Chapter Blue

Legal Expert and Emotional Wellness with Cody Robinette

• Tyra Valeriano

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This episode discusses the intersection of law enforcement and mental health, offering insights from former prosecutor Cody Robinette about the unique challenges officers face. Listeners will gain practical advice on navigating legal situations while prioritizing mental wellness. 

• Understanding the pressures of litigation faced by officers 
• Common mistakes officers make in court and how to avoid them 
• The importance of transparency and accountability in documentation 
• Emphasizing mental health as equal to physical health 
• Building supportive networks within the law enforcement community 
• Addressing societal stigma around seeking mental health help 
• Practical coping strategies during stressful legal processes

Contact:
State Bar of Texas- Cody Robinette

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Tyra Valeriano:

Welcome to Chapter Blue, the podcast where we discuss the world of law enforcement through an honest conversation on tough or controversial topics, real stories, perspectives and experience from officers all around the world. Whether you're here for insights on mental health, self-care, work-life balance, getting into law enforcement, getting out of law enforcement, or just trying to learn about personal and professional challenges officers face every day, you've come to the right place. I'm your host, Tyra Valeriano, and whether I'm going solo or speaking with a guest, each episode will discuss different aspects of life behind the badge. Let's turn the page and step into Chapter Blue. Hi, Cody, Welcome to the podcast. Thank you for joining me from my home state of Texas. It's the best state ever. I don't know if you agree.

Cody Robinette:

Amen to that. Yeah, thank you, tyra, for having me, and I'm honored to be here with you and join you.

Tyra Valeriano:

I want you to introduce yourself to the listeners, let them know a little more about your background and what you're doing with law enforcement now, and just kind of where your stance is in the law enforcement world.

Cody Robinette:

Yes, ma'am, so my name is Cody Robinette. I'm a licensed attorney in the state of Texas. I've been an attorney for 12 years. Five of those years, and the best of those years, were spent as a prosecutor for the state and I really enjoyed that. After I got out of law enforcement I went back into private practice for myself, so I run a solo practice law firm by myself and I'm also an instructor at the Police Academy. An appreciation of respect for those. So I like to get involved as much as I can to be any kind of support that I can be for those that take an oath to sacrifice their lives for us and put their lives on the line and sacrifice their own safety so that I can have mine.

Tyra Valeriano:

Well, thank you for that. I'm sure everybody appreciates that. How long did you say you did prosecution for?

Cody Robinette:

For five years, five years, and you said that was the best time of your life.

Tyra Valeriano:

Why is that?

Cody Robinette:

That was the highlight of my career. You know, when I was in law school it was, it was a joke because I said I'm never going to do, you know, criminal law. That's just I don't have a desire for it or a taste for it. And then, you know, I had those that were close to me that encouraged me get involved with it, get involved with it. And so I actually started out on the defense side and did defense work for four years and I was going, hey, okay, something clicks in my brain to be able to connect to this and so, for whatever value that is, my brain or lack thereof just connected to it, loved it and enjoyed the aspect of it. And then I got encouraged more. You know you should run for office, you should run for office. So for those five years was spent as an elected prosecutor in my county and the substance of it was fantastic. Like I said, that was the highlight of my career. The political side of it maybe not as much, but I enjoyed it and I miss it. I still miss it.

Tyra Valeriano:

Well, I'm going to say that part of that is because it's in Texas, right?

Cody Robinette:

I was about to say what can you find wrong with Texas? People can always find wrong in anything, but it's ideal for me. I love it.

Tyra Valeriano:

Yeah, I can't say that I'm biased or anything. I mean, I was born and raised in Texas, but I just know it's the best state, so I'm glad that you had that experience there. And it actually leads me to a whole lot of questions that I want to ask you that maybe the listeners are going to find interest in. Litigation is a huge topic, that is. I worked in New Mexico, so obviously it's not far off, but when it comes to the law it's very, very different than Texas. Litigation is like, I don't know, eating candy. I mean people can file anything and officers are drowning in stress from all of the tort claims and just everything that they're going through. What is something that you learned and I know, like I said, texas and New Mexico are very different from each other but what would you say that you've learned in your career? That you could provide some advice for officers who are going through litigation or what to expect if they are involved in one?

