The Lethal Library

16. From Trust to Tragedy: The Disappearance of Denise Williams

• The Lethal Library • Episode 16

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Welcome to another wild ride in the Lethal Library with Stephanie and Dani as they unravel the tragic tale of Denise Williams. Picture this: a prison riot, heaps of drugs, and the unfortunate misuse of a young woman as an informant. Denise Williams, a 27-year-old informant for the Nampa Police Department, mysteriously vanished in September 1987, only for her body to resurface almost a year later. With details emerging about coercion by the police and a brutal murder orchestrated by drug dealers, this story brings out the gritty underbelly of a small Idaho town. Dive into the chaos, inconsistencies in police practices, and the aftermath, including a riot that ended with the murder of suspect Richard Holmes. This episode is packed with all the elements of a gritty crime saga!

Contact The Lethal Library at TheLethalLibrary@gmail.com. Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok!

Dani:

Welcome to the Lethal Library. Welcome, I'm Stephanie. I'm Tani.

Stephanie:

And today, Dani is going to tell us another story, which I've heard little tidbits of. Can I spoil it a little bit? Yes! I've heard rumors of a prison riot. Drugs. Lots of drugs. Lots of drugs. And there's three main suspects, I guess, so it seems like a very juicy tale.

Dani:

It's really hard when I'm, when I am researching these because we don't just hang out to record, we're, we hang out other times. And I'm just like, oh my god, I can't wait. So hopefully I didn't build you up too much and hopefully you enjoy it. this is this is a messy one. There's lots of people stuff.

Stephanie:

Okay, I will do my best to be keeping notes and.

Dani:

Was Denise Williams wanting to really help the Nampa Police Department, or was she forced? What responsibility does the Nampa Police Department hold in this case? In this story, there are undercover informants, lots of drugs, and multiple murderers, and even a prison riot. It's gonna be wild, folks. 1987. The last time 27 year old Denise Williams was seen was on September 18, 1987. She left her house with a man she knew and his friend to grab some beers at a local convenience store. In December, the Nampa police are asking for help to locate her.

Stephanie:

A few months later, NPD, I'm already, we know the NPD, not personally.

Dani:

The Nampa Police Department said Denise was an informant for the department and had helped solve at least seven cases. And they believe she is dead.

Stephanie:

She was helping them a lot, seven cases to be solved because of her.

Dani:

Yeah, she knew what was going down. Detective Alan Creech, a different Creech, which can I just relation, was the bane of my existence during the Creech research because he came up in so many, so many searches. I'm just like you, Alan, I don't want you Alan. Detective Alan Creech said we have tried to convince her that her life was in danger. The department found Denise employment and a place to live in neighboring Boise. But Denise refused to locate. A close friend of Denise, Liz Meininger, spoke out against the police department. Liz had last seen Denise four days before her disappearance. Denise told her 24 hour surveillance was being provided and that she thought her life was in danger. Liz said that Denise was asked three different times by the MPD to work as an informant. And she finally agreed. Pressure. Well, they have a little something on her. Detective Creech met Denise when he had given her a hundred dollar citation for the marijuana possession and a summons to appear in court. She had three plans. In her house, that she was holding for a friend while they moved.

Stephanie:

She's just being a plant mama.

Dani:

Yeah. Come on, plant girlies. Shouldn't you hold some plants for your friend? Absolutely. You gotta move. Oh, you don't want them inside. storage. They'll be sad.

Stephanie:

No, bring him here. We'll give him some sunlight.

Dani:

Liz said that the police told Denise that they would not fine her and would dismiss the charges if she agreed to work as an informant

Stephanie:

for three plants. That is wild. I thought it would be something much, much worse. But I mean, in Idaho, that is very, very bad, very bad.

Dani:

Denise was financially financially. Yeah. Not doing well. So a hundred dollar fine was huge for her and you know, if you don't pay your fines you go to jail I mean so we can be like a hundred bucks. Well, this first of all is back in the 80s but also she didn't have that kind of extra money, so

Stephanie:

No, and this starts the cycle of oh, so then I get to go to jail. I get to lose my job Maybe I lose my car and my home And

Dani:

children.

Stephanie:

So then,

Dani:

desperate situation. Detective Creech denied that there was a request, for surveillance from Denise. She just wanted to for fun, obviously.

Stephanie:

She's like, you know what, I've always wanted to be an informant.

Dani:

Well, but I think, what, what Liz is saying is that she was nervous. what I'm understanding is that she wanted surveillance and thought it was being provided for her, so she wasn't sweating it.

Stephanie:

She's like, they've got me, I've asked, they're gonna be around.

Dani:

I've got them seven. Yeah, like seven times and It wasn't that big. I don't know. Nampa wasn't that big. I don't know what They were thinking the police department It would soon become obvious who who would be the common link

Stephanie:

After seven.

Dani:

Yeah, so Creech said he did not force Denise to be an informant He simply told her there could be an that she could be an informant When her citation was issued, you know how that went down.

Stephanie:

Well, and to have to do it seven times for a 100 fine for three plants. That's ridiculous. Like I thought that we were gonna be like, oh she was transporting on her boat 300 pounds of cocaine. Sure. Yeah, I could see you having to really provide something multiple times, right? Three plants. Civilian possession. This is wild that they had someone that's not experienced in this position.

Dani:

Two weeks after her citation was issued, Denise, pled guilty to marijuana possession. And then she came to the police and said she wanted to help. Creech said, quote, she felt God was compelling her to help with a drug problem. She was under no compulsion to work with me. I'm gonna, I'm gonna say fat mouth.

Stephanie:

You really, yes, I, I agree because it's like She had to plead guilty still.

Dani:

Mm hmm.

Stephanie:

So what do they do? Just waive her fine and put it on her record? What did they, what was she offered in exchange?

Dani:

Exactly.

