S2 EP6: Is climate activism good for the activist?

What's it like to be a climate activist and can it be good for you? Protest and civil disobedience have won many of the benefits and freedoms we enjoy today, but  what about the activists themselves? Is it all about hardship, risk and stress, or can activists benefit too? Paul interviews research Robyn Gulliver (University of Queensland, Australia) about her research on the wellbeing of activists, and hears again from climate activist Rosie about her first-hand experience of getting involved, organised and arrested. Armed with Robyn's advice, Paul steps out with his local Extinction Rebellion group. 

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Transcript

S2 EP6: Is climate activism good for the activist?

PHJ: This is Paul Howard Jones and welcome along as we explore more connections between mind, brain, and Planet, you'll find links to research referred to in this podcast, images and Ways to connect on social media on my website mind brain planet.com.

Hello. I’m standing in a park in Bristol on a winter's day, dressed in a long black gown about to engage in some climate activism. In the last episode, we were looking at what makes somebody become a climate activist. And this week, we're focused more on the actual experience of activism and what effect it has on the people who do it. So it's almost time to move off. And the plan is that one of us reads out a long list of lost species as we walk through the crowds at this fair. And every time a species is read out, I'm supposed to crash a large symbol to mark their disappearance. We’ll see how it goes. 

My first experience of activism actually began by watching others do it. And this is quite typical, the sense of empathy and connection we feel for others. Participating in an action can be a crucial step towards participating ourselves. But how does this happen in the brain?

Our brains start getting wired for participation from our earliest infancy. When, as babies, we start waving our arms and limbs in front of us in response to our feelings, neural circuits for intention, for emotions and for movement begin to connect to each other. So much so, in fact, that our brains acquire what is sometimes referred to as a mirror neuron system. This system helps regions of our brain that normally activate when we move, to also activate when we see others moving their bodies, bringing to mind their potential motivations and how to act on them as if these were our own. Not only this, but neither we as the observer, or the person we are watching, may even know this is happening. It can be like a type of unconscious mind reading. And it's not just big actions like waving our arms around, but our micro expressions - those almost imperceptible muscular contractions that pass briefly across our faces. Neuroimaging research has shown that when we see another person's face as they experience an emotion, regions of our brain can activate as if we are experiencing that emotion too.

PHJ: 21-Year-old activist Rosie explained to me how she progressed from school strikes to civil disobedience by observing and relating to the actions of others.

Rosie: When I first got involved, like prop properly, I guess I'd been to a few big marches, big XR marches or like the school student strike. And then when I came to London I went to a few smaller Just Stop Oil marches and I had my first witness of civil disobedience at one of those marches - where I saw some people my age standing and lying on a bridge, when we had been asked to move by the police, and refusing to get up until they were arrested. Seeing people, I found it really, really, really emotional. Watching someone do that, I felt super powerful but also upsetting like: ‘why are you having to do this? To take action and put your body and yourself on the line at risk when everyone seems to be just going past like normal? And also like, we're right next to parliament and the people who are supposed to be in power aren't doing anything about it. I felt, yeah, just like emotional …it made me really want to get in the road with them, but I was cautious 'cause I hadn't experienced this before, but I did definitely feel like an urge to just be like “take me too!”. And then I started attending community events, so learning more about it, attending talks and non-violence trainings and community meetings where I'd meet other people and just talk about it.

PHJ: And when did you start taking action yourself?

Rosie: I was asked if I wanted to start my own group with a few other people for students because just up while didn't have many student groups, so me and some people, who I didn't know that well at the time, started a kind of student group called Fossils Off Campus. We just, like, we started, so we started learning how to self-organize, how to leaflet canvas, poster, put on social events and then we organized our first rally at UCL and we managed to get quite a few people. And in doing that I learned a lot about community organizing and then Just Stop Oil kind of started its own student campaign and we did some slow marching just as the part of bigger Just Stop Oil, and that was when I did my first kind of more civil “disobediencesque” kind of thing where we were doing small groups marching in the road and you were like directly in conflict with the people and the cars around you, so you are causing a kind of point in tension of conflict and you are existing in that. I did like quite a few weeks of that like every other day sort of thing.

PHJ: How did those sorts of activities lead to you becoming arrested for the first time?

Rosie: So some people in Just Stop Oil sprayed a building in Canary Wharf with orange paint, ‘cause It was a company involved in funding the EACOP line (East African Crude Oil Pipeline). At this point, we were all a crowd watching and this big truck with a hose came to wash it off. So we all went and sat in front of it so they couldn't wash it off. And I actually end ended up getting arrested then for the first time unintentionally, like the police kind of swarmed in on us and just arrested everyone - I think it was over 30 students - for sitting in front of this building - were arrested. So yeah, that was my first experience of that.

PHJ: “Upsetting”, “super powerful”, “conflict”, tension” -  strong emotions appear central to Rosie's experience of climate activism. I contacted researcher Robin Gulliver to find out more about the role of emotions in activism and the impact of those emotions on the activist. 

