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Reading the Room: The Art of Connecting with Young Patients | Rachelle Hodel, APRN

• Ashley Love • Season 1 • Episode 41

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When Rachelle Hodel set her sights on working with babies, nothing would stand in her way, not even the absence of a job posting. Armed with determination and a freshly written cover letter, she walked straight into the nursery manager's office and launched a 15-year career in labor and delivery.

That same decisive spirit guided her next evolution when family needs called for a more flexible schedule. While raising three daughters and working part-time, Rachelle completed her nurse practitioner degree online, eventually finding her true calling in pediatrics where she's spent nearly a decade building relationships with children from birth through adolescence.

On this episode of Shadow Me Next, Rachelle brings us into the nuanced world of pediatric care, where success depends on your ability to read the room and adapt your approach instantly. For teenagers needing connection, she kicks back and creates a relaxed environment where they might actually open up. With younger children, she skips the intimidating white coat in favor of Disney t-shirts. This chameleon-like ability to meet patients where they are allows her to address not just physical health but critical conversations about bullying, mental health, and self-confidence.

The weight of responsibility in pediatrics is immense. These early health foundations shape entire lives. Rachelle navigates this responsibility with both professional expertise and personal warmth, creating such powerful bonds that during a recent medical leave, patients repeatedly called asking, "Is Rachelle back yet?"

Despite acknowledging medicine's broken systems, Rachelle remains optimistic about healthcare careers, believing the right people in the right roles can heal the profession itself. Her advice to aspiring clinicians? Explore widely, trust your instincts, and maintain flexibility. You never know where your medical journey might lead you next.

Subscribe to Shadow Me Next for more conversations with healthcare professionals who are reshaping medicine one patient at a time.

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Ashley :

Hello and welcome to Shadow Me Next, a podcast where I take you into and behind the scenes of the medical world to provide you with a deeper understanding of the human side of medicine. I'm Ashley, a physician assistant, medical editor, clinical preceptor and the creator of Shadow Me Next. It is my pleasure to introduce you to incredible members of the healthcare field and uncover their unique stories, the joys and challenges they face and what drives them in their careers. It's access you want and stories you need, whether you're a pre-health student or simply curious about the healthcare field. I invite you to join me as we take a conversational and personal look into the lives and minds of leaders in medicine. I don't want you to miss a single one of these conversations, so make sure that you subscribe to this podcast, which will automatically notify you when new episodes are dropped, and follow us on Instagram and Facebook at shadow me next, where we will review highlights from this conversation and where I'll give you sneak previews of our upcoming guests.

Ashley :

When Rochelle Hodel first became a nurse, she quickly realized she had one dream to work with babies. She chased that dream fearlessly, walking into the nursery manager's office with a resume and a cover letter, not even knowing if there was a position open. That leap of faith led to 15 years in labor and delivery, caring for families during some of the most important moments of their life. But life changes and Rochelle knew she wanted a career that would grow with her family. She returned to school online while raising three kids and eventually found her home in pediatrics. For nearly a decade she's been guiding children from newborns to teens, building bonds that last years and sometimes entire childhoods. In this episode, rochelle talks about the privilege and responsibility of shaping health foundations in kids, the art of reading the room to truly connect with patients, and why some of the most important conversations in pediatrics have nothing to do with lab results and everything to do with bullying, confidence and mental health. She also shares how she navigates the hard moments, the ones she can't fix right away, and why she still believes medicine can be unbroken by the right people in the right roles. Please keep in mind that the content of this podcast is intended for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be considered as professional medical advice. The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the host and guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any other agency, organization, employer or company.

Ashley :

This is Shadow Me Next with Rochelle Hodel. Rochelle, thank you so much for joining me on Shadow Me Next. It is just such a pleasure to have you here. I am so excited to talk to you about your path to medicine, what you do on a daily basis. Thank you for joining us. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me. So let's start at the very, very beginning. What first inspired you to pursue a career in medicine generally? And then how did you pick being a nurse practitioner in primary care family medicine? Oh, that's a very good question.