Cody Robinette:

You bet and I'm limited to how long with this? Yeah, I'll keep it succinct as much as I can. So one of the subjects that I teach in the academy is force options. It's not how to use force, but it's when you are justified in doing so. And I loosen the tension a little bit with a dad joke, because I'm full of those and full of some other stuff too. But what I tell them is the way that you throw a party in outer space. You plan it, and so the more preparation you do in advance, the better off you're going to be, not only in understanding your justifications, but having more confidence in yourself in the actions that you take. So taking time, even if you're not on the clock, is just to keep yourself abreast of the law, to keep yourself in the know of the things that you have.

Cody Robinette:

Protection for Texas, again being the best state there is in the union, has many, many protections for law enforcement officers, for law enforcement officers, and the justification for that is that our legislatures want to give officers the flexibility and the freedom to be able to do what they are designed to do. You know so there's a lot of justifications in Chapter 9 of your penal can you. Here's what you can do and be right and justified in that. As you said, there is a big distinction between who can file stuff versus are you going to be successful at stuff. So it's it's not. It's not an exact question when somebody says, can I be sued for this Because I have to split the frog here and say, can somebody file on you? Yeah, anytime, and that's not always comfortable, but will they prevail? That's always a different question and a different analysis.

Cody Robinette:

So you know the more that you can lean on those that have your back for your prosecutors, for your TMPA, your county representatives, things like that that when you do get in trouble, that they're the ones to come to your rescue.

Cody Robinette:

The more you get to know them, have a personal relationship, the more you can trust them, the more confidence you have in them and they are there for your protection. They're there to go to bat for you, and that's what I told my law enforcement agents day one when I got in as a prosecutor. You know we may not always see eye to eye on everything, I may not always understand the nature of your job and vice versa, but I want you to always have confidence that as long as you are doing what you can within the parameters of the law, I will be there to go to bat for you always, and you don't have to fight alone. And that's one of the biggest pieces that causes apprehension in people is that I feel alone and I feel like I'm fighting alone and I feel that I have to take this all on myself and have to have all the answers. And you don't. Nobody does.

Tyra Valeriano:

Right. So how is that role different? You said, you did defense too, right?

Cody Robinette:

Yes, ma'am.

Tyra Valeriano:

So you were able to see both aspects. What would you say is the biggest mistake that you saw officers make in court, or maybe even on the reports? What is something that was very common for you on the defense side?

Cody Robinette:

I would say number one. The worst thing, the worst thing that you can do, especially to jeopardize your career, is double down on a lie, or even if it's not even if you don't categorize it as a lie inside your head, you're not sure. So you kind of just try and float with it and you'll get hung with that noose Is that defense attorneys will pick up on that. That's blood in the water, right. And the defense attorney sharks will come run into that and say, yeah, we, we've got you and we can, um, make it look terrible.

Cody Robinette:

So, um, what I advise my officers, one of the other subjects that I teach, especially in academy, is courtroom testimony, and I start off by telling them be human, guess what? You are human, so be human and present yourself as a human. You are going to make mistakes. I make mistakes too. Therefore, be human and when you do have a mistake, admit it.

Cody Robinette:

Admit it willingly and freely, bring it to the prosecutor's attention beforehand, and that way we can, on the prosecution side, we can mitigate that, we can take the sting out of it, so that if you're on the stand, if you make a mistake in your report and the defense attorney is salivating, being like, oh, I'm going to get them, I'm going to get them. The prosecutor is going to be like, hey, let's do this in direct and say you know what? This little, this little error here, you know typographical error, that's really not what you meant, was it? No, okay, are you gonna do better next time? Yeah, okay, great. And then the defense is gonna say, oh, oh, you made a mistake. And we're gonna say, yeah, baston answered, we've already covered that, no problem.

Tyra Valeriano:

Yeah, you know, when you said that it just gives me a visual of being in court. I didn't really have to testify very often, but the times that I did I can literally visualize a dog drooling at the mouth because there's like meat, I don't know. That just gave me a visualization of it.

