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The deep end pool podcast focuses on residential pool maintenance and may not cover commercial pool requirements. Please consult the CDC and your local authorities and code requirements for commercial pool maintenance. Now, let's solve some pool problems with your host Frank and Jackie Disher.

My fellow Americans and swimming pool owners.

Hey friends, welcome to the deep end with Frank and Jackie, his sidekick in life and on the earth. We're so happy you're with us this week because we have round two. We're not going to talk about it yet. Round two of Rudy Stankowitz, but we'll talk about that in a minute, but hope you're having a great week.

It is time to get out and vote. If you did not early vote, not shame on you, but because some people just can't, but you got to get out on Tuesday, man, get out, get 

out there, vote, get out there, vote. Hope you've early voted. 

Yeah. 

But. So, yeah, this important election. 

It is an important election, um, so, uh, we're not going to, we don't get political other than if you don't vote, you don't have a right to complain.

Yep. So there you go. Get out and vote. I 

vote, therefore I complain. That's how it works. 

That's how it, yeah. So we had a Halloween this past weekend. All our kiddos 

did this crazy. All of our 

littles were just darlin our oldest, our only grandson, we, we're, we're formin a girl gang, cause. We've got more. But he was, where's Waldo?

And every picture with his friends and their neighborhood, they've got like 10 friends, 12 friends, A bunch of, yeah, it was a 

bunch of them 

that go, he was always like up in a tree. 

He was always beside 

behind the bush. 

Yeah. He was, uh, doing that, what do you call it when you, well, he's photo bombing, like from the back photo.

All of it. 

It was, it was, it was, it was hysterical, very clever foster. And then Parker, our oldest granddaughter, she was a minion, a deflated 

minion, 

because minions are, they're never going to go out of style. 

She 

was the cutest thing ever. And then our. Daughter of Kate was Jesse from Toy Story. Yee haw. She was the cutest little cat ever.

Yes, 

she was. 

She was darling. I got to go trick or treat with her for the first time. And then 

Carter, 

Carter Rose, 

who has no clue what's going on. No, 

she's seven and a half months old. She was a golden doodle because our doodles. And so 

they posted pictures of her sitting with her. 

So we had a Carter do Carter doodle 

Carter doodle 

Carter doodle that was just darling But yeah, well, you didn't pass that candy cuz you don't do others.

I just walked around with a cake But it was yeah, it was great. It was 

it's been a crazy couple weeks But I want to talk about something happened last week 

Oh, what happened last week? Tell me, last 

week when I went to buy a new van, because we decided, you know, I leaked detections, picking up a lot. I'm tired of moving equipment to and from, you know, one vehicle to the other.

So it's time to go get a van and we buy two or three vehicles. We do, 

we do. 

Well, we got through a lot of vehicles and I decided, you know, I'm glad I decided against it because I've been buying slightly used. Vans and trucks, you know, just very low mileage. And there's one dealership I use. I'll even say their name is Huffines up in Louisville.

It's Huffline, Huffine Chevrolet. Yeah. They have a really good used vehicle department. They, Paul is, was my sales guy. He's been my sales guy on several, all the Poolwerx  use him. 

Yeah, he's awesome.   

He, no, he's really good. He goes above and beyond. 

And I will say this, they say if you buy new, it depreciates the minute, especially when we're in business and you, I mean, but, 

but I mean, but you also get to write it off the first year.

Well, sure. 

Man awake, but yeah, but I mean, this time I was like, you know what? I'm going to go ahead and get a bigger van. I'm going to get a new van. I'm going to get this new Dodge pro master, which now I'm after reading, uh, several people and telling my story. A lot of people said, man, be glad you didn't get it.

There's a lot of problems with it, but you know, whatever, but I, 

the one we got. 

No, the one I was thinking about getting at another dealership and I was at a Dodge dealership and while I'm there not really liking what they got, they didn't really have a whole lot of choices. I pull up an ad and it says that there's this dealership on the other side of Fort Worth an hour away.

That I had this fan exactly what I was looking for and it had a really good price on it. Right. So while at this dealership, I called them. I said, is this the real deal? And well, excuse me. Oh, we do not do that. play game, sir. We're so far above that 

because no one does that anymore. 

I'm just, but I'm telling you, I'm about to drive an hour there.

If you have that vehicle in stock, I'm going to drive one hour there and get that van to nine. I'm going to have somebody bring me and I'm going to bring that van home tonight. And this is about five o'clock in the afternoon. Oh, no. Yeah, we'll have it. Well, we'll pull it around for you and, you know, it'd be ready for, we're ready to go for you when you get here.

