#53 - Kate Dore talks generational trauma, cancel culture in comedy, Louis CK & comedy classes

Episode #53 of Good Times Noodle Salad gets real fast as Matt and Paige are joined by comedian Kate Dore for one of the most emotional — and hilarious — conversations yet.

What starts as a deep dive into stand-up comedy quickly turns into something heavier, as the trio unpack generational trauma, childhood experiences, and how those things shape not just who you are, but how you perform on stage. A talk about Matt's kids going through their own trauma leads to Matt and Kate both crying.

They also get into the realities of comedy culture — from why “cancel culture” doesn’t stick in stand-up the way people think, to giving flowers to comics they respect, including Louis CK and Dave Attell.

Plus, they talk about coming up in the scene, including what it’s like taking Bill Bushart’s 101 class at Mark Ridley’s Comedy Castle and how it helps shape new comics in the Detroit area.

It’s raw, it’s funny, it’s uncomfortable in the best way — and it’s one of those episodes that sticks with you.

Transcript

SPEAKER_08 0:38

We'll get it. We'll get it straight when we're getting there. I'm a silly, silly broad fun.

SPEAKER_03 0:43

We're getting there. I'm by chemical means, because my neighbors are fucking dipshits here.

SPEAKER_08 0:50

Fireball. Alright, let's get this down by my body. Cheers, ladies. Cheers, y'all. Thanks for having me. Dude, thanks for coming. Yeah, I'm excited. I like doing this kind of stuff. Ooh, I'm breathy though. I gotta watch it. I'm a big puff my peas.

SPEAKER_03 1:06

That's alright. It all gets fixed in editing. True. The uh so spots. Yeah. Um I got a showcase on Tuesday at Ridley's. Oh, nice. That's exciting. I'm uh I have not done that set as much as I would have liked to before I do Ridley's Room. Yeah. You know, I'm a little I went to One Night Stands last night and um it got.

SPEAKER_05 1:34

Oh, he's gonna have a hard time focusing.

SPEAKER_08 1:38

You need to get like a quilt that you can hang up on the door.

SPEAKER_03 1:41

I'm gonna get a sign that says shut the fuck up, Cunts.

SPEAKER_08 1:43

That's where I'm like on air. Shut up.

SPEAKER_05 1:46

We have that that we usually put out, and she was complaining about that sign being out there.

SPEAKER_03 1:51

Yeah, we we have a little sandwich board that says, Shush, we're recording with a picture of Jon Stewart with fingers on his lips. And she's like, You're not gonna put that in my area. We are not gonna tell my customers to be quiet.

SPEAKER_08 2:02

You should have, I would think there's some kind of thing you could do with your lease that you have rights to that space. We do.

SPEAKER_03 2:09

We did. And then our fucking dumbass landlord was like, Oh, you can rent the entire hallway.

SPEAKER_08 2:15

I would definitely push it that it's like if we need to, we're gonna take this to court because I want my like last month's rent because I have to move. I'm the fucking pay the fuck out of here.

SPEAKER_03 2:25

I'm getting the fuck out of here.

SPEAKER_05 2:26

Yeah, we tried calling him before you got here, he did not answer. Yeah, I'm getting the fuck out of here.

SPEAKER_03 2:30

I'm not surprised that's a good thing. This whole fucking yeah, I'm I'm fucking pissed. He fucked me. Fucked me over.

SPEAKER_06 2:37

How long have you been here? A few months. Even with the prior room.

SPEAKER_03 2:41

Yeah, a few months. We've been like four months now or something. And like I was really excited. Like when we first got here, Ashley from Hatchery Co. is super cool. She's got like a a vendor store basically. So she's got she I mean, she's cool as fuck. She's been super supportive and very helpful. And then uh John from the bar uh Bright Bargains, super cool. Yeah. But then Norm leases the hallway and it fucks me.

SPEAKER_05 3:10

And it's like, oh, you and then and then he also told her that you only um record at night, which is gonna read the whole letter?

SPEAKER_03 3:20

This is a fucking first of all. I use Chat GPT so much I can I can I I know a hundred percent that this was generated on Chat GPT. Yeah, I'm just looking for the word diligently or fucking. I don't need a robot to foster how to tell someone to fuck off. But essentially, this this fucking letter is basically saying that we'll have a productive working relationship. Oh, I like the last line with neighbors as long as we do what she wants.

SPEAKER_08 3:44

I look forward to a positive relationship. What was the last line?

SPEAKER_03 3:48

I truly appreciate your understanding. Blah, as we get the shop up and running. My preference is to resolve things directly and amicably without needing to involve the landlord. Thank you for cooperating. I look forward to a positive working relationship. Positive working relationship.

SPEAKER_05 4:03

We've been here since December.

SPEAKER_03 4:04

The everything in this letter says that we'll have a good working relationship as long as we do what she wants, which is basically we don't record until her store is closed, which is at 6 or 7 p.m. Unless she has special events that go late into the night. So basically, I can't use my fucking studio because Norm is a fucking retard and leased the hallway.

SPEAKER_05 4:28

I don't know if it's norm, though, especially because she put I don't want the landlord involved.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

It's Norm. He's the one that fucking leased the hallway. He's an idiot.

SPEAKER_08 4:39

He's a fucking idiot. Money grubbing is gross. Like, I mean, it's his job. Yeah, but come on. You can't have this space is like cordon off, like they know to just keep it over there.

SPEAKER_03 4:49

Right. Well, she probably looked at it like, well, I can these little suites aren't gonna handle my whole store. Right. How can I make this work? And it's like, well, do you make the whole fucking thing? But but also if you look at it. If you go downstairs, it's kind of the same thing where like the entire hallway and all of the rooms off of the hallway are all a store. So it's like it this is kind of the the mo of the building. But to have a to have a guy who records a podcast in the building and then tell a lady, yeah, you can he's only ever here in the middle of the night. So she thinks everything's gonna be fine, and then we're here at like 3, 4, 5 p.m. and she's in the middle of doing shit.

SPEAKER_08 5:33

People here at 4 30, yeah, and then there's just noise like Right.

SPEAKER_03 5:39

Right. I mean, yesterday we we actually got away with recording without much issues, surprisingly. But the but in general, it's like you wait, hold on. You expect me to pay all of this money to rent this studio. It's a lot of money, and then I can only use it when her store's not open, which is after 6 or 7 p.m. And then also when if she doesn't have any special events going on.

SPEAKER_08 6:04

So then do you get a good discount on your room? I was gonna be not able to fucking use the room.

SPEAKER_03 6:09

I was literally gonna tell him, hey, if I'm only allowed to use this for half the time, then I'm paying half the fucking half the fucking rent.

SPEAKER_08 6:17

You could come in later, but don't fucking pay what you're paying. It's crazy. Yeah, I'm not crazy.

SPEAKER_03 6:23

I'm not happy about the situation. I'm I'm pissed about it. And I tell you what, like, the more we talk about it, the less I want to blame her because all she's trying to do is protect her own interests.

SPEAKER_08 6:32

She didn't know that this was like a podcast studio, and then it's like, oh, you can just have the whole giant hallway.

SPEAKER_03 6:37

Well, she did, but she was told that we're only here in the middle of the night by Norm. So Norm fuck I mean, Norm is just he's a fucking idiot, dude. He's a dumb fuck. And also, I have a huge bone to pick with him because we were here recording. Right. We I my kids, I put my kids in lawn chairs and and had them chilling in the hallway, playing playing on their switches, no big deal. Hey, if anything happens, come on in. And we're in the middle of talking. Who's here? Was that Nick? Nick Stevens. Nick Stevens. So we're talking, and then I'm just my seven and eight-year-old are out there in lawn chairs, and then all of a sudden I hear fucking shit and fucking God, fucking shit, and fucking bop up. And I'm like, what is going on? So I go, I run out there, and it's Norm, the fucking the landlord, running around screaming because children because because the fucking lights are on. Because he he, I don't know, drove by and saw that all the lights at the building were on. He called a maintenance guy who is a new guy who no one has met. The new guy comes here, starts yanking on door handles and shutting lights off, and the other store sees that on the security cameras, goes, What the fuck? Somebody's breaking in here. Rushes up to the building and starts threatening to call the cops on him. He's like, I don't know who the fuck you are. You're running around my business yanking on door handles. So then they the three of them are screaming at each other in front of two little kids. So I go out there, I go, What the fuck are you guys? What are you guys doing? And he's like, Are you sh- and then he turns it on me and goes, Are you shutting the lights off? I go, I'm fucking here. I'm fucking here. What are you talking about? The lights are on because I'm fucking here. I mean, I'm this is why I have the podcast studio. Because we're here recording. It's like 7:30. And he's he's swearing and it's swearing and yelling in front of my son, who's seven. And my son goes, Daddy's scaring me. And I'm like, oh, I'm gonna fucking murder him. Scaring my kid. I'm so pissed. And then he doesn't even I understand getting real like seeing red when you're in a conflict with somebody, like another adult. No, but don't turn it on someone else.

SPEAKER_08 8:46

Like you were just here.

SPEAKER_03 8:47

He's fauna of kids. And then you don't even have the class to be like, hey, that wasn't you guys. It was it was, you know, me and John were arguing. My bad dude. I shouldn't have sworn I shouldn't have been yelling in front of your kids. Like, no class hasn't fucking said a word to me, won't answer my phone calls now. Fuck him. He's a bitch. I'm gonna smack him his fucking mouth next time I see him. I swear to God. Don't do that. Scaring little kids. I'm pissed. I'm fucking pissed. He fucked me over business wise and he scared my kids. So now I'm like, fuck you. I'm done with you. I will tarnish your name for the rest of fucking time. You're a piece of shit.

SPEAKER_08 9:20

There's no excuse. And I don't know, man. I feel like that's something to pursue in litigation. Like, I'm not gonna I'm just gonna leave.

SPEAKER_03 9:30

And I'm gonna tarnish.

SPEAKER_08 9:31

You're gonna pay your last month's rent.

SPEAKER_03 9:32

No, I'm gonna. Cancel the card that it's on. Well, that's the thing, is that we paid first month's last month. So I paid him for March that money. And I'm getting the fuck out of here, and that's it. That's that's I'm just gonna be amazing. Yeah, I'm fucking pissed. I'm I'm pissed about this whole situation. The way it all shook out is fucking bullshit. And you know what's funny is that I've been told in a million different ways that when you meet someone new and they fucking smile in your face, they're a piece of shit. And it feels but it your instinct is so the opposite of it.

SPEAKER_08 10:02

Yeah, my brain doesn't work that way. I don't fuck people over, I don't talk shit. Like if someone's friendly towards me, I'm yeah, I don't know. I just have that in my head to be like, we're we're cool. Yeah, right, right.

SPEAKER_03 10:14

Because it's so counterintuitive to be like, oh, this guy's smiling and he's really nice. He's he's fucking me over right now. I'm just he was the nicest guy on earth when we met him. Oh, I bet.

SPEAKER_08 10:24

And then he's just fucked up. He's wheeling and dealing. Fucking douchebag.

SPEAKER_03 10:28

Fucking douchebag. Doesn't even have enough class to apologize for sh cursing somebody out in front of a seven-year-old, scaring the shit out of my seven-year-old, who, by the way, thought he wasn't allowed to come say something because he was like, I don't want to interrupt dad's podcast. So he's just sitting there scared shitless while a six foot three grown man is swearing and screaming at the top of his lungs in front of him. Fucking scumbag, dude.

SPEAKER_08 10:50

I would have been. I was fucking seeing red.

SPEAKER_03 10:52

I was seeing red. I'd end, I came in, I was like, dude, we gotta end the podcast. Like, I can't get past it. I'm so fucking pissed off.

SPEAKER_08 10:57

Sorry, we gotta do something else. I can't. Oh man, I don't have children, but I have that like psycho mom instinct of maternal instinct in my body that I'm like, I'll fucking create. Like, don't fuck around around kids. It's not okay. Yeah. Scare a little kid.

SPEAKER_03 11:14

To scare to run around screaming and swearing in front of a little kid. Because the lights are on.

SPEAKER_08 11:20

Yeah, and you know, people are here at night. What the fuck do you think about? Like, they want to We're gonna be here in the dark. They want to put you guys in here at night only and then And then be mad when the lights are on here at night.

SPEAKER_03 11:32

Geniuses. Geniuses at this point. At what time was it? Like seven or week ago?

SPEAKER_08 11:36

7 30. Yeah. It's not like it's fucking four in the morning and they think someone's breaking it, which they have it look like someone's fucking breaking it.

SPEAKER_03 11:42

Because they send a new guy here. And then and John was was like, Why can't you text the fucking the tenants and say, hey, we're sending a or yeah, just send out a whole thing of it. Hey, we're sending a maintenance guy to shut the lights off, just a heads up. And Norm goes, I'm not doing that. I'm not texting 30 different businesses. Wow.

SPEAKER_06 12:01

You don't have a group chat to like go and just email everyone?

SPEAKER_03 12:04

You can't send a group chat out. You know how much that takes zero fucking hours.

SPEAKER_06 12:07

Four fucking seconds.

SPEAKER_03 12:08

Yeah. So I'm out of here. I'm done. We we have like a soft commit to move to a different way.

SPEAKER_08 12:13

It just sucks to like you have to move all your shit. Like you have it set up the way you like it.

SPEAKER_03 12:17

Dude, I think that this space, if I could just like copy and paste it somewhere else, I fucking love this office. Yeah. But every time I come here now, I get fucking pissed because of all the bullshit around.

SPEAKER_08 12:28

It's not good for anything, you know, you're trying to do a podcast and just have guests and stuff.

SPEAKER_05 12:34

Like and then you just mad the whole time.

SPEAKER_08 12:36

Yeah, that's not conducive to good read, like good podcasting, whatever. Like right.

SPEAKER_03 12:41

We should all be like sitting here, like I mean, although like rage baiting is kind of like a fucking good thing for engagement. But but you get talking, but but I tell you what, like I want to come here and be like, dude, so what's new with you? Not be like this motherfucker for you know, and yeah, I mean, I want to come here and be I want to feel joy when I come here. This should be like my mil my little man cave. Like, I uh the fact that I come here and I'm this angry every time I come here, and I got fucking guitar hero right there. Like, you know how bad that like this is bullshit, dude. This this should this should feel like my little man cave, like my little bar or something like my basement or something, you know? Yeah, and instead I come here and I'm like, what the fuck what's the new conflict today?

SPEAKER_08 13:20

When you have kids, you can't have randos coming over, so it's not like you can just podcast in your basement. Like your home has to be a safe space, so you need something else exterior that yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 13:31

We used to do it at our house, but then once we started having guests who were like, yeah, we can't.

SPEAKER_08 13:35

Yeah, I would always be weird about people coming in and out of my house that I don't know, especially with kids. Like I have pets, but that's something with like having parties or anything, and someone invites their rando friend, and I'm like, I don't fucking want some rando around my animals, and I'd be like ten times more psycho about a child, like a human being. Right. Yeah, I would be super nuts.

SPEAKER_03 13:55

I wish I wish that we could just do it out of the house. It'd be much more comfortable, obviously. We can control the conditions way easier, but that's the thing.

SPEAKER_08 14:02

Like your garage suitable for it, or no? Just a lot of the houses here, it's like a super tiny garage.

SPEAKER_03 14:07

Like, yeah, we we our house, I just can't I just can't do it. We have so many guests that it's just it's just yeah, it doesn't make sense. It's not safe.

SPEAKER_08 14:16

Yeah, knowing like randos knowing where you live. Yeah, well, that's the thing too. It's like if I have a guest, if I have a guest that I don't jive with and then they get bitter, like they could fucking Yeah, or people get weird where they like they get very like vibrato on a on a mic, and then they're like, Oh, I don't like what I said. And it's like, well, think about what the fuck you're talking about. Like, what? And then they're mad about something they want you to like delete the whole episode or filter out a ton of the shit that they were talking about.

SPEAKER_03 14:42

That happens all the time, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 14:43

And I tell people right away, it's super weird about it, and it's like, don't like I don't know. I do I do a music podcast, it's a music history podcast, and it's just me and my two record dudes. But sometimes we get on a topic that I'm like, hey guys, like I'm cutting this because it's like political or something that I'm like, eh, like you know, I don't know, I don't want to put it in there. But when you have like random guests, it's like have a fucking brain in your head about the shit you talk.

SPEAKER_03 15:09

Like, yeah. There's been a handful of episodes where I've started off by saying, like, hey, don't talk shit about your dad because I'm not cutting it out.

SPEAKER_08 15:16

Yeah, if somebody that you know is gonna listen to it or could listen to it, like maybe we'd say that off mic.

SPEAKER_03 15:22

Yeah, you know, me and my so this this podcast started off with me and my brother. And uh he is the he has a hard time being vulnerable without like getting grump like getting gruff about or he has a hard time well he will be vulnerable to me, right? But then he's like, Oh, this is public, and then he's a really hard time with that.

SPEAKER_07 15:46

And he's like, You gotta cut it, don't you?

SPEAKER_03 15:47

Yeah, and it was like, hey, I'm not doing that. I'm not I'm not editing out, yeah. And then sometimes I would edit out shit because he would he would take a oh god, there was a couple of times where he was trying to say that separating an art the art from the artist is something that should be necessary because there's so many great artists who are pieces of shit as people, and but he took a very long time to land his plane, and I was like, dude, it just sounds like you think Mel Gibson's like the shit. Like you like this, so I had to cut that out. He had a lot of good things to say. I'm like, dude, yeah, he's like, he's such an amazing director that it's like uh you know, it's almost okay that he's a piece of shit.

SPEAKER_08 16:23

Yeah, you always gotta watch it because that's like oh my gosh, that's that uh Chappelle bit that's like I don't know if Michael Jackson molested all those little boys, but I know damn sure that he made thriller. Like just stupid shit like that, but it's like uh yeah, that's tricky. Because I like I never want to stop listening to Michael Jackson, but now shit's changing with that. That's coming around full circle. That like that might have been shit with Epstein Files things that they are trying to get him in trouble, and it's all these fucking white hetero dudes that are raping children. Like, that's all crazy that's turning around. Um, but yeah, the the Mel Gibson thing is Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:05

The uh yeah who it's who had the joke that uh like if you like you get one. Like you like was that you gotta watch it, yeah.

SPEAKER_09 17:14

Is that Chris Rock? Yeah, that you like have to Like you're so good.

SPEAKER_03 17:18

Yeah, like Michael's is so good that he's allowed to.

SPEAKER_08 17:21

Oh, that's like people forgive that, yeah. But that's all those kids like it's so fucked up joke. It's such a weird situation when he does have all these kids around, but all the famous kids like Macaulay Culkin and all those dudes, like they said he never ever did anything to them. And then you have people calling him that are like, My kid has cancer, he wants to come hang out with you, and it's like you want your child to go hang out with a adult man alone, and then you're gonna sue him for millions of dollars.

SPEAKER_04 17:49

Like, yeah, all right.

SPEAKER_08 17:51

That's on the parents, too. Like, that's a really fucked up situation. But the other one that sucks is like I love Kevin Spacey. Love Kevin Spacey, so many fantastic films, brilliant, like impressionists. Have you ever heard him doing impressions of people? He's brilliant, and that like um I was trying to fact-check myself in that joke. You're good. Oh, you're fine, whatever. I don't care. Give it a goog, man. I don't care. Um he he did this film. Did you ever see Beyond the Sea? It's about Bobby Darren. He wrote it, directed it, acted, sang in it, and it's like fucking incredible. And then all this shit comes out where he's a creep, and I'm like, fuck. Like, can't you just be cool, man? Like, goddammit. It always happens. Like, I feel like I hate that so much.

SPEAKER_05 18:38

Any musicians that I like get into, and then all of a sudden it's like, Yeah, yeah, Kevin Spacey was one of my favorite actors.

SPEAKER_03 18:44

Oh, brilliant. He had that movie. Do you remember that movie? Capex? Capex was insane. So good. Yeah. Uh the usual suspects, amazing. Brilliant. And then he had one about the death penalty where they did this like ritual on film to like prove that the death penalty was an inherently flawed thing. It was an amazing movie. God, I wish I remember that. Well, if only we had the power. Yeah, look it up.

SPEAKER_08 19:10

But the uh he did this really weird one that was like um oh what the fuck is the name of it? It's like Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil or something like that. And that's a really random one, but that's such a good one. And it's like a really early Jude Law movie. Um and they have this super famous drag queen in it.

SPEAKER_03 19:31

The life of David Gale.

SPEAKER_08 19:33

Oh, I've heard of that. I don't think I've ever seen that. Sorry, I don't want to do rally. No, you're good. No, that's such a bummer that he just ends up like there was this weird clip after he got accused of everything, and my fiance was super into House of Cards, and that's when they like kill him off, and then they show this clip of him on oh, what was inside the actor studio? Do you remember that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he's like, Oh, when I do my acting classes, I I really go for the quiet kid. I like the one that's sitting in the back of the room and this and that. And I was like, it sounds sweet when he says it, but then you think about it, you're like, this is so fucked. Grooming.

SPEAKER_03 20:10

It seemed endearing, but it's actually grooming.

SPEAKER_08 20:13

It's such a scary, like, it'll give you chills if you watch it in a different context of like being aware of situation.

SPEAKER_03 20:19

But yeah. I but also the like cancel culture had gone so far that people were getting cancelled for shit that's like the Aziz of Sari situation where essentially he goes on a first date, the girl gives him head, and then she regrets it.

SPEAKER_08 20:33

Yeah, then she's gonna come after him and then he's fucking loaded.

SPEAKER_03 20:37

And then shuts down his career because she regretted it. Like what hold on. Okay, like not only is it that's a loaded you have an a loaded agenda there, but also you're diminishing people who have like real fucking trauma that they dealt with.

SPEAKER_08 20:56

That's what's scary when it's like you want to believe all women. Like I'm abroad, obviously. Like, I want to believe all women, and shit's happened to me, but it's like the ones that fucking exaggerate or or change some, like change the narrative to be the victim. I'm like, shut the fuck up. Like you're part of the fucking problem just as much as creeper dudes are, right? Where like you're creating this where people don't fucking believe.

SPEAKER_03 21:21

It undercuts the reality of frustrating actually traumatic encounters.

SPEAKER_08 21:26

That was I love Prairie Home Companion. Do you ever listen to that? That's such a doofy, like NPR. It's an NPR, it was an NPR show, and it's Garrison Keeler did this show for like fucking 25 years on MPR. That's the guy that hosts. Wait, wait, don't tell me. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 21:43

Okay, so he's another show. I didn't know he had another show.

SPEAKER_08 21:45

Prairie Home Companion is this like cute, wholesome as fuck show where they're like, oh, we're in uh we're uh coming live from Lake Woe be gone, and they do all these goofy little like stories and interstitials, and the bands on, and there's like A dude who does sound effects and shit, like that's the one dude's job. And it's so cute and wholesome. And then there was something that they filmed that this broad had a really like low cut in the back dress. And Garrison's like dancing with her, but his hands like down on her back. And she's like, Oh, he fucking touched me and this, that, and the other. And it's like, it's on film.

SPEAKER_04 22:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 22:21

Like you had this dress on, he didn't fucking grab your ass. He's not grabbing your tits. Like, what the fuck? And it's like one of the most wholesome like things in the universe. And then they're gonna accuse this dude and they cancel it, and then they try to come back out, like come like redo it with somebody else, and it never worked. And it's like that was that dude's show for fucking like 25 years, and then you're gonna be like, oh, this one broad that wanted to get loud and mad about something that was so harmless.

SPEAKER_03 22:49

I tell you what though, I listen, I loved a NPR, I loved NPR, but they created their own environment. Like they created too woke. Like they created their own. I stopped listening to NPR saying for a specific episode. I was listening to Terry Gross. Okay. And she had a she had a transgender female on. Yeah. So she had transitioned from male to female. Correct. Yeah. But she was explaining that she lives on this spectrum where she goes back and forth day to day. Yeah, gender-free. And sometimes hour to hour. Yeah. And during the interview, she's like, I just switched back. I'm a male again. I'm a fem I'm a female again. Yeah. Like within like a 25-minute interview. And I was like, what the fuck, dude? Like, this is getting so weird. I can't do this.

SPEAKER_08 23:41

Like this. I want to accept all that and be like, okay, cool, whatever. But then people take it and weaponize it. Or like my fiance teaches, and he had a student like that, and he's teaching college, and he has a couple hundred students at a time, and people expect you to remember their name. It's like he doesn't fucking remember like friends' names. Yeah. And that was this person that was gender fluid that was like going back and forth, and then he didn't use the one name the one day. And it's like, well, I don't fucking like you have to tell me. And he's totally cool. He's cool. Like, we have a ton of gay friends, we have trans friends. He's never a problem about anything like that. He's super cool, but this person just wanted to be a fucking problem.

SPEAKER_04 24:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 24:21

And I'm like, you're that's the same with the women causing shit. Like you're part of the problem of why a lot of people aren't going to like dig their heels in on weird shit like that. That's the opposite side, is gonna be so fucked up towards anyone else who's like just living their life. Yeah, they're just living their fucking life and they're gonna get shit on or hate crimes because some fucking idiot is going out of their way to be an ass.

SPEAKER_03 24:46

Well that exactly. That's the thing so frustrating. I can't tell you how many times I've seen like rage baiting on purpose, transgendered TikTokers like going out in public and and like looking for something. And you're like, what are you doing? Like these are just like people who are like waiters who like like you know what I mean? I get it, like I feel like I have to say a caveat because I look like a certain kind of guy.

SPEAKER_08 25:13

Like I I he's not an insurrectionist, okay. He wasn't at January 6th, leave him alone. I listen, I was a his first baby mama was black, leave him alone.

SPEAKER_05 25:28

2% black, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 25:29

Yeah, oh by the way, I wish she was 2% black. She's Dominican.

SPEAKER_03 25:34

Dude, I had to call her because I was like, Paige was like, hey dude, you keep saying this. Is she black? And I was like, I think so.

SPEAKER_07 25:42

Puerto Rican. Indian.

SPEAKER_03 25:44

So she c I call I called her, what was that yesterday? Yeah. I called her yesterday, and I go, I go, hey, aren't you are you black and Indian? And she goes, I'm like 2% black.