Cody Robinette:

You bet they're ready for it and they're hungry for it. And so when you as a prosecutor, when you enable your prosecutor to be able to take that sting away, the salivation just dries up and they have nothing. The defense has nothing. So, like I said, number one if you make a mistake, or you know, if you make an error, admit it, no problem. Another big I don't know if I'd call it a mistake or error or what it may be just kind of some oversights is. You know, we exchange thoroughness of our job for convenience and I've had plenty of times where I've had to go back to an officer from the prosecution side. I've had to go back to an officer and say, hey, you know what, I need some supplement here. I need a little bit more, not because I enjoy making your life miserable that's not true but because I need to make sure that I am here as a prosecutor to protect you on the stand, so that you don't sweat as much as you potentially could.

Cody Robinette:

Whether know whether that is saying you know you didn't submit a report. You were on scene and you may have, you may or may not have observed something, but your defense comes to you and says hey, by the way, this body camera caught three officers on the scene and we only have two reports. What's up with that? And that's not great, and that it makes all of us on the state side. It makes us nervous for that. So you know, don't you know? I tell my officers don't take offense to that when we come back and ask for more. It's not that you didn't necessarily do a thorough job, but it's just saying, hey, you know, help me. What is it? The movie? Help Me, help you.

Tyra Valeriano:

I want to ask you I know we talked a little bit about before we started the podcast that you have a passion and you really like to help officers on the mental health side. I want us to jump into that because I do want to tie the two together, especially because I feel that there's a lot of value in tying what you do now and what you have experience in into the mental health aspect. So tell us a little bit about that.

Cody Robinette:

You bet, before I say anything else to my cadets, their first time that they are seeing my face, god bless them. I encourage them that their mental health is every bit as important as their physical health. We do physicals routinely, so why don't we also do checks for our mental health? You know, we've, for one reason or another whether it's self-imposed pressure to say, oh man, am I perceived as weak just because I'm going to seek, you know, counseling on the mental side, or whether it's, you know, unknown pressures from from an external source, unknown pressures from an external source the importance is that we get tune-ups, and it's especially in law enforcement that is so important. The average human will experience a traumatic event about seven times throughout the course of their life, whereas a law enforcement officer, through the course of their career, will experience traumatic events. I think it's somewhere between 250 and 300 times.

Tyra Valeriano:

I feel like it was more than that, I don't know. I feel like in 10 years I went to like an 800. I don't know Something crazy feels like it.

Cody Robinette:

Right, right. Of course, that number is going to vary for a whole lot of other people and depending on the size of your jersey, there's a lot of factors into it. So I am a proponent that you cannot be healthy if you may be incredibly physically fit but you are not mentally on top of your game, and vice versa right. You need to be mentally, emotionally, physically fit in order to perform this job. There are a lot of pressures, there are a lot of things that you are living in a world of the worst part of society, that there is day in and day out and you may do so 12 hours a day or more. I think you said your your shifts when you were what patrol sergeant you were what 12, 13 hour shifts.

Tyra Valeriano:

Yeah, I mean it's it's scheduled for 12 hours, but the agency that I worked for was very busy and we were short staffed, just like everyone else, and I was staying longer, and that's just how it was. So yeah, you bet.

Cody Robinette:

So you know, for for that many hours out of your life, for literally 50% of your daily existence. In your life, you are experiencing things that people have gotten to a rotten situation, whether through their own or whether through, you know, being a victim of somebody else's actions. That's the worst part of it, and so you've got to have an escape, and you've got to counteract that with positive situations, with self-fortitude, right, strengthening yourself, and nobody's designed to do that on their own. We are not designed to walk through this life on our own. No matter who you are, no matter what profession you're in, nobody's meant to walk alone, and so it's important that we are running at 100%, as much as we can be, because we've got to be a step ahead of those that we're encountering right.

Tyra Valeriano:

Yeah, of course.

Cody Robinette:

In every way respond to that?

Tyra Valeriano:

because, to be fair, I want to say that I remember getting maybe not the exact same feedback from our instructors about mental health. It was brief, but you know, you go into the career, you're so excited and it just kind of goes past you. And then five, six years down the road, here I am with this podcast, right, and I might have a listener out there who's been on for five, six years and they're like man, I remember they told me that and I didn't take it seriously, and now I'm having to deal with all of these things that I had a jumpstart on doing if I would have just listened the first time. So how do your cadets respond to you telling them, hey, pay attention to your mental health? I mean, are they accepting? Do they ask questions? What's their response to it?