Awesome. Yep. And so my son called my son, he comes and say, Hey, can you come get me and take me all the way to the other side of Fort Worth? And he missed the hockey game for this, by the way. 

He missed the doubt his Dallas stars. He had tickets. 

He had tickets, season 

tickets to the Dallas Stars and he 

did not go to the stars game 

and 

he came and picked me up, drove me was.

25, 30 minutes from his house to our house, then it's an hour to where he had to drop me off. Then it was over an hour for him to get back to his house after dropping me off. So he picks me up and we go all the way down there on the way is, you know, classy sales guy coach. I don't know what he coaches, but I bet it wasn't coached well, calls me and he says, Oh yes, sir.

Mr. Disher. Yes, sir. We'll have it ready for you. Okay. This is the van we're talking about. Exactly. And I told him the one is yes, sir. And that's the price, correct? No, Bait and switch. No, sir. We don't play that game here. And I was like, okay, I'm on my way. And I get there and I'm going to go ahead and say that I'm not, I'm not going to say the name of the dealership.

I don't think 

you should, 

but you know, those crackers, those really good buttery crackers, the Ritz crackers. Well, the name of this dealership is the opposite of less Ritz crackers. Okay. But I'm not going to say the name of the dealership, but it 

is the 

opposite of less Ritz. Okay. And it's about out on the other.

It's on the West side of Fort Worth. Went all the way out there and I come pulling up and the guys act a little awkward. He always, or anything else you might be interested in. Well, you know, I did ask, well, what do y'all get for the gladiators? And he's, Oh, well, let me pull that up. I said, no, just off, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm not getting one tonight.

Just, you know, 

gladiator. 

And he goes, well, let me, let me get the keys. Uh, we pulled it around and, uh, and he's acting a little awkward. And we get out there and we get all the way to the van and he opens the door. And he's like, well, I be, they must've left the door open. The battery's dead. And I'm sitting there thinking, y'all just pulled it around for me.

Supposedly the door was open for what? 

Five minutes, 10 minutes. So I jumped in it and it started right up. I said, no, the battery ain't dead. He goes, Oh, uh, uh, must be the key fob. Uh, uh, okay. All right. Well, Hey, you know, and I walk around the van, you know, cause I'm ready to sign and take that van that day.

I, I told 'em I need it now because I had a couple jobs the next day. I want to get it loaded early in the morning. Right, right. Start using it and uh, I'm walking around, I say, Hey, uh, tire's low here. Oh, actually it's got a screw in it. I go, Hey, do y'all have any spare tire? Uh oh, no, no. Maintenance department is closed.

I can't get you a tire. Said, well, it's got a fulls size spare. Can I just swap out the spare? Oh, no, we can't allow that. Well, if I buy it, why would you care? And I'll just come back next week or something when I, when I'm available. Oh, no, no, no. We can't do that. Uh, we, we can't allow that. Uh, You don't want me buying this van, do you?

Oh, no, sir. Uh, it's just uh, you know maintenance is closed and we can't you don't you I told you I was coming an hour all the way here if you didn't want me to buy the van Why didn't you say something because i've drove over an hour And thank goodness our son, I told him, Hey wait, wait five, 10 minutes just to make sure this deal is gonna go through before you drive off.

'cause if he would've taken off, he'd have got halfway home and had to come back, get me. 

You'd have to Uber home. 

And I told, because 

he even headed to the dollar star escape. Oh my gosh. 

Oh. And I asked him, I said, well. He goes, well, I can have it delivered to you. And this was on a Thursday and he goes, well, I can have it delivered to you.

And I said, well, when could you have it delivered to me? Cause I need it right away. Well, it would be next week sometime. Well, what day next week? I mean, maybe I can get through the weekend, but are we talking Monday? Oh, I can't tell you that. There's just no way to tell what day you can deliver it. By the way, our other sales guy, every vehicle I've bought from him, he's driven to our shop that day.

Right, right. 

And is about as far away going the other direction. So anyway, opposite Les Ritz, about five people messaged me, Oh, I'm going to contact the general manager, make sure they apologize to you. Cause this guy didn't even apologize 

that 

I couldn't take the vehicle that night. He just sat there looking at me and didn't apologize.

Didn't say anything. And let me turn around and walk off the lot, did not say a single word to me. And then I put the story out there and all the whole, Oh, general manager's going to call and apologize. Oh, I know the head of this over there. He will call apologize. Oh, they never treat people like that.

I've bought three vehicles there. Yeah, they do. Yeah, they do. I have yet to hear from one person from opposite less Ritz Jeep Chrysler Dodge Ram 

on 

the West side of Fort Worth. So y'all can buy me. I will never recommend anybody to y'all. And I hope you get what's coming to you. So let's move on. All right.

