Sunboy Meets Grandmother Ayahuasca

In this episode, we dive deep into spirituality with our special guest, Smoky Boncroft, a seasoned practitioner of various spiritual modalities. The conversation is rich with exploration and shared experiences, covering Smoky's extensive journey through psychedelics, ancient rituals, and her profound connection with the cosmos. It becomes clear that our audience is eager for these conversations about spirituality, especially in a world increasingly dominated by AI and digital interaction.

Smoky opens up about her experiences with ayahuasca, recounting the transformative ceremonies she has participated in over the past six years. Her recounting of the rigorous preparation and intense purging rituals associated with ayahuasca sets the stage for a candid discussion on the challenges—and the enlightenment—that come from such deep healing practices. The dynamics of ceremony are laid bare, as she shares stories of the physical, mental, and emotional battles faced in a room filled with others undergoing similar journeys.

Listeners receive an illuminating explanation of what ayahuasca is—an Amazonian brew containing DMT that facilitates profound emotional and spiritual healing—along with a detailed account of the ceremonies’ rigorous structure. Smoky's personal anecdotes serve to demystify the experience: from the purgative nature of the medicine to the integral role of the shaman, who leads participants through the immersive process with traditional healing songs known as "Icaros." We discover how these songs act as anchors, guiding individuals through their psychedelic journeys, and hear about her remarkable encounters during these ceremonies.

As Smoky reflects on the overarching themes that surface—ancestral healing, personal power, and celestial connections—she introduces the listener to what she refers to as her “sun boy” persona, depicting a past life that offers her a feeling of warmth and a sense of belonging beyond this current existence. Her visionary experiences are both enchanting and enlightening, emphasizing that these journeys often lead to a feeling of reconnection with divinity and nature.

The conversation unfolds further into discussions about the balance of suffering and healing, and the notion that through struggles, profound awakenings occur. Smoky shares humorous yet relatable stories of mishaps during ceremonies, including one memorable moment when a participant humorously revealed they had soiled themselves. These anecdotes create levity amidst deep topics, showing the human side of spiritual exploration.

The episode also touches upon Smoky's insights gained from other retreats and her interactions with varied communities. We venture into her experiences at a retreat that included a psychic medium and Reiki practitioner who claimed to have interacted with an alien during a healing session. This sparks an engaging dialogue about the nature of spirituality and the eclectic personalities drawn to such practices.

Smoky’s journey is woven with threads of humor, vulnerability, and cosmic curiosity, providing a rich tapestry for listeners seeking to explore spirituality beyond conventional boundaries. By the episode's end, listeners are not only informed about the complexities of psychedelic experiences and the healing arts but also left with a sense of inspiration to embark on their own spiritual explorations.

Transcript

Speaker0:
[0:20] Well, well, well.

Speaker1:
[0:22] We have a very special guest on our podcast today.

Speaker0:
[0:26] A spiritual guest.

Speaker1:
[0:27] Our listeners seemed very intrigued by our previous podcast, What is Woo?

Speaker0:
[0:32] Yep.

Speaker1:
[0:33] They seemed to not only enjoy the— Something resonated. Something resonated. I think people are hungry for spirituality in their lives.

Speaker0:
[0:41] Looking for lightness.

Speaker1:
[0:42] Looking for lightness in this AI world, in this kind of— Human connection. So it happens to be that my best friend and one of Flav's best friends, longtime listener and supporter, is on the show today. And she is a very spiritual person. Very. Her spirituality, her spiritual practice spans many different decades and many different types of teachings.

Speaker0:
[1:18] Modalities involving ayahuasca, ceremonial cacao, thinning of veils, releasing, setting things on fire.

Speaker1:
[1:29] Yep.

Speaker0:
[1:30] All of it.

Speaker1:
[1:30] And she's also very in touch with aliens and reiki and the paranormal if you want to get your spiritual fix we have it right here this

Speaker0:
[1:41] Is your go-to pod for spiritual fix.

Speaker1:
[1:45] Her name is smoky boncroft smoky boncroft take it away I am curious about some of your psychedelic experiences. Okay. I think you're a very evolved spiritual being. Yeah. So we would like to hear about some of your stories.

Speaker0:
[2:15] Show us the woo.

Speaker1:
[2:16] Now, you recently had an ayahuasca experience.

Speaker2:
[2:21] I did, actually. Just so your listeners don't think that I'm one of those people that's doing it monthly or even quarterly.

Speaker0:
[2:28] Well, you were, though.

Speaker1:
[2:29] You were for a while. How many times have you done ayahuasca? How many times have you done ayahuasca?

Speaker2:
[2:35] Okay. First of all, it's been six years since I last did it. But when I was in Costa Rica, over the span of two years, mind you, you don't just do one ceremony. It's usually three. Okay?

Speaker1:
[2:47] Three in one month.

Speaker2:
[2:48] No, it's usually three in a weekend. Go big or go home. And there's a reason for that if you're interested.

Speaker0:
[2:58] We are.

Speaker2:
[2:58] The portal is open. So, first of all, if you're counting how many ayahuasca ceremonies you've done, it's probably not working.

Speaker1:
[3:07] Okay.

Speaker0:
[3:07] But I do think you told me one.

Speaker2:
[3:09] But 22. Yeah.

Speaker1:
[3:09] Should we explain? Maybe, do you think some of our listeners might not know what ayahuasca is? Maybe explain what ayahuasca is.

Speaker2:
[3:16] Happy to. It's, well, it's a medicine from the Amazon. It's actually a vine and bark that's mixed together in a tea. Oh, boy. Don't spit over your equipment.

Speaker1:
[3:32] No, no, no.

Speaker2:
[3:34] Wow.

Speaker0:
[3:35] What was it? Was it the word T or BART?

Speaker1:
[3:37] Just taking it seriously. It's very hard. Okay. So it's psychedelic.

Speaker2:
[3:43] It contains DMT. It's plant medicine. So it contains DMT, which is dimethyltreptoline.

Speaker1:
[3:49] Okay.

Speaker0:
[3:50] Wow. Yeah. Didn't see that coming out of your mouth. I did it.

Speaker2:
[3:54] DMT is already in us when we're born, when we dream, when we die. When we die. So we have it in our system. We're meant to connect with it. It's not an accident.

Speaker1:
[4:02] Okay.

Speaker2:
[4:03] It was discovered a long time ago in the Amazon, and it was used, it was sort of like a rite of passage for people. Warriors used it, hunters, it made them sharper, it gave them visions. So it's jungle medicine for sure. And the reason why the architecture of ceremonies is typically three is the first night is to just clear you out, to clean you out. As in? As in you.

Speaker0:
[4:29] All the holes.

Speaker2:
[4:30] I mean, you might vomit a lot. It's purgative, and you might shit yourself.

Speaker0:
[4:35] Purgative and shit yourself.

Speaker2:
[4:37] I've never shot myself. Have you vomited a little? For sure. In the last ceremony, it was more energetic vomiting. The vomit didn't come up, but it still was a— You're just retching. Retching. It's some horrible sounds. Dry heaving. The sounds are horrible.

Speaker0:
[4:51] Yeah.

Speaker2:
[4:52] Oh.

Speaker1:
[4:53] Okay.

Speaker0:
[4:54] That would just—I feel—give me anxiety, but I'm not sure, you know.

Speaker1:
[4:59] I've never— That's the first thing. I mean, you have to have a special diet before you do this.

Speaker0:
[5:03] I won't deal with this.

Speaker1:
[5:03] Exactly. A week of just vegetables, no spices.

Speaker2:
[5:06] Exactly, yeah. Nothing stimulating. No caffeine, no sugar.

Speaker1:
[5:10] Right.

