Behind the Mic Ep3

Behind the Mic, Episode 3

In this final Behind the Mic bonus episode, we step back from the interviews of IPAA Insiders Season 1 to reflect on the stories, insights, and shared experiences that shaped the series.

Host Jo Rose is joined by Amy Mathai of NSW Treasury, and Megan Maletic, previous Lead Consulting Partner at Deloitte for the NSW Government and public services sector. Together, they explore what it really means to move between the private and public sectors, the mindset required to thrive in public service, and how curiosity, listening, and purpose can shape meaningful careers.

From navigating change and maintaining enthusiasm, to the power of storytelling and personal honesty, this conversation highlights the human side of public service work. Amy reflects on learning through challenge and growth, Megan shares insights on sustaining energy and seeking diverse perspectives, and Jo unpacks why origin stories matter so deeply in how we understand leadership and service.

This episode doesn’t offer a single roadmap. Instead, it invites reflection on learning, adaptability, and connection, and encourages more voices, especially frontline staff, to join the conversation in future seasons.

Whether you’re considering a transition into the public sector, thinking about how you grow and lead through change, or curious about stepping forward to share your story, this Behind the Mic episode offers thoughtful insights and a fitting close to Season 1, while setting the tone for what’s to come in Season 2.

SHOW CREDITS
Host: Jo Rose
Writers: Alessia Campagna, Nicola Hardy and Jo Rose
Producer and Editor: Alessia Campagna
Technical Producer: Anthony Watson
Executive Producers: Jo Rose and Nicola Hardy

Music Credits:
Let The Good Times Roll: Music from #Uppbeat
https://uppbeat.io/t/ra/let-good-times-roll
License code: DNAIHKYCKOUU6HBT

Enchanted Puzzle: Music from #Uppbeat
https://uppbeat.io/t/andrey-rossi/enchanted-puzzle
License code: YTN0OYX8RBDDUQ73

Easy Flow: Music from #Uppbeat
https://uppbeat.io/t/hybridas/easy-flow
License code: R2FTWOYRCB7YOW21

Not That Easy: Music from #Uppbeat
https://uppbeat.io/t/soundroll/not-that-easy
License code: MYQOVXXWAFZULECH

On Tiptoes: Music from #Uppbeat
https://uppbeat.io/t/soundroll/on-tiptoes

We would like to acknowledge the Traditional Owners of the land on which the podcast is taking place today. We pay our deep respects to all Elders past, present and emerging. We would also like to extend that respect to any Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples listening today.

Transcript

Behind the Mic Episode 3

IPAA NSW acknowledges the Gadigal People the traditional owners of the lands and waters this podcast is recorded on.

Hi, I’m Jo Rose and I’m the CEO of IPAA NSW and the Host of IPAA Insiders.

This is our final instalment of our Behind the Mic series where we take a deeper look at some of the topics we covered in Season 1. 

In this conversation I’m joined by Amy Mathai, Associate Director Climate Finance programs at New South Wales Treasury and Megan Maletic, Lead Consulting Partner at Deloitte for the New South Wales Government and public services sector. 

We chat about differences and similarities of working in the private vs public sector, the unique mindset needed for working in the public service and Amy shares her advice for anyone wanting to be a guest on Season 2. 

So, let’s get into it!

Jo Rose 

Megan, you have had an adjacency to the sector for must be almost two decades, and I know that you've seen lots of people transition between the public and various other sectors. What do you think is kind of a key to help people transition? 

Megan Maletic 

Well, yeah, Jo, I think I'm really excited by. How much movement we're seeing between the sectors. I think shared experience and shared knowledge only serves to foster a better public service and better services for citizens. I think the key attribute that people bring to the transition is a is an attribute of listening, listening to you know, the audience that they perhaps, you know, move into listening to perhaps why services are delivered the way they're delivered, listening to themselves, what ultimately truly motivated that move, or that shift and change, and really keeping that close to their heart. But actually, you know, through that listening, that curiosity, trying to deeply understand the What now, but what's actually possible, and really being open to bringing the connectedness of both worlds together into one context.

Jo Rose  

Amy, thank you for joining us. I actually found your interview really fantastic. It was one of the ones that I remember. It was quite emotional, actually, when you talked about what drove you into the public you into the public sector. And so as someone who has made that transition relatively recently, what advice would you give to others about how to transition into the public sector?