Cody Robinette:

I asked them is that literally crickets that I hear Because it's you know. They don't know what to take with that because they're not often they're not coming from, you know, inside the realm of law enforcement to begin with. Some of them are jailers and working dispatch or something like that. It's a different animal and so there's not often a lot of feedback and I acknowledge that up front and I tell them you may not see it now. The more you go into academy you'll see it because that's going to wear you down. But also, you know, when you get into the stresses of your daily job, like it'll, it'll readily become apparent and so it will make more sense later. But you know, I give, I give them all my cell phone number.

Cody Robinette:

I said you know I'm not here just to be your instructor, to fold the book and walk out of the classroom. If I'm supporting you, I'm supporting you and that means you know you've always got somebody to talk to, whether you want. You know you don't have to always take that, that's fine, but I'm a resource for you that, even if you just need me to stay quiet, I promise you. Attorneys can do that, but we can stay quiet. If you just need to vent. That's fine, and occasionally I will get them that boomerang back, whether it's in the academy or sometimes afterwards.

Tyra Valeriano:

And you know I love it when they do, because I was just going to ask you if you've gotten any calls.

Cody Robinette:

Yeah, you bet I do and I love it. And sometimes it's not even on just kind of a mental challenge, sometimes it's a hey, would you just kind of walk me through what I should do here, either in my family situation, or you know insurance, it doesn't matter. And I say you know, even if I don't know everything like I'm, I'm here for you for sure, so I do.

Tyra Valeriano:

I want to link your position now to the mental health aspect, and the reason why I feel like this is a really interesting conversation is because there's a lot of new police officers out there who probably have under five years. They may not have experienced any type of litigation, but we know that everything that comes on to social media your body camera, your reports, everything is out there, it's available for the public and it causes a lot of scrutiny. And sometimes you know when people see things and they think that the officer is wrong. They don't understand the law number one and they don't understand what the job is of the officer or the limitations that the officer has. So one thing I would want listeners to know from your perspective is the stresses of litigation.

Tyra Valeriano:

If there is a claim filed against them, whether it be from a criminal case or just a standpoint of something that somebody doesn't like what you did and it's not criminal but they're going to file a tort claim, what do you think that does to their mental health? Because I'll tell you, I've only been in one litigation case and it's almost over. I'm actually still in it and I've been out of law enforcement for two and a half years. It's still not done. It's a long time and it's very stressful and, considering how long these cases take, the stress can actually be unbearable. If you have tort claim or you know different things being filed against you over and over and over within a short timeframe, what, what do you think is good advice to tell officers that are either experiencing that, or have experienced that, how to deal with their mental health in these processes?

Cody Robinette:

The first thing is not every case is designed to take a shot at you personally. It's not necessarily meant to be here. We have a problem with mending this idea of like I did something wrong, versus they don't like me or it's a rejection of the self and it shouldn't be. Even as a defense attorney, I liked to make friends with law enforcement officers and tell them just, you know, even if I'm not in the middle of a case, just tell them off the cuff, you know here's who I am and here's what I'm about and you know. Thank you for doing your job, etc. But I want you to understand that just like you're doing your job, I'm doing mine right, and so attorneys necessarily make their business off of taking and picking up a client's cause, whether it has merit or not. Sometimes we're going to because we run a business, and that's especially more critical for small businesses like mine, where I'm the only attorney in my practice. So we we have to be zealous advocates for our clients, and sometimes that means, you know, we have to advocate for them in ways that we may not personally agree with. We set ourselves aside to do what's in the best interest of those we have agreed to represent.

Cody Robinette:

So you know, whether it's civil or even in criminal cases, right when you get put on the stand you kind of feel personally, attacked and digging down to the nature of being a law enforcement officer. Let's say you have a DWI stop and you're challenged on it. You have a motion to suppress and the defense attorney wants to rip you into shreds because of the nature of your stop. That feels personal. That definitely feels like you know, what did I?