Stephanie:

I don't think that she was like, you know, since you did catch me I did read my Bible a few times and I've decided this is my calling. I don't think so.

Dani:

Detective Creech said people who want to become informants must first sign a contract stating they are volunteering for the position. But sometimes police, quote, make deals with people to work as informants in exchange for paying citations.

Stephanie:

So it's not necessarily a hundred percent voluntary in my eyes. That's a little bit under duress.

Dani:

Corsive?

Stephanie:

You're not doing it just because you were bored one day and said, you know what? I've been thinking endlessly on what I can do to help the NPD. I've been dreaming about it. So I better just go there. No, no big deal that if I have to go to jail, I'll lose.

Dani:

Is my livelihood.

Stephanie:

I just wanna help. Help these good

Dani:

boys and blue out. No, Denise worked with the department for three months for a small fee, so I think she was making a little money on the side. and I think that they paid her citation, but also, in three months, seven people get busted.

Stephanie:

That's

Dani:

very

Stephanie:

dangerous. there's no way that certain people aren't realizing who's running in certain circles and It becomes very obvious very fast. What's the common denominator?

Dani:

According to Creech, Denise was a cut above the rest of the informants. Oh. Yeah, seven in three months.

Stephanie:

They should have known and been like, slow down girl. Like, what are you doing to protect yourself? Because how do they not know that you're telling on them?

Dani:

Denise's sister, Diane Vaughn blames the Nampa police for her disappearance. Quote, if she was really up against a brick wall, if the situation was as Creech says, why didn't they move her butt out of state? Because they are, they're coming out and they're saying, Oh, we think she's probably dead, right? After two months of her being, you know, disappearing. If they knew anything, I mean, why would they? Keep her, they're just getting the, getting it while the getting's good. I believe that. Diane said the department should have forced her sister to leave if they were that concerned about her well being

Stephanie:

or at least been like we know the timeline of employment as an informant and this isn't good. Like you're, I mean you're

Dani:

crushing it, but you're also putting your life in severe danger. Yeah. Instead, Of moving her out of the area, they found her a minimum wage job in Boise, but she never secured a place for her to live. Quote, she, this is her sister, quote, she didn't get any credit for what she's done for the Nampa police. Now there's the possibility that she's dead, and now that's her fault? Isn't she entitled to the protection we're afforded by law? The police seem to be writing this case off and saying, oh, it's just another druggie, and that's not right. According to Diane, Denise refused to leave Nampa after contacting 17 different parties about renting a place in Boise. 17? Yeah, she's trying

Stephanie:

to find a place. That's all. And we know how it is with renting. They want an application, probably an application fee. I'm sure it wasn't as much back then, but still. You don't have 17 if they're 10 each. Now, we're talking 170 like

Dani:

well, they determined these places that were renting had determined that She couldn't afford rent and daycare costs on the minimum wage job that that the MPD had found for her over there So so

Stephanie:

she's it was they've placed her in between a rock and a hard place. She's like we're doing our best

Dani:

Yeah, here's a minimum wage job in Boise And you know, historically, Boise has been more expensive than Nampa. And she might have been getting aid here in Canyon County. Who knows, you know, how that was working. But, she tried to go over there. And, by the way, I don't think that that would have

Stephanie:

No, Nampa to Boise is a 20 minute drive. 20 to 45 minutes, depending where you're going.

Dani:

Hmm, and traffic. We

Stephanie:

do have freeways here, contrary to popular belief. There is a freeway that will lead you straight from Nampa to Boise, or even Caldwell to Boise. Can you believe it? I know. Like you can get somewhere. There's paved roads. but no. Multiple lanes too. I mean it was small enough back then that I can see it could have made some difference. But, like you said, moving a town over, two towns over, that's not gonna do anything.

Dani:

Meridian didn't even count as a, as a town. It's like a half a town at that point. Yeah, it was a town and a half over. It's huge now, so. Diane first reported her sister missing at 9pm on September 19th. Diane called Detective Creech at home on September 20th. The family knew what was going down. I mean, for her sister to have this detective's number at home. Diane called Detective Creech at home on September 20th, and he said, quote, She probably went out and got drunk someplace and fell asleep. Oh, this is just rude. If I was, oh my god, I'd be livid if I was her sister. I mean, and she is, she's upset. Diane says her sister has never been irresponsible to her children or her family. She would have never gone out all night and not come back.

Stephanie:

And just for that to be your first response, even if you're thinking it, maybe if you did know something, that's

Dani:

How about the seven people that she helped bust?

Stephanie:

Yeah, this is probably your best informant. You said a cut above the rest.

Dani:

A cut above.

Stephanie:

That's so fucking frustrating. I can't imagine how awful that would be to be sitting at your house as a sister and be like, She's done all this for you. She Are you gonna at least go fucking look for her? You are the law. You're involved in her activities that could put her in

Dani:

danger. Are you going to go look for her? Yeah. Creech told Denise he would go look for her sister on Monday.

Stephanie:

Next business day. We'll take three to four business weeks, we'll look into it.

Dani:

A little over a week before her disappearance, Denise's last provided a tip that led to the arrest of Richard Holmes on September 10th. Over 100, 000 worth of drugs were seized, which included 51 marijuana plants, 10 grams of cocaine, 176 grams of loose marijuana. 8 grams of meth, and to round it out, 4 hits of LSD.

Stephanie:

Just a nice variety.

Dani:

They were druggin

Stephanie:

And the all inclusive store, this was like the Walmart of drugs. What do you need?

Dani:

See a little meth, a little LSD? Well, anything you need. they also, and this becomes, important later. They also found 7, 000 in cash. So, these, these guys had cash, they're doing the drugs.