Speaker2:
[5:10] Yeah, no salt, no pork. Pork is always like the dirty meat. Yep. You know?

Speaker1:
[5:15] As Jews know about that. Yeah. And the Muslims.

Speaker2:
[5:18] Yeah.

Speaker1:
[5:19] Yep.

Speaker2:
[5:19] And, yeah, the Amazonians.

Speaker0:
[5:23] So, have you ever been at a ceremony and someone shits themselves?

Speaker2:
[5:30] Yes. In fact, the last ceremony I was at, my friend was an angel, meaning she was supporting. And really, that's just a terrible— And they're also

Speaker0:
[5:37] Doing the ayahuasca?

Speaker2:
[5:38] They do, but they don't do a lot. Just a little nip? A little nip, but they're— Rub the gums? Yep. They're going to empty your puke bucket, and they're going to clean your brown sheets.

Speaker1:
[5:49] Wow.

Speaker0:
[5:49] Oh, wow.

Speaker2:
[5:50] And this one guy last time, in the morning, you have a ceremony where you're sharing what happened, and the guy was, like, thanking the person, the angel, and then he's like, okay, fine, everyone, I shit my pants, okay? I shit my pants. So that can happen.

Speaker0:
[6:03] I just am like, okay, hold on.

Speaker2:
[6:06] So why would you do it, right?

Speaker0:
[6:07] Well, no, sure, it must be worth it, but for instance, were you all in a room together?

Speaker2:
[6:14] Yes.

Speaker0:
[6:14] And you did not realize this man had shot himself?

Speaker2:
[6:17] Oh, God, no. You are just fighting for your life spiritually.

Speaker1:
[6:23] Well, explain to us. What do you mean by that? So explain to us your journey.

Speaker0:
[6:26] How long does it last?

Speaker1:
[6:27] We don't want you to reveal too much about your interior life if you don't want to. No.

Speaker2:
[6:32] I'm happy to reveal about the shaman.

Speaker0:
[6:34] You can grab from many experiences.

Speaker1:
[6:35] What does it feel like? What does an ayahuasca trip feel like?

Speaker2:
[6:40] That's like trying to bottle the ocean.

Speaker1:
[6:42] Okay. Okay.

Speaker0:
[6:43] Wow.

Speaker2:
[6:46] It's a lot. It's a lot. Okay. All right. First, I want to say that this last one that I did, because there's a lot to cover. The last one I did was with the Shipibo tribe in Peru. That's the lineage. But I thought, so my shaman was not Peruvian. He was not Shipibo, but he is a early 30-something former hip-hop artist from California. And that made me reluctant. I'm like, but I really liked his partner. I'd done The Way of Wild Wisdom with her, another workshop series. And it was her partner. And when I asked my friend, the angel, about, you know, she's like, oh, he's fantastic. And I was like, well, what's his story? And when she said he did hip-hop in California, I'm like, oh, I can't. It's going to be a bro. But then her partner said to me, he's like, I have never met someone who is more committed to a path in my life about anything, period. And I trust this person. He has a lot of integrity. And I said, okay, I'm interested. And I got to say, this guy has studied in the jungle for 15 years. He's done what's called La Dieta, where he will go and take on the consciousness of a plant and diet for a long time.

Speaker1:
[7:56] What do you mean he takes on the consciousness of a plant?

Speaker0:
[7:58] And diets.

Speaker2:
[8:00] La Dieta. The death. La Dieta just means the diet. A lot of people in this circle go on plant diets. So they will go to the deep jungle with their maestro. The maestro is like the shaman. and they will not eat much for a long time. You know, they'll eat the bare minimum so that their system is totally clear, right? They'll do a dry fast and then eventually they'll have a little bit of water but then they will take whatever plant consciousness they want to enter their body.

Speaker1:
[8:29] Keep the microphone at a consistent level. So just like this is fine.

Speaker0:
[8:33] Plant consciousness. Consciousness.

Speaker2:
[8:36] Consciousness.

Speaker0:
[8:37] Consciousness.

Speaker2:
[8:37] Every plant has its own consciousness.

Speaker0:
[8:40] So they're going to eat like the bark from any old tree?

Speaker2:
[8:43] It's not going to be the bark. Every plant is sort of different. Like you can take on the consciousness of lavender or rose by making a tea and really.

Speaker0:
[8:52] So you starve yourself and then drink a plant tea.

Speaker2:
[8:57] Yeah. And you're in solitude. You're on a digital detox. You don't have a lot of inputs. I have not personally done what they've done. I'm just trying to lend credibility to our shaman, which he had until, so cut to the ceremony where he said, I'm going to be doing what's called Icaros. Okay. And I was like, okay, I've read about these. I thought he's like, they're healing songs. And while you're journeying, I'm going to be.

Speaker0:
[9:24] Oh, boy.

Speaker1:
[9:25] This is your shaman who's leading your ayahuasca ceremony. Okay. Yep.

Speaker0:
[9:29] That's become a lavender plant.

Speaker1:
[9:31] Yeah.

Speaker2:
[9:32] Now we're just doing lavender.

Speaker1:
[9:35] Okay, so he's a lavender plant and he's a shaman. Yep. Go ahead.

Speaker2:
[9:40] So, first of all, you go and you take—it's a ritual, right? There's candles, you know, we set intentions. Then there's the whole thing about, like, intentions. I'm, like, so sick of that word.

Speaker0:
[9:51] The word intention?

Speaker2:
[9:52] The word intention, I just think, is so overused, right?

Speaker0:
[9:56] Like journey.

Speaker2:
[9:57] Yes, journey, intention. And I said to a shaman once, why do I need an intention? And he said, would you go to an airport without a destination?

Speaker0:
[10:06] Fine.

Speaker2:
[10:07] I would.

Speaker1:
[10:08] Sure. Yeah, because it's more fun.

Speaker2:
[10:10] Sounds fun.

Speaker1:
[10:11] Yeah. Sounds fun.

Speaker0:
[10:13] Did you say that?

Speaker2:
[10:14] No. No. Okay. I didn't.

Speaker0:
[10:17] So what – all right. Well, you don't have to tell us your intention, but what's happened?

Speaker2:
[10:21] Well, with the intention, I did say set it and forget it. And he's like, oh, I like that. But I really took that from a crockpot manual. But he liked it. And you do have to set it and forget it. Because once you're on the ride, you're not going to remember it anyway.

Speaker0:
[10:33] Yeah. So what's the big deal? It's like.

Speaker2:
[10:34] He says it anchors you in the way that the healing song, the Ikaro anchors you. Because some people go really far out. They're like blasted to the cosmos. I'm personally not. But.

Speaker0:
[10:43] I have a feeling I would be.

Speaker2:
[10:44] That will tether you back when you hear him singing. I was expecting.

Speaker0:
[10:48] Beautiful voice.

Speaker2:
[10:49] Beautiful voice. No.

Speaker1:
[10:51] Jimbo, can I ask that you keep the microphone in the same position at all times?

Speaker2:
[10:56] I'm fidgety.

Speaker1:
[10:57] So don't go too close.

Speaker0:
[10:58] She's a storyteller.

Speaker1:
[10:58] Like this, like Sarah and I are doing.

Speaker2:
[11:00] How's this?

Speaker1:
[11:01] That's fine. You don't have to be too rigid about it. You're going in and out and in and out.

Speaker2:
[11:08] Can you fix it in post?

Speaker1:
[11:10] No, just keep it. Keep it.

Speaker0:
[11:12] We'll push the AI button.

Speaker1:
[11:14] It'll fix it.

Speaker0:
[11:16] Okay, so the Icarus.

Speaker2:
[11:18] Icarus. Icarus.

Speaker0:
[11:20] Icarus.

