Property AI Report 080 - Winkworth Wounded, More AI Moolah & Scorsese Slammed

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Property and AI News
01:02 Challenges in the Property Industry
03:56 AI in Property Marketing: The Winkworth Case
08:47 eXp's Growth and Milestones
09:49 AI Funding and Market Dynamics
18:23 Apple's Upcoming AI Developments
21:45 OpenAI's Hardware Innovations
23:45 AI in Filmmaking: Martin Scorsese's Use of AI
28:39 Microsoft's New AI Tools

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hi everybody and welcome to the Property AI Report. This is your weekly digest of all things property and AI, brought to you by me, Mal McCallum, and my good friend and co-host Matt Goddard. Matt, how are you this sunny Friday? It's Friday again, Mal. I'm great. Whereabouts in the world are you? I am in glamorous Plymouth today. I've had a very nice little run along the seafront. Um, yeah, no, it's beautiful. Very, very nice. Are you looking out over that home at the moment? I am indeed. Yes, I can see Smeaton's Tower off there in the distance. So, yes, very, very lovely. And uh great place to uh to be chatting about this week's uh events in property and AI. So, um yeah, let us crack on with our property news. All right, uh big news this week, all about firms facing some financial challenges. Again, just to kind of set the table on this one, there's been a lot of talk about um how estates and lettings agents and indeed construction firms and other property firms have been faring over the last year or so. Um, and this is a report uh from Menzi's LLPs. Uh it's called Fixing the Foundations, um, based on a survey of 250 senior decision makers from UK construction and property businesses, painting a picture of an industry grappling with rising costs, squeeze margins, and persistent payment delays. It does kind of set the scene that that you know, for smaller businesses, particularly those that are dependent on, you know, some of the utilities and the fact that the costs are going up quite significantly from a personnel perspective as well as from petrol and so on. This is causing some significant problems in and around the the industry. Um, Matt, have you come across anybody indicating that they've they've got some some issues around this?

SPEAKER_01 1:28

Definitely in terms of costs and needing to sort of tighten belts, not just sort of looking to invest and and grow. Um there's definitely is a sort of a um a lot of companies going through difficult times and having to make considerations around potential redundancies and such like there's a lot of companies who are really positive and making big steps forward as well, right? But there's it's not to say it's all sunshine out there. This report definitely echoes that.

SPEAKER_00 1:54

Yeah, and and I do think you know, well, I think generally we are quite a positive industry, right? You know, even in kind of downturn, do you hear people who are just still like, it's gonna be okay, it's gonna be fine. But yeah, I do worry, and you know, obviously I'm out on my tour right now, and I think completed number four yesterday, so we've got five this morning in Plymouth of the 40 that I'm doing. And and yeah, you you kind of do sort of speak to to agents who you're not quite putting on a brave face, but you know, clearly I I think the market is has been tough this year. I think, you know, obviously just as there were the the green shoots of uh something quite exciting happening potentially through 26, we had the um you know Trump launching his war on on Iran, and that just seems to have sort of set a bit of a a bit of a holdback on the market for the first part of the first half of this year almost. So yeah, I I I think that there are you know, as I say, that there's a lot of a kind of brave face being put on the the current situation and and people making ends meet, and as you say, kind of you know, maybe not making that higher, uh, maybe you know not kind of expanding as as they might have been planning to do this year, alongside those that are, you know, genuinely doing doing very, very well. And and again, maybe it's the the kind of um the world that we operate in, but they tend to be the ones that maybe we we end up speaking to because that they are embracing technology, they are looking at you know ways of of doing things better, faster, um using using tech. And and you know, again, for those out there that that aren't playing around with some AI, playing around with some AI, you'll be able to find some some ways that it can help. Um but yeah, no, I just thought it was it was quite a um quite a telling and quite a punchy um report uh on um yeah, the kind of state of uh state of the nation, state of the industry, and just kind of bringing bringing home just how kind of challenging it is for a lot of businesses out there right now. So if you are feeling the pinch, um you're not alone. But yeah, that kind of um the overriding thing, and hopefully what you'll get from from listening to us every week is there are some really, really good systems out there that are going to be able to help you, and and there are people out there who can help you as well. All right, next story in property uh news. We um wanted to just have a little look at how to a company that's been using AI and not perhaps in the best way. So there's been a report basically on Winkworth. So Winkworth's got over a hundred, I think actually maybe over two hundred franchises, franchisees in the the UK and elsewhere. And uh they've been using some AI to uh virtually stage some properties. And it's particularly seems to be the one particular uh branch, which is tooting, that has been um caught by the Times, uh basically uh who uh interviewed a couple who viewed a home in tooting uh that was markedly different from how it appeared in the images. So, Matt, obviously this is something that we know very well in terms of virtual staging, in terms of the power of AI. What's your take on this story?