Rachelle:

So I guess I was influenced by my older sister. She went into nursing before I did and I guess as a kid right you know, growing up I always had this kind of like motherly, take care of people instinct because I had great, a great mom, great grandmas, all of that stuff to kind of like guide me into that personality, character traits, that sort of thing. So I really honestly did not consider any other career path and I always knew I loved kids, but I especially loved babies. So that was my goal. My goal was to work with babies. So I went to nursing school, loved it, had a great time, learned so much, I excelled and really really enjoyed like labor, delivery, nursery. Just something clicked with me. So I started working as a nurse tech my senior year of college and then I decided you know what? I'm just going to write up a resume and I found out where the nurse manager's office was for the nursery and labor and delivery department and I just wrote up a little cover letter and I put it on her desk and, lo and behold, stars aligned and I got the job. So I didn't even check to see if there was a position open or not, I just went for it. So that was like my dream job. I loved it. I loved every minute of it. I spent 15 years there.

Rachelle:

Of course, you know, when you work in a hospital, it's a 24-7 operation. There's no, you know. So there's weekends, there's holidays, there's call Started a family. So I have three kids and I have three girls, and so then I just got to this feeling that I was ready for something more. I think, after you're in a job for about five plus years, you really have had the life experiences. You got your feet wet, you felt comfortable. Then you grow on that, you grow on that, you grow on that, and I got to a point where I was really confident in what I was doing.

Rachelle:

But then I thought, what else could I do? What, what? What else could I do, you know? So then I decided I was going to try to look into something, a career path that was a little bit more family friendly, so that I could go to the sporting events after school, the school events, things like that, and so then I started looking at nurse practitioner. So that's what I did. So, um, crazy enough, I got my degree online, with three kids at home and working part time, thankfully, and then it just fit. I just, I mean, I was scared to death at first, because it'd been 15 years since I went back to school, but I did it. And then I started out in what's called internal medicine, slash pediatrics so, but I dealt mostly with adults, but my passion was still with kids and with babies, and so I was thankful enough that a position came up with our pediatric group, and so that's where I've been for the last like nine plus years.

Ashley :

This is so important for a lot of people not just women, men as well to understand is it's so important to find a career that can really shift with you and shift with your life, and and and and I think that well, number one, it just makes it makes your life a little bit easier. But number two, it really helps prevent burnout and it helps prevent those feelings where you think I need to be somewhere different and I I can't be here because I need to be there. And being able to be flexible and shift, I think is one of the absolute gems of working in nursing Um, and you can you really make it your own. You know, and I love that. You knew. I mean, it was just, oh, get after it. That's what I tell my students all the time. It was just well, get after it. That's what I tell my students all the time.

Ashley :

If you see something you want, get after it. And that's exactly what you did. You said you put your resume together cover letter, threw it on a desk of somebody that you knew was in leadership, and and look what's happened. So so you're working in pediatrics. Is it pediatrics and adult medicine? Both?

Rachelle:

No, I did that at first and then now I've transitioned to just pediatrics.

Ashley :

So newborn through 18, 19 year olds, oh, that's an incredible job, and this is the thing about pediatrics which I would love to hear you elaborate on is your patient is a pediatric patient, but your education is not just for them. It's also, I would imagine, for their caregivers, their parents, their grandparents, the people who are taking care of these kiddos. What is that like Exactly?

Rachelle:

So it's like I have more than one patient at a time. So, yeah, my focus is actually on the kiddo, but a large majority of the visit is parent education. Large majority of the visit is parent education, parent reassurance, parent support, parent guidance. But then you know, you get your older kiddos and so then I'm more focused on them, but the parents in the room and I can see them out of my peripheral vision nodding or throwing them under the bus or whatever. But yeah, it is definitely a group effort but I love it. I love it. I feel like it is a huge privilege to be there to take care of their kids, that they trust me to take care of their kids and to see them grow up. That's what I love the most about it.

Ashley :

I mean, it's all such formative years as we all know, those first years of life. I distinctly remember some of the things my pediatrician told me when I was growing up, like a lot of it had to do with building muscle and eating healthy and things that you know. As a 14 year old kiddo I just thought, oh, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. But now, as a much, much, much older person, you know yeah, yeah, yeah. But now, as a much, much, much older person, I think, whoa, she was totally right. You know, building those foundations is key. Um, the weight of what you do, I'm sure, feels very heavy at times. How do you balance that? I mean, you are establishing these health foundations for these kids that that will carry them literally for the rest of their life. Is that difficult? Have you developed tactics to have those conversations with them?

