Wheel Chat - Your Go-To Mobility Podcast

Wheel Chat: Episode 5 – The Battle of Aluminium Folding Chairs

• Wheel Chat • Season 1 • Episode 5

Share episode

In this lively episode of Wheel Chat, Justin and Antony go head-to-head on the top aluminium folding manual wheelchairs. From the Kuschall Compact to the Quickie 2, Ottobock Avantgarde, TiLite and Airrex, they break down the pros, cons, and quirks of these popular models. If you’re navigating the world of folding wheelchairs or looking for expert insights, this is the episode for you!

What’s in this episode?

  • A detailed comparison of features, weight, and configurability for leading folding chairs.
  • The quirks and challenges of wheelchair design and naming conventions.
  • The importance of weight, roll quality, and customization for users and prescribers.
  • Honest banter, industry insights, and even a bit of humor about keratin treatments!

Justin and Antony also share their experiences in Australia and the UK, diving into the practicalities of prescribing, scripting, and choosing the right chair for every user.



Email us :
We’d love to hear from you. If you have any questions about this podcast, please email us at wheelchatpod@gmail.com

Follow us : TikTok : https://www.tiktok.com/@wheelchat_podcast

Instagram : https://www.instagram.com/wheelchat_podcast/

Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely those of Anthony and Justin.

Justin: Welcome back to Wheel Chat our fifth episode. Wheel Chat! 

Anthony: Wheel Chat! No, feeling that?!

Justin: Pipe down. 

Justin: It's been a long day. It's our fifth episode and actually our last couch session. Because, uh, this has been nice sitting on a little couch. I wish I had lived in Leeds. Well, I wish you lived in Australia and you bought this couch.

Anthony: You never know what the future holds. 

Justin: Hunter, you want to come? Come to Australia? 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: It's our last session of live face to face, but we will be continuing these sessions- 

Anthony: It's been cool. 

Justin: Over Zoom, and we'll actually be having more guests. In between these episodes we got really excited and we started messaging people.

Anthony: Yeah, we had some fun. 

Justin: And we've already got some confirmed guests of people who are, uh, experts in their field and people we generally want to chat to about a certain topic or a product. 

Anthony: Yeah, because I think through chatting and what we know is yeah, we've got like some really good knowledge between us, but there's always people out there with greater knowledge in that specific area, and you can always learn more.

Justin: Exactly. Yeah. So we'll tell you about what we like what we know and then for the things that we don't know, we'll get people on and then we can all learn together. 

Anthony: Where are you getting your hair done, by the way? 

Justin: Mate, this is actually a keratin treatment I got done before the wedding. Uh, this is how I just wake up like this.

Anthony: You've changed. I mean, I don't know you. I mean, keratin treatment? What next? 

Justin: I don't know. 

Anthony: Jojoba oils? Wraps? Where are we going with this? 

Justin: Getting lasers to get rid of the hair off my arms. Who knows what's next? 

Anthony: And I see you've lost the nails from the wedding? 

Justin: Um, uh, no, I cut them the other day. Emma's very, uh, on me with cutting them. Also got my first mani pedi before the wedding. So no cuticles on these bad boys. 

Anthony: Wow, you really went to town. 

Justin: Yeah, I know. All things for Emma. 

Anthony: Was it a suited affair? 

Justin: Yeah, suited affair. I'll show you some photos. There was drums, there was everything, mate. It was a wedding to go to. Best wedding ever, babe.

Anthony: I'm still waiting for the invite. 

Justin: You'll get it soon. Hello Hunter, do you want to join us for the last episode? 

Anthony: Ah, we've got Emma shouting, we've got parties! 

Justin: There's nothing better when people come up to you after your wedding and they say 'that was the best wedding I've ever been to'. 

Anthony: Yeah, I mean I hate to say, that is what people say.

Justin: I know, but they really meant it this time. 

Justin: No actually I'm sure. Knowing the two of you- We had, we had big Lebanese drummers. We even had a brass band come in and they were just like working within the crowd and it was like really interactive. He sang on a megaphone on the dance floor and it was just. 

Anthony: How did you get over, like, the whole being a centre of attention thing? Because that must have, like, destroyed you.