Speaker2:
[11:21] Okay, the first night that I heard them, I was purging. I felt like he was, it was so intimate. I felt like he was right in, everyone's on their own mattress, okay, with a bucket. And I set up a little altar for myself with my little crystals and my angel and my oracle card and my mom's mass card. I had a whole thing set up. Forget it. You're just fighting for your life. It's like everything's knocked over. You might as well not even have an altar

Speaker1:
[11:47] Who's knocking it over? Is it you knocking it over?

Speaker0:
[11:51] Yes I would not do either of your things That you both did We.

Speaker2:
[11:56] Love it We

Speaker1:
[11:57] Love the pain What is wrong with us?

Speaker2:
[11:59] We love to suffer So wait Wait, are we addicted to suffering or healing or both?

Speaker0:
[12:03] I think the high you get from not being in the self-induced suffering Well.

Speaker1:
[12:08] Suffering brings about awakening Completely It's all about suffering No,

Speaker0:
[12:12] I'm proud of both of you for this.

Speaker1:
[12:13] Listen, so you knocked over.

Speaker2:
[12:15] I couldn't do what you did. I couldn't do your retreat. Yeah.

Speaker1:
[12:18] I mean, you knocked over your own altar. Is that right? Correct. So you set up an altar of crystals and different, like, tchotchkes and knickknacks and whatever.

Speaker2:
[12:28] I had my Nana's rosary. I had my mom's mass card.

Speaker1:
[12:31] So you had that altar.

Speaker2:
[12:32] And I have a beautiful, like, angel rose quartz.

Speaker1:
[12:36] And so within minutes, you had knocked it down.

Speaker0:
[12:39] You just supermarkets swept it.

Speaker2:
[12:42] I also get really hot. I get hot all the time anyway. I think it's what, sir? Or what's plot?

Speaker0:
[12:49] What could it be? This podcast. It's brought to you by perimenopause. Yeah, long-time supporter, big-time fan of TWAB.

Speaker1:
[13:02] You two attribute everything to perimenopause.

Speaker0:
[13:06] Because everything is perimenopause.

Speaker1:
[13:08] Okay, so you both run hot. Let's just say you both run hot.

Speaker0:
[13:11] I do, but I think she was...

Speaker1:
[13:13] So you knocked the altar down.

Speaker2:
[13:15] I'm sweating so much, I'm taking off layer by layer.

Speaker1:
[13:19] Okay, are you naked? No. Okay, so you still have clothes on.

Speaker2:
[13:22] I have been in other ceremonies. Okay. Not this one.

Speaker1:
[13:25] Okay.

Speaker2:
[13:25] And I did warn the shaman. I was like, I'm going to try real hard. He's like, look, if you get, let's say, extroverted, is the word he used, he said, we have another room we'll bring you in.

Speaker1:
[13:33] Okay. Well, you need to take off your clothes.

Speaker2:
[13:35] If anything, if anything, because I said I've, sometimes I start singing into infinity. One never knows.

Speaker1:
[13:42] Okay.

Speaker2:
[13:43] Not all the time, but in 22 ceremonies, sometimes shit gets real. You find your power.

Speaker1:
[13:48] Okay.

Speaker2:
[13:48] In fact, I have a friend who tried to, her intention was to find her power, and then when the shaman wasn't in the room, she sat in his, like, throne, for lack of a better word, starts playing with the rattles and the tobacco, rain sticks, literally. And she says to the ceremony, she's like, this is what it means to be in your power. She was dead serious.

Speaker1:
[14:09] So she took all the shaman's instruments and started digging them around and playing the instruments.

Speaker2:
[14:17] Yes, tobacco. She found her power.

Speaker1:
[14:20] She took the shaman's spot. Yes. Where was the shaman?

Speaker2:
[14:23] In the other room helping someone.

Speaker0:
[14:25] And what happened when he returned?

Speaker2:
[14:27] I guess that's what I said. I'm like, you've got ovaries, my lady. Yeah. And what's really sweet, though, is that's when her now boyfriend fell in love with her. He was in the ceremony.

Speaker1:
[14:37] He saw her in her power.

Speaker0:
[14:39] It must be meant to be.

Speaker2:
[14:41] Now they run cacao ceremonies. Which I recently learned to understand.

Speaker1:
[14:45] Oh, my God. Okay. Let's stick to one thing. at a time.

Speaker2:
[14:48] One thing at a time.

Speaker1:
[14:49] We'll talk about cacao ceremonies later. Okay, so you're on this ayahuasca trip.

Speaker0:
[14:55] The Icarus.

Speaker1:
[14:56] The Icarus.

Speaker2:
[14:58] I'm so hot.

Speaker0:
[14:59] You threw your altar away.

Speaker1:
[15:01] You threw your altar away. Okay, you're still clothed. You're still clothed.

Speaker0:
[15:06] You're not extroverted yet.

Speaker1:
[15:07] You're not extroverted yet. So then what happened?

Speaker2:
[15:10] So, again, in my mind, the shaman's right here, right here, okay? Okay. But I later learned that you can have altered perception. You can think that they're right on your mat and they're not, which is very trippy. Because in my mind, I'm like, well, it's a one-on-one healing, I guess.

Speaker1:
[15:28] You thought the shaman was having a private lesson with you, but he wasn't even there.

Speaker2:
[15:33] Completely. He was there, but his partner was way across the room. But she's like, that's not uncommon where people think it's just for them. And the Icarus he does, it's another language. So the way he describes it is, and I had these visions, you see really cool, trippy, in some traditions it's called pinta, and they are Icaros. Icaros is the healing song, but it's also the architecture of the visual that you get. If you just Googled it, it's all these little maze things, patterns, colors, but it's always the same for people. Well, that's pretty weird. It's weird. And the Icaro, the song, is meant to work with the visual, and the Icaros can help guide people's journey. So there's some Icaros that he does that are known to be purgative because he's trying to, like, it was pissing me off. The first night he pissed me off.

Speaker1:
[16:29] He's singing these songs called Icaros. He's singing songs called Icaros. Icaros. And sometimes you feel like he's right at your face singing them to you personally, but really he's away somewhere or singing to the group. You feel like he's right there ikaro-ing to you. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. All right.

Speaker2:
[16:47] And he did know that one of my intentions was to help clear my ancestral trauma. That's another big buzzword. And work with the female lineage, especially on my mom's side.

Speaker1:
[16:57] Oh.

Speaker2:
[16:58] Yeah. I mean, there's, it doesn't even matter if you know what happened to them. But I know there's a lot of, there's some mental health stuff. There's body image stuff. I mean, some of it is just your garden variety grew up in the 1950s or whatever. It's women. Yeah. It's women. So I wanted all that cleared, you know.

Speaker0:
[17:23] Effie, fair enough.

Speaker2:
[17:24] Right? I wanted that out.

Speaker0:
[17:26] So –, He was singing special Icaros. Yes.

Speaker2:
[17:32] And in one of the Icaros, he kept saying ancestral, ancestral. And that's why I'm like, oh, this is my prayer. This is it. But the songs, they're not gentle at all. And in my mind, it seemed like he was like a fighter in a ring. And it kept going around and around because it's so repetitive and like staccato and forceful. It's weird that I thought that like it's kind of like who wants to go? Who wants this? Who wants to fight the good fight? And so like he said, he's like afterward, he's like I got really good pockets of healing because like me and a few others, we were just like really getting stuff out. But the songs themselves, I used to know them right after I started doing them to him. And I'm like I felt like I could have sang them with you. And I was kind of like getting into it. I wish I could do one Wow.

Speaker0:
[18:35] Okay.

Speaker2:
[18:35] But better than that, different, but that's the thing. Like, it's very foreign. Your ears haven't heard this.