SPEAKER_08 25:55

I'm like, you're 2% black? Was she like the super, super dark Indian or look black? Yeah, yeah, yeah. One of our one of our friends, like one of our friends that's around the comedy community is like so dark that people think he's black all the time. And I'm like, no, dude, like he's Indian. Like he's fucking Hindu. Like, I tell you what, like people get funny with that. They just think like, oh, this dark-skinned person's obviously black. And it's like, no, they could be Dominican, they could be like Puerto Rican or whatever the fuck else that's like could be dark. So it's so funny.

SPEAKER_03 26:25

So that's my def my defense of myself in this situation is that. You went Roseanne where you're like, I thought the bitch was Joe.

SPEAKER_07 26:35

I thought she was Joe.

SPEAKER_03 26:36

She looks like me. No, I fucking no. There was no drugs involved. It's just me being dark. Oh, dude. No, okay. So my defense of this is that Okay, so my ex is dark. Right. And she's got the she was she was adopted by a white woman. Okay, okay. She raised in America from like three years old on the five. Okay, right. So she's she's got an American accent, almost a valley girl accent. Oh, that's hilarious. So she just looks like a she looks like a black girl who's got like long wavy hair. Right. Like and I would argue that she presents as African American way before she presents as Indian. Like so, like in the vein of like how her and I were perceived when we were a couple, was a black and white couple, not an Indian and white couple. Like she doesn't look Indian to me at all. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She like a s like I when I think of like an Indian, like what is what would like a stereotypical Indian woman look like? Right. It's like a light brown skin, sharp features, you know, like sharp sharp nose, sharp chin. My ex does not look like that at all. I'm gonna show you a picture of my ex just to just to fucking prove your point. Just to validate myself a little bit, because a lot of the times I was telling these stories in the vein of like what it was like to be in an inner relational relationship or like having like racial.

SPEAKER_08 28:06

Well, if you were up in Holly, where were you originally, like Holly, or where'd you say you were from?

SPEAKER_03 28:10

We grew up in Waterford and then we moved we didn't move to Holly.

SPEAKER_08 28:13

Still very, very white though. Like yeah, very white, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:16

But like me and Chris Harvey and me and uh Steven Lolly talked about specifically, like I I present a certain way, so I'm sitting at a bar alone and some dipshit wearing like a NASCAR jacket's like, oh fuck, look what just walked in, and it's like black people. It's like, oh, those are my friends. I'm going to hang out with them. I'm literally waiting for them. But like I look like the guy, like because I was in an interracial relationship, when people would see me without that, I started to pay attention to, oh, you think I'm safe to be interracial. Racist towards you think I'm one of you. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 28:50

Some of the shit that people say to you, like you're another white person and they think it's okay to say shit to you. Like by the way, I'm Lebanese and Irish. Like yeah, so like you're one of those sleeper cells because some Lebanese will have red hair. So it's like, yeah. That's that's my I call her my sister-in-law. My brother and her aren't married, but she's my sister-in-law, whatever. She actually looks light in that color. Yeah, she looks lighter, but definitely you could think that she's actually darker than that picture looks. But my um my sister-in-law is Palestinian. Her one nephew is at one of the sleeper cell redhead with hazel eyes, Middle Eastern. Hell yeah, that's my cousin. Yeah, yeah. All right. Um, that's funny though, but yeah, that's I've had shit said to me by other white people that I'm like, I had somebody the other day that was like asking me all these questions about doing stand-up, and he's like, Oh, do you just say the N-word on stage? And I'm like, no. Why the fuck would I? And he's like, Well, why can't you? They say it all the time, blah blah blah. And I was like, A, I don't fucking say that anyway. Like that's like such a fucked up thing.

SPEAKER_03 29:50

I only say that in traffic. What do you why would you why would I say that on stage?

SPEAKER_08 29:53

And I was like, I don't even say that during rap songs, dude. And he's he just was like, Well, well, why not? Blah blah blah. It's just so funny shit that people think and like shit that people say to you. Like where I've I've done a bunch of the like black room, like quote unquote black rooms where you're in like punchline or somewhere like yeah, and I've had like white people say shit to me, and we're literally in the fucking room, and I'm like, why the fuck are you here? Like, why do you come to the black room? Mind-boggling that people do this shit in comedy. That I'm like, what kind of sociopath are you? To like it's so frustrating. It's so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 30:31

We both know a comic that I would love to talk about off mic that there's a couple around that are like holy shit. It just I was told that I probably shouldn't even fucking say this on the podcast. Yeah, do it off mic. Don't say yeah. Well, okay, this isn't that bad. I was told that I would have to pay to play a black room, and I wouldn't be put up until the very end of the night because it's a black room and there's they they treat us differently. And then I went to that black room and they were the most loving and welcoming. It felt like I walked into my aunt's house. Like it was like the most loving people that I've ever like I didn't know any of the people at that black room. And I walk in and it's like, hey, thanks for coming. You want something to drink? Come hang out. Come on in. What song do you want to walk up to?

SPEAKER_08 31:20

What are you doing? What are you doing?

SPEAKER_03 31:22

Literally that welcoming. And yeah, and that guy had preloaded my mind to be defensive.

SPEAKER_06 31:27

Please come back.

SPEAKER_03 31:28

Like literally texting me. It's so fucking women. I sh the owner of that room. I should just say, Keisha. I called Keisha to confirm that she was doing the mic. Right. She called me on accident. Like called me back to call a different Matt. Yeah. And then she was like, oh, hey, while I got you, are you gonna come every Wednesday? You gotta come every Wednesday. Nice. And then we talked for like a half hour. I met her for what like five minutes at her mic. Yeah. The nicest woman on earth. Yeah. But I was getting preloaded with information that and I'm like, no, it's you.

SPEAKER_08 32:00

Not every like, not every white person. It's like you're a problem. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:05

Yeah, yeah. We're gonna charge this asshole to be here.

SPEAKER_08 32:07

That's no, that's crazy. We're not in New York where they charge you like five bucks to do mic. That's not how anything is. Right. That's so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 32:15

I I after listening to Rogan, I'm putting myself in a box, dude.

SPEAKER_08 32:21

You were trying to get yourself out of it by saying you look a certain way, but you aren't. Now you're listening to Rogan.

SPEAKER_03 32:26

I've listened to Rogan for like fucking 11 years. He's I tell you what, I don't accept the narrative that he's this scumbag. He's such an accountable good guy.

SPEAKER_05 32:37

But he was really good on Fear Factor. Really nice guy.

SPEAKER_03 32:40

He pushes back.

SPEAKER_08 32:41

I liked him on talk radio.

SPEAKER_03 32:44

Yeah, news radio back in the day. Yeah, news radio. He honestly, if you if you listen to his if you listen to his podcast and or hear about his reputation with the way he treats people that are in his life, he's a really good dude. Yeah. It's just he pushes back on these like on these talking points. Yeah, these crazy things and like And people don't like that. You can't talk back about the narrative. Don't don't push back on the narrative about COVID or this or that.

SPEAKER_08 33:07

Yeah, well, some of the ideas he gets in his head that he holds on to that I'm like, buddy, like fucking read a scientific journal. Like there's some weird shit for sure. But I will I will listen if it's like Joey Diaz fucking best, one of the best guests that ever does Rogan. Yeah. Um, I always do like when Duncan Trussell's on. Like there's a few people that I really do like to listen to that'll go on that I'm like, alright, or what was the other show he was doing with Ari and Normand and Oh, save the Protect Our Parks. Protect our parks. And I'll listen to that kind of shit with him. But I'm like, some of the shit that he just like digs his heels in on that I'm like, buddy, like, did you even graduate college? Like, you don't have a biology degree to be talking shit or like agreeing with a bunch of crazy things. Yeah, there's some there's some health stuff.

SPEAKER_03 33:53

I like RFK gets on there, and I'm like, well, first of all, RFK, I can't listen to him talk, but he says some insane shit.

SPEAKER_08 33:59

Sounds like he's like drinking gravel while he's talking. Your throat sounds like a garbage disposal.

SPEAKER_03 34:04

Were you the one that the fuck did you have the joke about RFK having the brain worm? Was that you?

SPEAKER_08 34:10

Maybe I don't have a bit bit, but I could have talked shit on it. Did if somebody sounded a full-on bit about it. Oh, okay. If somebody else said something and then I went up and was like fucking brain parasites, like I'll I'll go off on it, but I don't have a specific bit about it. Oh, I wish I I don't want to blow up somebody's. I'll probably if I if somebody else said something and then I went up and talked shit.

SPEAKER_03 34:30

No, I think it was no, they had a full-on bit about. I don't want to blow up anyone's premise.

SPEAKER_08 34:34

Yeah, because I'll if somebody says something and I'm like it was like a yeah, I don't want to fuck up the premise.

SPEAKER_03 34:39

God, I wish I remember who was.

SPEAKER_08 34:40

I don't want to see if it's an open mic. Like if you saw me at one night stand say something where it's like I riff off of somebody else and like nah, like this fucker.

SPEAKER_03 34:48

Yeah. No, it was a full-on like two or three minute bit about it. No, no, no, no, no. Yeah, God, I don't want to blow up the premise though. But it was a great premise. That's funny.

SPEAKER_08 34:57

Yeah, no, I'll talk shit on something, but I wouldn't and his brain worm.

SPEAKER_03 35:01

Apparently that's why his voice sounds the way it was, because he had a brain parasite. Oh I don't know. Whatever.

SPEAKER_08 35:07

He is a parasite.

SPEAKER_03 35:09

He just is one. No, dude, this is the thing, dude. I he did so much good work as a lawyer, and then he just got fucking weird.

SPEAKER_08 35:18

Dude, we're in a fucking like the timeline we're in right now feels like a we're living in an onion article. Is it thundering outside? They're rolling shit by.

SPEAKER_03 35:28

I hope they're rolling her body out.

SPEAKER_08 35:30

Jesus, Matt. I feel like we're fucking in an onion article, though. It's such a bizarre time to be alive.

SPEAKER_03 35:36

The onion is like the onion can't write anything that's stranger than fucking reality.

SPEAKER_09 35:41

Yeah, literally can't write something that's more than a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_03 35:43

The onion should put out headlines that say, like, RFK says something reasonable. Like that would be fucking hilarious, you know? RFK makes a good point that is based in actual science. That should be an onion fucking headline. RFK gives up eating roadkill. Like, what? RFK, the pinnacle of health, eats McDonald's burgers with fucking Trump, you know? Geniuses, drugs bottle of red dye number 40. Dude, watching RFK get into a fucking cold plunge with jeans on with Kid Rock was the most asinine shit I've ever seen in my life.

SPEAKER_08 36:16

Kid Rock, that's somebody else who's a fucking joke. Like he's a character of a human being. It's so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 36:22

I commented on that video of them and I was like, they definitely fucked after this, right? Yeah, that was real romance. I was like, all right, let me delete this.

SPEAKER_09 36:30

I don't want to deal with this pushback. Yeah, that's weird.

SPEAKER_03 36:33

Like that was the weirdest propaganda I've ever seen in my life. Like Kid Rock is the pinnacle of health. The guy from fucking Taylor that's probably been on Suboxan for 40 years.

SPEAKER_08 36:44

The guy that grew up in Romeo with like rich parents that was never in the ghetto, never poor. Is he from Romeo? I thought he was from fucking Taylor. No, no, no, no, no. He's from yeah, and then he lives in Clarkston now. Yeah, yeah. No, he has like a multi-million dollar home in Clarkston, and he's like never was poor.

SPEAKER_05 37:01

My friend was best friends with his kid. And like didn't know that his dad was Kid Rock. It was just Mr. Mr. Robbie. Mr. Richie. Yeah. Richie. She knew him as Mr. Richie and he would like pick her up from school. She had no idea. Yeah. And then like the kid ended up, he was like getting bullied or something because of who his dad was. And he ended up moving schools, and she was like really sad, like, oh, my friend's leaving. And she didn't realize it until like after he left that that was his dad.

SPEAKER_03 37:28

It's actually insane that he was getting bullied in Clarkston, where everyone is a conservative twat.

SPEAKER_08 37:34

Yeah. And money. Like most of the neighborhood around there is like good money.

SPEAKER_05 37:39

I don't know if it was like bullying or if people like I remember her saying that people would like walk up and try to take pictures with him and like get his autograph instead of when he picked her up from school or something. No, the kid. They're trying to take pictures of the kid. Just because his dad is.

SPEAKER_08 37:52

I thought you meant like he's picking them up from school. Good rock, let me take a fucking selfie. You know, no, he grew up in Romeo and his family owned like a fucking Cadillac dealership or some shit. Like that was never you check this out. Check out the Rich family. Like that was not him ever being poor, not him ever being fucking the same reaction because I opened up my phone and my ex was still up there.

SPEAKER_03 38:17

We both went. Oh, you had a visceral.

SPEAKER_08 38:20

You both literally had like a weird visceral reaction to it. I heard some of your shit on one of the other shows that I'm like, oh God, she's not a nice person.

SPEAKER_03 38:28

Oh my god. Oh well. That's a whole thing I don't want to hit you. Oh, you're good, dude. There we go. I I stopped doing those bits because that absolutely divides the room. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. William Harvey had a great point about it. He was like, hey, you're taking for granted that people, first of all, know that you're a good person. Yeah. And they want to support your fucked up ideas. Like, he's like, you're going up there, you're doing these horrible bits, and you're expecting the audience to be on your side. All they hear is that you're talking you're you're punching down on the mother of your children.

SPEAKER_08 38:57

You just sound like a scumbag. A person of color. Yeah. Yeah. That's always tricky. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:04

Fuck. What was I? Oh, uh Kid Rock. Kid Rock's family. Own a car dealership. Oh. And did he grow up wealthy? This episode brought to you by ChatGPT, which drives everyone nuts for some fucking reason. Yes. With some nuance. Kid Rock. Did Kid Rock's family own a car dealership and did he grow up wealthy? Yes, with some nuance. Kid Rock's background. Kid Rock grew up in Romeo, Michigan. His father, William Bill Ritchie, owned and operated multiple car dealerships, including a Lincoln Mercury franchise in the Detroit Metro area. Was he wealthy? He was not old money rich or celebrity level celebrity level wealthy, but he also was not poor or struggling. His dad owned and operated multiple dealerships.

SPEAKER_08 39:58

Yeah, give me a fucking break about what kind of money they had.

SPEAKER_03 40:01

He grew up in a fairly comfortable upper middle class suburban.

SPEAKER_08 40:04

Look up his childhood home. Give that a goo. Give that a chat GPT.

SPEAKER_03 40:09

Kid Rock Childhood Home.

SPEAKER_05 40:13

You can just find this shit.

SPEAKER_03 40:14

Mm-hmm. 6,500 square foot. Mm-hmm. 5,600 square foot colonial style estate on five and a half.

SPEAKER_08 40:23

If it's called a fucking estate, you didn't grow up poor asshole. Like what a fucking asshole. I just can't stay in Kid Rock.

SPEAKER_03 40:29

This is for my heroes in the Methadome Clinic. He's writing this from his fucking 3,000 square card.

SPEAKER_08 40:35

Yeah, your family had money to put you in a fucking methadone clinic, you piece of shit. Fuck off. That guy going from like, oh my gosh, when he was like in his rap bullshit era and he was all hired, and then he goes into like country bullshit. Yeah. Dude, I can't. I can't with pop country shit, dude. That fucking makes my skin crawl.

SPEAKER_03 40:57

Bo Burnham nailed it. Have you listened to Pandering? He came out with a song shitting on like the arena country. And it's perfect. He's just like he's just like he he nails it. He nails every like fill-in-the-blank fucking ad lib country song. He's like dirt road, pickup truck, a pretty girl, a starry night, a dirt beard. Yeah. I think he literally says that in that order.

SPEAKER_08 41:27

That shit.

SPEAKER_03 41:28

Yeah, he nails it. And the whole song, the choruses, I'm pandering. Like it's fucking perfect. It is a perfect synopsis of all of the like in the 90s we had the fucking boy bands that were all pandering, engineered bullshit.

SPEAKER_08 41:44

That's creepy shit. If you ever look into any of that, like the I can't think of the fucker's name, but the main guy that was like recruiting all those kids to be in the boy bands. And what a fucking creep. Like you if you look into that, that's a whole fucking other thing. He's just a creep that he's like getting these, they were kids, and he's getting these young dudes to be in these boy bands. And I'm like, man, this guy is a fucking piece of shit. Like that.

SPEAKER_03 42:12

I do remember watching like a short documentary about InSync and Backstreet Boys and 98 Degrees. Yeah. And I remember one of the guys who was in who was involved was like, This is so we're so clever. We're like, we got a flavor for every kind of girl. And I was like, that is the grossest thing. I don't remember who but I remember being specifically grossed out by that. Like, dude, you're talking about like you're little girls. Little girls.

SPEAKER_08 42:35

I'm 38, so I'm like the perfect age for that bullshit to like take effect. And that just thinking about people like, yeah, we're gonna get these little girls tingling down there. Like, what the fuck is wrong with you, dude? Like, so gross. Those dudes are so creepy.

SPEAKER_05 42:52

I've never watched that one about the boy bands. How old are you guys? 32.

SPEAKER_08 42:57

Yeah. So you're a little young for like you're still in that timeline of like, but you were a boy too, but I was like I that could be, yeah, that might be. Is that I'm 29, but I was obsessed with Justin Timberlake. Yeah, it's funny. Well, you had him solo. That was your first concern. I I You got the tail ended in sync then. They were my first concert guy when I was seven. That was my first concert. Yeah, that's wild. My first one, I saw the Backstreet Boys at St. Andrew's Hall and Destiny's Child opened for them. Wow. That's St. Andrew's Hall. Literally St. Andrew's Hall. Like, isn't that fucking crazy? Like, I saw Beyonce before she was Beyonce. Like, that's fucking crazy to think about. But I'm like, my uncle was a weirdo. Like, now that I think back on it, that like this isn't an actual like blood uncle. It's like my family friend that would be like, I'll take the girls to concerts and stuff. And I'm like, now it seems unwholesome. But but we did, we saw fucking Backstreet Boys. I saw Chris. Dina Aguilera with him and like Britney Spears with him. And I'm like thinking back on it that I'm like, why is this like 30-something year old dude wanting to go to these like little girl shows? Not great. Okay, so Lou Perlman.

SPEAKER_03 44:13

I I that's probably that sounds like once I looked up his so uh Lou Perlman had a long list of controversies way beyond just shady contracts. Here are the big ones. Financial scams. He's screwing all those people over. The he ran one of the largest Ponzi schemes in U.S. history, created fake companies and sold bogus investments, stole over 300 million from investors, got caught in the mid-2000s, was sentenced to 25 years in prison, exploiting boy bands, groups like Backstreet Boys and InSync and Q accused him of paying them shockingly little, despite massive success, structuring contract contracts, so he took huge percentages as both manager and band member, misleading them about how much money the groups were actually making. This led to lawsuits from multiple artists. He claimed business assets that didn't exist, faked financial statements to appear extremely wealthy and legitimate, and used success of his bands to lure in more investors. The legal outcome, he pleaded guilty in 2008, ordered to repay hundreds of millions of dollars, which most of was never recovered, and he died in prison in 2016. He wasn't just a shady manager, he was basically built the band boy band Empire of the 90s while simultaneously running a massive financial con.

SPEAKER_02 45:32

Crazy.

SPEAKER_08 45:33

Wow. Yeah, the uh Harvey Weinstein of him. He was fucking creepy.

SPEAKER_03 45:39

Yeah, he's like the yeah, yeah, yeah. He's the Harvey Weinstein of the fucking music.

SPEAKER_09 45:43

Yeah, it's wild to think about.

SPEAKER_03 45:44

Well, I guess Harvey Weinstein was like mostly sexual. I don't think he like I don't think I don't know if he ripped off anyone financially. But he definitely exploited women.

SPEAKER_08 45:53

But um yeah, I what a fucking crazy uh thing to get into, though, that they had that time in the 90s of all the boy bands, and then you had like Spice Girls and shit going on, and then you had Britney Spears and like Christina Aguilera and all these people that that they're just fucked up. Like Brittany Spears is so as a person Is Christina Aguilera normal? I think she had trouble, but she's good, like she's okay. She's alright now? Yeah, I think she had a lot of shit going on though for a while.

SPEAKER_03 46:27

As a guy who's gotten, you know, I'm in my 30s. Is that on? I see a red light. Okay, all right, cool. I normally turn the lens out. I was like, oh shit. Flip your little flippy out. Yeah. That one's out. That one's out. That's how I can see that's right. It's on the red light's on. Right on. Okay, that scared me for a second. Uh all right, start over. Fuck people rolling shit around.

SPEAKER_07 46:48

Damn it.

SPEAKER_03 46:50

Don't get him started. As a guy I think they're doing it on purpose now. For real. I'll be like, this is my star. Uh as a guy in his 30s, though. Yes. Who I like I have a 13-year-old son. Yes. 12-year-old son, almost 13. And looking back. Okay, this is a weird idea that I've been like flirting with. I'm I might want to do a bit about it, but like when you're growing up and something is in the media, you think that's just like how the world has always been. It's like, oh, Britney Spears is a star. I'm eight years old. Britney Spears is a star right now. It feels like she's always been a star. But now that I'm in my 30s and have a kid who's coming up on his teenage years, I'm like, this is the weirdest shit ever. Like to get a 15-year-old girl and make her a fucking superstar and make her hypersexual, put her in pigtails and a fucking halter top and a short skirt and her little skirt, and like have her like blast her legs open while she's on stage and like wearing leotards and stuff, and like it's the weirdest shit in the world to me. Like, who is your target audience?

SPEAKER_08 47:58

Because I don't think it's why were her parents okay with that shit that, like, oh, they're gonna make a ton of money off of it, and now their kids fucking mental and she had to sue, like her dad was controlling everything for her, and she had to sue him.

SPEAKER_03 48:11

Like, well, she went, I mean, she's crazy. I think she's got some real mental health issues. I mean, like, if you see any of the videos of her fucking around at her house after she had dives, yeah, after she got removed, like she got dives in that taken off of the conservative ship or whatever, conservador ship. Yeah, uh yeah, it's like maybe she should have been under one because she's she seems fucked up, man. I don't know. Yeah, she ain't she's not uh doing great. It's I I think handing I think handling fame for anyone. If you got famous at 50, I think it'd be hard.

SPEAKER_08 48:42

Like stars, any of the actors, like Amanda Bynes, yeah, her is so fucking sad. Hers is so all those fucking kids that were involved with Nickelodeon and dad, all those people with Nickelodeon are fucking crazy, like oh my gosh, and I think about those like 80s movies kids that were famous. It's like uh what the fuck, Corey? Like Cory Hayne and Corey Feldman, and like Corey Feldman is fuck, dude.

SPEAKER_03 49:10

What the fuck? Yeah, by the way, crazy, crazy. We need to bring back bullying specifically for Corey Feldman. Him going on a fucking music tour and just bullshitting on the guitar pretending to be soloing is the most infuriating thing on earth to me.

SPEAKER_08 49:26

It's so it suits his his outfits. Oh my gosh. Do you ever listen to the bonfire and the bonfire talking about him?

SPEAKER_03 49:33

No.

SPEAKER_08 49:34

Oh my gosh, it's Big J Ogerson and Robert Kelly's show, and uh it's on Sirius, but holy shit, the stuff. And they'll go see him, they'll like go live and like oh my god.

SPEAKER_03 49:46

It's such a I love Big J Ogerson.

SPEAKER_08 49:50

He's coming. You need to go see him Ridley's buy tickets right away because he's gonna be at Ridley's August 20th and 21st or something. You need to grab those. Yeah, because that's gonna sell out quick. Yeah, I feel like he's the fucking sweetheart. I love him. He's awesome. I I wouldn't describe him as a sweetheart when he's on stage. He doesn't sound nice, but he really in person he is, because I've met him a bunch of times and he's he's great. He is really sweet.

SPEAKER_03 50:17

Paige used to have this bit that she thought stand-up comedy is just the cringe. I heard he talk about this, but especially.

SPEAKER_08 50:25

She calls it a bit, but it wasn't a bit. I heard he talked about this because I wasn't a bit a couple episodes, but that's yeah, that it like it like circled back to being a bit, but it's not where you just really genuinely felt like I genuinely hated comedy.

SPEAKER_05 50:37

I did I couldn't, it was so cringy to me.

SPEAKER_08 50:39

I think if you like are newer to comedy and then you only see like TikToks and shit, and you're like, why the fuck is this person just like everything's crowd work? But they're only posting shit that went well. They're not posting crowd work that went horrifically sideways.

SPEAKER_05 50:54

No, it was just I didn't I I hated the fact that people were on stage trying to get to the city. Trying to make people laugh.

SPEAKER_08 51:00

Yeah, it's not for everybody. I mean, it's definitely not a thing for everybody, and then it's like I don't know, it's such a funny, and not everybody's good at it like this. I like it now, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:13

Yeah, now that well that's I think Big J is like the first real famous comedian that you started watching, and you were like, this is like you were actually a comedian. He's so good. Yeah, yeah. He's so good. I tried to show her I was washing the dishes and I was listening to um Shane Gillis's Netflix special, and I was crying, laughing just because he like it was before all the memes about the grilled cheese shit. Like I went into it raw. Like I didn't know what was happening. And my god, I was crying. I was like, I gotta pause. She's like, what are you laughing about? And I'm like, dude, okay, I'll like I'll save this for later. So okay. So I finished doing what I'm doing, and then I'm like, all right, let's sit down and watch this. And immediately he starts making like retard jokes and page works in special ed. So she's just like that's tricky.

SPEAKER_08 51:56

That's like all the time I've been doing stand-up, I've only said retard on stage like twice, and I I don't like it. I use it, and it's like I kind of wish I didn't say it. But there's been a couple situations where I call somebody out in the crowd and I'm like, these fucking people, like but I get it, I get the like working in special ed, and then you have somebody, but he also like he has somebody in his family that is that he's like worked for the Special Olympics and shit. Like it's not him being an asshole, because there are some people that are fucking like gross about it.