Justin: I know, I had a lot of anxiety around that. That's actually how I opened my speech. I was like, 'oh, hey guys, I hate to be the centre of attention, so I'll make this short'. 

Anthony: I'm sure there was, like, a video going on or something. 

Justin: I know. 

Anthony: I'm sure we'll be posting soon.

Justin: The video will be coming out soon, so we can relive it then. 

Anthony: Cool. So what we chatting about? 

Justin: Today we did the battle of the mid wheel drives. Around the bases. I thought today would be fun, why don't we chat about the battle of the aluminium folding chairs. 

Anthony: Oh my gosh, that's a tongue twister. It's really catchy.

Justin: Or aluminium. The reason is because it was actually really hard to narrow down because there are so many. We started going 'oh, we'll just talk about these four chairs'. And then when we looked into it, there's like probably 30 chairs. 30 chairs, like folding chairs, and they all do the same thing. They're all slightly even within the brand, like Ottobock will have six flat folding chairs. Quickie has a bunch of chairs like, do we need that many folding chairs? Probably not. So we've actually narrowed it down. So I reckon we talk about four ones that we've had the most experience with, so we can talk about them the most. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: To which that is the, for me, that's a Quickie 2, but the QS5. 

Anthony: Yeah. So like the Quickie Life, Quickie 2 in the UK sort of been superseded by the QS5 X.

Justin: Yeah. So QS5 X is like one, one we'll talk about. 

Anthony: Again, who names wheelchairs? I'm not being funny, but we should be in the business of naming wheelchairs because, like it's horrendous. 

Justin: I don't know how they get- 

Anthony: QS5. I mean what? 

Justin: They should just pick like something, like types of fish and just name like fish. Or something like different types of fish, or like a type of tree and just pick something consistent because QS5 means nothing.

Anthony: I don't know. I really honestly like? 

Justin: I don't know. Well, we got the Airrex that's a cool name because aero/aircraft/aluminium. That's what, and then the X is like the crop folding frame. Then we've got the Kuschall Compact which is a silly name as well because, why would it be compact? It doesn't need, like you kind of want it to fit the person, doesn't matter if it's you know. It's moulded around the person. So there's no such thing as a real compact manual chair. And then the last one was the Ottobock Avantgarde which, I have no idea what that means, it does mean something. 

Anthony: Avantgarde it feels like, you know-

Justin: En Garde! 

Anthony: En Garde! 

Justin: So they are the four. Of those four, which ones have you had the most experience with or what's your go to?

Anthony: I just had a really weird vision of like, you know, leaning over to the left side and whipping the wheels off and like, we could have a wheel. That'd be no, no, not feeling that. Yeah. Sorry. Well, you were asking me a question. 

Justin: Yeah. Well, what's the chair out of those four? Which one have you had the most experience with?

Anthony: I would say my most experiences with the compact. 

Justin: Yup. 

Anthony: Kuschall Compact been out a long time. It's for me, it's like a fail safe. It's like, you know, it's not going to go wrong with that chair.

Justin: Yeah.

Anthony: It delivers on all the promises I find, it did go through a slight sort of revamp where they've kind of in rigged the front and it's kind of like-

Anthony: Yeah. And I just, do you know, through, several hundred assessments and people testing them, it's very rare that that one doesn't come up as one of people's favourites on the turn roll, on the weight and on what they're looking for. It kind of delivers on all fronts. 

Anthony: Yes. There are downsides for sure in terms of, you know, maybe the adjustment at some points, although it's pretty good.

Justin: I would have to agree. I think the Kuschall Compact is probably, oh it's up there for my favourite folding chair, but I very rarely do it. But that's more because in Australia supplies aren't that great.

Anthony: Okay.

Justin: And it's like, you need to support the chair after. Delivery times are important.

Anthony: I mean, I'd love to say UK the supply's not great. No, but actually it's got a lot better. We went through a little bit of a dip.

Justin: It's probably better now but, like if you're looking at it just as a pure product I would say it's a pretty good chair. What I like about it is that you have the option of, similar to the Avantgarde, you can have the single and, correct me if I’m wrong, single brace and double brace.

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: So if it's 16 inches and under you do save a bit of weight by having the one cross brace instead of a double cross brace. 

