Print, Passion and a Playlist: Rob Ellison of Tonic Magazine

This week I'm joined by Rob Ellison, co-founder of Tonic, a stunning long-form print magazine dedicated to the history and culture of drinks. We recorded this one in person at Burnt Faith Distillery in Walthamstow (yes, a brandy distillery inside a former church) and it's one of those conversations that just flows. 

Rob's creative journey started with a drum kit spotted in the corner of a church in Walsall at age nine. Music brought him to London in the mid-90s and while things didn't go quite to plan, he's still here and now on issue eight of a magazine that's part publication, part coffee table book, part Spotify playlist. 

We talk about building an indie magazine from scratch, the realities of community and distribution and his dream of taking subscribers on drinks tours across Nigeria, Ghana and Zimbabwe. Rob also shares the people who shaped him along the way, including his wife and creative partner Bonita and a certain TV presenter who now sends him handwritten letters. 

His advice to his younger self? Stay curious, build your people around you and remember it's a marathon not a sprint. 

Connect with Rob:

• Instagram
• Tonic Magazine Instagram
• Linkedin
• Connect with Benita

Resources & Links: 

• Tonic Magazine – Dive into long-form stories on drinks, culture, and community
• Burnt Faith Distillery – Experience the unique distillery space mentioned in the episode

Transcript

Angela (00:02.062)
Hello and welcome to Creatives Like Us, a podcast where we open up conversations about what it really means to build a creative career when you're black or brown. I'm your host, brand and marketing graphic designer, Angela Lyons. In my guest episodes, I sit down with creatives who are out there doing the work, navigating the industries and proving that there's space for all of us. Because the more we share, the more we see our stories out there and the more we see ourselves reflected.

and the more we realise we're not alone in this. Okay then, are you ready? Let's dive in to today's episode.

Angela (00:40.907)
Hello, hello, hello Rob. Thank you for joining me today at Creatives Like Us. we are, where are we? We're in the burnt.

Rob (00:47.884)
Hahaha.

We're in Burnt Faith, just to the right here in Walthamstow. It is Walthamstow.

Angela (00:55.246)
I know we're on the borders of Blackhorse Road area, but yeah, it's still part of Walthamstow.

Rob (01:02.062)
Yeah, to have a brandy distillery in Walthamstow is a little bit unusual, but Simon is a creative genius and yeah, he allowed us to have this space. It's called Burnt Faith actually, because it used to be a church. Yeah, it to be a church, so there's a burning technique to make the brandy and so he's put Faith and Burn Faith, so that's why it's the name.

Angela (01:27.086)
great name and good history. I'd have to look that up. anyway, you've told us about Burnt Faith. Yes. So tell us who you are and where you are in the world and what you do and what type of creative you are.

Rob (01:39.094)
Okay, yeah. So, my name's Rob Ellison. I'm originally from the West Midlands, a place called Warsaw, which is in between Birmingham and Wolverhampton, and there we are, a little town there in the center. Creativity, well... I've done a lot of things, I suppose, growing up. I lived with my godmother, who was a very God-fearing, older God-fearing person, and so she dragged me to church whenever.

you could have the opportunity. And one day, there was a drum kit there. And a young nine year old, 10 year old me was like, Oh, what's that in the corner? What's going on? What's that seems very interesting. So my cousin Lance at the time said to me, Oh, do you want to play? And then I got on there and played understood it straight away. And that was it. I was hooked. Yeah, I hooked. played in the church and things like that.

And then later on played in bands, went to college. When I left school, did music and stuff. And so a friend of mine who was a photographer in the kind of mid late 90s, it was at the same college as me, he came to London. And he was looking for Daze magazine doing these big photo shoots and everything. And he said, yeah, come up.

You know, can be in a band and it's going to be a really, really great. The London Live. He sold it to me. He sold it to me. I don't know if he was the mayor at the time, but he sold it to me. And so, yeah, I came and things didn't quite go as they will, they went off in a very, very different direction. But, yep, I'm still here. now I'm doing a drink history magazine called Tonic. So a very, yeah.

But I suppose we'll get into all the stuff that happened in the middle of the journey.

Angela (03:40.014)
And it's nice that we're here in the distillery. it's linked up to the magazine and what you do now. We've got lovely Bonita here with us too. And I'm just going to say that there is, we're actually, as we said, in the distillery, so there's going to be some background noise. Well, hopefully I did some of that out. But if that's what you're hearing, background, it's part of the scene, we're in the scene of where we are. So we're talking about magazines. I love magazines, you know that, you? And I think we met through Sophie.

