that said, have you thought about this? And you're like, no. And then you go, that's just changed my whole career path.

I love that, like a proper serious customer.

Yeah

do actually, and he's passed away now and I'm sad that I never went back to go and have a chat afterwards, but my university lecturer, Bal, he was terrifying. I can't even explain. Everyone was just like, oh, we've got Bal today. And you're of just on your P's and Q's because he's really ruthless. What did We did visual communication. Me, I did visual communication at uni. Oh my gosh. And it was stuck a pathway into graphic design. Actually, maybe it's taught before that.

Kayleigh (14:15.31)
Because I didn't know what graphic design was until I applied for it at uni.

But if you don't know, you don't know, do you know?

Hey, there's always lecturers maybe. The lecturer I had at college, I actually went and did a foundation art and design course, foundation art course. And my lecturer there was like, you keep gravitating to words and letters. So maybe you should look at typography. And then when you do go to uni, maybe instead of doing interior design, maybe you do graphic design. I'm like, what is that? That sounds interesting. So I literally, a few weeks before my interview at Birmingham City Uni, I Googled what is graphic design.

melting laser came up. you New York. Looking back on that, that is so lazy. How did I even get in? And I took that, I wrote about that. took that to my interview and I got in, got first choice, in. So actually, maybe lecturers have kind of paved the way.

One thing, that one thing you did, that was quick and easy wasn't it?

Kayleigh (15:14.33)
Imagine that, imagine that. yes, here I am. That was like, I was 21 then. So it's like, yeah, good 20 years ago now. it just, yeah, I just kind of actually fell in, but maybe what I was interested in back then before I knew what it was, maybe it was just coming out so loud that, you know, maybe it was innate, maybe I was always supposed to do this actually.

So you didn't actually know what the actual term was, but you knew that you were into it and you really liked it.

Obsessive typography and that's always what I stuck with even at uni when we kind of did our specialisms mine was typography and I just adored it even still now I've got insane yeah and I've got an obsessive collection of fonts it's really bad really really bad it's my dig show.

I just had to literally yesterday unsubscribe to the counter print books too. It was quite hard for me to press unsubscribe. But then afterwards I did it. was like, I'm going to subscribe again. I'm going do next time. But not now. Because I just love, I love their books and typography.

Wow, okay.

Kayleigh (16:07.787)
I've heard of that

Kayleigh (16:16.686)
I'll have a look. It's been a while since I've looked at that. Yeah.

They're gorgeous. I saw one yesterday and it was full of color and full of fonts and I was just like, oh, and I said, and unsubscribe, didn't eat this because I'm going to buy another book.

But then maybe the books, so you've got a collection of them already. So maybe you can just like leaf over them when you're having withdrawal symptoms.

Coffee, yeah.

Angela (16:36.942)
Yeah, that's why I unsubscribed because I was like, they're making too much money now. Hopefully they've been listening.

Please sponsor, because you're in love, Yeah. It was a tough loss.

Yeah, send us samples. Send me a kindly sample.

Yes please, yes please, yes please.

Brilliant. I was going say quickly, just again, I'm interrupting. Yeah, so was your college lecturer, let's talk about the catalyst. So was mostly your college lecturer that was your catalyst connection, is that right?

Kayleigh (17:08.874)
Yes, both of them actually. I'm kind of talking about it, it's both of them, yeah. College and then university.

Yeah, brilliant, brilliant. And so in business now, is there anyone who you would love like to work with? Who's your future clients? Or are you happy with the clients you've got now? Or is there anyone in particular, maybe a brand or a person that you would love to say, my God, I'd love to work with them.

is a really good question actually.

I like to manifest, I like to put it out in the world. Cause I think when you've put things out in the world, it's like having a vision board. I create a vision board every beginning of the year and sometimes in between. Yeah. And sometimes in between a quarter maybe or something like that, just I'll write it down. put it down in my diary, honestly. And it's really weird because you think that you're not going to, you think, my God, you can't do this. You can't do this. And you look at the thing and you're like, my God, that's happened. my God, that's happened.

Yeah!

Angela (17:59.598)
It's really interesting. So yeah, I've got a vision board at the moment and some of the stuff has happened. So.

So I need to do a vision board. hear about them all the time, but I'm how would it possibly work? But I think it's meant to be like some kind of a neurological cure.

Yeah, only I work towards it. It's about, I know people think about a little bit of woo woo, but you know, the manifestation and your beliefs too, obviously religions and you know, so on and so forth. But I do believe if you put something out in the world, good or bad, let's focus on the good. So Kayleigh, let's manifest, who would you love to work with?

