Thriving Artists: The Daily Joyride with Robyn Cohen

Embracing Imperfection: Dr. Rachel Miller on Thriving as a 'B' Student

• Robyn Cohen • Episode 13

Share episode

Are you tired of striving for perfection and feeling like you're never quite enough? Does fear of doing it “wrong” stop you in your tracks? In this extra special episode of Thriving Artists: The Daily Joyride, host Robyn Cohen takes a deep dive with Dr. Rachel Miller, a licensed clinical psychologist who has devoted her life to helping people unlock their true potential. Tune in to discover how embracing your imperfections can lead to a more powerful and joyful life. From deeply personal anecdotes to professional insights, Dr. Miller shares practical advice on living authentically, the importance of meditation, and the power of showing up, even when it's messy. This episode is a wake-up call for anyone who is their own worst critic and a must-listen for those ready to break free from self-imposed limitations. Get ready to be inspired, empowered, and transformed as you learn how to thrive by being a 'B' student. Your journey to a creative, fulfilling life starts here!

Connect with Dr. Rachel Miller:

Facebook: Rachel Miller 

Website:  Dr. Rachel Miller

🔆 Hello Thriving Artist!

🎊 I made you an MP3 Audio Gift designed to infuse your day with passion, ease and purpose: (in less than 7 minutes!)

“5 Proven Practices to Peace & Power” FREE GUIDE!👇https://mailchi.mp/cohenactingstudio/free-gift-to-freedom

Plus!

June Acting classes are in full summer swing!

Jump in:

🌍 Join Online via zoom:

🗓️ Mondays @ 12PM PT

🗓️ Tuesdays @ 6PM PT

✅ All time zones welcome.

 Register for a class here: www.cohenactingstudio.com

Audit a class here: Auditor sign up

Never audited before? Your 1st one’s on me!

👉 DM on IG to save your free spot: @RobynCohenActingStudio

💻 Online | Community, connection, creative confidence, deepening your craft and more!

⭐️ One-on-one coaching is available throughout the year—book a private session on Robyn’s website

✅ If this episode resonated with you, feel free to leave a review—And share it with someone who needs to hear it - Let’s make this Thriving Artists’ community into a powerful and potent Movement!

Yours Truly!

💕 Robyn C. 

👉 Follow Robyn on IG: @RobynCohenActingStudio for more updates, inspo and free resources. 

Time Stamps

01:12 Invitation to Join the Acting Studio

02:08 Welcoming Dr. Rachel Miller

06:16 Personal Reflections and Friendship

10:33 Navigating Adolescence and Mean Girls

15:05 Therapeutic Insights and Self-Perception

22:39 Understanding Childhood Trauma and Shame

22:45 The Impact of Parental Influence

25:19 The Role of Group Therapy and Meditation

25:50 The Importance of Self-Acceptance

28:10 Exploring Human Potential and Emotions

31:42 Parental Influence on Professional Life

36:30 Navigating the Quest for Approval

40:14 Balancing Ambition and Self-Care

44:25 Final Thoughts and Farewell

🔆 Let’s ride. Let’s thrive. Together!

Robyn Cohen:

Hello. Hello and welcome back, thriving Artists. Today's guest is someone who has been touching my heart and rocking my world since I was five years old, and continues to inspire me with her fierce intelligence, her deep empathy, huge heart, and her unwavering purpose in helping others. Dr. Rachel Miller is a licensed clinical psychologist based in dc. and one of the most gifted, insightful, intuitive, and loving human beings I have ever known. Even in elementary school, she was the one that stood up for others with conviction and kindness. Such a winning combination. And today she brings that same strength into therapeutic environments In her work as a teacher, a therapist, and into every life she touches. in this conversation. We talk about what it means to live your calling and how the path doesn't have to be perfect to be powerful. Rachel reminds us that being a B student or even a C student for that matter, doing it messy, but showing up with care and presence is more than enough, It's actually how we truly thrive. Actors, artists, human beings, everywhere. This one's for you because your calling matters. Your expression matters, and if it's been a while since you've acted or if you've never stepped into my studio before, this right here, right now is your invitation to join us. You are so invited to come and audit a class. Your first one, by the way, is free, or if you've been with me before, drop back in and let's get to it. We meet on Zoom on Mondays at 12:00 PM Pacific and Tuesdays at 6:00 PM Pacific, and the work we're doing there, it's so alive, it is so electric, so joyful and so very needed So just DM me on Instagram@robyncohenactingstudio or email me robyn@cohenactingstudio.com. It's all in the show notes, And we will get you into class so you can get your creative groove on And with that, here's my fantabulous conversation with the one and only delightful Dr. Rachel Miller. Here we go. Hello, hello, and welcome back to the Daily Joyride. we're already in the midst of a celebration. I'm here with one of my nearest and dearest, we've known each other since, like, the dawn of time. And we just had an incredible dance party, which, uh, you know, was reminiscent of any number of times, Rachel, that we were at each other's house, playing on the playground, at a slumber party, impersonating Michael Jackson, like whatever it was that was happening, it felt a little bit like that. And so thank you for that. And Rachel, by the way, she is the life of the party. so today we are, so delighted to introduce Dr. Rachel Miller. Dr. Rachel Miller is a clinical psychologist based in Washington, D. C., with over 20 years of experience. Dr. Miller, I feel like just calling you Dr. Rach, We're just Rach. Just drop the doctor. We're just Rach. Now that's known. Okay. So, Rach specializes in individual, group, and couples therapy, addressing a very wide array of presenting issues and psychological concerns, tailoring her approach to meet individual client needs. Since 2005, Rach is a I love it. Rachel has maintained a private practice in Washington, D. C., offering therapy to a diverse clientele and is the co founder and co director of Prentice, a private practice training institute where she trains and helps support and guide emerging professionals and therapists going into private practice. Rachel has been an adjunct faculty member at Georgetown University since 2007. Her academic journey includes a Bachelor of Science from the University of Michigan and a Doctorate of Psychology from Go Blue and a Doctorate of Psychology from George Washington University. Well, I just got a degree. We share that in common. We both have a degree. Mine was a master's in the arts and crafts. Yours is a master in something much more real. Yeah, no, no, hey, No, but say what you were going to say, that there is actually a crossover in terms of character. Of course