Today we're going to be positive. All right. That's that took up a lot of our time, but all right. So we got Rudy coming on. Rudy is if you last week was part one on black algae. This week is part two on black algae. And we really get into the nitty gritty. Of black algae in part two. So this is going to be a really good episode.

If you, if you have a swimming pool and you're in the industry, you need to listen to this. Rudy has a lot of good information. And, uh, if you, if you're not in the industry, you need to be listening to this because black algae, it's, you know, it's not, you're not immune to it. Nobody's immune to it. It can happen to anybody.

All it takes is one slip up and low chlorine and a dead spot, and you can easily get black algae. So, but, so we're going to go to break and when we come back, it will be Rudy Stankiewicz with part two on black algae. Y'all take care.

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It's not magic. It's science. 

Fair enough. All right. All right. So I have toxic stuff. That's what we came down to now. How toxic is each genus? I don't know. I only know from the one test that I did where I got those numbers. So what I need at these points, because I don't have funding to do this stuff and I do pay for all of these things out of pocket is like somebody else to pick it up and run with it.

Here's the information. Here's what I got. Here's as far as I can take it. You either give me money to go forward or I need somebody else to take a look at it and come up with a better way to destroy what we're actually, or to treat that to destroy, yeah, to remediate it in the pool of water or prevent it based off of this information, but the problem is I'm seeing major manufacturers.

of some of the algaecides that are out there in the market, still talking about this as if my information never came up, looking at the old ways. And I hate to think this way, Frank, but they make money on this stuff. Why would they want it? to change. 

Well, it's like some people, the conspiracy, they don't want to cure cancer because they can treat you for 10 years 

because here you go.

Look different things that we can look at as far as is out of the box treatments. 

Well, now, now, yeah, 

this is what we're dealing with. 

Black algae, cold water does not kill it. Correct? 

No, it goes dormant. 

It does go dormant. So that cyanobacteria basically goes dormant. So, but it's still in the air. It's still on the ducks.

It's still on the bugs. It's still on the squirrel that got in a puddle and came to your pool because every fresh body of water is a potential black algae. So raccoons, they go, they play in a Creek. They come to your pool. They wa they wash and poop in your pool right there. Everybody thinks you're so clean as a crap right there on your top step where they're washing their food.

So he's bringing black algae and the ducks flew in and sent 

me in a whole different direction again.

Raccoon poop is a whole different direction. Let's let's save that for a different conversation because I can talk an hour on raccoon poop, 

but the, the black algae is going to get introduced in the winter. And all these people that say that are, I don't do anything to my pool in the winter. It's just fine.

They're getting black algae spores in there. And then as soon as that water starts warming up. 

That might not become active until the water warms up. And then all of a sudden, yeah, we have a problem. And so, yeah, we need to, 

if the water gets a little bit warmer, the 

chlorine is less 

heavy because it takes the warm water for it to create the biofilm.

For, for it to do its process and create the biofilm. I'm assuming I'm assuming because it doesn't colonize. So it only creates the biofilm when it's colonizing, or at least that's an assumption on my part. So people were not doing crap to their pool. Cause they stopped swimming. The water's cold. They don't, they're not seeing anything multiply.

They think they're doing just fine. They're LSI get out of whack. Okay. That now you're creating little nooks and crannies and crevices. For the black algae, when it does decide to start growing and the water starts warming up, water starts turning green, black algaes already started colonizing. And now they're like, Hey, okay, it's time to open a pool.

I'll go ahead and go get that treatment too late. Black algae's already started colonizing and good luck because now you're going to spend the next three, four months trying to eradicate black algae that you could. Easily prevented with good water chemistry and good circulation. 

And here's here's here lies part of the problem.

So not only is it tough to kill, we have to look at this now from, and this is just a testament to keeping up with your plaster, of course, dead spots. That's a builder error. So builders need to be on top of this as well. And in some of these funky wild design pools, that's a big concern to me and looking at some of those, because, I mean, They have to be hydraulic geniuses to pull off some of the things that they do.

And some of them are, which is great, but you know, maybe some people shouldn't do that. Imagine this. So the plaster. So this is a testament to getting your pool replastered when it needs to be redone. And, you know, now my pool plaster is three years old. We can go look at that if you want to, but it looks pretty damn.

You've seen pictures recent. It doesn't look that shabby. But imagine this pinhole. Okay, so now what I want you to do is I want you to picture that you're holding a test tube, and you start filling it with marbles. Each marble is an algae cell, okay? Now by the time you get to that top of that test tube, you've got, what, um, a certain amount of marbles there, let's say five, six, seven, whatever.