Cody Robinette:

Number one thought is just because this has been filed, you're looking at it, going wait a minute, what did I do wrong? Now you're second-guessing yourself. Then also, you know, when you're going through a bunch of questions now it causes a bunch of more apprehension and you're going man, what could I have done differently? What is this about? And it's taken very personally because the challenge is based on the conclusion that you made. So it may not be about you personally, but it may just be. I made a decision in my professional career and you know it's being challenged and from the civil side it's not much different. It's just that you made a professional decision through your professional capacity and that's the only reason why you're here. If you were in a different role you might not be there you're here.

Tyra Valeriano:

If you were in a different role you might not be there. So the mental health aspect of that and you know I can see the similarities between taking a stand on a criminal case and, on the civil aspect, you know, having to deal with the process. I have seen officers in my career who have been sued for many reasons, some of which are not them. It usually is based on wanting money. People want to pay out, people want money. So if they find something they feel is wrong, even though they may have no merit, they just want a payout. And that's usually how it goes at the end of the day. So would you agree.

Cody Robinette:

And everything starts at seven figures. Everything starts at seven figures, everything starts at seven figures. You know, you got bumped by an officer. That's a million bucks, right, there, right.

Tyra Valeriano:

Yeah, right, I mean, it's literally everything. So when you in your position? The reason why I want to ask about the mental health aspect is because officers stress about these things, right, I've seen these officers go through so many civil cases and they've had them filed and filed and it doesn't mean they're a bad officer. I mean they're good people, they're good officers. Yeah, they make mistakes here and there, but nothing that would make you think, hey, they're getting sued left and right, what's wrong with this cop? They're stressed out, you know, and it's like how do you, how do you help them deal with that? Because civil cases take a long time.

Tyra Valeriano:

This follows you until the very end and regardless of what the outcome is, I'll tell you one of the the aspects of worry that comes with the civil side is that, depending on what the outcome is, there could possibly be a criminal charge that could occur from that, depending on what happens, and that alone can make an officer stress out for years and years and years and they don't know how to cope with it. What is your best advice for coping with that during that timeframe?

Cody Robinette:

coping with that during that timeframe. Find a healthy vice emphasis on healthy, and I say that as an attorney 33% of us, through our careers, will end up through some sort of substance abuse at some point in our career. That's dangerously high, right? So don't lean on things that aren't healthy for you. But again, you know, escape, unplug your mind for it. Sometimes I get that that's a challenge is to say you know how am I supposed to separate myself from this? You know, especially, this is affecting my day in and day out. But go find the best part of the world and plug in there, whether it's a family, whether it's church community, whether it's, you know, other officers that are friends, maybe in a different jurisdiction. Escape from that. Escape from that.

Cody Robinette:

It's not wrong to unplug, it's not wrong to to just take some time for yourself, right, and don't stigmatize it being selfish. Don't categorize that as being selfish. Self-care is not selfishness, you know, because you have to in order for you to be able to pour into somebody else's glass, you've got to have something in your own pitcher, and so you have to work on that. And that was one of my challenges for a long time is that I categorized it as selfishness and so I wouldn't take time for myself and I ended up being like a shaken Coke bottle that continues and continues, that pressure builds up until you know something kind of.

Cody Robinette:

Something kind of manifests itself in an unhealthy way. Right, and that does happen a lot. You know inability to concentrate, you know tiredness, fatigue, you know you're again you're not running at a hundred percent, which is not not ideal, and you can. You can either invest in doing that and putting time into your, your self-care and your escape and and up front, or you can be forced to make time for it after the negative physical manifestations come through. Something that I personally encourage, not because of, not necessarily because of religious practices itself. You know I am a follower of Christ. I practice Sabbath rest is I take one day every week just to escape from work, not because I believe that that's going to bring me like to be like, oh cool, I have a better standing in heaven that way, but because it's a good opportunity for me to practice gratitude and to practice things that are again appreciative of the things that I do have and am blessed about, and that's part of my escape from the day in and day out what I'm doing.

Tyra Valeriano:

So you mentioned that you had a time where you were experiencing some mental health concerns or issues and you kind of bottled that up. I mean, at what point did you realize, like holy hell, I gotta, I gotta take control of this because it's not going down the road that it should?