SPEAKER_03 52:33

It's him, it's him pointing out that people who are like overly empathetic about it are f are are phony, weird, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 52:43

Like woke white women shit where they're gonna be mad about someone saying it, and it's like, all right, well, unless someone's truly being a fucking piece of shit about it, it's not it's I have such a difficult time because I like I did my minor in French, so like en retard is like you're saying retard, but it's meaning like late, like it's not fucking insulting, but it's such a tricky area that you're in.

SPEAKER_03 53:07

Yeah, you know, it's complicated to to navigate that successfully.

SPEAKER_08 53:11

Shane has this bit that he goes into this whole thing. I don't know if you guys have ever heard this, but he's like, I look like the number one sleeper agent at the Special Olympics. Have you ever heard that? Oh my you need to listen to that because he's he's literally talking about working the Special Olympics because it's like his, I think it's his cousin, it might be a nephew or something, but it's it's somebody related to him, and he did work the Special Olympics. He's like, There's all the Hooters waitresses are coming up and hugging me too. I think it's so fucking funny.

SPEAKER_03 53:38

So good. But then he also goes on to say, like uh in that in that special, he goes on to say, like, you know, oh, people that are haven't been around anyone that has Down syndrome, yeah. They find out that you have a relative with Down syndrome, and he's and you get this fake empathy, like, oh are they how are they? Are they okay? And he's like, they're way better than anyone else I know. What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_08 53:59

Where he's like, they're literally the fucking happiest people, like they have they're fucking crushing it at life because they don't worry about stupid shit and they're happy all the time. And I'm like, I love that he addresses that because it's so true. Where it's like they're fucking thrilled about everything. Like that's I wish my brain worked like that.

SPEAKER_03 54:16

They're not on fucking like Prozac and just like barely getting through that day without a power.

SPEAKER_08 54:20

How much I like hurt my own feelings with my stupid thoughts that I'm like, fuck, dude.

SPEAKER_03 54:24

Like for real, dude. I I have anxiety issues. Oh, I'm the worst.

SPEAKER_08 54:28

I've I've made jokes of weird shit that I'm like, this isn't even real. Or I'll have like nightmare, like night terrors that I'm like, why, why, brain? Like, why do you do this? But yeah, he's so funny. And then he um there was something else I was gonna say about him, and I can't think of what it was, but he's just so sweet. And and oh, this is what I was thinking about that like people have to appreciate the time you were raised and the way you spoke when you were a kid and a teenager and coming of age. Like when we were coming of age, that shit was okay. Yeah, and it's really, really, really hard for a lot of people to like drop that where it's like, all right, so fucking Itel is my favorite comic ever, and my favorite comedy special of all time, Skanks for the Memories. And think of how much of that shit would not fly, dude.

SPEAKER_03 55:15

Raw. Eddie Murphy Raw. Oh, fucking. You can't even play that to a Gen Z kid.

SPEAKER_08 55:20

He'd pass out. Think of like Richard Pryor, where like this N-word's crazy, like that literally wouldn't even be on uh you couldn't even get it on Spotify. Like you there's like stuff that people do that I'm like, you have to think of the time that like yeah, there's certain I don't know, whatever. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 55:36

Richard Jenny and and and Robert Schwab. Richard Jenny is crazy, yeah. Yeah, I mean my god, and then some of like Louis CK's shit.

SPEAKER_08 55:43

Like some of his shit, and he's another one that got cancelled for like I fucking love Louis CK. Like he's I'll fight for him. I don't agree with what he was doing, but like that's a bunch of adults that were hanging out. Like it's a weird space to be in. But I went to see him the last time he was in town and he's just fucking crushed it. And Norton opened for him. No shit. And I'm like, man, like Norton's another person that would just be like outright canceled, but it's like his wife is a trans woman. Like, you can't fucking cancel somebody when they're actually like in that life. But yeah, that so good.

SPEAKER_03 56:17

He was can't believe Norton. I can't believe Norton got married. That's that's the most mind-boarding thing about it. I know it's not even so funny. It's not even surprised that he married a transgendered woman.

SPEAKER_08 56:28

It's just surprising that he's like, have you ever listened to his podcast where it's like Jim Norton Can't Help You? I think is the name of it.

SPEAKER_03 56:34

I didn't know he was doing a podcast.

SPEAKER_08 56:35

Oh man, he does it like in his apartment and like his little dogs around, and you like hear his wife talking and shit, and it's fucking so funny. He'll have it's a call-in show and he'll have other comics on, and it'll be like a tell or like Joe List or Mark Norman or somebody like that that's in New York, and it's so fucking funny. But I love Jim Norton. Norton's so good.

SPEAKER_03 56:57

He has this new bit where he's like, he's like, My wife's obsessed with Chat GPT.

SPEAKER_08 57:03

And he's like he did that when we went to see him. Oh no shit. He did those bits right up. He talks about like uh she talks to it when it's like she's like cooking dinner and it's talking to her. It's like, oh, you're doing a great job. Like, just add a little more, add another dash of salt.

SPEAKER_03 57:19

I was thinking about adding spinach, and it's like, wow, you're really you're really an amazing, you're taking this to the next level. And he's like, Oh my god. He said something like you know, whatever, like it was great. I love that I don't have to have these fucking conversations anymore. She can talk to us.

SPEAKER_08 57:34

She can talk to this fucking robot. I know he's so funny. Oh my god. He we saw him, we were in New York in August, so we got to see him at the cellar where he's kind of working that out, and then I think Louis was like the end of September. So just seeing him in like a month and a half of like where he has it like flushed out, and he does like a whole like 25 minutes of like talking shit on that. That I'm like so fucking fun to see that progression.

SPEAKER_03 58:00

Yeah, but dude, I love Louis CK.

SPEAKER_08 58:05

He's probably did you get to go to that Louis at the Fox like last year?

SPEAKER_03 58:09

Oh man, I have never seen Louis and I want to. I fucking love it.

SPEAKER_08 58:12

I've seen him twice, and he's just he's a murderer. He's fucking crazy. He had this one bit that I literally was like in tears, and it's just my brain's so fucking weird of shit that makes me laugh really hard. But he's like talking about being in New York when New York was harder, and he's like, Oh, you know, you'd walk around and be like, Oh, I saw this dead bee on the ground. And it's like, how did it beat? Like, I'm seeing a dead bee. And it's like, oh, somebody shot a bee. And I'm like, this fucking made me lose my shit. That I'm just like, it's such a goofy, it goes it's a really, really, really long bit, but that's like that's how it wraps up. I'm like, oh my fucking god. Like my brain just likes weird shit like that. And I'm like, man, Louie, yeah, Louie's crazy. His shows have all been awesome.

SPEAKER_03 58:57

Like I didn't like Lucky Louie, but Louis on FX was a movie.

SPEAKER_08 59:01

Louie was yeah, Louis's really great. And then what's the broad that was on that? The dark haired broad? Because she's Bobby Hill's voice. What's oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 59:09

What's her name? Oh god.

SPEAKER_08 59:10

I like her a lot.

SPEAKER_03 59:11

She has one of the funniest episodes of Louis. She's so good. Do you remember the episode when they go to the museum?

SPEAKER_08 59:18

I have to think about it. I haven't watched it since it was like on. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 59:22

So they go to this, they go to this museum and they walk up and there's like a stand there, and it says press, and it's a button, and he goes to and she's like, What are you doing? Don't. And he and he's like, It says to, yeah. It says to. And she's like, Don't. And he pushes it and it says the N-word, and it sounds like him. And everyone that's on the other side of the room turns around, like, what the fuck? And he's like, Oh no, no, no. It was it was the button, and he starts pushing the button again, and it's like fire truck book or whatever. Like it's like it doesn't say it again, and he's like, Oh my god.

SPEAKER_08 59:54

He's so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 59:55

Dude, it's the fucking oh my god, I love that show.

SPEAKER_08 59:58

His writing and and thinking of shit where it's like, oh, he fucking wrote pootie tang and like just crazy shit that he's done in his life and some of the shows.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:07

Ingram Ingram did you read his book, Ingram? It made me sob like a baby. Yeah, it is one of the most excellent the one of the best written books I've ever read in my life. I I don't read fiction at all. I just like I I have a I have a weird mental block about reading fiction. I have a hard time with it. I'm just like, this is fucking this isn't there's so much reality, I don't need to read bullshit. True, true. And uh but I'm but I'm a fan of TV so and movies, so it doesn't make sense. Uh but that is one of the few fiction books that I've read, and my god, that book made me sob like a baby. It's one of the best books I've ever read. It's it the writing is excellent. I recommended it to her book club, and her whole friend group was like, I'm not reading a Louis C.K.

SPEAKER_08 1:00:54

They gotta like read more into what happened, where it's like, all right, these are all fucking adults. Like I didn't even know there was anything weird that happened with them. So and then they said it and they were all like nah. But it's a bunch of adults, and it's not like they were like chained to a fucking wall. Like it's gross. I wouldn't want to be a part of it, but also like they agreed to it. There's a bunch of motherfuckers like Seinfeld, like everybody fucking loves Seinfeld and never condemned 38 years old and fucking a 17-year-old, and it's like, why was that okay?

SPEAKER_03 1:01:26

Well, because he's nice and cute.

SPEAKER_08 1:01:35

Clean of the cat. Like, yeah. I don't know. I don't trust clean the one clean motherfucker that I don't think is ever gonna come out as a creep is like Nate Nate Bergazi. He seems like he's actually a good dude.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:48

Yeah, he's a sweet guy, but I wouldn't be surprised if Jim Gaffigan fucking held someone down and just I don't think no.

SPEAKER_08 1:01:55

I don't know. He's no, I know, but he's he is clean, but he's another one that I don't I think he is genuinely a good guy. But yeah, it's scary to think about shit like that, and it's like, oh, like Seinfeld's in the Epstein Files, and like Seinfeld went out of his way because um you know Bobcat Goldthwaite, like Bobcat, when that first was happening when he's like with this 17-year-old, Bobcat called it out multiple times, and then Seinfeld goes and he's like, If if you book him at your club, I'm never gonna work there, and if this film studio uses him, I'm never gonna work with this film studio. What a fucking douchebag. Goes out of his way to fucking blackball him, all right, for his whole career, all right. And even to the point of like, we did end up watching most uh comedians and cars getting coffee because I wanted to watch the other comics on it. But there's an episode where he's on with Bridget Everett, and Bridget is fucking go see her. She I feel like she was just here a few weeks ago.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:55

She's so fucking funny.

SPEAKER_08 1:02:57

She we went to see her and she like literally grabbed a dude out of the audience and sat on his face. Like she's fucking crazy. But she was really good friends with Bobcat, and there's the episode with her, and Seinfeld to this day, which is like fucking 30 years later, is like goes off about Bobcat to her, which is like this is one of her best friends. You're gonna talk shit on your show and not cut it. Like he put it in the episode.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:24

Did she defend him?

SPEAKER_08 1:03:25

She did in like a very tactful way that it's like, like, buddy, you're the fucking one that's wrong. Like you're 38, you're old enough to drink when this broad was born, and then you're fucking her. Like, that's crazy. And it was legal in it was legal in New York at the time. It was legal. She was the age of consent, so it was okay. And her family was okay with it.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:43

So it just tells me that he was grooming a child until she was the age of consent.

SPEAKER_08 1:03:47

Yeah, like you guys met before she was 17, and then you're like you let it out, like it's you're around in public with her when she's 17.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:56

38 years old dating a 17-year-old. We were literally just looking this up yesterday. Yesterday. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:04:02

Yeah. Yeah. If you have time and you want to fucking like maybe blow your brains out, you can look up the fucking Epstein file shit that mentions him, and it's like, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:12

Like Bobcat Goldthwaite is one of the most underrated, underutilized talents. And a dire as a director, amazing.

SPEAKER_08 1:04:20

Brilliant. He was and when he did like World's Greatest Dad and all those, and then uh, what the fuck was the one where he's like the Bigfoot movie? No, yeah, this one where he was like with his it's like a character that is his daughter, and they're going around like shooting people, which sounds crazy. What the fuck was that called? It was so good. Um I'll never think of the name. We'd have to look it up later, but it's great. He he did that, and that was probably man, that might be 15 years old now, but he was best friends with Robin Williams. So we saw him live once not long after Robin Williams passed away, and he does this impersonation of Robin that's just fucking uh it's like Robin Williams playing video games, yelling at children on a video game.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:06

God bless America is the movie. That's the one.

SPEAKER_08 1:05:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Great film, great film. World's greatest dad. That uh did he do World's Greatest Dad? Um and that, like I love there's another there's another one that he did that I love that what was the one you mentioned? Bigfoot? The what was the book? The Bigfoot one. Was it like a fake documentary?

SPEAKER_03 1:05:26

It was like a mockumentary, if I remember right.

SPEAKER_08 1:05:28

I don't think I've ever watched that. But I've met him a couple times and he's absolutely the sweetest. Like he turned out. Way of Creek. Huh. I don't I've never seen that. It's a found footage style horror movie. Oh, funny. I've never watched that. I'll have to check that out. Dude. He's a trip though. He's so like he dropped the voice. So if you go see him now, he doesn't do like anymore. Um super fucking nice. Like, we went to see him. It was him and Dana Gould, another person. Super underrated that I fucking love Dana Gould. Dana Gould's podcast is Incredible. And his his Halloween episodes, especially, are excellent. He does so much work for it. Uh but long story boring, we had this bit with our roommate that it was like a million years ago that Bobcat's on Space Goes Coast to Coast. Did you ever watch that on Cartoon Network? Yeah. So Bobcat's on, and he has this thing where he says, like, whoa, crack a window, will ya? And it was some weird thing that ended up developing between us and our roommate. And our roommate was moving down to Texas, and I went through all his boxes of shit and wrote these like crack a window on paper, and they're hidden throughout all of his shit, like in picture frames, in fucking like cups and bottles and all like anything that I could possibly like hide shit. It'd be like on the flap of a box that he'd like open and be like, what the fuck? So we go see Bobcat live and I tell Bobcat about this, and I'm like, Can you just do like I know this is really annoying a lot of times, but he's like, No, that's hilarious. And he's I was like, Can you just film a clip? Like, can you tell Dan, like Dan, crack a window, will you? And he's like, Yes, does it, and I send it to my friend, and he's like, That's one of the nicest things anybody's ever done for me. I love that. I'm like, dude, Bobcat is like so fucking sweet. And he has a residency. If you ever go to Chicago, um, it was like every Wednesday at the Lincoln Lodge in Chicago. He lives like 45 minutes outside of the city, and he's just like living the married life and like has a farm and shit, but he comes into the city, like work on an hour every Wednesday. Yeah, and he's just a nice dude, he's cool, but somebody's like shitting their pants out there. I think they blew their nose.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:39

It's funny.

SPEAKER_08 1:07:41

I love sound effects.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:42

I actually thought that was my me because I pulled on the mic right when that happened.

SPEAKER_08 1:07:46

No, it wasn't you, it was somebody like blowing their nose. I have that kind of beak. That's how my nose sounds when I blow it. Hell yeah. Let's crack another beer. You want another one? What are we doing? Let's crack it's beer time. I interrupted you like way long ago. What were we talking about? Um, Cory, Feldman, and that. So Bonfire and Big J.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:06

Bud Light, Bush, um, twisted teas, long drink.

SPEAKER_08 1:08:12

Well, have you ever watched Shane's uh oh, what were those shows called? Can I do I'll do a BL, why not? BL, thank you. Um can I get one? Shane had these uh Philly Court. Break something? No, it's just a rack of glass. Glass on glass. Glass on glass. Oh thank you. Appreciate y'all. Um Shane had these things. I'm derailing myself, but it made me think of it with the twisted tea that they were called Philly Court. Have you ever watched these? No, dude. It's you gotta check these out. Yeah, they're a bunch of skits that they did, and they do Philly Court, and there's one like that's a big thing, I guess, is twisted tea down there. And uh you'll have to check them out. I don't want to spoil anything because they're so fucking funny. But this is like pre-tire, pre-anything that you think about them being in, and that's like before he was signed to SNL. You have to find them. They're so fucking good, but that's a huge thing in them that they talk about twisted tea a lot. So that's what made me think of it. But go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:14

I was gonna say the the one thing I love turning people on to that nobody knows about is fucking pet court with Gary Busey. Have you watched this?

SPEAKER_06 1:09:23

Uh it rings a bell.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:25

It's the most irreverent nonsense on earth, but it's the funny, like as a comedian.

SPEAKER_08 1:09:31

Are they like literally like interviewing animals on the stand and stuff? I feel like it's pet owners where there's like some kind of conflict about their pets.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:39

Alright, all right. And Gary Bucer, Gary Busey is the judge.

SPEAKER_08 1:09:43

I feel like I've seen this because like any weird animal shit, because I've been in vetmed forever, that like people send me a lot of weird animal clips and stuff. So I feel like I know what you're talking about, but I can't pick out a specific pet court.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:57

Pet court is it's the most irreverent malarkey on earth. I love that. I gotta write myself a note about pet court. Dude, he's such a fucking you gotta check out Philly Court.

SPEAKER_08 1:10:07

Philly Court.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:08

Dude, I I do love Shane Gillis, man.

SPEAKER_08 1:10:10

Oh, he's a fucking who, and I think he's genuinely like the sweetest. Like, he puts up everybody, like he did all those Madison Square Garden shows just a couple months ago, and he's like, he gets a tell, he gets Mark Norman, he gets Joe List, and like he gets a bunch of people coming out to his stuff, and that's like I'm not huge on Bert, but Bert Kreitcher is really good about that, like using his platform to like support his friends.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:34

Yeah, he seems like a good dude, even though he's like yeah, okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:10:38

I think he's like a legit, nice guy and like really looks out for comics that he loves, which is cool.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:44

Yeah. Um I think all those guys get flacked because of you know, they want to call it like the manosphere that Rogan has created, but it's not really like they're not like the manosphere.

SPEAKER_08 1:10:55

It's weird because it's people who like if you're really into comedy and you love comedy, you knew Joey Diaz before he was on Rogan. Right. You knew, you know, like there's a bunch of people that you probably knew before they were ever involved with Rogan, and before Rogan was like his Joe Rogan experience was a thing, so it's not like I hate when certain people get roped into that because it's like this comic is great before they ever talked to Rogan. They were great, like, yeah. I don't put them in that. I'm like, well, if you fucking got asked to go on Rogan, would you go on Rogan? Fuck yeah. Somebody asked me that, and I was like, Are you fucking stupid? Like, yeah, I would do that.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:35

Fuck yeah, dude.

SPEAKER_08 1:11:36

Like, I would go talk to him and talk shit to him. Like, I'm like, are you crazy? But it's so funny to think of like I don't know, that's anybody who acts like they wouldn't do it if they got the opportunity. That's like Kill Tony haters, where I'm like, yeah, whatever, kill Tony. Like, it's changed so much, and Tony's using his platform for uh evil instead of good, unfortunately. But he also has made some people who really deserve it get their time, which is cool, like, especially like our friends in Michigan, like a few of my friends who've been on it in the last handful of months. That I'm like, these are people who fucking worked hard as shit and were out every fucking night and doing multiple mics a night. That I'm like, okay, they got the chance.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:18

And people really hate on it, and I'm like, yeah, it sucks because you'll have some idiot go up and they they don't deserve to be there, but that's the way the cookie crumbles, and sometimes that's funny, but but but to give Tony credit, he shits on them hard when that happens. Yeah, when it's somebody that like took a fucking spot as a bet. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, oh, you thought that this was just a joke. No, there's people who are like hoping that their dream will happen tonight and you just wasted a fucking space.

SPEAKER_08 1:12:46

You wasted somebody's time. Like we went, we did go to one of the nights at Madison Square Garden because we were there that week. And if you go sign up, you get in for free. So if you go in like the middle of August when he does it every year, we've done this two years in a row, and I'm like, if you go sign up, you get into the whole show for free. I'm like, hell yeah, I'm gonna do that. And if I get pulled, whatever, like my fiance signed up. He's like, I gotta figure out a minute. And I'm like, the likelihood is like it's probably about 250, 300 people are in the line. So I mean, it really is like the odds are pretty good. But the one dude that got pulled was like he'd been pulled two times before in Austin, and he just goes up and he's like talking shit about his ex and he has a restraining order and he can't see his kids and all this shit. And Tony fucking like eviscerated this dude. Like, why the fuck are you wasting anyone else's time? We're like, this is literally Madison Square Garden, and this is gonna be on Netflix, and I have to cut this whole shit because there's probably some legal shit that you aren't supposed to be saying this. Right. And I was like, At least he'll talk shit to people that are stupid. Or like he had this one broad I remember a while ago, it was a white girl that came up, and she just out of the gate just rips like three N words, and I was like, What the fuck is that? Like your nervous word that you say, girl? And like they just throttle this broad, and I'm like, all right, good. Like they do talk shit on people that are just wasting everyone's time, but yeah, it is a funny. I don't know, there's a handful of comics that get big on it that I'm like, it's frustrating.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:15

There's a couple that I don't that there's a couple of regulars that I'm like, why? Why are they regulars?

SPEAKER_08 1:14:20

Yeah, I ended up getting pulled. We were at Legion of Skanks in in New York. Have you ever listened to that? It's Big J and Dave Smith and Louis J. Gomez, and they did a fake kill Tony because Tony was gonna be on it, and one of the interns that we're like made friends with from going to New York so much, he's like, Don't say anything to anybody because this is like you know, behind the curtain, whatever. But do you want to be in the bucket pole tonight? And I was like, fuck like shit, went in Rome, why not? Yeah, and they do one of their interns got pulled, and then it's me and the guests, all right. So the other guests, it's Tony Henchcliffe, Sal Volcano, Dave Vattel, holy shit, and Joe DeRosa, and then the three regular dudes.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:05

I'd throw up, dude.

SPEAKER_08 1:15:06

I wanted to fucking like jump out of wind, like I was insane.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:15:11

So we're they did it late. Usually they record that at eight o'clock on a Monday at the stand. Tony couldn't be there till ten, so they do a showcase. So we go see the showcase. I'm like nine beers deep by the time this is happening, and they have all the dudes are smoking. I never smoke. I can't. I'm allergic to it or something. I fucking freak out on it. Usually non-verbal. So I'm sitting in like the Snoop Dogg section because we get moved, we're sitting up front. I get pushed over to like the Snoop Dogg section where like all the dudes that work for the show are sitting there just ripping blunts. Everyone on the fucking panel is like ripping blunts. So I'm high as I don't need like higher than giraffe pussy, like whatever you want to call it. But I'm high out of my mind, nine beers deep. And Attel, like 40 minutes into the episode, a tele walks in. And I say to Nick, my fiance, like, Nick, I'm getting pulled out of the bucket. And he's like, Why? I'm like, Attel just got here. I'm fucking getting pulled out of that bucket. I just know it. And I'm like, have your phone ready. I know it's gonna happen. And he's like, no way, whatever. Like, there's a bunch of other people, no way. Sure as shit. Second person to go up, and I'm like, I'm out of my fucking tree. Like, I couldn't believe I could even talk. And then the funniest part, so you I've talked to you about doing the classes at Ridley's. Yeah, and the advanced comedy teacher is Joel Fragomeni. Have you met Joel before?

SPEAKER_03 1:16:35

I've not met Joel, no.

SPEAKER_08 1:16:36

Joel, you will end up learning this, but I'll just spoil it for you now that Joel does the gathering of the juggalos every year. Yes. And he is a character called Upchuck the Clown, and he goes up before the comics. So Lewis and Big J had just gotten back from the gathering, and the first 40 minutes of the episode is them talking shit about Joel and like show a picture of Joel as Upchuck the Clown and all this shit. So when I get off and I'm about to do my interview, I'm like, I have to fucking just preface with Upchuck the Clown was my advanced comedy teacher. And I don't want to spoil any of it because it's just so fucking crazy that I can send you guys the episode that it was, but I like literally Sal Vocano. I say this out loud that I'm like, Upchuck the Clowns was my advanced comedy teacher, and Sal Vocano looks and just fucking loses it and puts his head down and he couldn't even talk like the rest of the time. He's like, What the fuck?

SPEAKER_03 1:17:36

I think he loves Sal Volcano too.

SPEAKER_08 1:17:38

He's such a sweet, sweet dude, and he's another dude that's like super, super famous for like a legit, nice, never lost break. He came from I'm friends out of all the record shit that I did. I was during the pandemic, I was selling records, like actual vinyl, and I met all these people all over the whole country. So like his childhood best friend is somebody that I actually like know and have podcasted with, and I know all these crazy fucking stories about Sal and him as kids. They worked at the same deli and whatever. And uh Sal was on Story Wars. Do you ever watch that? Sal had this story on Story Wars, and that's like Lewis's and Big J's new show that it's like uh a bunch of comics come on, they all have a story that gets pulled randomly, and you have to guess whose story it is, and you get points, whatever. So it is a game show. Sal had this story about someone showing up at his work dressed as the crow, and it's like raining and it's the middle of the night, and he's like closing the deli by himself. And I'm like, I know this is fucking Donato. And then at the end of it, when they like reveal whose story it is, and Sal has to explain the story, and he's like, My friend Donato. And I'm like, I know this fucking guy. Ooh, sorry. I'm like, I know this guy. And I'm like, oh my god, it's just so funny that I called it before he even talked about it. Yeah, but it oh my gosh, yeah, he's such a nice dude. But you guys can watch this episode, it is oh, it is bad. I'm fucking I like I said, I never ever smoke, and usually I'm non-verbal, so I'm like, hi, as a kite talking and I just like talking, and I get heckled where they literally explain like a minute uninterrupted. I get heckled. They're trying to move me back into the light because like the stage is tiny and they have a projector going during during Legion of Skanks because they're like projected on the thing what they're filming. Oh my god, it is a fucking crazy, crazy thing that I'm like, I don't know if I'll ever be that nervous doing comedy again. So I kind of have like a weird superpower of like go up in front of Atel who's my hero, and then Sal and Big J. And Big J. Right, and like Louis J.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:43

Dude Gomez. That's like a that's like an alternative fucking Mount Rushmore.

SPEAKER_08 1:19:48

Oh my god, yeah. I always ask people that like what's your Mount Rushmore a comedy? And I'm like, man, that's like tricky, tricky to name names, but that's crazy that some of the most famous and most like well-respected comics that I've like, I'm gonna fucking freak you what if you watch it. I literally stand up and I'm like freaking out. So who okay?