Rachel:

there is.

Robyn Cohen:

Yes.

Rachel:

Yes, but what I was going to say is we are all craft, we all create our own stories. And whatever that narrative is, whether you're, someone's telling you the lines or you're creating them and you're unconscious. It is still narration of a life.

Robyn Cohen:

It really is. we could really just spend the entire podcast on that premise, idea, cornerstone of what drives us. But I'll just finish your biography and then we'll get into it. Okay. It's not much longer. We were at Georgetown, and then we were at the Doctor of Psychology from George Washington University. Her extensive training encompasses a pre doctoral internship at American University and a post doctoral fellowship at Georgetown University. These are just the best places in the world and institutions, and they're so lucky to have had you. Beyond Rachel's professional achievements. I have had the privilege and joy of sharing a lifelong friendship with one Mrs. Dr. Rachel Miller Miller. She married a man who has her same last name. Rachel Miller was always Rachel Miller to me, and then she married one Jason Miller, and now she's Rachel Miller Miller, which is incredible. If that doesn't make someone laugh, I don't know what

Rachel:

could.

Robyn Cohen:

I don't know what could. Then they're asleep. All right, wake up, everyone, because we're going to explore Rachel's insights into the therapeutic world, her contributions to the field of psychology, and the fantabulous journey. That has shaped both her personal and professional life as we, get some questions answered today in conversation about how do we live our best lives? Welcome to the show, my amazing friend,

Rachel:

Rachel. Thank you. Hello, hello. Robyn Hello. Oh, this is so fun. I feel like you're right here. It's so great.

Robyn Cohen:

I am. I

Rachel:

am right

Robyn Cohen:

there. And you know, right off the bat, I'm present to, what you do in the therapeutic world for humans everywhere. And at the same time, who you are as a friend. And because that's originally how I know you, you know, I didn't meet as your patient, although I wish I did. And we had a long conversation last time we saw each other about, can I be your client? She's like, no, we're friends. Friends in real life, you can't, I can't have a patient that is my dear, like it doesn't work that way. I accepted it and I invited her onto the show. So um, yes, this is better, we'll have fun, we're gonna have fun. And so when I think about you, Rachel, since I have known you and been lucky enough to be your friend and in your circles, you occur to me from a very young age as someone who was always. You like in terms of we were talking about the crossover between, you know, acting arts and crafts and psychology and our stories and your character, if you will, like if you were playing, you know, the character of Rachel Miller is someone that has consistently Yes, you know, we were young and children and went through puberty in college and grew up and you know, we transformed in many ways. But yeah, so you were my

Rachel:

you were my Partner in crime in puberty because we were like the, the, we were the leaders of the pack so sadly.

Robyn Cohen:

