Shadow Me Next!
Shadow Me Next! is a podcast where we take you behind the scenes of the medical world. I'm Ashley Love, a Physician Assistant, and I will be sharing my journey in medicine and exploring the lives of various healthcare professionals. Each episode, I'll interview doctors, NPs, PAs, nurses, and allied health workers, uncovering their unique stories, the joys and challenges they face, and what drives them in their careers. Whether you're a pre-med student or simply curious about the healthcare field, we invite you to join us as we take a conversational and personal look into the lives and minds of leaders in Medicine. Access you want, stories you need. You're always invited to Shadow Me Next!
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Shadow Me Next!
What dying teaches us about truly living | Jenny Lytle, BSN
When a hospice nurse with thirty years of experience speaks about what matters most at the end of life, it's a story worth listening to. Jenny Lytle's journey into nursing began with an unlikely inspiration, a childhood fascination with thermometers during her own hospital stays, but has evolved into a profound calling that's taught her what true care really means.
"It's such a privilege to be with people in their hardest times, in their most vulnerable comments," Jenny shares, describing her nearly two decades in hospice nursing. While many assume hospice work must be relentlessly depressing, Jenny reveals a different reality: one where unexpected joy, meaningful connections, and even humor exist alongside grief. She dispels common misconceptions, like hospice means "giving up" or that patients no longer receive medication, and explains instead how the focus shifts to quality of life defined by each individual's unique priorities.
The conversation takes a deeply personal turn when Jenny describes helping finding her mother, also a nurse, receive hospice care in her final hours after a brain aneurysm. This devastating experience solidified what Jenny had observed throughout her career: healthcare providers excel at caring for others while neglecting their own needs. The realization sparked her mission to help caregivers develop sustainable self-care practices, culminating in her book "Self-Care Isn't Selfish" and the development of personalized approaches that don't feel like additional burdens.
For anyone considering a healthcare career, particularly in emotionally demanding fields like hospice, Jenny offers reassuring wisdom: it's not about caring less or becoming hardened, but about establishing boundaries and self-care practices that allow you to remain present and compassionate without burning out. Whether you're a pre-health student, a seasoned provider, or simply curious about the human side of medicine, this conversation will transform how you think about care, both for others and yourself.
Ready to explore more stories from healthcare professionals? Subscribe to Shadow Me Next and follow us on Instagram and Facebook @ShadowMeNext for highlights and previews of upcoming guests.
And check out more of what Jenny has to offer at her website: jennylytle.com
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Hello and welcome to Shadow Me Next, a podcast where I take you into and behind the scenes of the medical world to provide you with a deeper understanding of the human side of medicine. I'm Ashley, a physician assistant, medical editor, clinical preceptor and the creator of Shadow Me Next. It is my pleasure to introduce you to incredible members of the healthcare field and uncover their unique stories, the joys and challenges they face and what drives them in their careers. It's access you want and stories you need, whether you're a pre-health student or simply curious about the healthcare field. I invite you to join me as we take a conversational and personal look into the lives and minds of leaders in medicine. I don't want you to miss a single one of these conversations, so make sure that you subscribe to this podcast, which will automatically notify you when new episodes are dropped, and follow us on Instagram and Facebook at Shadow Me Next, where we will review highlights from this conversation and where I'll give you sneak previews of our upcoming guests.
Ashley :Sometimes the road to medicine starts with a noble calling. Other times it starts with a thermometer. Jenny Lytle's journey into nursing began with a childhood fascination, but over the last 30 years most of it's been in hospice care, she's found a far deeper purpose being present with patients and families in their most vulnerable moments. In this conversation, jenny shares what decades in hospice have taught her about life loss and the power of presence. She opens up about misconceptions around hospice, the unexpected joy and humor that can exist alongside grief, and why quality of care means something different to everyone. We also talk about a deeply personal turning point when Jenny's mom, who's also a nurse, passed away unexpectedly, and how that loss sparked her mission to help caregivers care for themselves through her book Self-Care Isn't Selfish and the Becoming Method. If you've ever wondered what it takes to thrive in such an emotionally demanding field or how to keep serving others without emptying yourself, this episode will leave you with insight, encouragement and maybe even a new perspective on what it means to truly care.