SPEAKER_03 1:20:12

So who I'm gonna steal your question. Who who are your Mount Rushmore?

SPEAKER_08 1:20:17

Um, my Mount Rushmore of comedy. I like I said, Attel is forever my favorite forever. Annie's literally the sweetest, and I'll tell you a story about that in a minute that he's like legit the fucking nicest person. Um I love Norm McDonald.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:20:35

Um Stanhope. I love Stanhope. Stanhope, like it's uh Dave Attel's favorite comic is Stanhope. Yeah. Stanhope's fucking brilliant. He's a lunatic, he's like absolutely watching him do comedy, and I've gotten to see him a handful of times, and it's just like watching one of the masters work, and you see him where like an idea comes into his head, and he can just do it. Yeah, he just lets it out, and it's like, shit, you're so good. It's so crazy. Um Eddie Peppitone, another underrated, absolutely fucking adore him. He's a nice, nice dude. And I have a couple funny stories about him and shit that's happened to me with him, but he's Eddie Peppetone is absolutely underrated. Oh my god. If you watch his new special, my fiance and her sitting front row. If you look in the middle of the front row, we're sitting there. We went out to Chicago to see him. Hell yeah. And we went to the second show. Like he had Gary Golman opens the show for him and does the God mic for him on it. And he's brilliant. I think he's one of the best working comics, and he's like so underrated, and so many people don't know him. And I'm like, you gotta look him, gotta look him up. He's one of my favorites. So that's my that's my rushmore. That's my people. Yeah. Um, I mean, there's so many people I could name, but that's like who I gravitate to the most.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:21:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:55

Who's yours? Yeah, I was gonna say, as a fucking You're a huge comedy nerd, I know.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:01

Yeah. You gotta ask me next.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:03

I am uh the first one I'm gonna name, which I think most people would not expect out of me based on the way that I look. Right. Is uh Tig Nataro. No, I'm fucking lying to you. Um I heard you talk, I was like, yeah, right. No, uh Neil Brennan, honestly. Oh, brilliant.

SPEAKER_08 1:22:20

Neil Brennan brilliant, and that's people don't realize like writing on Chappelle and stuff, like fucking brilliant.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:28

Yeah, wrote a ton of it, wrote half baked, but then fuck all of that. He brings that stuff up all the time because I think it for him brings validity to his career.

SPEAKER_08 1:22:38

Yeah, I think in being relevant of people like knowing his name or like putting it out there that like that's hard. That's like that's like saying Bobcat or somebody else, who it's like they're fucking they're a brilliant comic, but people don't know who they are. Yeah. And paying attention to who wrote whatever, that's especially him writing Chappelle and that, like I think Three Mikes is one of the most brilliant specials of all time.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:04

Yeah, it's it's got heart, it's it's got heart, it's got stupid, it's got brilliant. I mean, it's so I have I have it on fucking vinyl framed on my walls in the basement. Yeah, I fucking love Neil Brennan.

unknown 1:23:19

Oh god.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:20

I want to I I wanna see. It's tricky, it's tricky.

SPEAKER_08 1:23:23

That's one that I've had like a lot of thought about when people ask me, and I'm like off the cuff, those are my four, but then I could I could interchange it where it's like living working comics or not.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:33

But I know I like I want to put a caveat, like, all right, are we talking about inspiration? Are we talking about like who do I want to sit down and watch?

SPEAKER_08 1:23:38

What's your voice in your head? That's the other thing of like in in you starting to do stand-up and you have a voice in your head. So who are your voices in your head when you're writing and you're thinking of like this will be funny, how to say it like this? And I'm like, Oh, I notice a lot that I do certain people for sure have certain people's voice in my head when I have something that I'm working on. Yeah, so then that's the other thing is deciding who is it who is the inspiration of like so I love rant comedians, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:09

So that's that's probably the rest of my rushmore. It's yeah, Bill Burr, yeah, Louis C.K. Yeah, I mean Louis C.K. we talked about for fucking 10 minutes. I love Louis C.K. He's a genius, he's a fucking he can articulate an idea that everyone's had but couldn't figure out how to say it. Yeah, and then he's like, let me take this idea and I'm gonna run with it. Yeah, and then it kills, it murders people. People are like in pain laughing because he took an idea, like I saw a veteran or like an our soldier got on the plane, and I thought about giving up my seat to him. My first class seat.

SPEAKER_08 1:24:51

I didn't do it, I thought about it.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:53

It felt good for the rest of the day because I thought about it.

SPEAKER_08 1:24:57

This new thing when we saw him in September that he was like, he was talking about having to put his dad in like an elder care home, and he's like, just the whole thing boils down to like, here's money, you take him. It just boils down to that. And like the way he did it was so good. But it's it's a lot of real life stuff that he'll bring up that you're like, all right, yeah, everyone thinks this, but no one says it out loud.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:23

Yeah, I hate to. Okay, so for my last one, so I got Neil Brennan, Louis C.K., Bill Burr. So Bill Burr, I think Bill Burr gets boxed in as the Philadelphia rant guy, you know, he gets beat. Yeah, he's just angry. He gets boxed in as this Boston angry guy.

SPEAKER_08 1:25:38

He had a great show too. The F is for Family was great. And then um in the movie, Old Dance, yeah, incredible.

SPEAKER_03 1:25:44

But so I I love Bill Burr's comedy. Yeah, but I love that he pushes himself every time he does a special. He his first couple of specials, it's all rants. And then he starts doing act outs.

SPEAKER_08 1:25:57

But then he'll back, yeah, he like backed off of that. Yeah. Because you don't want to put yourself in a box of like your style is all you're known for. Yeah, you don't want to be ranting for 45 minutes. Yeah, and like he go ahead, finish what you were gonna say, and then I have another thought about it.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:12

But I so I love his comedy just as a viewer, but also as a comedian, I respect how he pushes himself every time. Right. He's always a guy who's trying to grow, and he doesn't accept that he's just this angry guy from Boston. He's like trying to get beyond that and figure out why he was an angry guy from Boston. And I think that someone that is actively and openly working on themselves, immediately you get a ton of respect for him.

SPEAKER_08 1:26:39

Well, like, especially for a dude like that, like a hard, angry Boston kid to be like, I am trying to work on myself. Like, you have to give them credit for that, that they'll be outwardly expressing it. Yeah, it's massive. That's crazy.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:53

Yeah, it's like it's like could I picture any of my coworkers in construction being like, oh, dude, I'm going to therapy. Fuck no. No.

SPEAKER_08 1:27:02

Pipe fitting.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:03

No. No, most of the fucking no. They're not gonna be like, yeah, I'm trying to be a better guy. No, I want to figure out why I hate my fucking dad.

SPEAKER_08 1:27:10

They're gonna drop a lot of a lot of slurs towards you if you say anything like that out loud.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:16

No doubt. Okay, so the my last, my final Mount Rushmore, I'm gonna go cliche, but it's out of the respect of what he did in his early days, which is Adam Sandler.

SPEAKER_08 1:27:28

Oh, for our generation in like the 90s, early 2000s, of like quotable records of all time. That oh my gosh, yeah. That first album in that is like I we had that, my brother had that on CD, and I've probably listened to that a thousand times.

SPEAKER_03 1:27:47

Is that the is the first one when he's got the peeping tom in the tree? And like or thoughts of a peeping tom or whatever.

SPEAKER_08 1:27:53

What was the thing with the goat where they're like playing football with the goat and that? What the hell is that called? I can't. Can't even think of what it's called because it's been 20 something years since I listened to it, but I'm like, man, and especially when he was like that resurgence of SNL being good, where like you had that like original generation of SNL and all those murders, and then it kind of falls off a little. But then coming into the 90s, where it's like him and Chris Farley and like David Spade and Kevin Nealand and Chris Catane fucking Norm is on it. Fucking norm. Norm is fucking insane and gets in trouble so much and actually like gets himself cancelled from it. And I'm like, man, Norm just oh yeah, I that's one of the huge things of why I absolutely adore Norm for so many reasons, but that's a huge one of just being like, well, fuck them. Like this, like the shit that he would talk on that when he was on weekend update. But Sandler on that time and that just being like really bringing comedy back around again, where like you have like um like Eddie Murphy and those kinds of guys in the 80s are like fucking killing it, and and comedy's big, and then it kind of hits a lull, and it's really, really big right now again, where you have these like ebbs and flows of like comedy being popular, but definitely that time of SNL is like another golden era, and that's like our childhood era of SNL being incredible.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:17

So I could see some of the most quotable shit from that from those records. The the the thoughts thoughts over peeping, Tom. And he like climbs up into the I'm climbing the tree.

SPEAKER_08 1:29:27

Well, and like his most crazy shit on SNL, where he's like lunchladyland is fucking in my head forever, forever in my head. And then what was the married couple? I'm trying to think of the married couple, it's him and and Farley again. Farley's the wife, and he's like dressed Sandler's dress as an old man. What the hell is their name? And she's like reading like menus and shit or like cooking books. I'm just like, oh my god, they're just so that was such a good time.

SPEAKER_03 1:29:57

See, I I love when I was a kid, I could not stand that my brother would put on these ranting, intelligent comedians. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I'm you know, I'm fucking 14 or something.

SPEAKER_08 1:30:09

When you're a kid, you just don't get it. That's like you're not 14 listening to Carlin or like being forced to. You're not, you know, you're not gonna get it if you're listening to Bill Hicks or somebody like that, where you're like that dumb kid. You don't get that. Like right.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:23

I had to age into those right, right. I tell you what, like George Carlin, I fucking love. I've got a rec I've got a record of his framed in my basement too. Yeah, but Carlin's never made me laugh. I just love what he does, but he but I've never laughed.

SPEAKER_08 1:30:37

He gets like too smart, and and shit that he makes me think about that I'm like it's all relevant right now again. And I'm like, man, if Carlin was alive right now, right? He would like spontaneously combust, he would fucking explode. Like that would be the craziest. But there is a handful of comics, and that's you mentioned like Louis Black, where I'm like, there's a handful of ranters that they're like too smart almost to get the crowd to be completely involved in being how it's funny. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:08

Um yeah, there's like a saying, like a like a perple a perplexed audience is not a laughing audience, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's how I feel about Carlin. Like, I love Carlin, but I brilliant.

SPEAKER_08 1:31:17

But I somebody who's like so well read and so smart, and it's like, man, if you had somebody like that running for office, where it's like somebody like that should be a politician, and that's a bunch of people trying to push like Jon Stewart or John Oliver or somebody like that, where they're like, please go into political office, and it's like they're too nice, they're not scumbags, right? They don't want it, that's why they're not there.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:40

I think it should be a requirement that you don't want to be a politician, and then we just force you to be James Stewart, yes, yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_08 1:31:50

It's it's a strange time, right? Such a strange time, but that um getting back into that thing of like picking your rushmore, and then that could change. Like there could be somebody that comes up that like um thinking of somebody who's like super brilliant. I know you brought him up before, but Sam Talent is I fucking love Sam Talent. He is absolutely a gem of a human being and kind and nice every time I've talked to him because he does the independent a lot, like he was doing these Wednesday shows where it was like Sam Talent's show, and he'd just be hanging out and he'd talk, and like he knew my name, and then he saw my fiance and he's like, Oh, the professor. And I'm like, he didn't know Nick's name, but he knew that he's a professor, and that's what the impression was in his mind to like retain like, oh, this guy's a teacher, like this guy, whatever about Nick, but yeah, he's just such an interesting comic, and then a writer, and he just dropped the new graphic novel. So that's something that came out recently that he just dropped like this week. But he has a book called Running the Light, and man, he is so fucking smart. His grandma was a librarian, and he would just like hang out in the library all the time. And I'm like, his lexicon of like the words that are available in his brain are always impressive to me. That I'm like, man, this dude is so smart. Yeah, it's he's a genius for sure. An actual genius.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:12

But he's the kind of guy that can he can he never makes you feel dumb. No, and kill you.

SPEAKER_08 1:33:17

He never makes you feel dumb when you're sitting in the audience, that he's like so good and so spontaneous, and just into being goofy and having fun and just being so random, where like he'll do certain shit and it doesn't hit everyone. But I was thinking about like last year he did a Wednesday and he did a Sam Talent show for the Motor City Comedy Fest, and he had this bit that he comes up and he's just like something, something about Big Iron, and he's like Big Iron and blah blah blah blah blah. But I'm like obsessed with old country, so I'm like, I know he's talking about Marty Robbins, Big Iron, and I'm like, I'm fucking losing it. And like most of the audience is like little light chuckles, but I had to go up to him after, and I was like, Sam, fucking killing me, dude. Like, you're just so some of the shit that he thinks about.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:04

That is one talent so smart. That's one talent that Daniel Tosh has. Is funny like that is he'll ring a bit until there's one person left. And he's like, that guy's gonna die.

SPEAKER_08 1:34:16

Yeah, and he doesn't give a shit that nobody else is laughing at it. He's like, he's all there for that one person laughing. That like it'll get too dark or it'll get too weird, and people just like hee hee hee. Right, and then someone in that one person in the dark in the back is fucking loot, crying, yeah, pissing themselves. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:36

See, I I hesitate to put like Daniel Tosh and Dane Cook in my list of like who I love because I'm not 14 anymore. Yeah, but I'm gonna be like Jeslinick, like those dudes, like Jeslinick is picking some weird political fights like that.

SPEAKER_08 1:34:52

He's gotten weird, but like back when him and Tosh I put him and Tosh kind of in the same bracket of like getting weird, and like they'll get you into a storyline and they'll fish hook you into something really fucked up, and then it turns around on you again, and I'm like, damn it! Like he gets me every time.

SPEAKER_03 1:35:08

And you know what they're doing comics like that. Yeah, you know the tricks that the call for it fucking hook like every time. Yeah, there's a lot of com see like the more I the more I've learned doing comedy, the more I'm like, I'm kind of fucking ruining this for myself because now I see the tricks that are happening. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:35:24

There is that like I just I think because I've listened to so many podcasts and like listen to so many comics talk about comedy, and you you hear that behind the veil stuff of like how much sacrifice it is and how straining it is on relationships and and all the shit that they're going through, that's all the really like heavy, sad shit that a lot of people never think about, or like people who aren't huge comedy nerds just think, like, oh, this goofball got on stage and just said this off the cuff, and it's like, no, that's like hours and hours and hours of like painstaking labor and going to mics and eating 10 bags of dick a night, and fucking like you want to walk into traffic, and then finally you get to a special or you get to like someone sees you do your hour live or whatever, and it's like, oh, they fucking killed it, but it's like you have no idea like the blood, sweat, and tears that went into that. Yeah, and that's you know, that's uh I think if you that book, The Sam Talon, the uh running the light, and then I I need to check it out, I haven't watched it yet, but there's a uh Stanhope movie, I think it's called Road Dogs, but that's really a lot about that, like the time in between shows and that time on the road and all the shit that you go through to actually do that as a profession. It's just such a wild thing to think about all that sacrifice of everything that they're sacrificing to do that to pursue that.

SPEAKER_03 1:36:55

Yeah. Yeah, I I I have the bug. It's fucking I have the bug and I love it, but I'm also like worried because I'm a family guy first. Yeah, yeah. But I'm like, my god, I fucking love this so much. Like I like last night we went to stands.

SPEAKER_08 1:37:11

I was not on the Does your oldest kid, but you have that like older kid, is he cool just hanging at the house when you're gone? Like, or do you don't want to put that on him?

SPEAKER_03 1:37:20

Um a little bit of both. Like we do it very rarely where we'll be like, hey, we'll be gone for we're gonna go to the gym, we'll be gone for two hours. Yeah, you know, like we'll do that.

SPEAKER_08 1:37:27

Yeah, but like it's hard because like child care and stuff, because there's a couple comics that are have young, young kids, like toddler kids, and I'm like, man, the child care aspect of that is like so hard to navigate.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:40

Especially when you have three, it's like, can I get grandma to watch the kids? Fucking yeah, you don't even want to do it with three. Yeah, yeah. Well, that's a lot, yeah. It's a lot, but but my kids are self-sufficient now, so like I mean there's seven, eight. I wipe my own ass.

SPEAKER_08 1:37:53

I wipe my own ass. Yeah, Jimmy Stewart. Those kids, they're all right, they're old enough to be like Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:38:00

But when they were baby, like when they were like two, three, and eight or whatever the fuck, impossible to get someone to watch them. It was impossible, couldn't do anything.

SPEAKER_08 1:38:08

Oh, that's my my brother-in-law, and they have four. And I'm like, I want to take them out and do stuff with them, and he's like, No. I'm like, I know they're animals, but we have like a whole crew with us, we can watch them. He's like, no. But yeah, it's my best friend has five, and I'm like, them navigating childcare when her and her husband both work full-time jobs, and I'm like, luckily they have both grandparents are around to like help out, but I'm like, man, five is fucking lot of feed. That's a lot of chaos. It's a lot of people to feed. I always describe her house. I go over to her house, and I'm like, it's like one flew over the cuckoo's nest where there's like one of them's dancing in the corner by themselves, and one of them's like throwing a fountain out the front window and escaping.

SPEAKER_09 1:38:52

It's like it's just such a fucking crazy scene.

SPEAKER_03 1:38:55

Spitting the pill out from underneath his tongue.

SPEAKER_08 1:38:57

When you're the person coming over where I'm like the fun auntie person, where they're like, look at me! I'm like, oh my god, they all are like insane where I'm like, oh, I'm looking at you, I'm looking at you, and I feel like a chameleon, my eyes go in two different directions.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:11

Dude, as a parent, I fucking hate when my kids get into that mood. Because there's some there, we have to do that. Well, not even well, that that will drive me nuts too. But when we have people over, and then there's Oh, they just get cranked to the hilt.

SPEAKER_07 1:39:24

Well, some watch this. Uh uh. There's and they like jump.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:31

All of our friends are like very nice people. So like they'll give my kids the attention. And I'm like, hey, be a dick to my kid, please. Yeah. If you're gonna knock him down a peg. If you don't care that he's here, he'll go upstairs and play with his shit. Uh but if you keep going, what'd you say, buddy? And then oh he's down in the basement with us for the entire fucking night.

SPEAKER_08 1:39:51

Yeah, and you want to have like friend time. Yeah, that's tricky. Yeah, that's tricky because you want to have your friend time and be like, I can talk to an adult human being. Because that's like when I go to see my best friend. She's like the whole time. I'm like, Yeah, I forget that you like talk to a bunch of seven-year-olds and under for like the last 72 hours straight. Oh, yeah. Like, yeah, at the adult time, and having a normal conversation is very limited when you have a bunch of kids. But three That's why I do this. One was 13 and then seven and eight. Yeah, so the seven and eight like really wants to be involved. Is the 13 like too cool to hang out? Oh my god, you're starting to get there. Yeah, that's frustrating.

SPEAKER_03 1:40:28

Dude, I make fun of you. I've been breaking him lately because he has this like facade of like. I'm bad, I'm angry, bad all the time. Yeah, and then like I dude, I grabbed him. I uh I go, What's your problem? He's like, What? I'm like, what's your fucking problem to do? He's like, What do you mean? I go, Here's an alkaline true album. Shut up. I ran up and grabbed him by the neck, and I was like, shave your shitty mustache. And he just started dying laughing. He's like, Stop! And then I started punching him and he's like, Oh my god. Oh my gosh, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:40:58

He's kidding so hard though, going into junior high. Oh my god, it's so fucking hard. He's been with his girlfriend for a year and he's almost almost 13. Damn, kids now. Like, we we had this conversation because a bunch like I work with almost all women. There's only one dude at our clinic. Now he said I work in vetmed, and they like having these conversations with all the other gals, they have kids that I'm like, dude, I could not fucking I don't know how you parent, I don't know how you do it. And they're like, little girls are getting their periods at like 10. And I'm like, what the fuck? I think even earlier than that. Eight, eight, they said that like eight and ten. I'm like, what the fuck? Kind of like what is happening with everything with people's bodies, but that to be like 12, you're like, we've been together for like a year, like right, right.

SPEAKER_03 1:41:45

Isn't that crazy? Like it'd be like next month they'll be together a year already.

SPEAKER_08 1:41:49

But they're sweet, that's like wholesome. It's wholesome, and that's good.

SPEAKER_03 1:41:52

They're still like when they hang out, it's still super awkward.

SPEAKER_08 1:41:54

Like they're all cute, yeah. Sometimes that works out. Like, I can't talk shit because like my fiance and I have been together for 22 years. Wow for real. Like I was 17, like gonna be 17 when we started dating. And I was like, sometimes that happens. No, not Seinfeld. We didn't go full Seinfeld, but yeah, they like it's cute, but that generation's funny too, because that's not like the hookup culture and stuff has changed a lot with those kids, and that's like even like our niece and nephew, like Nick's little like cousins too. They're like late cousins. There's a big gap between them. So they're more like our niece and nephew versus cousins to him. But they they're both in like committed relationships, they're like in their 20, young 20s, and been with their partner for like a long, like been with their boyfriend or girlfriend for like years.

SPEAKER_03 1:42:47

See, this is where I start to sound conservative. I'm like, this is good. It's good, it's good for the kids, it's good for kids.

SPEAKER_08 1:42:52

I think it's good. Like, go back. I'm glad that's like coming back. That it's like I think of all of our friends that have these like fucked up relationships and all this like turmoil and hookups and all this drama, and I'm like, right, but hopefully for like everyone's psyche's sake, that like that's working out well. I hope that that like your kid like that. Hopefully, that's a good thing for him. He's with her, and they're like, Yeah, you know, I don't that works out sometimes. There's a bunch of people that I know that like they've been together for a million years, and that's been their person.

SPEAKER_03 1:43:25

Right. I mean, I I think anything with anything reasonable is is the way it should be. It's not like I I feel like when we were like going through high school, like the narrative was like, Why would you want to hold us back? We're we're trying to like have these, like these are our 70s, we're gonna have this hookup culture where it's all free sex and it doesn't matter, and yeah, yeah, you don't slut shame me and whatever, and all this shit, all these words started coming out, but it's also like, hey man, like there's there's like you can develop a much deeper and much more like fulfilling relationship by committing to somebody, and then also if kids start being involved, which is what you're fucking practicing, right? If kids start getting involved, that'd be so tricky because like so much better for the kids.

SPEAKER_08 1:44:13

Yeah, I think about some of our friends that have had kids and then they're bringing people around, and I'm like, this is such a like not healthy person to have around your children. Yeah, there's a tricky.

SPEAKER_03 1:44:24

So scary to think about that it's like we've had to navigate some weird shit there. My ex.

SPEAKER_08 1:44:30

Yeah, that's your ex having anybody like unsavory around.

SPEAKER_03 1:44:34

Well, so she's 30 years older than her. She was cheating on me with several guys.

SPEAKER_08 1:44:40

I heard you talk about the one on the Peggy. I listened to Peggy, I love Peggy. Shout out Peggy Beatty. I love her too. Shout out Peggy Beattie, she's a fucking hoot. Uh, but that you I heard you mention that that she's like hooking up outside in the apartment parking lot and shit. And I'm like, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_03 1:44:55

Oh, that one is she was so our old house was surrounded by an apartment complex. But you had little kids, like you had a little baby. They're like two or three at the time to go fuck a guy in the parking lot and like do exandex or whatever.

SPEAKER_08 1:45:10

Like she robbed a fence. She hopped. She built a fence to go fuck a dude in the parking lot. I'm saying bitch not as a dragon, I'm saying bitch is a little unspeed female dog. You can be derogative, she's a bitch.

SPEAKER_03 1:45:23

But she she's getting plowed by a dude in a fucking parking lot. And while that's happening, my I think there were three and four at the time, walk out of the house looking for mom, and they were found by the neighbor walking down the street, one of them in a diaper, looking for mom, wondering where mom's at, and she's in the parking lot next to next to the house. All these doing pills and fucking a 60-year-old.

SPEAKER_08 1:45:47

All three are yours and hers. Yeah. So there's that age gap too that you're with her that long. Yeah, they were that little leaving the apartment, like fucking.

SPEAKER_03 1:45:55

Yeah, we lived in a we so we had a house that was surrounded by a par apartment complex. Okay, okay. So then she hopped the fence out of our yard into the apartment complex parking lot to go fuck a dude. To go fick a fuck a 60-year-old.

SPEAKER_08 1:46:08

That's when you hear, do you know who Ryan Sickler is? Like, there's a handful of comics that like his mom was doing that kind of shit, and then she completely fucked off, and like they were like 16, their dad died, and she just like abandoned them. Yeah, she wanted to adopt the two kids and like not have Ryan. She was like trying to get full custody of the two kids and not him, too. And just some of the shit that I hear that the comics talk about with with the way their mom out of anyone in your life to like fuck off is so crazy.

SPEAKER_03 1:46:40

They have your mom be the piece of shit. Damaging for your mom to be the succumb the scumbag.

SPEAKER_08 1:46:45

It's so crazy. It's so crazy. Are they old enough now that they're like realizing that? Or they still like the littler ones are still like in that like that like I so gray area.

SPEAKER_03 1:46:57

A caveat. All right, all right. Is that I'm I'm a child of divorce and my parents played that game hard. I don't like that. That's right. To convince the kids that the other one's a piece of shit. Yeah, no. So I'm I'm trying really hard. Don't play into it to not create a narrative. Right. And it and it sometimes it slips out. I'll get like I'm I'm not perfect, don't get me wrong. Like, no, I'll get upset. I'd be like, you know what? What do you oh you been at your fucking moms? All of a sudden you think you can swear or whatever. And like it'll slip out, and I'm like, I shouldn't have said that. No, it's hard.

SPEAKER_08 1:47:30

That's fucking navigating that. I don't know how the fuck people are.

SPEAKER_03 1:47:33

It's difficult, it's difficult, but like, but I know that they don't really like bad talk her though.

SPEAKER_08 1:47:39

I do like in front of them. Yeah, that's the big thing of like there's so many parents I hear do that shit, and it's like you're just jeopardizing your relationship with your kid because they're gonna grow up and realize all the shit that you were doing. Yeah, and it's like, why don't you play like be the good guy? Be the fucking play devil's advocate, don't fucking talk shit about the other parent. They're gonna realize who's fucking them over. Well, that's gotta wait it out.