Rachelle:

Some of those conversations can be difficult, but I always go back to I need to tell them this or I need to educate them on this, because I don't know what they get outside of here. So if I'm the only one that's going to tell them, then so be it. I'll be the only one. So I think at first it was hard but, like any new job, you learn, you grow, you keep doing it over and over and you find a groove, and so I feel like a lot of these kids. I can kind of read them a little bit and then, you know, I just kind of go from there. So if it's a shy kid versus a non-engaged kid, versus a kid who you know is just longing for some type of support and attention, I think my approach is different.

Ashley :

Here at Shadow Me. Next, we like to talk about quality questions. These are questions that you might hear while interviewing for your pre health professional school. Rochelle and I didn't have a chance to talk about a quality question, but this situation that she's describing brings up one I've heard, and it led to a rather awkward conversation. A rather awkward conversation.

Ashley :

Tell me about a time you witnessed a clinician who did not read the room. How did this make you feel? How do you think the patient felt? In pediatrics especially, your clinical plan only works if your patient and their family are on board. Rochelle reminded me that one of the most valuable skills you can have in medicine is the ability to read the room. That means meeting people where they are, whether it's sitting back and relaxing with a teenager who's guarded or leaning in with extra reassurance for a worried parent. This question challenges you to think beyond the medical chart. How should you adjust your approach so that your patients feel seen, understood and ready to work with you? Keep in mind that there's more interview prep, such as mock interviews and personal statement review over on shadowmenextcom. There you'll find amazing resources to help you as you prepare to answer your own quality questions to help you as you prepare to answer your own quality questions.

Rachelle:

So I try to meet them where they're at, but yet still be in a professional role. But you know, sometimes if it's a teenager and I try to like, relate with them, I'll just sit down, we'll just kick back, we'll just be relaxed, you know, and I'll just try to get them to open up to me and then share what I need to share with them. And then I can tell I mean, obviously there's some kids who are like I don't want to be here, I'm not going to listen to you, and I just say flat out okay, I get it, you probably don't want to hear this, but this is my job, so I'm just going to have to be short and sweet with you and then I just tell them, you know, but then you get these other kids who are like just starving for information and starving for attention. So I enjoy being that person for them and building that bond and telling them that at the end of the visit, you know, I just want you to make good choices and if you need anything, I want you to call me, and so then I'll give them my office number and make sure that they have it, and same with the parents.

Rachelle:

You know, I've just told them time and time again. There's no dumb question. We are here for you. I've been there in your shoes before, you know. If there's anything you ever need, please don't hesitate to call us.

Ashley :

It's so interesting because I think so often the outside perspective of medicine is that we walk in, we make a diagnosis, we formulate a plan and then we move on to the next patient and so much, especially in pediatrics, I would imagine so much of what we do is reading the room. You have to read the room because you can formulate a plan, you can make a diagnosis until the cows come home. But the other element that people don't realize is you have to get your patient on the same page you are, so that they will do these things that we are recommending and they will follow along. And being on the same page starts with reading the room and meeting people where you are. Like you said, I love.

Ashley :

I love it when our teenage patients come in and I get to kick back and relax with them. Truly kick back Like you do. You get down in your seat, you get your feet up, you lean back. It's just your whole body changes, your your body language changes and, um, it's a. That's something that you learn, I think, just doing it. I mean, they don't teach you this in school.

Rachelle:

No, no, absolutely not. But you know, you've always been a witness to a medical encounter where the doctor or the provider comes in and they're just straight to the point. You know, we're going to do this, we're going to, and it's just, and then they're gone. Going to do this, we're going to, and it's just, and then they're gone. I'm sorry, but that doesn't resonate with me and I'm sure it doesn't resonate with other people. But it's like how are you going to get compliance if you don't first build some type of a trusting relationship, so with these kids?

Rachelle:

If I come in and I wear scrubs, I wear Disney T-shirts, I mean, I don't wear a white coat. So if I feel like if I go in there all sturdy and professional and stuff, they're going to be more intimidated perhaps At least some kids and they're not going to want to share things with me. But if I, you know, look like the average Joe and I try to lead them, you know where they're at, and I try to get some sort of trust with them, that usually goes over a lot better.

