Regenerative Agriculture: Thriving as a Modern Rancher

Episode 28- Boundaries, Burnout & Balance: A Conversation with Kacee Bohle

• Christine Martin

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In today’s episode, I’m joined by Kacee Bohle — farm girl turned leadership coach, founder of Agri Minds, homeschooling mom, and a powerful voice for the human side of agriculture.

Kacee shares candidly about her journey from corporate ag to entrepreneurship, and the pivotal moments — including deep personal loss — that made her rethink what a meaningful, healthy, sustainable life in agriculture truly looks like.

We dive into:
⭐ The Three B’s: Burnout, Boundaries & Balance
⭐ Why mindset is often the real bottleneck in farm and ranch life
⭐ The pressure so many land stewards feel to “push through” at the expense of themselves
⭐ How burnout affects marriages, families, and the next generation
⭐ What it looks like to shift old patterns and actually create a life that fits your season
⭐ The difference between a request and a boundary (and why most of us confuse the two!)
⭐ How to navigate generational dynamics, communication challenges, and the need for change
⭐ Why self-awareness is one of the most underrated — and essential — tools in agriculture

Kacee brings humility, humor, and hard-won wisdom to this conversation. Whether you’re a farmer, rancher, homesteader, or supporting the ag industry in any way, you’ll walk away with a deeper understanding of how vital your inner landscape is to the health of your land, your relationships, and your future.

This episode is a reminder that regeneration begins within — and that honoring your own boundaries, needs, and emotional rhythms is just as important as caring for the soil beneath your feet.

Kacee is hosting AgriMinds Summit in Ohio, March 24-25, 2026. For more detail: Summit - Kacee Bohle Coaching

You can learn more or connect with Kacee here:
Instagram: @agcoachkacee
LinkedIn: Kacee Bohle
Website: kaceebohle.com

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Let's make regenerative ranching and farming more intentional, profitable, and fulfilling. I’d love to hear your biggest takeaway from this episode—DM me on Instagram or schedule a call to chat about it!

Connect with Christine Martin:
Website: https://thrivinglandsteward.com
Email: info@thrivinglandsteward.com




Christine Martin:

With me today, I have Kacee Bohle who lives in Indiana, and before we started I was sharing that I once lived in Indiana, but on the different side of the state. And it's much colder for her than it is for me here in east Texas. Kacee, I would love to have you introduce yourself to, our listeners.

Kacee Bohle:

Yes. Well thank you so much for having me on today. So Kacee Bohle, I grew up on a fourth generation row crop farm here in Indiana, and I've worked in agriculture my entire career. And about four years ago, I left corporate ag and started my own coaching, training and speaking business. And so today you can find me talking about balanced boundaries and burnout and specifically around people in agriculture who are struggling with those areas. I also am a home. Schooling mom of two, my husband is an operator working swing shift. And so figuring out how to balance all of the things, how to juggle all of the activities and tasks and be present when you need to be present, that is something I have lived and continue to live. And I like helping other people figure out how to create systems and be intentional in a way that works for them specifically in their season of life. So that's what I get to do every single day and it is such a joy being able to serve the industry in that way.

Christine Martin:

That's wonderful. So how long have you been homeschooling your children?

Kacee Bohle:

So I've got two kiddos, currently a 9-year-old and an almost 3-year-old, and we are on year two with my nine-year-old, my three-year-old. We're just getting ready to start talking about shapes and

Christine Martin:

Sure. So.

Kacee Bohle:

is home with us and so it does, uh, does challenge us on some days of how can we entertain her while we focus on lessons, but so we're going on two years with our homeschool curriculums now.

Christine Martin:

That's exciting. So a long time ago, because my daughter is now 36 I pulled her out of school at sixth grade to homeschool. And at that time I was a single parent and working full time and I, became very friendly with my neighbors. And my neighbors were a homeschooling family of 10 children, the best run household I've ever been exposed to. It was a fabulously run household and she still does a good job. Anyway. When I was sharing some of my concerns about, my daughter's education my neighbor. Very kindly offered to have her stay with them in the house while I was at work. I could still determine curriculum and activities and whatever, but she would be supervised by, this mama. And then I came home and had to do math,

Kacee Bohle:

Yes. It

Christine Martin:

but yeah.

Kacee Bohle:

I'm so thankful that you had somebody nearby to help you with that

Christine Martin:

Yeah.

Kacee Bohle:

often, especially as women, we feel like we have to do it all. And so for the fact that you were able to say, you know what, this is an area that I'm okay with asking for support in, not necessarily to make the decision for me or to take it off my plate'cause I don't want to, but reality is, like sometimes you do need a little bit of support. So I'm so glad that you had that.

Christine Martin:

Yeah, it was a true blessing. It was a true blessing and, ultimately the families blended right holidays. We did everything together. My kids loved having 10 other children to play with and the age ranges also matched up with my kids. Yeah, it was a fabulous experience and I was very fortunate.

Kacee Bohle:

Yes.

Christine Martin:

Kacee, why did you leave the ag, industry to start coaching? What did you see that prompted you to do this?

Kacee Bohle:

Oh, that's such a good question. I think for me, I was tired of missing out on my kids' life. So at the time I just had my son and my husband and I were switched roles, right? I was the breadwinner, but I feel like when I came home I was also the bread maker. And so it was really difficult in our marriage. We had a little bit of a struggle with like the. The hierarchy, if you will. It's like, who's actually making decisions here, but who's actually doing the work? And it was a challenge and it was affecting my marriage. I had to travel three, four nights a week, some weeks. Um, and so my husband was at home running around with, you know, school drop-offs and making sure that he is at practice and all the things. And honestly, it was just really, was gut-wrenching to not be a part of that. And I think one of the big defining moments for me is I was up in Minneapolis for a company end of year slash Christmas party type of event. And. were all sitting around at a restaurant, having the camaraderie that most teams do when they get together, especially when you work remotely across the country. And my son was having his very first Christmas program that night. And so my husband texted me and he's like, Hey, he is getting ready to go on. Do you wanna FaceTime? And so I sneak out and I'm hiding, like in the alley next to the restaurant, watching my son, who I think was like four or five. It was like the pre-K type of thing. And, um, he was up on stage doing his Christmas program and it, there was just a knife in my stomach turning and I was like, this sucks. Like I just, I don't wanna be the one who's away, like know for the majority of. History, it's always been the husbands who's gone away and who've been the breadwinners who have missed out. And the moms were always there. Like, that's kind of like standard, that's stereotypical. Right. And I don't know if men experience those same types of feelings of missing out. I'm sure that they do, but it's not talked about. Right. They may not admit it, they may not talk about it outside of maybe their spouse. But, for me, I was just done. Missing out on life. so that was a couple of years before I decided to leave, but that's when plans started to go into motion of what's my strategy? How can I start building something now, maybe on the side to eventually transition out of having to travel all the time, find a way to, I don't know, start my own business. And so, I started doing some different leadership, personal growth programs, and eventually found myself in a position where people were asking for my advice and coming to me wanting to know, an answer. They sought out an answer to something and they thought I had it. Honestly, I've never been okay with telling people straight up, this is what you should do. I've always been the kind of person that's well, tell me about what makes you think that this is the right route? Let's validate it or what's your gut telling you? What are your facts telling you? And turns out there's a term for that and it's called coaching. And so I went into some different leadership programs and became a certified leadership coach. And I was just doing that all nights and weekends, earning a little bit of side money. And eventually I started making enough money to say, this is something I think I could turn into a real, like a full-time job. I found out I was pregnant with baby number two and while I was pregnant I was putting in plots, still traveling around the state of Indiana at the time. This is for a different company. And I just remember bending over and putting some stuff in the ground, like checking soil depth. And I was like, this, ugh. I'm just not excited about putting plots in, like I'm about to have a baby. My stomach hurts, I'm sick. I don't feel good. I just wish I could go lay down. And you can't do that when you have plots to put in. You can't do that when work needs to get done. And I just, I thought to myself, I need to build something that works with this season of life. If I wanna go lay down and take a nap at one o'clock in the afternoon, I don't wanna have to ask for permission. I don't wanna have to take a sick day. I don't wanna have to justify or validate how I'm feeling to somebody who doesn't have a clue how I feel right now. And I just, I was like, I don't want a boss anymore. And so while I was on maternity leave, I. Just put some feelers out there about some group coaching programs, some speaking opportunities, and I ended up making more money while I was on maternity leave than I did in seven months worth of my full-time salary. And so. I was like, this is crazy. Why am I like putting this off? And so when it came time for me to go back after maternity leave, I told my boss, I said, I'll stick with you until after planting season. Then once planting season is done, am, I'm out of here. And so that was back in 20 May of 2023. And here we are November of 2025 and I've not looked back. I mean, don't get me wrong. There were days where I was like, this is a little scary. The inconsistency of income and the holy crap. This is my name that I'm representing and I don't have anybody to fall back on. It is scary at times, but the amount of time that I've gotten back has just been so worth it. And I don't regret any, any of it. I mean, I don't regret working for somebody else. I don't regret leaving. I don't regret pulling my kid out of school. That was not part of the plan. We can dive into that if you want to, but that was not part of the plan. I felt God nudging me to leave my. My company and start my own business. And then shortly after he is like, also, you should take your kid out of school. And I was like, how are we gonna do that? And so that wasn't part of the plan, but here we are. And that was my journey and I don't think it's a fit for everybody, but in this season of my life, this is exactly where I should be.

Christine Martin:

That's wonderful. Isn't it interesting the journeys that we have, right? We, when we go to college or or even in high school, we think we're gonna live a certain life. And have a certain path, and then life happens and it changes completely. Now, when I was in high school, when I, so I was born in Argentina, raised in Brazil. And while I, when I was going through high school in Brazil, I never thought that I would have land and managing animals and coaching so it's, kind of fun.

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah, well this wasn't my plan either. My plan originally was to come back home and farm with my family. And like I said, we can talk about that too. But this wasn't, none of this was what I planned when I was 18, 19 years old. None of this looked like I had imagined.

Christine Martin:

Yeah. Yeah. How exciting. That's wonderful. So, you're coaching now and you're helping farmers and I'm assuming mostly farmers.

Kacee Bohle:

Yep. Farmers, ranchers,

Christine Martin:

Okay.

Kacee Bohle:

owners, and people who work within ag. So it's a

Christine Martin:

Okay.

Kacee Bohle:

like people who work in agriculture

Christine Martin:

Okay.

Kacee Bohle:

on.

Christine Martin:

Mostly conventional.

Kacee Bohle:

I have got a range all

Christine Martin:

Okay.

Kacee Bohle:

I, mean, it really is hard to say this is the demographic of, of the job. It's more the through line between everybody that I work with is their the, their workload, they're burnt out, the season of

Christine Martin:

Okay.

Kacee Bohle:

and.

Christine Martin:

Okay.

Kacee Bohle:

the job title isn't necessarily the important piece there, but, so I've got a wide range of conventional farming, like the traditional stuff. I've also got some regen farmers. I've also got people who don't farm at all. They support the farmers.

Christine Martin:

Sure.

Kacee Bohle:

It's, across the board,

Christine Martin:

So you've mentioned burnout, your three Bs. What were your three Bs again?

Kacee Bohle:

burnout, boundaries, and balance.

Christine Martin:

Okay, so tell me more of how did you define that those were the three most important things that needed to be worked on.

Kacee Bohle:

Well, those were the three things that I experienced the most. And there's a quote, and I don't know who said it, but I heard it one time, they said the person that your best. Fitted to serve as your past self.

Christine Martin:

Yes.

Kacee Bohle:

What I've gone through is, is something I can relate to people with, right? Like I know what that feels like. It's not something I'm inexperienced with'cause I've lived it, right? And so those are the three things that I worked with. And if I'm completely honest with you, where the three Bs came from was my son and I were doing his language arts lesson one day and they were talking about alliteration. And I was like, alliteration, what is that? Like, how do I not know what this word is? And maybe I was taught it in school, I don't know. I probably wasn't paying attention that day if I'm honest with you. But alliteration for those who don't know, is when you have two words next to each other that start with the same word or the same letter. And so burnout and boundaries, they both start with bs. And I was like, man, that's got a nice roll off the tongue. Burnout, boundaries, and balance. And so that's where the three Bs came from. And I'm like that just. for me. So that's where those three Bs and obviously we talk about some other things, but this sounds really nice. So those are the three that I talk

Christine Martin:

I love it. No, that's. It, iterations are fabulous. They're so catchy, aren't they?

Kacee Bohle:

Yes.

Christine Martin:

So tell us your experience on burnout and how did you address it?