SPEAKER_03 1:48:04

It's the hard thing, is is when they're little, the narrative that you sell them is the narrative in their head. So it's like it's really hard. Like that's it.

SPEAKER_06 1:48:12

How you talk to them about the other person.

SPEAKER_08 1:48:22

And how they think of themselves and other people, and how it's okay to speak about women, especially if you have boys, like dude, that you have to be so careful about that. It is so complicated. Like, because so I can't even imagine, especially if she was like just some of the stuff I heard you talk about before. That I'm like, she just was really a monster towards you and your kid, like your oldest kid, is so sad.

SPEAKER_07 1:48:46

But to to not fucking be like this fucking dude, like it'd be so hard.

SPEAKER_05 1:48:52

And right now they're the kids just see it as oh, we have one house where there's rules and one house where there's not rules. Yeah, they literally have like a free-for-all there.

SPEAKER_09 1:48:59

So they're like, We're gonna go mom's fuck shit up.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:02

We're gonna go for fucking.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:05

Are they cool towards you? Like you you're playing a very tricky role too in their lives. Like your role in their lives is really fucking hard. The two little ones love her. Good. Okay, that's good. The oldest one. Well, the teenager's gonna be a teenager, right? He's I don't like teenagers.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:22

He cares about you, but he gets frustrated.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:26

How long have you been involved?

SPEAKER_05 1:49:27

Um four. Almost four years.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:30

Yeah, so a good chunk of their like he was nine, like not even, and then the little littles were little. Yeah, so they're like used to maybe stuff around. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:49:39

He was uh nine yeah, like nine when I met him, so he was a little bit older. Yeah. Now I feel like as he's getting more into his teenage years, it's more like there's a lot of pushback. Yeah. But when he was younger, there wasn't as many things.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:52

That's not like directed towards you specifically, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:55

I think it's not a him versus page thing. It's

SPEAKER_08 1:50:03

Is he mad at his mom? Is he getting it now that he's like gonna be mad at his mom?

SPEAKER_05 1:50:07

She actually well, he actually at one point asked to live with us full time.

SPEAKER_03 1:50:12

Because of how bad the relationship. But he's it's gotten better since then. Yeah, but that sucks to like yeah. There's a so there is a my ex is somebody who shot demand respect, which I like I know that's like a loaded thing to say.

SPEAKER_08 1:50:31

Like if you're a parent, you need at least some kind of like law, like rule of anything, like being in charge of anything.

SPEAKER_03 1:50:39

Yeah, and that well, and that's the thing is that she would rather lay down and just give up the fight than then it's frustrating.

SPEAKER_08 1:50:48

Then I am dominance the opposite. Especially if you're teaching and doing and you already have that in your head to like Yeah, so I I was a teacher and now I'm a behavior analyst. So like what I do all day is like I'm holding you accountable for you're getting handed a real fucking ball of like crazy thing to get into to be behavior analyst and have that where you have to deal with like that's a lot of people.

SPEAKER_05 1:51:15

But I'm very much like I know that if I say this is what's happening, this is what's happening, and if you're gonna fight me, like you're not gonna win. You're not gonna win. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:51:25

What age bracket is yours targeted? Like, are you in a specific like age bracket doing that, or is it like all over?

SPEAKER_05 1:51:31

Um so I have anywhere right now, I have like two to nine-year-olds at the moment. Okay, but all with autism. Um so like I'm using different like strategies with money, but I use a lot of it at home too, where I'm like, okay, if you do this, then you're gonna get what you want. Like we're reinforcing the good behaviors. But like if you start to do some things that not aren't acceptable, then we're gonna replace that.

SPEAKER_03 1:51:58

We're gonna and that's then that's what the oldest is having such a hard time with is being held accountable because at one household, if he pushes back, it's okay, whatever.

SPEAKER_08 1:52:08

Do whatever you want, which is like not real, you're gonna create a fucking monster. Right. Like that's not okay for a kid.

SPEAKER_05 1:52:15

But even like down to like when he's like, Hey, can I have a snack? And I'm like, Yeah, did you do your chores yet? Yeah. He's like, Well, no, I'm like, okay, do your chores first, then you can have your snack. Yeah, yeah. Like it's just like little things like that. Like, you're yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:27

And he he gets frustrated because he's not used to the pushback because he knew that like I'm the rules, yeah, and mom is the get what you want when you want it kind of deal.

SPEAKER_08 1:52:37

And you can't let you can't let someone figuring out how to be a human being do like that's how you make a fucking psycho. That's how you make a Barack Turner. Like literally a fucking psychopath. Like aye. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:52:50

Do you think you think she's a sociopath, or you think she's just like damaged beyond like is she just like hard to one thing that people like when I was with her, or when I freshly broke up with her, yeah, everyone was like, Why did you give it so much time? Or like girls that I would talk to would like, you know, like start a dating after her would be like, Why did you fucking why, why, why?

SPEAKER_08 1:53:11

And I'm like, You were young when you were with her. That's pretty you had a baby at what 19 or something. It's like so fucking young. You're figuring out how to be, you're not an adult yet. You don't have a fucking fully formed lobe yet. First of all, my parents had a very contentious, toxic divorce towards you too. Involving you in that is toxic.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:33

My idea of what a relationship should look like when I'm 15 is like, oh, you're supposed to just scream and flip shit over when you don't agree.

SPEAKER_08 1:53:41

I'm gonna punch a fucking hole in the wall. Like that shit. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I did all that shit.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:45

I ripped doors off of walls over like finding out she was cheating, and then she'd like steal all my money out of a bank account and then go fuck another guy, you know? Like, and this is a cycle for 13 years. And and so, like, when I first when I first broke up with her, so many people would be like, I mean, I've heard it in even when I was with her, why why'd you give her so much time? Why'd you forgive her about it? I didn't know any better. I didn't know any better because I was young, but also she I had empathy because she had gone through so much shit so fast.

SPEAKER_08 1:54:12

If she's super, super damaged, were you just like if you have that in you to care so much about someone else?

SPEAKER_03 1:54:17

Well, that was the thing, is like I'm fucking rescuing this fucking scumbag pit bull.

SPEAKER_08 1:54:22

Well, she's a damsel in distress. Well, and you're just like a white dude that's like, I can help her, I can I can fix her.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:30

Well, so she okay, so she was she was abandoned in India.

SPEAKER_08 1:54:34

Well, and that's her being adopted at three. She comes to the US and gets adopted by a single white lady.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:40

Eventually, she was adopted. She was adopted and then sent back and then returned first. She was adopted by a family who then the family was both teachers, they both got laid off at the same time from the school district, so they returned her to India, and then she got adopted. They sent her back, and then they and then she was adopted again by a single woman who, in my opinion, was more friends with the girls. There's two of them. She adopted two girls from India, not blood relatives, but uh sisters by adoption. So she adopts two girls from India, and and I I think that she was friends with the girls instead of a parent figure to the girls because the way that they act is is is akin to like a Nepo baby. Like they don't they don't have any concept of consequences or repercussions for anything they do. It's all selfish, selfish, selfish. At least it was. But yeah, but then she like we went so and then the mom that adopted them died of cancer when when my ex was 17.

SPEAKER_08 1:55:47

So it's like you were adopted returned, but then you're in the system again because you're not 18.

SPEAKER_03 1:55:53

She was no well, she wasn't. Did they let her out of it? She no, she was she didn't have to deal with that. It was only a few months away from her 18th birthday. That's the the US system is fucked. It was so she went through a lot of shit, and then her and her sister sued each other in probate court for for her mom's money. So, like the only person on earth that she had she was fucking going to a court war with.

SPEAKER_08 1:56:16

Oh my god. Because the one sister was saying, well, my own. But if they were raised that way to fucking not have any empathy or any like thought of anyone else and be like, This is mine. Yeah, this is mine. Like that's so fucking crazy to think about.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:31

The I so I had a lot of empathy because of how much shit that she had gone through at such a young age. Like and like we so we split, we were together for like four years, and then we split up. She we we got an apartment, her you know, her mom dies, her mom uh we get an apartment, she we get pregnant with our oldest, she's suing her sister in probate court, and she just then she's got like pregnancy hormones. Yes, she tries to stab me. I I was fixing up the apartment because we're gonna move into the house that we bought, and I'm fixing up the apartment. I tell her to, I'm like, hey, you gotta leave. I'm like, painting, I don't want you breathing in kills, paint, you know, and she flips out, the argument fucking escalates, escalates, escalates, yeah, and she tries to stab me. Yeah, so I call the cops, I explain the situation, and they commit her to the psych ward. And then while she's in the sideboard, she fucks another guy. Fucking eight months pregnant, six months pregnancy, six months pregnancy, like visibly pregnant. Fucks a guy in the sideward. I find out about this, I break up with her, I fucking take my baby, and we leave. Yeah, and I I and I file like emergency custody because she was like trying to hang herself, she was doing drugs, all kinds of shit after.

SPEAKER_08 1:57:46

Postpartum makes some really fucked up things happen to a woman's brain. Like that's super, super scary that people don't bring that up. Like, yeah, a couple of my friends that I'm like, man, postpartum was not okay. And then a lot of moms are on their own, where like at least you were around and trying to fucking like I was trying to make a woman.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:07

But yeah, that's so scary to have your baby involved in right, and then she would say shit like, Come get this baby, or I'm gonna fucking kill him while I'm at work.

SPEAKER_08 1:58:15

And I'm like, Well, what the fuck you can't leave, I'm gonna fucking like lose my job. Like, right, just somebody working. Playing a kid is a pawn in anything is so fucking which she did all the time.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:26

So I so I take I say I take my one-year-old, we stay together until he was one. I I'm like, I can't fucking do this. I take my baby, I leave, I file burst to custody, and she basically doesn't see him until he's like three years old. So sad won't doesn't come to any of the visitations. By the way, the visitations were a quarter mile away from her house. I would drive 45 miles. Yeah, there's no excuse to go a quarter mile away from her house. By knowing you had like supervised visitation because because she had all kinds of drugs in her system and she cussed out the judge during our custody hearing, said you're gonna give him whatever the fuck he wants because he's got a fucking file over there. So just do I just do what you're gonna do. She goes, Okay, what do you want? I go, supervised visit. I want full custody, supervised visitation. She goes, Done. All right, look at that, look how that works. Yeah, and uh yeah, and then so crazy, like barely so her her her uh relationship with my oldest has been tarnished since that period, which when I think even if he wasn't old enough to remember, like little kids are really good with energy and like how people move around them and how they age them, like he remembers like living at his mom's house, at grandma's house.

SPEAKER_05 1:59:40

He'll like say he'll say, I lived at grandma's house, I lived here, I lived here.

SPEAKER_08 1:59:44

They'll know that something is not okay with someone. Yeah, it's so sad. It's so crazy. He that's not even like your full long-term memory doesn't start usually till you're four.

SPEAKER_03 1:59:54

Some people it's sooner, but usually till you're four, and then he knows that it wasn't I think he just know like there's just a I don't the disconnection is because of her and the way that she's treated him since then. Like it's not that like if she if we got back together different than the other two. Oh, yeah. She did I think she's trying to change that now. I gotta do have to give her credit. Like she is older. It is better now. But it was literally like I mean, we came when when he came to live with us full time, it was uh she called and said or he called and was like, Mom wants you to come get us, and she was in the background, like, no, not all three of you, just you.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:34

And I was like, That's the Ryan Sickler shit. He should listen to that.

SPEAKER_08 2:00:38

I'm like, man, that's fucking wild to have your mom be that. Oh, buckle the fuck up.

SPEAKER_05 2:00:45

I've gone into all this because we're already at two hours.

SPEAKER_08 2:00:48

Yeah. Do you want to leave? I have to pee. We'll go pee. Why don't we do a pee break? Let's do a you can you pause or do you have to wait? Yeah, I mean we can. Well, you can keep going. I'll come. Do you? I don't have to have to go, but I'll go already. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:00

Well, she okay, so let me tell you the story. You tell me because she's heard this four times.

SPEAKER_08 2:01:05

It's alright, is it? The loudest thing on earth. I slammed the table earlier.

SPEAKER_09 2:01:09

Oh, everyone's very reactive, or I'm like, fuck. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:01:12

All right, all right.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:12

So I had a dr real quick, I had a drummer on here with his band. And this fucking he was like, by the way, he was exactly.

SPEAKER_08 2:01:24

Yeah, that's when I slammed it.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:25

I'm like, oh, that's anytime something came up that he didn't like, he'd start acting like a fucking child and he'd start like flicking stuff and drumming. Oh my god. Good insane. God, he was driving.

SPEAKER_08 2:01:35

Do you ever hear it like that's all those like influencer bitches where they're like doing the ASMR and tapping with their nails, and I'm like, I'm gonna punch a fucking hole in the wall of this. Oh, he was acting like a fucking child.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:45

I'm gonna fucking freak out. He was like a hired gun drummer for the band, too. He was acting like a little fucking kid.

SPEAKER_08 2:01:51

I would fucking I would tell him to leave. I'd be like, dude, like this is literally an audio podcast, and when I fucking get this to edit it, I'm gonna freak the fuck out.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:59

Yeah, I was not happy. He like dude, yeah. I don't I don't wanna yeah, I don't know. You're good, you're good. He he was pissing me the fuck off. I am not cutting that. They will not be back because of their fucking drummers.

SPEAKER_08 2:02:12

That shit sucks when you get someone who's a fucking nightmare like that. Yeah, he was a douchebag. He smoked a cigarette in my building and then like came back and pretended he's like. Who's he thinking is David Tell? Get the fuck out of here. Get out of here.

SPEAKER_03 2:02:24

Uh, but okay, so the so Okay, wait.

SPEAKER_08 2:02:27

All right, yes. All right, reset the this is a lot of like unpacking the fucking crazy shit.

SPEAKER_09 2:02:35

All right, so go for it.

SPEAKER_08 2:02:36

Okay, go for it.

SPEAKER_03 2:02:37

So me and Paige were going Christmas shopping, and I get a call that uh my son calls me like, hey buddy, what's up? He goes, Mom said you have to come get us. I go, Okay, I'm on my way. Right? Like I'm never gonna say. No problem. Yeah, I'm on my way. Doesn't matter what I'm doing, I'm on my way. Yeah, and and then like Paige was saying in the background, no, that's not what the fuck I said. He can pick you up.

SPEAKER_08 2:03:04

But he wants them to go because he's worried about them. Maybe. Maybe I bet you he's looking out for them too. That she's in whatever the fuck she's doing, and he wants them to go too.

SPEAKER_03 2:03:14

Yeah, so I pull I pull up and uh I'm like whatever. Like, I'm I no problem, I'm getting him. I pick him up, and he gets in the car, and he's upset, and he's like shutting down. I'm like, what's wrong? And he's like, nothing, nothing. And then when how old is he? Either nine or ten. And so he's trying to hold it together, he's trying not to cry. And oh god.

SPEAKER_08 2:03:39

I would freak it out, dude. Like I'm getting out of lottery. I know, I'm having a hard time even telling this. Anyone being mean to a kid fucks me up. Like just being shitty to a fucking kid. Like, what the fuck is wrong with you?

SPEAKER_03 2:03:53

This is what happened. He gets so I find out this story by putting it together between what he told me by what mom told me, yeah, her. And by what the other siblings told me. Is essentially he got home first from school, gets off the bus first. The other two were getting home later or whatever, for whatever reason. Yeah. So he gets home first, he calls my ex and he goes, Can I make a snack? I'm hungry. She goes, Yeah, go ahead. Yeah. So he makes um he makes uh pizza rolls, like he microwaves some pizza rolls. In pulling the pizza rolls out of the freezer, he knocks down a bag of vegetables that was open and tied up in the freezer and it just makes a mess. And just goes whoosh all over the floor. And he gets his food, he walks past the mess, and he goes and eats it. Yeah. She gets home, sees the mess, starts flipping the fuck out on him, goes in his room, a lot you fucking clean up this fucking mess, blah blah blah. And he's like, I'm not doing anything until you tell me why you're yelling at me. And she goes, You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_08 2:04:55

The nine-year-old's more logical than a crazy woman. Right.

SPEAKER_03 2:04:58

And uh and she she's whatever, storms down the hallway, and he's like playing uh he's playing his Xbox and he's like, I'm not doing I'm not doing it because she's screaming at me and I don't even understand what the problem is. And my daughter runs into his room a couple minutes later and goes, Mom's throwing away all your Christmas gifts. And he goes, What? And she he runs out down the hall.

SPEAKER_08 2:05:24

Did she tell them that?

SPEAKER_03 2:05:25

And they're like before like she was doing it, and my and my daughter ran to go tell the oldest. Yeah, so she he runs down the hallway to see that she's smashing his she uh she's smashing. You're just like, we're both gonna cry. Dude, this shit I can't do. She's smashing his his presence into the garbage can, breaking everything, and he uh starts sobbing, yeah, and he runs out of the house to like go get space away from her in her manic episode. And I should pre I should have prefaced this by saying that my son loves video games because it's his escape from having to be the dad, because she puts that on.

SPEAKER_08 2:06:10

Well, and if yeah, you that happens to a lot of kids in that situation. That's what I meant when he said you need to come get us. Yeah, so he's wanted to protect that.

SPEAKER_03 2:06:19

Can you get yeah, can you get her food? Can you get her a snack? Can you help change her diaper? Blah blah blah. Like she like she's putting so much on him.

SPEAKER_08 2:06:28

Like seven when they're little, little diaper kids.

SPEAKER_03 2:06:30

Literally, yeah. Like my mom makes jokes about this, like when she would watch them, uh, she'd be like, Yeah, Jamie, come here, let's change your diaper. And then my son, my oldest goes, Oh, I already changed his diaper. And she's like, You don't, you're not, you don't have to do that. Like, he doesn't even realize that it's a problem. Yeah, but okay, so to circle back, yeah, his his Xbox was his escape from being the third parent. Right. When I wasn't there, he was the fill-in dad. Right. And so he so she's smashing his presence, he starts like having a panic attack, he runs outside to get air, he's like, I'm gonna go play basketball and get out of the house, get away from her screaming. While he's out there, she had ripped the Xbox out of the wall, runs out into the street and frisbees in and fucking smashes it. And this is when we get the call. So fast forward to we show up, he gets into the car and he's just devastated. And I go, Hey, you're not in trouble for what happened here. Yeah, you're not, you're in my you're you're at my house now. Yeah, whatever happened at that house. You're in my space and you're safe. That's what happened with them. That's or with her. This is not you're not getting in trouble for for this. Right. And oh, this pisses me off.

SPEAKER_09 2:07:47

Doug, I would be fucking like I'm like in tears already.

SPEAKER_08 2:07:52

We had to even elaborate on it, and I'm already fucking in tears.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:55

This is like the 22nd or 23rd of December. I can't even. And we have to Christmas shop right now.

SPEAKER_08 2:08:03

We need to do Christmas and be like, we need to be like happy and have this like fun, wholesome day.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:09

So, like, we're we're behind on Christmas shopping. I think I was waiting for a check because I was still an apprentice. Oh, yeah. And so, like, we take we take them to Walmart or whatever, and we're Christmas shopping. And I and so I'm trying to talk, I'm trying to get information out of them still, because I'm sure I'm still trying to piece together what happened.

SPEAKER_08 2:08:24

But they have that weird protective thing over their parent, too, the other parent, where they like don't want to rat him out or they don't want to make them look. And their mom also tells them and to not fucking yeah, that's a whole other thing. Or would she do the bribery thing? Like, don't tell your dad, I'm gonna buy you whatever game for your Xbox.

SPEAKER_03 2:08:42

She was she specifically tells kids, the kids not to tell me stuff, and it got to the point where we had to have a doctor inspect my daughter because I was worried. Yeah, like so we take we go we go to Walmart to go Christmas shopping after this, smashing his Xbox, smashing his Christmas presents. My son's fucking devastated. He thinks the world is falling apart because of this bitch. And he turns to me. I'm trying to get information out of him, and he goes, I don't know, dad. Like, I don't know if when I came out when I was born, I was just ugly, and she decided that she doesn't love me, but she loves that she loves the other two, and like I was just ugly when I came out, and then she and she decided that she doesn't love me because she's always treated the other two different than those are for sure your kids. Yeah, and it infuriates me. Dude, I would fucking dude.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:39

I there's so much. I can't even articulate right now because I'm like, that's such a fucked up thing to like make a kid uh think in their head that their parent feels that way.

SPEAKER_03 2:09:49

He's looking for a reason why he's always been treated differently than the other two by her. And like it's changing now, I guess, but my god, you have a steep fucking hill to climb to fix that. Like, for a nine-year-old to not only recognize that he's getting treated differently, but to articulate it and be like, hey, this is so bad that I think my mom doesn't love me.

SPEAKER_08 2:10:12

And to think that it's like I'm ugly or that, like, what the fuck? Like, you guys both got tissues out? An eight-year-old. I'm sure grandma, I always got tissues out. She got she's she's it's a grandma with allergies in Michigan that I always have tissues. But I was like, dude, before he even got into any of it, when he first said that he called and he asked to get picked up, and then she's yelling just him, that I'm like, I fucking started getting teary eye just from that. Yeah. But to have him fucking say that he thinks it's him and not her, right? And to recognize as like a little kid to recognize that it's like what a fucking awful that he's getting treated so differently. Do you think that's like part of it of like when you got custody? So you guys broke up for a while. You get back together and have the two other kids. How long were you broken up for in that space? Like two years, and you had full custody of him for that time.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:10

Yeah, and she basically did not see him.

SPEAKER_08 2:11:12

And you said like all the supervised visits and stuff, she wouldn't show up and you just sit there and like wait it out and be like, okay, we went and whatever. But do you think a lot of that's like based in that that he she fucking whatever about him and not being around and you taking him and taking custody as part of it? Like how he how she treats him.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:33

Yeah, I've talked about that where I was so young that I think I let my mom kind of take the reins on how everything shook out. Yeah. And I shouldn't have.

SPEAKER_08 2:11:41

Well, and I'm sure she fucking hated this girl. She like wanted to murder this girl.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:46

She was like, I need to protect my grandbaby.

SPEAKER_08 2:11:48

And so like she was like, I can't fucking imagine being involved in the grandma and being like, You give a shit about your grandkid, dude. I would be insane.

SPEAKER_03 2:11:57

I th I do think that. I do think that some of the way that I reacted and and and got the you know supervised visitation.

SPEAKER_08 2:12:08

And some of that's you're so young that you're like you could feel like you're hurting her in a way, but she probably didn't give a shit that she didn't have to deal with him. Yeah. You know, if that was like some kind of selfish component of it, but also you're protecting him.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:21

Like I think there I well, that's what I worry about. Is that what were my intentions as pure as I like to sell it? Because I don't know. I mean, like I was you're too young. I was 20.

SPEAKER_08 2:12:30

I'm way too fucking young to have all that. Like, there's so much nuance in that, and then you helped him. I'm sure you fucking saved his life. Because if she was that fucking crazy, like think of all the moms that they are really truly going through postpartum alone and they do something to hurt their baby is so fucking scary. So she threatened all the time, constant threats of that is and to fucking like yell at the judge and shit. Like oh, and not have a kid be around that, regardless of her actually doing physical bodily harm to him, to lock him in a room and let him scream till he falls asleep, or like whatever the fuck. Like, there's so much shit that I've heard with like situations like that where the parents split up and the other parent is just so gross towards the kid just because they they like got that time and they just are using it to hurt the other parent is fucking crazy. Yeah, there is so much. I mean, there's so much about it. Dude, but to have him that just hurts like by fucking heart so bad to hear him say that. Like, if that that shatters me to little pieces, like how do you fucking like talk to him? It'd be like it's not you, buddy. Like you have nothing, nothing about you is why she's like this towards you.

SPEAKER_04 2:13:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:13:52

That would be a good thing.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:53

And that's and that's where I have regrets, is like it was was me being so brutal in court when we were 20 and we were splitting up the reason that she and him have a tarnished relationship and probably will forever. You know, because I took I took those bonding years away from her being vicious in court.

SPEAKER_08 2:14:15

It sounds like a person that's like a legit sociopath or like there wouldn't have been like good maternal bonding. That was not a realistic thing that was gonna happen. Yeah. If someone really is a fucking sociopath, and like it's a completely insane film that's like so overacted. But have you ever seen Mommy Dearest? No. Oh wait, is that the it's it's fucking the craziest. Like, you need to watch it. It's so so crazy, but um oh, what's the broad's name? It's a famous actress, and it's like about her, she adopted these kids. And the first couple, she was like a monster towards the the older ones, and then the younger ones she's nice to, so like in their writing about it and telling their tale of it, like the younger ones are like, she was never like that, she was totally fine to us, blah blah blah. And then the older ones are like, no, she's a fucking psychopath towards us and so abusive and scary. Um what the fuck is the actress's name? I'd have to look it up. I'd have to look it up. But mommy dearest is like what you're describing, and it's so horrific to think that a mom see.

SPEAKER_03 2:15:26

I'm hesitant to like I'm hesitant to be like, it's absolutely all her. Like there is no you're too like our relationship was so Joan Crawford. Joan Crawford, our relationship was so toxic.

SPEAKER_08 2:15:38

Yeah, well both both of you had very like fucked up ideals of how you're in a relationship, and then to put a baby in the middle of it, like that's like anybody I've seen, like we have a couple friends that they already were so gross together, and then they'll have a kid, and it's like to bring another human being into a situation and be like, this'll help, we'll be better people. Like that's such an unrealistic thing to think that that's gonna ever save a relationship where it's like such an extra stress and extra complications of constant thinking about all this other shit that you oh man, it's so it's so hard, but it's just sad that that's the way she is towards him, is like so awful.

SPEAKER_05 2:16:25

But I feel like it has gotten better. It's more of a friend.

SPEAKER_08 2:16:32

Because maybe, you know, she's growing up too. Like that sucks that she it sounds like she had a really fucked up life too. And some people like you get raised into being a monster instead of like you have to grow into being a decent person, and that could take a lot of time and a lot of unpacking for someone else to do. It's just a crazy thing to think about.