Stephanie:

And when you get busted for drugs like this, they can take anything that they think is associated. Yeah, they

Dani:

took a Chevy Nova. Do you know where the house was at? I had to, it said Caldwell Boulevard. Oh, shit. But back in the day, Caldo Boulevard, there was like more property up there, like, uh, it was right by CWI, uh, out there. Oh, that campus. It's by like the chef's store and everything. Yeah, yeah. There was a, a mobile home out there. So that's, that's in town now. Yeah. Um, back in the eighties was kind of a little bit rural, a little bit rural. so that 7, 000 that they found, there was more of it somewhere because Richard Holmes posted Bond the very next day.

Stephanie:

Or he had some very influential and powerful like people, maybe I shouldn't say influential, so he had some people that were bankrolling him or involved with him that had money. Yeah. This is what it, if you find a gal with three pot plants she's watching for someone and Maybe it's a lie if you want to believe that it's a lie or whatever. Three plans. But, this is not someone that's well established in the drug world. This is someone that's probably being invited to parties or Maybe has some friends that she hears a name. This is like punching above your ability like

Dani:

this was above her pay grade.

Stephanie:

Yeah, she should have been exposing someone with That many drugs and I feel bad for her and I wish she would have maybe realized that I'm not blaming her Because she just thought that she was gonna be taken care of.

Dani:

But also the MPD putting her in that position greedy fucks People are going to figure that out. Yes. I mean, we're talking the 80s. Maybe there was 25, 000 people in Nampa. Maybe. 22. I didn't, but I just know growing up. It was definitely under 30, 000 people. And 7 people have been busted for drugs when this lady's been around. And she had to testify against these people. There's no secret informants. Okay.

Stephanie:

Yeah, she needed to be in the witness protection or out of state immediately. There's. This is wild to me.

Dani:

Richard Holmes was arrested again on December 7th, 1987, for second degree kidnapping, aggravated battery, grand theft, possession of cocaine, and carrying a concealed weapon. So, obviously, not concerned about a September arrest with 100, 000 for the drugs.

Stephanie:

I guess not. Still out gallivanting and

Dani:

I can't wait to

Stephanie:

hear about this kidnapping

Dani:

thing later. It's so, you're like, what? Is this a movie? It sounds like

Stephanie:

a

Dani:

movie. In 1988, Ronald Eugene Wages, 35, is arrested on a kidnapping charge on February 10th. There we go with that middle Eugene name again. As I was just thinking that. SO FUCKING POPULAR! He was already in the Canning County Jail where he had been since January 5th on drug charges. In late February, a grand jury was formed to investigate the probable homicide of Denise. Meanwhile, the police continue to search for Denise's body, believed to be located in the Squaw Creek area south of Marsing, Idaho. The grand jury indicts four people for the disappearance of Denise. Richard Holmes, 33, for criminal kidnapping, and he's also being held on intimidating witnesses and obstructing of police officers. Police officer. Three others are indicted as well, but that information is not released to the public because it's a grand jury. They don't have to do that. Oh, you're right.

Stephanie:

on March 4th, Holmes wife, Deborah, was arrested for a February 21st theft. She's accused of stealing tools from the state highway district building and banks. You know those buildings. Yes. The big brown buildings. People who have driven that way should know. They surely know. In court records filed in April, interviews from two acquaintances of Holmes were revealed. The two men said they were coerced into taking Denise into a remote place in Owyhee County, and they believed that she was going to be killed. I thought they were going to kill her. I thought they were going to Yep. And I was like, you know what, but I got a dentist appointment tomorrow and Sigh. Both men face charges and are being held. The two men said they tricked Denise Into going into the desert to a pre arranged meeting place near Squaw Creek on September 18th. One man said, quote, Holmes said she was a problem. Holmes asked one of the men, quote, if it came down to it, would we have the guts to pull the trigger to kill her, you know? And I told him no. Both of us did. Told him no repeatedly. Holmes then said he would look at her like an animal, cut her throat, and let her bleed. Yikes. So many drugs. I mean, bad person, but drugs too. Holmes said if she's not in court to testify against him for sales, all they can get him for is possession. And this is the 51 plants and the foreheads, you know, all of that stuff. According to the records, the two men picked up Denise and went to Middleton, bought tequila, and drove her around for a while, drinking and smoking marijuana. Now I'm just a little sidetrack here about Middleton, so if you're not from here or don't understand Idaho We have, state run liquor stores, but in some little towns where they don't have a state run liquor store because it would be too expensive, they do allow other, like a gas station, convenience store. I know, I have made runs to this, you know they want, because they're open later. They're open later and they can sell later and, I mean, liquor stores are, we're shutting down like at nine o'clock, I don't know, I think it's like that here. Right now too. It's like nine o'clock, right? I'm not out that late. I don't know but you can't buy liquor after like nine o'clock. You can go to the bar You can go to the bar, but you cannot you're gonna be like at 901 decide that you want to get tore up And listen to music and play some cards with your buddies And go buy a bottle of whiskey because it's, it's fucking closed. So, but there are some state run, there's, I don't even think there's one around here anymore. But you knew you could drive to Middleton. No, that was the place and it was, it's kind of a straight shot from Nampa. Like, so if you have someone that's sober enough to drive there. And it's after hours, you go on a little field trip to Middleton, and you get your booze there and come back, and Cause I think you could buy it there till like 11. I know exactly the store. Maybe even later. I know the exact convenience store. So, we've all done it. So, they drove her out there, picked up a bottle of tequila, they were doing their thing. Near midnight, the men took Denise out to the Marsing area. where they were confronted by a man with a shotgun, who they believed is wages. I don't think these guys knew exactly what they were getting into, to be fair. Okay. The man directed them to remove Denise's pants and underwear and tore open her blouse. They also tied her up with shoestrings and poured vodka on her. A. Vodka not necessary. B. What's up with the fucking shoestrings? Well, and why does she need to be naked? Like Yeah, it's just show of power. It's stupid. But then the men were told to leave. Thanks for the delivery. Bye. So, At what point though did these guys be like, Mmm, that's not what I thought was gonna happen. Well, yeah, and it's just once again, A common thing we hear is If men aren't around, who's gonna protect these women? From who? Other men that they do not stand up to. Like oh, yeah, she's now naked and covered in vodka and we're yeah, I guess I'll go on about my day Weird, I cannot imagine being put in a situation like that and being like Oh, you know, I do have to run a few more errands tonight, like, okay, bye. And just go home? Like, what the fuck? Police located a thong and a comb believed to belong to Denise in the area, but have been unable to locate her body. And when I say a thong, I mean a flip flop. Thank you for clarifying, because it could be either. It was a flip flop. Wages and homes are finally indicted on murder charges. In May an in, this is kind of a little sidetrack here. Just to let you know, in May an inmate in the Canyon County Jail, Juan Rivas is seeking$500,000. Rivas was severely beaten after be being put in the same cell with his co-defendant.