When you treat now, even if you're treating it with something that'll work, you're gonna kill that top marble. 

Now it's in the way, 

but that top marbles protecting the marbles that are underneath it. And this is where people could possibly theorize that it has roots. It doesn't, but it will definitely fill that pinhole.

It will fill those pits. It will fill that deteriorating plaster. So yeah, sometimes the pool does need to be replastered, but not for the reasons folks are saying. It's not because the algae's taken root. It's because the pool needed to be replastered in the first place. And that's why we have black algae.

Yeah, people that claim this root thing, that's like saying water has roots. No, it doesn't. It's just going to get to where it can. It's not going to penetrate deeper and create more nooks and crannies. It's going to make you see nooks and crannies. That you didn't see before, because now you got this discoloration in that spot where before it looked fine, I see it all the time pulls that we'd had no, no idea.

It had a little crack just because we always see it in bright sun or whatever. And then it gets black algae in it. Now you see it because the black algae is 

highlighted. Let's look at it in its most simplistic form. Algae is a plant, okay? But black algae is not. It's cyanobacteria. It's a bacteria. And bacteria just does not grow roots.

I'm sure everybody would agree. Okay. It happens to be hard to kill. It is actually cited by many people as being the original source of oxygen on the planet, cyanobacteria. So it's been around a long time. So it's not going to be easy to get rid of. It's outlived what we had three, four catastrophic life destroying events on the planet.

Last one being the dinosaurs. So it's, it's out survived all of that. Now we're looking at trying to treat it as if it was an algae. When it's not now, I will tell you the way this sticks to surfaces is by adhering it's like, and that's what it does. It's the outer cell that has that controls the outer cell of the bacteria that controls whether or not it's going to stick to walls or be free floating.

So, and this negative charge. Determines how it's going to stick. And that's what happens. It does. It holds a negative charge and that's what makes it up. And then when it sticks, then it starts to secrete that polysteric solution. So it's almost like if you stuck a piece of gum to the wall, it just sticks.

It doesn't have roots. It sticks. And then it spreads from there. So one of the things that I found. And this is kind of, it's not 100%, and I can't tell you why as of yet, but we're working on trying to figure it out, is that in our research on using aluminum sulfate to lower cyanic acid, we found that if we put in the amount we're recommending in the method that we're using to drop the cyanuric acid that in about 40 percent of the cases where the pool had pre existing black algae, the black algae just fell off the walls, just fell off.

You made it let go of that biofilm. 

Correct. And I, I took it and I, I put it on, um, underneath a microscope and I actually added. A dose of aluminum sulfate to my sample of black algae to see how long it would take to kill it because I'm thinking, Oh, wow, that's great. Aluminum sulfate just killed it overnight.

How cool is that? And I let it go for a period of days and there's nothing that's going to happen overnight. Not. where it's going to kill it. I thought I was fully expecting to look at it and see it start to lice very quickly. And that's what we're doing because when you add a hundred parts per million of aluminum sulfate, what you're adding is 14 parts per million of aluminum.

The cool thing about using aluminum sulfate is when it forms that flock, as long as you do a thorough vac to waste, you're removing the aluminum. While you're vacuuming to waste, unless you stir it all up. Okay. And the way it works with the cyanuric acid is that we theorize, I theorize that it's pulling the cyanuric acid out of solution, forming a new complex called aluminum cyanurate.

And that gets caught up in the flock and floats to the bottom. And we can imagine this principle. Um, if you're not buying it a hundred percent, if you're listening, we know what happens with copper. 

Yeah. 

Copper cyanurate is a big problem. You get the purplish. pink blotchy stains on the walls and floor of the pool.

That's because the copper pulls cyanuric acid from the solution and complexes and forms those stains. It's just the benefit with the aluminum is it gets caught up in the flock that we form the aluminum hydroxide flock and we vacuum it out to waste. So, all right, that's not working. So I have a new theory here.

So when you add a dose of aluminum. Can I, can I tap on something here? Yeah. 

All right. So you're saying basically the black algae coming off the wall, we didn't necessarily kill it with the aluminum. It lost its attract. It's. Connection to the wall and just fell off. Okay. All right. All right. That's very clear about 40 

percent of the cases.

That's cool. So we didn't kill it. We made it fall off. It's still alive. It's just chilling at the bottom of the pool. Now, instead of being stuck to the wall, not a hundred percent of the time. 40 percent of the cases, I want to be clear about that because I don't want people just thinking, Oh, you can do this every time and it's going to work because there have been times where it did not.