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah. So I touched a little bit about how I was traveling all the time. I covered a lot of the corn belt or I guess the Eastern corn belt. So Indiana, Kentucky, Michigan, Ohio, parts of Tennessee, parts of Illinois. And I just, I was traveling so much and I just remember like I'd be in the bottom of Kentucky working with a farm and then as soon as that meeting was over, I had to book it to Northern Michigan and it was just like all the time I was just up and down the highway. And so not only was I burnt out and just feeling. I was in the car all the time, and so I had physical symptoms of sciatic pain, right? Like my hips were outta whack. I just, I had so many mental and physical symptoms of my job, which wasn't super labor intensive. It was just in a car for hours and hours is not good for you. And I just, I remember going back and forth and I was just like, I'm just not enjoying this anymore. What I thought was a dream job on paper I made six figures. I had a company truck with less than a couple thousand miles on it. I had amazing health benefits. I was doing fine, I just didn't like it. And so there was guilt and resentment around I should love what I'm doing, but I'm. Physically dreading getting up in the morning, like it just was like pulling teeth for me to get down, get in front of my computer and do the work I had to do, and sending reports to my boss of, here's our forecast. And I just dreaded it. I was so exhausted from it. And. Unfortunately, I was taking it out on my family. Like I mentioned, I was taking it out on my husband. I was taking it out on my kids and almost being resentful towards them of I have zero energy left at the end of my workday, and now you want me to make supper and now you want me to read you a bedtime story and now you want me to cuddle with you in bed. And it's just like, where am I gonna get some me time? And then my husband would be like, what do you mean you had nine hours in the vehicle of me time? And I'm like, you don't understand. It's not the same thing. And I just, so all of that was stacking up. And so I had this tug of war inside my brain of you should appreciate this, you should love this. You should be grateful, you should feel blessed. Versus this isn't in alignment with what I like to do. I don't enjoy these tasks. I'm not showing up as my best self at home or at work. I'm not giving my all to my c. To my clients. I'm not giving my all to my family. Like I just, I was failing in all of the areas and that was burnout for me. That was my version of burnout. And so I just, I was like, I have to do something. It's not gonna just magic magically work itself out. And I think so many of us hang on to the hope of, if I just hang on a little bit longer, if I just get through this season, it'll start to feel relieving. If I can just get to this next level in the company, then I'll have relief. If I can just till this kid gets done teething or once, once they're out of daycare and into school, then I'll have a little bit more me time and just hoped that one day would all sort itself out. And then those days came and it still didn't feel any better and I thought, okay, something's gotta change and that's me. And so that's where a lot of the mindset work began, because I kept, yes, the external factors. We're valid, but a lot of it was also my mindset and my approach and my thinking towards these things, and it was just a mess all around. And so that's a lot of the work that we do too, is around mindset. why my company is called Agri Minds, right? Because it doesn't matter the type of work you do, if your mindset isn't right, everything is going to be negative or everything is going to be through this victim mentality. Everything is going to be lack mentality. So you've gotta get your mindset right first. And that's, a lot of the work that we do too.

Christine Martin:

How many people that you've worked with came said, I know my mindset isn't right. Help me change it.

Kacee Bohle:

Every single one of them.

Christine Martin:

They rec, they recognize. They recognize that the burnout, the boundaries is a mindset issue.

Kacee Bohle:

yeah.

Christine Martin:

Really?

Kacee Bohle:

I have people complete a form, so I've changed the way that I accept clients or agree to work with clients. I used to think I've gotta say yes to every single person that comes to me. I'm super desperate. I need the money. This is a startup business. I need to just help everybody. But what I've realized is a lot of people aren't ready to do the work.

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

what the problem is. They're not willing to put in the effort to make the changes. I can relate to that. I was there for a long time of I know something's wrong. Oh, here's a perfect example. Let's just say, and this is something I still currently battle with, is my mindset around my weight. If, I don't know if this is a video podcast or not, but I

Christine Martin:

It is a video. Yeah.

Kacee Bohle:

The example will sit whether you're listening to audio or not, if you can tell. I've got a little bit of a blemish here. This is a zit. This is, I'm 35 years old looking like a teenager here, because the other day so here we are. November 13th, we went Halloween. Trick or treating, we get this bucket full of candy. Every single time I eat chocolate, I break out and look very youthful. Okay? Not in the positive way. What do I do? I dive into the many Twix and here we are. It's showing up. I know that's the issue. What do I do? I can continue to eat the Twix because it's right there in front of me. It's handy. It's an immediate satisfaction. Long term though. I'm mad that I have zits on my face and I had a speaking engagement this past week. And of course like only so much that you can cover up, right? But those are some of those things. You know what the problem is, but you're not willing to do the work, right? You're not willing to say no to the Twix. And again, that's just something working human. And sometimes we just don't have the willpower. Sometimes we just say yes anyway, because the temporary satisfaction is more to us than the overall root problem. And we do the same thing in life, right? We know what the problem is, we know it's our job, but we know it's our mindset. We know it's we keep putting ourselves in these situations. And until you have had enough. Nothing's gonna change. And Dave Ramsey talks about this a lot. Like when, so Dave Ramsey's kind of like this financial guru. People listen to and on his podcast and, radio station a lot, he'll say, nothing's gonna change until you are just so fed up. You're so mad at being broke. You're so tired of living paycheck to paycheck. And until you've hit that point, you're gonna, you're gonna fall into the same pattern. And the same can be said for my clients, right? And so now I have a form I make them fill out prior to me even getting on a phone call with them of on a scale of one to 10, how ready are you to make a change? And if they're like I'm at a five or six. I think maybe six month coaching is not the right path for you. Maybe a two hour strategy session would be beneficial to you. But that kind of helps me gauge how ready are you to make a change? And a lot of the times, like they do just need a kick in the butts. They do just need to be heard. Maybe they're not even ready to make a change, they just wanna feel validated in their feelings. And some people need that too. And there's no right or wrong, and there's no there's no place for me to say whether or not somebody should be doing something. I can see from an outsider perspective, this would be beneficial to you, but ultimately they have to make that choice. And so every time we get to the point of, yes, I'm ready for coaching. Every single time, they're like, I know. It's my mindset. And I think that I draw the right people in because the name of my business is literally Agri Minds and it talks about mindset all over my website. So if you're not interested in mindset, I'm probably not gonna appeal to you. You're probably gonna go find somebody else that's better suited for what you need, and that's fine too.

Christine Martin:

So you've, been able to niche down to figure out what, how it is you can best serve your clients. That's fabulous. And you look beautiful. I can, I could barely tell you're blemish. And I will share with you, yeah, I will share. I've traveled and lived in many, countries and experienced different cultures. And for me, Christmas and Thanksgiving is always associated with poni. Have you seen the poni, the Italian bread?

Kacee Bohle:

Yes. My in-laws are Italian and I every Christmas. Yep.

Christine Martin:

Yeah. They're on the shelf and I made the mistake of buying one. And I stay away from anything gluten because I react to the gluten. And, but it was sitting there on the shelf and I left it quite prominent and I'm like, Ooh, that would be good. This morning, toasted with a little bit of butter. So I broke it out and I didn't just have one slice, I had four slices.

Kacee Bohle:

That will happen. And now, you know. Right. And now

Christine Martin:

Oh, I know, I know,

Kacee Bohle:

but

Christine Martin:

I know.

Kacee Bohle:

was worth it at the time. Right.

Christine Martin:

Yeah, it was worth it at the time. So I take my enzymes and say, okay, this will the consequences won't be quite as dire. So yeah, we all do it.

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah, I feel you.

Christine Martin:

So you have clients come and say, I know, it's my mindset. How do you help them change their mindset? What are, what does the conversation look like?