Anthony: Yeah, you've got to be careful though on that. It's only a certain client that you can really afford to do that. 

Justin: Yeah. Yeah, so they're lightweight. They're somewhere at 16 inches wide, or under, pretty light, nice on their chair, then I think it's a good chair. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: What I love about the Kuschall as well is the armrest because none of the manual chairs have a side guard. You can't really do side, it's either side guard or armrest.

Anthony: Correct. 

Justin: So that's one issue. So they have an armrest that has both, it's like a T handle- 

Anthony: That's right. 

Justin: With side guard, which is lovely. What I also like about it is that it's a lightweight armrest and that it's still quite strong because a lot of, like you think about the Quickie armrest, the flip back armrest or the Airrex ones, there's single post.

Anthony: Yeah, yeah. 

Justin: They're quite weighty in the receiver and everything. But this is, this armrest does both. It is a strong one cause it's a T post. So it's strong. It includes side guards and it's lightweight. So that alone is like, oof, I really like this chair. I like that. I like the look of the Kuschall. I also like the hard adjustable push handles you can put on the back.

Justin: I think it's a really, really good chair product wise. 

Anthony: It's also the lightest. 

Justin: Is it? 

Anthony: It's 9.6 kg. 

Anthony: There you go. With the single cross brace there. Yeah, 9. 6, it's, it's coming in the lightest. 

Justin: Yeah. 

Anthony: Now, there'd be an argument, on um, you know, the Avantgarde is 9.7. 

Justin: We're talking 100 grams. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: And these are like, I don't know who does these weights. Like, how do they weigh? Are they all 16 by 16?

Anthony: I know, exactly. That's the thing. I mean, yes, if you read the small print, it will be all down. And remember, it's all without any sort of accessories or anything on there.

Justin: Yeah, so I always, I always question, I actually have a luggage scale. Because when people ask me like, how much does this weigh? I'm like, I don't know. Like, I get why they're asking me. But I'm like, I have no idea. Like, it depends on how this is configured. How we're going to configure your chair is going to be different. How, you know, why, there's so much factors at it. 

Anthony: I don't know about you, but sometimes like when somebody says how much, and you go 'oh it's really light'. And you go, oh bloody hell, it's actually, it's not. It doesn't feel that light. 

Justin: Okay, before we even get into the chairs, I actually want to say, this is probably one of my biggest sadness aspects of our industry is our folding manual wheelchairs. Is that they cost so much and I get this carbon fibre and titanium. And that's not what today's episode is about. But just for a chair that cost thousands of pounds or dollars, you'd expect it to be so light, but there are off the shelf chairs that are lighter. So when people come from an off the shelf chair, like a Breezy Basix or something or even a Karma self propelling chair. And then here's this one that's ten thousand, ten times the price of what your off the shelf one was and I lift it and this is, this is heavy. 

Anthony: Yeah.

Justin: I'm like, I don't, it's embarrassing. It's embarrassing to say, 'hey this is it!' Now I get why it's heavier because it's more durable. They're custom made so that you know, they configure in a certain way and the components are stronger so you can reposition. They're designed to last a longer time but still, the weight should be nicer and I don't think any of these chairs scream out as if like a, whoa, this is really like-

Anthony: Yeah, no, I mean until you're getting into your sort of high end titanium’s and stuff like that- 

Justin: I'd say even the carbon fibre ones. I say that's when you really start to feel 'oh, this is a lightweight chair'. This is better than what I had before. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: But unfortunately none of these in terms of weight wise, are super lightweight. So, and where the differences really come in are their options and features. So I think Kuschall has pretty good amount of options, but what I have always not liked about it is, come in to script it, is always a bit of a nightmare because they don't have a configurator. So there is on, on TiLite and TiLite, Ottobock and Quickie, they all have like an online configurator. So when you put it in there based on the seat to floor height or the, the, the wheel size, and you know, it'll tell you, will this work or will it not? And just every time I do a Kuschall, maybe I need to get my experience up. One, it's in centimetres, which kills me, even though I'm Australian. It's just like, oh, this is 39 centimetres seat to full height. I'm like, wait, what's that in inches? We all work in inches, so I've got to convert it. But then I think I'm following it right, but there's always something that catches me. And that time of order, it's not until the manufacturer come back and they say, 'oh, actually you can't do this'. And you're like, 'oh, I've got to go back'. And 'hey, do you actually want these wheels'? Although, it's just noise. And so that, so the fact that the script form is a bit tricky to work with. The fact that we don't, in Australia, our supply, to my knowledge, isn't that great, that could be wrong. Um, and parts have always been a bit of a nightmare. 