Dani:

Giglio Medina. And wages the two men attacked Rivas wages grabbed him from behind and called him a snitch and began hitting him On the face and chest wages told Rivas He was going to rape him and beat him because he heard Rivas was talking to the police about the drug situation or Nampa

Stephanie:

Yeah,

Dani:

so that just let you know what kind of The reason I included this is because, wages. There was some shit happening. And he's in jail, so he's sober. He's just He's in jail and sober. He's just a bad dude. The tort claim states that Wages is known to be a dangerous criminal who had severely beaten another inmate just a month before. Why are they putting him in a cell with other people?

Stephanie:

You know, my question is, why don't they give them a razor blade?

Dani:

With a toothbrush. Oh my god. This is, I'm, Canning County, okay? It's not, it's not the Idaho State Correctional Facility. They don't know about the razors and the toothbrush. It doesn't seem like they care much, but They don't. Okay. During a sentencing hearing for Holmes on an unrelated kidnapping charge.

Stephanie:

Ha ha ha ha ha. They were just kidnapping left and right. They

Dani:

were. he said his abuse of drugs began after his home burned down last summer. I don't know how it burned down. They probably were doing drugs. Meth lab, who knows. In July, Holmes enters a guilty plea on four felony drug charges. Prosecutors agree to a sentence of five to ten years in prison, running concurrently with five to ten year prison term he received earlier this year for a second degree kidnapping of Ricky Simonis.

Stephanie:

Okay. They are

Dani:

kidnapping. It's coming around. The three other drug charges will be dropped. The four felony charges stem from the September 87 drug raid. A mistrial was declared in May after a thousand dollars of cocaine was discovered missing in the evidence.

Stephanie:

Oh, how does that happen?

Dani:

Hmm.

Stephanie:

Who has access to the evidence rooms?

Dani:

The NPD.

Stephanie:

They were having a ball. An A ball.

Dani:

An A ball. I don't even know shit about drugs, but I know that there's an A ball. Is that a thing? That's right, right? That is right. Yeah.

Stephanie:

They were having an eight ball. They were having a time. Woo. Oh, shit. Oh, props MPD. I bet that was a

Dani:

memorable time. On August 2nd, Denise's body is finally located. Finally. I mean, it's almost a whole year. About 35 miles south of Marsing, Idaho. It was about a hundred yards off of Cow Creek Road, approximately 10 miles off of Highway 95. So it was one of those dirt roads back there. Yeah,

Stephanie:

Cow Creek Road sounds familiar.

Dani:

Yeah. Hmm. There's people listening that know exactly where that's at. Yeah. The body was in a deep ravine, partially concealed by rocks. August is busy, cause also in August, Nampa Police Chief Marshall Brisbane asked the state to review the city procedures regarding drug informants. Mmm, like mmm, because people were pissed! Just like we're like, how does, how does this even happen? Right? Seven in three months? You gotta realize the risk there. The Idaho Bureau of Narcotics. Didn't even know that was such a thing, but there it is. Reviewed the policies, Reviewed the policies and stated they are essentially the same as the State Bureau, which doesn't mean shit to me.

Stephanie:

For me, I'm like y'all just had how much cocaine go missing from your evidence room. Idaho Bureau of Narcotics is of doing narcotics. Like what are we? We do cocaine the best. Like, what the fuck? So, it doesn't mean much.

Dani:

In August, Maxwell Mad Max Hoffman is charged on August 22nd with the fatal stabbing of Denise.

Stephanie:

Really?

Dani:

Well, they finally found her body. Hoffman is already in prison for second degree kidnapping of a man named Ricky. It

Stephanie:

was the Wild West.

Dani:

So, Holmes was also charged with the Ricky Simona's kidnapping. Okay. Ronald Wages pleads guilty to first degree murder before Judge Doolittle. In September, he testified that Richard Holmes ordered the revenge slaying. Wages also testified Denise was killed by him and Hoffman on orders from Holmes. But Holmes was not present when the murder took place. Wade just said he stabbed Denise in the heart when she pleaded to be put out of her misery after Hoffman first had slit her throat. This is brutal, guys.

Stephanie:

No

Dani:

shit. Yeah. There'll be a little bit more. It's,

Stephanie:

it was a brutal murder

Dani:

and everybody. There was

Stephanie:

a lot of people involved.

Dani:

A lot of people and everybody was high and drunk and just Thinking that their Scarface almost So, you know those guys that I'm gonna, those guys that she, that took her out to the desert,

Stephanie:

yeah,

Dani:

one of them, Longstreet, 19 years old, testified for the defense with a different story. He said Wages ordered the trio out of the car, pointing a shotgun at them. Wages then told the men to tie Denise up with the bootlaces before leaving. Longstreet and his buddy Slauson are facing second degree kidnapping charges, but they are cooperating with the authorities in exchange for a six month jail term. How do you get, why would this even be a negotiating factor if they actually delivered a person to literally

Stephanie:

be slaughtered? Well, you wonder if they were just like, oh pick up our friend.