Horrifyingly, I was the, yeah, the leader of the pack. I was full grown when I was in fourth grade. I was a woman. I had, things happening that were, Unimaginable. And I really, I, I, I really was not equipped. I was not prepared. And, even knowing that my dearest were going through that, still, we're going to talk about it. We're going to, and don't worry men, because this, everyone has to go through puberty. God willing. Yes. Right. so when I think about you now and what you do and who you are for your patients, your community, your groups, the people you lead to, the people that you develop and help. I imagine that, you, who I think of as this person that was always just you and what that meant. For me, for you, Rachel, to be you was like, wow, this is an authentic human being who is, I don't know how to say this, except like is in resonance with a world who's like out there being herself and that gift of who she is, of who you are as a person that radiates generosity, fun, love, Like magic, joy, hilarity, intelligence, fierce intelligence, married with loyalty and kindness, nonpareil. I imagine you today, like you just being you, and I know there's decades of training at the highest institutions in the world, but just being around people as who you are. Because it made such a profound difference for me in my life that you existed. Because, you know, growing up, not everyone's a Rachel Miller. And in high school and before and middle school, and especially when you're going through puberty and you're fully developed, I am the same stats as I was in fourth grade. I'm the same height, weight, all of it. I can wear my clothes from elementary school. And I did just put on a Halloween costume from the seventh grade where I was playing Glinda, the Witch of the North, as I starred in a film where I had to play someone going to a Halloween party. So all that to say It was a rough and tumble time, and there was, as you know, as there are in every arena, at every age, it wasn't all kindness and community and friendships galore. There was, there were some We experienced meanies, hardships, meanies. A lot of discomfiture getting through life and growing up really fast and, And that you, that you exist and that you existed back there for me at that time, it was like, it's, it's going to be okay. I had that experience with you, Rachel. Yeah. Like I had that experience. Like, it's going to be okay. And so two things about that. In your practice these days. what are some of the number one things about relationships and friendships that are important that your patients know about, and garnering those, because it was, it, it sort of saved my social life, that you existed sort of in my mind's eye saved my social life. Well, first of all, can I interject for a second? Yes, interjection. No, go ahead. Go ahead. Oh, no, please. No, this whole podcast it wants to be your interjecting on me the whole time. Please. I'm so

Rachel:

excited. Please. I just can't. I want to first, I have to, I have to pause and thank you. It was such kindness of what you're giving to me and that memory you have. It's so interesting. This is what we're talking about of like. Who are you internally and who are you externally and I listened to that I'm like, wow, I agree with what you said in part. Now, as I know myself, I feel like I have confidence as like at the ripe old age of 48, to be able to be like, I can't. Are we cursing in the show? I don't know if we curse. Be you. I want us to be as unedited as possible because I think that what you said before, like, let us be who we are. The idea of what you're speaking to is my, speaks my heart. What surprises me because I'm all about the answer of your question, which will, I'll try to expand on is about helping people to find their authentic self and then find the courage to be themselves. What surprises me and what you said, Robyn, is that if I think back to my, early puberty days and the self consciousness and then into middle school of all the meanies and all, and the self consciousness of all the ways to not fit in. And I think about how desperately I wanted to fit in. We were joking about the dance party at the beginning of the hour, and I was thinking like, Yeah, but, you, Robyn Cohen, Robyn, you, everyone knows this about you, I assume, you were the star. You were, the first time I met you, you were playing, we were in second grade. You were playing Annie, in Annie. I was

Robyn Cohen:

in first grade. I was in the audience. It was a first, it was a one two combination. We were in first grade. You're right. They, they put me out there with the big second graders as Orphan Annie, the sun'll come out. Yes. Yes.

Rachel:

And you can make that noise come out of your mouth. I cannot do that. And so like, yes, I have that memory. You were in seventh grade. You were the, maybe one of two seventh graders in our seventh, eighth, ninth middle school to make poms. And I was like, Oh my God. And I was lucky enough to call you one of my dear friends. Friends. I was so admiring. And I also, I have no musical talent, though. I like to be a showboat of my own. You

Robyn Cohen:

can rock out like nobody's business. I should have recorded the dance party. Continue. Well, yes, off

Rachel:

key and most often off beat, but I don't care. So that's okay. But anyway, I'll just say back in middle school, when I was like feeling all kinds of too bad, You know, I was tall too early and I didn't know my body yet. just all the ways in which all I thought about was let me be who I need to be in order to make it through another day of middle school. You know, it's like it was survival is the way I felt. However, you told that story and I believe you because I've heard similar things from other people that I'm lucky enough to still be in touch with. It's like, I remember there was a particular mean girl. who, who terrorized people, and I remember, I remember the day in eighth grade where I was like, I've had enough, and I, I said, that's it, you person who will remain nameless, that's it, you're out, I, I, I won't take this anymore, and I was like, oh no, because now she was queen bee, and I would be like, what will happen to me, but something happened, a switch. And I was like, I can't be I felt like in order to stay in, her cool club, I had to do mean things that didn't feel good. And then one day I did, it was eighth grade. I felt courageous enough to say not for me. And luckily other people. were loyal to me and didn't, you know, throw me off to the curb when I threw her off. Well, because they were

Robyn Cohen:

dying inside too with their alignment to meanness and cruelty. they were grateful that you were the ringleader that was brave enough to say, no, no, not anymore. This has to stop. This has to stop. So that allegiance was there. They were following their true hearts in following you.

Rachel:

Yeah. So the thing is, if I didn't have that memory of that event, I wouldn't even be able to believe you when you say I came off that way because internally it felt different. You know, it's learning to learn about what it is to be brave or operate in a way with courage, like it doesn't It's terrifying. You don't feel safe. So it's really easy to mistake the anxiety of a moment with feeling shut down or small. When in reality to the outside world, there's a lot of strength that is being projected. And that's really, I mean, that's what I took from your intro of like, wow, what a gift. I didn't know I was, I don't always know that I'm seen that way. Wow. Wow.