Rob (03:49.304)
right?

Angela (04:09.154)
Both and three nights magazine.

Rob (04:11.502)
It's stuff across Freelancer magazine. Yeah and and watching her journey setting that up. Yeah

Angela (04:17.974)
Yeah, and she said that you had a magazine and I was like, magazine on alcohol? can't be. There's a magazine for everything, isn't there? So tell us a bit more about the magazine. Yeah.

Rob (04:27.246)
Yeah, so Tonic magazine at the time, well, I say at the time still, we're working with a lot of travel writers, travel PRs, and they would go away, you know, to these places all around the world to write about them. And they'd always come back with some kind of spectacular story about how you go to this little town in Spain and...

wine would be coming up out of the fountains instead of water and you know. like a dream. That sounds like an adult Willy Wonka's dream. Yeah and all of these kind of fantastic stories but they never were able to place them anywhere because the outlets that just be more interested in know 10 things to do in you know this place or something that was a little bit more traditional then.

then these fantastic stories about the making and the production of drinks in industrial estate in Wolframstow. But we thought to ourselves, no, we feel that there is really something behind this. And we do think that the general public would really be interested in it. And we thought, yeah, if we could put it in print, long form, evergreen, beautiful stories, then we feel that with the passion for creativity, we feel that...

something and that's where Tonic was born.

Angela (05:55.566)
And I love the photography, he's saying it's long form, but actually the photography too sells it. And obviously you've got words and everything, but when you actually have the words and put the pictures in and it's such a beautiful magazine. And it's thick and it's substantial. It's a copy table book.

Rob (06:11.118)
Yeah, I mean, sometimes I say to people, it's a magazine and they kind of like, oh yeah, and then I show it and they say, you should have called it a magazine. Look, it's being substantial. Oh, you could, know. you know, also with, I have to say with my musical roots as well, it has a playlist with it. So I

Angela (06:20.631)
you could smell

Angela (06:29.07)
come on to that. Yeah, it's got a Spotify playlist. Every issue has got a Spotify playlist, which is brilliant. And I love it also when you tag people on Instagram, you'll always find a song for them. So your musical connections all coming through. Yeah.

Rob (06:43.842)
Yeah, so all my little creative bits that I've just kind of picked up along the way, I've found a way to, on intended, found a way to distill it all into one thing.

Angela (06:58.222)
And what issue are you now on Sonic?

Rob (07:00.834)
We are now on issue 8.

Angela (07:03.286)
introduce Benita and I've mentioned her twice now. Yeah. Do you to tell people about Benita?

Rob (07:05.806)
Yeah

Yes, well, Bonita is my long suffering wife, and also my creative muse. And she picked up my hand for a game on, she chose this spot to record. there's all sorts of, you know, there's nothing that she can't do. She's on Instagram, little my look her up, you know, you can hire her, you know, for all of your, all of your jobs, job woman.

And so yeah, she's kind of the creative force behind me really. Very good to keep me a check on one hand when I kind of run off with kind of things, but also at the same time, I think very good in terms of giving me confidence to do things. know, growing up sometimes, especially at my, you know, my generation, my time of point of things, growing up sometimes you were told

be careful, don't fly past your nest, don't, you know, just certain things, stay in your lane, things like that. And so that would sometimes when you want to do things kind of...

Angela (08:21.582)
especially something different, especially arty or creative.

Rob (08:24.75)
Yeah, yeah, be careful, watch out. And so I think sometimes having her by my side, it kind of gave me that confidence that you'd say something and then, you know, she'd be like, Okay, then so let's check out how we can do that. like, There's no. Okay, let's go. Great team. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, we're. Yeah. So I think we make a good team. Yay team. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Angela (08:53.39)
I'm a BT!

Rob (08:55.042)
We cut.

Angela (08:57.07)
Do you hear that? They make beautiful music, R &B things.

Rob (09:00.788)
Yeah, music together, yeah.

Angela (09:04.078)
So I was going to ask about, so you've got the magazine, you've got the Spotify playlist. And I was going say also you kind of branch out into events. I know when you launched the magazines, you do a bit of event work and also you fairs, is that right?

Rob (09:15.756)
Yeah, so, I mean, with, like I say, know, the sort of, you know, all the other jobs that we've kind of done over the past two decades, can't believe we are done with that whole surely. that's how long we've been doing events for tourist pools and all of that. It came natural that that thing to kind of say, okay, yeah, we've got a magazine but

Angela (09:27.892)
the magazine's been going.