Amy Mathai  

I think it's like taking any new challenge. I don't know if there's any specific golden key or golden ticket. I think it's about, as you said, about connect, like asking the question of the why, why you're doing it, what the why of the organization or the team is so locking into that purpose, figuring out what in your skill set, whether that be specific expertise or transferable soft skills, that you can offer and bring in, and then doing a gap analysis. What don't you know yet? What can you learn from your team? What other resources can you lean into and get curious and be kind to yourself as you do that. But if you continue to keep trying and keep learning, you'll figure it out, and you have something of value to offer wherever that is. So be excited by the challenge.

Jo Rose    

You seem really energized by your role, and you've been there a few years, I think is that right

Amy Mathai    

I've been in Treasury for a few years, but I've been very lucky to move around into a couple of different roles, and I will say that that's happened quite organically. So when I joined treasury, I took my skills from being in the private sector, where I had done a couple of different roles, took my financial expertise, took all the skills that you learn very quickly in consulting, and then joined a financial policy writing role for the state. And so that was using exactly as I said. Before, using skills I already had, developing new skills and then learning very quickly in the role. But then, as I started working in this whole new ecosystem that is the public service, I started to realize, right? I have learning to do about how government works. So I took a secondment into the Parliamentary Services team, which is a very throw you in the deep end way of learning how government works. And I'm very glad that we have the working government training that you can do now, so you don't have to learn at such a quick pace. You can take your time with it. But yes, so basically, I've moved, sort of found what I knew, what I could offer when I wanted to learn, and then take in a different opportunity, and just tried to keep learning and growing.

Jo Rose  

And how have you maintained your enthusiasm?

Amy Mathai  

That's a good question. I don't, I don't know that I'm particularly enthusiastic in general. I think I just, I want to keep learning and growing, and I don't, I don't know if it's something that my generation is so used to constant change. So I like learning new things. I like continuing to grow and evolve. It feels opportunistic. And also the natural pace of the world we live in now, I almost take it for granted that things are changing, and I think that's good, because take any of the current wicked problems that government or. What any organization is looking at. We need new ways of coming at the problem. We need to be asking different questions. We need to be getting more diverse thought and perspectives into the problem, because we're not going to find the solution continuing to do what we've always done, and that's exciting, scary, but exciting.

Jo Rose  

And Megan, how do you maintain a sort of enthusiasm for the work that you do? 

Megan Maletic  

I think it's a little bit what Amy's touched on, which is a variety of experiences. So, you know, in some respects, yeah, change is daunting, as Amy's shared, but actually it keeps things a little bit spicy, doesn't it? It keeps things a little bit, you know, oh, okay, right. Well, this is gonna, this is gonna be tough, and I think not being dissuaded by that sort of fear or that angst around the change, but actually leaning into the opportunity that it can present is probably how I keep the enthusiasm I think, you know, when I think about the experiences or the learning experiences that you know, working in professional services is presented, it's not just about, you know, the different projects or different clients I get to work with across the New South Wales government. But actually the leadership experiences I get to have, you know, we've had an enormous amount of change within our own organization, and that's been tough. But actually knowing that I'm getting set up for skills for, you know, future leadership opportunities helps to bring that sense of growth and change within my own career. And I think watching and seeing how the sector is evolving, you know, in this, you know, very, very changing and volatile context maintains my enthusiasm at the end of the day, and you know, it's about delivering services to the public sector and to communities. And what's not to be excited about with that at the heart of it.

Jo Rose  

Amy, you shared what inspired you to join the public sector. I'm interested to know, was that challenging to share, and, and, or if you've received any feedback from people who've listened,

Amy Mathai 

I mean, definitely challenging to share, but I'm trying to do more things like that. I found that the most inspiring, encouraging people I have around me are honest about the things that make them them, and that is quite permissioning. So I'm starting to feel the sense of duty that comes by being on the receiving end of other people's honesty and openness. We're all human, and that itself is a tough experience. So I've so, yeah, I'm very grateful that I've had that, and I'm grateful to share it, and it's tough, but it's also an honor to do this work, but also have the opportunity to share my little piece of story. And in terms of feedback, it's been just that, and just like feedback from you that's really touching for me to hear, because I'm really curious about people and what makes us tick, and our jobs, I think, are just a small part of what makes us us. We all exist in a huge system, and what we do is important to us, but there's a bigger picture of who a person is. 