Robyn Cohen:

recently, my mission in life is to synthesize that inner and outer. Yeah. And to find a kind of congruence between these two people, the one that, there's the one that we occur for ourselves as. And then there's the character that other people are perceiving we are. And wow, for most of my life, has there been a radical, a chasm, just the most gigantic disparity between who I thought I was on the inside and the story I had about myself, and how I was being perceived, let's say, as you shared so eloquently, on the outside, which is a very different story. different, story you know, and in your practice today. is part of it to feel our own, our wholeness? I mean, is that sort of the aim that we can actually feel our wholeness and start to enjoy our own company? Just like I was enjoying yours and you were enjoying it. Like, can we enjoy our own company?

Rachel:

Yeah, right. And what ends up absolutely that is a goal of. In my mind of therapy in both, in two ways, one, our relationship with ourselves and in two, our relationship with other people and in different periods of time. I think that can be either one of those can be what becomes a sticking point. and they inform each other because, of course, if you're stuck in one set of yourself, you, it's very, very hard to bring a more full sense of self into relationships with other people. and it's really easy to get kind of locked in a role in other people's, you know, View of you. So both, I think they inform each other, but absolutely. I mean, and this is what I was saying about now in my middle agedness. Um, in Shakespeare, we say now

Robyn Cohen:

in my dotage as King Lear said, by the way, for those of you watching, you can see that Rachel looks 21 years old. For those of you who are listening on Apple podcast or Spotify, She looks like a spring chicken. Continue. Well, let it

Rachel:

be known that my Zoom filter is all the way up, you know, in terms of like the, like, I will say this, it is so, we'll call it humbling. I'll be on Zoom all day when I'm doing virtual sessions and I'm looking at myself and I'm like, I'm holding up just fine through the day. And then I look in an actual mirror where there's no filter and I'm like, oh, dear God. Well, that's shocking. That's shocking. There's wrinkles. I didn't see those. But you see the act, you see

Robyn Cohen:

the joy and the laughter, people,

Rachel:

the joie de vivre, because it doesn't matter. Nobody cares

Robyn Cohen:

if we have spinach in

Rachel:

our teeth. Well, exactly. And I have looked like this, the way that I see, I look in the mirror and I see all day long and no one's been horrified. People have been, you know, I look good, fine. Quite the opposite of horrification. Quite the opposite. Right. But that's about back to what you were saying about what that story of ourselves can do. It's like what you end up seeing in the mirror is a reflection of whatever it is you're telling yourself that you are. So,

Robyn Cohen:

Rachel, how do we start? How do we even start to start to rewrite our stories about ourselves? Stop being so mean to ourselves. I work with a lot of actors, a lot of our listeners. They're like, they're torturing themselves. Self pity. Inflicted masochistic, it's harming themselves and ultimately the people around them in this violence against self. How do we begin to begin to rewrite and create the dialogue of a conversation that is going to walk us back home to the fullness of ourselves?

Rachel:

There's a lot, okay, different schools of psychology would answer this differently. Some would be as straightforward as saying, and I like, different folks, different strokes for different folks. So this could work for some people. This isn't how I work, but some would be as simple as, you know, very, structured kind of thought change. CBT therapy would be like, okay, let's catch the distorted thinking. Let's make real behavioral changes. You know, every time you notice a certain thought, we're going to replace it with another one. And that works. Another way that I think about it is a little bit more of a full story about where I get more interested in. And by the way, you can incorporate a little bit of all, so there's really no shade on any way of working. It's like, whatever's going to help. But, to me, I think it's really important to start to understand and notice where are those voices coming from? those negative internal voices that you're, of the, Actor who can't stop telling themselves that they're never going to get apart because who would want them anyway, or, you know, anything, or, the twenty something year old who is certain they'll be alone forever. Yeah, it's basically,

Robyn Cohen:

it's impossible, it's not for me, it's not possible for me, and there's a scarcity, and I'm all alone. Those are the kind of general big chapter titles, yes. Correct. And then,

Rachel:

so the questions are, in my mind is, Let's start to find out why did that story need to be told initially. Who said it to you first? And if it wasn't as direct as who first said it to you, whose voice you've now internalized, the next question is, it's like, was there a reason why it was, it always was adaptive at some point in life. Our minds are, we're brilliant, everyone is brilliant in their psyche. Everything that has become a part of who we are at whatever age came there for a reason. And at some point in your life, it was an adaptive solution to something that was going on. If we're lucky enough to outgrow whatever that adaptive whatever that situation was, what is needed to be adaptively to adapt to the new circumstances of life changes, you know, the brain isn't as. Plastic as we like and it takes some undoing. Why would

Robyn Cohen:

why would that be a good thing in the moment? Why would being mean to myself and i'm a disgusting little girl or a bad little boy? why is that a good thing at the time? Why would that why would well I can think I could think of

Rachel:

a hundred examples I'll give you two just because we'll just have to be quick about it But let's say i'll make them up and honestly i'm really making these up. Let's say one could be that You grew up in an environment where there were a lot of mean people around and a way to protect yourself from the shock of, of getting kind of plummeted with these criticisms was, it's like, think about yourself before someone can think of you. It's preparation. It's like, I'll be sealed up against it. That's one possibility.