Anthony: I think we're much better suited for that than here because we're not seeing that same feedback. And there are configurators available now online at Invercare. 

Justin: Yeah. Can you get drum breaks on them? 

Anthony: On a Kuschall Compact? I believe you can actually. You can. You can, and that's a problem actually on a lot of, yeah. And on a folding lightweight aluminium. You struggle on the, on that. And you also struggle to put a mountain bike tire on with a hub break. So you have to be careful of that, but that's a really nice option to offer someone when you can, because that person really wants to go into that rugged terrain.

Justin: Yeah. So Kuschall light, decent amount of options. looks nice, quite sturdy seating system, reliable. But back end is a bit tricky. So I think as a product standpoint, it's a pretty good product. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: Now, where do you go? 

Anthony: You know, just to let you know, like, so that is like, sort of starts in the UK at £2025 

Anthony: which to be fair is the, is the highest price point out of all the four chairs that we were discussing. It's not that, you know, but it's just a thing to bear in mind. 

Justin: It's a good question about, I wasn't even think about which one's the most expensive. For me, I know, I know the Quickie 2 and the Airrex are priced very similarly cause I do a lot of quote comparisons and it's like a few hundred dollars difference between them.

Justin: It's hard to really like say one's more than the other, but- 

Anthony: But I think in all fairness to the Kuschall, you can see the quality within the frame. And that's what I would say is quite, for me if you were pairing up for instance the Quickie Life. We, we are not, um, selling in the UK really anymore, because it's been superseded by the QS5 X. I still think there is a, a visual quality difference.

Justin: Yep. I, I, I could agree. 

Anthony: And I think that in terms of the, because we, let's come back to the weight actually. So we've talked about the weight in terms of lifting, but actually in fairness to the user or the end user, who's the most important person, what would they talk about the roll? Like, would they find that easier to propel?

Justin: I think for, for me, in these range of chairs, these like, we'll call them, like, 

Anthony: Active folders. 

Justin: Active folding chairs though. I think these are just like folding chairs and your active folding chairs are more like your Zenith. 

Anthony: Yeah.

Justin: Your, what's the Progeo one that has the- 

Anthony: Joker?

Justin: Is that the one that has the, it's similar to the champion, the Kuschall champion.

Justin: So these are like, these lightweight folding chairs that are built for more rigidity. That's like your active chair. These ones are for more I guess your disability population where they're not necessarily pushing. They might be pushing short distances but they're not necessarily like really active. 

Anthony: Coming out of your Breezy and they're saying 'I want a good quality chair' and I need it to be lighter. 

Justin: That's highly configurable. 

Anthony: Yeah.

Justin: And on the highly configurable this is where I think the Quickie 2 trumps all of them. I think this is like the one we can get the lowest seat the floor height. You can get the best options for different types of casters and the 'build for me' team will do whatever you want. 

Anthony: Yeah.

Justin: I think for me, you get the least amount of configuration issues with the Quickie 2. That's why I think Quickie 2 is like a really good reliable product. It also has a growth kit, which is fun. So if you're a new OT or a new physio or prescriber and you're worried about the width doing it wrong. I mean it's not an ideal thing to do-

Anthony: Because we don't measure wrong, right? 

Justin: Yeah, we don't measure wrong. We never make mistakes. I've never had to use the growth kit to fix one of my boobers um, but yeah, you get a free growth kit. So within five years of manufacturing of the chair, if a child grows or client condition changes and you need more seat depth to put a thicker back rest, you can get a growth kit where they'll send you all the parts for free, but then you have to get a technician to install, which does cost money. So, I think that's cool to have a free growth kit and have a really highly configurable chair. And have the 'build for me' options for Quickie 2, Quickie range. 