I theorize now when we add aluminum sulfate to the water, what you get is aluminum in a plus three stage of oxidation, which has a very positive charge. So when you get a positive and a negative, what happened, Frank? We neutralize it, neutralize the negative charge of the outer cell wall. Of the bacteria, we neutralize it, that's the part that actually controls whether or not it sticks to something, and once we neutralize it, guess what?

It has no control. It no longer sticks. It falls to the bottom. 

So possibly a flocking, aluminum sulfate flocking, brushing the fire out of it. Maybe come back later, brush the fire out of it. Let it really get mixed well, and you'll get a lot more come off the wall. Now you no longer have that protective layer and now you can kill the crap.

So, yeah. 

And if it falls off the wall, you can also just vacuum it out to waste. You might have to 

kill it. 

So, but what you should do now, here's the thing. If, if the reason that it's not falling off is because remember the test tube with the marbles, maybe we're only getting that first one. Now we should go in with an aggressive treatment because we took that first one out and see if we can get a little bit deeper.

Okay. 

And then just so good chemistry, we have 

that we can look at. So 

it's never a quick, 

right. We don't want slow moving water. We don't want a pitted surface, because that'll give us the dead spots as well. You want to keep a good chlorine level. You want to keep your pH at 7. 5 or less. When I say or less, I mean between 7.

2 and 7. 5. Unless you're in Florida, because they think they're hot shit. They change the acceptable range from 7. 0 to 7. 8. Whole different story. 72 to 75 where you want to be. And again, just keep tabs on this stuff on the only other, the other thing chemically I can throw in, which is not a cyanobacteria or a black algae thing is a mustard algae thing.

Mustard algae does prefer a black algae. a calcium hardness level on top of those other things we just spoke about, because it's all very similar, but they do prefer a calcium hardness level over 275 parts per million because it actually uses the calcium in the water to move for mobility. So we can actually find the best spot in the pool once it's in there, but its ability to find the best spot increases as the calcium hardness level increases.

So it doesn't directly make it grow better, but it helps it travel to an area where it can grow better. 

And mustard algae, my understanding, mustard algae will eat plaster and silica, it eats silica. So it will draw, it can actually create some pits if in a bad enough situation, it would be a long time to do it, but, but we're, there's a 

lot of sources of silicon.

In the water, the sand in your stand filter, the D in your D filter, there's silicate in the plaster, which we were just talking about. Then also depending on where you live in the part of the country, since Flint and Michigan had occurred, municipalities on a much greater level have been using anti corrosion chemicals.

In the water, the drinking water, because it coats the inside of the pipes, and there's still a lot of lead plumbing underground, so to coat the inside of the pipes, so the lead doesn't leach out into your water supply, but what you're getting then is a steady flow of these anti corrosion chemicals, and the two primary ones they're using is silicates, And orthophosphate, and orthophosphate is specifically the type of phosphate that algae needs to grow.

Now, diatoms, mustard algae, are the only thing on the planet known to consume silicate. So, by increasing these anti corrosion chemicals in the drinking water, which is also your fill water for your swimming pools, now we've increased those levels in the pool. So, if you're not checking for phosphates, You should, because now we're adding them directly to the fill of water.

And whether or not you believe it's a problem or not, I'm telling you now we have an incoming blast of it. And one thing we don't check for is silicates. We can, the tests exist, but we don't. So, if you've seen that you've been having more problems with mustard algae in the past decade, than you have in the past, Remember, we talked about the Saharan dust, the California fires, the silicates coming through the tap water, orthophosphates coming through the tap water.

That's a perfect storm right there. I know it's off topic, but we're talking about algae, so why not? So I wanted to throw out a couple of different things, though, that I'm beginning to look at as far as their effectiveness. Eliminating black algae, some other things we can do where we actually treat it as a cyanobacteria versus treating it as a Algae with products that we already use, but we might use for something else and then I'm gonna give you one that we don't use in this country that we use in other countries.

That is probably about the best thing out there. And you can believe these product names. If they're not things that you like, but I'm just gonna I'm just gonna drop some names. So, first off, I biofilm disruptors. Cause there are some chemicals we use for other purposes. And one of those is natural chemistry is pool.

Perfect. Plus phosphoryl chemical that we use in there, though. It's not marketed or designed specifically to be a biofilm disruptor. It is one. So use of that product can help us. It's not going to make it fall off the walls or kill it in a day, but it can help us in the battle against it as well as.

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None of these folks are sponsors for my podcast, but they should be. 