Robyn Cohen:

And you become a person that is going to be very guarded, highly defensive, I'm not going to let them in. And as a five year old, malleable little sponge, you make a decision, okay, if I'm going to survive, I'm going to have to steal myself. And then you, then you grow up to be a woman or a man that is incapable of defrosting their hearts enough to even have a relationship. That's right. Thank you. with a friend or a romantic partner. Yeah, I don't

Rachel:

need to, I won't, I won't be vulnerable because if I'm vulnerable, I will get, Hurt? Hurt. Uh, physically worse?

Robyn Cohen:

yelled at or far worse, something life threatening or that occurs as life threatening Yeah. As a child. Yes.

Rachel:

Another possibility for why the story evolves that way is because sometimes, and this is a thing that's a little bit harder to explain, but you I know will understand it because as wise as you are, that we are in relationship first with our. Primary caregiver. So let's say it's a parent or two parents. If a parent isn't capable of holding on and knowing their own shame, it goes somewhere. If a parent grew up and hasn't had the work to find their own self loving posture and isn't in a place of feeling really, kind of critical in the world, it may not even be a criticism of the child, but it may be an unconscious way in which a kid grows up knowing the best thing they can do to make their parent feel big is to be small themselves. You know, that they stay, they stay young or broken, the ever needing child who can save a parent who needs to be good by being ungood. There's lots of ways. That's just, I mean, I'm really throwing out two very random examples,

Robyn Cohen:

but it's so on point because the beautiful actors that I get to meet and the ones that are in training and development, the dimming of the light. Artists do the dimming of their light, which is a maladaptive behavior from that's a perfect example. I was around family members and I had to hide and be small to protect myself and the family unit. And as an allegiance to my parents who were also going through their own psychotic breaks at times. Exactly.

Rachel:

Right. And like, right. Think about it. If you love your family and your light shines so bright. that it makes mom feel dim. You don't want mom to be dim. You want her to be potent. It's very scary as a child to have a parent who can't be in their own power. So what if a solution is I will dim my light so mom can keep shining bright. Then that but then of course you leave your family and that being that that adaptive solution you've outgrown it because now you're with people ideally who actually want to and can flourish and there can be something that you know it's a generative energy one person shines you realize it's not it's only in a zero sum game where it actually is that one person's light is dimmed by someone else's in reality we just get to have a brighter world and But it's only when a system operates where you can feel how like a culmination of people's energy is building and building and building that you can start to believe it.

Robyn Cohen:

Yes.

Rachel:

This is where I'd make a pitch for group therapy, by the way.

Robyn Cohen:

Do it. Do it. And it's going to be all over the show notes and how people can find you before we, have to depart, which I wish was in 12 hours from now instead of 20 minutes. But the, for people that, let's say, can't meet with you, they're in California, they're not going to be able to sit with you in person one on one or in your groups. Yes. That are literally suffering, drowning under the avalanche of their, the trauma from childhood. What's the first thing that a person could do, a layperson, that can't maybe get to therapy right now, but what's the first thing, like literally, from the moment they wake up that a person could do to start to untangle this, unravel this, and dismantle these maladaptive behaviors and defense mechanisms that were at one point very valuable to save them.

Rachel:

Yes. That's a great question. And nobody, this is unpopular in some, Yeah, sir. But I'm going to give it anyway because it's honest. There's not an easy way you, you think about anything that you and your body know? Well, it's very hard to, to do differently. So like, if you want to try to change your posture or sit differently, it is with a lot of effort and thought to make that happen. So nothing is going to happen easily on this front. It's with effort. The thing that if not therapy, which obviously that it's You know, what I'm going to mostly suggest, I really believe in the power of meditation. I think meditation and it doesn't, I mean, yes, people can practice all different ways. Could you go to a meditation retreat for two days? Absolutely. I don't do that. I don't have time in my life right now to do that. But to take a few minutes, I think daily, honestly, cause I think routine habits only form a certain way. It creates space in your brain where if you can have an observing ego. Which is a lot of what therapy gives us space to start to develop. You get to think about things where you're deciding and making choices instead of it being a compulsion. If it's a compulsion, we go right back to the old behaviors. If we just sort of are doing rote, we will do the same thing over and over again in our cognition. So if you want to have space for choice, It has to be have a little bit of a time to develop an observing ego to notice if and what I love about Guided meditation every guided guided meditation will have some version of trying to distance self criticism It's okay. If you if your mind wanders, it's okay Just notice and gently bring it back, you know, those kinds of prompts why because what you're doing is like making space Without judgment with a separation from judgment to know who you are. And then once you know who you are, you get to have more of a choice on what parts do I feel real to me, which part where I like to alter some and which parts are great just how they are.