Speaker0:
[18:41] Pulsating, kind of.

Speaker2:
[18:41] Yeah.

Speaker0:
[18:42] Sounds downright awful.

Speaker2:
[18:44] It was. It was.

Speaker0:
[18:45] Especially if you're feeling nauseous or unwell.

Speaker1:
[18:47] Okay, so you're vomiting.

Speaker0:
[18:49] Get out of my space.

Speaker1:
[18:51] You've destroyed your altar. the shaman is singing songs directly to you. You're sweating bullets.

Speaker2:
[18:59] Someone's shitting the bed. Someone's bawling in the fetal position.

Speaker0:
[19:04] Someone's bawling in fetal position. You were aware of that one.

Speaker1:
[19:06] So by the end of it, what did you come away with?

Speaker2:
[19:09] That's just the first night.

Speaker0:
[19:10] And when did it end?

Speaker2:
[19:12] Let me say that his partner, the female The female shaman. When she comes in with that voice of an angel is not even an exaggeration. She saved us all. and her sound healing, all these beautiful instruments, it's like, thank God, mom's here. Yes. finally yes relief okay

Speaker0:
[19:32] So mom's how we're gonna feel once.

Speaker2:
[19:35] And that's what you're in it for okay is the female shaman but that's just is

Speaker0:
[19:40] There always a.

Speaker2:
[19:40] Female shaman no um there's usually there's music is so embedded in it so yeah there is maybe if she's not even titled like they're both shaman like co-facilitators sometimes it's just a shaman like he could be from columbia or peru if he's the real deal but then he'll have like a tribe of people that make music and are helpers. They work with the fans and the tobacco, the Palo Santo to clear the energy. There's always like, it's a group effort. But they were both equally holding the ceremony, holding a very good container. They knew how to move the energy around. But the first night is to clear you out. And then the second night is to show you more, show you where you're not so aligned in your life. Whether you ask for it or not, invariably it comes up. So I had to work with that.

Speaker1:
[20:34] So listen, you go through these three days of what seems like magic.

Speaker2:
[20:38] The third day fills you with light.

Speaker1:
[20:40] So let's go to the third day.

Speaker0:
[20:41] So it ends on a high.

Speaker2:
[20:42] It ends on a big high.

Speaker1:
[20:43] The third day ends on a high. So when you left, when you finally emerged from this trance of yours or a spiritual journey of yours, what did you come away with?

Speaker2:
[20:54] I felt more, okay, this is going to sound like my friend who said, in your power, and maybe that's a common thing for women these days, which is great, I felt completely in my power.

Speaker0:
[21:09] Thank you.

Speaker2:
[21:11] Crickets. Not the cackle. Come on.

Speaker1:
[21:14] Okay, so you felt completely in your palace.

Speaker2:
[21:16] I felt connected to God. I felt connected to nature. There you go. I did.

Speaker0:
[21:21] You were cleansed.

Speaker2:
[21:22] I felt cleansed.

Speaker1:
[21:23] Okay.

Speaker2:
[21:24] Yeah, I felt like I saw— You were reborn.

Speaker1:
[21:26] So was there repentance and forgiveness and I'm sorry and— I wouldn't—I mean,

Speaker2:
[21:32] Those feel like Christian words or Catholic.

Speaker1:
[21:35] Well, that's okay, but that's part of a spiritual journey where you feel a regret or a shame, and then you feel a divine forgiveness.

Speaker2:
[21:46] I'd also like to share that this has happened to me on more than one occasion where it's revealed to me, for lack of a better word, that I'm a sun boy.

Speaker1:
[21:54] What's a sun boy?

Speaker2:
[21:56] Those are my own words. I don't know how else to say it, but I'm going back to some kind of life where I'm just this bright, sunny little… Boy. I mean, he's Native American. I'll say it. I'm a Native American sun boy, and I've never felt so seen.

Speaker0:
[22:10] A future life or a past life?

Speaker2:
[22:12] That's not even clear. It just, that felt more real to me than this identity that I have now. And I also...

Speaker1:
[22:20] What is a sun boy? What is a sun boy?

Speaker0:
[22:24] If you could draw a sun boy.

Speaker2:
[22:29] Did you ever see Cocoa?

Speaker1:
[22:32] The Disney movie?

Speaker2:
[22:34] Yeah.

Speaker0:
[22:35] Oh, yeah.

Speaker2:
[22:36] The lead character, Miguel.

Speaker0:
[22:38] That's a sun boy.

Speaker2:
[22:40] Well, that's what I look like.

Speaker1:
[22:42] Is it a boy who spends a lot of time in the sun? Is that what a sun boy is?

Speaker2:
[22:47] It's a boy that's also the sun.

Speaker1:
[22:50] Okay. Oh, and the plot thickens. What do you say? Oh, like you understand. The plot thickens. Oh, I understand.

Speaker0:
[22:57] It's not just the boy.

Speaker2:
[22:57] It's not a boy.

Speaker0:
[22:58] It's a boy that is the sun.

Speaker1:
[22:59] Okay.

Speaker0:
[23:00] Got it.

Speaker2:
[23:01] These things can't be understood with the mind.

Speaker1:
[23:04] I know. Listen, you don't have to tell me.

Speaker2:
[23:06] I met my star parents.

Speaker1:
[23:07] Who are your star parents?

Speaker2:
[23:09] I was on this awesome planet, and again, it felt realer than this reality. And I'm like, you can just leave me here. I'm all good. Beautiful, blue, silvery planet and like these sort of light beings. And it was like a download revealed to me that this is your star family.

Speaker1:
[23:27] So you had star parents on this blue planet.

Speaker2:
[23:30] Many Lives, Many Masters. Read the book. Yeah.

Speaker1:
[23:33] Okay. So you had these parents. They all lived on a blue—it's a blue planet.

Speaker2:
[23:38] Blue and silver.

Speaker1:
[23:39] Blue and silver planet. Was there oxygen there?

Speaker2:
[23:42] I didn't ask.

Speaker1:
[23:43] Was there gravity?

Speaker2:
[23:44] Not sure.

Speaker1:
[23:45] Okay. So you have these parents. They're aliens or— Stars. Star parents. Star parents.

Speaker0:
[23:52] Were you a star?

Speaker2:
[23:53] I don't know, because I was looking. I had no, I guess. You had no form. I had no form.

Speaker1:
[23:58] You had no form. You had no legs or arms.

Speaker2:
[24:00] You were woo. I was. I was woo. I became woo.

Speaker0:
[24:04] You were woo. Yeah. On that starry planet.

Speaker1:
[24:05] It was beautiful. Wow. It was beautiful. I love it.

Speaker2:
[24:08] So between Sun Boy and the star family, you know.

Speaker0:
[24:10] Very celestial.

Speaker2:
[24:11] It was beautiful. Yeah.

Speaker0:
[24:16] So, which trip was that?

Speaker2:
[24:18] This was a few weeks ago.

Speaker0:
[24:20] Oh, this was the most recent.

Speaker2:
[24:22] This was the most recent. Again, I hadn't done it in six years, and then I just went to a place in upstate New York.

Speaker1:
[24:26] So you felt healed, you felt restored to some degree. Yeah. And then you were off to New Mexico.

Speaker0:
[24:35] I just have a few more follow-up questions. Yeah, go ahead. Mostly, I'm interested in what are you doing between the ceremonies?

Speaker2:
[24:46] Sleeping, eating healthy food, getting outside in nature, journaling.

Speaker0:
[24:52] How long does it last?

Speaker2:
[24:53] It's a long-ass ceremony starting around 7 p.m. and then you're done about 4 a.m.

Speaker0:
[25:01] And how do you know when you're done?

