Run Your Race Podcast
When I first listened to David Goggins' book in 2019, I was hooked. If he could run 100 miles without training, I thought I could do it with training! It unlocked something in me, leading to my journey into ultramarathons. Since then, I've completed multiple 100- and 200-mile races, something I once thought impossible. This podcast aims to give you that same mindset shift. Each week, we interview elite endurance athletes to inspire you to believe more is possible and push yourself to the next level.
Run Your Race Podcast
#011: Jeremy Miller - How To Run A Faster Marathon
Jeremy Miller shares his transformative journey from hating running to becoming an accomplished endurance athlete, highlighting the importance of consistency, mindfulness, and proper training in enhancing marathon performance. Listeners can glean valuable insights on nutrition, recovery, and the mental aspects crucial for successful running experiences.
• Emphasizing the power of presence and mindfulness in running
• The journey from disinterest in running to completing 11 marathons
• Consistency as the critical element for long-term improvement
• Tactical advice for pacing, training, and marathon prep
• Nutrition strategies for optimal performance and recovery
• Importance of strength training and injury prevention techniques
• Viewing fitness as a lifelong journey of self-improvement and discovery
You Can Find Jeremy Here…
You may pray, dude, gotta pray, gotta pray Always, check, check, check, always pray, pray.
Speaker 2:For everything.
Speaker 1:Pray for everything. Lord, we just thank you so much for today, God, thank you for Jeremy, Thank you for the wisdom that you placed inside of him. Lord, I pray that you would just bless this show, that you'd speak through Jeremy, that you'd speak to all the people listening, that they would not only become better people but better runners and just a light to those around them. Just like Jeremy's encouraged so many people, Lord, I pray that he would just encourage even more through this show, and this would be tactical, practical and also just open people up to a new level of possibility for their life. And we just honor you. Guide my questions In Jesus' name. We pray Amen.
Speaker 2:Amen, Dude, I will say I'm not a religious person, but I like the prayers before eating, before podcasts, because it brings you to the present.
Speaker 2:Yeah, tell me about that we get so caught up in thinking about everything else that sometimes we're not very present. But I like I don't know if we prayed last night before dinner, but the other night I was at dinner with friends and they prayed. Before night I was at dinner with friends and they prayed before and it's like it's a good, gives you a good moment to like appreciate your food in the present moment and just just be here. I like it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's interesting because, like I mean, obviously I'm Christian and I think that there are like principles that God created that just are the way things work. It's like we're talking about the law of sowing and reaping and when you sow you will reap, but you just got to keep sowing and sowing and sowing and eventually you'll reap. And almost I wonder if, like I mean, prayer is you know how like people are, like set your intention and things like that. It's almost like sometimes, too, prayer is like that in a way, where it's like setting an intention and I believe it's communicating, like.
Speaker 1:Sometimes too, prayer is is like that in a way, where it's like setting an intention, um, and I believe it's communicating with god. But I think I wonder if you know, because there's that principle of prayer and and how that works, like if the intention setting, people like are are grabbing that principle and making it work.
Speaker 2:That makes sense.
Speaker 1:I don't know, that's kind of weird out there, but I just thought of that.
Speaker 2:That makes sense. I mean, I meditate every day, whether it's for 30 seconds or 10 minutes, but I take time every day to just what does that look like? Wherever I'm at, I just close my eyes, think about where I'm at right now, what I'm grateful for, and I just like it's a chance to just be present and, like, turn your brain off for a sec and just be right here Because, again, like with technology and all these distractions every day, it's so easy to just not be present. Yeah, so it's a good reminder.
Speaker 1:It's easy to like get to a place where you are like, man, I'm not there yet, yeah, or I'm working towards this and I'm just going and going, but I'm not there yet, and like focus on that gap versus how far you've come, and so I think that yeah.
Speaker 2:That's what a Buddhist like that's a strong element of Buddhism is like being present, like being enlightened, basically through meditation is just having like being present, like being enlightened, basically, yeah, through meditation is just having like being ever present, because if you're only ever present in this exact moment, there's no opportunity for suffering or negative thoughts or negativity, because you're literally just focused on what's happening right now. Because the only time you're ever upset is if you're thinking about something in the past or something in the future, like what's coming up or what already happened.
Speaker 2:If you're just focused right now you can't be upset.
Speaker 1:Look at you, philosopher. Add that to the credentials. All right guys. So welcome back to the Run your Race podcast. I'm Pierre Chow and you may recognize that voice. That's my friend, jeremy Miller. Jeremy and I met, I think now two years ago I don't know, I'd have to look back 2022, I was working for Steve Weatherford and we went to do a podcast. Steve was on with Nick Baer, jeremy was working for Nick at the time and who knew?
Speaker 1:Like who knew that we'd just become such great friends? Jeremy is an incredible endurance athlete, done marathons, 100-mile races but in this episode I want to focus on how to run a faster marathon. We'll dive into Jeremy's backstory how he actually got into running, how that progression looked like and give you some tactical takeaways on how to run a faster marathon. But Jeremy has run how many marathons 11. 11 marathons over the last couple of years and he's run as fast as a 244 marathon, which is what is the average pace on that 6.16 per mile.
Speaker 1:Okay, 6.16, six minutes and 16 seconds per mile for 26.2 miles. Imagine that, just think about that, just meditate on that. That is freaking fast. And Jeremy helped me run a faster marathon, a 251 marathon. But he's so full of wisdom, so full of insight and just someone I look up to a lot. So, jeremy, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2:Quite the introduction.
Speaker 1:Thank you, Piercy, hey dude.
Speaker 2:What's your average pace on your 251?
Speaker 1:Oh, it's like 630?. I think 628,. I think, yeah, yeah, that's fast too man. I know.
Speaker 2:So fast, thanks, so fast, thanks to my coach and literally that was on, basically your first attempt at running a fast marathon yes, yeah, honestly I.
Speaker 1:I ran my first marathon and I ultimately I just went immediately into longer distance races and then, after talking to you, I was like, man, maybe I need to run a fast one. So we did a couple long training runs.
Speaker 2:Jeremy trained me and it was great yeah, you crushed it, man, I think, um, there's definitely a formula to marathons which I'm sure we'll get into.
Speaker 1:Let's get into that, but let's first get into. Jeremy Miller didn't always run. Where and when did he start running?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I hated running for the first 20 years of my life. Hated running Sports. It was always used as punishment. Anytime you'd miss a ground ball in baseball, you'd run laps. If you messed up a drill in hockey, we'd skate lines. Like it was always used as punishment. So cardio I just despised it. So I avoided it whenever I could. And then in 2018, I was living in Hawaii for an exchange program in college and I was sitting on the bus one day and just randomly put on this podcast, this guy named David Goggins was on the Joe Rogan Experience. Never heard of him, Didn't know anything about him. And then he starts-.