Anthony: I mean in the UK, as I say, everything has been superseded really on this QS5 X. They've really invested a lot of time and effort on that. I think it's improved the Quickie. But you said yourself you haven't had a huge amount of experience yet. So it'll be good to get your feedback when you're, back in Australia and you're working with it. Keep me posted on what you think. 

Justin: I've been told it doesn't supersede, but I can't remember why. Like for us, like, like it's not like they'll still have the Quickie 2, but what does the Quickie 2 do that the QS5, QS5 can't do? 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: We'll have to find out. So that's the Quickie 2. And then anything else on the Quickie 2 that you want to mention? Oh, stroller handles. Oh, people love stroller handles.

Anthony: They do. 

Justin: Those little, you know, flip up ones. 

Anthony: Yeah, so like, you could call it a pram handle, stroller handle, which I hate the name actually, because you're not a child in there, right?

Justin: Well, I think we call them 'hashi', they're hard adjustable stroller handles. That's what they call them. But they're not hard adjustable, they're more angle adjustable.

Anthony: Yeah, so there's about three different types, right? So, I mean, the height adjustable push handles, I think that lets it down. I'm going to be honest with you in terms of aesthetics. We've had some beautiful looking chairs and then they clamp on the height adjust, because they're the ones that clamp on all the ones, not the internal ones that are built within, but they don't seem to do those on that.

Anthony: I just think that aesthetics really let you down, actually. So point to people out there that are doing that, sort it out. 

Justin: And, with push handles, an interesting thing as well is, this is one thing I like about the Kuschall and not so much the other hard adjustable ones, is that the Kuschall one actually bends out a little bit. So with those hard adjustables, it's good to have it hard, but you're so close to the client. So it's good to be able to like angle it back so you've got a bit more range to not kick your feet on the anti tippers. So I like that they do that which is quite nice. 

Anthony: Yeah. The price point is really keen on the Quickie Life and the QS5 X. It's like QS5 X starts at £1500 and the Quickie Life here, although it's not really something that you get, it's like £1695. Um, thank you. 

Justin: It's alright. 

Anthony: For people who can't watch, um, I just got approached by Justin in a very sort of loving way. 

Justin: I just went for the kiss. 

Anthony: Uh, and yeah, I, yeah, there was no kiss unfortunately. 

Justin: I was fixing your mic.

Anthony: Thanks man. Is that what you say? So yeah, price point wise really competitive.

Justin: Yes. 

Justin: How does that fix in Australia? Yeah, I'd say all four of those chairs are all priced quite competitively. So I think the similarities between all four for us is their price comparatively. They weigh roughly the same. Again, it's more just comes to price. What can you do with them and how reliable and stuff they are? How well can you get parts? 

Anthony: Tell me, anything being made out in Australia? Any manufacturing being done? 

Justin: There is the Glide wheelchairs. They are similar to the, I've never worked with them. Anyone that uses them will say 'mate Glides, they bloody last a lifetime. They're Australian, made'. Just like any country.

Anthony: I love it. I love it. 

Justin: Everyone in the UK would love RGK. Anyone in, uh, where's, is it Switzerland? Swiss would love, oh, Swiss is the best. Ottobock is Germany. So on Ottobock, how, what do you? 

Anthony: Yeah, Avantgarde. It's an older chair, in terms of it's been out, forever it feels like for me. A reliable chair. Ottobock, that is one thing I think whether you agree or not, that Ottobock, what you do get with Ottobock is reliability. You get that German engineering. 

Justin: Yeah. 

Anthony: And I feel it delivers in that. They've got the Zenith as well. We're going a bit more high end on that. Um, so the Avantgarde, I always felt was a bit weighty. I always felt it was a bit weighty, but when I look at the weights, it doesn't, it doesn't reflect that. 

Justin: It might just be the configuration you've had. But one thing I like about that, you can do the same other thing to the Kuschall and have the single cross brace instead of the two.

Justin: So if you've got someone who's 16 inches and under, you can have a single cross brace, which reduces the weight. Similar to the Kuschall, I like the armrest because they've got like those- 

Anthony: Yeah, I think it's an attractive looking chair. 