SPEAKER_01 4:23

It's not even really necessarily virtual staging, is it? Like um you could argue that staging in general is maybe misleading people. And like I know in this particular one, I think there was a mention that a chimney breast had been removed and the rooms looked larger than they did do. But if you you look and sometimes with a fisheye lens on an agency photograph's property rooms look bigger than they are, and if you manage to scrabble up on a stool and into the back corner of a particular room, you can make it look a heck of a lot bigger than it maybe feels in person. I think maybe a part of this is just that that reaction. And I've got a bit of history with the times, so I do feel that sometimes they're obviously a bit more trying to grab clickbait headlines around things, and but and we'll park that that for one moment. Um You can't leave us in that suspense. It could easily have been um it could easily have been, yeah, it's the first time probably these things come up, but if if we'd had the opportunity to just say, look, we could have virtually uh staged it, we could have normally staged it, and the people may well have then been commenting that hold on, I bought the house and the it wasn't as great as as all that furniture they put in. You know, we were with Lemon and Lime Interiors, weren't we, the other week? And some of the the over um makeovers they do with with their uh their work is absolutely stunning and um it really sets people in the right frame of mind. And that's part of the art of the estate agency, isn't it? Makes people realise just what is possible with the space that they're they're looking around rather than all on it's uh it's a bit yellow. It I won't say what Elaine said actually. Well I don't know who did. You smell the cat pee coming off the photo sometimes. Like you need part of that to to engage people, don't you? And I think maybe this is just that first opportunity to have a dig in the ribs of the the agents who are trying to trying to make most of the new technologies.

SPEAKER_00 5:59

Yeah, I I I think you're right. There is it's the line, isn't it? Where is that line between actually kind of showcasing something that is completely different? I think I remember, you know, again, that they they periodically come up now, these stories. There was one agent who like basically removed a shop from next door. So just showed the house when you're gonna have to.

SPEAKER_01 6:14

Get rid of the M25 on your doorstep or move the nerve circular.

SPEAKER_00 6:19

Yeah, exactly. So, you know, I I think that there are the the I think the history of a state agency, if you go back to the dawn of time, has probably been, you know, just making things look a little bit better than they might actually be in real in real but but you know, that's that's the sales process, and you could argue that in any you know consumer environment where people are looking to buy them, perhaps you know, they might, you know, that that that McDonald's burger may may not actually look quite as appetizing when it comes out from the from the kitchen. But uh but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

Why did you pick on McDonald's? Like was Burger King?

SPEAKER_00 6:45

Are they better than you know? Well, my son has just got a job in McDonald's, and that's why it's fragment of mind. Fair enough. As it did, he's he's he's studying for his A level, so he's just got a part-time job there. So anyway, digressing slightly, I'm I am gonna find out what that time story is for it from you. Um and then I'll I'll tell people later on. I'll put it in the newsletter or something. Um, it's a reason to come to the roadshow, is it, Mal? That's right. Dangling the secret story from Matt Godhardt. But yeah, look, we do virtual staging a lot for loads and loads and loads of agents. Um, and it is um it's it's it's an art. You have to make sure obviously that there is it it is it it it bears resemblance to to what is there. You know, we we we spend a long time uh with with the tech making sure that there's you know that the the structure is correct. So yeah, we actually have a kind of AI architect, we've got an AI photographer, we've got uh various um AIs performing different functions within within that process. Um and yes, if you do kind of just sort of um ask it to produce something, then it can be quite um quite wild, and you you may not actually be able to spot what is what's missing, you know. So actually it's put another window in that wall, and you're just like, oh right, and and you know, if you put that out, then that that's problematic. Um but yeah, I think just like with any new technology, with any kind of uh you know an enthusiastic use, there's there's there's lessons to be learned, there's the there's traps to to fall into. But uh but yeah, I do think it's um it seems quite unfortunate that this particular agent has been hammered quite so much as a result. But yeah, and and obviously, you know, I think that wink with franchising it that head officers kind of just you know put uh put some guardrails in place, I think, for future use of it. Um but yes, it's um it is something that uh that I think people need to be kind of just mindful that they need these things do need to be checked before they're going to go out because they can be um very yes, there they're there there are risks to it unless you use uh the very kind of skilled essential operators uh who who kind of know what they're doing. So that's our second story in uh our property news. Um third up, um kind of um been torn a little bit on this one. So so we've got exp um who've passed a thousand agent milestones. So I mean that's a lot, right? They've done pretty well since 2015.