Rob (09:42.936)
Do we need to have something a little bit more around it? Something that could kind of highlight the magazine and highlight print in general? And so I think having a drinks magazine is good because, you know, we're better to have, you know, events than, you know, in distilleries or in cocktail bars, you know, to help solidify the community. Because I feel like with indie magazines in particular, as you will know from Freelancer, is that

Community is kind of key.

Angela (10:13.998)
It's key, it? It's keeping it alive because otherwise it just won't survive. You need the people around you, especially in magazines, and bringing them up, promoting them and just, yeah, they're the ones that support you and you support them.

Rob (10:26.954)
Yeah. And there is something about it that, you know, I can have, you know, I can talk to subscribers and say, it's not, you know, it's going to be a week late or it's going to be, and they'll be like, yeah, don't worry about it. You know, there's, there's, it's a totally different, I think, sort of scenario and group when you're small, because they really do support you and they really, really want you to do well. So we do that. And then, I was sitting on top of that, Indie.

let's be honest, it does have issues in terms of distribution, getting the word out there just to the people on the street. A lot of marketing. And finances. Yeah, finances. You can boost your posts, that's fine, but does that generate anything back? And so I thought, if there was an opportunity to

get spaces where all as many indie publishers as possible could take a table, come free of charge to sell their magazines and give them a chance to get some income. And plus also just for the general public to kind of go, you know something, Prince Not Dead and there's some. Yeah, Prince Not Dead, there you go, he gave me the cue. know, the one that.

Angela (11:45.358)
I'm gonna my badge.

Rob (11:52.33)
you came to was just so good to not only, you know, meeting some of the general public, but also at the same time, talking to each other. Yeah,

Angela (12:04.27)
to find out what's going on and what they're up to. Even down to papers, I was looking at some people's papers, was like, what's this? I've never seen this one before. Sorry, a paper geek.

Rob (12:11.598)
Yeah, yeah, you've to be a paper geek. You've got to be a paper geek. So yeah, so we really want to expand the fairs as well and get places. So if anybody's watching this and you have a space for us, please.

Angela (12:26.872)
What's your ideal space?

Rob (12:28.968)
Ideal space. You know something I would actually like to have it in the British Library. I think that'd be really cool. Yeah. I'm trying to at the moment but they see one responsive and also we used to do events before somebody else at the Royal Geographical Society. Again, a place that's got big maps, some of the oldest maps.

the Yeah, in the world and things like that. I just think, oh, yeah, just to have just to have backdrop. the garden and the garden looks at Verola Hall and all of that sort of stuff. Yeah, that would be something like that. That kind of links to print and paper and history.

Angela (13:18.35)
I know some of my friends and I've done I one for in particular she does some evenings there. She's a lawyer and she does some workshop workshops first like she has panel talking. Yeah, and but she normally has quite a lot of she's in there like every month. So I wonder like, yeah, if there's an in there. I don't know how they work it but she's there and I'm like, because I got to speak on a panel that I was like, Oh my god, with the British

Rob (13:34.828)
Yeah, definitely. Touchdown.

Angela (13:44.086)
I'm super massive.

Rob (13:46.558)
That's it, Lady Ange.

Angela (13:49.55)
Well, I used to live in Leighton and my mates used to call me Lady of Leighton. And I also have a nose because this is Leon's, not Lion's. So I'm going back to like your days of London and coming back, you know, there was obviously somebody there that said to you, let's do this and let's try and you come down and then there's a whole change of direction for you. Is there anything else anybody else in your life that's been a catalyst connection that said and it's your life is completely

Rob (13:53.677)
Okay

Rob (13:58.286)
It's a n-yons.

Angela (14:19.576)
changed or...

Rob (14:21.016)
Yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean, it was mad because where I'm from, I'd say it's a small town, was, you know, factories and all of that sort of stuff. And when I was a kid, you know, you just, you know, dream of being in London and we used to, me my brother, we used to watch, does it wish you were here with Judy Charles? And John Carter and those sorts of things. And we've watched like that. And then they say the price at the end. we were like, my God.

Angela (14:48.758)
I remember those programs. He's just like, who the bloody hell's gonna hold that?

Rob (14:54.217)
I surprised of how I was back in those days and they just really just rolled off their tongue like yeah, gives us inspirations like oh my god, I can't afford that, you Nobody really went on big holidays abroad back when I was there.

Angela (14:59.127)
aspiration.