Cody Robinette:

Right. There was a time that I I was. I was undiagnosed at the time and I had never felt depression and anxiety before, so I didn't know exactly what it was. I could surmise, but you know I I'm not a diagnostician in that respect and those that I had close to me and around me had said you know, I think this is something that you should consider doing, that you should go, should go, consider seeing help beyond you.

Cody Robinette:

The way it got bottled up was that I again I categorized it as selfishness, so I didn't want to invest time in that. However, I did start doing things to try and self remedy and be like I've got this, I can defeat this. And of course, I thought, if I can do my physical exercises enough, well, that should just bust it. And of course, some people who were unversed in mental health challenges said, well, that's all you got to do, just get your sunlight and exercise. Yeah, okay, Guess what? It didn't work. It helped, it helped, but in no way did that alleviate the pressure of the Coke bottle that was being shaken, and so what finally forced me was that I just had a physical breakdown. Is that I just finally decided you know what I'm going to take two days off of work.

Cody Robinette:

I think I missed like a Thursday and Friday. Um, I just, I just had to escape, but I was, I, my body was physically exhausted because my brain was overworking. Uh, of course it was dealing with the stuff inside as much as it was dealing with the stuff outside and compounding, and I, you know it was inability to concentrate. It was, you know, inability to properly express emotions, and I had plenty of people that say, you know, man, this is going to be a tough conversation, but I don't recognize you. This is not the Cody that I recognize or knew or grew up with or whatever it might have been. And they said something's different about you and I'm concerned.

Cody Robinette:

And if it weren't for the encouragement to say, hey, you know what, let's do this together, and people that supported me and actually physically went with me to my appointments, even though they didn't say a thing, but just having somebody there with you, was paramount, because the worst feeling that I had during the darkest days of my depression and anxiety was that I was in the fight of my life for my life, and I looked to the side and I felt like I was fighting alone. That is the worst feeling. Isolation is the worst feeling, and it compounds. What you're feeling and going through is to be like the burden is on my shoulders alone and nobody else is there to help me, and so it feels overwhelming to that.

Cody Robinette:

Find your community Again. We're not meant to walk alone. So find the people that are going to do that, to say, hey, tell you what. I'll sit with you on the phone while we call the physician and you know I'll go with you to your appointments and you know I'll drive you there. For goodness sake, and they did, and that is what kind of picked me up, set me back on my feet. We'll walk with you for a little bit until you can get yourself going again. And that was the initial steps that I needed to get back on track.

Tyra Valeriano:

That's really great to hear that you know you're able to pick up from that. I think it's very difficult for people in law enforcement to come forward. First of all, and obviously we know there's a stigma I mean, everybody knows it is and right now this is what we're trying to change and I actually had a discussion prior to you with someone else about that and there is this stance of, hey, you're a man, you need to deal with it To a certain extent. Yes, I understand that. I don't disagree with that. I understand that I don't disagree with that. Just the way society is right.

Tyra Valeriano:

But I recall working with an officer during my career who experienced a lot on the job and a lot at home and you can just tell he was going on a spiral down. I mean, you can see it. It wasn't just in the way he acted, it wasn't just in everything that people were seeing on the news or body camera or what was being said in the newspapers. I mean, he went through a lot and part of the the reason why I think it's so important to change a stigma is because, even though he's a man, he was going through a lot and he maybe he didn't feel like he had an outlet, or maybe because he had so much years in law, law enforcement, that he just felt like you know, I'm almost done, it's fine, I'll just deal with it the way I'm dealing with it and that'll be that. And you know, I don't know what, what he's doing with his life now. I do know when I left he was not in a good spot and it's just really hard for police officers to want to break that boundary. They're perceived as weak, they're perceived as, oh, you can't deal with it.

Tyra Valeriano:

And I personally, my journey with the mental health aspect of law enforcement isn't so much because that's what I experienced.

Tyra Valeriano:

I do have my own personal journey and most of my struggles were family related, that kind of strung from the job Right through a different lens and looking back at my time as a sergeant and realizing how many resources are not available for police officers, it really just put into perspective why nobody wants to ask for help, because if you want to ask for help, you're going to be given the EAP program and I've talked about this before and that's all we really have.