SPEAKER_01 8:42

I feel like when we start when we started talking through this, and we could probably flick back through the show notes, but um, I think it was around about five, six hundred this time last year or early last year when we started doing these, the rate at which it's grown, and obviously it's um the nature of the business is that you can sort of um it almost compounds, doesn't it, as they get people into to the network. But even so, it's it's one of those things where I think uh maybe an hour we've hit a thousand, we'll stop shouting out every time um unless we're scrambling around for new news on the show. But it's very uh it was great to see that it's uh obviously Adam Day and the team there keep keep growing it, and they do have some really strong agents in that network.

SPEAKER_00 9:18

Yeah, 100%. So yeah, and yeah, just a huge congrats to them. They've kind of obviously built from pretty much nothing seven, six, seven years ago, and uh have done incredibly well. And yeah, I like you, I know a lot of great agents who uh who are part of that network. And yeah, it just keeps going from from strength to strength. So well done to Adam Day and uh and Co. All right. Next up we want to move into our AI and tech news. All right, so the big stories around AI and tech news this week has all been about money, money, money, money, money. So Anthropic is sort of the big beast now, and it's it's it's fascinating and really impressive to see how they have grown, particularly over the last sort of six to eight months, into essentially the the kind of dominant player in this particular space, overtaking open AI. So the the news this week is that they've raised another sixty-five billion dollars and they are nearing the one trillion valuation um ahead of an expected IPO. So yeah, that this is just gonna kind of keep uh keep building, I think, isn't it? Because you know, the the raising raising sixty five billion is is is insane. You know, and again I keep going back to I think that the largest IPO up to this point was raised like 24 billion, and everyone was like, that's amazing. And this is private funding, 65 billion, with a view to IPOing, valuing the business at something like you know, over a trillion dollars. I mean, this is this is incredible, right, man?

SPEAKER_01 10:36

There's some amazing figures floating around like with the the conversation we had right at the start about the the gloom surrounding the sector and people having to cost uh cost cuts, um, you know, it it sort of just becomes a bit disconnected from reality, but it's it's not just them, is it? Uh Alphabet, the parent company of Google are talking about raising 80 billion to fund their AI build out. Um we've got uh obviously this is uh talking about SpaceX, talking about OpenAI. Interestingly, OpenAI, um OpenAI this yesterday, I think it was they announced that they've hit a billion active users worldwide, so they're they're sort of flying again, um, and and that's being driven, I expect, um, by Codex. We also said, you know, I think it's some of that 85% of the users are on the free models. A lot of the time we're talking about the the bleeding edge stuff, and actually most people are using those free models that are maybe six months behind in terms of the releases, but um, even so it's there's there's a lot of lot of cash flowing around there. Um and it's just there is there is a concern when we talk about it off off air, uh, was that um we we we tried before about token maxim and sort of token leaderboards as a way of sort of trying to force even development teams into utilising uh agentic coding specifically to really sort of get people into it where maybe they've been a bit reticent. And I've even this week I've been with development teams who have not using it and and some people who didn't even know what Codex was as opposed to clawed code. So it's it's like you you mentioned it offline as well about Jeffin's paradox that actually people are now getting to that stage where we were maybe six months or a year ago and lit really starting to do these things. But actually companies who are like Uber have put in a uh a limit on their token span now, Walmart have have also done it um where there's been a backlash this week around GitHub moving to a token-based model, but it's it's getting to that stage where people are now actually looking not at the efficiencies of the tokens. So when we say you know the new model from OpenAI, ChatGPT is the best, is it the best in terms of actually token consumption? Because everyone's gonna start looking at how much is it actually costing me in real money? Um, even this morning, my my claude's already sat at 95% of the consumption for the day and it's 8.09 on a Friday morning.