Kacee Bohle:

It depends on the client, first of all. Sometimes and I'm very open in saying this, sometimes it makes sense for them to instead go work with a therapist or a counselor, and here's how I help them determine. Who they might need in their corner. And sometimes it's both of us at the same time. But I think a lot of people don't really understand what a coach is or how a coach can help. And the view I have, and I know other coaches may not always align with that, and I'd like to hear your thoughts on that too. But how I've been trained is if you have an open wound, if it's something that is like so triggering and so traumatic and just. It, it just gets you all worked up and emotional. That might be better directed toward a therapist or a counselor, somebody who can really help you heal from that. Whereas a coach is, Hey, you've got scar tissue. It's healed, it's still affects you, but it's not a deep, fresh wound. A coach is probably a, good fit for you there. So another way to look at it is, Hey, I've gone through something. I need help getting over it. A counselor or a therapist, I'm going through something and I want advice or somebody to go through this with me. Maybe a mentor would be good or a consultant who wants to be responsible for some of that work. Or, here is something that I'm looking to go through. Here's some changes I want to make. Here's what I want my future to look like. That's where a coach, I think, really thrives. A coach can consider and obviously take into consideration all of those things, but a coach really can be helpful if you're like, Hey, here's what I know. Here's where I'm at and here's where I wanna go. That's really where I help people. And so it just depends on the person. as far as like, how can we shift mindsets? I do it through a couple of different ways. I do three or six month individual coaching we really just talk about them, right? What do you wanna talk about this week? I make them do prep forms and debrief forms, and over time we start to see those shifts. But a way that I do it through a group setting is something called Agri Minds Live. So that is a very specific. Training program. We have specific topics through 12 weeks. We cover your goals. We cover something called working genius, which helps you understand what gives you joy and energy and what drains you, right? Like maybe your work is literally draining you every day. If so, maybe it's time for you to consider a different career path or a different role, or maybe we can't change those things, so how can we adjust your mindset through those? We also talk about communication. We also talk about your mindset, your mentality, your belief system, your circle of influence. So there's a very specific structured curriculum that we go through in the group training program. That also gives opportunity to mastermind, to have coaching as a group that way too. And so you start to see some mindset shifts that way because they're exposed to tools and resources that they've never been exposed to before. Wait, what do you mean? I can shift my mindset? What do you mean Your thoughts are your feelings. And that turns into actions and that turns into results. And you mean I can change that cycle at any time? I didn't know that everything that I know, think or believe was either taught or caught. That changes the game for me of realizing you have so much power and control over what you're going through. And a lot of people in general, but specifically within agriculture, didn't know that kind of thinking existed, which is crazy to me. But it's also like understandable. Like a lot of people in agriculture struggle with their worth. What does productivity mean? What does success mean? And it's directly tied to their output, What are you producing that determines your success? And we don't know that there's anything other than that. And so when we start introducing these new types of thinking, new concepts, new tools and new resources, it's of course there's no way your mindset can't shift because you're getting in new information. And a lot of the times people just have never been exposed to new information because they're in their rural communities, they're in their small bubbles, they're in their family they're, they're surrounded by generation and generations of the same ways of thinking that's been passed down. And not that it's wrong, it's just they don't know any different. And that's the work that I wanna introduce to people of. are other ways of going about this. And so when you talked about regenerative agriculture, a lot of people are like, that's different than anything I've ever been exposed to. That must be wrong because if it was right, we would've done this before. Why is this all of a sudden now happening? And so we can talk all about my experience with regenerative agriculture, but I think that's where it begins is your mindset around all of it.

Christine Martin:

Yeah. And I love your point that the change doesn't happen until it becomes critical. Until it's I can't keep going I can't afford the chemicals, the chemi the input costs are just so great. I'm close to being bankrupt type thing. And when I, so I'm an educator with holistic management and we focus on the environment, the ecology, the ecosystem functions. We focus on the financial aspect of it. We also focus on that social, that quality of life aspect to it. And when I was going through my training. We have a community of 60 educators plus all over the world, and we, share email. And I put it out there. I said, why isn't, why aren't more land stewards? I use land stewards to cover farmers, ranchers, homesteaders why, aren't more land stewards thinking holistically and using this holistic framework to manage their operation? And most of these, my colleagues came back saying I've been doing this for 10, 20, 30 years. My neighbors see that I'm still green, that my productivity is higher. I can carry more animals, or my yields are higher. And they never once come and ask me, how did you do this? Until it becomes critical, right? Until there's a disaster. Until there's it affects'em financially. I was at a workshop. Oh, a couple years back in central Texas and it was just a one day workshop and we had a gentleman come and attend. He was 75 years old and the workshop was on regenerative agriculture. And usually we start with the circle with in introductions and your expectations. And in his introduction he goes, I'm here because I've just found out that the way I've been taking care of the land has caused my granddaughter to be sick. And so I, want to learn how not to make people sick, and I want to learn how to heal my granddaughter. It's just, it's oh, the emotional aspect of it the, burden that he's now caring because of his previous practices. But to as an example, it's only when it becomes critical that you start, wait, this is, this might not be right, this might not be good. With respect to the mindset, where do you see that pressure point? Where do you see that critical point happening for most of these people on the land?

Kacee Bohle:

That's a great question and it is, different for each person. Obviously there's no cookie

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

here, but on average, you're right. Something has to happen and it's pro, it's usually around the relationships. I, am not getting along with my brother who I'm farming alongside with. We can't see eye to eye, and that's holding us back in our operation. am getting divorced. My husband and my this husband and wife aren't seeing eye to eye. He's not being present. She's overworked. It's, caused a strain in their relationship. Or even with their kids, right? Like I am, for me, for example, I'm missing out on my kids' life. And I just, and here's something I'll share with you. So back in 2023, this was January of 2023. This was eight weeks after I delivered my second child. I go down to Nashville to speak at a conference. And while I'm down there in Nashville, I thought, you know what? I'm gonna get together with my sister who lives here. I don't get to see her very often. so before we head back home, I'm gonna stop and have breakfast with her. So we stop when we have breakfast. My mom did not wanna go. My mom went with me down there because my eight week old was with me, and so she was watching her while I was on stage. I don't recommend speaking when you're eight weeks postpartum, but it is

Christine Martin:

No.

Kacee Bohle:

So my mom's with me. My mom's can we just go back home? She is so like tired. She's not used to being around eight week old babies that long. And she's can we just go home? It's a five hour drive. I really don't really wanna stop and, have breakfast. I was like, I think we really need to. So we stopped when we have breakfast with my sister and it was fine. No, no big deal. On the way home we're having all sorts of conversations about my sister and how she doesn't have her life together and she is still a barista and she's 40 years old and she should do this with her life and she should do that with her life. And we're talking about how. She's happy though. She's content. Like she was thriving in the starving artist world. That's, she was loving it. And so that was Saturday morning we stopped and had breakfast with her. Tuesday I get a phone call that she was dead and she died of a drug overdose. And it rocked my family in a way that we were not expecting.

Christine Martin:

Oh, I'm so sorry.