Robyn Cohen:

Who are we, Rachel? What, what do you believe? What is your worldview? Who are we? What are we?

Rachel:

You and me,

Robyn Cohen:

specifically? Oh, you're so fun, Robyn In terms of like, you know, who are we as humankind on the planet, you know, catapulting throughout the, through the universe. What is it? That's so hard. What can, who are we? What can we be? What, what are we? What are we capable of? Why do this work? Why take the time to meditate? Why take the time to develop practices or go to therapy? I was in therapy, more classical psychotherapy for 27 years. I still work with coaches. I still work with a hypnotherapist. It is, you know, it's a constant in my life. What is it That why we, why, what are we capable of being and why is it worth it?

Rachel:

So I am not going to even take on the question of the why. Why do, were we gifted with a huge, large frontal cortex? I don't know why. Why are humans as we are? I don't know. But I know we are. So for some reason, we have evolved from wherever into whatever to have this part of our front of our lobe of our head that is either a curse or a blessing. In my mind, if you want it to be a blessing, you have to do the work to pay attention to the shadows because that frontal lobe doesn't turn off. And once you have it, your, your mind is going to work. It's going to work a lot in these thinking kind of ways. Other mammals. They get, they get the benefit of having great sense of smell, or they can, you know, they can find their way home, like Lassie, in ways that we can't without our phones. I mean, it's really sad. We really have no ability to get around anywhere now that we rely on machines.

Robyn Cohen:

The penguins, the penguins that can find their romantic partners after a year. Everybody watch March of the Penguins. Oh, I love that. Yes. Yes.

Rachel:

So cute. But here we are with our oversized frontal cortexes. And we just, that's why. Why? Because it. It's not for everybody. Some people, for whatever way that they're constructed, there's a simplicity to the fact that, like, they don't get caught in their own little, booby traps. They can move through the world with joy, and they can, not get too stuck on the obstacles. They can keep moving when they stumble. But for many people, The stumbling knocks you down and you need some help to get up and be able to get out of that thought loop that can be really a trap and it becomes a cage with an open door, but you have to be able to realize how to get to give yourself permission to walk out the door.

Robyn Cohen:

Yes. And, what was. The conversation, what was the dialogue? I love your family so much. I think about your parents and your sister and they were, I felt familial. They were part of, we were part of a big, you know, a tribe in Maryland. And when you think about your, timeline and like, what are the things. Because I think everybody, if they have a chance to be like a Rachel Miller, like, let's go, let's go for it. I'm going to do all the therapy necessary. But what do you think that you absorbed from a young age that you took with you and you staked your life on in terms of, if I align with what I was taught about this, Or what was shared with me. But what were some of those things that you absorbed from your family unit that you were able to really bank on Yeah. And have, be effective in your life growing up?

Rachel:

Well, you know, it's a combination of good and bad. Yeah. So like. I don't know a thing. I have a lot of therapist friends as you can imagine, and I don't know a single one of my therapist friends who would disagree with a statement that, you know, you are a therapist before you're trained. When you're a therapist, you have the job in your family first. That is certainly true for me. You know, I had a mom who struggled with depression, one of the currencies for how to survive the house for me was to be able to figure out and to think, how could I be there for her to help her feel better? and then, and variations of that within different parts of my family. So that's one piece of it of like, how did I get into my profession and how did I get kind of shaped into realizing the, the emotion, the power of the emotion and how, it could be both the most. Authentic, truthful part of ourselves and also the part of ourselves that can be blinding, you know, people's emotions and people's resistance to them, not wanting to feel what they feel can be another way that people can get pulled off track. So that's one part of it. Then I was lucky enough also to have a father who is not the most emotionally, available person. But talk about joy. He is. He shows up with joy. He loves people. He loves life. He celebrates And everyone else he meets. He is such a, has such a generous, he's generous in all ways, but especially of spirit, he just really genuinely wants the best for everything. And to grow up with that kind of mirroring of like, I, anything I did, I mean, I, I, like we spoke about it. I don't have the natural gifts and the arts as you do, but I would show up with like whatever junk that I had created and he'd be like, wow, that's amazing.

Robyn Cohen:

It's so true. I have an image of your father imprinted like a post it on my forehead and he's only ever always smiling. Not to say that of course there aren't moments and the dips and the ebbs and the flows, but there is no image of That I have stored anywhere in my brain that I can call on or call upon or pull forth where he is not smiling and there's a twinkle in his eye sort of the side, the crinkle and the eyes and the smiling and the twinkle and, you know, your mom too, I experienced is such a tried and true, like, yeah. There was something a groundedness to her and I couldn't put any of this into language, but I saw how there was a yin yang, just the energies that complemented each other. yeah, my mom taught me

Rachel:

how to be, Fierce. Like, she is so brave. She, you know, in her own ways could be alienating because she also you know, didn't always know how to reign initially back in necessarily, but that doesn't matter really because what it taught me and especially like in the time that we were growing up where it was and still is, let's be real, where like, To be, like, there was a certain way that women were encouraged to show up, you know, like, she a little bit bucked that, in her truth telling. And that, I mean, there was a fierceness and, that, for sure, when I think back to that thing we were talking about in eighth grade, I was being able to say, like, no, I don't accept that. You know, I certainly had that mirrored from my mom.