Actually, I would adore to, maybe I should put them on next year's vision board. I would love to work with someone like Black Ballot. Yeah, it's like a little sisterhood, isn't it? And I just think I would love to help them just reach more folk. What they do is amazing. They're kind of uplifting black women career-wise or just life-wise. Sometimes they're writing articles about motherhood. Sometimes it's about microaggressions in the workplace. Sometimes it's just about having fun. And I just think...

Yeah, it's like a really important pillar actually. And a nice community just to know that you're not on your own feeling some of the things that you may do.

Angela (19:09.742)
I think you should do the vision board maybe after this call.

I think I really want to just any excuse to do a collage.

Yeah, I put the link to do for Black Ballad in the show notes. So let's get a bit of, you know, manifestation putting it out there. my gosh.

said it now, like this is the loudest version of speaking it out into existence that I could have possibly done.

There are so many organizations at the moment. obviously you've got creatives like us. Yes. Vanessa and I founded and you've got, I don't know if you've heard of Join Our Table. No, haven't. They're called JOT for short, J-O-T. And they're a group of black women that focus on marketing and careers in marketing and design. Have a look at them. They're really good. I know Black Ballad is more of a...

Angela (19:59.126)
It's more of open to everyone and every career, but think Jot's focus is more on the creative side of women's sisterhood. So yeah, have a look at them too.

put them on my notebook or I'll and check them out for sure. Sounds really interesting.

Yeah I love what black blood are doing so yeah yeah cool all right so you put it out there

Yeah.

Yes, some manifestations. Thank you, Ange. Absolutely.

Angela (20:21.23)
So have there, so while you've been working in the workforce and even now maybe in your own business, have you come across any aggressions or, cause I know you mentioned it just now with Black Ballads and like.

It's like one of those things we want to talk about, but we don't want to talk about. But it's one of those things that I think are important that other people should hear about. And just to be aware of, and that is if you're black or white or any color of the world, so the shade that you are that I think one of things this podcast is spreading awareness and also wanting change. So is there anything that you'd like to share or positive or negative?

Absolutely. I think people shy away from, and I have in the past, shy away from speaking about things like that because it feels like sometimes you're taught to quieten your voice. Sometimes it feels like victimhood, like you're playing a victim card, but actually these are true experiences. And I think by talking about it, maybe it will help someone else in a current situation get out or seek some support or actually just stand up to whatever's happening. One of the...

agencies I was working in. There were definitely some people that maybe didn't like that I was in the office. I was the only black woman in the office. And I feel like most agencies, especially in this kind of work, there aren't very many, you know, black and brown faces there. And there was a of cold shoulder behavior, particularly from one person in the team. And then one day I went back into the office and there was like a bit of a, there was a general cold shoulder energy. was like, morning, morning, as you do.

and it was met with a lot of silence. I thought, what's going on? And then my manager had called me in and said, this person, so and so has said that you have been telling some of the interns, know, something about being paid and whatnot. but I have not even spoken to some of those people. Very strange. And there was no discussion. was no, you know, have what's happened, what has been said. Have you spoken to this person at all? It was just, okay, well, we're to ask you to go today. now. What? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Kayleigh (22:21.678)
And then when I left, the same person who had had that conversation with me, she called me crying and saying, oh, you know, I can't believe this happened. don't know. Do you know who could have said it? I'm like, this is, no one's even asked me what's happened. No one's even, you know, done any investigations. No one's calls. I just, it was really bizarre. And then to understand later, later, later with a few other private conversations that actually that person who I had raised a flag about before had started some strange, it wasn't even a rumor. He just went to the

a CEO who was never actually in the building. He worked in a different part of the country and said this about me. I thought this is just painful. Yeah. So I was a bit on edge after that, which is maybe a reason why I probably decided to go out so soon. Yeah. Because I just didn't want to experience that again. I don't like tension. love to, I like to laugh. I like to have a good time.

what's up.

Angela (23:08.846)
You're so fun and yeah, I know you're a good person.

So I just didn't want to experience anything like that again. I want to enjoy my work without feeling like the career is going to be overshadowed by things that I can't control. I can't control the colour of my skin or the food that I bring into work or anything like that. I am who I am. So yeah, I maybe if I can choose who I work with, which is, you know, the benefit of working for yourself, then I think I'd feel safer. Which is crazy that we even happen to...

about that and condition ourselves to think like that or be like that. it's crazy.

But it is what it is also, I'd recognize that sometimes you can't change everything in everyone today or tomorrow. yeah.

Well, thank you for sharing and shame on that person. But we all know karma. Anyway, let's leave it there. Absolutely. As I said, I don't wish ill on nobody,

Kayleigh (24:03.662)
that anyone who's experienced something like that can speak up for themselves.