Ashley :

I'm so glad you brought that up and actually it's a perfect segue into one of the other things that I wanted to talk about, which was you mentioned the fact that sometimes the things that you talk to these, these patients, about other people might not be talking to them. So it has to be you. It has to be you in pediatrics, and and you mentioned taking off your white coat, which I just love so much what would you say for somebody like me who isn't in pediatrics, but maybe we'll see pediatric patients? What are some things that you wish we would talk to our, our kiddo patients about more things like, I mean, do you want, do you want us to, to be talking to them about bullies, like in germ? We see that a lot. Oh, you have acne. Um, tell me about why you're here today. Somebody's bullying you in school because of your acne. Let's not talk about your acne, let's talk about bullying. What are some other big, big conversations that you expect the clinicians in other fields of medicine to be having with our kiddo patients?

Rachelle:

Well, that is a good. That is a very good topic. Mental health in kids is huge. It's probably some of my more challenging visits and a lot of it is based upon some bullying, some sort of past trauma and trying to get them to have self-esteem, have the self-confidence to and that's just. That comes with maturity. But having someone to say I see you, I validate your feelings. No one's trying to tell you to feel differently, but you know you are in charge of you and unfortunately we cannot change other people's. You know behaviors years, but we can help you to build the coping skills, to build the shield that you need in order to get through your school day. School years, especially like those junior high years, they're rough.

Ashley :

They're really rough.

Rachelle:

And you know, having raised, I have three girls I've been through junior high three times. I still had one in high school. But it's just, I guess, just kind of prepping your kids more for social relationships, you know, and just having like real conversations Like, okay, you're going to get exposed to this, you're going to do this, let's. Let's maybe like ask or say, like when somebody says this to you, you know what could be your response, and just like a lot of very much so talking about relationships and maybe what to expect. And then there's the whole aspect of health and taking care of your body, and it is so much easier to let your kid just eat whatever they want, but no, you know. So starting, you know, I try to get my families when the kids are young and we're starting foods and going into the toddler phase and going into the early school phase of you're in charge of what they are eating. If you don't buy it, they can't eat it, you know, type of thing. And so, yes, you can still have all your fun foods and things like that, but it's just like you set the example. If you've always done it that way, they don't know any different, and so then that's how they grow and you, just you, won the battle, you know. But you can't start the battle when they're 12, 13. And now you want them to. Oh, you're not eating enough fruits or vegetables and you're not, you know, doing it. No, that's going to be a little harder to change and also, that's another thing that you know that I wish that happened a little bit more often.

Rachelle:

But, and also I tell parents like, yes, you want your kids to love you. Yes, you want your kids to, you know, come to you, but you can't be their friends, you know, per se, you know you're still the parent, you still set the guidelines, you still set the boundaries, but you do it in a loving and supportive way so that they are, you are their safety net. But at the end of the day, if they, you know you set the consequences for any behaviors that you do not feel are, you know, correct. So a lot of times, parents will come to me with teenagers who have crossed the line after line after line after line, and then they want me to fix them.

Rachelle:

I can't fix them in a 20 minute appointment, you know. It's just like so that that's another, you know, challenge too, but it's just parenting's hard. Parenting is very hard. It is not easy. It is much easier to give in to your children, but it's not going to benefit them. So that's another thing that I like to do with parents is just offer them support, offer them guidance. Just keep doing what you're doing, or you know they're still going to love you, you know, if you tell them no.

Ashley :

What a concept. What a concept. It's true, it's true, and I'm like putting my parent hat on and not my my clinician hat on right now. But I some of the best advice, obviously, that I get as a mom comes from my pediatrician, comes from the clinicians that are seeing my kids and helping me figure out what I need to do and how I need to approach this, and I am so grateful for them. I'm so grateful for them and the way that they, first of all, love my kiddos and I'm sure you feel the same way. It's just such a special, unique field of medicine because, truly, I feel like my pediatrician loves my children and it's an interesting thing because you've seen these kids grow and you've seen them develop. You guys probably develop these really tight bonds with these kiddos, yeah.

Rachelle:

Yes, yes, very much so, and that's one of the things that I love the most about my job. I love seeing them grow up. I love seeing them on my schedule and being so excited and luckily I get to do that quite often and luckily I get to do that quite often so it really like reaffirms. This is where I need to be, because that feeling that I get when I get to see these kids and I unfortunately had to be out of work on an extended medical leave not that long ago and I mean like I was gone for like six plus months and I kept hearing from the nurses these families would call in is Rochelle back yet? Is Rochelle back? Is she coming back? Are you sure she's coming back? You know, because some of their kids now, some of these kids now will only see me. They don't want to see the doctor. They only will see me because I've formed that bond with them.