Dani:

But with her being tied up, the vodka, I don't know. Mm. It's like, oh, this, this is a little bit more violent than, this is not a talking to.

Stephanie:

What people will go along with when there's some weird power structure, and Drugs! Men.

Dani:

Holmes and Hoffman arrived later in separate trucks. Holmes then confronted Denise. He asked her why she busted him, and she replied it was her job. He kicked Denise in the face while she was sitting down, and then told her, You're dead, bitch. That makes me so

Stephanie:

She should have never been put in this position. I cannot believe this is over three pot plants. Exactly. I mean, and I mean it doesn't surprise me, just recently they're like, there's a bill on the Idaho legislature that any possession is 300 fine of marijuana. And everyone is going and paying all of Oregon's taxes to get it. Like, Oregon has so much tax money from Idaho. That's the

Dani:

only reason I'll say go Oregon, because otherwise it's a shit show, but, Before driving off, Holmes told Hoffman. You know what to do. Wages and Hoffman snorted some cocaine and meth several times. Damn. Before killing Denise. I wonder, and I don't know this, I wonder how long this was drawn out for her.

Stephanie:

I bet it was a long time. I've heard that meth time, like, Meth time doesn't even exist? No, it doesn't and especially, you know, it sounds like they had talked about it before of could you do it and it's It seemed like there was a lot of pushback from others, and so it's like Well, that was the

Dani:

two guys, the two younger kids, the 19 year olds, that Yeah,

Stephanie:

so you can say that you would do it all you want, but when it comes to actually doing it, and it doesn't sound like she's fighting or anything, and Now they're trying to like, get up the fucking balls. Get the meth courage. Yeah, to do it. Meth courage.

Dani:

Richard Holmes was the one who led the, led the police to Denise's body.

Stephanie:

Really?

Dani:

On September 25th, a riot breaks out at the Idaho State Penitentiary. Uh oh. The riot caused hundreds of thousands of dollars in damage and resulted in the stabbing murder of an inmate. Inmates were preparing a homemade liquor called Squawky.

Stephanie:

Let's go Squawky. I thought it was hooch. up.

Dani:

Right?

Stephanie:

Maybe there's different brands. They're like, we make ours on an orange base and others make theirs on a grape base. Some do apple, but we do Squawky.

Dani:

Do you think there's ever any, like, yeast involved? Like, do you think that maybe, who knows? You know,

Stephanie:

all you have I do not know how to make liquor. All you have is time, so. And especially now with the resources, you could just call someone and be like, Hey, Google how to make liquor in, uh, incarceration. I'd be scared

Dani:

to get poisoned.

Stephanie:

I think people might be scared, but,

Dani:

Look, you drink it first, and I'll There's some desperation. If you're not dead in two hours, then I'll have some with you. I would be immediately kicked out of that group. You don't get any! None for you! You Yeah. No. If you're not gonna partake, you don't get to wait and see if we die. You suck. Bye. I'll find a new group of friends. Let me go to Gblock. Play some cards and I'll drink some Kool Aid. When the guards moved in to take the squawky drink, the riot started. 60 well armed officers assembled at the prison nearly two hours after the 78 inmate unit was lost to rioters. 78! They're like, there's a fucking lot of us. A bonfire had been set, almost every piece of glass in sight was destroyed. Dozens of holes were punched in walls and cells. Okay, Kyle, damn. The inmates surrendered after choking on the smoke from their own fires. Oh. That was Uppy! Somebody open a fucking window in here! I can't breathe! I Somebody open a window at this place. Like, bruh.

Stephanie:

Too much on the bonfire, too much, too much. Sucking all the oxygen out of here.

Dani:

That made me laugh so hard. This is fucking funny though. They're like,

Stephanie:

oh, mmm. This is the mistake that Rick and Jared would make in a prison riot. They'd be like, we know how to make a fucking fire. Let's burn this

Dani:

shit down. Oh, wait. No, we can't breathe. We can't breathe. We can't escape. We can't. Oh, but I bet

Stephanie:

you it was a sexy fire. It's a, I'm sure it was a very sexy fire. They're like, this bonfire is badass. Why are they not functioning?

Dani:

Uh, after nearly three and a half hours, the dust settled and Richard Holmes was found stabbed to death in his cell. Oh God. A hole was punched through home cell hollow block wall baby building in prisons

Stephanie:

out of cinder block. Just stacking some cinder blocks, so like, that looks good. Yeah, little mortar in between. If someone can punch and break through it. This is, I think I said on one of the earlier episodes, a lot of these prisons were just smoke and mirrors. Like, they had all of the, on the outside, the sheen of security. But,

Dani:

you gotta fill those ho I have dropped cinder blocks before and broke them. Like, it's not super durable, like, you can build walls out of them, but you could also, I feel confident that I could punch a hole through one, I mean I probably could. Or at least

Stephanie:

chisel your way, or if like, over

Dani:

time, chip away. Quit being cheap, state of Idaho. That shit should have been filled with concrete. It was hollow,

Stephanie:

like you just, it's like Legos. You just stack them and you're good. No one can get through that. Nobody. Shawshank is like, hold my beer. Yeah,

Dani:

he would have been out like in two days. You had nothing but time. Nothing but time. Corrections director Al Murphy told the Joint Finance Appropriations Committee that the main cause of the riot is three things. First, inmates are dangerous. The second cause is, inmates are dangerous. And the third cause is, inmates are dangerous. I'm sorry,

Stephanie:

that is, who, who is this again, please?

Dani:

this is, the Corrections Director, Al Murphy.

Stephanie:

Al Murphy, nothing tells me that you're terrible at your job more than that answer. That, I'm, if, if some type of hazard happens or bullshittery happens at your job. Not my fault, not my fault. It's almost like, well customers are dicks. Like, if you have a failing restaurant, customers are dicks. No. Like, you, you give three reasons and you give those three repetitive reasons, you should have never been put in that position to begin with. What a piss poor level of leadership. Bullshit.