Ashley :This is Shadow Me Next, with Jenny Lytle. Please keep in mind that the content of this podcast is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be considered as professional medical advice. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the host and guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organization, employer or company. This is Shadow Me Next with Jenny Lytle. Jenny, thank you so much for joining us on Shadow Me Next today. You have been in healthcare as a nurse for over 30 years. You have a wealth of information and really interesting things that will apply not just to people interested in nursing but people across the board of medicine, which is fabulous. So thanks for joining us today.
Jenny Lytle :Ashley, thank you so much. I'm excited to be here.
Ashley :Oh, it'll be a great conversation. So let's go way back, jenny, it's been 30 years. What initially drew you to medicine and how did you choose nursing?
Jenny Lytle :Well, I would love to say that it's like some really noble thing, but really the original thing was the thermometer. I was sick a lot when I was young. I spent some time in the hospital and I had some lung issues and everything's good now. But I love the thermometers and you know the little holster kind. I really like the kind that people still use now and I just thought that was really cool.
Jenny Lytle :And so that started my nursing journey. I thought I want one of those and then, throughout high school and stuff, I thought maybe I want to do something more mental health related. You know, I was thinking psychology, psychiatry, somewhere in there. But then I got into a not great relationship and I decided you know, this is really, this is really a bad thing. I didn't recognize that at that time, but so let's just make it all come together as quickly as possible. So I wanted to go to LPN school because my mom was like, okay, before you get married, I want you to finish college. And I'm like, okay, it's a year program, it'll, it'll work and thankfully did not marry. The guy did go, went to school with my mom and so that's that's what started my my nursing career Probably not the most traditional.
Ashley :No, you know. I love it though, because I think there's so many things in our life that leads us to where we're at, and sometimes you don't realize it in the moment that that that shift is happening until you know. Somebody asked me on a podcast 30 years later hey, how'd you get into nursing? That's a really neat story. I love the visual of of the thermometer. So, jenny, you work in hospice now, which is a really. I have worked with people in hospice before, and our nurses, our hospice nurses, are just. You guys are saints. You are incredible, have you did? You always know that you wanted to work with people nearing the end of their life and kind of navigate that path with them, with people nearing the end of their life and kind of navigate that path with them.
Jenny Lytle :Not at all.
Jenny Lytle :I had known of hospice and I think my grandma was technically in hospice, like at the hospital, but she died when I was four and a half, so I don't have memories of that and I knew the word hospice, but I had a lot of misconceptions, like I feel like a lot of people have had where you know, I thought it was just for people with cancer and people who were like dying today or tomorrow.
Jenny Lytle :And I actually got into hospice because I had done long term care and some clinic work and things like that. But my close friend, her dad, had lung cancer and he had been going through treatment and stuff and and then he woke up one morning and had had a big change, went to the ER and they sent him home with two weeks to live on hospice and they were a pretty non-medical family and so I spent a lot of time over there for those two weeks and I got to see what hospice was like, you know, coming into the home, and I thought this is so cool, you know, to not be hooked up to a bunch of machines, to be able to go outside and smoke and have all of his friends there and all of that. You know, I thought this is kind of cool. I think I want to do this. But side note, I'm the type of person that I want to do everything Like I see a help wanted sign at the gas station, I'm like, well, that looks fun, you know so feel that yeah, do you.
Jenny Lytle :So, so I let it sit a little bit, you know, and and that was in July of 2005. And I started for working for that same hospice in October of 2005. So it's been almost 20 years in hospice.
Ashley :That's incredible, and you know it's funny Now that you say that. It's jogging my memory and so many of the hospice nurses that I know have literally been in it for decades, decades. So it must, Jenny.
Ashley :there must be something about it that is not just miserably sad and depressing all the time, or else I can't imagine you'd want to stay in it for decades. Is it generally speaking? Just you mentioned misconceptions. Maybe we'll ask about that. What are some of the misconceptions, and can you clarify that for us, Because surely it's not always incredibly sad?