Kacee Bohle:

it's one of those things where it's like, life is so short, and for the past several years, all of us in my family are battling with, could have treated her differently. We could have been there for her. How did we not know that these were things that she was experiencing? did we not know that this was stuff that she was doing? would've happened if we would've stayed in town longer and spent more time with her versus just having breakfast and gone back to her apartment with her when she invited us and we instead said, no, we gotta get back home. What would've changed? And we live with this, what if, but until you have experienced a loss and you have experienced such a traumatic shift in your life, you don't think it's gonna happen to you. And that's when you were talking about that guy who said, my granddaughter is sick like You won't change it's too late and something has happened. And so, yes it was right at the same time I was considering leaving. But that was one of the key factors for me that said. what? My sister died at the age of 40. She left a 12-year-old daughter here on Earth now who doesn't have a mother to grow up with. And I just like I, just can't imagine not being able to see kids grow up. I can't imagine what my kids would turn out like if they didn't have a mother or father in their life. it, you just, you have to take advantage of life when life is there it won't be forever. And something my husband says all the time, and he is like, nobody gets out alive like nobody you, have so many people who are living, not everybody is like experiencing life to the fullest.

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

a lot of the times, like we talk about retirement too. Oh, when I retire then I'm gonna go to The Bahamas

Christine Martin:

Yeah. Wow.

Kacee Bohle:

go on the cruise. I'll take a vacation for the first time in 60 years.'cause then they'll, they won't have the cows that they need to feed or they won't have whatever that needs tended to. And it's you may not get there, you may not get there. Why not? Go experience it now. And so it, it is a, balance or another term I like to use is harmony,

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

finding the right harmony of income versus life. And you get to decide what that harmony looks like and it may look different seasonally.

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

Like, sometimes I'll have clients who are like it's planting season. I can't just stop what I'm doing to go to the baseball game because we've gotta get this in the ground. We have a short window, we need to get this planted, or we've gotta get it out of the ground because the snowstorm is coming. Whatever the thing may be. I can't just drop what I'm doing. And that's a personal decision, but you need to have your back on that, right? If that's the decision you're making, make sure that's one you can live with. And not that I wanna guilt trip people, not, I do not wanna guilt trip people because I know what that feels like too. And I, hate when people make me feel shame or guilt about my decisions. And that's where the boundaries conversation we can dive into that later, but I just think it's so important to say, make the decision and have your back on it. If this season it makes sense for you for six weeks to just go hard on the field. Go hard on the field, but when you're off out of that busy season, make sure you're being very intentional with that time because you may not get it again.

Christine Martin:

I love that, especially because what you're saying is this isn't a recipe, right? It's not something that you're gonna do day in and day out. As, land stewards, we understand seasons, we understand winter and spring and summer and fall, and there's different duties and this different rhythms, right? Daylights and and, the night hours. And we're all unique. We are all unique, right? We, have our own experiences, our own knowledge base, our own unique priorities, our own unique values, Is what enamored me with this holistic management aspect of it, is we have a very complex environment to to deal with. Not only are we stewarding nature, which is complex in itself, then we've got the financial aspect of it, and then we have the human aspect and we're, very complex creatures.

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah.

Christine Martin:

And, so it, it has to be adapted, it has to be adaptable. And to your point, you've gotta be okay with the decision that you've made. In holistic management, we do have. What we call, and I'm gonna do a quick scr, a quick show here on the video the decision testing questions to make sure that when we make a decision that we actually comfortable, that we've considered the financial outcomes, we've considered the social outcomes, is my spouse gonna be upset because I've made this decision because now I'm gone for 80 hours a week for the next six weeks. Are, we doing the right? Are, we managing correctly for what we're seeing on the ground, on the land so that we can make that decision with confidence, with clarity and understanding the consequences, the symptoms that we might have to address after. That's beautiful. Okay, so tell me about the boundaries.

Kacee Bohle:

Oh, this is so good. This is my favorite area. This is my favorite bee of the bees

Christine Martin:

And, it is mine. It is mine too. And I'll share with you before, before you, I let you answer I when I moved to the states, I came up to the states for college from, Brazil, and I was 18. I was very emotionally immature, very mature, just all around. And I'm in a new country, in a new culture trying to fit in. So I, I learned very quickly to be a people pleaser because that was the easiest way for me to, fit in. And I did have a relationship that was very difficult. And I did go to therapy as I was in my thirties. And my therapist said, Christine, you need to implement boundaries. I'm like, excuse me. What, you, what is boundaries?

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah.

Christine Martin:

you mean by boundaries?

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah. You and everybody else,

Christine Martin:

Yeah,

Kacee Bohle:

like, we hear

Christine Martin:

yeah,

Kacee Bohle:

but we don't actually

Christine Martin:

yeah.

Kacee Bohle:

it means. One of my favorite like metaphors or analogies to use is imagine a 40 acre field and you own the 40 acres, but you don't own the surrounding land. a lot of the times, at least here in west central Indiana if it's something that's got livestock in it or depending on, what's on that land, we have a physical fence

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

keeps the right things in and hopefully the wrong things out. It is a clear line that communicates what your responsibility is and what your responsibility is not, and it is a physical determination that communicates to the other people, Hey this is mine and that is yours, right? Nowadays we're getting away from physical fences because we have digital farming products, right? Digital systems that show us GPS lines or on the screen, we can see clearly where the boundary line is. And so sometimes we don't need the physical fence, especially in like where we live. It's field after field, after field, very open. It's not super choppy in the area that I live. And so you may have 300 acres and five farmers farming that 300 acres, but it's one consistent track of land. But there are boundary lines around them, and so you have to figure out like maybe we do put a post. Just hope that the, thing that we determine the line is the, crop, right? We may have a bean field next to a cornfield, and that's what's helping us see. But to the standard person, we don't really know like, oh, are there different people responsible for these different areas? Is this one person responsible for all of it? what's the difference? And so that's why I like to use boundaries are the, physical markers. But if you don't have a physical marker, like a physical fence row, you have to communicate your boundary line. And something that I think a lot of people misuse is the terminology between boundaries and requests. And so the difference between a boundary and request is the boundary is something that you set. It's something that you're responsible for communicating and sticking to. You do not need approval by anybody else to set your boundary. In your field, right? It's, not up to anybody else. A request on the other hand, is something that you can ask of somebody else and they have the option to say yes or no and vice versa. They can ask you a request and you have the option to say yes or no. But a request and a boundary are not the same thing. And for so many people, especially a lot of my clients, if I've got these boundaries in place, no, you have requests in place. So you need to get really clear on what are your boundaries, what are you willing to do or not willing to do? What are you saying yes to or no to? What are you saying? Maybe I'll bend a little bit. This is a flexible maybe portable fence that you take with you, which you have the option to do, right? Those exist to where I live. Maybe we'll have cattle grazing on cornstalks, and so we have temporary fence posts in there, right? Like you get to pick and choose when and where you put your fences. Those are boundaries, and until you have clearly defined what your boundaries are, of course people are going to cross them. They don't know they exist, right?

Christine Martin:

Right.