Justin: Yeah, it's a good looking chair. And then so it's got those armrests that have side guards built in and flip back. And has those like quick hard adjustable handles. So I just feel like it's, and it's sturdy. 

Anthony: That's what I’m saying. 

Justin: Yeah, what I love about it, it's the only chair that actually snaps opened. You know how you open it, you open them and then the chairs will just sort of rest on those clamps. But then to actually like, when you have to push your palm, and it goes 'boom, boom' and I'm like, 'oh yeah', now it's like stiff.

Anthony: There's real feedback. 

Justin: And why is that so important? So if someone is pushing the chair, there's rigidity in the chair. And when you, when you don't have rigidity, when you have flex, every push, you lose energy. So to be able to have a chair that is, pretty everyday chair. It's not necessarily an active chair, but snaps closed.

Justin: Also has 140 kilo weight capacity. I didn't, I didn't write any notes, mate. This is all from memory mate. 

Anthony: This is unbelievable. You're getting it live and you're getting it quick and it's happening now. Actually, it says 130, no I'm joking. 

 

Justin: Um, without going to a heavy duty chair, which often heavy duty options weigh more.

Justin: So you've got an everyday weighted chair at 140 kilos. So that's really cool. Yeah, it looks cool. Colours are good. 

Anthony: You've got some nice prescription options there. 

Justin: The push handles aren't great, like the hard adjustable push handles. It's like, I hate when they have hard adjustable push handles and it like gives you like 5 inches of range. It's like, what's the point of this? Like, either you want them down out of the way or you're up for everybody. 

Anthony: When you were talking about rigid rigidisers, um, do you call it a rigidiser? But we were having this chat in work the other day and there's like across the three different companies, the American companies, like they call it a rigidiser or whatever, you know, to, no, to maintain. You know we were talking about keeping the chair fixed in a really nice sort of solid when you, and then you can have a cross brace on a lot of manual wheelchairs that just gives that. You know, if you've got a canvas back. 

Justin: Yeah. Yeah. You mean the push handle, like the rigidiser bar. 

Anthony: There you go. Yeah. 

Justin: Rigidiser bar. Stabiliser. 

Anthony: Stabiliser bar. 

Justin: Yeah, you can do that. 

Anthony: That was a total side joke. 

Justin: That's more for, I guess, canvas backs that you want to reduce that tweaking. 

Anthony: But I think that's important because people overlook that sometimes and you go out and you think, oh, the person says, I'm pushing it and it's like, there's a handle. You're like, yeah, no, no, yeah.

Justin: Yeah, definitely for durability of the chair. You imagine if you're pushing a push handle and it's, you're pushing all the way up here, sorry for the listeners, and it comes all the way down to the base. There's a lot of leverage. 

Anthony: At present, Justin has his right arm over his left. 

Justin: He's dancing. Yes, there's a lot of like wear and tear on the push handles.

Anthony: Yeah.

Justin: I'm gonna rigidize out. 

Anthony: Yeah, it's just, but again, it's just, that was a total side note, just curious to see what we're calling it these days. 

Justin: Yeah, no, fair enough. So yeah, no, I think. That's three of them. We've done. 

Anthony: No, you've got the four there. 

Justin: No, we haven't done Aero X . 

Anthony: Oh, yes. We've got the Aero X .

Justin: When did, that's American. 

Anthony: So that's not a product that I've been working with. 

Justin: That's American. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: And, uh, the thing I like about the Aero X is that it's made in the U.S. 

Anthony: Yeah. He's very Forrest Gump on me there. Very a box of chocolates. Yeah, it's not a product I've worked with, so you tell me about it.

Justin: It's just another great, it's more the who makes it that's makes it so great, Permobil and Permobil just really reliable for us, especially in Australia. They're just reliable on parts. They're reliable on lead times, reliable on product. So it's just like you know what you're going to get; no surprises.

Anthony: So it's TiLite.

Justin: TiLite. Yeah.

Anthony: Sorry, just for the users. 

Justin: Yeah. In terms of its options, I don't necessarily think it offers anything that other chairs don't. It either offers the same or, yeah. 

Anthony: So the Aero Z, the Aero X. 

Justin: Nah, just the Aero X. So the Aero Z is the rigid, but Aero X is the fold in.