Jenny Lytle :Right, it's not, and that's the thing that people have. That and I used to love when I would have students that would come and shadow me in person Because it was, you know, they would come in. And some of them were like, okay, you know what? You know, my grandma had hospice and I'm really excited about this, and most of them were like I'm here because I have to be, I know I'm not going to do this, I don't want any part of it. And and it was like, okay, well, thanks for the honesty. You know, we'll see how it is.
Jenny Lytle :And and what all of them realized is like it's not just all gloom and doom. You know, it's parts of it. It's funny sometimes, and it's parts of it. It's funny sometimes and it's and it's fun and it's such a privilege to be able to be with people, with patients, with families in, you know, a lot of times, a home setting, whether that's in their private home or wherever they call home, you know, an assisted living, a nursing home, whatever, being able to be there with them in their hardest times, in their most vulnerable. You know, maybe the time when their house is the messiest because it's their most vulnerable. You know, maybe the time when their house is the messiest, because it's not a priority, you know, and being able to be there alongside people in that space is it's, it's just, it's such a such a privilege and and it's an honor to be able to be there. And one of the things that I really do love about hospice is that you're able to be with the patient and the family one-on-one in that moment. Now you may have, you know, your phone may be blowing up, you know that you have 20 other people to go see, but in that moment you're there with them and you know that's not the case in a lot of other settings. So that's, I think one of the biggest misconception is that it's just all, that it's all sad.
Jenny Lytle :Another one is that it's giving up. You know well, if somebody's on hospice, you know that's just, they're just giving up. You know either the the patient and family themselves are giving up on treatment, or maybe the doctor feels like they're giving up and that's a tough one because or like they failed somehow. You know the reality is we're all going to die. And you know there's a lot of things that we wish we could, you know, could be different, and we wish that it was later, or we had longer, or you know, or that there was different circumstances.
Jenny Lytle :But there are people who don't want any kind of treatment, and that's okay, you know. The same as there are people who will never want hospice. They are going to want to do everything that they can do, fight up until their last breath, and that's okay too. It's just understanding you know what you're saying yes or no to, and that's that's one of the big things with hospice. It's not about giving up, it's about changing your focus, changing the, your goals of care and and deciding. You know, I want, I want to have the best quality of life for however long I have, and you know, and sometimes that's less and sometimes that's more. It just it depends.
Ashley :Options are a beautiful thing and I think they can be overwhelming, but thank God we have them because different people have different preferences and those preferences are going to lead them to different options. You know, I just you mentioned it so briefly, but it really it really struck me when you're describing the patient that maybe he just wanted to go outside and smoke with his friends. You can't do that when you're in the hospital. First of all, you have to walk across the street because you can't do it in the hospital.
Ashley :Also, you're connected to oxygen and tubes and lines, and your friends have to pay for parking before they can even come up to your room to get you to go grab a smoke. We all know that smoking is bad, but when you are facing the end of your life, we are going to find comfort in a variety of different things, and if that is what you have spent your whole life doing, then so you know. Thank God that we have hospice nurses like you to help support these people as they take their final steps in this world, to be more comfortable and to explore their options and to enjoy their options and focus on the things that matter.
Jenny Lytle :things like that Instead of, like you said, instead of just being hooked up to lines and tubes in the hospital room, right, right and, and having people who you know who, who really are very adamant that you know well, you shouldn't be smoking. This is what you know. This is what got you here. You know, like they know, that and it's that way with family members sometimes. You know well, you know he still wants to smoke and and you know that's, it's not going to matter.
Ashley :You know Now Jenny and I did not get a chance to discuss a quality question, but this topic that she brings up would make an excellent interview question. When a patient's choices go against your personal beliefs or medical advice, how do you respond? This isn't a textbook question. It's real life as a hospice nurse. In Jenny's world, quality of life looks different for every patient. Sometimes that means supporting decisions you wouldn't make for yourself. Could you do it? How would you explain your reasoning in a professional school interview? Keep in mind that there's more interview prep, such as mock interviews and personal statement review, over on shadowmenextcom. There you'll find amazing resources to help you as you prepare to answer your own quality questions and that's what I tell the patients and the families like.