Dani:

A recording. Made by an Idaho State Police Sergeant outside of Holmes sales block, recorded Holmes calling a suspect out by name and pleading with him not to injure him. Not to enter him? Not to injure. Oh god.

Stephanie:

Wow! This is very racy. I mean, still not to injure is big. Maybe we should start that over because I'm like, I mean, this is the eighties. You don't have a recording thing on yourself. How did you catch this?

Dani:

So just so you know, they called it a pocket recording, which I'm assuming he had like a little cassette recorder, you know, like the mini tapes or something. The name Shorty was repeated several times, although the police could not see into Holmes cell. A bloody palm print found in Holmes cell also belonged to Shorty. A first degree murder warrant was issued against Rodney Shorty Areza, 21. I'm gonna go with it. Areza? That

Stephanie:

sounds good.

Dani:

Shorty was serving up to 10 years on robbery of a Bliss bar and the battery of an employee in Gooding County. Two others are suspected in the murder of Holmes. John Sorgren, 36, and Merle LaMere, 25. When asked about the motive for the murder, Ada County Sheriff Vaughn Killeen stated, Erazia was trying to establish a reputation in the prison as being tough. Erazia is about 5 foot 4 inches tall, but weighs about 190 pounds. Big boy. Thick boy. He was just 15 when he robbed the YN bar in 1983 and was tried as an adult. He, shorty struck Jake Overfelt, a 56 year employee, over the head with several whiskey bottles and kicked him in the neck and left him for dead. Jake was cleaning up after closing hours. People

Stephanie:

don't, I mean, I think bartending's a dangerous job. No shit, we've been through this a few times, like.

Dani:

Colleen also stated that Holmes may have been killed because he was labeled a snitch. How ironic, which I feel

Stephanie:

like is probably the case. Well, you're grasping at straws He was looking at ways to get out of this and have it only be a possession And who knows if he wasn't

Dani:

making a deal, right? Let me tell you where the

Stephanie:

body's at

Dani:

cuz or let me technically he wasn't there. He wasn't there. He left He just ordered the killing right? So he thought maybe he could get out

Stephanie:

and he's probably got some great With the variety of drugs. It was a smorgasbord. Of drugs. You're, you have multiple contacts. That you could probably be like, Eh, I don't really like that guy. I'll turn him in and get a couple, a reduction on my sentence or the charge. Sure, sure. I agree. Alright, Holmes. So, possible snitch.

Dani:

In a jailhouse interview with the Idaho statesman. Erasea said, first of all, these attorneys had to be pulling their fucking hair, like, quit talking, dude, the Idaho statesman, just shut the fuck up. But in his jailhouse interview, Erasea said, I didn't do nothing. He had no motive to kill Holmes because he is scheduled for release in the summer of 89. Quote, I only got 9 or 10 months left on a 10 year sentence. What kind of fool do you think I am to go out and commit a murder when I'm about to get out? It's a pretty good point. In October, Debra Holmes put guilty to several charges, some stemming from the theft in February from the highway district, as well as welfare fraud and drug charges. She is sentenced to probation. And I'm convinced she got sentenced to probation because her husband died.

Stephanie:

Yeah.

Dani:

In October, a breakdown between Canyon and Hawaii counties regarding who is paying and who is trying what. Because, you know, the drug bust was here, they kidnapped her from, from Canyon County, but they actually found her in Hawaii County. Multi

Stephanie:

county.

Dani:

And they were trying to work it out, but it just, it's not happening.

Stephanie:

Well, and the NPD is like, if we can't have whatever drugs those are, how are we going to steal them? So, if you let us have the, I mean, this is all me making up things, but they have a track record of dipping into that evidence room and maybe they just really wanted that evidence. I don't know who has it, but NPD, this wasn't your shining decade for sure. Holmes Attorney

Dani:

Keene! Make it another appearance. Blame prosecutors for filing court documents that included information about Holmes Corporation with the authorities. So they did. Little cooperation. Yeah, but they filed it and then it was publicly. It was public. Publicly. Public er. Thank you. In November, there's a complete fallout from the investigation. The Hawaii County Coroner, Harold Mick Craven, resigns. He's pissed. He said that the sheriff hid Denise's body from him for two and a half days, and he was never taken to the scene. The coroner. What

Stephanie:

is going on here?

Dani:

Well, they knew they fucked up and were like, I don't I kind of got the feeling, so the body was found in, I'm just, sorry, recollecting my mind, my research. The body was found in Waihee County, which is where Craven was. But they took the body to Canyon County, and the Canyon County, coroner, thank you, actually did the autopsy. And Craven was only notified like an hour or so before. and he's basically like, I can't do my job like this. A coroner is A number one. but the sheriff in Hawaii County basically told him like, this is my body. Oh, and

Stephanie:

he's

Dani:

like,

Stephanie:

alright, well, fuck you, I'm out. So he just

Dani:

quit, he said, I can't, I can't do, he, he said, I cannot do my job. If this is how it's gonna go, so he quit.

Stephanie:

So, I feel like this ties into the greater theme of fuckery in law enforcement. Because for, that might sound trivial on, at surface level. But if this type of shit's going on, and this was the last straw for this person. So it sounds like to me, recognizing things, that Yeah. A professional, in a coroner's sense, was like This is it. I'm done. I can't even be doing what I'm paid to do

Dani:

because that's his is He's supposed to go out there and take pictures and look at everything and look at the evidence He didn't get that opportunity and then just to haul him off to another County. He's totally being undermined

Stephanie:

Yeah, so and I can just about guarantee this wasn't the first time. Yeah,

Dani:

cuz I'm sure it

Stephanie:

had happened Yeah, and PD you were dipping into that evidence room

Dani:

We have moved on to 1989. 1989, we're almost to the 90s folks. Which is like, what, 15 years ago? It was like,

Stephanie:

yeah,

Dani:

15 years ago. In a preliminary hearing for Eurasia, a fellow inmate tearfully testified that it wasn't Shorty that killed Holmes. The inmate, Jerry Mills, said two other inmates stabbed Holmes. He would not name them because he was afraid for his life. Mills cell was directly across from Holmes. He said inmates wearing bandanas and stocking caps over their faces used pipes to break a hole into Holmes cell. They used knives attached to mop handles and pipes to try and stab Holmes.