SPEAKER_00 12:50

Yeah, no, it is crazy because it it is so easy to for for that to just expand and bloat out. And you're right, you know, actually, yeah, it's gonna be much more important to have efficiency, but then you know, the models themselves, it's it's almost like it it's dependent on on them as well, right? So it's a two-way street. You've got the prompting side of things. So if your prompts are not good enough or specific enough, then you have to have like two or three go-rounds before you actually get what you want. Um, but at the same time, you know, if the model is not intelligent enough to actually understand what you're trying to get at, then again, you're gonna get around two or three times more than you you would otherwise. So it's gonna be really, really interesting to see how all of this kind of plays out. And then and into this as well comes you know the open source models. And there's there's news this week of Gemma 4 from Google, which is their kind of you know, almost on device, kind of, you know, put put on a laptop and it's and it's it'll just work for you. Um and I think that's gonna become much more of a feature in the um in the climate as we go through, because as you say, you know, people are quite comfortable using the free versions, which don't have the power of the the bleeding edge ones that you know perhaps are being more used by by those at the on the frontier. And actually, if you can use Deep Seek or if you can use Gemma and you can use, you know, even one of the old Lama models, and and it's it's free and you can kind of just keep going back to it, then is the increased the the significantly increased cost of using these cutting edge models going to actually force people to to just kind of look at uh having these on on-site models rather than necessarily going to to to everything that's kind of coming out of the labs right now. And and then what does that mean for the IPOs? You know, we again we were talking offline, weren't we, about uh actually are we gonna hit is is this kind of peak? You know, because everybody's kind of trying to use all the the the cutting edge models, but you know, GitHub, as you say, Copilot, that's now metered. So, you know, it's consumption based rather than just a subscription-based. Um and that's gonna make people at least think because you know, again, you've read the stories, I read the stories, people going from like paying 29 quid a month to paying £3,000 a month, and it's like that's that's not something you can really kind of um play for in a in an SME budget. Other things, you know, that's I'm I'm on the tour, this is the third tour that I've done six months ago, speaking to agents, you know, that they weren't you know that they were only just kind of getting their heads around sort of Chat GPT, a lot of them. And now we're I I'm seeing you know them far more educated about what actually you know AI can do, and then and and many more of them are using these tools uh in their day-to-day. So yeah, I think it's it is that that there's growth, but I don't think it's gonna be kind of um as steady kind of you know, everybody rushing towards the the frontier ones. I think there's gonna be a lot of um a lot of people looking at some of the older models and thinking that they're good enough, right?

SPEAKER_01 15:25

I I also um I believe it's actually and I say believe it rather than the same thing, but it's that's the enterprises, they're the ones who are driving this and they're the ones who are are burning through the most tokens, right? So we talk about Uber and we talk about Walmart, you know, they're the ones who have got the most spend going through Anthropic rather than through OpenAI. And it's also those guys who've starting to drive line items for AI usage in their in their PLs and and sort of making sure that those things are planned out and and you we will get to that stage. And you said about it needs to be the models that are efficient, but I think it's really important people start to think about it not just the models but also the harnesses that you use those models in. And by harness I mean codex or clawed code or clawed cowork, because it's becoming as as important to see the releases of the harnesses as it is to see actually what's coming out of the models and and cleverly and and as guess as you'd expect, the anthropic made a move whereby you didn't pay as much for your usage if you're using clawed code or cloud clawed cowork as if if you would do like you had where you were you were plugging clawed into your open claw and therefore you're actually having to pay per token, right? So it's it's shifting back, I think, towards a world where you don't think about the models as much as what is the application on my desktop machine or my laptop that I'm used, excuse me, using those things for.

SPEAKER_00 16:42

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the ecosystem is is maturing kind of gradually. But yes, it as you say, it's kind of going to be increasingly important to look at your stack, essentially. So actually, you know, well, what's the model underneath, what's the harness that goes over the top, and what are you prompting, you know, at the at the human end? Or were you you and your team prompting at the human end? And I think all of those, the the skills of building those and and running those, I think is going to be the almost the the kind of software developer of the future, right? It's it's that that's gonna be the highly prized kind of um job.