Speaker2:
[25:03] When the last cup is served and the journey is complete.

Speaker0:
[25:07] Does everyone end at the same time?

Speaker2:
[25:09] No, if some people are still in their process, then they'll wait. But at the end, the shaman comes around and does sort of an energy clearing. And he's, well, he's actually sealing, sealing in the good stuff. So they use tobacco, one of our oldest plant medicines. And he does this very comforting.

Speaker1:
[25:25] It's like, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh. That feels very relaxing.

Speaker2:
[25:33] Does it? Yeah. It is. And then you have a little talk. And it's so beautiful when they're doing one-to-one talks, even when people go up for the cup. It reminds me of I grew up in the Catholic faith where people would go up for the sacrament, you know, for the host. But this you're just seeing the shaman over candlelight, you know, and they take the cup and they hold their heart and set their intention. And he has a little talk with you, you know, how is it? How are you doing? How is it in there? So you feel very held, very cared for. That's very important to be in a safe space.

Speaker0:
[26:03] Yes.

Speaker2:
[26:04] Yes. Yeah, and there's a lot of music. So at the end, we all sang. Oh, here was kind of the jarring part. They had a resident musician there named Bob. And they're like, you know, Bob's here tonight. And I forgot that Bob was going to do music. So I'm deep in my process. I've dealt with the Icaros. I've endured that. I've heard the beautiful music from the partner, the angel.

Speaker1:
[26:27] Icaros are the songs,

Speaker0:
[26:28] Right? The chanting.

Speaker2:
[26:29] The chanting. But the females' Icaros were very beautiful and different. In fact, and it's kind of funny, they work together and live together, obviously. But she told me that he's like, you know, why don't you ever kind of, you know, meet me and riff with me? I was like, oh, that's such a rapper. And she's just like, that's not how the Icaros come to me. Thank God.

Speaker0:
[26:48] Oh, these are— They're a couple. They're bespoke? What do you mean? The Icaros, is it a set song or they make them up on the spot?

Speaker2:
[26:58] No, it's not improvised. They're set songs.

Speaker1:
[27:01] Kim, please, I'll ask you once again. Just hold your microphone at the same place.

Speaker0:
[27:05] You mean Smokey Bong? My name is Smokey Bong?

Speaker1:
[27:08] Just hold. You can just keep it at the same place. Okay. Okay.

Speaker0:
[27:17] Okay, so you're going to go back where at 4 a.m.? After the music.

Speaker2:
[27:22] Well, people that paid for a room are going to go to their room.

Speaker1:
[27:25] A little bit further from your mouth. What do you

Speaker0:
[27:26] Mean people didn't pay for a room?

Speaker1:
[27:28] That's good. That's good.

Speaker2:
[27:29] Just right here?

Speaker1:
[27:30] Yep. That's fine.

Speaker2:
[27:31] Some people paid for a room. I already paid $1,500 for the weekend. I didn't feel the need to pay for a room, so I slept in my bed on my mattress. I slept in the ceremony room.

Speaker1:
[27:41] Yeah, why not?

Speaker0:
[27:42] You slept in the shit puke room. With your altar and tatters all around you.

Speaker2:
[27:50] I cleaned it up the next day.

Speaker0:
[27:54] My God. So please tell me that they took those buckets out.

Speaker1:
[28:00] Yeah. Did they take the vomit bucket?

Speaker2:
[28:01] That's what the angel does.

Speaker1:
[28:02] Wow. That is some angel.

Speaker0:
[28:04] Damn.

Speaker2:
[28:05] Well, she gets free ayahuasca ceremonies.

Speaker0:
[28:07] Who else slept in that room?

Speaker2:
[28:08] I slept next to a guy who was doing it for the first time. And he was so far gone. We were, we were asked, everyone was asked to share a song on the third ceremony and they were very formal, you know, because ritual regulates the nervous system. We need ritual and we need to know our parts.

Speaker0:
[28:29] Sure. And the process, the order.

Speaker2:
[28:32] Exactly. So we, we had it all choreographed and they're like, everyone's going to do a song. If you don't want to do it, you just say pass.

Speaker0:
[28:40] Right? Yeah.

Speaker2:
[28:40] So I did my song and after my song, it was completely quiet. And when I was done with, when you're done with your song, you have to go, so everyone knows, okay, it's time for the next. And then I look over and he's just... He's blasted to the cosmos. And it's the deepest silence you've ever been in. And I'm thinking, do I wake him up? Do I, you know? Yeah. And it was a long silence. And then the shaman came over. He nudged him, said his name repeatedly. And then he's like, would you like to share a song? And then he just goes, pass.

Speaker1:
[29:19] Oh, wow.

Speaker2:
[29:20] He's very sweet.

Speaker1:
[29:21] Oh, boy. So you slept with him, next to him.

Speaker2:
[29:24] I slept next to him. There was, yeah, yeah. A lot of, in this particular ceremony, there was a lot of gender-fluid people.

Speaker1:
[29:30] Okay.

Speaker2:
[29:31] Which was interesting because I told the shaman the next day, I said, I'm sunboy. I said that in my sheremoni. And I said, I'm sunboy.

Speaker1:
[29:39] Which is half sun.

Speaker0:
[29:40] Sheremoni.

Speaker1:
[29:41] Sunboy is half sun, half boy.

Speaker0:
[29:43] Half boy. Coco, like Coco the movie.

Speaker2:
[29:46] Yes. And the shaman's partner said to me privately, she's like, you know, there's a lot of, like, gender fluidity here. Do you think that's influencing your journeys? And I, because I said, I said, maybe I'm a boy.

Speaker0:
[29:58] Well, you said that you've seen yourself as some boy before.

Speaker2:
[30:01] Yes. That was in a mushroom ceremony.

Speaker0:
[30:04] It wasn't just the they-thums.

Speaker2:
[30:07] That's true. That's true.

Speaker1:
[30:09] So. Fair. Okay.

Speaker0:
[30:12] But maybe the energy was just open.

Speaker2:
[30:14] It was very open energy. A lot of young Manhattan, like one guy was like a club kid, you know.

Speaker0:
[30:21] Did he pay for a bed?

Speaker2:
[30:22] No, but there was actually, I mean, I guess safe space. I can just say whatever.

Speaker1:
[30:27] Yep.

Speaker0:
[30:27] Just don't say names.

Speaker2:
[30:29] I won't say names.

Speaker0:
[30:31] Kim, don't say any names.

Speaker1:
[30:33] Okay, sir. Jimbo. Okay.

Speaker2:
[30:37] I thought $1,500 for the weekend was a lot.

Speaker1:
[30:39] That is a lot for a weekend.

Speaker0:
[30:41] For what? Like, I guess you get the food and the ceremony.

Speaker2:
[30:45] The food is, I mean, some hummus and watermelon.

Speaker0:
[30:48] Let's be clear. Oh, not getting better. Okay.

Speaker2:
[30:53] But you can't have a lot because you have to be on la dieta. Just say la dieta.

Speaker0:
[30:58] It's fun. La dieta. La dieta. Become the plant spirit.

Speaker1:
[31:02] Mm-hmm.

Speaker0:
[31:02] The consciousness.

Speaker1:
[31:03] This?

Speaker2:
[31:03] Are you sold yet?

Speaker0:
[31:05] No.

Speaker1:
[31:06] Okay.

Speaker0:
[31:07] It freaks me out. I love hearing your experience. So you're sleeping in the room.

Speaker2:
[31:11] No. So I thought $1,500 was a lot.

Speaker0:
[31:13] I agree. Okay.