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: What it does offer is a titanium version, but that's the 2GX. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: But in terms of, in terms of features, I can't think of anything that the Aero X does. 

Anthony: So it's a really popular chair for us. I don't personally go out because it's one of my colleagues, works with the TiLite products more, but, he absolutely loves them. He always has. And he'll put his name to that all the time. 

Justin: Yeah. But I'd love to, another person to get on the pod and ask, 'hey mate, why do you love, why do you love the Aero X so much'? And I'd be happily debating. I do a lot of Aero X’s as well, but it's just because it's a good reliable product. 

Anthony: Exactly, yeah.

Justin: You would get a good outcome for your client. It's how you designed a chair. But if we're splitting hairs, which is what this podcast is all about, finding the intricate details. 

Anthony: Yeah. It's got a nice folding back. But there was an issue with the folding back at one point. I don't know if the force was there. 

Justin: On the rigid chairs?

Anthony: Yeah, on the, on the, uh, on the folding, you know, with the fold down back. 

Justin: The new precision lock backrest. Which is nice, it was just weak, and it kept breaking. 

Anthony: Yeah, that was just a point to note for anyone listening. 

Justin: Yeah, but I don't, I don't think there's any real reason to be like, 'oof' like that's why, that's why you go Aero X.

Anthony: No. 

Justin: And I could be wrong here, but maybe we get your boy on. Who is he? Shout him out. 

Anthony: He's got a face for radio. 

Justin: Maybe when we're, when we're back and doing Zoom, we'll have cameras on. 

Anthony: Andrew, he'll be laughing, kind of. Nah, yeah, no, by all means. Look, listen, it's got a great name, TiLite. It always has. And what I have found, in all fairness is TiLite users, from when I've chatted to them, they stick with them. You don't find they change. Well, certainly from my experience, certainly within the company and customers when we're chatting to them, it's very rare that they'll sort of, I've seen them move.

Anthony: I guess like anything, like people have cars and they love, like a Nissan versus a Toyota. You know, people are like, 'oh no, I always go there'. So people can just get attached to certain brands. Same with cushions, right? 

Justin: Yeah. So in terms of like, in terms of like, like actual specifications, there's not a whole lot of difference like again, you could do most things with most chairs. But there's a few certain things I like so if I was to make a perfect chair- 

Anthony: I am putting you on I'm putting you now.

Justin: All right, let's start this up with a perfect chair. I would have the Ottobock...um I like the idea of a snap lock Ottobock seat. I would probably have the Ottobock or the Kuschall armrest on there. So they're like the ones that- 

Anthony: So we're Avantgarde. 

Justin: Avantgarde. No, I'm not picking one. I'm hybrid. 

Anthony: Oh, you're hybrid.

Justin: I'm having the options of a Quickie 2- seat to floor height, the castor size, the 'build for me' options of a Quickie 2. The Quickie 2 stroller handles which are very, like almost all my chairs have that to a point where even, I've even had to retrofit them onto a TiLite sometimes, when people go into a TiLite. The growth kit of a Quickie 2 and the 'made in America' of uh of TiLite. The reliability of the brand of TiLite. 

Anthony: We need to just completely hybrid them all and just see what we end up with. 

Justin: Well, there's even better chairs as well. There's other chairs out there, and look there are other brands within aluminium. There's a what, we didn't talk about the Catalyst, the Motion Composites.

Anthony: Yeah, we've got Ki Mobility with the Cat 5. 

Justin: Yeah. 

Anthony: Cat, we've got yeah Motion Composites lovely wheelchairs. 

Justin: Yeah, they've got that's actually my favourite folding chair. But they are- I didn't talk about it today because the carbon one is really where it's at. 

Anthony: Yeah. 

Justin: Super lightweight. 

Anthony: It's a beautiful chair, but we're talking top end and we're talking about the aluminium.

Justin: Yeah. We're talking about aluminium. This is like your entry level-ish. 

Anthony: You've had a Breezy there. You've had that sort of thing. You've kind of now got, you've, you've, you need the wheelchair to do more. And somebody's pushing you or, um, or, or you need it a bit lighter to propel. That's what we're talking about. Right. 