Jo Rose  

I have a great privilege in getting to sit down with lots of people in public sector, and I often ask people, sort of their origin story. I started my career as a filmmaker, so I'm very interested in structure of storytelling, and pretty much everyone who has been in the sector, or in or out of the sector or adjacent to the sector has something that has driven them to that sometimes it's something really tiny, and sometimes it's something completely massive, and it's fascinating. Though, humans are infinitely fascinating, and we all come to our job with all our parts of humanness. So I think, I think it's fantastic that people are sharing that on such an intimate sort of experience as a podcast. Do either of you have any advice to people who might be interested in being a podcast guest?

Megan Maletic  

Well, I think at the heart of what I've learned in participating in this podcast series. Is the power of storytelling and actually realizing just through conversation, how much information we can just surface, just in a conversation or a story or what have you. And I think you know, for me, it's, you know, don't be, I guess, dissuaded by the structure that perhaps podcasts bring. It's a conversation, it's it's an exchange of information, of ideas and and actually, it's quite energizing in that way.

Amy Mathai 

I love what you just said about storytelling, and I think it's what really resonates with me, Joe, about the, um, acknowledgement of country that I've heard you do before, which is about that history of storytelling is so innate in us and it's something that truly connects all of us. And I think we can do more of that. I think we can do more of finding the connections, um, 'cause there's, there's so much more unity than what you'd see on the front page of a publication. Um, so advice to somebody who would like to, even if you're a little bit scared, like I was, go ahead, put your hand up. Um, 'cause there's a great team at IPAA that will absolutely support you, um, in bringing yourself forward. 

Jo Rose  

Excellent. And do you have a burning question, Amy, if you got to ask a question that you'd like us answered in series two? 

Amy Mathai

Um, I think it's less of a question and it's more of a source of an answer. I would, and maybe this is a challenge I put to you if I can do that. Um, I'd love to hear from more frontline staff. I think in the public service we have. If we just look at the numbers or statistics wise, there's so many people doing the frontline work, um, that I'd love to hear from, um, what's their daily experience like, what's it like working in that system, that ecosystem that we've just spoken about.

Um, that's, I'd love to hear that. 

Jo Rose 

I might end with you, Megan. Um, just one final question. Um, some advice for people about thriving in, in our, I guess, just evolving environment. Um, maybe top, top two or top three tips that you might say to people if they came to you for advice.

Megan Maletic 

 I think, um, be aware of what actually gives you performance energy.

What are the ingredients that are unique to you that, you know, fill your cup? So if that's not clear to you. Do some work on that for yourself. That might be a walk, it might be social connection, it might just be some good quality sleep. Let's be honest, that makes a big difference. Um, you know, it might be, um, you know, just making sure you are allowing intentional time in your week to do some thoughtful work.

Um, so I think know what your ingredients are for performance energy for you. The second tip that I would give to people is, um, go with curiosity. Seek to find information about, you know, trends not just within the sector, but nationally, globally. What are those issues? Um, you know, and just keep trying to, to learn, uh, and explore, uh, knowledge.

Uh, I think, um, IPAA is a great source. It's really approachable. The information is actually sort of at your fingertips there. Make sure that you are diving into that. Um, and I think the third thing I would say is seek multiple perspectives, and whether that's forming your network and working that network.

There was a great part of season one that talked about networking. And yes, it can be awkward, but really the value in networking is really, really key. So, grow your network, grow your, your community in order to learn about the diversity of perspectives and thoughts because I think that will ultimately make you a better leader and a better public servant.

Jo Rose

Fantastic. Thank you so much.

Megan Maletic

 Thanks, Jo. Thank you. Thank you.

Jo Rose 

Thanks for everyone, for being here today. I don't know about you, but I really loved hearing all the different perspectives and unique insights. I hope you got some wisdom out of today's conversations, and I hope you've got something that you can apply to your public sector career.

Being able to showcase diversity of thought and celebrate knowledge sharing are just two of the reasons that we started IPAA Insiders. And what I hope you know is that there are a lot of people behind the scenes here at IPAA Insiders, and I'd like to do a bit of a shout out to a couple of them. In, particular, Nicola Hardy, the Director of Capability Design and Member Engagement at IF New South Wales.

Our producer, Alessia Campagna, and our technical editor Anthony Watson.

And I'd also like to thank David Prideaux from Wesley Mission Studios for the Studio time. The first season of IPAA Insiders is available now. And if you missed an episode, I do encourage you to go back and have a listen. I always want to hear what you think, so please do slide into my dms and tell me if there's something that we missed, something that you wish that we'd asked, or if you want be part of the conversation.

And I'll see you next time for season two. 

<END OF EPISODE THREE>