Tyra Valeriano:

And where I'm from, it was a small I wouldn't say so small town now, but it was a small jurisdiction and if you go to the EAP program, that counselor knows you know so-and-so and their wife and friends, with everybody that's in the community and now everybody knows your business. So we're not going to do that Right and there's no, there's just no resources. So these conversations, I think, are really great because it shows people that this is why you have to talk to someone and maybe, if you don't have to talk to somebody, agencies should be providing resources that are immediately available for first responders to access without having to go through a supervisor or HR and put themselves out there because they're not going to want to do it.

Cody Robinette:

Right, yeah, absolutely. And the other challenge is to be like, okay, you know, I've got the pressure of needing to be my absolute best on the job and then I've got to take care of this off the job and I'm exhausted after a 13 hour shift, like, how am I supposed, am I sacrificing my sleep for that? And there's a lot of considerations and, like you said, just the initial step of reaching out to be like can I do that in a safe way is not always a comforting notion to people. And you know, some of the things that I did is that I definitely got out of my jurisdiction to go find a mental health counselor and you know, and I that was an added layer of safety to it to to keep you know my confidentiality of the things that I'm going through. And there are assistance programs that you know. Okay, they don't know you and you don't know them, and that's sometimes that could work both ways, right, sometimes that's a comfort to people to be like, oh cool, well, they don't know anybody that I know, and so they're not going to be inclined to talk to whoever. Or it could work the other way to say but they don't understand and they don't know me, how are they supposed to jump into my situation if they don't understand me Right? And so, regardless, reaching out, especially taking a shot in the dark, because you don't know how that's going to end up or the road that's going to take you, that's a challenge for sure.

Cody Robinette:

And, as you pointed out before, we have to have command presence. Right, we have to have command presence, which means I give the perception to other people that I'm in charge, you're not in charge, I'm in charge, and here's how we're going to roll through this situation. You have to have the answers, a whole lot. You are expected to have the answers, and so this is one of those times where mental health is such a different animal because it's a monster inside of your own head. How are you supposed to pull that out of your head so you'd have it right in front of you and fight it there? You can't. And it's a different thing to say, oh, maybe I don't have all the answers for this, I don't know what to do, and you freeze up. But you know we don't.

Cody Robinette:

And especially the stigma of masculinity, like you pointed out, is to say, tyra, I read a post this morning that it was supposed to be on masculinity. But it said don't tell anybody your problems, nobody wants to hear it. You are a man, you are designed to handle that stuff on your own. And I was like what a lie. What a lie. Like what are we telling people to do? Handle that on your own. What if it doesn't work? What if, when it doesn't work? Right, that's such a lie and I'm like man, I feel bad.

Tyra Valeriano:

My husband and I have this conversation often and we're running out of time, but I wanted to tell you that, since we're on the topic, and he's you know he's a man's man, like he's been bodybuilding since he was 15 years old, done all these competitions, loves the gym. You know he years old, done all these competitions, loves the gym. You know he's athletic, just all the things, and he does preach that. You know you're a man, you need to suck it up and that's what he believes in and that's okay. Okay, so I don't sit there and argue with him, but I do think that there are certain circumstances that he's never been exposed to or that he's never experienced. And even though he can tell me, if it were me and I dealt with that, I think I'd be fine. Well, that's okay to assume that, but you will never know unless you're in that situation. And when we talk about that situation, my grandpa and this is a story I've actually never told, just my family knows, but my grandpa was in the military and he was very, very high ranking in the army and when I was like five years old, I remember him telling me he was walking into the garage and he told me that he was really sick and that he was going to be going to the hospital and that he probably wouldn't come back. So I just remember him telling me that he was really sick and then, the next thing I knew, one day he wasn't there anymore. He died right. So I thought he died in the hospital because he was sick. It wasn't until I was 17 years old that I found out that he committed suicide in the house. He shot himself in the room that I used to stay in. To top it off, I didn't even know that, and you know that was a long time ago. And so it brings me back to this point where everybody goes back to well, be a man's man. This is how it's always been. It's been like this back in the day.

Tyra Valeriano:

But my grandpa, who was very high ranking official in the army, you know, obviously he didn't feel like. He didn't feel that we don't know what happened, we don't know why he did what he did. My grandma thinks that you know he was seeing someone. So even though he was seeing someone, maybe there just wasn't enough time because that stigma has just been there for such a long time. So it's.