Angela (15:07.054)
what funny I talked to my sister about this yesterday when we talk about family holidays, we back home. It wasn't like no beach holiday. my friends were like going to Spain or like we were like, we'll just go. I know obviously I'm back home. My back home is St. Lucia and it's nice. But I was like staying at family's home in St. Lucia.

Rob (15:21.47)
Yeah, there was no my ties and all that. Yeah. And so, yeah, when, you know, Jermaine, the guy who was working for, you know, days at a time, you know, he told me to come down, met the lady behind the camera there. Yeah, that's what happened. And yes, she did, you know, she gave me the confidence to kind of do things. And I was like,

I think London had given me a few hits as well. So I was like, no. And she was like, no, really push, really go. And so, yeah, first of all, yeah, first of all that Benita and then pushed me to go and do this event for these travel writers. And the person who was in charge at the time was John Carter from which she were here. And so it was like, yeah.

And so I go and he was there and he just was like, hello, old boy. And I'm like, is he talking? You know, and at that time I'd walk into a room and I'd be like a, like a mouse kind of stick to the stick to the edge. Yeah. And, know, and over time, right up to this very day, he's somebody who he doesn't actually give any sort of advice. But the fact that I've been able to spend a lot of time with him.

buses and you know and in countries and he tells tell me all of these kind of stories I could say things to and he'd just be like yeah yeah you should do that I was thinking about you the other day and he writes me handwritten letters and he sends me stuff yeah it's just weird to kind of this was a guy that I looked up to and now it's like always crazy yeah

Angela (17:03.916)
So there's somebody on TV that you work with and got to know.

Rob (17:05.965)
Yeah. Yeah, so it's that sort of, and just to give that sort of, just that sort of energy to just like, you can. Yeah, you can. We'll just walk, you know, let me just see if I can, do you mind if I can do that? Yeah. What, is the worst that could happen? They tell you no. He didn't fall apart into a pool of water. He just, he just moved on to the next thing. Okay, so that's off the table. Let's just.

Angela (17:26.584)
Bye.

Rob (17:35.808)
And so, yeah, think, you know, people, yeah, people like him as well.

Angela (17:43.4)
Cool connections.

Rob (17:48.014)
Actually, I did actually have a chance to speak to that much anymore. But Judy Chalmers, I did have a chance to speak to quite a lot back in the day. And it was always, but we had a different relationship when she phoned, I don't stand to attention. don't know why. I phoned her up and she goes, oh, Robert, Judy here. Why am I? Oh, sorry. Why am I doing that? It's a bit odd.

Angela (18:07.138)
She was the voice of a foreign city! Yeah! I know, I've still got my pajamas on.

Rob (18:14.894)
But yeah, but those guys would definitely put me in a different frame of mind.

Angela (18:20.33)
Yeah, so thinking about the future and what's happening next projects. What are you up to next?

Rob (18:26.606)
You know, one of the things, I the magazine started, we started it up and then a little thing called COVID happened. I don't know if you knew about that. And so that knocked us completely off track. But one of the things that we did talk about doing was doing tours.

Angela (18:47.246)
What's also the magazine or?

Rob (18:48.911)
Yeah, so for subscribers or anybody that wants to get involved we could do tours of well, tours of say for example this distillery or...

Angela (19:00.014)
We like actual tours where you come to this. So you'd organize it and you say, here's an hour and we're going to walk you around to tell you a bit of the history of the place.

Rob (19:07.994)
Yeah, that sort of thing. But also I've been talking to, over time, this guy called Daniel who imports a lot of African rums, whiskies, beers, ciders, gins, about doing something further afield. Africa, maybe? Yeah, so to go to Nigeria, Ghana, Zimbabwe, and do big tours over there and going to see gin distilleries, whisky distilleries, cider houses.

all the stuff that he's kind of importing to kind of go, yeah, this is what they're doing over here. And the sort of African spirit and drinks is really starting to the tastes and the flavors there is something that's really starting to take off over here. And so getting the chance to go and see them, you know, support and see what they're up to. That is something which hopefully soon we'll be able to do.

Angela (20:03.83)
Is there an African dream? Is there an African dream?

Rob (20:06.734)
Yeah, so there's lots, but there's one called prasera and that's the prasera, it's named after prasera, the kind of juniper. And what makes that different is that usually with gin they kind of dry it out before they start the process, but juniper it just goes in like as whole, so it gives it a different sort of body, a different kind of complexion. And everybody in the village is involved in, know,

picking the gene apart or the different herbs involved to go into it. They make the bottle, they make the caps. everybody's involved and it's all a sort of co-op type of situation that goes on over. Yeah, they get the profits.