Robyn Cohen:

what was her, was there a line of work where she exemplified this or just in your own home? Like, your mom is fierce and you would just see that, her commitment to authenticity, being straightforward. not mincing words, you know, there's such an affliction in Hollywood, this need to please and, you know, to smile to everyone. But people, don't want you to be nice, really. They want you to be straight. They want your straightness. They want your authenticity. I think that's the most loving thing that you can bring to a person or a conversation or a stadium of people, your authenticity. And so was it something you just absorbed just in the home or in what she did in the world or both?

Rachel:

Well, it's a good, I mean, my mom worked always outside the home, but as a child, it's like, you know, we're all narcissists, grandiose little beings as children. So I honestly don't know that I have as much of a sense of her life as a professional. so it's more of like what I would see in terms of like not taking any, you know, Stuff from anyone, you know, she was just, both within her marriage within terms of like She of course wanted to be loved but she didn't get distracted by that So like that's including as a parent, you know, it would be like Not to do the popular thing for the sake of acceptance, but to do the right thing. I think that is what she showcased and emulated in all parts of her life. I would assume in her profession. I didn't see it as much there, but, you know, I certainly saw her moving through the world of like saying the hard things and not always being liked for it.

Robyn Cohen:

Yeah, what a superpower, you know, I've been for the most part, majority of my professional acting life has been in. The Hollywood area and the amount of love and approval that has been outsourced just by me alone, let alone the millions, the millions surrounding me that are also on the daily, you know, trying to get a job. What I noticed several years ago is that I wasn't actually trying to get a job. I was trying to get love and approval. And I, and what an excruciating place to try to find it in Hollywood to get love and approval. Yeah. From some, you know, it's a scary place to try to get love and approval in this particular, it's a business and this machine. And so. that's such an earmark that you absorbed that, you know, I, gosh, and I don't have regrets because I've learned so much and now I can sort of share and teach and help other students avoid some of these traps of this disease to please and, you know, trying to get everyone's approval that will somehow fill the void that they didn't get from their parents, so I don't regret any of it. And. You know, at the same time, I can see that if I had come out to California or New York, where I also spent time professionally, with that somewhere in my craw, like, that would have been the difference that made the difference in terms of stepping into some really, like, Yuck, grimy situations where I did not value my well being. I was more on a mission to be approved of. And if someone told me, yup, you've got the job, then I could finally, uh, Take a breath and relax and be at ease. And that's so few and far between that for the most part, I'm in a cortisol, dopamine rush that went on for decades that ultimately made my, I was sick for a while. And you know, there were things going on, the dis ease in my body. And, so gosh, I, I, of course, like, of course, that was,

Rachel:

No, I was just gonna say, it's so generalizable, I mean, I think that you're right, that like, performing arts, there's, you face rejection in such a distinct and, and, like, obvious way that it's, it's particularly cruel, but I think that it's generalizable to sort of all people in all walks, because it's like, what you're saying is exactly right, it's like, Everyone feels as secure as their next sense of acceptance, and it's not that clear, you know, a little bit clearer and unfortunate way in Hollywood, where you either get the part or you don't. You're not confronted with rejection in that kind of actual tangible way in every profession in that same kind of way. But if it is a role, it's an invitation for a rollercoaster ride if everything about your self worth is tied up in external approval. And believe me, it is so much easier said than done to feel it from inside, but also to think about it as, you know, it's like not having all your eggs in one basket, even if it's not like really well and always generated internally. Cause that's not realistic. We all need something external to help give us a boost through life. We are social creatures, but if it's from other varied sources, if you have good friends, if you have family, if you have hobbies, passions, other ways that you can feel like, well, I'm doing mediocre this, this chapter of my life in work, but I feel good. I feel special in wherever else that can help be the life lap, like a float to get you through to the next achievement. It's really risky when everything is banked on one way of achieving, in terms of self worth.

Robyn Cohen:

That's, yes, so true, so apt. How do we marry working like Hercules to get our dreams? With this. reconstituting ourselves healthily in our last two minutes. What would you tell, what would you tell all the people that don't get to meet with you today? What do you want them to know about you can have, you can have a winning combination of going after it like Hercules in a healthy approach. How can we do that?