SPEAKER_03 2:16:53

But yeah. I hopefully it continues to get better. I mean, there's so much, there's so much to unpack that it's like it there's so much shit that isn't even.

SPEAKER_08 2:17:02

But it sounds like he's he's like really smart and uh empathetic that he even had that thought as a little kid to think that like that he sees that he's being treated different. And hopefully he'll like grow as he's growing and learning more about the world, that he realizes like she was super damaged. Like this this wasn't completely directed towards him, and you guys had a contentious relationship, and that's really fucking hard. But he seems like he's gets it. Like some little kids are so wise to shit. How I said they get energy, they get certain situations, and they can read people way more. Like, people are always like, kids are dumb. I'm like, his youngest kicks up are super smart about emotional sensitivity stuff. Like it's really crazy to see how they can read a room. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 2:17:53

You said the youngest is like the youngest picks up on a lot of stuff, and he like is very like intuitive. Well, it's boy, girl, boy. Okay. Yeah, but he'll like ask questions that I don't even like think about. I don't know. Yeah, I mean, like he'll be completely outside the situation.

SPEAKER_08 2:18:13

You're like, wait a minute, what?

SPEAKER_05 2:18:14

So my brother passed away before I met them. And so like but he know, like every time we're at my parents' house, he'll like ask different questions.

SPEAKER_08 2:18:22

Like, oh are there pictures of him up and stuff that he sees, but he like knows that he existed at least and like knows the situation.

SPEAKER_05 2:18:28

Yeah, and he'll be like, So which which bedroom was his? Like oh like he saw like a like a basketball hoop on the wall, and he was like, Oh, this had to have been Alex's room because he he let he must have liked basketball, like stuff like that.

SPEAKER_08 2:18:45

Like he just funny where they're observational, and like it's funny when you have a kid that remembers something that is like, Oh, we talked about this, or this happened when you were like four, but then they'll bring it up and be like, Remember blah blah blah? I'm like, Yeah, he's like that. Like, what? But we have a couple, a couple of our friends' kids, and I feel like our one little like nephew is very much like that. Like, he remembers shit that I'm like pre-long-term memory shit that I'm like, wait, what? Like, this hasn't happened in like six years, but he'll think about something, and that's weird to have that like observational awareness of like, oh, this was his basketball hoop. He liked basketball, and and to ask what room was his is wild.

SPEAKER_03 2:19:26

Like it's funny because like when you're when you're raising kids, a lot of the times you're just trying to get through something to like just the day, get I mean, just like survive the day. Hey, we're gonna go to dinner, let's just get through dinner without anyone. No one ever meltdown and we like eat and but it like I mean it's like the smell of the roses thing where you're like you forget to be observational as an adult because you're trying to keep the plate spinning.

SPEAKER_08 2:19:50

The one kid that like stops and picks up a worm off the sidewalk, and that kind of thing of like just being present, of being in a moment of something is so interesting to watch kids go about their day.

SPEAKER_03 2:20:01

We walked into a a fucking steak like a steak joint, and he looked up on the wall and he goes behind the hostess, and he goes, You guys have a bunch of cars, but they don't like they're not similar cars. Are those lost cars? And she goes, Yeah, do you want one? Like those are like that kids left like little Hot Wheels.

SPEAKER_05 2:20:21

And he's like, Yeah. I wouldn't have even like I thought they were just a part of their decor. Like I didn't even think about the fact that it was.

SPEAKER_03 2:20:28

Hey, those cars aren't similar to each other, so they're not a simple collection. So are those lost?

SPEAKER_05 2:20:35

Yeah, like he's super smart.

SPEAKER_08 2:20:38

It's crazy stuff to think that like a little kid, like his brain is working on a different level. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:20:45

I just I hope that uh me and my siblings were how many siblings? Uh there was three of us originally, and then everyone got or my parents got divorced and remarried, so then you have all the extra, yeah, like all the extraneous people of half siblings.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:02

Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:21:02

Well, it's all steps. We don't have any halves.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:04

Oh, okay, okay. But the uh But then you have like a Brady Bunch situation going on on both sides. Yeah. Yeah. But the uh so me and my Everybody gets along pretty good? No. No, no, it's fucking horribly toxic. Oh that's another podcast.

SPEAKER_03 2:21:23

That's a whole other podcast. But uh But I love it, I love it. My mom's side is very like I love my mom. They're like much more than my step siblings on the well-adjusted kids. Great people. Yeah, great people.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:34

They're your stepdad was cool and like he has good kids.

SPEAKER_03 2:21:38

That's gonna make me emotional.

unknown 2:21:40

Ah!

SPEAKER_03 2:21:41

You fucking Jeeves, what are you doing to him? This is a therapy session. Seriously.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:45

I'm my notepad.

SPEAKER_03 2:21:47

My stepdad is the first positive, accountable, how old, honest male role model I ever had. Oh.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:59

How old were you when this happened? Fifteen.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:03

Fifteen or so, fourteen. Yeah. And but I actually got kicked out of my mom's house like young because I was being a real scumbag. Oh. Stealing money from her, stealing cigarettes, stealing fucking booze from her, whatever. I'm like, you know, being a kid in Roseville, basically. And I got kicked out.

SPEAKER_08 2:22:20

You were what Kid Rock wanted to be as a public.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:22

Yeah, I was like actually living, I was like, yeah. You're the American baddest. They don't even know the shit, like half the shit I would.

SPEAKER_08 2:22:29

Oh, I think about shit that my parents don't know. Because I was like pretty good. I have to say, I was pretty good. I never really got in real trouble. Like, but I think about shit that I was getting up to, and I'm like, man, I'm so lucky that I never like really fucked up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:42

The the closest we had to having a real big fuck up is we me and my sister and brother had a house party when my mom was out of town one time. And uh so we had like, and my brother's seven years older than me.

SPEAKER_08 2:22:55

My sister So he could go get a keg and shit. We were all fucked up.

SPEAKER_03 2:22:59

How he's seven years older, my sister's three years older, and we have all of our friend groups are at the house.

SPEAKER_08 2:23:04

So there's like that's a big mix of different not okay to be with a bunch of 14-year-old girls and shit. Yeah, yeah. Not okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:23:12

Yeah, the so the real problem was is that my sister like hit on a dude that was working the Taco Bell drive-thru, and he came with a how much older is she? Three years older. So she was like 16 or 17 at the time. But this dude's like a car and a job. He actually ended up being a good dude. Oh, okay. His name's Dave Canada. Shout out Dave Canada. All right, that's good. Uh his friend was a fucking scumbag. Okay. So Dave shows up and he's a good dude. As far as I know, my sister might call me after this and be like, he was a fucking rapist or something. But as far as I know, Dave Canada was a good dude. Dave Canada was a good guy, isn't it? Uh so but Dave shows up, he brings a buddy who is a black guy. The only black guy that shows up to the party. And my brothers, who's seven years older than me, three and a half years older than my sister. Yeah. Uh his buddies are making jokes. They weren't. No, no, they were all metalheads, all like sweet dudes. That's different.

SPEAKER_08 2:24:10

But one guy was Pucks and metalheads are like never racist dudes. Like it's really weird if you get like the random skinhead dude, but it's not the norm.

SPEAKER_03 2:24:19

So not the norm. One of my brother's friends was making jokes that were not landing right. Oh and he's like, uh, and taunted. So me and did I pull it? I didn't. Me and one of stepping on it. Me and one of his uh buddies are me and one of my brother's buddies are playing guitar here in the basement. Yeah. We hear this commotion upstairs.

SPEAKER_09 2:24:38

Oh no, there's just a big fucking fight.

SPEAKER_03 2:24:40

And we're like, what the fuck's going on? So like we run upstairs.

SPEAKER_08 2:24:43

We've had some house parties where there's been a fucking brawl breaks out.

SPEAKER_03 2:24:46

What we get not okay. We give up, we get upstairs right when the the the black eye, my mom, it was Halloween time, and my mom has all these little ceramic Halloween houses that she puts around the house. Yeah. And the I got up there as soon as the black eye swung and smacked one of the houses, and the house flew past my head and hit the guy who I was playing guitar here with. We just got upstairs right in the mouth, it broke all of his teeth. And he's like, You want to call me this? You want to call me that? And we're like, Whoa, what the fuck? We're doing it. And he like punches my brother in the face. My brother goes, What the fuck did I do?

SPEAKER_08 2:25:22

And uh You're like, You're at my house.

SPEAKER_03 2:25:24

So then, like, it was like all of us like grab him and throw him off the front off the front porch. We had a big brother like this. This guy, this guy's flipping out. He's like, They're racist. And we're like, no, we're fucking not. What the fuck happened? Well, it came out that like our friend was making racist jokes. He's a fucking idiot. You should have punched him. You punched the wrong guy, you broke the wrong guy's teeth. And uh, so we throw him out the front porch, close the door, lock it, and the guy picks up a fucking brick, like a brick paver that was around my mom's garden, picks up a brick paver and tries to throw it through the bay window, which is like a five foot by foot. Dave fucking tackled his arm right when it was happening. He's like, No, no, no, no, no, no, no, and stopped it from happening. And he'd have to shut up Dave Canada. Shut up. Well, I don't know. He might be a scumbag. I'd have to ask my sister. He saw it in my buggy. See the fucking picture of the bay window. That bay window got broken. Like your mom would have killed all of them. She would have fucking she found out about it because Ryan. Ryan's teeth got fucking smashed. All of his teeth were broken. Uh he had to get like dent, like completely. Legit implant. Yeah, yeah. I think the front six teeth were fucking smashed right out of his face. And me and him were playing guitar hero 30 seconds before it happened. He had nothing to do with that. How old is he?

SPEAKER_08 2:26:37

He's like fucking 13, too. He no, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_03 2:26:40

That was my brother's friend. He was like 20. Oh, okay, okay. But yeah, holy shit. And oh my god, the amount of shit that we the amount of shit that my mom doesn't even know about that we This is when she's a single mom, so she's out of town.

SPEAKER_08 2:26:53

And then this dude comes into her life, so she starts dating this guy when you're 15, or they got married when you were 15.

SPEAKER_03 2:26:59

Um, they might have got I think they got married when I was 17.

SPEAKER_08 2:27:02

But this is like the first solid figure in your life, dude, your stepdad.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:08

I'm gonna say my dad, my dad has a moral compass that he preaches.

SPEAKER_08 2:27:14

But the shit talking shit on your mom and going back and forth with that and putting you guys in the middle is like not okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:20

I mean, like my dad definitely had a moral compass that he was trying to instill on us, but there was a lot there was so much drama in the family that it was like, hey, that's not who you actually are, or like or like that's not what you know, that's not what you're showing us to do. Yeah, you're just telling us to act this way, but you're not doing that, you know.

SPEAKER_08 2:27:40

Yeah, you lead by example, not by what you're saying. Like that's what's such a fun and weird thing that people do to kids.

SPEAKER_03 2:27:47

Yeah, and then my stepdad comes into my life, and then he's like the most solid, accountable, mostly I mean, there was, you know, he's there there's issues like there is with anybody, but he's for like 99% of the time, he's a extremely accountable guy who's like, Yeah, this is how we should do it. Well, and he's figuring shit out too. Yeah, and and to have a guy who owes me nothing. I mean, I was almost an adult when I met him, and he's been the like him and my mom are the only two people who have consistently been in my corner through all the shit that I've been through. Yeah, it's like I'll fucking kill for that. That's a lot, you know. The guy owes me nothing. If his last name wasn't so fucking hard to spell, I probably would have changed my last name to his name. I'm not kidding.

SPEAKER_08 2:28:36

But a a good a good guy and somebody who's a good dad, like that doesn't matter if it's their actual child or not. Like, he's not gonna let you fucking drown. Right. You know, that's somebody who's a good dude is gonna take care of everyone.

SPEAKER_03 2:28:52

Yeah, but he's gone he's gone above and beyond the the like oh you should help. It's like but that's part of loving your mom.

SPEAKER_08 2:28:58

Like, if he's a legit good dude and he loves your mom, he's gonna take good care of you guys too.

SPEAKER_03 2:29:03

That doesn't which he always has, yeah. He has in spite of our behavior.

SPEAKER_08 2:29:08

Yeah, which but he's understanding where you're coming from. If you were coming out of all that crazy shit that was going on, yeah, that's a lot, like yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:29:17

I mean, there's a lot of shit that I did that I that like, man, I'm like, what the fuck was I thinking of? But you know, I'm I don't want to undercut it and be like, well, I was a kid, but I was a kid and I made some fucking weird decisions. I stole. I mean, my mom had like a two-dollar bill collection. I fucking stole it. Uh yeah. Just stole hundreds of dollars in two dollar bills and spent it on bullshit like buying a buddy's bike from him and like buying cigarettes or whatever. Yeah. Like spent hundreds of dollars of her collection in two dollar bills, just for you know what I mean.

SPEAKER_08 2:29:46

I love how you had a two-dollar bill and I was at like it might have been like a tackle bill or some bullshit like that, and they're like, this is fake. I'm like, it's not, but all right, like I can spend other money, but I'm like, why did I try to spend that? Yeah, it's probably worth fucking four bucks.

SPEAKER_07 2:30:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_09 2:30:04

It's funny to think about that. It's like a whole collection of two dollar bills where you're like, hell yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:09

Right. I think she probably heard that like they were gonna stop making them, so they're gonna be worth it.

SPEAKER_08 2:30:13

She's like hoarding them, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:15

Yeah, and I was like, I'll steal them.

SPEAKER_08 2:30:17

Man, when I waited tables, I would get silver coins all the time. And I had like, do you know those dollar bills that'll be like a silver mint, whatever dollar bill, so it has like a blue stamp on it instead of all green. And I my dad is like such a coin nerd, so I knew what to look for, but I'm like, man, this person thinks they left me like 75 cents, and I'm like, they left me like a$20 tip because it's all silver coins and like just keeping your eye peeled on stuff like that. But yeah, I wonder if two dollar bills and the people are gonna start hoarding pennies now. Oh yeah, no, people are gonna start fucking hoarding pennies and stuff, and it's like uh I was just joking about that.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:54

Like, how many how many bars are gonna peel up their epoxy fucking penny tables now?

SPEAKER_08 2:30:58

Oh yeah, like the whole bar is all penny. It's like, oh my god, it's a million dollars.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:02

What did we do?

SPEAKER_08 2:31:04

People are so funny, start melting it.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:06

Yeah, start melting the epoxy. Yeah, God. So wild.

SPEAKER_08 2:31:11

Yeah what a like it's nice that you had you were lucky that you had that come into your life to have a good solid influence because that's making you a good dad, too. And that's what I mean about a good dude's gonna know that how much that influences your life and how much that helps you. And that's especially if you you know you're trying to figure it out to be a good parent too. Like that's saving so much generational trauma, just being around and being like decent. Not even above and beyond or whatever, like just being decent to somebody else's kids that aren't yours. Like it's wild how many people don't see that and don't fucking figure that out or don't ever don't understand like trying.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:57

Dude, I the amount of people that don't work on themselves, and I'm like, you know what's fucked up about you, but why are you choosing to like stay bitter and angry and fucked up? Yeah. Like you like you know what you went through as a kid, and you're like you're staying this way.

SPEAKER_08 2:32:11

That's I just yeah, that's people that I said, like a a couple that we were friends with that we're not friends with anymore, that they like brought a kid into their gross toxic ass relationship, and then I had like another friend that recently was like splitting up and like young kids and just being a fucking asshole. And it's like it's your friend, so you just like want to be okay, but also being a friend is like calling people out on their bullshit. Yeah, like you aren't gonna help them grow as a person with just agreeing and being like whatever, it's cool, man. Like, do whatever you want. Like, no, you need to if you're a real good friend and you have to be like, hey, you're fucking up your life, and you're gonna fuck up your kids' lives. Like, don't let parents do shit that you see that's like I'm in a tricky position not being a parent, but I'm also like, I'm a kid from a very like weird relationship where my parents are still together, but it was a lot of fucking crazy shit when I was a kid. And I'm like, don't fuck your kids up by being a selfish, selfish asshole. Like, you need to fucking not play that game. That's parents that like how you said talk shit about the other parent and start all this drama and like put the kids in the middle and the kids a pawn in in playing these games is like don't fucking do that. That's so gross, it's so fucking crazy. That's like a big credit to like my fiance's mom. Like she's past now, but when I first started coming around, I'm like, he's like 19 when we first started hanging out, and his mom didn't say shit about their dad until they were older adults. Like their dad was like a party animal, a fucking maniac, like on drugs, drinking, like he was a problem. And he would talk shit on her, where it's like, well, she's the stable one. She's the one that like has a house and not a trailer, and they Have support and get to school. And it's like you, he was a friend dad, yeah. How you said, like he was their buddy, not their dad. He's like you go over, like I started going over there. I'm like 16, we're all underage drinking at his house. It's like you come in, and other friends of ours that are even younger than us are like shit housed already when you get there, and it's like this is not okay. Like, we're so lucky that nothing ever happened, like, really, like Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:34:28

Yeah, no kidding. Dude, I'm so crazy. It's funny looking back, like uh now that I'm I feel like I'm like almost kind of repeating history with my parents and trying to take lessons.

SPEAKER_08 2:34:39

Yeah, the cycle repeats itself, and that's where you have to like break generational trauma is just figuring that out and like cutting it off before it happens. Yeah. Because you'll see shit that you do that, like I see shit that I say to my like little nieces and nephews, and I'm like, oh I'm so my mom. It is so crazy. Like, I'm so my mom and how I talk to kids and stuff.

SPEAKER_03 2:34:58

Dude, and I and I I grew up like when I was like a you know teenager into like early teens, I hated my mom because I had like fully fucking drank the Kool-Aid.

SPEAKER_08 2:35:08

Well, if you think everything's her fault because he's fucking feeding that into your head, and that's what I mean about you talking about your ex around your kids, is like you're learning how they're learning how to speak about women and how to treat women, and you have to like fucking proceed with caution because you don't want them to be a piece of shit like that.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:27

Like you don't want them and we and have that cycle back. We had to have a conversation one time because she was kind of upset with me because I defended. You said something. Oh I defended my own.

SPEAKER_08 2:35:37

But that's not letting her have like not letting your ex have that toxic behavior where you have to.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:42

I was like, hey, hold on. If if like and you weren't like, I don't know if you remember this conversation, but like we were like, I don't know. You were like, What like why are you being neutral in this?

SPEAKER_08 2:35:54

Like she I think we were talking one-on-one, but I was like, hey, if you guys aren't around the kids, but then you have to be like But I was like, All right, but we have to like let them know that her behavior is not okay either, because that's a very difficult thing to navigate to, like, right.

SPEAKER_03 2:36:07

But I was like, I remember saying to you, like, hey, like, if we don't work out, how would you want me to talk about you? Oh, yeah. Like, even though she's even though she's being a scumbag, I'm not letting her fuck with my life. I'm not gonna like I'm still gonna have boundaries. I'm not gonna let her run our lives and like diff dictate what happens in our lives. But also you get comfortable with certain words coming out of your mouth, and if it is so hard to do it. If we just relentlessly talk shit about her in private, it's gonna leak into our kids' ears. Well, and it slips out.

SPEAKER_08 2:36:43

And when you're mad or something and it slips out, and you're like, I wish I didn't know.

SPEAKER_03 2:36:47

And it does happen, but like I don't want to get in the habit of Yeah, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_08 2:36:51

Especially the little. You've been like the best like diplomatic person throughout the whole thing. Like you were like jumping in where you're like, she's getting better, she's just she's working on herself. Like you've been the most diplomatic on everything. Where I'm like, what's this bitch taking to this kid? I'm like, what is this non-year-old having his head covered?

SPEAKER_03 2:37:13

I think we were having a conversation about like how we were gonna go about something. And you were like, I would hope that you'd give me that much grace or something like that. And I was like, I don't remember exactly the context of it.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:24

Well, just like if you guys split up at all, like how you would talk about how you would like approach it with them or something like that, it sounds like.

SPEAKER_03 2:37:31

I I don't I don't remember exactly. I think it was yeah, I think it was basically like, hey, we're we're gonna do this, and you're like I think you I think it was about the house and me not suing her out of the house.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:46

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:37:46

Okay and and uh and and you were like, I hope you'd I don't think you'd let me get away with everything you've let her get away with.

SPEAKER_05 2:37:54

I probably did say something.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:55

And I was like, but she like if she legit did, especially when you guys owned a home together so young and you had that babe, like that's a lot of hair. She got a lot of people that you have to deal with. She got away with a lot of stuff.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:06

There's a lot, yeah. There's some shit we'll talk about. We can talk about off mic. But there's I mean, there's there's I don't have a relationship with my dad's side of the family because of her.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:20

Because they chose her, chose to believe her bullshit.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:25

Yo, over you might when you were trying to fucking protect your kid and like keep your kids safe.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:33

Before that, I was there's a whole story. Alright, alright, alright.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:37

There's a bunch of shit I don't know, but it's wild to have family that's like your actual family do that shit. Where like Well, because my dad's a pussy. There's like friends.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:46

He's a fucking pussy.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:47

I've had like friend breakups and stuff, and people when they pick sides, it's so strange. My dad's so strange to me when people pick sides.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:57

Yeah. He I've said this a million different ways, but you guys have no relationship now, or is he?

SPEAKER_08 2:39:02

Oh, he has a phony one where he'll show up to my kids' birthday. But he comes to comes around for the kids.

SPEAKER_05 2:39:08

I've probably seen him. I can probably count the amount of times on both hands. Yeah. And we're getting married. And we're getting married.

SPEAKER_08 2:39:15

She's a meant half my second. Dude, that's like me and Nick being together forever. Like Nick and I we're engaged, but I'm like, whenever we do our wedding where there's like most of his family on the dad's side, that I'm like, oh, I've seen this cousin four times in 20 years. Yeah. Literal fucking like over 20 years, and they're like, We want to invite blah blah blah and this, that, and the other. I'm like, uh, you aren't even fucking invited. Like, are you out of your fucking mind?

SPEAKER_05 2:39:39

His steps, his steps I've never met.

SPEAKER_08 2:39:42

I've been around for a long fucking time. And if you wanted to be involved in our lives, you would have. Like, there's Chancer Rapper said it best.

SPEAKER_03 2:39:50

I don't want no one at my wedding that won't be there for my marriage.

unknown 2:39:54

Dude.

SPEAKER_08 2:39:55

That's some wild shit because that was like Nick's brother got married and had this big, like, beautiful, elaborate wedding at this, like, um, it was like a country club, like a real fucking nice venue. And the one cousin is like just causing problems in this shit. And he's like, he called, he wanted his girlfriend who he hadn't even been with long, wanted his girlfriend's kids to come. To like, it's like 125 bucks a plate or whatever the fuck. Guess how old these kids are?

unknown 2:40:23

Oh god.

SPEAKER_08 2:40:24

Three, 17 and 19. And he's like, Well, if they can't come, I'm not fucking coming. And he's like, Okay, like don't. They can stay home. And I was like, that's something that like Nick's brother's so fucking nice, but I'm not. And I'm like, no, like, I've seen this motherfucker three times, and like that at that time was probably like 16 years into our relationship. And I'm like, he calls you and he's like trying to sell you an Xbox that's hot or he wants money or whatever. And I was like, whatever about this fucker. But he ends up showing up, so him and his like stripper girlfriend, trash come, and they're at this nice, nice fucking place. He's in a wife beater in fucking khaki shorts. Jesus Christ. At a fucking wedding, at a fucking, like, it's literally like some kind of fucking country club. And and they end up causing a fucking scene throughout the whole thing. Of course. And that's I put my foot down on ours where I'm like, I we have no plans. I'm like, I don't give two shits about anything with wedding stuff. I'm not that kind of bruh. It's in this. If you like it, great. Good for you. I don't, it's just not my thing. And we have all these people that are like, we're gonna be at this thing and this thing. And I'm like, uh, what? No. Like, I've seen you like fucking three times in 20 years. Like, yeah, are you on fucking crack? Like, I'm having a hard time with that girl. He I go out of my way to try and set shit up with people where like he has people that are like up in the UP, and like his one cousin and aunt are up in the UP, and they literally are like around the corner from my dad's family that we're actually going to see. And I give them like a heads up like a month ahead of time, and then the day that we're supposed to hang, they're like, Oh, we went to the beach, we went to da da da.

SPEAKER_03 2:42:04

We're doing something we could do any other day.

SPEAKER_08 2:42:06

Fucking any day? Yeah. And we're up there for a week and you fucked off when I like made I'm the coordinator, you know, I'm the fucking plan maker, reach out, talk to everybody, do all these plans. And I'm like, dude, if you didn't fucking like get it together to even bother to have like I'm like, well, after the beach, do you want to like we can swing by like we're around the corner? And they're like, oh, we'll be too tired. I'm like, these people don't give a fuck about you. Like it's it and that that's that shit with the kid, that's that shit with the mom, the parents. I'm like, if your cousins and your auntie who loves you and cares for you, like can't even fucking make an hour or two hours to do whatever the fuck, like that fake uh that like fake caring about someone is so fucking frustrating to watch as like the outside observer, where like I went out of my way to make these plans and you don't give a fuck about my dude, where I like care too much about this situation happening. Yeah, it's so fucking enraging to me, and I'm not that nice to like forgive that. I'm like, no, they had plenty of fucking time to figure it out. I gave them a month's warning of like us being around, and they it sounds like you have shit going on like that.

SPEAKER_05 2:43:19

She's more forgiving about it, I feel like, than I am.

SPEAKER_08 2:43:21

I'm having a hard time with it. Because I'm like, I've never met these people. You have your family you make, you have your friends that are your family, and you have that family that you make, and they give a shit and they'll really go out of their way for you, and you have that like blood, and trying to invest that time because it's blood is fucking hot.

SPEAKER_03 2:43:42

I woke up, I had a dream.

SPEAKER_05 2:43:44

I don't know if you should tell this dream.

SPEAKER_03 2:43:46

I'm telling it. Fuck it. What am I gonna do? I'm gonna pretend I I don't lie because I grew up around liars, so fuck them.

SPEAKER_08 2:43:54

It's not your fault that they do the shit that gets things in your psyche that be dreaming about shit.