Kacee Bohle:

that's one of my favorite things because if you don't have boundaries, of course your balance is gonna be out of whack. If you don't have boundaries, of course you're stirring up a recipe for burnout you're saying yes to things that don't need to be said yes to right now. You're saying no to things that do need to be said yes to right now. And so when you have your boundaries, your balance, and your burnout, all in check, that's a good harmony, right? And I think that a lot of people don't even know where to start with that stuff, which is where folks like you and I come in, where we try to help people take inventory of where you're spending your time, your energy, your resources, your attention, and does it make sense to be doing that now in this season of life?

Christine Martin:

Yeah. When I learned about boundaries, all of a sudden I recognized that my parenting did not have a lot of boundaries. It, there was a lot of requests, but very. Few boundaries, and so I change, I adjusted accordingly. And of course, the children, the kids reacted accordingly because it's not always well received, right? When, you set the boundary.

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah. I don't remember where I saw this video, but there was this video of this girl talking about boundaries with her son, and I'm probably gonna screw this story up because it's been so long since I've had to think about it. But I hopefully you'll get the gist of it. But essentially, she was talking about boundaries with her son, and she said, every time we get into the elevator, the sun pushes all of the button. Elevator, all the floors. And she's like, stop doing that. I really wish you could stop doing that. Well, she thought she was setting boundaries with her son. No, that's a request. I'm asking you to stop pushing the buttons. And he can say yes or no to pushing the buttons. So every single time they get in the elevator pushes all the buttons, and they got all the floors that gotta stop at, and just getting so frustrated. And somebody talked to her about boundaries and they said, why don't you try this approach instead? So the next time that they get in the elevator, was reaching towards the boundaries and she kind of gently grabbed his hand and said, listen, you touch these buttons again, there are going to be consequences. You can choose to push the buttons, but I'm telling you that this is what I'm going to do this happens. And of course he's like, oh, I get it now. Like there is a

Christine Martin:

Right,

Kacee Bohle:

And he ended up pushing all of the buttons. And so she enforced the boundary and that is the key there. You can set all the boundaries you want, but until you not only communicate the boundaries, but then stick to the boundaries and enforce them, are gonna walk all over you. Right? And

Christine Martin:

exactly.

Kacee Bohle:

can ask requests. can set your boundaries, but the important part is to enforce them.

Christine Martin:

I'd like your insight because I've, had to address it myself within my own family, and then as I work with clients, how do we do that with families? With, our parents, with our siblings. We were brought up in this household that didn't have boundaries. Maybe they had requests but maybe it was a free for all. How, do we manage that? Because it can get tricky.

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah. It absolutely can get tricky. And I think the thing to remember here is that. because you've set a boundary doesn't mean you like other people are gonna understand or approve of it, you don't need their approval. But it, it does get tricky because you're like, but it affects them. How do I say no, I'm not working on Sunday'cause I wanna go to church instead of farming when that's the way that it's been done forever. Nobody's ever stopped working to

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

two hours going to and from church. That's brand new. So I think the thing to remember there is you don't need permission, but it does absolutely help when you get them on board. And so the things to remember there are, is a brand new thing, this is a brand new boundary. They may not accept it right off the bat, which okay, but you have to remember if, if they've never been exposed to you, all of a sudden standing up for yourself or all of a sudden putting things into play that haven't been done in five generations. Of course it's gonna take a little bit of time to adjust. And so if it's super important to you, put it out there, to explain your reasoning. Some people are gonna be on board and some people aren't. And that's unfortunate, right? And that's why I am trying to do the proactive work of kind of shaping this next generation, so that way we're changing the outcome, we're changing the trajectory of our people, versus trying to teach old dogs new tricks, if you will. But those old dogs need a little bit of time to come around. And so continue to stand your ground, continue to enforce your boundaries. Give them a little bit of grace because they've not ever experienced this before either, right? And I think that that's something that we forget is you've never done this before. You've never set boundaries. You've never stood up for yourself. You've never had a different opinion that you've voiced to, know, somebody else in your family, right? You guys have never done this before. Of course it's gonna be bumpy, of course it's gonna take some time to work the kinks out. But if it's truly important, need to stick to it even as uncomfortable, awkward, challenging, difficult. It may be it's important to you and it, and they will eventually come around. And if not, you do have options. And I don't think a lot of people recognize that either is do have an ability to find somewhere else to go. And I don't think a lot of us wanna hear that either, right? What do you mean? If I don't get along with my family, I just stop farming. What does that even mean? It's like it does exist. It does exist and I'm giving you the permission to explore that. I hope that doesn't come to the case, though. I do know a lot of people in agriculture bringing in a third party to help with those conversations that are neutral, that are like the Switzerland, right? Like they are, I'm not siting with you and I'm not siting with them. I'm kind of the moderator that's kind of playing this neutral third party that's not emotionally or financially invested in this conversation. I do that sometimes too, of just trying to Hey, here's where this person's coming from, because there's so much emotion. though we say in agriculture, like there's no place for emotion. Listen, everything you're doing is emotional and if you don't properly know how to name it. that can be tricky, which is why we talk about emotions inside of agri minds as well, right? Everything you do is emotional, otherwise you wouldn't be doing it. And knowing how to have those conversations is important as well. So I work with people on boundary setting scripts sometimes, because it prepares you of here's what I wanna say. And sometimes you just be like, I wanna make sure I get this right. So I'm gonna read off of this piece of paper, it's gonna look silly, but I wanna make sure that I, there's no room for misinterpretation, there's no room for confusion. the boundary, here's what I'm willing to do, and I would really appreciate your support in that. And then be quiet and let them react the way that they need to react.

Christine Martin:

And recognizing that some people need more time to process that, right? That. You need to give them that time to, to contemplate if this is brand spanking new. If this is a whole new concept, give them that time. Some of us need more time to process things than others. And sometimes our Yes. Exactly. Yeah.

Kacee Bohle:

it doesn't resonate or they're so caught off guard. If you're doing this face-to-face verbally that you do need to text this, maybe you do need to write a letter, maybe you do need to send an audio message so that way you are heard and your voice is there and the right implications are heard, but they have time to sit and respond without you looking at them like, which sounds so crazy. It's like, why would you voice text me your boundary? It's like people like my husband, if there's something I need to really tell him. if it's when we were struggling in our marriage, like I had to write a lot of stuff down for him and leave him a note and he would process it. And I tell you what, that saved us knowing

Christine Martin:

Sure.

Kacee Bohle:

in their language because

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

is 80% about them and only 20% about us. They, how are they going to receive the message in a way that we want them to, we need to speak that language.

Christine Martin:

I love that. I love that. And it is so true. Yeah. My daughter's very auditory. My son is very, is more tactile. So giving him something to a piece of paper to read was much more effective. Much of the struggle that we see in agriculture right now is that generational transfer is the parents letting the, younger generation come in and maybe do things differently. We've talked regen ag to switch from conventional to regen. Have you had any experience any work managing that transfer?