Speaker2:
[31:13] And then I heard this one of the club kids who doesn't have a lot of money talking to the shaman after saying, I heard that you guys might do a scholarship or financial application. The shaman's like, look, a lot of people ask me for discounts. I'm happy to do it when I can. Just know that it comes out of my money. You know, we've got to rent this house, blah, blah, blah. And then And apparently this kid was getting discounts. And then the shaman said, and I heard that you found $700 in your drawer. You shared that. And then the guy was like, yeah, I did. And he's like, and I'm just going to say, do you think, you know, you sit with that. Do you think since I've given you all these discounts that maybe.

Speaker1:
[31:50] How did he find $700 in his drawer? And what drawer? I thought you said he didn't have a room. No. What drawer?

Speaker2:
[31:58] This is in a prior ceremony.

Speaker1:
[32:00] Okay.

Speaker2:
[32:00] Okay. Because the shaman has a history of giving this guy, young man, discounts. And somehow he was privy to the fact that he, in his house, found $700.

Speaker0:
[32:12] I don't know. Where he lives.

Speaker2:
[32:13] Where he lives.

Speaker0:
[32:13] In Queens or whatever.

Speaker2:
[32:14] The implication being, you're $700 richer. I've been giving you these deals for so long.

Speaker0:
[32:19] This is all kinds of crazy, in my opinion.

Speaker1:
[32:22] Fair.

Speaker0:
[32:23] Why is the shaman... poking around and this guy's...

Speaker2:
[32:26] He didn't find the $700. I don't know why he was privy to that.

Speaker0:
[32:30] That's what I'm saying. And then bringing it up, waving it over his head.

Speaker1:
[32:33] How does the shaman know that this kid in Queens has $700 in his drawer?

Speaker0:
[32:38] And then why are you waving, dangling it out like he owes him something?

Speaker2:
[32:42] I don't know.

Speaker0:
[32:42] It negates the charity.

Speaker2:
[32:44] I didn't like that. Yeah, no, you're right.

Speaker0:
[32:46] You're right. One last thing. It makes it about the capitalism. Yeah. And you're wearing this guy to be a healer and whatever.

Speaker2:
[32:54] This is the point he made. He goes, let me ask you this. He's like, in what other industry? You know, if you go to a restaurant, do you start asking for a discount on the menu? He's like, why in the healing industry does everyone feel entitled?

Speaker0:
[33:06] Wow. This guy.

Speaker1:
[33:07] The shaman said that. Yeah. Wow. During the ceremony.

Speaker2:
[33:11] Not during.

Speaker0:
[33:12] After his Igro chants. You owe me money, money, money. Give me 700 that you found in the drawer. In Queens. In Queens. I know it because I heard it from the pigeons.

Speaker2:
[33:29] Side note, if you ever see a stray feral dog, I heard when I was in Costa Rica, they said, go to the dog. It'll back off. I'm going to try it with your cat.

Speaker1:
[33:40] Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker0:
[33:41] Roberta needs a little something.

Speaker1:
[33:42] Roberta needs a little. All right. Quick break.

Speaker0:
[33:47] What a journey. What a journey.

Speaker2:
[33:50] What a world.

Speaker0:
[33:53] From here out, Smokey Boncroft is going by Sunboy.

Speaker2:
[34:03] I'm not mad about it.

Speaker1:
[34:06] So we're talking about some stuff outside. Yeah. What was it?

Speaker2:
[34:13] We didn't talk about what ayahuasca tastes like.

Speaker1:
[34:15] Okay. What does ayahuasca taste like?

Speaker2:
[34:18] So I'll start with the consistency. Motor oil. Sludge.

Speaker0:
[34:23] Wow.

Speaker2:
[34:23] Okay. It is warm, sour raisins. Every time.

Speaker0:
[34:29] Wow. That doesn't sound too bad.

Speaker2:
[34:31] I said that to the shaman, and he's like, I've never tasted a sour raisin. But you could imagine it.

Speaker1:
[34:38] Now, after this ayahuasca ceremony that you did, you went on a writer's retreat.

Speaker2:
[34:45] We've got to back up.

Speaker1:
[34:46] Go ahead.

Speaker2:
[34:46] I mentioned that with all the beautiful songs. First, the forceful, aggressive, provocative Icaros by our shaman.

Speaker1:
[34:55] These are songs that they come up with on their own?

Speaker2:
[34:58] They learn them through the Shipibo.

Speaker1:
[35:00] What's the Shipibo?

Speaker0:
[35:01] Oh boy, here we go Sarah.

Speaker2:
[35:03] Do you remember?

Speaker0:
[35:04] It's a tribe Where?

Speaker1:
[35:06] Probably Peru Do they go to Peru to learn these songs?

Speaker2:
[35:10] They've been doing

Speaker0:
[35:10] It for And this is where the shaman, the hip-hop tap dancer from California.

Speaker2:
[35:17] He's not a tap dancer?

Speaker0:
[35:22] But I bet he could. He could. I bet he could. He sounds very rhythmic. It's where he went and did the La Dieta in the forest. Are they?

Speaker1:
[35:31] Your memory is amazing.

Speaker0:
[35:33] He went into the forest, did the La Dieta, and then drank the tea and became the consciousness of a plant.

Speaker1:
[35:39] Oh, right.

Speaker0:
[35:40] And that is what validates him.

Speaker1:
[35:43] Okay.

Speaker2:
[35:43] For 15 years.

Speaker0:
[35:45] And makes it.

Speaker1:
[35:46] He did that for 15 years? Wait.

Speaker0:
[35:48] He was a plant consciousness for 15 years?

Speaker2:
[35:50] And for 15 years, he's been going to the jungle.

Speaker0:
[35:53] To do La Dieta. Well, la-di-da, great for him. Okay, so.

Speaker2:
[36:02] So with the songs, I forgot in my, I was far away, you know, I'm in my process, my journey. And all of a sudden, mind you, this is happening the same time that our host is on her retreat.

Speaker1:
[36:16] You, right? Oh, yeah.

Speaker0:
[36:18] Oh, y'all were, this is right.

Speaker1:
[36:19] We were having a parallel journey.

Speaker0:
[36:23] Dueling retreats.

Speaker1:
[36:24] Not dueling, parallel.

Speaker0:
[36:26] Parallel.

Speaker1:
[36:27] Complementary. Synchronistic.

Speaker0:
[36:28] I was on a retreat with Pegasus of stamina.

Speaker1:
[36:32] Yep. Go ahead.

Speaker2:
[36:33] So all of a sudden I hear someone, Bob, with an acoustic guitar.

Speaker0:
[36:42] The resident musician.

Speaker2:
[36:43] That I forgot was going to play.

Speaker0:
[36:45] Whatever that means.

Speaker2:
[36:47] But here you have all these you know different indigenous songs and all of a sudden an acoustic guitar comes out were

Speaker0:
[36:53] Any of these people indigenous at.

Speaker2:
[36:55] All no okay cultural appropriation white is across the board across the board um all right bob i think the shaman's wife is from connecticut But she's been to the jungle.

Speaker0:
[37:14] Sure. Okay.

Speaker2:
[37:16] They have a maestro. I did say, I was like, can the maestro come here? And they're like, oh, no.

Speaker0:
[37:22] Oh, not the maestro here. You're crazy. You think the maestro's coming here?

Speaker2:
[37:32] What's the next logical step?

Speaker1:
[37:34] Okay, go ahead.

Speaker2:
[37:35] He wants nothing to do with us yahoos. He's probably laughing all the way to the bank. Absolutely.

Speaker1:
[37:40] Okay, so what's...

Speaker2:
[37:41] I should have asked what percentage of the 1,500 goes to the maestro.

Speaker0:
[37:45] Yeah, I bet not much.

Speaker1:
[37:46] Wait, who's the maestro? Who knows?

Speaker0:
[37:48] Someone in the jungle.