Jenny Lytle :look at this point. It may be, you know, it may make it a little bit harder for him to breathe in the moment, you know, or it may not, but in reality, like it's not going to make any difference in terms of, you know, length of life. But you know, if he hasn't quit in the past 50 years he probably doesn't want to go through the withdrawal of that right now.
Ashley :The withdrawals alone.
Jenny Lytle :Yes, exactly when it comes to the end of your life. I don't know. I think it's easy to be healthy and feel like you've got a lot of life left and feel like you know what people should be doing should be doing, and so hospice is a little more about you know, just letting people figure that out for themselves and do what they need to do to live however long they have with as much dignity and joy and peace as possible.
Ashley :Exactly I just I love that so much and I think that is such a cool. It's such a cool thing that we have access to. Like you said, this is something that everybody is going to walk through one way or the other, and allowing options is just it's so important.
Ashley :So, jenny, tell us what does a typical day look like for you? Touched on it a little bit. You know you might be seeing one patient in your mind, you know you have a bunch of other ones, but what does you know? Start to finish, what does it look like?
Jenny Lytle :Well, so for me my role is a little different than it used to be. I've done a lot of different roles in hospice and so right now I work after hours on call, so hopefully my role looks like I'm sleeping. My role looks like I go to bed at about 8 pm because I go on call at 11 and I want to get a nap in case I get called right at 11. But then, you know, but sometimes, like last night for instance, I was on call from 11 pm to 8 am this morning and I got a call at oh, it was right at midnight and it was about a facility patient that was having loose stools, and so they had some loperamide there, but they didn't have an order for it. So they were like she's fine, other than that she just had these two loose stools and we'd like her to stop. And so I called, got an order for that, called it to them and didn't even need to make a visit, and that was the only thing I did all night.
Jenny Lytle :That doesn't always happen, you know. There's times when I'm out and I'm driving and doing things, but for a, like a typical nurse in hospice, a case manager, you know. So those are the RNs, who are the ones that are, you know, the primary nurse for that particular patient, and so they, you know we start off with a morning call where we, you know, do a 15 minute phone call. Everybody just kind of calls in and hey, here's anything you know new that's going on. Or you know, maybe I'm going to be out of commission for these couple of hours or I've got this meeting or whatever. So then it's just starting to, you know, to go and see the patients and and so that usually looks like you know, 45 minutes to an hour with each patient and family and that's doing a.
Jenny Lytle :You know doing an assessment. You know getting vitals, listening to lungs and bowel sounds and checking for edema and things like that, and reviewing medications, finding out if there have been any falls, have there been any changes, what kind of symptoms are you having? Really looking at that whole assessment and also any needs. Maybe there are some DME needs that are there or some psychosocial things where you need to involve more of the team. You know getting the, maybe getting the chaplain or the social worker involved and really making sure that everything is is holistic. And you know, in hospice, the, the patient and the family are the unit of care.
Jenny Lytle :So, it's, you know, it's not just, it's not just making sure the patient isn't having any pain, but it's, you know, it's not just it's not just making sure the patient isn't having any pain, but it's, you know, it's educating the family and supporting them as well, because of course, you know, being a caregiver is tough. It's tough when you're getting paid for it, but it's even tougher when you're at home with them 24 seven and sometimes don't have much of a break. So, and in the meantime, you know, you're maybe getting calls from patients and families who are calling in and having changes or needs and making sure that you know prescriptions are refilled. And so our team is really good about being proactive with those kind of things, families knowing that, okay, we're going to look at supplies and meds during every visit and make sure that you're not running low, so that at 5.05 on a Friday we're not getting calls about needing supplies or needing medications that somebody's going to be out of.
Jenny Lytle :They're really good at that and I know from previous hospice experience that is a godsend, especially to the on-call staff, because it's, you know, when you're, when you're trying to do those kinds of things, then that takes you away from maybe other needs that are more important really, but maybe not quite as urgent. And and just knowing you know when, the, when the nurse and the team knows the, the patient and the family a little more, you know, it's just easier for them to be able to manage those kind of things. So usually it's four to six patients a day, depending on drive time and things like that. And you know, sometimes that sounds like not a lot and sometimes it's not, depending on where they are, and other times that's, you know, a a full eight hour shift plus plus.