I love see you later, see you later, 

metal eliminator specifically, though, it focuses on metal sequestration, sequestration. It also aids in reducing biofilm formation by removing metals that can fuel biofilm growth, like it or not. It is a photosynthetic bacteria, so it does perform photosynthesis, which means that it does need certain metals to make that process occur.

So even though we can kill it with copper, it needs copper in order to create the chloroplasts inside that enable it to Do three perform photosynthesis and turn sunlight into food. Basically potassium monopresulfate can help oxidize contaminants that can contribute to biofilm formation. We know that as non chlorine shock.

We also know that that is also not a actual shock either because potassium monopresulfate is not strong enough to break the chlorine hydrogen bond. or excuse me, the chlorine nitrogen bond that occurs in chloramines, it gets rid of the stuff that can lead to chloramines. So you're never going to reduce your chloramine level with a non chlorine shock.

The other thing I wanted to talk about, and this is the thing, like I said, that they use a lot, um, aside from some other things that work, ozone is very effective, hydrogen peroxide, but ozone is a contact kill, so it actually has to come in contact with it. Hydrogen peroxide used in a combination. With UV or ozone, what we get there is AOP, Advanced Oxidation Process, which is very effective.

Chlorine Dioxide. 

Chlorine Dioxide. 

That's the one thing that they, that's the one thing that they use in other countries that we don't use here, that is extremely effective at disrupting a biofilm structure. Penetrates the protective slime layer without you having to brush, and it oxidizes the organic matter, killing the bacteria within the biofilm.

more stable than the traditional chlorine. It also has less disinfection by products associated with it. 

Any, any chance that they show up in the US? The typical chlorine 

we use. 

Any chance that will come to the US? Well, we like to take 

things, we like to take things slow in the US. So when they first, chlorine dioxide first came about in the late 1800s.

So we're getting there right now, about, uh, 13 percent of our municipalities are Using chlorine dioxide. I don't know if it's an experimental state or not, but it is, uh, they are using it to end successfully. I don't know. I can't tell you if it's going to come here or not. I don't know the reason why it hasn't come here as of yet.

I know our friends in Australia are very familiar with it throughout Europe, other places. I think it's the better way to go and I think it might be the better solution to killing it, not preventing it, but killing it. 

Okay. 

Aside from the other things that we mentioned now, I want to jump back to some of those products that I mentioned.

There are other products that will do those things in those same categories by other manufacturers. I don't know what they are all off the top of my head. And I named a specific, for example, I named a specific enzyme. There are all different enzymes out there. So I can't attest to the chemical or I can't attest to the formula used in everyone's.

product. I just know that if it's the same as that one or that one, it works. So on it with the metal, uh, with the sequestering agent, so on and so forth. It depends on what their exact formula is on how well of a biofilm disruptor the product is. So I don't mean to short any other manufacturers. I just can't know all of them.

So tell me. No, send me an email. Rudy, you stuck. You didn't name my product. 

And that is Rudy at CPO 

first 

Rudy at CPO class. com. Now, 

uh, uh, real quick, be the first one of those emails. I 

cut the copper sulfates, you know, products like, uh, Blu ray Excel. I love Blu ray Excel. I don't like using it every day because I feel like it's a, it's that thing.

Okay. We got things we have to overcome that are. Not ordinary or extraordinary that we have to overcome. So Blu ray XL is a really good addition to help overcome the extra is the, is the way I look at Blu ray XL. I mean, love the product and the, and I would use it, I would use it on every pool. And I would recommend it for every pool, but people don't test their metals.

And if, if everybody would test their metals, I'd be fine with it. As long as we could control it. Cause we can, you see you later to lower the metals when it will to an excessive. Point and we can drop it down and, and then you gotta have good water balance when you're using metals, because if you don't, you're going to stay in your freaking pool.

And you're going to blame the source of the metal when it was just basically bad management. 

Blu Excellent. Like you said, it's an excellent product. If it was managed better, I like to call it responsible chemical dosing, which we're not really strong on. Uh, there are folks who are, there's a lot of folks who aren't.

We all know the, the person who it's a, an orange DE scoop of bicarb fixes everything. But Blu ray XL is, is, was, is my go to when I had a pool that had dead spots in circulation. Yes. There's nothing I can do about the way it's built. I can't change it. You know, you have a dead spot because that's when you get the algae always growing in the same spot over and over again.

It's opportunistic. There's only one reason it's going to keep occurring in that same spot. And it's not because it's embedded in the plaster. Sometimes you do successfully kill it, but now you have it again. It didn't come back. You have it again. It's different. So we're going to have a dead spot and we're great there.

It's sent roots and it's grown back from the roots. Oh, crap. We talked about that. 