Kacee Bohle:

I don't do a ton in that area just because I, don't specialize in transition plans or succession planning. I mean, I have personal experience with it, but it's not something that I like raise my hand and say, let me help you with this. I do see it often, and think that if you don't have an open line of care. Communication, it's going to be super difficult,

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

difficult. So that would be the number one area I would suggest is find ways to learn how to communicate with each other.

Christine Martin:

Yeah. And, I agree with you. It's all about communication and openness and, you if, it's a generation that believes, well, this is how we've done it and I'm doing what my granddaddy did, so you should be doing what your great granddaddy did. And having that open-mindedness, which can be a struggle.

Kacee Bohle:

Mm-hmm.

Christine Martin:

And again, it goes back to what allows for change, what allows for that change of mindset. So a mediator, a moderator generally gets called in for that so that they can say it in their own words and, the moderator mediator translates it to the next generation saying, this is what they're trying to tell you

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah. There's

Christine Martin:

and

Kacee Bohle:

in having that third party in there.

Christine Martin:

no.

Kacee Bohle:

we're getting better, right? If you were to ask me these same questions like seven, eight years ago, I would say I don't have anything to tell you. Like I have no idea to how, to help you. But I think one, mental health being a conversation that's becoming more and more, accepted, talked about, I think we have a long way to go still, but I think just having the mental health conversation is a big deal because it's like we're understanding why resistant to change or why they're not open to conversating about it. Well, it's because there's such a deeper thing going on there. And I think for many people in my generation, the, there's this weird, like we're in this strange transition generation of like, we were raised with a lot of what our parents were raised with around like. social media, hardly any internet, very old school way of doing things on paper and not using technology. The farming practices were all pretty standard, but then we were also raised with technology and phones being in our pockets twenty four seven and access to information that is unlimited, right? So like we, we do have a very strange generation kind of caught in between history and the future. And so I think my generation is kind of confused of like, while I see the benefit of that, but I also know that this exists and so how do we the transfer there? And so I think for a lot of people in my generation it's like. Is it appropriate for me to bring this up? I say, hey, there's a better way of doing it because we wanna be respectful of the past generation, but we also see that the reason the family farm is going under is because of the resistance to change and the old ways of doing things. And so I think we're put in a little bit of a pickle if I'm honest with you, but I think that the, individual that approaches the older generation a tactful, data-driven approach is usually more successful than. You're doing it wrong. You're falling behind. Your ways are old, you're outdated. They're not gonna get anywhere. And so of course there's gonna be friction. Now I will say that's not a cookie cutter approach either. I think it's definitely dependent on the person, because I know a lot of 70-year-old people that are way more advanced than I am.

Christine Martin:

Mm-hmm.

Kacee Bohle:

tech savvy. But I also know people who are my age and maybe a little bit younger who are like, I know this one person who's 17 years old will not go get a driver's license. They,

Christine Martin:

Really?

Kacee Bohle:

have zero interest in driving. nephew, who is just about to turn 18, him and his buddies leave their phones at home and it is impossible to get ahold of them. They do not text. They do not text.

Christine Martin:

I,

Kacee Bohle:

is the strangest, it's the strangest thing. It's like what? It took my niece four days to reply to my text. And I don't understand. I thought you guys were like on your phones all the time. Like turns out, like the youngest generation going on right now has zero interest, zero

Christine Martin:

understand it. Yeah.

Kacee Bohle:

I don't understand. I couldn't wait to turn 16 and drive. And now we've got people who are 16 to 18 years old who will not get their driver's license. I, don't understand it. So I think we have to remember to not group everybody together because every single person is an individual and there are some stereotypes there, but we can't just throw everybody into the same category too.

Christine Martin:

No I, appreciate you sharing that. Respecting, the knowledge and the experience has goes a long way to helping shift the transition. And as an educator, I do quite a bit of work on that succession work between one generation, another and it boils down to values. Find those common values, right? If if this is, if the only value you can agree on, we wanna keep this land in the family then, we start from there. And, say, okay okay. So if fa, if keeping the land in the family is important, then what is the next most important value that, we can pay the bills. Okay, what do we need to do to pay the bills? Then that leads to maybe we need to increase productivity. How do we do that but not spend more money? That kind of stuff really helps. So you've shared in the introduction, you're fifth generation. How has that transition been for you Are you running the, place or is it, are your parents still involved?

Kacee Bohle:

My parents are running the show. I help out during the busy season now, and then my the sister just older than me, so there's four of us daughters. The oldest one is the one that passed away, the one just above me. She helps out with my family farm quite often as well. And then I'm the next in line which wasn't how it was, right? Like when I graduated from college, I was the only one interested in the farm, don't have any brothers. And so I was like, if I don't take over the farm, then it goes away, right? And so I had this. Pressure, this responsibility, this weight on my shoulders, that it was up to me. And I put that on myself. And so when I graduated from college, I came back home with a degree in agriculture, business economics, thought I knew everything, came home, and then soon realized like, this isn't exactly what I thought it was gonna be. Turns out I don't just get to come in and take over. My, my ideas aren't vetted. I had a very big ego and, I got a reality check. So I was farming with my family during busy seasons. And then I was also working at our local John Deere dealership. And so I, that's the very first place I ever experienced burnout was 19, 20 years old and working a full-time job during extended hours.'cause John Deere stays late. busy seasons and then as soon as that was over jumping in the tractor and working until the beans were too tough to cut. And I experienced burnout right out of the gate and I was like, I too young to be. This wore out. I started having physical issues because I was standing on concrete all day. And not that I'm whining'cause I know that there are people who work way harder than I do and much more physically demanding jobs. But I just thought, this isn't bringing me joy. There's gotta be more out here. And so I did that for about three years and then I ended up getting reconnected with my college sweetheart, who is my husband now. And we ran into each other and. I was trying to figure out how I could move closer to him. So he was from St. Louis and I applied for a corporate John Deere job. Got it. Which moved me to Missouri. And while I was having the conversation with dad around Hey I have this really amazing job to go work for corporate John Deere. Do I take it because it's gonna move me? What are you and mom and grandpa gonna be doing?'cause grandpa is still alive at the time. And he's like, you need to go. I can't offer you a 401k. I can't offer you any of those benefits. I can't pay you what corporate John Deere is about to pay you. So I think you ought to go. And then, know when the time is right. Come back home and farm. A couple years later, grandpa passes away and I was like, okay, we gotta go, we gotta move back home now. Like telling my husband, time for us to go pack up. We're going back to Indiana and we get back over here. And my dad was like Danielle, my, my oldest sister she's, working with us. We don't really have a spot for you. And I'm like, well, I thought the whole point was the transition. And turns out I had made up this whole plan in my mind and assumed a lot of things. And I'm very transparent about that. My parents know how I feel about that whole thing. It's kind of a, a touchy topic, but no, I am not farming full-time. I am serving other farmers full-time. And maybe one day I will be able to get back on the farm, but I also know I have options and I am going to do it the way that makes sense for my husband and I and my family. And I have some. Slight differences in how I believe farming should be approached than my parents do. We've talked about that as well. So mom, if you're listening, we should be good, right? Hopefully you're still making Thanksgiving. Um, but it's one of those things where it's like I had all these assumptions and hopes and dreams and it did not work out the way that I wanted it to. And I think that an important topic that needs to be talked about more too, there are people who wanna come home and farm. All the things that I keep hearing on social media is how do we get this next generation back on the farm? How do we make farming sexy again? It's like there are people who wanna farm and it's up to y'all to help enable that to happen. And the very first time that I met this one guy, he was from Kentucky and he was moving up to Indiana to help. Transition because the guy here in Indiana didn't have any kids. And he is like, I have this huge farming operation. Like I, I'm ready to start slowing down, like I want to retire and live life. And he had this family friend of his and was like, Hey, if your son's open to farming, I will teach him everything I know and then we will have this succession plan and by the time this year hits, I will be out and he will be in. And so I'm like, there are people who want to farm. And so I think that is an important conversation as well, that needs to be had. Because I think the majority of people just assume this generation doesn't want anything to do with the farm. It's like, no, we're out there. We're just not allowed to talk about it because it's too triggering, it's too touchy, it's too sensitive.