Speaker 1:So by random choice you listened to that episode, or did someone recommend it? I?
Speaker 2:think I saw somebody shared it to their Instagram story. I remember it was one of my friends from from wyoming and they're like this. This episode's great, like you gotta listen yeah clicked on it. Listen to it blew my mind, changed my life literally. Uh, it hurt. Him tell his story of running 100 miles with no training. You know all the hardships that he had growing up with like an abusive father and like everything that most people know about Goggins now.
Speaker 2:Crazy story and it was just so inspiring and I think it resonated so much at the time with me because I was done playing sports. I wasn't really doing anything that I was passionate about. I was kind of just going to the gym a couple of times a week lifting weights, doing machines. I was studying political science in school, which I didn't care about, so I was just kind of like lost, I feel. Like a little bit. I was drinking a lot, like going out to the bars and just not doing anything intentional in my life and hearing goggins um, it's just crazy story.
Speaker 2:And how he used endurance to build self-confidence and and do all this for himself. I was like man, this sounds interesting, like maybe all, maybe I can get something out of that too. And story and how he used endurance to build self-confidence and and do all this for himself. I was like man, this sounds interesting, like maybe, maybe I can get something out of that too. And so I literally went home that same day, grabbed an old pair of running shoes and just threw them on random mile as hard as I possibly could, realized how out of shape I was and then just kept coming back to that for over a year of just like one to two miles a day as hard as I possibly could, but obviously that's not how you build running fitness, aerobic fitness, and I learned that after almost a year of doing that I'm like I'm not getting any faster by doing this like I can running really hard yeah so I started paying more attention to to running and trying to build more endurance.
Speaker 2:So I'd do like a five mile run, a 10 mile run and then one of my friends talked me into doing a ultra marathon in my hometown. Uh, summer of 2020 so summer of 2020?
Speaker 1:how far into running was that?
Speaker 2:that was about two years, okay, after I first started running. Okay, cool, just like a mile a day. Uh, my friend talked me into doing this ultra marathon. It was 12 hours to run as many loops as we could around this eight mile trail and I I was like, well, goggins did 100 miles in 24 hours, so I should be able to do 50 miles in 12 hours, right.
Speaker 2:That's how it works Logical and I was running maybe 10 miles a week like not anywhere near what I should have been doing and went and ran 43 miles in those 12 hours, so like off of basically no training no knowledge I was eating like goos and like drinking like Fairlife chocolate milk and just things I probably shouldn't have been having.
Speaker 2:I didn't know anything about anything back then but built a ton of confidence in saying, okay, if I am able to go do this and like grip my way and have the mental strength to get through 43 miles, like what would happen if I actually trained properly. So that's when I was like, okay, let's figure this out. So start paying more attention to like podcasts and reading and buying books and asking other people in the running community. And then from there I did like my first half marathon, first marathon and so on.
Speaker 2:So since then yeah, 11 marathons Qualified for Boston six times now, wow.
Speaker 1:Which is what time.
Speaker 2:It was sub three to qualify. Now it's sub 255. So I guess six sub three marathons. And then, like this spring, I did three sub three marathons three weekends in a row, which I thought was crazy. I didn't really intend to do that, but that's insane, just sort of happened, I guess. And then, yeah, 244 marathon, hopefully going for like 239 in the spring in tokyo so yeah, from literally hating running, not having any clue what I was doing, to now doing all this stuff, is pretty crazy to me that is incredible.
Speaker 1:One thing that stuck out to me and just a revelation I had is like, dude, you literally were not running at all before you listened to this podcast about a guy with a crazy story, inspiring story, and then you get into running and running changed your life. Now that's a huge, huge part of your life. You know, you're creating content, you're doing all these races. It's just so powerful how literally one podcast can alter the course of your life, like, if you let it, almost.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's interesting. Now I don't want to sound egotistical at all, but I get messages every week of people saying I listened to your podcast, I listened to your YouTube video, I watched your Instagram reels and I ran my first marathon, I signed up for a race because of you and I'm like dang, like that was me like five years ago listening to Goggins. Now there's people telling me the same thing, that I've inspired them, so it's like it's a crazy surreal thing to be in that position.
Speaker 2:And I never even really think about it that way. I like running. I want to document it. If I inspire people along the way, that's great. So, yeah, it's cool how that one thing can have such a big impact. It's like the butterfly effect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 100%. Do you remember like the first run you went for really? I know you ran probably in sports, but like after listening to that podcast, do you remember what that was like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was just like I was just running as hard as I possibly could, Like I was just sprinting, was just like I was just running as hard as I possibly could.
Speaker 1:Like I was just sprinting. Was it miserable?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it was literally like seven minutes. It was like probably the hardest seven minutes ever. And I remember it was seven minutes specifically because prior to that, the only real knowledge I had of running was in seventh grade. We had to do the mile in PE and I ran a 7.12. And so I was like, okay if in seventh grade, when I was like 12 years old, I ran a 712. And so I was like, okay if in seventh grade, when I was like 12 years old, I ran a 712. Now that I'm in college, I'm 20 years old, I should at least be able to run a 712. Right, so I would just try and beat that every day.
Speaker 1:Just because you get older means you get faster logically right, yeah, yeah, uh.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I remember that was like my motivation to run faster was like I gotta beat my seventh grade time and it was so hard because I had no capacity for it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's crazy. I mean you got to, I mean you've probably seen this right. Like, what I see is one of the biggest mistakes people make when they get into running is just thinking they have to run hard all the time.
Speaker 2:Yep, that's exactly what I did. That's what most people do and I think it's because that's what we're taught. Especially if you play sports or in PE, it's like if you're not breathing hard.
Speaker 1:The only time you're running is when it's punishment and you have to do sprints.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're always doing sprints, Like most people. Don't do easy runs in sports, maybe, unless you did cross country or track or something. But yeah, if you played sports or PE, you're never just like let's go run easy pace.
Speaker 1:I've never even heard of an easy run. I didn't know what that meant. Yeah, what? What kept you?
Speaker 2:coming back and running again and again. Was it curiosity? Was it made you feel good? It was definitely mental, for sure, because I physically felt horrible. But I think that's why I liked it so much was because I felt like mentally it was a place I could kind of meditate. When you're running, you're forced to be present, you have to be in the moment, like because it's uncomfortable. Anytime you're uncomfortable, you are aware that you're uncomfortable, and so running is a great method of meditation. And so, again, because I was just kind of lost in life at that point, I was like this makes me feel like I'm doing something, like I'm doing something, like I'm being intentional with something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's definitely a mental thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you're growing, you're getting better. There's something about that feeling of pushing yourself and seeing that reward and progressing time after time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I wasn't. I feel like I made some progress there, but the progress, uh, ended up kind of being just like being able to run a little further each day. And it was more just like breaking down the mental barriers. And I was. I was probably building some fitness cause. I was running almost every day but I wasn't running the right way, so I was. The progress I was making was like, okay, let's do like three miles tomorrow or four miles. I remember my first five mile run and it was like holy crap.