Ashley :Jenny, people on hospice can still get medicine. I mean, that's just. I think that might be another misconception. They think well we're just going to give you water, and well, maybe not even water. You just sit there and you know, pass away.
Jenny Lytle :So that's not, it's it's still very much care, Absolutely, absolutely. It's just and honestly. We still have people who are full codes on hospice.
Ashley :That's another kind of thing is, you know we got to be a DNR?
Jenny Lytle :No, you don't, because some people aren't, they're just not there yet. You know, one of the the big things about hospice is we meet people where they are and so it's. And so it seems like, well, if you, if you know, if you know you're dying, why would you want CPR? Well, sometimes we get people you know, ideally. So let me just back up a little bit to qualify for hospice, because I think this is one of the first misconceptions to qualify for hospice you don't have to be like dying today or tomorrow. You have to have a physician say that if your disease runs its normal course, you have a life expectancy of six months or less. So that's a lot of people, because none of us have an expiration date, you know. I mean, we don't know when that is. So you know, there are some people who, yes, they qualify for that and maybe they continue to meet that criteria for two years and so they, you know, can continue to stay on hospice, as long as you know, as long as that criteria continues to be met. So some people maybe they think, well, of course, you know, like I've got, I've got cancer, but of course, if my heart stops or I stop breathing. Well, of course I want you to restart it, you know, because that doesn't seem like the natural progression in their mind, you know, maybe at that time. And so the goal is to, you know, by the time somebody is getting closer to death, to you know, to have that so that it is going to be a DNR, so that it is going to be able to be a peaceful death. But again, that's something that doesn't always happen and you know, in that situation then we tell them, you know, okay, if you know, if that's what you want, then you need to call 911 then, because we're not going to get there in time to do anything, and but that's, that's few and far between. But as far as treatment, you know, even if somebody has a DNR, that doesn't mean do not treat, that just means don't resuscitate, you know. So everything from a comfort standpoint, we're still going to be doing, and people, as long as they want to, you know, eat and drink and all of that, then absolutely do that.
Jenny Lytle :But that's the medication part is something where people get a little, you know, confused about that too. There's a lot of misconceptions in terms of end of life medication and especially morphine. Morphine is like the thing that people hear and they're like oh, I don't want morphine Because it's seen as a last. You know, once they start the morphine, then that's it. And there was some of that and that's just because people's pain wasn't treated well until then, you know, until close to death. And then it's like okay, well, now we don't have to worry about you getting addicted, which we don't have to worry about anyway when somebody is dying. But now it's.
Jenny Lytle :You know, we treat pain like from the beginning.
Jenny Lytle :If there's pain, you know, and some people don't ever have pain, some people don't ever have shortness of breath, and so, you know, not everybody.
Jenny Lytle :It's not a one size fits all approach, for sure. You know it's everything is very individualized and it's people are treated to keep them comfortable, and that depends on what their goals are too, because some people would rather be, hey, like I'm in a lot of pain, I don't wanna be, maybe my pain's a 10. I want my pain to be a two, and for some people that's not realistic anyway, but I want my pain to be as low as possible, even if that means I'm pretty groggy. And then there's others who are like I want my pain to be as low as possible, even if that means I'm pretty groggy. And then there's others who are like you know, I can deal with a five or six if that means I'm able to still be able to talk with my kids and my friends. And so it's just figuring out what people's goals of care are and and then helping them achieve that as best as we can.
Ashley :Thank you so much for explaining all that so well. You know, as you're talking and describing these things, it just makes me wish sometimes that in during life our regular medical care could be as beautifully tailored as it is at our end of life care.