Ashley :

No, it's true, and there's a dichotomy there, because that is so meaningful for us, right. But at the same time it can be really challenging for you, especially when you are trying to take care of your own medical issues and things like this the wonderful and the joyous moments of pediatrics. But I'm sure there's some really tough times too. How do you navigate that? I mean, does that just wreck? You Are those days where you just go home and you say I'm just gonna look forward to tomorrow.

Rachelle:

You know yeah yeah, there's always those days, but I feel like you're always gonna have that in pretty much whatever profession that you have. That's what makes the better days better. But I guess the most challenging are the ones that I can't fix right away, because I'm a fixer, you know, if I see a problem, if I see a kiddo struggling, I want to fix it and I want to fix it now.

Rachelle:

But I've learned. Unfortunately that's not always the case. I've gotten more comfortable with not knowing, but I always reassure my families. I'm not really sure right now, but you know what. We're going to figure this out, I promise you. I will get you in touch with the right specialist. We'll involve all of our team. You know things like that. So the ones that I just can't fix right away, the ones that I know it's going to be a longer journey, those are pretty stressful. The ones that come in that perhaps have I found two kiddos with pretty large tumors in their abdomen, and that's pretty rare and I've had two of them now. So having to maintain that sense of calmness on the exterior when on the inside I'm 99% certain what this is and not to try to, you know, scare the parent too much. But those are challenging as well and those weigh on me and I think about them and think about them. But luckily that's not every day.

Ashley :

And we rely a lot on our education. I think in those moments and I would imagine you rely on your expertise in those moments I think sometimes, in some situations, parents even appreciate you, saying you know what this is hard and this is scary, and I don't know, and I'm sorry, but we will figure this out and I will get you to where you need to be. And I dread the day that we don't feel those and I will get you to where you need to be and, and you know I, I dread the day that we don't feel those things when we get home. I dread the day when we just say okay, bow and walk out the room and don't think about it again.

Ashley :

You know so, as much as it does hurt us to see kiddos with you know abdominal masses and not know um, well, at the same time, thank God, it does still hurt, because that is why we do what we do and that's why we're so um, that's why we're not well, we're not robots. That's how we're going to be replaced by robots. You know, thank goodness, what would you tell a pre-health student and this is a pre-PA, pre-nursing, pre-med student about medicine in general? You know, all they're hearing recently is it's broken and there's problems and people are getting burned out, but you and I know better, I think. And what would you tell them to inspire them?

Rachelle:

Yeah, I would say go with your gut, you know, and the thing about medicine is there's so many different avenues that you can explore. And to try to navigate these avenues, a little bit, Reflect on how you're feeling as you navigate these. You know pathways, see what clicks, see what doesn't. And that's the beauty of nursing medicine is there is something for everyone. Unfortunately, yes, some parts of medicine are broken, but I have the faith that it can be unbroken with the right people and the right systems in place. And just, it is just a. It's a rewarding, it's challenging, but, yes, it's not for everyone too, you know. But if it's something that you feel, that is something that you want to do, then explore it.

Rachelle:

And there's so much to explore, so don't just stop at one thing either. So even if you say you land in pediatrics and that's just not your cup of tea, after a while guess what? There's lots of other things that you can explore. And and that's just not your cup of tea, after a while, guess what? There's lots of other things that you can explore. And so that's another reason why I went through family nurse practitioner is because it did not limit me. It made me a little bit more marketable when I was done and I can go all of these different avenues, whereas somebody who had I worked with pediatric nurse practitioners. That's all that they can do. So that's another thing that I would probably tell people is to get a degree, but get a degree where you can still branch out.

Ashley :

No, that's great advice. You know, don't niche down too hard early because you don't know where you're going to end up. You don't know what you're going to love and, like I said before, the nursing field is so great for that, and I love the way that you said. Medicine can be unbroken. We can, we can fix this and it's going to take people and it's going to take good people in good positions, ones that, like you said, they they know their strengths and they know where they belong. So, rochelle, thank you so much. Thank you for joining us. I'm just so grateful for you and for your time. Thank you for joining us on Shadow Me Next. Thank you so much, ashley. Thank you so very much for listening to this episode of Shadow Me Next. If you liked this episode or if you think it could be useful for a friend, please subscribe and invite them to join us next Monday, as always. If you have any questions, let me know on Facebook or Instagram Access. You want stories you need. You're always invited to shadow me next.

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Ashley Love

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