Speaker2:
[37:50] His, like, the guru.

Speaker0:
[37:52] Oh. The main shaman.

Speaker2:
[37:53] He doesn't call himself a guru, but the one he learned from his father. It's the lineage. I don't want to make light of the Shipibo lineage.

Speaker1:
[38:00] But the maestro is somewhere in California.

Speaker0:
[38:02] No, no, no. Peru. The shamans from California.

Speaker1:
[38:06] The shamans from California, the maestros in Peru.

Speaker0:
[38:09] That's who they would study under.

Speaker2:
[38:11] Yes, but he is not interested in coming to upstate New York.

Speaker1:
[38:14] Okay.

Speaker2:
[38:14] I don't know why.

Speaker0:
[38:16] Yeah, I can't imagine.

Speaker2:
[38:18] He has a family, a farm, a life.

Speaker1:
[38:21] Okay, so maestro is not there. No. Now, what was your parallel journey with me?

Speaker2:
[38:25] So all of a sudden, I'm deep in my process, and I hear an acoustic guitar.

Speaker1:
[38:40] Okay

Speaker2:
[38:40] And and all of a sudden i hear someone singing um iris by the goo goo dolls

Speaker1:
[38:47] I've never fucking sung or heard that song okay so what was it sing it sing it for us sing us the goo goo dolls oh who's singing this

Speaker2:
[39:03] Bob the resident musician that i forgot was going to regale us with his song after the icarus it was a tonal change

Speaker1:
[39:13] I keep forgetting what

Speaker2:
[39:14] The healing song the healing

Speaker1:
[39:16] Song okay okay It's a great song. Oh my God.

Speaker2:
[39:23] You'll know it.

Speaker1:
[39:24] Isn't that from the movie with Meg Ryan?

Speaker0:
[39:27] I think so.

Speaker2:
[39:28] It is from Companion, but...

Speaker1:
[39:31] That's the Angel movie with Meg Ryan and what's his name? Okay, so that means...

Speaker2:
[39:39] I don't want the world to see me.

Speaker1:
[39:41] So that made you think of me?

Speaker2:
[39:43] No, when that happened, I lost my shit. I couldn't stop laughing. laughing did you piss yourself laughing almost yeah almost surprised

Speaker0:
[39:52] You didn't actually.

Speaker2:
[39:53] And that's when you came to me we were laughing together

Speaker1:
[39:56] Yes i was laughing in my retreat thank you with you there no

Speaker0:
[40:00] Joke oh you saw gabby in your journey.

Speaker1:
[40:02] I saw kim on my journey jimbo on my journey yeah did

Speaker0:
[40:06] Anyone see me.

Speaker2:
[40:11] I didn't did you

Speaker1:
[40:12] I didn't but you weren't on

Speaker0:
[40:15] Retreat I wasn't.

Speaker1:
[40:17] When I was saying who is it dragging around this corpse I heard you laughing and saying it to me yes Gabby who is it dragging around this corpse that's when I was laughing when

Speaker2:
[40:29] Bob started playing Iris by Goo Goo Dolls I lost it there

Speaker0:
[40:34] Were two ways.

Speaker1:
[40:35] It could have gone That was a good way.

Speaker2:
[40:37] Yes.

Speaker1:
[40:38] I love it. I love it.

Speaker0:
[40:39] Across the cosmos. Well, maybe you weren't even that far apart. I don't think so. Physically.

Speaker1:
[40:44] Probably 20 minutes. You know we're both upstate New York. Probably a 20-minute drive from each other. Oh. Yeah.

Speaker2:
[40:50] Can we say our locations?

Speaker1:
[40:52] Or no? I don't even know.

Speaker2:
[40:54] She doesn't even know where she was.

Speaker1:
[40:56] She doesn't. I don't know. Okay.

Speaker0:
[40:58] We were close. Wow. Spiritually and geographically. So did he do any more?

Speaker2:
[41:02] Afterward, he did. For me, it was the tonal shit.

Speaker1:
[41:06] Bob had a really bad taste in music.

Speaker0:
[41:09] Very, really poor choice, Bob. You didn't, Bob.

Speaker1:
[41:14] He wasn't very spiritually advanced.

Speaker2:
[41:16] No, but you know what I feel bad for Bob? Because he goes to a lot of these ceremonies, and now I think it's for free because he shares his music. But he has chronic pain.

Speaker0:
[41:25] Well, that does suck for Bob. Yeah, it does.

Speaker1:
[41:27] It sucks for Bob. It does.

Speaker0:
[41:29] He doesn't have to put it on you, though, with the goo-goo dolls while you're in shamanic ceremony.

Speaker2:
[41:36] And, you know, the song that I shared, and this wasn't even during the sharing. That just came out of nowhere, which is why it was so funny to me. But when we did the formal sharing, I did a song from the Lakota tribe. It's a medicine song. Would you like to sing it with me?

Speaker1:
[41:49] We'll like to hear it. I don't know if we can sing it with you.

Speaker2:
[41:51] It's call and response.

Speaker1:
[41:53] Okay. Go ahead.

Speaker2:
[41:55] You ready?

Speaker1:
[41:56] Sure.

Speaker2:
[41:57] Okay.

Speaker0:
[41:57] If you're making us do it, let's do it. All right.

Speaker2:
[42:00] So I'll do it then you. Okay. We-hey-ya, we-hey-ya, we-hey-ya.

Speaker1:
[42:09] We-hey-ya, we-hey-ya, we-hey-ya.

Speaker2:
[42:18] And, I'm not dumb.

Speaker1:
[42:21] Okay, sorry, go ahead.

Speaker2:
[42:22] And may all mothers know that they are loved.

Speaker1:
[42:26] And may all mothers know that they are loved. And may all daughters' daughters know that they are beautiful. That the circle of women may live on.

Speaker2:
[42:39] That the fire of the goddess may burn on.

Speaker0:
[42:42] Are you making it up as you say?

Speaker2:
[42:44] Yeah. I sang that at Pachamama around a fire with a hundred women in a peyote ceremony. Anyway.

Speaker1:
[42:56] So listen, dude.

Speaker2:
[42:57] Yeah. I am grounded. I'm a very grounded person.

Speaker1:
[42:59] You are.

Speaker0:
[43:01] You have flights and you ground. Yeah.

Speaker1:
[43:03] Okay. So you've been through a lot of trips, a lot of journeys. Yeah. Um, The ayahuasca journey being the first one we've talked about, but you've been to a lot of retreats, too, that didn't involve ayahuasca, but you met a lot of very interesting and sometimes peculiar people on the way. For sure.

Speaker0:
[43:24] It attracts a certain crowd.

Speaker1:
[43:27] It attracts a certain crowd. And you're one of them. And I would say you are one of the most grounded people in these retreats. Yeah. But you also have a very open mind, so you're able to relate to a lot of people that perhaps maybe don't have their feet on the ground as much as you do. But I was very interested to hear. Are there any New Mexico retreat?

Speaker2:
[43:50] I would like to tell you about a retreat I went to in Lake George on Halloween weekend last year.

Speaker1:
[43:57] Lake George, New York.

Speaker2:
[43:57] Yeah, Lake George, New York.

Speaker1:
[43:59] Upstate New York.

Speaker2:
[43:59] Yeah, at the Fort William Henry, which is very historic for the Battle of Fort William Henry between the French and the Indians.

Speaker1:
[44:10] Okay. American, Native Americans. Native Americans.

Speaker2:
[44:13] Oh, my God. I think it's actually, no, I think it's actually,

Speaker1:
[44:15] In this case, here we go again. In this case, it's Indian.

Speaker2:
[44:18] No, in this case, it's Indian. When you talk about the French-Indian War, you don't say the French-Native American War.