Tyra Valeriano:

I think it's safe to say that it's not really that there's a problem with holding certain things in because you're expected to. If you're a man, if you believe that, that's fine, there's nothing wrong with that. But what it is is that the experiences that people are facing in first responder roles are very, very different or even military, like my grandpa are very, very different than what the average person is experiencing in their life. And so we keep preaching that and we're just like, yeah, you know what, it's fine, it's fine and I joined this role because I'm an alpha male and I can deal with it, but that does not change that you're still human, right, it doesn't change that you're still human, absolutely, absolutely.

Tyra Valeriano:

Okay, so I know we have come to an end and I asked my guests. I always ask them a question that is related to law enforcement, but since you are in an attorney role, I want to ask you something a little bit different. What is a constitutional or what's a right that you see officers violating the most in Texas?

Cody Robinette:

The right that I see officers violating the most, I would say, is the right to be secure in your person's papers and effects without probable cause. That's been reviewed by a magistrate a neutral magistrate right? So, unfortunately, I have far too many cases where and we're talking West Texas, right, and so we have somebody that made a complaint, so the sheriff hops in the truck and says, yep, let's go get them, and they drive up to the person's house and they're cuffed and heading back to the station. I'm going hold up. What, like? I forgot the part where you were wearing a red coat and a George Washington looking wig and the three pointy hat, and so I'm like when did the British invade? I encourage my cadets all the time.

Cody Robinette:

There is nothing wrong with getting a warrant ever. If you have the time and availability to do it. That is absolutely the best step to take, because you have your probable cause that's been validated by somebody that's impartial, and sometimes it's the same judge who signs your warrant. That'll be hearing the case, right, and if they want to challenge the warrant, you can be like hey, judge, you're the one that signed that, dude. If the defense attorney has a problem with it, they can take it up with your honor, so do that.

Cody Robinette:

And it sounds, that sounds really unfortunate. But it happens more than we see, and it happens more than we think. And it's I mean it's it's easily remedied. And I, once again, I think it's our human nature, just for our hearts, to go out to that person, be sympathetic and be like, oh man, you know that's a wrong against you, but you know we can calculate those things, we can be thorough and methodical with them, as the constitution prescribes. As you said, becoming being a constitutionalist is kind of becoming more and more rare because we're going what is that thing, what You're?

Tyra Valeriano:

right, and that's why I kind of paused for a minute. I'm like, okay, wait, maybe not. Everybody knows what that means these days, I'm not sure. But on the topic of you know, the're just sitting there at the sidelines like man, I wish we can do that and we see them pursuing, you know, right down the street and I don't know. Texas, texas is great when it comes to being a police officer.

Cody Robinette:

I will say that you bet, you bet and I don't mean that to emphasize. You know, when things don't go right because they go right 99% of the time right it's again the squeaky wheel is the one that gets the grease and gets the attention. And so, you know, we see the small, the small indiscrepancies and stuff that that may not look right, but the large majority of the officers and the large majority of the situations are are to the T and I love that about it and and I love the ones that that take their job seriously and they want to do it right, and they want to do it right the first time, and so they're going to do what they need to, to measure twice and then cut once.

Tyra Valeriano:

Fair enough. Well, Cody, thank you so much for joining the podcast today. It's been a privilege to have you and your legal advice, giving us mental health awareness and all of the stuff that you've learned along the way. Do you have any contact information that you can share with listeners if they want to reach out to you?

Cody Robinette:

Yes, ma'am, so you can go to my state bar page it's the State Bar of Texas and then you can Google me and find me from there, or there's a search bar that you can find me and my contact information is there for my practice.

Tyra Valeriano:

Okay, all right. Well to the listeners. Thank you, guys for tuning in and again for your continuous support. Everyone be safe and I will see you on the next one. Thank you for joining me on chapter blue. If you enjoyed today's episode, be sure to follow and tag me on social media and share with your friends and fellow officers. If you're interested in joining an episode, I'd love for you to be a part of the conversation. Until next time, stay safe, take care of yourself and remember you're never alone in this journey.