Speaker 2:I came back to our apartment in Hawaii after running five miles and I was I was like so excited, but I was like so tired and Bree was like asking me questions and I'm like, bro, I just ran five miles, Like you got to give me a minute, Like I was just like so defeated but also I felt so good and accomplished. So it's funny Like we do five miles every day and just feels like nothing now that's crazy perspective.
Speaker 1:Um, when did you actually start to get better and improve and think how you referred to it as like actually learn how to run properly? Yeah, I would.
Speaker 2:I would say after that ultra marathon, because I couldn't run for like two or three months after that Cause I hurt my knee in the process because I was so under trained and so when I couldn't run then I was hurt. I was like dang. I definitely didn't go about that the right way. I should probably learn about this. So that's where I learned about like easy running and just some speed work and mixing up your types of runs and things like that.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, it was like end of 2020, early 2021. Uh, and it was in 2021 when I ran my first half marathon.
Speaker 1:So, and that was when.
Speaker 2:I did like an actual training plan for it.
Speaker 1:Cause.
Speaker 2:I wanted to break a one 30 for the half, cause I was like eventually I want to do sub three. So I was like at at least break 130 for the half. So I did an actual training program. I still have it somewhere on my computer, but I went through it a few months back and I was like I can't believe I did this Like I made my own training program, just like I don't want to pay for a coach or anything.
Speaker 2:I just like did a bunch of research online and I was like of right but mostly wrong. It was just like I would run all my runs at eight minute pace exactly. So it was like and I would call them on shrava easy runs or like recovery runs my heart rate was like 170, but I was like, okay, if my race pace is going to be 650 per mile, then my easy pace should be eight minutes a mile, right, and I was like I didn't know anything about zone two yet, or heart rate training.
Speaker 2:So I was getting, but it was still not quite right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's an encouragement, because it was like you didn't come out the womb ripping sub three marathons. You started with the struggle, you know, not knowing what you were supposed to do and that's something that I've learned too is a lot of people get held back myself included by thinking you need to know the perfect way, how to do it, when in reality I mean with all things in life, especially, you see it, in running it's like just get out there, start, and as you progress, you'll start to make adjustments to get better, because you can read a lot of books about running in proper form and recovery and things like that, but you really learn recovery when you're exhausted, because you just did a 20 mile run or 10 mile run or whatever or your five mile run and you need to figure out how. How am I going to be okay to run tomorrow or in a couple of days?
Speaker 2:Yeah, experience is the number one teacher, I think. But also you can fast track success and like, fast track your way to your goals, but by, I think, accepting that you're a beginner, or accepting your own ignorance, maybe, or like, cause I was so stubborn for so long, I was like I don't want to coach, I don't need a coach, I'll figure this out on my own. I can do my research online and figure it out. But now, like I just started training for high rocks the last few months, immediately as soon as I knew I was going to do high rocks, I start following as many people as I could on instagram about high rocks, watching youtube videos, working out with people in person, understanding how they do it, like picking their brains and just really acting like a beginner and being a student, rather than how I used to be of like I'm going to be stubborn and figure this out on my own, which can be beneficial, but it's such a slower process.
Speaker 2:Or if you can just surround yourself with that information and those people, you can get to those goals so much faster.
Speaker 1:Yeah. But it takes you admitting your, your ignorance yeah, humbling yourself yeah are you a fan of doing the research like yourself and being a student in that way, or like getting a coach or both?
Speaker 2:there's definitely pros and cons to both. Me personally, I would prefer to hire a coach for sure because it's obviously they're a coach for a reason. They know what they're doing and I think they can help you, uh, avoid injuries. Um, you can certainly figure it out on your own but I think you're going to have a lot more success with a coach and in.
Speaker 2:A coach is not only there to like provide a program and tell you when to run and how to run, but also like telling you when not to run. Like so many athletes get so excited, especially getting into a new sport, that they want to just run every day. They want to run 20 miles every Saturday, but it's like don't do that. Like a coach should be there to also say let's do 10 miles instead of 20. Let's run easy instead of doing a hard workout or something, and then also just being. It's like having a team with you almost too, because if you have questions about like should I do this race or this race or should I try these shoes or these shoes Like, a coach is there to help provide like advisory too.
Speaker 1:That's good. So let's get into actually running a faster marathon and what it takes. Um and so I want to. So you obviously did the 244. What did your progression in times look like Like when you ran your first marathon? I think you started off the gate and you were fast. I think it was like a 301, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I ran three hours 54 seconds.
Speaker 1:Okay, three hours 54 seconds, which is fast for a first marathon, really fast. Well, let me ask you this what do you think allowed you to run such a fast um marathon? And to give people context, my first marathon was at 343 yeah so like 43 minutes, uh, slower than jeremy, um. So yeah, what do you think?
Speaker 2:I think a lot of it was how long it took me to actually run that first marathon, because I started in 2018 running and I didn't run that first marathon until four years later, in 2022. So I had four years even though I wasn't really training as I should have been, it was still a lot of time spent running, which, over four years, you're going to build a lot of fitness.
Speaker 2:And at that point, too, I was like I had a better training plan. I was still wasn't working with a coach or anything, but I had a lot more knowledge and and two. I think it's important to know like I played sports growing up. I've never been overweight, I've never like. I've always been super active, always moving my body, and so I don't have like amazing genetics or anything like that, but just cause I've always been active and moving, like I've had some level of base fitness, which definitely helps.
Speaker 1:Yeah for sure. So it took you four years to run your first marathon. You've been building up, I mean improperly training, but still training. Did sports that? So that that makes sense. Um and so what do you think are the like biggest key components to actually running a faster marathon?
Speaker 2:I think consistency.
Speaker 1:Okay, talk about that.
Speaker 2:Consistency of just showing up every day, at least five, six days a week, if not seven days a week, and just being consistent. I think it's. Everybody talks about consistency. I think it's self-explanatory, but that's the number one thing. That's why, like, the fastest marathon runners are usually in their mid 30s or so and that's like the prime endurance age, based on what we know, because they've had so much time, so many years, of just being consistent and building up that endurance that's required for marathons. Uh, like, most younger people can't go run like a 215, 220 marathon, like it has to take them several years to build up to that, because it just requires that consistency, because it's such a slow process. Like there was one magical workout we could all do or one 16 week build that would just get us to whatever time we wanted. Like everybody would do that. But it takes stacking all that together over over a period of time.
Speaker 2:So, being consistent, I think, is far and away the number one thing.
Speaker 1:What do you think has made you so consistent, whereas most people really struggle with it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it's definitely a struggle every day, so you struggle with it too. I think everybody does. I don't know about you, though you might oh yeah for sure I do.