Stephanie:

Like, poking and prodding?

Dani:

Yeah, but they got in there. I

Stephanie:

don't know if that's how it started.

Dani:

Quote, I could see a guy stab Holmes in the stomach area a few times and heard Holmes say, no, no shorty. Holmes reached up and pulled the stocking cap off of the man's face. I seen who, I seen who it was. Unquote. The inmate left Holmes's cell and about 10 minutes later, another inmate entered. With his face covered, quote, he laid Holmes body out flat, rolled him over, pulled his shirt back, and started stabbing him, it seems like a hundred times, unquote. oh, that's, it was brutal murder. In February, Longstreet is sentenced to one year in the Canyon County Jail for a plea. to second degree kidnapping. That was the other fella that they, she went out drinking with under false pretenses. To only get one year.

Stephanie:

Especially knowing what happened. Mm

Dani:

hmm. In March, Hoffman's trial finally began. In opening statements, the prosecutor says after Hoffman learned of his arrest on first degree murder, he slammed down the phone and yelled, I killed that bitch for a guy, and now he won't bomb me out of jail. So

Stephanie:

you thought these were your bros. Drugs.

Dani:

A pathologist testified that Denise died from a blow to the head with a large rock, despite her throat being slashed and getting stabbed in the abdomen.

Stephanie:

That is so fucking awful. It is.

Dani:

Wages testified that Denise stated, finish the job, finish it. And that's when Wages took a hunting knife and stabbed her through the armpit. So there's conflicting statements here. Abdomen. Armpit, but she had the initial her throat was slit and she was still alive. That's wild. So she there was some reporting that Her throat was slashed her testimony Actually that her throat was slashed and that they thought it was done and then she came crawling up the ravine right, so I think

Stephanie:

they probably thought it was like the movies. They did a quick little slicey and they're like.

Dani:

So then that's when they stabbed her again and then started throwing rocks on her to hide the body thinking she was dead when she wasn't. She actually died from a blow to the head. It was a brutal murder. How, it's so sad. The pair then started throwing rocks over the body to conceal it. After five hours of deliberation, Hoffman was found guilty of first degree murder. You think? Yeah. After the trial, Denise's parents, Bill and Lois Fisher, said they didn't believe Hoffman is guilty and should not be sentenced to death. Lois said, quote, I'm very confused. We have information that I can't disclose. I don't think it's over. I know there is more. They do believe That wages is partially responsible for Denise's death, but that he shouldn't be executed either. They are naming the Nampa Police Department partially for her death. Fair.

Stephanie:

Fair to me too.

Dani:

In late March, Denise's body is finally released. to her family so they can bury her. That is so hard for me, when these families are having to wait for these trials to be done. Mm

Stephanie:

hmm.

Dani:

This wasn't the first time. And it will not be the last time. Like they need some closure, finality to this situation. In April, James Slauson was sentenced to one year in jail and two years probation for kidnapping. He was a kid, one of the kids that took her out there. Hoffman is sentenced to death in June. Getting it done! Idaho! Also in June, Arisa is on trial for the murder of Holmes, moving very quickly, and he testifies in his own trial. He said he climbed through the wall to see if Holmes was still alive. Holmes eyes were open and he lifted his shirt to see if he was breathing. They have that recording though. Of him saying, I don't know, I struggle with this one. Another inmate testified that Arazia said, quote, somebody go in there and, and check this out. Nobody would step forward. So Arazia went in to check for vital signs. He looked like he was gonna throw up. He seemed to be in a daze, and that was a quote from somebody testifying.

Stephanie:

I'm sure it was wild in there. They got a damn bonfire going. Can't breathe.

Dani:

Horatio is found guilty of Holmes murder. Wages is finally sentenced to a fixed life prison term. So no parole. This is the guy who pled guilty, and he was testifying against everybody. Right. Mad Max Hoffman. Loses an appeal in July for the kidnapping charge of Ricky Simona's on December 7th 1987. This is the guy he kidnapped for you Hoffman wages and homes went to Ricky's home and beat him Then they put a gun barrel down his throat and forced him to sign over his bill pick up for a drug related debt. Goddamn. These guys were met with lots of drugs. Ricky said they threatened to break his jaw if he didn't sign over the truck. So that's where all those charges came from. Dude, you're out on bond for like 100, 000 for the drugs and you're just, lay low. What are we doing? Oh, he's like, that money's owed to me. I'm gonna go get

Stephanie:

it. Ricky. We're gonna kidnap. We're gonna. Pistol whip, we're gonna do what we need to do.

Dani:

In October, the attorney, Cahill for Shorty requested a new trial during the sentencing phase. It's wild. I don't even know how you do this. In court, Cahill called three inmates who had previously testified at the trial. The three said they were ready to identify who actually broke into Holmes cell and stabbed him. During the time in court, Judge Carey denies the request for a jury to sentence Arazia. We all know where that's going. Mm

Stephanie:

hmm,

Dani:

exactly. Pauline Miyachi, the head of a prison reform group, testified that another inmate confessed to killing Holmes, along with two other people. Miyachi said Merle Lemur confessed to the killing to a religious counselor. Lemur had testified in Shorty's trial, stating he did not kill Holmes. but refused to name who did the murder. A volunteer spiritual leader, Paul Bull, said he spoke with Lemur privately on August 29th. Lemur told him he, Sorgin, and Clark had broken into Holmes cell. Lemur told him He, Sorensen, and Clark broke into Holmes cell. Lemire said, I stabbed Holmes three times, and then I didn't like what I did. I was doing. And Sorrenton took the shiv and stabbed him multiple times. Then Clark hit him in the head with a shovel. He also stated, I am not going to stick my neck out on death row. Mm mm. Aracia is sentenced to a fixed 35 year sentence for the murder of Holmes to run concurrent with a 20 year term for rioting.