Justin: That's what we're talking about. Yeah.

Anthony: So that's been, that's been really nice. Cause I, do you know, it's really, I genuinely get a lot out of hearing and listening your experiences but also what's happening in Australia. I'm just curious. Like I want to know, are we missing something in the UK? And actually what's refreshing is that I think we're pretty aligned. 

Justin: Yes. 

Anthony: Um, and that, that's pretty cool. So that makes me feel like, um, you know both countries are sort of moving the right way. 

Justin: And I think going forward, our future episodes, it'd be nice just to catch up. And I think our plan is to just chat about our week and see what clients we saw. What did we learn from the week? What mistakes did we make this week? 

Justin: Yeah, definitely. 

Anthony: But Hey, listen, before we wrap it up. 

Anthony: What does ChatGPT think? 

Justin: Oh yeah, that's a good point. Okay, we were gonna try this out. Of all the times to stop working on me. ChatGPT, you there? 

ChatGPT: I'm here. What's up? Something on your mind?

Anthony: So you said we were gonna... 

Justin: Hey, so I'm just doing a podcast at the moment with my friend Anthony. Anthony. 

Anthony: Good job. 

Justin: And um, we're just talking about the differences between folding chairs. And we want to get your opinion on, what's the main differences between the Ottobock Avantgarde, the Kuschall Compact, the TiLite Aero X, and the Quickie 2. 

ChatGPT: Oh, nice topic. Here's a quick breakdown for you. The Ottobock Avantgarde, known for its customisation. It's a lightweight folding chair. Great for active users. It offers various options for adjustability. 

Justin: No. No, that's, uh- 

Anthony: She's gonna take our job here. 

Justin: No, no, that's not good enough. I don't want you to read the brochures. I really want to tell you, like, what are the key differences? Like be really brief. Why would I go one over the other? Like what does one do that the others don't? 

ChatGPT: You're comparing two options and need a quick rundown. 

Anthony: Yes, we do. 

ChatGPT: Could you tell me what the options are? 

Justin: Well, like I said before the Ottobock Avantgarde, the Quickie 2, the TiLite Aero X and the Kuschall. The Kuschall Compact as well. Sorry, man. 

ChatGPT: No worries. Here's a quick- 

Justin: Sorry to interrupt. Let's dive in. 

ChatGPT: No problem. What's up? 

Justin: No! 

Anthony: This is why everyone doesn't need to worry about any AI, because we're in the game, we know what we're doing, and they're not quite there yet. 

Justin: No, they're not. 

Anthony: Which is good news for us. 

Justin: We'll try one more time, and we'll see how it goes. Just tell me the key differences, and why I choose one over the other, when it comes to a Quickie 2, an Avantgarde Ottobock Avantgarde, a TiLite Aero X and a Kuschell Compact. Why would I go one over the other? Don't give me the brochure. Don't just read some specs. Tell me why would I go one over the other. Go.

ChatGPT: All right, let's make it clear and simple. Quickie 2- known for versatility and a wide range of customisations. If you want a wheelchair tailored to specific needs Ottobock Avantgarde offers sleek design Ottobock Avantgarde offers sleek design and is lightweight.  

Anthony: No, see I think what you're doing now is you're not listening to me and it's really problematic, but you know what you've done? You've actually proven to the audience that you are not where we are at. Yeah. 

Justin: And I don't want to insult you, don't try to be where we are. Because then I'll be out of a job. But if you are going to do it, come to me first so I can come up with all the answers. But until then, you're fired. But I hope you have a great day. Don't take over the world. 

Anthony: You know what makes me really laugh? Is that he apologises to her. And that's really kind of you Justin. 

Justin: That's true, you never know when they're going to take over. You're not going to take over, are you? 

Anthony: Ah, that's great. On that note, guys, we're going to wrap it up. But it's been great. It's been a great episode. It's been fun. 

Justin: Follow and subscribe to all your favourite, uh, podcasting platforms and have a great day. Be happy. Or, not happy. That's okay. But just be appreciative of what you have. 

Anthony: Yeah. But hey, listen, we'll all chat. 

Justin: Wheel chat next week. 

Anthony: Well, thanks for listening to Wheel Chat. Cheers guys. Bye!