Um, you're going to have to believe a lot in this one. So, so yeah, and, and to your point before Jack's magic product makes a lot of great metal removers and stain removers and enzymes and such as well. And they're one of my favorites.

I don't, I don't remember where I was going with this. So, uh, yeah, we chased rabbits. I have a lot of practice of being drawn off off path, but, um, or going off off. 

We need to do something where we just get together once a month and we can cut it short and say, okay, we'll, we'll pick it, pick that up next month or something.

Because I get you, Jason. And I mean, this is going to end up having, just this episode is going to have to be two shows. Well, the 

important, the important thing to remember is that, you know, it's almost like the definition of insanity, right? If you keep doing something over and over again, expecting a different result, that's what that is.

So here, how's, how's this, can you do one better? What if you continue to treat something as an algae that's not an algae? Why don't we just treat it like it's a cyanobacteria, because that's what it is. How much better of a success rate would we have if that's what we did? Because we actually took samples from swimming pools to use in labs to figure out whether or not our stuff works, 

you know, because everybody's go to his metals.

I love AOP, but not everybody wants to put an AOP system on their, on their pole because it does create hydrogen peroxide, which we know the effect of this, just that little bit of residual helps, you know, that, that, uh, the process creates. 

That's one. There's, there's a few. We can talk on that if you like to, but I know which one you're talking about.

They use as a combination of ozone and UV, which produces hydrogen as a by product, which degrades and we get AOP. It's the whole thing. 

But Rudy, I, I, I appreciate your morning. I, I mean, I, if neither one of us had anything to do, we could probably just. Talk for all day. If we want it. 

Oh, if I, and if I, I forgot, if I comes back to me, what I was going to say, I'll give you a call and say, Hey, let's, let's add five minutes or so, or the way we talk, it would be 30.

But, um, but let's add five minutes. If I remember, I just don't re I just, I lost it. 

Are you doing shows this winter or not shows? Or I know you're doing shows. I'll probably see it five, six shows this winter, but are you doing CPO classes? 

I'm doing CPO classes, mostly virtual now, um, still have, uh, getting adjusted to, uh, moving around.

You know that I had a pretty good injury a few years ago. 

I was going to ask you offline 

earlier this year. 

I was going to ask you offline. Health is still a hard time moving. 

I fell off a mountain. I was, it was in Greece. I was in Athens and I decided, you know, cause we just did the horror episode. So I like to check out weird things.

With that as well. So there's a cave there. It's called the Veles Cave. It's supposed to be haunted. It's at about, I think, 600 meters. So I went up there and explored that. And then they were saying, well, you know what? There's a sanitarium that, They used for tuberculosis patients that closed in the forties when penicillin came out of it.

800 meters. You wanna go check that one out? I was like, well, yeah. So I went up there and, you know, what do they say? F. Oh, F. F around and find out. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So I found took a pretty good injury there. But, um, You know, all in all, I'm, I am going to be that guy that slides into home plate on the way out, exclaiming Yahoo.

That's my goal 

with the cane. Now 

I'm sitting in a wheelchair right now, Frank, but I'm, I'm in between cane and wheelchair. Yeah. So I figured it out. I was a cane. I can walk exactly 1 8th of a mile in a day. It doesn't matter how I use it around the house in the yard or on the street. I can walk 1 8th of a mile and that's that.

Then. So I kind of alternate with a wheelchair to extend it out a little bit. And I did get 1 that's highly portable. Um, but I'll probably be, um, I know for sure. I'm speaking on algae. I have one, one class on algae, one class on cyanoic acid at the National Plaster Council's convention in, uh, tail end of February.

I will definitely be at the Florida show and I'm gonna try to get to Atlantic City and I think that might be it for the upcoming shows for me. 

All right. Well, I 

hope I'm not going to make Dallas. 

Well, uh, hopefully, hopefully I'll see you at those. I do plan on, I will be at Atlantic city and I plan on going to the Florida.

Are you talking about everything under the sun unless they renamed it? 

Okay. Uh, well it's, it started out as the Florida show once upon a time, well, 

I'll, I'll definitely see you to those and uh, you know, I hope your mobility comes back quick and you can do what you need to do. Hi. 

It's. It's the ones that I can travel to within a short distance solo, uh, is where it is.

If, I mean, I could probably do Dallas, but I'd need somebody to tag along with me on the ride. Uh, so, and that just gets a little bit more challenging having somebody drop everything to go to a show there they don't want to go to. 

I'll go pick 

you up. I'll go 

pick you up. Well, you know what? I mean, you could play this, dude.