Speaker0:
[44:23] Oh, my God.

Speaker1:
[44:24] It's just filling up. Okay, go ahead. Yeah.

Speaker2:
[44:27] So we went down to the fort, which is where some shit went down. Okay. Okay. I think we're in like the 1600s.

Speaker0:
[44:35] All right.

Speaker1:
[44:36] I don't know. I don't know this history. Go ahead. Yeah.

Speaker2:
[44:39] I don't know. Obviously, I don't either.

Speaker0:
[44:40] I just wonder, is any of it real important to describe this retreat?

Speaker2:
[44:45] Okay. What got me, first of all, was the woman who was facilitating and leading it is a very well-renowned psychic medium.

Speaker1:
[44:55] Okay.

Speaker2:
[44:56] And my sister had gone to her and I've heard good things. Plus, you know how expensive Lake George is and the Fort William Henry. Okay, we go there over the summer. That's like $700 a night. My cousins pay it. They have money. We stay somewhere else. Anyway, this was $2.50 for the weekend. I got a lakefront room with a hot tub in it, like a jacuzzi and a fireplace. And the entire weekend plus food facilitators and two nights at the Fort Uma Henry was $2.50.

Speaker1:
[45:22] I'm in. So they're almost paying you to come.

Speaker0:
[45:24] That's crazy.

Speaker2:
[45:25] Yeah, the economics don't work.

Speaker0:
[45:26] Sounding more my vibe.

Speaker2:
[45:28] I think you would be totally fine with this. There's no plant medicine. There's nothing. No. In fact, there's very good presentations, one of which was a woman who practices Reiki, and she goes up and does a full PowerPoint presentation.

Speaker1:
[45:42] What's Reiki?

Speaker2:
[45:43] Reiki is energy healing, energy transfer.

Speaker1:
[45:46] Okay.

Speaker2:
[45:48] So she does that and she gave a presentation and I'm with her I'm like yeah Reiki I know Reiki I've had Reiki done this is like pretty benign but then she says in fact I've even had an alien on my table wow I'm in okay how she

Speaker1:
[46:08] Alien on the table okay

Speaker2:
[46:12] And she knew that because she knows human energy And she's like, wow, this is something different. Before the being even got on the table, she knew, oh, wow, this is what I'm working with. And she said, OK, so normally I ask people, you know, you want to be comfortable, take your socks and shoes off your hat. And I'll just say the alien.

Speaker0:
[46:29] It was dressed and it was in a human.

Speaker1:
[46:32] What kind of baseball cap was it? It was a human body. Was it a Yankees cap, New York Mets?

Speaker0:
[46:35] Yeah, what kind of fashion does the alien have?

Speaker1:
[46:37] What kind of fan was he? A fan of which baseball team?

Speaker2:
[46:40] I don't know, but we should get her on here.

Speaker0:
[46:43] That would be great. I'd love a follow up.

Speaker2:
[46:45] Yeah.

Speaker1:
[46:45] How big was the alien? Was it short?

Speaker0:
[46:48] It was short. It was like Elijah Wood is what I'm envisioning. With the little hat, just an Elijah Wood kind of guy.

Speaker2:
[46:58] But what is the hat? I wonder what the hat is hiding.

Speaker0:
[47:01] Maybe a hat of hair.

Speaker1:
[47:03] What color was the alien?

Speaker2:
[47:05] It looked human.

Speaker1:
[47:08] It was a human. Let's be clear. Are we talking about like a Lego man alien? Like how big is this alien?

Speaker0:
[47:13] Let me clear something up for you. A small man that looked like Elijah Wood came and got on her table. and the Reiki teacher was like oh, that's an alien and.

Speaker2:
[47:30] Refused to take off

Speaker0:
[47:31] Clothes and he wouldn't take off his hat or shoes but it looked like Elijah would it looked like a man.

Speaker1:
[47:40] Now we told you like 5 feet or like 2

Speaker0:
[47:42] Feet probably 5 too 5 too.

Speaker1:
[47:45] On the table why did he get on the table why couldn't he sit on the chair it

Speaker0:
[47:49] Might be helpful if you just think that it was a human.

Speaker2:
[47:53] And that it was a massage. Treat it like a massage.

Speaker1:
[47:56] What do you mean? He was getting massage or he was massaging? He was getting Reiki.

Speaker2:
[47:59] It's like massage but you don't touch the body.

Speaker1:
[48:02] Yeah. Okay.

Speaker2:
[48:03] The unfortunate part is we're in a ballroom, like a corporate ballroom.

Speaker0:
[48:08] Did anyone laugh? Was there any reaction?

Speaker2:
[48:10] So you can't just like rapid fire questions. Someone's at a podium.

Speaker0:
[48:13] But what was the response?

Speaker2:
[48:16] Aw. Shock and awe. And then other people just, yeah, nodding like okay but no laughter no yeah okay no except for actually una and i were stifling laughter okay and afterward my friend this is my friend una she's like i didn't connect with that woman did you it's like i think she's great But she did, okay, so she did say that while she was giving Reiki, she's like, I guess the way she described it was, the energy was like nothing she's ever worked with. It was foreign. The DNA, the architecture, everything was different.

Speaker1:
[48:48] Did he show up out of nowhere or did he come through a door? He just came in.

Speaker0:
[48:51] It was a retreat.

Speaker2:
[48:52] He was beamed. He didn't come to the retreat. She's telling a story of her Reiki practice.

Speaker0:
[48:57] Got it. But you don't know. It could have been there. It definitely could have been.

Speaker1:
[49:01] Could have been. Did he show up in a car or how did he show up? I don't think she knew. He just walked into the room.

Speaker2:
[49:06] It was a walk-in. It was a walk-in. It was not a walk-in.

Speaker0:
[49:08] It's her, like imagine a doctor's office.

Speaker1:
[49:10] Okay. Yeah. This alien just gets up on the table.

Speaker0:
[49:13] Gets on that table and she's like, oh, what are we working with here?

Speaker2:
[49:18] Okay. And she did say she had a very strong experience where she was like out of body because it's an energy transfer. You're giving and you're receiving. It's kind of a dance. And she said she had felt like knocked out of her body kind of. Yeah. So it was she had a very strong experience with it. And then afterward, she asked the alien, you know, basically like, how was that for you? I guess like you do after sex. And and he said, no. Interesting. And walked out.

Speaker1:
[49:48] Wow. I just pictured this tiny figure.

Speaker0:
[49:53] No, it isn't a tiny figure. It's Elijah Wood in height and stature.

Speaker1:
[50:00] Getting up on his table. So he's sitting on the table looking at this woman on the chair.

Speaker0:
[50:05] It's just a human. Inside is the alien.

Speaker1:
[50:08] But why was he sitting on the table?

Speaker2:
[50:10] He was lying on the table.

Speaker1:
[50:11] To get his lying on the table.

Speaker0:
[50:14] That's what you do when you get raking.

Speaker2:
[50:15] It's like you're getting a massage. You lie down.

Speaker1:
[50:18] But wouldn't you lie down on a bed or sit on a chair? It's in a doctor's office. I mean, can you imagine?

Speaker2:
[50:22] It's not a table like this.

Speaker1:
[50:23] It's a massage table. Oh, a massage table.

Speaker2:
[50:27] We're all hung up on aliens. She's hung up on the furniture.

Speaker0:
[50:31] The wooden table. It's a massage table.

Speaker1:
[50:34] Oh, gotcha.

Speaker2:
[50:35] Call me when the spaceship lands.

Speaker1:
[50:38] You could just chill now.

Speaker0:
[50:40] Well, I think we can say after all of these thrilling stories and spiritual journeys, what a world. Wow.