Speaker 2:I think, um, knowing your why is huge. Uh, I, I usually get up at like 6am every day, go run first thing in the morning and most days I don't really feel like getting out of bed and going outside and running. But I remember why I'm doing all this, why I run and that's a big part of it And's just my why is just to be the absolute best version of myself that I can be, and there's a lot of elements to that. But I know that laying in bed, sleeping in, skipping my run, is not gonna help me become the best version of myself so that's always like.
Speaker 2:The root of everything I do is like how do I live my life to be the absolute best version of myself? Cause I don't want to be 87 years old on my deathbed and be like dang. I left so much on the table.
Speaker 2:Like why didn't I do that? Why didn't I get up and run every day? Why didn't I run a marathon? I don't want to have those regrets, so that's a big part of it. For me is is finding that why and that's, I think, finding your why is a process Like you have to actively search for it and go through the motions and sign up for hard things and go do whatever it is that's going to allow you to find that out. And then once you really know what that is and maybe it's always changing, but once you have that idea in your head, I think it helps to be consistent and show up day in and day out and a lot of people they have kids or they have a spouse or they have some big goal they want to achieve and like that's the why in the back of their head to get up and do something every day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like that, and I think I've seen this illustration of your why being like an onion, and you like peel back the layers and it gets deeper and deeper, and I think it does shift and change from time to time, which is really good. So, um, so, be consistent, show up every day. So, jeremy, I'm running a couple miles every day. Now, what's important?
Speaker 2:I think changing the types of runs you're doing, um, for most people the 80, 20 rule is a pretty good approach. So about 80% of the time you spend running should be easy runs, and by easy runs I mean zone two heart rate runs. By zone two heart rate I mean the best way to do it is take your age and subtract it from 180. That's called the Maffetone method. So for me or let's just take a 30-year-old, for easy math 180 minus 30 is 150. You never want your heart rate on an easy run, a zone two run, to be above 150. You never want your heart rate on an easy run, a zone two run, to be above 150. And then usually you can subtract about 20 beats per minute. So probably one 30 to 150 is a pretty good range for zone two Um, and that's really the only heart rate zone I personally pay attention to Um, because every everything else is like I'm either running essentially roughly as hard as I can or running zone two, so that's when I pay attention to the most, and then the other 20%.
Speaker 2:So 80% of the time easy runs, 20% of the time is speed workouts, tempo runs, threshold runs, like all these different types of runs people have probably heard of, and that really the reason it's only 20% is because you can get a lot of stimulus out of it, like a lot of physical adaptations out of a very small amount of volume, and so you don't need to do like every run as hard as you possibly can, because, because they're so physically demanding, uh, it's also going to delay your recovery time, like it's going to cause injury if you overdo those two but you get a lot of adaptations through a very small amount of volume.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's good. So what, when are you doing that? 20%?
Speaker 2:So say you're running five days a week, I would run probably four days a week, easy, and then one day a week. Speed work can be on whatever day you want it want it to be. Most people do like tuesdays or wednesdays, and then a little bit longer run on saturdays and, uh, yeah, speed workout can be on a track. There's so many different ways to do it.
Speaker 2:You can do interval work, you can do threshold runs, you can do tempo runs um, I guess they're kind of the same thing, I guess. But yeah, and a lot of it just depends on what you're training for, like if it's a marathon specifically, yeah, uh, I like to, early on in the build, do more like interval work where it's like 800 meter repeats, uh, or mile repeats, things like that, where you're pushing for a few minutes at a time and then you rest a few minutes at a time rest and as you get closer to marathon day, you want to get a little bit more specific with your training, so doing more. Obviously, a marathon is 26 miles, it's very long, so you want to do more longer like tempo, threshold type runs where it's like five miles at this pace or eight miles at this pace.
Speaker 2:Longer intervals, yeah, or even doing like, like long run intervals is what I call them, or like marathon workouts.
Speaker 1:Yeah, talk about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, where you do so. Workouts where you talk about that, yeah, where you do so. This would like uh be on your Saturday long run, for example, and because these are so intense, you probably only do one to two of them a month. Uh, because they're just, they're really demanding on your body. So that would be. There's kind of two ways to go about it. One would be uh, intervals within the long run. So say you're running 20 miles. Within that you have five sets of three miles at your marathon pace with a mile rest. Three miles at marathon pace, mile rest. Do that like five times.
Speaker 2:Or you could do one of my favorite marathon predictor workouts is you'll run it'd be like 20 miles total. You'll do about 12 miles easy and then you do six miles at your marathon pace. So you've already run 12 miles. Your legs are tired. You're kind of in that like easy running cadence and then now you have to kick it up into gear into your marathon pace for six miles. That's a, that's a good tempo effort and then do like a two mile cool down and that's one of the best marathon predictor workouts you can do. I think if you can go and do that workout at your marathon pace. I think that's a. That's a pretty good indicator.
Speaker 1:You guys are getting some great stuff from Jeremy, because I haven't even heard that one from him.
Speaker 2:It was actually Coros wanted me to film a YouTube video doing a workout program by Des Linden. She's like the probably the best female American marathon runner. And that's one of her like specialty workouts. Oh, that's great, yeah, so it's 12 miles easy. Six miles of marathon pace, two miles easy.
Speaker 1:Okay, and you?
Speaker 2:do it all the way through unbroken.
Speaker 1:No rest or anything.
Speaker 2:Oh wow, it's a tough workout that does sound tough.
Speaker 1:rest or anything. Oh wow, it's a tough workout. That does sound tough. So yeah, just to sum this specific part up, say you're running five days a week. One of those days, on Tuesday or Wednesday, do a track workout where in the beginning of the block you're doing shorter intervals 400, 800 meter repeats or like mile repeats and then work your way up in the distance to you know longer intervals. And then you said one to two times a month you want to do like a longer run workout, marathon style workout, where you're doing on your long run intervals at your marathon pace.
Speaker 2:Precisely, precisely Beautiful. That's good, good summary.
Speaker 1:What else is important? So we got that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, obviously, the training is only one part of it. Nutrition, I would say, is one of the next biggest things. Okay, making sure that you're fueling before workouts, feeling during workouts, feeling after workouts. I'm not a nutritionist so I won't say too much on, like your daily diet, obviously that's important eating whole foods, a lot of meat, fruit, vegetables. Take your vitamins, things like that. Um, there's probably better people out there to talk about daily diets yeah, we'll bring on a nutritionist, make sure you're eating enough food on a daily basis, uh, and then feeling before workouts, we can start there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, for me personally, I usually don't fuel for any easy run under 90 minutes. Uh, just because our glycogen stores. Uh, glycogen is like the main fuel source for running. Or as you start running faster, uh, those don't really start to get depleted until past the 90 minute mark and so you don't really need to fuel before that. So, like most of the time, if you're running four to 10 miles on, like a weekday, usually don't have to feel for those. Some people choose to. Some people say it makes them feel better. That's a good point. Before I go too far into this, I think the number one thing with nutrition is just try everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, try feeling before workouts. Try fueling, try gels, try liquid calories, try solid foods and just see what works best for you, because everybody's so, so, different.