You could play this if you're going to be in a wheelchair, get one of those voice synthesizers and all of a sudden you get some respect. Yeah, just like this is a Hawkins.

I'm here to talk to you about technology. No, I'm totally, I'm not going to go that route. I'm totally going to go professor X. , professor Xavier, if I'm gonna be in a wheelchair and I'm bald, we're gonna roll with that one. All right. Although I appreciate Stephen Hawking, which was an awesome impression, by the way, wasn't it?

wasn't bad. Wasn't bad. It's pretty good. Yeah. But, all right, Rudy, I appreciate you Tom, bud. Yeah, it's, we still didn't get to wear everything you wanted to cover and everything I wanted to ask, but there, go man. 

It's I, we'll just do another one. 

Yeah, we'll, we'll do another one soon. Alright. I appreciate you just lemme all take care bud.

All right, buddy. Thank you. Talk soon. Bye. 

Hey, Jackie. Hey, Frank. Have you ever wondered how you can clean between all those pesky filter pleats on a cartridge filter? 

Yeah. I lose sleep over it. I mean, it's so tedious and it takes forever. I can never seem to get them all clean. 

Well, here's a pro tip. Try the cyclone filter cleaner.

It uses water pressure from your garden hose to spin the filter as you clean it. This allows all the filter pleats to get thoroughly cleaned out and the best part is it is fast and doesn't hurt your back. 

Wow. 

The cyclone filter 

cleaner. 

You got it. The cyclone filter cleaner. You can thank me later.

Thanks. And what I love about their filter cleaner. is they have this wand. It's the best filter cleaning spray device I've ever used. We've tried many, many different ones. And they got a short version now and they got a long version, but I love using those things. Even on our DE filters, we use their wands.

And do we have a code? 

We have a special discount code. If you go to cyclonefiltertools. com And use code DEEPEND, you'll save 10 percent on your order. So you can buy direct from them. Great stuff. I'm glad I found it. We got one on every truck. My guys love it. Guys, don't miss out on this. This is the best filter cleaning system out there.

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Hey friends, welcome back to the deep end. After that fabulous, I feel like I know everything there is to know about black algae until it happens to me. And then I'm going to call either you or Rudy and then 

Rudy's the expert, you know, and we, we talked about it. Rudy's don't really the only person in the pool industry that's done any research.

On black algae. 

And it's extensive what he's done. He 

has gone further than even any of the chemical manufacturers have gone. Researching black algae. There was no information out there. And that's why Rudy, I mean, it cost him some money. He had to spend some money to have tests done and things like that.

And Rudy's very scientifically minded anyway. So if 

you're bent that way, then you got to chase the rabbit down the hole. And 

he probably enjoyed the. He's still working on it. He is still working on it. He will continue to work on this. He's, uh, he, he has spores growing in his house. I'm sure his wife loves that.

He has little test tubes laying around full of black algae. He's got test tubes with mustard algae in them. He's got all kinds of stuff going on, but thank 

you, Rudy Stankiewicz 

for your efforts and the time you spent with us talking about this, we really appreciate you. Yeah, and, uh, Hey guys, make sure wherever you listen to us at, uh, cause we still got things messed up with Spotify and Apple and all that.

It's a crazy mess. Oh my gosh. Uh, we got somebody trying to claim, uh, intellectual property on our, uh, On our show and nobody's ever contributed anything to it. So that's kind of funny for 

you, 

except for me and our guests. Uh, we, we, well, our old station manager, Russell, uh, we call him Hector, but Russell Owens, you know, he, he, he gave us a little help.

But he's the only one that's ever participated. So anyway, so it's messed everything up, but we're getting that straightened out and we should be flying right here in a couple of weeks. We may change hosts, but we'll hopefully we'll be updating regularly on Spotify and Apple. We're still making the episodes, but right now you got to find us on pod, podco, podcast.

co and that's the one we post. So look at us on the Facebook group. But once we get back on Apple and all that, we've done lost all our reviews, all our ratings. We need Joe. 

Oh my gosh, please, 

please, please, please, please give us reviews and ratings. We need all of our listener 

comments, man, because we need to do another show on listener comments.

So, all right. Uh, thank y'all very much. Thank you, Rudy. Thank you to all our sponsors. Absolutely. And we will catch y'all next week. 

Happy fall, y'all. 

Happy fall, y'all.

Be sure to give us a five star rating and review on your favorite podcast platform and send us questions and topic suggestions to deependfrank at gmail. com. That's deependfrank at gmail. com. Dot com and also check out our homepage at the DeepEnd pool podcast.com for all of our podcast and video content and links to our blogs and our sponsors, and the products we know and trust.

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