Robyn: Hello. My name's Robyn Gulliver and I'm an activist and an academic at the University of Queensland in Brisbane, Australia. 

Robyn: So often people start to engage in activism because they're really, really angry about something or they're concerned about it or their friends are doing it and they see the passion they bring to the cause. So you already have heightened emotions when you start taking part in activism. And then, of course, that moment when you do something for the first time, if you join a protest or you go to a group or even to things like talking to your member of parliament or talking to political representative - it can be really intimidating and scary so you can feel quite heightened emotions. 

PHJ: Robin's team interviewed 29 climate activists and they reported a range of negative effects. The most common was sleep disruption - reported by almost half - with several juggling different medications to help manage their sleep. Others reported reduced interest and motivation at work, which can be a core sign of burnout or depression beyond sleep. However, the most common problems were with stomachs, weight and diet. I asked Rosie whether she felt that negative emotions ever became difficult for her?

Rosie: I guess when I first started really deeply thinking about climate, it was in my first and second year of university in London. So I think it was a bit of a different story then because I threw myself in - like feet first - and I didn't quite know how to deal with that yet. So I was finding all these things out and I was, you know, I had lots of energy, anger, passion, excitement, and wanted to just engross myself in it and you know, like talk about it all the time. I think, yeah, at points there were definitely times, especially when it came to activism, where like the kind of the urgency and the adrenaline and, because you are in this bubble where everyone around you, if you are involved in an activist group or community that's talking about it, this feels like the only thing in the world right now. Like this feels like there's this huge awful thing happening, which it really is, but it's just that's all that's happening for that amount of weeks and you can really just push yourself and push yourself and not realize and not check in with what's going on: like how you're really feeling. It is hard to slow down in those moments.

PHJ: Robyn, the reality with climate change is that you are not gonna see the effects of your individual activism change anything very much very quickly. So climate activists are always lining themselves up for a difficult ride, aren't they?

Robyn: Absolutely. It, it can be crushing, right? It crushes the soul when you think about climate change and how little power that we have effectively to do something about it as an individual. It is a major concern at the moment: Climate anxiety, climate apathy - that lack of control, that feeling that there's nothing that you can do that would be meaningful about this issue. But the great thing about actually engaging in action or activism is that you can then do something. You get the sense of achievement and we know that's a really, really critical motivator of activism as well. That you feel like you are doing something - no matter how small, but you're doing something. And then, when you join in a group, you're doing something together that's bigger than the sum of its parts, right? And that feeling of achievement in that area then hopefully counteracts that still continually crushing feeling of ongoing climate change.

Robyn: It's just a difficult journey to navigate. It's probably across many social movement as well. When you think about women's rights or, or disability activism, for example, these things – they weren't solved in a decade. They took hundreds of years sometimes of constant activism by people to actually get to the point where we are now. And I'm sure many activists would've completely felt like giving up and that it would never happen. And yet, with their group together, they had enough of a sense of ongoing achievement that it kept those movements going. And we have our civil rights, we have our gender rights and all these things that we enjoy today.

PHJ: Is there some difference though with climate change because of that sense of urgency?

Robyn: It is a bit different with climate change. You have this time bound period, you don't… it's just a difficult thing to manage independently, regardless of whether you wanna do any activism at all. And it permeates our culture now, I think if you're in that sphere, right? It's just my prediction, and I don't know if you wanna put this in the podcast, but I've got two 10 teenage boys, right? And they kind of don't dwell on it too much, but my prediction is, within a decade or two, there'll be a lot of people who are really struggling psychologically just to deal with the fact of climate change full stop. And the fact that we are doing it to ourselves, you know, humans are responsible for this, maybe not all of us individually to a great degree, but we collectively are trashing our planet. And that guilt can be a terrible demobilizer if we don't have a group of people to actually take positive action with together to alleviate it.

PHJ: And so the organizing into groups - then it's doubly important not just for practical reasons, but for the sharing of emotions, positive and negative. And that sharing can become an important part of the bond that then supports activists?

Robyn: It really can. And if it's shared in a positive way with, with a group of people who have the same values as you, they have the same norms around trying to make a difference and trying to make the world a better place. These emotional connections can be really, really strong. And in some of the research I've done with long-term activists, so people who have been engaged in activism for decades, they will often say the one most important thing that keeps them going over time are the friendships and the joy. And sometimes even say the love that they have for the other activists. They're actually participating in these things with very, very strong emotional bonds.

PHJ: And this emphasis on the social aspects of being an activist aligns very much with Rosie's experience:

Rosie: Becoming part of a community was a really nice thing - to feel like you finally had like an outlet of people who see things similarly to you. And that was really refreshing. So I felt like a strong urge to keep coming back. Yeah, it was just really nice to be around people who were say, thinking similar things and who I felt I was learning from. That was a really big thing. Like I felt really inspired by lots of the people around me and I was learning lots and lots.