Speaker 1:Here's a great example of that real quick I'll just cut you off. You know, during marathon training and stuff, I think I was doing anywhere around like 40 to 60 grams of carbs per hour, 40 to 50 probably. And it's very interesting some research and specifically David Roach completing the Leadville 100 in like a record-breaking time. He also won heavily in 100. And I don't know the exact amount of carbs he was eating per hour, but it was something like 100 to 105 grams of carbs per hour. And there are studies coming out saying the more carbs per hour the faster. But at the same time, if you do too much and you're not trained for it, you're not prepared for it, you might have GI issues and GI issues are one of the number one causes of DNFs, especially in ultra marathons. So just a further you know evidence of try it out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they used to think, until like a couple of years ago, that you could only have 60 grams of carbs per hour, and and then last year it was like 90 grams of carbs per hour, and now I I think they're like we don't know if there's even a limit to how much you can have. Um, I mean, as long as you can stomach it and digest it, like, do as much as you can, essentially because it's not gonna hurt.
Speaker 2:Um, I have some numbers on how to like uh yeah, grab your notepad and jeremy's gonna rattle.
Speaker 1:There's a a lot of numbers here.
Speaker 2:So be prepared. So this would be before, say, like a speed workout or a long run workout, like one of those marathon workouts. So about 60 to 90 minutes before the run, I would consume about 0.5 to one gram of carb per pound of body weight. So, for easy math, if you're 180 pounds, one gram of carb per pound of body weight. So for easy math, if you're 180 pounds, one gram of carb per pound of body weight, that's 180 grams of carbs. Before your workout.
Speaker 2:Uh, and then uh for hydration. Hydration is also super important, obviously, with sodium. Um, I would do 18 milligrams of sodium per pound of body weight, so 18 times however many pounds you weigh, and that would be prior to the run and then during the run. Basically what you said. It's a range of like, at least I'd say, minimum 30 grams of carbs per hour, up to probably 90 is good for most people. So 30 to 90 grams of carbs per hour.
Speaker 2:And then if you need sodium during the run, obviously sodium is also very subjective depending on how salty your sweat is, how much you're sweating, but generally most people are good with 500 to 1500 milligrams of sodium per hour and that would be, I'd say, half a liter of water per hour at least. So, yeah, and like the sources of those carbs again, very subjective on what your stomach can handle, but for most people, uh, I recommend gels, one of the easiest ways to get carbs. Uh, liquid calories such as, uh like a Morton drink mix or a tailwind or something like that. Scratch nutrition, uh, like the basically it's just sugar, but they put it in uh like endurance form, I guess. It's just sugar but they put it in like endurance form, I guess. And then a lot of people will do like a Morton solid or a bagel or English muffin, something that's just very carb dense, whatever you can stomach.
Speaker 2:Yeah, basically. So that's before and during the run, and that you could take those same principles and apply them to race day, on marathon day or or even like a hundred miler or something. That's good. What are your favorite? Sources uh, for pre-run I prefer just liquid calories, so I'll do like a morton drink mix why, usually the 320.
Speaker 2:I just I have a hard time eating solid food because usually I'm running really early in the morning and, uh, my stomach is fine with it, but I just have a hard time like physically chewing it and swallowing it, like I can tell my body just doesn't really want it. So the liquid calories are so easy because you just drink it down and you're good to go. Also, do some of my applesauces occasionally. Applesauce is a great way. I know you use spring awesome sauce. I like that too.
Speaker 2:Morton, I think their whole lineup, they say, is all you need to fuel for a race or a workout. So the morton solids I'll do those occasionally if I want something solid. Otherwise I'll just do the drink mix and then the gels. The gels work amazing, the gel 160s, and so I'll do like a gel 160. Those have 80 grams of carbs, uh, or sorry, 40 grams of carbs in the gel 160s. So I'll do on race day. I'll do one of those gels every 30 minutes, basically okay. So that would put me at 80 grams of carbs per hour okay, yeah, that's good.
Speaker 1:So 80 grams of carbs per hour for the race.
Speaker 2:You're testing different gels amounts on track workouts and long runs, yeah, um yeah, use the workouts as like a dress rehearsal almost, or like a simulation of race day. Try different gels. I mean even like early in your prep, just order a bunch. If you can Just order a lot of places, have like sample boxes or something, just order a few gels from each place. Go to your running store, grab like an individual gel. See if it tastes good, see if your stomach handles it well.
Speaker 2:Just try a whole bunch of stuff and see if it works for you.
Speaker 1:That's good. So we talked about training, we talked about the fueling.
Speaker 2:And I'll say one more point for after the run. Yeah, I don't have specific numbers written down, but make sure you feel after the run too, both carbs and protein. Why? Because you've done this workout, you've depleted your stores, your muscles are all broken down. You want to get fuel both carbs and protein, protein into those muscles as fast as possible. So you could, you could do a drink mix after the run too, because it's quick, easy carbs. I think a lot of people forget about eating afterwards because you're tired, you're like, okay, the work's been done, but now you got to recover. So feeling yourself up after the run just as important.
Speaker 1:So even a protein shake, protein bar, whatever you can just easily get down really quickly that's really good and I think that's something that I've forgotten at times in my training, in that your recovery is actually when your body's creating the adaptations and recovering stronger than you were before the workout. But if you don't give it the time, the sleep, the fuel to recover, your body's not going to adapt to the training stimulus.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I guess recovery would be a good segue.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 2:And I've kind of devised all this into what I call the four pillars.
Speaker 1:The four pillars Of marathons.
Speaker 2:So we have training, we have nutrition. Recovery would be next. I mean I think that, like you kind of mentioned all those things there about recovery, nutrition is a big part of recovery and then sleep would probably be the next biggest thing. I think sleep is one of the best tools we have for all things in life. I'd say sleep at least seven to nine hours a night and just prioritize getting to bed at the same time every night.
Speaker 2:There's a whole, there's a million other podcasts about how to get better sleep, so don't go too far into that. But I think prioritizing sleep is huge. Like we were talking this morning on the way to our track workout, a lot of the professional athletes I've talked to they say they sleep like nine plus hours every single night. They sleep so much and it's they take naps and it's just such a big part of their routine. And I think, like you said, that's when your body's actually making those adaptations, is not necessarily while you're working out, but it's in the process afterwards. So I think sleep is huge and then obviously doing like saunas, cold plunges, foam rolling, all that good stuff.
Speaker 1:Do you have a specific routine you follow for sauna and cold plunge or just kind of get it in as much as you can?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think, just whenever you can. Again, there's probably a better podcast on that from like Huberman. There's Dr Susanna Soberg, I think is her name. She talks about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think Huberman said the most optimal amount of sauna per week is like 57 minutes and then 11 minutes in the cold.