Rachel:

That's, So, as you said, I'm in D. C. D. C. is not known to be the most laid back town. Um, so, the idea of telling anyone around here like to, you know, I talk all the time. This is not my idea. This is Winnicott, who's a very famous, famous psychologist. Well, actually, he's a pediatrician, but He made huge advances in the field of psychology. He is known for the concept of good enough in parenting specifically, but I talk about it all the time. Good enough. Good enough is what and people resist it. I'll say to people you're good. It's good enough You work to be good enough work for a beat. I want you to be a B student Why because good enough allows for a lot of things in the role of parenting it allows for a kid to actually learn themselves And you need to feel frustration and disappointment in order to actually develop a sense of self That's where the idea comes from in terms of Winnicott, but that's the way to develop itself Sense of self. If you have every need, if you're gratified, you never feel disappointment, you'd have no way of knowing and shaping who you are or what you like. I would say that, by the way, more generally about joy, how do we know when something is joyful? Only when we can contrast to a full range of emotions. So if you're gonna feel happy, you gotta be willing to feel sad. And so for anything else, it's the idea of like, let's practice. Yes, go at it, but also rest because you can't be on 100 percent of the time. If you can be a B student of life, you're going to actually, it's going to be, you know, you're knocking it out of the park,

Robyn Cohen:

actually. I love that. It's enough. You're enough. Just saying the word, just saying, um, enough, like trying that out as a daily practice. It's really relieving. a morning prayer, a meditation moment. I'm enough. Yes. You're enough just as you are. When Rachel Miller, Dr. Miller Miller says it, I believe it. I promised her I would let her go because she has, worlds of people to help and care for. Rachel, thank you so much. And so deeply I'm going to put in the show notes, but just generally can people find you on your website or if they want to be in touch with you or with you, they can go to.

Rachel:

Yes, Rachel Miller PsyD, which is P S Y D at gmail. com. Oh, That's my email. You can email me too, but it's It's Dr. Rachel Miller, even easier. Dr. Rachel Miller, as simple as could be. Yes. It's Drrachelmiller.com It's my website.

Robyn Cohen:

Perfection. Perfection. Rachel, I love you so much. So much. I appreciate you so much. Oh, I love you,

Rachel:

Robyn Thank you. Oh, thanks for, for having me on. I'm coming out to la We're gonna do this in person. It'll be so fun. We're doing

Robyn Cohen:

it in person. You all heard it here. We're gonna hold you to it. Yeah. Loving me gently. and thank you for letting me sort of slip in a session with my favorite bestie since first grade. Oh, you know, Rachel, I was. sort of crushed that we, I wouldn't be able to sit with you in a therapeutic environment, but here you are with your gorgeous office behind you. And I feel that you've just been dropping the gems, just mic drops the whole time. Thank you. Noticing

Rachel:

my office. I have a patient who always refers to my office as the LA office. So it's perfect that you would notice it. It's

Robyn Cohen:

perfect. And we were so So all of us listening in or watching are just so lucky to get to be with you. My wish is that everybody has a friend like Rachel Miller or someone like you in their lives because it's just going to make it, a magical experience. That's what it is to know you. I love you so much. Thank you so much. I love you

Rachel:

too. Thank you for bringing joy to my day, Robyn Cohen. Likewise.

Robyn Cohen:

I love you Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, Rachel. All Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. Well, that was just the most delicious. So heartwarming. I'm just getting the message over and over. Be around the people that light you up, that fill you with a sense of your you ness, that reflect the best and the highest in you. That's what Rachel Miller, since I'm six years old, as Orphan Annie in the musical Annie, has been doing for me. And you know, I pray I can do for her and, the people in my life, that we are there to lift one another up. We are there To mirror the magic that is in each and every one of us and bring that out of the people around us just by being you. It's such a gift to hear, what she shared, just incredible takeaways of, you know, I'm enough, about, having things in your life that fill you with wonder and a sense of fullness and going outside and the practice of meditating and just creating that little elbow room for yourself, starting, from the top of your day, a little elbow room for your mind and for the grand director connected to all things and the whole cosmos to take the lead before our ego and our rapid. Fire thoughts, begin to try to, you know, steer us into rocky waters. So I loved all of that. I wish for all of you a magical rest of your day or evening, whenever you're listening to this, I wish for you, moments of experiencing the wholeness of you, the joy of what it is to be alive in the middle of the universe As once in a cosmos light to the world, and in a world that really needs your light. Much love, Until next time! I'll see you so soon. Adieu! Ah, wasn't that a breath of fresh air, just incredible Rachel's presence, her clarity, her humor, and that huge heart of hers. I hope you felt all of it. I feel so lucky to call her a lifelong friend, and so honored to share this special conversation with you. And if something in this episode lit a fire in you, Share it with a friend or with someone you love. Let it ripple out. That's how we build a creative life that we love together in community, showing up One brave, imperfect step at a time. Also, if you are feeling the pull to reconnect with your creative spark join us in class. You can audit a session. Your first class is free or drop back in if it's been a while. We meet Mondays at 12:00 PM Pacific and Tuesdays at 6:00 PM Pacific on Zoom, the work is powerful. It is playful, and it is transformative. Links to audit a class, Or to register for a workshop or in the show notes. I really encourage you to come meet your talent. Come say yes to your joy. Thank you as always, thriving artists for being on this rowdy ride with me, and I can't wait to see you next time on the Daily Joy ride. Till then, Be well, and I will see you so soon. Bye-bye.