Yeah, that's the thing about speaking up for yourself and some people actually can't and they'll just carry on. Hopefully they can find an ally too to actually talk to someone in the building or wherever they are.

And I hope maybe all the DEI stuff is kind of raising awareness of the things people may experience in silence actually. So yeah, I think it has to get better. I think it would have done from the time I was going through that.

You know what, I always think these things get better when you hear about what's going on in the world today and people cutting them, even big corporations thinking, we don't spend money on that anymore. It's just like, what is this about? What is the way the world's going? But hopefully, you you choose your clients and you work with people that you feel comfortable with. So that's the best thing.

Absolutely.

Angela (24:51.768)
Well done. So to end on a personal note, what would you tell your teenage self?

wow, that's a big question. What would I tell my teenage self? I will tell her to follow her gut, always. Trust your gut. Go where your skills are, not where you feel like you're allowed to go. Don't let anyone tell you that you can or cannot do something. And don't worry about, know, if you haven't seen someone achieve X, Y, Z, doesn't mean that you can't do it. So a lot of trust in her instincts and trust in her gut.

Yeah. Oh, I love that. Thank you. It was very reflective, wasn't it? Yeah. Oh, cool. I can't wait for you to listen to it back because I always, I do listen to it back obviously and check them out. So yeah, I love it because I, because I record them way in advance and I go back and I was like, oh, that was nice.

Thank you,

Kayleigh (25:44.854)
Oh me too, me too, I can't wait, I cannot wait. You've had some incredible guests on as well. I think even what you're here to speak about, I think it's so powerful, but it feels powerful in a very friendly, relaxed way. It doesn't feel like I've got to put on some big girl pants and it's very heartwarming and natural and authentic. So really, really grateful for you and the space that you've created.

Thank you,

Come on. on. Hold on, shucks. Put down your post-it note. don't know what you're shucks.

I'm gonna put your big girl pants on when I'm feeling scared.

You should, and you have created this, so you can do it, like you literally can do anything. I love how you're quite tenacious, you'll just be like, I'm going to do this and you'll just do it. And that's really admirable. It's not easy for everyone. It's not easy for me to do something like that. So I don't know if it's courage. I don't know what it is in you that just kind of, you just kick into action and I just, yeah, it's,

Angela (26:45.356)
Well, you know, I believe so I believe so I think that he's using me in a way that maybe can help somebody so

I love that and maybe that's the power that he's given to you. Amazing. Love that.

Yeah. Thank you. No, bless you. Thank you. So you know what's coming next? The quick fire of five questions. it's one or the other.

I'm ready, I'm ready, I am ready.

It's one of the other. So, crisps or chocolates?

Kayleigh (27:13.198)
Chocolate.

Beach or forest?

Beach.

Booker Kindle.

Right, guys?

Kayleigh (27:21.774)
Reggae, come on. Reggae. Dennis Brown, Freddie MacGregor, come on, of course.

Is that the Jamaican heritage? Yes!

Angela (27:32.078)
Alright, I'll let you have it. Patty, you're a sandwich. I think I the answers to this.

Salt fish patty please. you.

I love saltfish patty! I discovered them, don't judge me but I put ketchup on them too, I love it ketchup.

You're like my son. This ketchup, I almost banned it in this house because it just puts on everything. Are you like that too?

Not everything, but I tried it with a saltfish patty one day and I thought, oh this is nice. It does give it a little sweet, tangy taste.

Kayleigh (27:58.892)
make the difference.

So actually maybe I shouldn't judge maybe I should try that too. Try it. okay okay okay.

Oh, it's really, really been good chatting to you, Kayleigh. I loved it. So thank you so much. Do you want to tell people how they can find you?

Yes, there I am at hallcreative.co.uk. That's my website and the same on Instagram, LinkedIn. If you just pop in hallcreative, I should come up immediately. You'll see my orangey backgroundy round face.

I love it, it's really beautifully designed and the words are beautiful too. Thank you so much.

Kayleigh (28:37.676)
I'd love this today. Thank you so much for having me.

Me. thank you too. Thank you for joining me and have a great day. You too. See ya.

Bye, bye, Ang.

Angela (28:49.41)
So let me start by giving thanks. Thank you for tuning in to Creatives Like Us. I hope you enjoyed this episode and found it thought-provoking, inspiring and entertaining. If you did, it would absolutely make my day if you could share and subscribe. Great to review wherever you get your podcasts. Also, if you have a question or a comment, I'd love to hear from you. All the ways to connect are in the notes. And until next time, keep being creative, like us.