Ashley :You know and I think that you guys, you just have such a great way of listening to patients, listening to their families, considering all options and then picking options that are best for them, and I just I applaud you so much, Jenny. I'm going to shift gears here just a little bit, but I want to talk a little bit about your mom and the story that's kind of transpired since then, because it's such an interesting take. I have talked to so many people who have been inspired to enter medicine because of their family members. Your mom was a nurse, You're a nurse, and I think we just we see what they're doing and we think, wow, I really, really want to do that. And your story takes even more of an interesting turn because at a certain point your mother passed away suddenly and that caused you to realize, hey, what we're doing is an amazing job and we're offering incredible care, but at what cost to us? Absolutely Right. So tell us a little bit about that discovery and then some of the really incredible things that have come out of that.
Jenny Lytle :Yeah, well, thank you. So yes, my mom, my mom and I went to LPN school together and I graduated from high school in 93. We went to LPN school and graduated together in 94, because she had always wanted to be a nurse, but instead she was a teen mom, and so so, yeah, we were we, we did that and it was, it was great. Yeah, we were we, we did that and it was, it was great. We didn't ever actually work, work together very much, but but we did some and of course, we had, you know, the same language.
Jenny Lytle :And so that was that was cool to be able to, you know, to talk to each other about things. And she had some health issues and so she had been on disability for a while and she was one of those, you know, like so many caregivers, so many people who are drawn to, you know, healthcare and helping professions. She was somebody who would do everything for everybody but herself and she had an aneurysm and it was right in the middle of her brain and she had known that it was there for a while and, like I said, she did have other things going on as well, but she was going to. She finally decided because she wasn't sure at first. You know, do I want to do anything with it? Because it's, you know, it's kind of risky with where it is and it was right there at the circle of Willis. So yeah, there at the Circle of Willis, so yeah, and so she finally decided. You know, I think I'm going to go ahead and get it taken care of soon. You know, as soon as all these other things are taken care of, that aren't quite as urgent as something getting ready to rupture in the middle of your brain. But you know, but it had been.
Jenny Lytle :So I don't know, my mom was. My mom was incredibly tough. She had been sick for a long time and had a lot of things and she was still just, she was a very strong, willed, stubborn woman. And you know when, when people are sick for so long or they've, you know, they've had something going for so long you're like, well, yeah, that's there and we know that it could do something. But come on, I mean, it's been here forever. And so, yeah, and it did rupture and I went over and found her. I was going to be taking her to the doctor and I was mad because she was running late, like she was always running late, and and I walk in and like the house was quiet and I'm like, hello, come on, you know. And nothing. And yeah, and she was agonal, breathing in the bathtub.
Jenny Lytle :And so about 30 hours later she, she passed away at the hospital on hospice, because the, the hospital nurse wasn't quite grasping like the the urgency of the situation. You know I was, I was wanting her to be more comfortable. And she's like, okay, well, you know, we can see about a morphine pump. And I'm like, okay, that's great, you know, she's been in pain for like most of her life and she's not going to be now, and she's like okay, so then she comes back. She's like, well, I put in a referral for that for in the morning. And I'm like are you seeing what I'm seeing? Because there's not an in the morning, you know.
Jenny Lytle :And so finally I was like, hmm, so thankfully I had a little bit of pull still in our local hospice. And so I'm like hey, I need you to get ahold of you know. So I'm connected with my friends. One of them was there and and she was able to get ahold of the medical director and we got things going and got mom comfortable and she was able to pass peacefully. But I realized after that that that I just like we needed to do something different, as, as healthcare providers, as people who give and give and give, it's so easy to think, oh well, I'll get around to taking care of me later. You know, I don't have time for that.
Jenny Lytle :Or you know, the old favorite self care, selfish but it's that really made me realize just how much we need to figure out how to be able to meet our own needs. And so that kind of led me on this journey of, like, what does that look like and how can it be done without having to quit work or having it feel like a another full time job or when you have a busy life, like, how do you fit that in without feeling guilty, without being exhausted, when you're already worn out? You know, how do you stop from just sitting in front of the TV and every night and vegging out, and I mean, and I do some of that too. You know, I definitely, I definitely don't have it all figured out, but what I do know is that the more that I practice what I preach, the easier it is.