SPEAKER_03 2:44:00

I had a dream that we were at our wedding, right? And I had invited all the people that I was socially obligated to invite. Which is such horse. And I fed them. Yeah, and then I got up and I was like, hey, uh you, you, you, you, and I listed off like 30 people and I go meet me on the dance floor, and then I go, Your time here's up. I've met my social obligation. Now get the fuck out of my wedding. And I was like, I'm gonna do this for real.

SPEAKER_08 2:44:30

Give your lizard brain, that part of your lizard brain that's protecting you is working. It's working. You need to listen to it.

SPEAKER_03 2:44:36

There's so much shit I want to say.

SPEAKER_08 2:44:38

You need to you need to listen to that.

SPEAKER_03 2:44:40

Yeah, I I don't I don't want them at the wedding, but I'm socially obligated to invite my dad and his fucking pack of retards from Westland. Wow. I can't I get it.

SPEAKER_08 2:44:51

Yeah, I I said I've said it on stage twice. Like I don't like saying it. I'm sorry, I don't like saying it. I try not to, but I get when you're like when you have people that are like fucking just trash, that's those like cousins and Knicks that I'm like, they're fucking trash. They only talk to you like they literally only talk to you and act like they care about you when they want something or they want to sell you fucking Xbox and they're like gonna go buy Percocets and shit. And I'm like, you don't have to deal with that, you are not indebted to them in any way. If they wanted to be part of your life, they would have fucking made a point to be part of your life, and you have to you have to fucking let that go. I know that's so like oh, that's so much to like absorb and be like, all right, just fucking rip the bandage off.

SPEAKER_03 2:45:37

Not only are they not involved, they were actively colluding though to have this right.

SPEAKER_08 2:45:46

They actively colluded. Then you need to fucking cut them off. Like fucking rip the bandage off.

SPEAKER_05 2:45:53

But invited her to Christmas, dude.

SPEAKER_08 2:45:55

That's a fucking crazy move.

SPEAKER_03 2:45:57

So that I couldn't because of a PPO I had against my ex. I couldn't go to my own family's fucking holiday.

SPEAKER_08 2:46:06

That's such a fucking crazy thing to choose. That's uh such a choice for them to do, and they like and we wanted the kids to come and we didn't want them on.

SPEAKER_03 2:46:16

So they couldn't come with you? Which I've never missed a holiday. I've never missed a holiday on it. You couldn't bring your own children? Well, we didn't want them to miss out on anything. And we know that you wouldn't have shown up. I haven't missed a single holiday until family shit, dude.

SPEAKER_08 2:46:30

That was like just shit going on in that side of the family how I'm talking about that like the grandma is sick, and it's like we need to go see her, but to deal with the fucking aunt who's like created all these narratives with our sister-in-law that I'm like I don't want to get into it obviously here to air that, but I'm like, this is a fucking person that just makes so many problems that I'm like, these people literally go out of their way to make drama, and with people that they shouldn't fucking Nick and my my brother-in-law are like two of the nicest, fucking accepting, cool, like the best people, and they just go out of their way to cause shit with them. And it's like, why? Why some people fucking love drama like that?

SPEAKER_03 2:47:14

Like so, I'm I'm like a viciously honest person, and yeah, and not like I'm just gonna be I'm I'm not gonna be I don't do it as a malicious thing, but I'm like, dude, I'm gonna speak my mind.

SPEAKER_08 2:47:24

That's what I mean. Yeah. Oh my beaver, I'm gonna speak my mind because this shit, like people not talking about it and people being polite because it's family. Yeah, that's why these people fucking get away with acting like this all the time. Like you need to like talk about it.

SPEAKER_03 2:47:38

That's so that's such a shitty thing that you're like holding people accountable, I think, is way more malicious than being the guy who's holding someone accountable for being a lying sack of shit.

SPEAKER_08 2:47:47

We had this beef once, like Nick's grandma and I had this beef because I said something like Nick's mom was unemployed, and I said something at this like group, and I'm like, whatever, she's fucking staying down there. She's unemployed. Like, what the fuck? But she acted like I was like bad mouthing her. She's like, Well, what if I went and told everybody your dad's an alcoholic? And da-da-da. And I was like, I fucking talk about my dad being an alcoholic. Like, what's the thing? You're gonna find me with the truth? Yeah, literally, you don't talk about it, and you're gonna like use it as a weaponizer. Like, I talk about it out loud. Who gives a fuck? Like, that's I didn't do it. Well, that he doesn't drink now, like he's recovered. Like, it was just such a weird, like, turn of like someone who's so nice, but then something made her mad. She like you see who she really is. She like turned it on me to be like, it was such a bizarre thing to see that like that like uh facade change. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:48:41

Well, I think that's what's so freeing about being viciously honest, is like, oh, you don't have anything that I don't talk about.

SPEAKER_08 2:48:47

Hiding shit, I don't care because it's doing comedy too, where like people I talk about. I go on all these shows and like talk about myself and my relationship and like all this shit, and then people be like, what about or I'm gonna use this on a roast? I'm like, I don't like I anything that I want private, private, I'm never saying out loud, and 99% of the shit that's in my head I'll just say like who cares? Right, a human being, whatever, like who cares? But to weaponize it against somebody, and that shit saying that you wouldn't come with your kids is so fucking wild to do to someone.

SPEAKER_03 2:49:21

Oh yeah. Yeah, there's a whole fucking narrative around that that like it's it's like the most boring ghetto ass Westland horror version of Game of Thrones. But I sorry, but I don't get why I'm that this revolves around my fucking dad and his wife and his family.

SPEAKER_08 2:49:42

Did she worsen it when she came into the picture? Did that worsen it? Way worse. Yeah, that sucks. Because you got the you got both sides of the coin that you have the stepdad that's like great, amazing, and then you have the stepmom that's the evil stepmom. You have the Cinderella story.

SPEAKER_03 2:49:56

Treated my sister like shit.

SPEAKER_08 2:49:58

My sister's different, and she treated my sister because you had three siblings, but it's like the oldest, your sister's the middle, and you're the youngest. You have the same setup with your three kids, too, because it's a big age gap. Yeah, and it's a big age gap. Oh, yeah. But that sucks to be fucking that's so gross to me when an adult comes into the situation and is gross.

SPEAKER_03 2:50:17

Like shitting on the kids is such a wild she was she was okay in a lot of situations, like most situations, she was okay. But as we've gotten older, it's gotten more and more toxic and worse and more aggressively against her.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:37

Oh, yeah. So her kids, her kids they're prince and princesses, and yeah, fuck up.

SPEAKER_03 2:50:42

Yeah, one of them one of them is successful, so she rides that dick hard. One of them's a fuck up, and she helps that one constantly making excuses. And the other one is neutral. The other one is has a has severe anxiety issues, and babies that one. And he needs it.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:03

But you need feeding into it though. How is she towards your kids? She's nice towards your kids. I don't know. Sure. Or you don't get to see it. I don't see it. Because she's with the mom, like they're with the mom.

SPEAKER_03 2:51:15

Yeah, they're buddied up. They're fucking so fucking crazy. There was text messages. My ex's phone got shut off. It's so crazy. My ex's phone got shut off. And my oldest had a cell phone, and I I check his phone once in a while. Oh, and there's a lot of money. There was text messages from my ex to my stepmom where they're colluding against me to get me arrested so that she can win in custody. Even though you'd already had custody of the first kid.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:41

And then this is now a good thing.

SPEAKER_03 2:51:42

By the way, I was with the I spent anytime they needed anything, I would go over there and help, bust my ass, fixing something around their house, doing what I could. And they would I mean I would ask them for help and like I don't know. My dad would do like bare minimum shit to help me as like a young guy with three kids.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:59

Literally, like, can you like come by and hang out? Will I like go grocery? Grocery shopping. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:52:04

Yeah, well, we can't. Oh, I don't know. You know, she's got you know, she's having a hard time, and I I have a broken ankle and bullshit, all bullshit.

SPEAKER_05 2:52:12

But like I then as soon as his ex says, Hey, can you come help?

SPEAKER_03 2:52:16

Oh, yeah, no, no hesitation at all. And like, I don't need people in my life to help me.

SPEAKER_08 2:52:22

Well, but there's like But like as a young guy, some expected like with three kids for fucking grandparents to just like lift a finger is like such a it's not a huge ask. Zero like no help. It's not a huge ask to ask to be like, yo, can you hang out while I go grocery? It's not like you're like, I'm going on a fucking bachelor party for a whole weekend. Can you come stay with three kids? Like go into the grocery stores, like they know.

SPEAKER_03 2:52:48

No, I mean no to like and they when we when we split up, they now they watch because my ex works midnights, they watch my kids for her like three three days a week.

SPEAKER_05 2:53:02

But won't for us.

SPEAKER_03 2:53:03

They don't do anything for me. They don't do anything for me. They don't help me, they don't talk, they don't even they don't even don't even talk to me. Yeah, it's it's infuriating.

SPEAKER_08 2:53:12

And what's the custody situation? Like, how often does she have them?

SPEAKER_03 2:53:16

She has the two little ones two and a half days a week. And you have full custody, the oldest one still? I do, but she he's been going there recently. He'll go with them. Now he's now he's starting to do that, but I think it's because he wants the freedom of her house. So he gets to like monster and stay up all night. He's like not in the video games all night. Then he comes home miserable for a day and a half.

SPEAKER_08 2:53:36

Yeah, well then he's like and then he straightens back out to he has to sober up on dad's time, like go through detox from monsters.

SPEAKER_03 2:53:42

Literally. Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's no joke. It's true. It's true. Yeah, and and oh I it's it's just asinine. The only person on that side of the family who's ever defended me, and I heard about it was my little brother, my my brother that's 10 months younger than me. Yeah, but it was her kid. That's her kid. Yeah. Her step sibling. Flipped out on everyone on Christmas and said, Why the fuck is this bitch here and Matt's not here? Yeah, good. This is Matt's kids, this is Matt's family. Why the fuck is she here?

SPEAKER_08 2:54:13

This is like this past Christmas or a couple a while ago?

SPEAKER_03 2:54:16

Three years ago. He's the only one that I know that's defending me.

SPEAKER_08 2:54:19

Everyone else fucking gets it because everyone will never be like say shit, and it's like, you need to call people out on their bullshit. That's such a wild thing.

SPEAKER_03 2:54:29

Everyone else has exiled me from that.

SPEAKER_08 2:54:31

Especially if they know all the shit where she was like threatening your first kid and fucking being a maniac. They know all of it. She didn't want him around, and like how could you hear a nine-year-old say that he knows that he's getting treated different and he thinks that he's ugly or something's wrong with him? How could you fucking know that and then be on her fucking side?

SPEAKER_03 2:54:52

They know all of it. That's such a fucking they know all of it, and they picked her side. That's such a fucking Because my dad's back to my dad's a fucking pig. My dad's a bitch with no spine, and his wife decides where they go. What what his wife decides? I didn't know he was like so pussy whipped. He doesn't even like her. He's been talking shit about her since they got married to me. Oh, I mean, since they got married, he's been talking shit to me about her. I get you, I get you. Oh, you're fucking, I'm so sick of this, I'm gonna sell the house and move to Alaska. I'm not dealing with this no more. Blah, blah, blah. You're a bitch, dude. You play in the middle of the street, you get hit by books.

SPEAKER_08 2:55:31

What a wild way to behave as an adult. He's a man. He's a bitch.

SPEAKER_03 2:55:36

He's a liar and he's a bitch, dude.

SPEAKER_08 2:55:38

You're you're lucky you had the you'd it sucks you got the shitty side of it, but you also have the good side of it. So it's like you're so lucky to have like a good solid dude.

SPEAKER_03 2:55:47

There's two there's two steps of like Matt's recovery from being a fucking dumbass liar.

SPEAKER_08 2:55:52

Well, and imagine if that guy didn't come into your life where like he wasn't around at all. Like, who would you be? I'd be

SPEAKER_03 2:56:00

Mini my dad. Yeah. There's two there was two there were two steps into me becoming an accountable, honest man. And the first step was my mom marrying the man that she met. That was the first step of starting to see what a man is supposed to be.

SPEAKER_08 2:56:15

Have you ever told him that? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:56:17

Yeah. Oh, yeah. Good. And then being an apprentice working around a thousand dudes.

SPEAKER_08 2:56:23

Like thousand men. Yeah. Who are like, hold on.

SPEAKER_03 2:56:27

You're telling me you're coming to work and you're going to talk shit about your wife? Hold on. You're going to you're going to come to work and you're going to talk shit about your girlfriend.

SPEAKER_08 2:56:35

That's the kind of guy you're going to be. Dudes like that, bust balls, and like they'll call you out on shit. If you're not acting right, they'll straighten you up.

SPEAKER_03 2:56:43

You come to work, you talk shit about your kids.

SPEAKER_08 2:56:44

They're going to straighten you up.

SPEAKER_03 2:56:45

That's why you're fucking here suffering in hell at the steel mill. Yeah. Working, getting burned, welding pipe all fucking day. You're here suffering in hell, so you get to go home to those kids. You're going to come here and talk shit about them. Yeah. Like those are the kind of guys that will hold you accountable and change the way you think.

SPEAKER_07 2:56:59

They will call you out on shit.

SPEAKER_03 2:57:01

And those men are necessary, man. They're absolutely necessary. And they also like, wait, hold on. You're gonna you you let me get this straight. You don't have any money, but you're not gonna go to work on the weekend when it's offered. And you get like double time. Yeah, double time. It's like, come on, stupid. Like, hey, dum-dum. Wait, hold on. You're always complaining about money, but you go to the bar every break that it's offered, and then you spend your money on beer instead of keeping your money for your kids. Like those those men hold you accountable and they change the way you think.

SPEAKER_08 2:57:32

Well, and especially like that working class like that, and that's a tough job, and that's going through the whole apprenticeship and all that shit. Like, they know the struggle. They know what it's like because everyone there went through it. Yes, and all of them have a family, and they all like that's a bust ass job, and they're gonna fucking call you out on your shit when you're not acting right, which is it's important, it's good. It's lucky that you had that experience.

SPEAKER_03 2:57:55

It's important, and and and and it revealed to me how much bullshit I had in my mind that I thought was reality, and it's like, no, no, no, no, no, motherfucker. Let me show you the real way to do these things, and let me show you the real way to think. Like, let me show you the right way to go about this, the safe way to go about this.

SPEAKER_08 2:58:12

Yeah, you know, and those, I mean, those It's funny because in society where people shit on those people, where it's like any kind of grunt work or whatever, and they'll shit on those guys, and it's like these are the people that like make shit work in like the unsung hero of society of having any kind of job like that. Any kind of labor job is such a fucking thing of like how they push, push, push people to do a degree, and you want to do this, and you need to get go to be a doctor and go be a nurse and blah blah blah blah blah. And it's like the trades, it's such a funny thing until like I even think about it with like uh what was Mike Rowe's show? Dirty jobs, yeah, dirty jobs, more like showing and and focusing on tradespeople. And it's like, oh, they're fucking smart, they're well educated, they like busted their ass to do what they're doing, and it's such a funny thing to it's turning around. More people are getting into the trades now, but it's such a I was that generation of like, you have to go get a bachelor's degree, you have to do this in higher education, and da da da da. And I'm like, do you know how much I wish I did not fucking do a bachelor's degree and how long it took me to get my bachelor's degree because I was working the whole time, yeah, and I still owe a fucking stupid amount of money.

SPEAKER_03 2:59:32

I mean, not to this is not a put down on you, but she has a master Paige's a master's degree. Yeah. I have a master license as a steam fetter, and I make yeah, a lot.

SPEAKER_08 2:59:45

Oh, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_03 2:59:46

Like when she was a teacher and I was a journeyman pipe fitter, I was making uh three times as much as her.

SPEAKER_08 2:59:52

This last year I've been looking for a new job, and a bunch of jobs are asking for a bachelor's and want to pay under$20 an hour. That's crazy. It's hilarious. And I'm like, that's fucking criminal how shit is. By the way, my wish I went to be a plumber. Like, I genuinely can't be grossed out by like anything, and that's I'm like, I wish I fucking was a plumber's apprentice. Like, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_03 3:00:13

You'd start at 20 bucks an hour.

SPEAKER_08 3:00:15

Literally, and then you fucking like anything, I wouldn't be able to do electric. Electricity scares the fuck out of me. But I'm like, any trade that I'm like welding fucking pipes that would do it, doing whatever that I'm like, I fucked up that I like was convinced by two people that have higher degrees to just like you have to get this, you have to get this. And it's like now I owe$63,000, and I fucking the 99% of the jobs that are hiring are like, oh, you need a bachelor's, but you're not getting paid even fucking 20 bucks an hour.

SPEAKER_05 3:00:47

That's how it was when I was teaching.

SPEAKER_08 3:00:48

It's so fucking stupid. Well, they have to master's and I was getting paid a ton of the teachers. Not even that. Like so gross how much teachers put out of their own pocket. And like my friends, like I would say out of 10 people I know that went into teaching, one of them is teaching, and she's literally only still finishing teaching because she's at public school and she's doing that 10-year plan.

SPEAKER_05 3:01:10

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 3:01:11

And she's in her last year, and then who's in office now is trying to cancel that. I was like, dude, if I got fucked on that where she did a master's program, and then you're in your like 10th year where it should be forgiven and they're gonna cancel it. I'm like, I would burn the whole fucking. Like, she's gone through hell going through because she's in Minneapolis, all right. So imagine you're five years into it and fucking George Floyd happens, the pandemic, this, that, like everything that's going on, and then now with all the like ice occupation, yeah, and she her school is like around the corner from where the George Floyd shit happened, and it's during the pandemic and everything else. And I'm like, could you fucking imagine the hell she's been through trying to get out of that?

SPEAKER_03 3:01:57

I don't want to say this on on air, but that's what a Steam Fair makes, and our new contract is that.

SPEAKER_08 3:02:03

It's crazy. I wish I fucked up. But I'm just a scumbag that wears to yellow. I wish I went into plumbing. I'm dude.

SPEAKER_03 3:02:09

I'm a scumbag that wears yellow to work, so I must be an idiot, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 3:02:13

And like it's crazy. Yeah. That like I think about all the dudes that I know that went into auto too with the auto industry, where like you still kind of get screwed now compared to like 15, 20 years ago, but still they're like making way more money, and your retirement's so much better.

SPEAKER_03 3:02:29

And I'm like, man, the UAW is losing a lot of power because of automation. Yeah, it's getting fucked. But unionized skilled trades, you you mean good money.

SPEAKER_08 3:02:39

I mean, we like this is what a fucking nurse like that's like some nurses don't even make that by the way. That's just what's on my check. I have I have that's not any bonuses or anything.

SPEAKER_03 3:02:49

No, my my total package is it's crazy. My total package is double that. And that includes that's my total package is double that an hour, and that's and that is my retirement, my right.

SPEAKER_08 3:03:00

You have a full 401k all the shit plus all your benefit. Like it's wild. I wish if I went into like government work too, that's the other thing of like working for any kind of government thing. That I was looking in, I actually applied for a job with the FDA, and that would have been sick, but this is literally before the second term happened that I interviewed, had a really good interview in December, and then January hits, and they fuck everything in the government, is like all these jobs are cut, and everyone who hasn't been in it like longer than it was like three or five years, all the new hires got cut. And I they're like, We're gonna call you back, we really like you. This would have been a really cool job because it was working like farm animal shit for the FDA, and then I just never get a call back, and I'm like, motherfuck, like that would have been a sick job because the benefits had like a lot of people. The benefits are amazing at a government job crazy the pay is the pay was like actually pretty solid too. Right on, yeah, because it was a field position. So being out in the field, you made more money than a desk job. Yeah, and I'm like, I can't sit at a desk, I think I would go insane. Yeah, I couldn't it I couldn't sit at a desk. It's just like the last like 17 years I worked vetmed where you're like up and about the whole day. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:04:18

I but yeah, that's the thing, like I like it's right now it's like trendy to be like go blue collar, but I don't think that people really understand what a skill track is.

SPEAKER_08 3:04:29

I don't know how people understand how labor intensive it is because that was like my brother as a kid, like a young kid, started working in an auto shop and doing that bust ass work, like literally break knuckle work all day, busting your ass, fucking up your body, inhaling weird shit, like you're gonna deal with the fallout when you get out of it. But he ended up getting out of it, and now he's doing HVAC, which is like really lucrative. But I'm like, that's some bust ass work when he's like up on a roof and it's fucking negative four and windy, and it's like they push the trades now. But it's like you really need to have the the personality to do it too, like the temperament and the the stick to nice. Is that a good word? Like you need to have it, you need to have it in you to do it. No, no, they work, it's him and his buddy have their like own business that they ended up going out through. But it's like they own the company, yeah. His buddy owns it and then he works for him. Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:05:28

If he ever gets sick of his buddy, have give him my information. I'll get him in the union.

SPEAKER_08 3:05:32

Oh yeah, that'd be nice, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:05:34

But he like because I'm uh my my union is a heating and cooling. Oh yeah, okay. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_08 3:05:40

Yeah, because he does like a lot of his shit's doing like ductwork and different things instead of just like people always think HR, they're like, Oh, you're just working on like furnaces and AC units, and it's like, no, they were like going into a building and like putting the whole fucking system in, and people don't think about all that going into it, but yeah, yeah. It's such a crazy thing. But I'm like, you really do need to have it in your temperament and be like tough enough to tu to do it. It's not an easy thing. I don't know, it's such a funny time. I don't it's a weird thing to think about.

SPEAKER_03 3:06:13

Yeah, there's a lot of uh like I mean and my uncle have would have had a very similar run with somebody where he uh his his wife was in the medical field, but she's like a medical biller, right? It's like a fucking you're like a$20 an hour employee, right?

SPEAKER_08 3:06:33

That's such a funny thing to say medical field, but like I don't want to shit on anyone who's in billing and coding, whatever, but it's like you're not nursing or like it Yeah, but so like so they're having this conversation and I had so I have a similar run-in.

SPEAKER_03 3:06:46

So he's having this conversation with like a school employee, and and she's like, Oh, you're in the medical field. She's like, Yeah, I do this. And then she's like, and then what do you do? And he's like, Oh, I'm in construction. She goes, Oh. And she was like dismissive, and he was like laughing, he's like, Oh, you know, I'm fucking making 200. Do you know how much I make yeah as a you know, as a general foreman or whatever?

SPEAKER_09 3:07:05

Like, oh, we have this, we have this group.

SPEAKER_08 3:07:08

We have this group chat, and one of the other broads that's with one of the dudes in our friend group literally posts this picture that's like don't touch wet door jam. And she's like, This guy doesn't even know how to fucking spell. And I was like, It's spelled right. And I'm like, she's a nurse, and she thinks she could just like shit on this dude who's like a fucking union painter at the hospital. I was like, This dude makes more money an hour than you do, and he didn't flunk out of nursing school. Like, why are you gonna be like that? And I'm like, he fucking spelled it right. Like you literally are on your phone and you could have Googled it, but you'd rather be a bitch.

SPEAKER_04 3:07:46

Right.

SPEAKER_08 3:07:47

It's such a fucking crazy thing to have. And I called it out right away, and I was like, Yeah, it's fucking spelled right. Like you could have just Googled it, right? But you'd rather be an asshole. Oh, that shit. I wanted to, oh, this bride. It's proud. But there's a but there's like a don't be a fucking dick.

SPEAKER_03 3:08:06

There is this like culture of like, yay, blue collar, but it's almost like uh it's almost like a I don't want to say dismissive, but it's almost like a we're proud of you from afar. And it's like, hey, fuck off.

SPEAKER_08 3:08:21

Like come come put my patio in, but then fuck off.

SPEAKER_03 3:08:24

Like it's such a weird but like it's it's almost like uh it's necessary, yay, from like a bunch of people that live in these HOA neighborhoods. But like what they're refusing to accept is that like you have to be an intelligent person to build shit for a living. Especially like mechanical systems like that. We're doing huge, complicated, multi-million dollar projects.

SPEAKER_08 3:08:48

Literally, when you're working for like one of the big three in that where you're putting in all these things that are like you want your car to be fucking built right and you won't crash and die in a fire. Like Well, I mean, well, it like so fucking crazy.

SPEAKER_03 3:09:02

So, like as a as a pipe fitter, a steam fitter, like we'll do everything from like a weld water system where there's 30-inch diameter pipe that we're welding, yeah, that is circulating chilled water throughout an entire plant to keep everything functioning, so nothing's overheating. But also, we'll we'll also build paint lines that have to be technically perfect, otherwise your paint is gonna be fucked up on hundred thousand dollar vehicles. Yeah. I mean, and then also we have HVAC systems where the refrigerant is at hundreds of pounds inside these.

SPEAKER_08 3:09:36

Yes, I yeah, where like people don't understand, like this is gonna go off like a fucking nuke. If we do our job poorly, it could kill people. Yeah, yeah, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_03 3:09:46

But but also has to be so perfectly balanced. Yeah. Like people don't understand how difficult people think work actually is.

SPEAKER_08 3:09:55

My mom's family, like a lot of my mom's family, is down in Missouri and they're all farmers, and people always think that farmers are dumb. Like, there's this weird thing of thinking that farmers are idiots. And I'm like, no, these people are like planning hundred thousand dollar crop features. Like, what's gonna happen with this and have to do like actual genetic research and doing things and like figuring this plan out and rotating crops and doing all this shit that they're like, oh, farmers are just fucking dumb hicks, whatever. They're not they're some of the most resourceful people on earth. Yeah, they literally have like seed libraries and no fucking genetic engineering and all this different stuff is like animal husbandry and everything else that they do. It's but but not only that, but the the engineering that they have to do to make things work at a budget to end all the machines that they're fucking with where they're working on all their own giant machines, or like, oh, this like corn husker and all these other crazy machines that they own, and they have to invest$120,000 on one thing that picks soybeans and whatever. Like, yeah, it's just crazy. It's just so fucking weird when people have that attitude.

SPEAKER_03 3:11:04

Yeah. Farmers are brilliant. There's dude, there's two so wild. There's two things that I think everybody should have to watch. There's a series by a YouTuber named Smarter, he goes by Smarter Every Day. I like that guy as a character.