Speaker 2:That sounds right. Yeah, I think I don't have a sauna here at my house, unfortunately, but anytime I do, I probably go to a gym and sauna like once or twice a week. So I probably hit that 60 minute mark generally and then, uh, yeah, I cold plunge most days and I just do like 90 to 120 seconds like pretty quick and honestly, I think I like the cold plunge most for the mental benefits. Yeah, because you're triggering that fight or flight response in your brain.
Speaker 1:Yes, which is only going to make your mind stronger every day. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, recovery. I think active recovery is a big thing too. A lot of people forget about is like a lot of elite athletes will like hop on a bike and cycle after a big workout or you know, afternoon after a big workout, uh, going for walks. That's free, you can do it anywhere. Just get out and go for like a 30, 45 minute walk is great Anything that's going to get your blood flowing, but not add too much impact to your body.
Speaker 1:Got it, hey. One question I forgot to ask you is how long do you think a marathon prep should be, how many weeks? And also, what kind of mileage are you trying to get in? Maybe, maybe, like for a beginner, but then, you know, give answers also for someone who's a little bit more experienced.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think obviously a lot of it depends on two things One, your experience and fitness level before starting the block and then two, what your goal is for the race. So say, you've never ran before in your life and you're just trying to complete a marathon, I think doing like 30 to 40 miles a week would be sufficient. If you've got some fitness and you're trying to break four hours, say, and you've maybe run like a half marathon or something, so you have some knowledge, I would say probably 40 miles, 40 to 50 would be more than enough. And then if you're trying to qualify for Boston, like run sub three or, or I guess now two, 55 and then three, 25, if you're a female, uh, you probably want to be at least 50 to 60 miles a week.
Speaker 2:And then if you're going any faster than that, like I know the Olympic trials qualifiers guys, they have to run like sub 217, I think, is the standard for that. So most of those guys do over 100 miles a week. Wow, yeah, and I think the females as well. I think females like 235 for the Olympic trial standards. So, yeah, um, very subjective to your fitness and like some I know some people who can run a sub three marathon off of like 40 miles a week. Yeah, and I know some people who they run like 80 miles a week, so it's really subjective.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want to emphasize that to this with all that. We say, like, test these things for yourself, because there's general guidelines that are a great starting point. But you see, different things happen in endurance sports. Like I think David Roach, when he won Leadville, was only doing like 60 to 70 miles a week. Yeah, when you would think, oh, you know, if he's so excellent, maybe he's doing more.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know, when I did my first marathon, when I ran three hours 54 seconds, I think my peak week was like 48 miles and most other weeks were probably like 30 to 35. So not that much volume. Um again, it's just very subjective. You got to try it out. See, like I know for myself, I start to really feel the mileage when I get above like 50, consistently, Um. But some people can just hammer out miles and have zero issues with it. So it's very subjective.
Speaker 1:Yeah, one thing that I feel like a lot of people experience are running injuries. So I want to talk about that for a little bit. Um, I think something that happens when you run more consistently and you do it over time and time again, you train for different races is you start to get this feel for your body and how it's responding to the training, and so if you're feeling super run down and you're like, hey, I need a little bit of rest, you'll just pull back a little bit to avoid an injury. Versus other times. Know, other times you can push it even more. That's just my take on it. But how do you go about like monitoring how your body's adapting to the training?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's you basically summed it up, and it's it's difficult, especially if you're a beginner, because you have no idea what it's supposed to feel like, and it's really hard to explain, I guess, um, just because it's so much of it is intuition and how you feel, and nobody else can tell you how you feel other than yourself, and so well, and you're battling this like, oh, I don't want to run feeling as well, yeah, so that's weighing on here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, obviously, like our brains play all the tricks on us to get us to not run. So it's like, oh, my knee's a little sore, but is it sore enough to not run or is it going to be okay? And so usually what I tell people is like if you a lot of times like we're kind of stiff in the mornings, or like our joints aren't warmed up and so we just don't feel great, like, go jog five, ten minutes, and if you don't feel better by then, then maybe just take the day off like if it's getting worse as you're warming up.
Speaker 2:Most of the times you're gonna feel better as you get into the run. Um, obviously, if you have that for like weeks and it's like, oh, this doesn't feel right, like it's, it's really sore every day, like just pull back probably. But, like for most people, I think a lot of soreness just comes from like not being warmed up. And once you get into like a five, 10 minute run by that by that point you're usually feeling okay, and if it's still lingering.
Speaker 2:After that probably pay more attention to it. But again it's hard because, like during a workout, everything kind of hurts.
Speaker 1:It's like nothing feels great.
Speaker 2:But there's a big difference between something like hurting and something being hurt like an injury, and I think, unfortunately, a lot of that intuition just comes with time and experience. Um, so yeah, I don't know if that's helpful or not, but yeah, well, just pay attention to your body.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about that a little bit more. Why do you think so? I saw a stat, and it was like maybe it's one from one of your like 80% of recreational runners get injured per year. Why do you think injuries are so high in running and how do you mitigate that?
Speaker 2:I think a lot of it is because most people that are running probably didn't grow up running or they didn't run cross country or track and field and they see somebody on the internet like, oh, they're running 60 miles a week. I should probably run 60 miles a week because I have the same goal as them, but if you're new to running like you probably shouldn't be doing that. So I think a lot of it is like you know, you take a 25 year old who's never really ran before and you throw them into a marathon prep running 60 miles a week, they're probably going to get injured because their body just is not used to it. So I think a lot of it's that just inexperience, trying to do too much too fast and then probably, uh, like what I did when I first started was just running way too hard all the time. I think if you're truly running at your easy zone to effort, you're going to reduce a lot of the risk of injury.
Speaker 1:Um.
Speaker 2:I think another element too is lack of cross training or lack of strength training. Like a lot of runners will only run.
Speaker 1:They don't do any other form of exercise, and I think that's a mistake.
Speaker 2:Uh, because strength training goes so far for for preventing injuries Like, uh, building up bone density is like one of the biggest benefits, preventing stress fractures, just building up stronger muscles, which then, as you do longer, longer runs, it's going to help prevent your form from breaking down, because usually when your form starts breaking down, you're hunched over, you're like not striding out how you should like. That's where running injuries can come from, because you start overusing muscles that you're not supposed to be using. Yeah, I think most running injuries. To sum it up, in one word is just overuse.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Like either you're undertrained, you're doing too much or you're not strong enough. Like you're not cross-training in some way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, too much, too fast or too much intensity.
Speaker 2:Yeah, some form of overusage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, now, one thing I've done, and I know you do, to help prevent injuries and strengthen your body bone density you mentioned a little bit is every day. I usually lift three to five times a week, depending on how much time I have and how I'm feeling.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, I think at least one leg day a week. Obviously that's going to be. The most important for runners is strength training. Getting in the gym. You don't have to do a ton of weight, you can just do body weight stuff. But doing movements that are going to build up stronger muscles, more muscular endurance, is obviously going to help for running, preventing those injuries too.