Jenny Lytle :And when I do get off track because I do, I'm human and I, you know, I'm like, like I said, I want to do everything, and so when I do that, then I'm able to just rein it back in more quickly and and figure out because I I put together a, a process for for doing that, and basically it's about, it's all about personalizing what self care looks like for us, so kind of like in hospice, where we, you know, tailor that to the individual person and meet them where they're at. That's that's the same way I do with you know, with myself and with my clients. Is is really figuring out, like, what do I need most right now? And and thinking about the things that matter to me, because they may be completely different than the things that fill you up.
Ashley :Absolutely no. That's so perfect, and thank you for sharing that story about your mom. I think so often people assume that, as healthcare professionals, we have everything on lock in our own lives when it comes to healthcare and the healthcare of our family. And we're laughing because it's not true.
Ashley :No, not at all true, and even when you enter the hospital, and this is a place where you can be very comfortable with somebody who is dying, who you love. But you have been around that situation. You know it's still very challenging sometimes, um, for you emotionally, but also the whole process, the whole thing. Like you said, um, let's talk about your book. Self-care isn't. Self-care isn't. Oh my gosh, self-care isn't selfish.
Jenny Lytle :It's not shellfish either.
Ashley :It is definitely not shellfish. Self-care isn't selfish. It shares actionable strategies for healthcare providers and for caregivers. So I kind of. This is a two-part question. Number one as a healthcare professional, how would we know when we need your book? How would we know when we need to look at and and contact you to talk about some of these things? What would we be looking for in our own lives?
Jenny Lytle :Really, I think it's that, that feeling like you just don't have enough time, like you can't do enough, like you're always behind, Like you're frustrated and don't have enough time, like you can't do enough, like you're always behind, like you're frustrated and don't know why. Or the one that I fall into is, well, as soon as X, then Y, as soon as I get done with this thing, as soon as this, and then I realize it just keeps on. You know, there's not, it's like a to-do list. You know who gets done with their to-do list. I mean, you may knock some things off, but you know I've. I'm like, look at that, I marked four things off today, I added six, but I knocked four off. And it's like that. It's just when you keep thinking well, soon I'll, and then that's for me that's a big trigger when I know, okay, like I've got to do, I've got to do something different. And we do have those seasons in our lives. But also, if we're not intentional about it, even when we do have those seasons, and then we let off, Like I know, for me, when I get overextended, when I've let go of the self-care a little too long, then I'll think okay, you know what, I'm just going to keep pushing through this right now, but next week, you know I'll look and I'm like, okay, this is a big week right now.
Jenny Lytle :But you know I've got Monday and Tuesday where you know I've got some space. I can get a bunch of this stuff done. Almost every time, Monday or Tuesday, one of those days I'll wake up, and I did that this week. I woke up and I was like my head hurts so bad, Like I felt like I was so hungover I was not, but I mean my, I just I ended up needing to sleep more. I had to take, you know, my migraine medicine and I'm like, okay, so there goes some of those days.
Jenny Lytle :And a big part of that is I know I need massages, like every four to six weeks. That's kind of my sweet spot. It's been since January, just because of life and because of money and because of you know, all those things. It's like I'm just going to wait on that just a little bit longer and my body's going hey, hey, longer is up, Longer is over. Yes, yes, but it's knowing those kind of things about ourselves. And so back to your initial question of how would somebody know? Part of that too is, if you think okay, I know something needs to be different and I don't know, we're probably gonna say something about this at the end, but you can get a free copy of my, of my book, on my website, which is Jenny Lytlecom, or you can just go to self care isn't selfishcom? And get that too. But but yeah, it's just a great place to start.
Jenny Lytle :It's a it's a short book. I kept it. I kept it little because, well, partly because I don't have a long attention span. I know you probably can't tell that, but also, the people who really need it aren't people who are going to sit down and read a 300 page book on, you know. So it's, it's something where you can. You can read it very quickly. You know it's probably going to take you two or three hours if you read it straight through and if not, it's very easy to, you know, flip through and do little bits at a time.
Ashley :Absolutely fantastic, Jenny, and of course you're incredible, because that was the part two of my question is where?