SPEAKER_01 17:10

I don't think even software developer, it's a it's a bit of a I won't use that word, gimmicky phrase, but it's the the knowledge worker. Yeah, it's if you get up in the morning and it scanned your emails and looked at your appointments and seen the tasks that you didn't fill out. And that's the point of codecs and co-work, isn't it? It's not just your coder tasks, it's the the dull admin that you don't get round to doing because you're driving back from Portsmouth Ho or wherever you are.

SPEAKER_00 17:32

Yeah, Plymouth, sorry. Yeah, no, so so yeah, I I think that there's as as you say, that there's so much money kind of sloshing around in here. We also got Deep Seek at uh one of the the Chinese models eyeing 7.4 billion funding round, valuing up to 59 billion. So, you know, it it's it that there is there is a lot of land grab going on kind of behind the scenes, and yet as it kind of bursts out onto the public markets as it will do um in the coming months, I think it's going to be interesting to see what the appetite of the kind of general investor is is is going to be for any of these or all of these, you know, with OpenAI kind of coming on later on in the year as well. So we will keep you up to date with all of those as they kind of come through. Also, we will keep you up to date with um next week, Apple has their own developer conference. You're excited, aren't you? I am, you know, and and and only because only because I I'm obviously a stupid fanboy of of Apple. Um I have but the the my my iPhone and Siri on my iPhone has long been the kind of the poor relation to to all of the other stuff that I'm doing. But the news is that um the with Google Gemini now underpinning Siri, that there's actually going to be a really big uh kind of announcement about how Siri is going to operate going forward. And I think that's gonna be a really I think it's gonna be a step change. I think that the that suddenly the general public are going to be using Siri and instead of just using it for you know timing the cookers and you know asking what the weather is, actually going to find that it's really intelligent. And I think that is actually gonna supercharge a lot of what of of of people's understanding of AI. And I think it's it's gonna be you know pretty huge now. Let's you know, always always look at previously Apple Intelligence were about three years ago with such a damp, damp squib that it just kind of you know ruined it for for a few years. Um but yeah, I it if it comes off the way that it should come off, and it should have done three years ago, um I think it's gonna be really excited. Are you not excited?

SPEAKER_01 19:25

It's uh as the tagline sounds like it's gonna be all systems glow, which is a bit of a uh nod to the liquid glass um side of things, isn't it? But um I think obviously they've got a huge distribution network. I had I was really lucky to spend um uh a day earlier this week prospect state agency ever in Berkshire, and we had all of their senior managers and through the through the uh Reading office during the course of the day. And I think only one person had an Android uh phone and they were sort of heckled out the room. So it's um the uh um like that distribution, as they pull it off, amazing. Um and it's the the approach that they're they're looking to take is the the BYO approach, isn't it? Like you have ChatGPT or Claude, whichever account that you're using on top of, or in addition to them obviously using those Gemini models.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

As as default, exactly that. So yeah, so so you can bring your your your other stuff and your history and the memory and all that sort of stuff into into play as well. But but I just think for for for people who have just kind of like known about AI, kind of thought it's probably something they'll get round to at some stage, to to have that just in your pocket and able to just operate and you know, sitting in the car and chatting with it and all that sort of stuff, I think is just gonna be the I I think it's just gonna light a fire underneath. I just think people are gonna suddenly, you know, that understand a lot more about AI, and I think that's gonna be great for for everybody.

SPEAKER_01 20:40

So that's the 8th of June, Mal. So is that factored into your 40-day roadshow? Are you nipping on a flight, heading over and then flying back again?

SPEAKER_00 20:48

Just sitting very still and not doing uh anything. No, I will be out on the road then as well. Where am I gonna be? Um I think I'm in Doncaster on the 8th of Justin.

SPEAKER_01 20:57

There you go, 6 p.m. on in Donny. Just held down.

SPEAKER_00 21:02

Yeah, understanding. Yes. When I was doing the um the videos, I think you'd probably see the videos on LinkedIn for Donnie. For some reason, it was very obsessed with kind of horse-drawn carts and things like that around the market. So that's what's in the uh the AI video for that one. Anyway, so so that's Apple next week. Um again, you will undoubtedly get an update from us as to uh how it's gone next week. More AI uh news. Open AI has made um another hardware move with the acquisition of Opal Electronics, and that is a business that focuses very much on kind of cutting-edge cameras. So we have spoken before, you know, and Johnny Ive, designer of the iPhone, um, is now part of uh his his business is now part of OpenAI and helping them to develop some hardware. We think that it's going to be something that is some kind of like um little gadget, whether it's the in device or you know, they're talking about pins and things like that, with with the ability to listen and also to see. So this kind of uh this kind of makes sense, this acquisition, in terms of um being able to to to put very, very, very tiny, tiny cameras into very small objects. And Matt, are you as stupidly excited as I am about things hardware?