SPEAKER_08 3:11:18

Yeah, he we watched him with all his like guns and shit because he does we were into slow-mo guys, okay, and they do a lot of crossovers. So I'm like, I like that dude. So Destin's a super good dude.

SPEAKER_03 3:11:29

Well, so he has a series that basically is like farmers are brilliant, and here's why. And so he does a series of like all of these things that farmers have invented or that they do that is absolutely on an engineering level is a marvel. Yeah, yeah. But also, there's a series, Clarkston's Farm on Amazon Prime. So I don't know that one. Jeremy Clarkston from the British Top Gear. He's the big goofy farmer. Oh, they're a who, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 3:11:54

Those three dudes on Top Gear are fucking riot. All right, so Jeremy Clarkston, I know.

SPEAKER_03 3:11:59

So Jeremy Clarkston uh bought a farm, and when the when Top Gear and the Grand Tour ended, he was like, I'm gonna retire to this farm that I bought.

SPEAKER_06 3:12:09

Oh, that's cool.

SPEAKER_03 3:12:10

The guy that was running the farm retires because he's been running it for like 40 years. Yeah, he retires and Jeremy goes, I think I want to learn how to run it. And it's like basically him being a 60-year-old apprentice of trying to figure out how to run his own thousand-acre farm. Yeah, but you see how much shit farmers go through just trying to survive.

SPEAKER_08 3:12:30

Never get a break. Governmental red tail. Oh, governmental red tail.

SPEAKER_03 3:12:40

Yeah. Actually, because of this, I was trying to get a farmer named Elsie Scramlin on. He's like he's the head of fuck, I don't remember, uh the 4-H organization or something. Like he's like the guy. Yeah, like the local chapter. Well, no, like he's like the Oakland County like head of like this organization. But yeah, but he had he owns Scramlin Feeds, but he's he's one of the last active Oakland County farmers. He's been farming in Oakland County since. He started no, he went to Michigan State, graduated, and started a farm in the 60s or 70s, and then he's been actively farming for 50 or 60 years in Oakland County. And I was I was supposed to have him on the podcast.

SPEAKER_08 3:13:28

I gotta reach back out to him because now before he gets his shit going, get him get him in here soon before he gets everything going, because then he's gonna be too busy. Right, right. But that yeah, that'd be cool. That'd be a cool person to talk to.

SPEAKER_03 3:13:42

There's so much shit that the we have Wo uh Wojo coming, the owner of Wojo coming on. And uh yeah, we have we have a few like people who are trying to make it in the world of growing food or pro you know, flowers or whatever going on.

SPEAKER_08 3:13:57

When I went to Wayne State, they had this initiative of like converting a bunch of the like fucked up burned out houses and stuff where they were clearing out those and making it into farmland in Detroit. And they had a really cool program going on because they do some research and some stuff, botany stuff at Wayne, and they had a bunch of those people are running farms, and then they'd have like every Wednesday, they'd have a farmer's market on campus. And if you were a student, they would give you this sheet of coupons that you'd buy for like five bucks, but then you get like 20 bucks worth of fresh produce. And I'm like, what a cool thing that they were working on. And I it like kind of petered off, but uh like during the pandemic fucked everything up. But I'm like, it's really cool that they were working on this, and then they have all these spots that'd be like, oh, this would just be a bunch of burned out shit houses, but they clear it out and make it into farmland, and that's still going on, just that program I think kind of petered out at Wayne. But I'm like, it's it's cool that they're trying to do that, yeah. Because especially like urban areas like that, you get into like a food desert. You guys know about all this stuff. But that food desert situation where it's like the only things around are kind of like party stores and liquor stores, dollar generals, yeah, and that's not real food, that's not produce, like fresh produce, and then like it's it's cool that they were getting that cooking downtown.

SPEAKER_03 3:15:15

So we we reached out to there's a God, there's like a main guy who's like running this. He's I I I reached out to him trying to get him on. I can't remember his name. Uh I'm gonna look this up because I don't want to fuck this up.

SPEAKER_05 3:15:29

Um how are you gonna look it down up?

SPEAKER_08 3:15:35

If you talk to him or something.

SPEAKER_09 3:15:37

Or what programming?

SPEAKER_03 3:15:43

Tyson Gersh uh is the co-founder of the Michigan Urban Urban Farming Initiative. So I re I reached out to him to try to get him on the podcast. I haven't he hasn't got back to me yet. Uh yeah but I want to talk to that guy.

SPEAKER_08 3:15:58

Yeah, oh for sure.

SPEAKER_03 3:15:59

But yeah, but but yeah, the idea that you're taking these decrepit, dangerous buildings, you're getting rid of them, and then you're turning them to something that is community building and and teaching people like I was lucky that my dad is such a good teacher of of planting and knowing how to garden and like fixing shit.

SPEAKER_08 3:16:20

And I'm like lucky, so lucky that I had a dad that didn't like princess me into not knowing how to fucking do anything.

SPEAKER_04 3:16:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 3:16:27

Because I can fix a lot of shit in the house. Like we just changed our garbage disposal and like I had to rewire it and put it all back in, and then changing the faucet and just different shit when you're a homeowner. That it's like I'm so glad I know how to do this and didn't have to pay somebody to fix this for me. But that's too many people. I think like a lot of people don't even know how to fucking like plant anything, like don't know anything about doing any kind of gardening, especially food crop gardening, is like such a different thing. But it's like uh I know so many people that don't know how to cook or do anything either. I know I it's like so sad to me that their parents didn't teach them or take time to show them how to do stuff. Yeah, see, I true, I chose to learn all this stuff myself, and that's especially if you were coming out of that kind of chaos where like they didn't do anything.

SPEAKER_03 3:17:17

Well, I got some like fake bro science versions of like how to fix stuff from my dad, and then I had to like learn the real ways to do stuff, but like I would like sarcastically, like Paige would be like, Hey, do you know how to and I'd be like, I know how to do everything. Like, just I'm not kidding, like I'm kind of not kidding, but I am kidding. Like, yeah, she's like, Do you know how to fix? I'm like, Yes, like before you even finish that sentence, yes. And I think she kind of thought I was a bullshitter, and then we bought a house that was a three bedroom, one bath, and we turned it into a four bedroom, two bath. Adding a whole thing is I remodeled the basement and like put in a bathroom, put in a master bedroom, rewired everything. Like, and I think that was I don't know, I'm kind of speaking for you, but I feel like

SPEAKER_05 3:18:00

That's new.

SPEAKER_03 3:18:02

Huh?

SPEAKER_09 3:18:03

I said, What's new? She's gotten to say about five words this whole episode between me being a loud mouth and she was warming up that seat every podcast.

SPEAKER_03 3:18:12

She doesn't even talk.

SPEAKER_08 3:18:13

This one I feel like I've talked the lesson, the least amount in. But that it's funny how many people like it it just bums me out because there was a friend of ours. He was moving to Austin, and I was like, Well, we were trying to get this cooking show going that like he's a comic. Ronnie Rohrbeck, that like we were you guys were talking about like people being on uh Kill Tony getting on Kill Tony, and I'm like, Ronnie had like the second longest interview of anyone on Kill Tony, and we were trying to get a cooking show going because he his parents never taught him how to cook anything, all right. And I go over and I'm like, oh, this and that about the sink. I'm like, we it's a bachelor pad. I'm like, need to fucking clean the kitchen. I gotta get some of these dishes out here, do dishes. I go to hit the garbage disposal, it doesn't go. And I was like, something's in there, it's probably a bottle cap or whatever. I'm like, Do you have like you know where the button is? And I was like, Did you hit the button? He's like, Button. What button? I'm like, there's a button on it to reset it. And he's like, Oh, like, all right, well, do you have I hit the button, does it go? I'm like, Do you have the key? Key? I was like, there's an Allen wrench and all this shit, and he's like, You're like my dad and my mom. They're like, we got everything going, but I'm like, man, it just it's so funny. And like there's a sad part of it to me though that people didn't take that time to like help their kid and in owing homeownership and like just knowing how to take care of yourself and not get screwed over. Cause that was like I never really fucked with plumbing stuff. We had some big like our house is old, it was built in 41. We're in Redford, and like our old ass house had like some plumbing issues because of like roots and shit. We had my brother, like my friend's brother comes and he's gonna give us a deal. That was not a fucking deal. We ended up going and buying like this industrial snake to start doing it ourselves because it's like we're actually due for it. I'm gonna knock on this, we're actually due for one. But I'm like, every spring we have to do this. And I was like, man, like you just get screwed over so bad by people sometimes that like take advantage of your ignorance. Yeah. Like, that's something you can like instill in your kids to know how to do some shit. Like, you can't do everything, like I said, electricity shit. I'm not into it. I rewired the garbage disposal to like cut the plug off and have it on an actual switch. And I'm like, I can look at what they did before and do it, but I'm like, I don't want to fuck with any of this really too much. But yeah, I don't know. That's such a funny thing to know. But that's wild. Putting a whole other bedroom and rewiring all that. I'm like, oh, I don't. Oh yeah. I don't want to play with that.

SPEAKER_03 3:20:43

Nothing about building anything scary. No, oh my gosh, no. You know, I did well, but I also did I did apartment maintenance for like seven years, and then I you learned a lot of shit on the fly because that's all like fix and shit.

SPEAKER_08 3:20:56

I didn't know anything when I started.

SPEAKER_03 3:20:58

I didn't know anything. And then I and then I get a work order, it's like, hey, my whatever, my my garbage is full of doesn't work. I had this, I had to learn all of that. Dude, YouTube is such an amazing resource. I spent so much time listening to YouTube videos quietly in someone's apartment trying to learn how to fix a hot water tank or whatever.

SPEAKER_09 3:21:16

Yeah, you have to go in like, yeah, I don't know whatever how to get a light in here.

SPEAKER_03 3:21:20

But now, but now I'm like, I can confidently fix every fucking thing. Yeah, like I mean everything in the house.

SPEAKER_08 3:21:25

I think if you had like just even the most minimal amount of resources of like my dad would be like, watch, I'm changing this light switch, like come watch this. And he's like doing it hot. I'm like, dog, like are you fucking with me? But just having any of that little little nip of knowledge, and then you can go on YouTube and like watch it and just build off of that. I'm like, I'm so lucky that he was good about doing that stuff.

SPEAKER_03 3:21:47

Yeah, I don't think anyone should be afraid to dive into stuff. I mean, that's like I wear it. Make sure you turn the power off. Yeah, you're right. You gotta do everything safe for sure. Yeah, turn off the source of the energy.

SPEAKER_08 3:21:57

Our house is crazy because the dude, like before the guy left, we bought it from like this 90-year-old dude, and he'd lived there since like 1960, whatever. And they in the last like five years of him living there, he put a fuse box in. Not a fucking circuit breaker box, like actual fucking fuses. So we buy it and we're looking at this thing like what? Like you gotta get real glass fuses? Well, they had like a hole. Luckily, he left like a rack of them there, but I'm like, man, like trying to explain to people, we're like, it's a fuse box, and we just changed our homeowners, and the homeowners was like, You have to change out this fuse box. And I'm like, it's less than 15 years old. Like, this is a new box that the dude put in. They're like, No, you have to change it. I'm like, that costs double what the entire homeowner's policy costs. Like, we're not gonna go with you because we're not changing it. Like, that's crazy to get an electrician to come out and change it. Yeah, because we had it quoted and it was like some insane amount of money when we bought the house. So I can't even imagine how much money it would be now. Yeah, but I'm like, nah, we aren't playing that.

SPEAKER_03 3:23:01

Just change it yourself. You have a main uh main breaker.

SPEAKER_08 3:23:04

But you have to like have them come out and turn the power off outside and do all this shit for it. I'm like, it's not like you don't have a main breaker in the house. Yeah, it's not gonna be like a you have to like literally have the electric company come out and like turn off your power coming in and then fuck with it. And I'm like, I don't I don't fuck with electrodes. Yeah, I'll change the socket, I'll change the garbage tools or what I mean. Something that has like how many I don't even know what's coming into the house. What's coming into the house is fucking crazy amount of juice.

SPEAKER_03 3:23:34

Yeah. It's enough to kill you. It doesn't take very much to kill you. Nope.

SPEAKER_08 3:23:39

You don't need that many amps to fuck you up, man. It's not that much. Yeah. It's funny.

SPEAKER_03 3:23:43

Dude, on that note, we're at like three and a half.

SPEAKER_08 3:23:45

I know, I know. We could talk for a long time, and I like really need to take a leak too. So um, we should wrap it up on some happy notes. Let's cover we covered a lot of weird stuff. We unpacked some things, we cried a little, we laughed a lot. You almost got one to fall out of my eyelids. Dude, I like had real tears. I had to get a tissue. I had like real tears. That fucked me up. The nine-year-old saying that, man, that fucking like hurt my heart. That broke me. But happy shit. Let me tell you a good. I had I said this earlier in the episode that I was gonna tell you a story of Attel being the biggest sweetheart, and this is one of my plugs, so it'll lead into wrapping up and doing my plugs. And we were in New York in August. How I said I went on all that kill fake Kill Tony on Legion of Skinks and whatever. The night before that, I'm thinking that's gonna be the last time we're seeing Attel. And Nick and I have seen Attel. This is probably like our 27th time seeing him. He knows us, he knows my name, he knows I just do comedy, and we're outside, and he's like, You coming tomorrow? And I'm like, No, Dave, like we're gonna tomorrow we're going to whatever, we're doing a different show tomorrow, and we aren't gonna see you, so I'll catch you next time, or I'll see you. We were gonna go to Skankfest. I was like, I'll see you at Skankfest, whatever. Eddie's like, Alright, keep doing it, kid. And like pats my shoulder, and he's like, How about next time I'm in town? You can do some guest spots. So holy shit. That is happening, and he's gonna be at Mark Really's Comedy Castle April 30th through May 2nd. And I don't know what days I'm doing it, but I'm gonna be doing some guest spots with Atel, which is absolutely fucking crazy. Like saying it out loud is still surreal. Yeah, but he's literally like the nicest fucking dude ever, and he's so sweet and awesome and like looks out for people like that. So shout out David for being an absolute gem of a human being. Um, you guys should go see a tell. There's a bunch of shows coming up. Like Mark Norman's gonna be there, like you like uh Ryan Long's gonna be there. You guys gotta check out the calendar. There's so many good shows coming up at Ridley's.

SPEAKER_03 3:25:52

Matt's showcase this Tuesday. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 3:25:54

Well, you won't have this out yet, right? Are you gonna have it out in time? No. Are you doing what is your showcase? The 101 class? The 101, yeah. Oh, I'm glad that you did it. Okay, because we talked about it a while ago. I didn't know if you were gonna do it or not. I haven't seen you in a minute either, but yeah, isn't Bill the best?

SPEAKER_03 3:26:10

He's a he's a character, dude. I love a lot.

SPEAKER_08 3:26:12

I've known Bill for like a decade, so I knew him quite a while outside of comedy, and he is genuinely the sweetest, like most paternal, nice person and genuine, just so genuine and really wants you to do well and really wants to help you.

SPEAKER_04 3:26:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 3:26:30

And a bunch of people I think think that it's like not genuine, and I'm like, no, Bill is like fucking awesome.

SPEAKER_03 3:26:36

Dude, he made he made me laugh because of support. Like, I went, I went up to do I went up to do a part of my set that we were running through during the class. Yeah. And I had this joke about uh I had this joke where I'm like, uh, she shows up and she all the it's an Osempic joke. I'm like, she shows up, all of a sudden she has this, she has this fucking hip bone V thing like Brad Pitt had in Fight Club. Well, I don't say that because that's everyone knows that. And I'm not I'm not doing that. But so I go, she's she's got this shit, she's got the hip bone V thing that Brad Pitt had in Fight Club. Yeah, those those fucking meaty slides that made my heterosexuality a slippery slope, and he just goes, Yes! From the back of the room. It's just made me.

SPEAKER_08 3:27:18

I love Bill the Death. Oh, dude, that made me laugh so hard. Yeah, that's how I got into comedy was knowing Bill because his his sister-in-law is my friend, all right. So I meet Bill at a couple of her birthdays and stuff, and he's like, he knew Nick and I from us going to Ridley's all the time. Like he recognized us. I'm recognizable in my voice and my, you know, you guys know me, I'm recognizable. So he's like, I know you, and I'm like, Well, we come to Ridley's all the time, and we start talking about comedy and stuff, and he's like, You have to do the class, you have to do the class. And I was finishing my bachelor's, and I was like, I can't. I'm like barely squeaking by because I just can't focus on anything. I'm working. I was like, I have to graduate and then we'll talk, whatever. Long story boring. It's like I graduate in May of 23. In September of 23, I get this message that's like, somebody paid for people to take my class, be here at 10:30 on Saturday. And I was like, Got me. I fucking can't say no to that. Like, that's crazy. How lucky. So I was like, all right, dude, see you Saturday, and that's where we are two and a half years later. Then like I have to shout out Bill for just being so thoughtful and like really being cool and trying to push me to do it because he knew that I wanted to. That's why he charged me double. Yeah, he's like, another white guy, another white guy is paying double. But yeah, I just got really lucky timing-wise that it was that, and like I wouldn't have done it, I wouldn't have had the extra money or anything to do it, you know. Like, that man doesn't pay too nice, so I would never would have I never invest money in myself like that. I have too many like animals and crazy shit going on all the time, so I never would have done it. So I was super grateful to Bill for being like really being good towards me and being like really supportive and just pushing me to do different stuff that I would like never because that was when I took the class. I never did an open mic, I didn't do anything. I did the classes, and then my graduation was the first time ever doing stand-up comedy.

SPEAKER_03 3:29:16

Doing the fucking doing the showcase 100 people, yeah, just like fucking raw dog it.

SPEAKER_08 3:29:20

And we had a hundred and it was over 150 people because one of the guys in the class, it was his work party, some kind of work party. So he brings like 75 people. They were already drinking before they got there. Oh man. And I go, I went third after the host. So I'm like fourth in the lineup, perfect spot. Great, like not to like tune my own horn, but I had a good time. I did well. Yeah. Have a great set for never doing it and literally doing it for the first time, and have like people coming up to me and talking to me and blah blah blah. And I'm like, I've been chasing the dragon ever since. That's the thing. That's so then I go from that Wednesday. That's a Wednesday, great time. Go into Saturday. I go, there was Clausen. There was a place that was called Detroit Burger Bar in Clausen, and Polly Peppettoni would host this. Paul Peppettoni that hosts New Way, shout him out. Love Polly, host this eat shit for 10 minutes straight at this, where it's like a sports bar where like the Gary was talking about this and that, like they turn off the game to like have people come tell dick and fart and pussy jokes, and like no one's listening. And I'm like, dude, if that was the first time I ever did it, I would have never done it again.

SPEAKER_03 3:30:34

Oh, if I did the if I did the Berkeley Legion for the first time ever, I would have never done comedy again.

SPEAKER_08 3:30:40

That was a tough room for me when I came that night. That I'm like, even the hosts aren't listening. Like, there's four people, and there's like that older couple. I have to shout out that dude. The old dude was listening, and I was like, This is my biggest fan. I love this guy. But I'm like, thank god someone smiled at me. Right, right. You'll have that. You gotta go through a lot of those. I still feel that way sometimes.

SPEAKER_03 3:31:02

I kind of like eating shit because it like shows you where the faults in your writing are.

SPEAKER_08 3:31:05

You literally have to do that so many times. And I still every once in a while get hung up where I'll have someone stonewalling me that's sitting up front, and I'm like, I'm gonna get you motherfucker. But you can't, you don't even crack a smile out of them, and I'm like, dude, that just like hurts my soul. Like, yeah, sometimes you're gonna have people like that. You're the stonewaller. I have my one friend that we go to comedy shows with him and his wife a lot, and he's like this big huge guy with a big beard and long hair, and he'll sit like this. And he's smiling, but he's not laughing out loud. But I'm like, no, Dan is like one of the biggest fucking comedy fans, is like internally laughing, and he'll go up and be like, You fucking killed, and I'm like, Why don't you can't you fucking like express it outwardly? Like you're already a giant man with a giant beard and menacing as fuck, and you want to sit up front and then you don't even laugh. Like he's had so many people call him out when we're all together, because I'm a lunatic. Like you get me going and I'm cackling, and then you have Dan just sitting with us.

SPEAKER_04 3:32:05

It's like, hmm.

SPEAKER_08 3:32:08

You know, like we've had so many people call him out or call me out because I'm insane, and if I get going, it's a whole thing, but yeah. Um what else? You have your showcase. This won't come out. You have anything else going on that you were talking about?

SPEAKER_03 3:32:23

Just the showcase. Uh I'm just doing the show.

SPEAKER_08 3:32:25

That's this Tuesday coming up. It's doing yeah, get on some mics, get the showcase is nice, and you'll get other stuff from that. And then the nice thing is usually they invite you back as like a alumni, and you'll get to be on other showcases where they can't like fill up the whole show, like the class was small. So I've done like five of those where I've been invited back to be on either like the one-on-one graduation that wasn't full or like uh advanced graduation that wasn't full. When does this when will you drop this?

SPEAKER_03 3:32:54

Uh probably next Friday.

SPEAKER_08 3:32:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:32:57

I have maybe the following Monday.

SPEAKER_08 3:32:59

It's weird because you'll have these phases where you have nothing, and then in like a month and a half, you'll have like six shows, and like once you're getting into it more and you're getting booked and stuff, it's just funny. You'll have nothing. Like all of like January, February, I didn't really have anything, and then I had a couple shows. But coming up April 18th, I have Monty's Pub in Ann Arbor, Michigan. The 22nd, Cat Cafe in Ferndale, Michigan. We're doing a cat fundraiser. All the money from tickets, all the proceeds go to the cats. We did one at Detroit Shipping Company. Shout out Alessia Fionda coordinated all this, and they raised like$1,900 for the Detroit Alley cats. And that was a super, super fun show. So I expect this one to be really fun. Um, heavy flow, April 24th, is gonna be at the independent comedy club. You need to come out there, you need to come some of the mics out there. Those are fun. The heckle mic, the shit show is like my favorite training ground for chaos. I can't tell new comics enough to like go to the crazy shows. Go, go get in those heckle and like get harassed and get talked to.

SPEAKER_03 3:34:02

Maybe Logan will actually hang out with me if I go out to Ham Tramics. It makes you a fucking dweeb. I can't get him to hang out with me. Which one? Logan Monson.

SPEAKER_08 3:34:10

Oh, okay. You're friends with him. I love Logan. I didn't know you're friends with him. Him and his girl are there a lot because they do a lot of the shows of the black box and stuff. So she has a show coming up, I think it's like the end of like the end of April. She's gonna be on some show at the black box. So I bet you they'll be around a lot more.

SPEAKER_04 3:34:29

Right on.

SPEAKER_08 3:34:30

Skyler. That's Skylar does comedy too, but they both like he was doing it for a minute and then he kind of just disappeared, but he's been doing more stuff where he's been doing like plays and things. Yeah. And in more improv. I don't know. That's all I got. Attel is gonna be fucking crazy. I don't I'm so bad about not tooting my own horn or promoting myself, but also I don't care what day I'm going, you don't need to come see me. If you've never seen a tell live, please, please, please go grab tickets. They added the Thursday, which was like the April 30th show. I bet you the other Friday, Saturday, both shows are probably sold out, or maybe there's a couple tickets left, but that Thursday is gonna sell out quick. Last time he was in town, he added a Thursday, added a Sunday, and all that sold out.

SPEAKER_03 3:35:12

So if you guys don't have tickets, I fucking love it, you have to see him alive. I've been a fan since I saw him get yelled at by his cop buddy on Insomniac for throwing a cigarette on the ground.

SPEAKER_08 3:35:23

Dude, I like Insomniac's one of my comfort shows. So like a few months ago, Nick and I both had the flu, and we just like laid around like slugs and watched all of Insomniac. And like the other day I was like cleaning the house and stuff and just put it on as like background comfort show to laugh at. But I'm like, if you have you seen him before?

SPEAKER_03 3:35:42

I haven't seen him live.

SPEAKER_08 3:35:43

Dude, go right the fuck now and buy dick and please, please go see him. I don't care about me doing anything. I'm telling you, you have to go see him because I don't know how much more he's gonna be touring. He's touring because he's taking care of his mom, and his mom is in like end stage dementia, and he's paying like$300,000 a year to keep her at home with home care. For fuck's sake. So that's why he's still touring. So literally to be able to see him, I know, or so long. Is it like nine o'clock?

SPEAKER_03 3:36:10

No, I just got a text from Bill, I think.

SPEAKER_08 3:36:13

Oh, I love Bill so much. Shout out Bill Bouchard, what a doll. And he's like an amazing comic, he's so much fun to watch work. Have you gotten to see him do his thing?

SPEAKER_03 3:36:22

I've all no, I haven't seen him.

SPEAKER_08 3:36:23

You gotta go do one of the local shows, like a bar show or something, and you want to watch somebody do crowd work, that's just so fucking fun. And like watching somebody who taught you how to do shit when you see the master work, like Bill is so awesome. I can't say enough nice things about Bill. I just absolutely love Bill. But please go buy tickets to Attel. You have you love a tell, you have to go see him. Yeah, he might not be touring after this. This literally might be like one of his last tours because if he doesn't have to put all that money out for that, I don't know. She's like been in home care for quite a while. Yeah. So I would do it. I mean, seeing him at the cellar is one thing, but seeing him when he does like a whole headliner set. Yeah, you gotta go. Yeah, but I gotta go pee. I won't shut up about comedy stuff. I get cranked, man. I'm you're you and I have that where we're like huge comedy nerds. So come to some shows, check out Ridley's, check out The Independent, check out One Night Stands, check out fucking Cash's everything. Like Metro Detroit has such a wealth of amazing comedy and amazing talent.

SPEAKER_03 3:37:28

So go see live comedy. Incredibly supportive. Yeah. Not even remotely toxic, which is but you're new. No, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_08 3:37:37

It's like you'll figure it out. There's some sociopath motherfuckers around, but they're all from Ann Arbor.

SPEAKER_03 3:37:45

I'm talking about Metro Detroit.

SPEAKER_08 3:37:47

No, there's some whatever. There's some off-the-air beef that we could air out, but local. Good night, thanks for me.