Ashley :do we go next from here as we wrap up. It has just been such an incredible conversation and I feel so motivated. Number one, to go schedule a massage I'm doing that today yeah, good idea. But number two, just to listen better and to consider more things and then to take care of myself as well. So it is so important because, like you said, you cannot pour from an empty cup right, it's just not possible. If you had somebody ask you or somebody say I'm not strong enough for medicine or I'm not strong enough for a field like hospice, what would you? What would you say to that person?
Jenny Lytle :You know there there are a lot of people who say you know, oh, I could never do that and you know it's. I would say it's probably not what you think it is and it just it. It depends on where your, your passions and your gifts lie, like I've done, I've done some ER, I've done a little bit of stuff and I liked it. But like I really like the, the one-on-one, the touchy-feely parts, you know. So if you're somebody, you know it's what people oh, you know I just care too much. I couldn't do that. Well, okay, so I guess I don't care, but I do. You know that I really do. But it is so, so important to end up having boundaries and having ways to take care of yourself, because it does. It is, you know, compassion, fatigue is a real thing. It does get heavy at times and you do get attached to people. You know I never want to get to where I don't care. So you know I cry with a lot of my patients and families and when I get to a point where I'm just like just another day, then I'm done because I don't want to be that person. But it's just being able to get clear on what it is that matters most to you. And I think if it's something where you're like, I don't know, but check it out. You know, if it's something that you feel kind of like I don't know, it's a maybe there's something there, then then you know, look into it.
Jenny Lytle :It's it's not for everybody for sure, but it's a different. It's definitely a different way of looking at health care and and it's something to that, sometimes people feel like, well, you know, I'm going to lose all of my skills or whatever if I'm doing that. And I mean there are some things that you know that we don't do, obviously, in hospice, that we would be doing in a hospital. But I also realized one day, because I used to, you know, kind of think well, you know that there's so much thought about, you know people who work in hospitals. They're the. When you say you're a nurse, you know it's like, oh well, what hospital do you work at?
Jenny Lytle :It's like you know most nurses don't work in hospitals, but that's OK, but it's. But it's when you're out with somebody in the middle of the night, you have what's available in the home and you know, maybe some a catheter and some other random supplies you know basic wound care supplies in your car and there's something going on. I mean you've got to, you've got to pull out the MacGyver stops and figure out you know how am I going to, how am I going to manage this, and but that's one of the things that's kind of that's kind of fun about it if you're wired that way.
Ashley :The creativity there Absolutely. And I'm so glad you mentioned just knowing your own innate gifts too, because I do think, and of course I laughed hysterically when you said, well, I must not care, because, like, that's just the perfect answer to when people ask you about knowing, knowing your innate gifts will. It's not to say that if you don't have those gifts you won't do well in hospice, but it just, god, it makes the road so much easier. You know, if you are the person that can emote with a patient, that can sit there and feel what they're feeling, because the good Lord knows, when I am that patient, I would like to have a provider sitting there with me saying you know, I understand.
Jenny Lytle :I feel.
Ashley :I feel that you know, I don't want somebody who's been heartened by their life in medicine just kind of staring at me, watching, watching me cry Right Right. I so appreciate it. Jenny, you mentioned a couple of places where we could find you. Where can we find you if we are looking for more information or just to learn more about this incredible field?
Jenny Lytle :Sure. So if you go to Jenny Lytlecom, that's, that's where you can. Everything's attached there. But you can see you can get the free copy of my book. You can see other things that I have to offer. I do some blogging. I've got a newsletter that actually comes out three times a week that that just really goes into very simple, practical tips for for being able to fit in self-care and stress relief into busy lives.
Ashley :Fabulous, Jenny. Thank you so much. Thank you for spending the time and sharing your story with us on Shadow Me Next. I appreciate you.
Jenny Lytle :Thank you so much, Ashley. I appreciate the time.
Ashley :Thank you so very much for listening to this episode of Shadow Me Next. If you liked this episode or if you think it could be useful for a friend, please subscribe and invite them to join us next Monday, as always. If you have any questions, let me know on Facebook or Instagram Access. You want stories you need? You're always invited to Shadow Me Next.