Angela (20:50.754)
Get the profits too.

What is your favourite drink?

Rob (20:57.358)
My favorite drink. Unfortunately, it's hard liquor. I do like a vodka martini. Yeah, I think that's maybe the that's who I am now. That's the new me. The the Warsaw rubber has kind of washed away. And Lord Robert of Hackney. The day of woodpecker cider is gone. And yeah, but I do like a

I

Rob (21:31.864)
Yeah, what about you? Are you in your rom era?

Angela (21:36.302)
I don't like rum. I don't like any dark spirits really. I like String Gin. Okay. Like a tank wine. I'm not very fancy of any other gin or the other names to them. But I it with a really nice tonic water actually. It's tonic that yeah, what's the one? Oh, what are they called? They do different flavors. The elder flowers. The ones. Oh, Fever drink.

Rob (22:03.342)
Not true.

Angela (22:04.574)
I think that's only one I really like. Again, I used to drink of Schweppes, but I'm like...

Rob (22:09.514)
That's

Yeah, yeah. Well, actually, you say now we want to have a event at a place called the Thames Distillery all the way down in Burman Z. And the guys there who have the distillery and they make jeans for different people. One in particular guy called Simon Ford, who has got a brand called Ford's Jeans. Very nice jean.

that family has been making gin since 1658. they know a little bit about gin. So I was down there the other day talking to them.

Angela (22:55.21)
marketing though sorry to interrupt I've never heard of them so yes like why would I not have heard of them so they're marketing or is it

Rob (23:01.89)
Well, you know, I think what happened was is that obviously over that span of time that a lot of things have happened and now they are, they make gin for other people. So you may have heard of the gins that they make. They don't have a brand of their own. Interesting. Yeah. So if you do want a gin, you go to them and they kind of go what kind of gin and

obviously, with all of that knowledge, they kind of go, Okay, I can make you this type of gin. wow. Yeah.

Yeah, bespoke, yes, bespoke gin. So if I ever want one, yeah, I'd definitely go to them. And they've just taken somebody on who's from Korea and she is second generation gin. So she's come over to London and started working on those. So there's a real heritage with her.

Angela (23:52.492)
you've got so much knowledge. I'm like, you I know you did the magazine, but I've never thought about writing a book.

Rob (24:00.342)
Yeah, but you know, it's kind of interesting because you know, I suppose one thing maybe tied with the question that maybe that you're going to ask me when I'll say it now is to stay curious, you know, to me, I was like, what's going on over there? What are you doing? know, what are you doing? you're doing brandy over here. You know, and you just so by doing that, you just kind of pick up all of these. All of these sorts of stories and stuff. So

Angela (24:24.43)
I reckon you'd be amazed. That'd be amazing book. I think that'd be so cool. Yeah, and maybe focus it on I don't know the UK and how it's spread out to the parts of the world or people influencing here. don't know something like that. Yeah, that'd be really cool. You've got so much knowledge both of you. Let's like share it.

Rob (24:39.118)
Yeah, no, we have thoughts about that, you know the book or you know YouTube channel just to go around things that England is a strange place that you just could just walk past something every single day and not know that something really major happened at that and he just kind of walked past it.

Angela (24:56.302)
When I was walking here today, walked past the bus stop and I walked again and I walked again and thought I better put my Google Maps on. Then I saw the alleyway down here. I I never knew this alleyway was down here. And there's a brewery down there. There's like a distillery down here. So it's so true. It's like so much going on.

Rob (25:11.534)
Yeah, like every time I am, where is it up in Mare Street, I was go past on the bus and I look and there's this house and it's kind of, you know, kind of cold enough, nothing happened there. And I just kind of think Guy Fawkes lived there. You know what I mean? Guy Fawkes, you know, and you just kind of think to yourself, it's just, you just go past that. And you just don't even bother with it. It's very strange.

Angela (25:36.814)
So it might be with me to answer the question. So one of the questions that I like to round up on was what would you ask your teenage self or what advice you'd give them?

Rob (25:46.03)
So like I said, know, stay curious, always try to, you know, ask questions and find out from people and don't be like I to you before, who would have known that, you know, I would have this sort of relationship with somebody who I thought I would never have that, know, with John Carter and these sorts of people. So don't close yourself off. The other thing I would say as well is have patience.