SPEAKER_01 22:09

I just I just waggled my applaud at you while you were talking, but I think you were off looking at something else. But um it ties in with Sam Altman's excuse me intended vision for um ambient computing, doesn't it? Sitting there lurking in the background, knowing contextually everything that's going on and and those people who don't watch our podcasts, you know, even as we talk there's little tells and gives and and such like that you might not pick up if you were just purely listening to the transcripts and and that's sort of where these cameras are going to start kicking in, aren't they? And um sort of uh adding to the context that these models work with. And it works well because obviously OpenAI's got a lot of these image video and real-time voice voice model foundations. Whether he's pulling it all together or it's just then a bit more cash um continues from that point of view, doesn't it? So uh it would be great to see something get out the door and it not just be a puck or a an a um pencil or a a set of glasses.

SPEAKER_00 23:05

Yeah 100%. So yes excited to see where all that goes to all right that is our AI and tech news for this week. We are going to just dip into our occasional series Weird AI of the week. All right this is about Martin Scorsese who doesn't feature that often um on our podcast it's fair to say I know he's a great listener and likes to make sure he keeps up to date with all the stuff that we talk about. But he's got a backlash uh this week he's um he's been out uh basically uh talking about how he uses AI to storyboard um a lot of his uh his uh films now and and for those using AI to do things on a slightly lesser scale such as how am I going to you know do my website or you know what am I gonna do my presentation for and we'll we'll recognise that this is actually an eminently sensible way of using AI. For me I've always found AI really helpful in terms of articulating what my what what I I'm visualising. So you know whether that's the website whether that's you know my porter or whatever being able to explain it it to an AI and then actually argue with AI or you know go through a few rounds of design is really really helpful because then you can present it to developers and others as you know something that is is real rather than just trying to get them to understand what the hell you're on about. So Scorsese's been using he's been using Black Forest labs which is quite an interesting one because they kind of disappeared a little bit. They were very much in the kind of video era they they were part of um I think they were the first Grok video and and and audio and kind of um powering uh powering that system. But yes um he has come out and been an advert for it and said it's amazing. He's 83 years old and he's like this is this is really really good and unsurprisingly he has now come in for a torrent of abuse basically from the anti-AIs out there. And yeah he's been accused of throwing artists under buses and uh it that to use his legacy and power for this is just disgusting.

SPEAKER_01 24:53

Um so yeah it's um it's really quite quite punchy isn't it it's um polarizing isn't it this sort of stuff and you could argue that in in a weekend so last weekend um we saw two ai uh generated films overtake Mandalorian and grogu I think that's like baby odor isn't it that's right as the uh as the grossing films for the weekend both of those those films created by basically YouTube vloggers or or whatever the right term is these days it's and you know they're taking over one's called obsession one's called backrooms they are like proper AI generated films that are uh grossing more than than sort of mass produced films like a Star Wars release and so actually is it giving these call them artists with these concepts and and such like the opportunity to to go toe to toe with the big boys and Scorsese I think it's quite interesting him showing and talking through the video on Black Forest Labs and I'm guessing it'll go out in the newsletter if it hasn't already but where he's sort of saying think of a think of a town not a city not a village I want a winding street I want some cobbles I want to move the camera up here you could sort of I really enjoyed it because it's like hearing how he would direct a film right and I've seen it from as Steven Soderbergh's has used AI and there's been various backlashes against animators hasn't there it's it's one you could say well it's breaking it and you're you're you know you're making money off the history of all these people who've created it because that's how the models are are trained over time and it's you're taking that and not not passing it on the um you're making money off off the back of their all their hard work but also you're saying to young upstarts like yourself go create a bit of sweet symphony style video and um wander the streets of Doncaster um without having to spend a fortune shipping up there and filming it properly.