Christine Martin:

Wow.

Kacee Bohle:

like we need to have these conversations. So I'm dealing with it and I don't have the answers, and I don't have that figured out, which is why I don't say I am an expert in succession planning, because I clearly don't have that part figured out. But what I do have figured out is my mindset, and I can rest at night knowing that my mindset and my approach I've got my back with, and I don't need approval by anybody else to understand why I feel the way that I feel.

Christine Martin:

Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. That's so important. And I agree with you. I think the younger generation, and maybe not your generation, but the one the one just behind you. That they, have no exposure to farming or, ranching, but they get it and they want, they wanna be part of it cost of land is too high and they don't have the, that cash and, matching up those farmers and ranchers that don't have kids that wanna come back to the operation versus those, and to the younger ones that do match that up. Regenerative Farmers of America, they do have a, map and they do have a listing of those that want out and those that want in and try and match. People are

Kacee Bohle:

amazing.

Christine Martin:

Yeah, people are starting to, recognize that and, make that an easier transition.

Kacee Bohle:

That is so good. I'm so happy to know that resource exists because honestly, I think it would be easier to start from scratch these days.

Christine Martin:

Guess

Kacee Bohle:

if there is a farmer or, somebody interested in starting a farm, you don't need 2000 acres to

Christine Martin:

no.

Kacee Bohle:

acres. Like you can have a very optimized and efficiently ran homestead or farming operation with just a couple hundred acres. And I think that so many of us that grew up in traditional ag, traditional farming, we think it's gotta be this number, otherwise it's hobby, right? And it's like you can optimize this land, really take advantage of it. And I honestly think it would be easier to start from scratch because. You don't have this expectation, the baggage that comes with the generations. You don't have all the debt that's come with it, the bad decisions, the bad investments, all of that hanging over you. There are so many programs out there for first time farmers that will help you and assist you with getting started. And honestly, I think it would be easier to start from scratch than inherit family farm. Now, putting your emotion aside right now, bringing in emotion and realizing that there is a sentimental value there. I get it. That's tough. And that's a much longer conversation that I think could be valuable to have a, counselor or a therapist involved

Christine Martin:

Sure.

Kacee Bohle:

I think that I think it's an important one to know that those are some options that you've got.

Christine Martin:

Yeah, beautifully said. So we're getting close to our time. Anything that you would like to share that we haven't discussed? And then I would like you to share with the listeners how they can get ahold of you if they wanna work with you or have some questions.

Kacee Bohle:

Yeah. Well thank you for that opportunity. I'll just, I'll leave you with this, that, mindset work, whether it is around the farming operation, the ranching operation, or your own personal relationships, it's an ever evolving thing. And as you've heard me discuss with you today, there are areas in my life that I feel like I've got figured out. And then there are other areas where it's like, uh, I don't quite know what's gonna happen here. And my mindset isn't perfect in those areas. That's what makes me human. the fact that we're having the conversation is the important part because it's an ever evolving, ever changing thing. Every single day we're exposed to new pieces of information that are going to shift and hopefully us grow and evolve into a better, well-rounded human right. And so that's, the one thing that I'll leave with you, is that you've gotta give yourself the permission and the grace to be humbled sometimes by others and realizing maybe you don't have it all figured out. Understanding that things aren't always gonna go the way that you think that they will. And if your mindset is. Not stable. If your mental health is a little rocky, like it it's, either a make or break type of thing, and your lows will feel really low, but your highs will feel really high. And that's the thing that's gonna, that could wear you out, and that could be the thing that causes you to burn out of just this constant up and down and irregular emotions. Right. And so I'll just say that's why this is important. That's why these conversations are important to know that they're not the only ones struggling with these highs and lows that are struggling with your mindset going all over the place and spiraling and being toxic, and just not serving you. Like at least we're having the conversation about it. And I may not have the answer to everything, but I'm at least willing to open the door to the conversation.

Christine Martin:

And I'd like to add to that having that self-awareness of when you get triggered Of, when you're like, I'm not enjoying, this is so important. And the more we can understand our emotions, and I know emotions are a touchy subject, but we are emotional beings, right? We were given these emotions for a reason. And there can be a signal to what we need to dive deeper into. For a long time I disconnected from emotions saying, I'm going to ignore emotions. I'm gonna just use my head. And, I suffered consequences from disconnecting from my emotions, the burnout, the boundaries, the trauma small T trauma. So having that self-awareness is key to what we've been talking about.

Kacee Bohle:

That's so good. The self-awareness piece is the most important and it's the only

Christine Martin:

Yeah

Kacee Bohle:

It's the only thing that you can do is just John Maxwell has a quote that says There's no failing. It's just an opportunity to move forward.

Christine Martin:

Exactly.

Kacee Bohle:

you're experiencing. Have that self-awareness and saying what's working, what's not working, what needs adjusted moving forward. And that's all that we can do. That's the best that we can do.

Christine Martin:

Yeah, my coach likes to say if we don't get, the less the results we want. There's a lesson in there for us to learn.

Kacee Bohle:

Exactly, yes.

Christine Martin:

So how do people get ahold of you?

Kacee Bohle:

So I am most most often found on Instagram or LinkedIn. I'm probably the most active those places. So Ag Coach Kacee on Instagram, and then Kacee Bowl on LinkedIn. And then you can also find me on my website, Kacee bowl.com.

Christine Martin:

And I'll put that in the show notes too.

Kacee Bohle:

Yes. Thank you.

Christine Martin:

Thank you so much for this fabulous conversation. It was so nice to discuss this with you.

Kacee Bohle:

Yes. Thank you so much for having me on today.