Speaker 2:And a typical leg day for me will look like some compound lift to start. So either back squats, front squats or deadlifts usually what I do. Then I'll do some single leg movements like Bulgarian split squats, lunges, box step ups, things like that that are loading and focusing on one leg at a time, because, if you think about it, when you're running you're never on two legs at the same time. You always have just one leg on the ground, all that force and your body weight on that one leg. So strength training, that same way balance, stability under load on one leg is, uh, is huge. So, uh, yeah, I I noticed the biggest improvements when I started doing more single leg stuff.
Speaker 2:Okay, and like very functional movements like bulgarian split squats, box step ups, those kind of things I mentioned. Uh, just because it's it's really good simulation for running and you don't need to do a a ton of reps and you do a ton of weight. I typically will do rep ranges of like four to eight Okay, and the weights obviously are subjective. But like I'll get to the point where by that seventh or eighth rep of a set like I start to lose my form just a little bit. But I can still get through with good form, but it's, I can tell. If I did another rep, rep or two, I probably wouldn't be able to maintain that good form.
Speaker 1:So that's a good explanation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's kind of how I go about choosing what weights yeah, how?
Speaker 1:how many sets are you doing and how many exercises typically?
Speaker 2:uh, for the compound movements, so like deadlifts or squats, is usually five sets, and then for the single leg kind of accessory movements, it's usually like three to four sets and then again usually like four to eight reps of each yeah yeah, so all this is very subjective. Again, that's should be like.
Speaker 2:One big takeaway from this whole podcast is like use this all as a baseline yeah try it out for yourself, see how you feel and then adapt and see where you see the most benefits for yourself. Yeah, exactly, and that's what? Then adapt and see where you see the most benefits for yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, and that's what I want to do through this episode is just give you the elements of what makes a faster marathon time, the pillars, so to speak, like you're mentioning, so that you can adapt these and speed up your process faster, because I think that's one of the greatest keys to speed up and how I was able to go from marathon to ultras and then 100-mile races, 200-mile races is having that knowledge of a coach or content and then just being like, oh, they know what they're talking about, I'm going to do what they do or what they say, and test it and make adjustments and keep moving forward.
Speaker 2:Beautifully said, that was perfect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what are we missing about marathon training? Is there anything? We talked about the actual training, we talked about fueling, we talked about injuries, strength training and I think too. I mean, I was just talking to someone at the run club this morning and he's like I added one day of strength training per week and I felt like my legs towards the end of my long runs before I added strength training, my legs towards the end of my long runs were just dead. Now I feel like they have so much more strength. So even just one day, this will be an action step from the podcast, even if it's just one day, add one day of strength training, pick four of those exercises, five of those exercises Jeremy talks about, and go get a 30, 45 minute workout in. So that's a big thing. But what are we missing? Anything else?
Speaker 2:Um no, I love hearing that, though. That's cool. I think, uh, I think runners are definitely coming around to doing more strength training and cross training, for whatever reason. I feel like a lot of runners are afraid that if they lift they're going to get big and bulky and like put on too much weight and be slower. But like you can lift without trust me. I've been trying to get big my whole life and it ain't happening. Like you can lift all you want.
Speaker 1:I can relate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so, um, just depends on how you go about it, uh and, and what stimulus you're providing your body. So if you do it intentionally, I think you can. You can get stronger without putting on size and hindering your running. If anything, it's, I think, going to help you running before it hurts it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure, let's talk about gear a little bit. Do running shoes make?
Speaker 2:you faster. What kind of gear are we talking?
Speaker 1:about Do carbon plated shoes actually make you Jeez?
Speaker 2:Not that gear yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, not that one. We see where your head's at, jeremy. Do running shoes, make you faster.
Speaker 2:Oh, good question. The super shoes? Yes, definitely. How much faster? I mean based on what Nike says, like 4%, and that's why they call the shoes the next or what is it the 4% or next percent whatever? And that's why they call the shoes the next, or what is the 4% or next percent whatever. Because in their studies they did it showed that runners on average ran 4% faster. Some people were six, some people were two, but on average it was 4%. So, yeah, I mean, your like everyday easy run shoe probably isn't going to make you much faster, but there's a reason everybody wears the super shoes, the carbon plates yeah the foam like, and it's noticeable if you, if you've never worn a pair, and you go put a pair on yeah like you know, you're running faster.
Speaker 2:The, the energy return and the foam and how lightweight the shoes are. It's like, it's crazy, like it dude. Those pumas with the like basically spring built in are insane. They're heavy but you feel like you're just bounding on like a trampoline or something. The shoe technology is crazy. So uh yeah, with shoes, that's a huge question I always get from everybody and I give them. The answer They've don't want to hear is like go to a shoe store, try on a bunch, see what fits best for you.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think if you are wearing a super shoe whether it's Nike, adidas, puma, new balance, whatever, like it's fine, it's good. They're all going to be very comparable to each other, so as long as you're wearing a super shoe. I think you'll be good. That's good Um and that's only a good point. Don't wear that every day.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Save it for workouts.
Speaker 1:Don't. Don't wear them around town when you're just walking around. Don't wear your super shoes.
Speaker 2:Don't go to the gym in them, just uh, save them for your big workouts and uh and race day yeah, for sure I.
Speaker 1:I remember, because for trail races nobody wears like a carbon plated shoe really, or at least from what I've seen so far more people are now yeah, it's interesting, but anyway, I I came from trail running and I was like getting ready for this marathon.
Speaker 1:And jeremy's like, do you have, do you have good shoes? He's like, oh they're, they're gonna make a difference. And I got a pair and, yes, they made a difference. You can even feel just walking around in them, yeah, like the spring and how. Because there's a carbon plate inside of them and so that carbon plate, when it bends, it snaps back and propels your, your, your foot forward. From what I understand, Pretty much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's like a spring in there. Essentially, yeah, it's a the shoe technology is crazy. It's interesting, like I'm excited to see where it goes, because obviously it's only going to continue to get better, faster, lighter, like better foam, all that stuff, more bouncy. But I do question, like where they'll draw the line, or if they ever will draw the line.
Speaker 1:Okay, but I do question like where they'll draw the line or if they ever will draw the line.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, like we got to, this is too much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what's the fastest shoe?
Speaker 2:What do you like the most?
Speaker 1:My Fastest or most mix of most comfortable, I mean I ran my fastest marathon in the Saucony Endorphin Elite. Okay, that's what you wore, I think for Jersey City yeah.
Speaker 2:Those are great shoes. This year, when I did like the sub three marathons in three weeks, my favorite shoe I wore was the Alpha Fly.