It's not a sprint, it's a marathon. Too many times I see people, oh, it's not working in, and you've only been doing it for five minutes. So, plan, say to yourself, especially if I was to go back and think about Tonic Now, for example, I think my thought was at the time that I'd make this magazine, I'd make it the best that I could, I'd release it, I'd put it out there, and then...

first one would just be so successful that everything would just be great. And looking back now, it doesn't tend to work like that. And so yeah, plan. So I think going back now, what I'll probably will do is say, okay, I'm gonna have enough to make six copies, six editions, and just work it through. And at each point, I would reevaluate in order. So when it gets to six, we firmly established because

Angela (27:03.854)
Peace.

Rob (27:15.04)
It takes time to penetrate the market. There's just so much noise out there. There's just so much noise out there at the moment. Just to think that you can just speak and everybody just stops and listens to you. It doesn't quite work like that. So yeah, it's, it's a marathon. Yeah, it's not a sprint. And, you know, I'm not done with the cliches that needs to be, you know,

Yeah, your network is your net worth. So just really make sure that, yeah, you are curious, but also make sure that you have the right type of people around you, build a body of people around that you can ask, you can rely on. They're also going to be truthful with you if they feel that, you know, maybe that's not working or it's the right thing. They will tell you that, not in a negative way.

Angela (28:07.895)
What?

Rob (28:08.102)
Yeah, not in a horrible way, but they can, you know, maybe check and you could maybe check them. But if you build enough of a network around you, you know,

Angela (28:19.47)
So people, when you build that network around you, think that you become that person of influence, then people come to you for advice or whatever they need. And that's great in the community, isn't it? Just all helping each other. You've become the key person of influence.

Rob (28:36.27)
So don't have any for you.

Angela (28:42.542)
Oh, brilliant. Let's see, what time is that? 29. Oh, it's kind of perfect. So if you looked up the questions from before, because I normally ask the quick fire of five questions.

Rob (28:49.524)
I'm not there.

Rob (28:57.175)
I didn't say this. This is where I'm getting so troubled. I'm in trouble now.

Angela (29:01.358)
Maybe I should switch it up for drinks. Just my chocolates.

Rob (29:06.446)
my gosh that is tough that is tough chocolate Forest

Angela (29:12.578)
Beach or forest?

Angela (29:17.474)
Book or Kindle? Reggae or Sound?

Rob (29:19.32)
book.

Rob (29:24.087)
Right guy.

Angela (29:25.57)
Patty or a sandwich?

Rob (29:27.18)
You know? Patty. I'm not great with spices though. Patty, no.

Angela (29:30.574)
Any spice rums? Can you handle them?

Angela (29:39.266)
Is there anything else you'd like to ask?

Rob (29:45.411)
Thank you very much. feel privileged. Nobody usually wants to speak to me.

Angela (29:53.006)
You've got Judas Chalmers calling you,

Rob (29:55.756)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So thank you very much for the round.

Angela (30:02.422)
Thank you for joining me. It's been brilliant. I love the conversation. Thank you very much. tell people how they can find you and I'll put the notes on the show notes. Yeah, yeah, everything so

Rob (30:11.022)
So Tonic magazine, biannual twice a year, we have events in between and we have a newsletter. The tonicmag.com website and also Instagram, Facebook, and we do giveaways as well.

Angela (30:27.032)
all the giveaways I won a giveaway. Yes. One of your writers. There are competition where people win. They're going to their friends and would I'm sort of legit. Yeah. Yeah. Brilliant. that's cool. Thank you. All right, cool. Thank you. Thank you for the mics and everything because I was a bit nervous about how we're going to film today. But I think we've done it. So I hope everyone enjoys it.

Rob (30:56.012)
Yeah, so now we're going to drink the rum in the, the brandy in the barrel.

Angela (31:00.554)
can we? We've got shot glasses. Thank you to Burnt Faith also for letting us use this space. We'll also put the link in the show notes for them and if anyone's in Wollemstad, can come and visit them and drink some brandy.

Angela (31:18.83)
for listening to Creatives Like Us. If this conversation resonated with you, share it with someone who needs to hear it today. That's how we build our communities and amplify our voices. You can find all the show notes and the links at linescreative.co.uk podcast and connect with me on LinkedIn and Instagram. I'd love to see you there. Also make my day if you can leave a review or comment in your listening platform choice. And it's really easy in Spotify, leave it in the comments. Until next time, keep creating and keep supporting creatives like us.

See you next time, bye.