PHJ: And this is where we start getting to the good news about being an activist - that the positive health impacts, if you like, of climate activism - with most of Robin's climate activists like Rosie reporting enhanced connection and relationships and more reports of motivation and energy increasing rather than less. In fact, the number of people reporting negative mental health impacts were as many as those saying that their mental health had actually improved from becoming an activist. So all this made me wonder whether activism could actually improve our basic brain function in some ways. After all, Rosie has been in situations where she's been followed, raided, arrested, and detained - all situations that might lead some of us to be less than calm. So I asked if she'd learn to manage her thinking and emotions in new ways?

Rosie: Yeah, absolutely. And it's interesting you putting it like that because I guess I have felt that, but not always known how to like verbalize it because I would almost feel activism kind of created a new way of thinking that allowed like a radical consciousness that allowed me to navigate society in a new way and seeing things in a new way that to me felt liberating - even in small ways, like I can dance in the street and it doesn't matter people judge me, like just stepping outside of those boundaries and unlearning fears and restrictions. But also, yeah, having anxieties build up because you're exposed to new oppressions and repressions and then having to deconstruct those. So it’s like a journey, like a fluctuating journey for sure, of breaking down your own mental policing and then it building back up and breaking it down. And I think it's never a journey that's done. I think it's a constant ongoing journey, but I think a lot of it is a mental kind of battle. And I think something that makes it a lot easier is if you have outlets to speak to work through these thoughts, like people to speak to about these things. Like if you don't have a necessarily supportive like social or family network, it can definitely be a lot harder because you don't necessarily have people who you can talk to about these things. And I think that's where the community really helps. But also you can kind of get caught up in an almost like group mentality where you can get a bit too much in you’re kind of egging each other on if you're only in that bubble. 

I think it's important to have both. Like you need a bubble of people who are doing this, but you also need people who are not in this kind of like hyper radical head space because you need to be like able to get away from it. But at the same time it can also be frustrating being around people who aren't in that head space 'cause you can feel alienated and you can feel like frustrated 'cause you're like, wait, I've just been doing this crazy thing that feels so big and really powerful and then I step out into real world and actually everyone hasn't even noticed <laugh> and it, and it was like, it was a mental kind of week or whatever and then now you're all just like going to the pub and I'm really confused, <laugh>.

PHJ: So would you say that you are more or less resilient as a result of becoming a climate activist?

Rosie: Definitely more, definitely more. I didn't know I was capable of these things. I didn't know I was capable of organizing. I actually learned the most I feel I've ever learned in a short period of time because I learned how to organize a community and organize activism. And that meant doing things like on social media, doing things on hosting talks, hosting socials, all sorts, like making things. And that was such an informative educational experience for me. Like at points I felt like I was learning more than I was at university. Just like interacting with real people and learning from each other and sharing knowledge - knowing that I can then go through those things. Like (if) someone asked me four years ago ‘oh, you would gone to a police cell?’ I would've been like, what?? <laugh>. So like knowing that can happen to me and I'll, I can be okay. Which that's just for me. And I know that that can be a very different experience for different people. Like I obviously have a lot of privilege and that was there for like an okay experience for me or so far hasn't affected me too much. But knowing that I can do those things and be okay has definitely made me my eyes more open to the fact that I can achieve anything. <Laugh>, maybe not anything, but a lot more things seem possible. I kind of always try to explain, I always try and explain it to my friends and I know other people have had different experiences this, but for me, I genuinely think it contributes to my happiness. Like I think it makes me a happier person.

PHJ: Well, activism sounds like it can be good for society and for the activists, but before I step out and get involved myself, I thought I'd just check if Robyn could offer any final advice to ensure it would be a positive experience?

Robyn: 

It has to be something that you will find fun so you will enjoy it. It's not a chore, not a job you're doing that you're not being paid for. You're not doing it out of obligation, although of course we are, you have a moral obligation in some sense to do this. But it's actually something you would do because you find it fun. And when you look at people at different activism events, you'll often see a whole bunch of people having a lot of fun.

Protesters and PHJ: Extinct, extinct!

PHJ: Well, I'm with a lovely bunch of people who already feel like friends reminding passes by other species we've already lost and why we should care about climate. That feels purposeful. It feels good. I've had some great chats both with members of Extinction rebellion, but also with some of the public, although I should also say I've been called some rude names, but as part of a group that doesn't feel too bad. And as Robyn advised, this is quite a fun activity,

Protesters: Extinct!

PHJ: So back again soon, when in the next episode I'll be trying to take public transport from Bristol to the Sahara Desert.

Protesters: Extinct!

PHJ: You've been listening to Paul Howard Jones. You can respond with questions or comments about any of my podcasts by recording a voice message at www.mindbrainplanet.com - and you may be featured on the next episode!