Speaker 2:Okay, alpha Fly 3s, so loud they're so loud it sounds like a horse running down the road. Yeah, I haven't ran a marathon in the Pumas. I did a half marathon in the crazy fast RB. They're illegal technically. I don't know if I'd run a marathon in those, and those shoes are not really meant for like racing. They're kind of more of just like a marketing gimmick sort of, but I thought it'd be fun to race in them. But the other Puma shoes, the Nitro Elites I want to run a marathon in those potentially. And I think at the New York City Marathon I't remember the stats, but it was like the like five out of eight runners were wearing those pumas. At new york city, I think the girl that won, wow uh, was wearing puma. So I don't know. Um, I'm interested in those there's I mean, there's so many cool shoes out there.
Speaker 1:yeah, okay, here's a question. So many people train for a race and then it's like I train for my, now it's time to enjoy life again, and they kind of like fall off the wagon and then they wait maybe a couple of weeks, a couple of months, and they get back on and train. It seems like to me what has made you keep coming back to race after race and just keep growing and, you know, getting faster, pushing the boundaries. What keeps you coming back?
Speaker 2:That's a great question, and so I'm racing High Rocks Dallas this weekend and we're going to shoot a video for it, and the whole concept of the video is that exactly of like this idea that fitness in general is this never-ending pursuit of just making yourself better, challenging yourself, following your curiosity and that's what it always has been for me is just, I love fitness because it's a tangible way to watch yourself grow and make progress, and whether it's a marathon, or a hundred miler or a high rocks or a CrossFit, whatever it is like it's.
Speaker 2:I love challenging myself and seeing how I can grow and how I can learn, and it's it's just such a tangible way to do that and so that's how I've always thought about fitness is like there is there, literally is no finish line. Like I could always run a faster marathon, I could always run a further distance, could sign sign up for a new sport, like high rocks. There's always going to be some way I can continuously challenge myself and I want to do that forever as long as I can, because it's like this metaphor for life there really is no finish line. You just have to keep at it and keep doing it.
Speaker 2:I see a lot of people with weight loss journeys. I've never been overweight, so I can't fully relate with like weight loss journeys. I've never been overweight, so I can't fully relate. But I see it where like they'll lose. I guess I saw with my mom like she lost a lot of weight and like gained it back and would lose it and gain it back and all this stuff. And it's like when you set these goals and then it's like for some reason, your mindset is like okay, I did that goal. Now I can relax. It's and relax it's. Like you get complacent because you hit that goal.
Speaker 2:You feel good about it and then over time, you lose that habits that you built, you lose that consistency you built, and then you're just right back where you started. Yeah, so it's like it can kind of be exhausting to like always have to be doing something. But I like to go through, uh, like periods of training and like I'll take some off seasons, I'll do some periods where, like, I'll still do races and travel and do all this stuff, but I don't have any goals for myself. I'm just like, okay, I'm just gonna run this marathon and know that it's not gonna be uh, should we clean that up?
Speaker 1:no, we're good, we'll be done okay, I spilled the coffee it'll stain the table it'll be no in like a good way. Oh okay, stain memories stain the wood that's how you stain wood right. Spill coffee on it.
Speaker 2:It's a good finish, lacquer. Yeah, I think treating fitness like this kind of never-ending journey basically is my answer.
Speaker 1:I love that. Yeah, and it seems like you make it more about who you become in the process rather than the goal itself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's not about the times and the well. This guy ran this time, so I got to run this time, like. I don't care, I just want to challenge myself and if I'm curious, like next summer I'm going to do this like mountaineering adventure, like I've never summited a mountain and like gone across glaciers and all this stuff, but it seems so fascinating and like a new way to challenge myself.
Speaker 1:So I want to do that and I just oh, dude, I gotta connect you with this guy who helped, uh, mike posner um summit everest. He like trained mike to summit everest. I met him at running man, but yeah, so anyway, that's really cool. Now I want to finish it up. What advice would you give someone to running a faster marathon, whether it be like tactically or just like a mental piece of advice, and think through encouraging yourself as you were starting your running journey yourself as you were starting your running journey.
Speaker 2:Well, basically, what would I tell Jeremy in 2018?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:If he was trying to run his first marathon One, I would say listen to this podcast, because there's a lot of good information in here. Second, I would say I mean I already talked about it so much, but just being consistent. Like you don't have to go crush a workout every day, you don't have to go run 10 miles, you don't have to do like, do all this crazy stuff with you see on Instagram, it's just like just run four miles a day, nice and easy, it takes 35 minutes. Like you don't have to be a hero every day, just show up, do the boring work, be consistent, trust that process and I think you'll see massive results from that.
Speaker 2:Just a little bit of consistency goes such a long way, um, that that's probably the number one thing I'd tell people is like, don't try to be some like big hero hotshot guy and like I gotta go crush this track workout and post about it. Like Like, just do the boring consistent stuff. Yeah, that's like the number one thing, and it's the most unglamorous answer ever, but that's what gets you to those real results is just do the boring stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's reassuring too, like, oh, I don't have to go and do anything crazy, it's just I get to show up every day. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I think it makes it a lot less intimidating, because you hear all these like numbers and workouts and all this stuff we just talked about. It's like holy crap, where do I start? But just like, just start doing little stuff every day, yeah, and we improve from there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, with that, I'll encourage you listening. Just take one piece from this episode and optimize it and just tweak and realize and reflect on how it's impacting you. I think some of the fun parts about this is you get to almost consider yourself like an experiment and you're testing these different things and figuring out what works and what doesn't. But yeah, jeremy, thank you so much for coming on the show. Really appreciate your wisdom for everyone listening. Jeremy has an amazing YouTube channel where he documents his life, as well as workouts and training and all of those things. He also has a podcast and a great Instagram feed with very helpful tips. But, jeremy, where do you like people to connect with you?
Speaker 2:I've got my website jeremymillerio. I have all my links there. Instagram is where I post the most updates on a daily basis. That's just. Jeremy Miller should be able to find me through their YouTube. Also, jeremy Miller tick tock. If you're on the clock app, is Jeremy Miller fit? I believe I don't do a lot of tick tock. I don't, I don't know, I don't know about tick tock these days, but podcast is the Jeremy Miller podcast.
Speaker 2:And yeah we've also got tons of content with your own Piercy Xiao on there. So lots of YouTube videos. We've done together lots of podcasts. You're like a five-time podcaster on mine? Five-time guest.
Speaker 1:It's funny because I was at this run club with him this morning and there were a couple of people that were like, oh, I've seen you through Jeremy's content.
Speaker 2:Yeah, dude, you're everybody's favorite guest.
Speaker 1:Let's go Also let me know if you want me to have Jeremy back and what questions you have for him next time. So thank you for listening. Anything else, jeremy?
Speaker 2:Run your race.
Speaker 1:Go out and run your race. Thank you, guys for listening, see ya.
Speaker 2:Bye-bye.