SPEAKER_00 26:34

Yeah and and I do think you know that there is an irony here I think you know particularly in filmmaking where you look back you know I I'm sure when you know film first came along you know there was all the actors in the theatre going this is outrageous you know why are you using this technology to try to you know usurp us and you know instead of people come to the theatres they're going to go to the movies and you know and that's really bad for for actors and that's really bad for you know stage technicians and all that sort of stuff which was true. And now you've got all these film actors and you know even things like you know animators and stuff like that who definitely use technology to animate their stuff basically you know getting their pitchforks and their torches out and kind of you know coming after uh after Scorsese and and Spielberg and others. And I just think it is you know it's it it democratises this stuff, right? You know, I'm sure that you know drummers hate drum machines but you know now we've got far more music and and things like that. So look I think it's going to be an absolute boon for for creators who perhaps aren't as good at one particular thing. They're good at lots of things and they're able to now see their and imagine let their imaginations run wild, create stuff, build stuff that they never were able to before just like every you know technology in the past has enabled people more people to do things that they you know that would the would pr the preserve of a few in the past and yes it does mean that that those people are are less you know have less leverage and and are able to charge less and there will probably be less of those doing that specific stuff but there'll be far more people doing far more good stuff. And as you say you know whether or not you have a taste for YouTubers um you know turning their turning their hand to to films and stuff like that, the fact that it is that that people are willing to pay to go and see it kind of answers the question. It's like this isn't you know that this is progress. We are this is the way we're going. And I just think yeah people you know saying that it's uh you know that I think there was Guillermo del Toro said last year that he'd rather die than use AI and I bet that in the next year or so he will find himself in some way shape or form using AI and not dying. All right that's our weird AI of the week. Let's move on to our tool of the week. Matt, this is one from you it's Microsoft. So Microsoft had their big Cindig didn't they this week?

SPEAKER_01 28:32

And they've launched something new that is very similar to the kind of open claw um harness stuff right they did it's um we're in hot AI summer aren't we basically in we've sort of we've got the Google side you just alluded earlier on about the WWDC for for Apple coming up a Microsoft build conference there's a number of things that they they obviously covered during the course of theirs um and there's even a one passing line um that uh does is it uh their CEO um remand me of his name yeah there you go Sati yeah um he he made a very passing reference they're building a super app in the same way that Anthropica built the super app with Claude Cower and Codex's OpenAI's one but it was literally a sentence then he moved on so quite um when that's gonna drop who knows but the one that really interested me was uh Scouts which is basically their open a open claw inspired assistant that's even when you're talking autonomously in the background it's pulling together your Teams and your outlook and your SharePoint and various Microsoft documents to ensure that they're they're ready and presented to you as and when you need them rather than you having to think I'm gonna go off and request some meeting notes for this call with Mal. It's gonna be pulling all those things together. Unfortunately at the moment unless you're in the Frontier group which I'm sure a lot of our listeners will be for Microsoft it may well not be available for you but if nothing else um it might be one of those things where you think absolutely get myself on that Microsoft Frontier programme so I can have some of these new releases that keep popping out there.

SPEAKER_00 30:00

Yeah directionally direction of travel yeah again it it's just kind of indicative that that basically this is where this is where it's all going. You know if Microsoft's doing it they tend to be a little bit behind I think it's probably fair to say many of the the other kind of cutting edge development houses but uh but yeah they the fact that they are as you say drawing together your word your PowerPoint your you know your outlook and all this sort of stuff and and and and and able to to kind of um harness them together and um you are able to then to to use one set of AI tools across the whole lot I think is going to be another kind of moment where for people you know from who have used Office since the 90s or uh you know are still yeah plowing on with with the the the Microsoft stack they're gonna feel a lot more AI in their kind of lives on a day to day basis and I think it's gonna be again kind of good for for for everybody understanding what is now possible for sure. All right that is all we've got time for this week. Thank you everybody for listening in Matt you got a busy weekend on the cards? Absolutely nothing. Next week's um Propsy Mark 1 isn't it so will we see you or are you going to be touring the country? I will actually be away for for that so no not going to be able to make it um sadly but uh but yes we will have to organise when we're gonna do this as well it might be Thursday. But uh but yes so so sadly not going to be able to make that but um yes very excited to hear um all the stuff that comes out of it for sure and whatever you are doing out there this weekend enjoy it have an amazing time and we will catch up with you in six or seven days. All the best take care everyone