Stephanie:

Alrighty then.

Dani:

They don't care.

Stephanie:

They're like, yeah, there was some fuckery, who knows what. What happened? You're done

Dani:

in 1990. Merle LaMer 27 is charged for the murder of Holmes. This is so confusing to me. Laur said he was willing to take the blame because he had nothing to live for. He saw three men climb through the hole into cell, but won't say who In October, Laur pled guilty to second degree murder. He said he did not actually participate in the stabbing, but helped to raise Gia bust through the. Well, he is sentenced to 32 years to life. After sentencing, he told the court that Orazio is innocent. I want you to know the truth. Rodney had no participation in that. Make up your mind, bro!

Stephanie:

Yeah, this is

Dani:

So I'm having a hard time with Shorty's conviction. Mm hmm.

Stephanie:

I'm Because what really happened, I don't know if we'll ever know.

Dani:

No. So, of course, we have a Pills, a Pills, a Pills! Hoffman does get Joan Fisher as an attorney. I can't remember who she was with. Was it the Pratt brothers? She was with somebody and in 97 Hoffman files a petition with the court to drop his appeal so that he can be executed all the wells

Stephanie:

Really?

Dani:

1998 Hoffman is granted his wish and an execution date is given attorney Fisher says hospital Hoffman is not capable of making that decision to drop his appeals and a stay is granted. Like he's too depressed You know all that 2002 U. S. District Court Judge B. Lynn Windmill Issued an order for Hoffman to be resentenced. This is because he was denied a lawyer during his pre sentencing interview Idaho, get it together. And in 2003, sentences tossed out for Hoffman, the federal appellate court says juries, not judges, have to determine aggravating circumstances and sentence the criminals. Which we've seen time and time and time again. Again, yeah. In 2006, the 9th U. S. Circuit Court of Appeal rules that Hoffman has to be released or re offered a plea deal. That was, that he originally turned down, and then there's nothing. There's nothing until Radio silence. 2014.

Stephanie:

Damn.

Dani:

Hoffman is discharged. What does that mean? He's out. Released? I don't know. I don't know. What exactly? He's not in jail anymore. I don't know if he's dead. I don't know these things I wish I did. If I had money to go down to the courthouse and pay their ridiculous four 50 a page, I would know but I don't know. and in 2020, wages is discharged. Rodney Shorty 57 was released just last year in February, and Merle lame. Is 62 and released to non parole. That's

Stephanie:

incredible. Like, just mind blowing.

Dani:

That's all I got. I'd be happy to go down to the courthouse, kids, and get all that information, but

Stephanie:

they be charging buku bucks. It is, it is ridiculous per page to get transcripts. It's supposed to be

Dani:

public information. Thank you.

Stephanie:

I should be able

Dani:

to link that shit up online!

Stephanie:

This one has been wild to me. Like I still can't get over how they had some random girl who was not deeply entrenched in the drug scene, but doesn't seem. Three plants. Not

Dani:

deeply entrenched.

Stephanie:

is now putting forth and able to get seven convictions? That means that she was probably having more tips. this is not a big town, especially back then, and They knew.

Dani:

They knew.

Stephanie:

So was she just a party girl that knew a bunch of girls? That was some pretty girl that could hang out with these people or those people? And knew some names? Like

Dani:

You're like, I'm giving you one, bro. And then I'm out. Do you know what I mean? Seven, and four, I'm, I totally, for the, it was irresponsible of the Nampa Police Department.

Stephanie:

Yeah,

Dani:

to let her keep just go get another one. All right. Good job. They're

Stephanie:

like, oh we offered you a job in room and board No, you said I mean, what were they really offering her? They the money wasn't going to cover

Dani:

her

Stephanie:

cost to move to Boise.

Dani:

No

Stephanie:

What were you offering her that she could I mean anyone can

Dani:

And she, I'm going to tell you that her sister said she was just such a giving person. She was a good person and she had worked, in, home health care with seniors and also, or not home health care, but re you know, retirement, centers with seniors. And she had also worked with developmentally delayed, like that job, you have to be a certain kind of a person. She was a very giving person. Yeah, you have to have a gentle soul. and so she was a good person. She had a five and six year old, kids. she was 27. I just think she was caught between a rock and a hard place with these guys. over a hundred dollar fine. I mean that could be like now like maybe a 4, 000 fine like and if you don't have, they're gonna put you in jail.

Stephanie:

And we all, who, who can be away from their job for, Even if you're able to bond out in a week or two, what jobs are going to forgive you for that? And rent, and kids, and Or your mortgage, like, what if you do lose your job? Now you've lost your car, because your car payment's behind. Like, it jeopardizes everything, because you know that it's just such a flimsy house of cards that we all have it. You know, a lot of people are very well off financially. I try to be as responsible as I can and save as much as I can and I have a little bit of a buffer. But I can tell you, you know, most people are one medical bill or one marijuana plant watching for your friend bill away from it upending your entire life. So

Dani:

and how sad, I mean, I just, it's, I, yeah, it's just sad that, and what a horrible, horrible death. Yeah.

Stephanie:

Anyway. It was. It's definitely a story that had so many crazy factors in it. A little dabble of

Dani:

everything.

Stephanie:

Yes, and so many characters, but. Lots of characters. R. I. P. Denise. Like, she should have never been put in that position. Ever. She was not built for it, wasn't made for it, they took advantage of her, so. NPD. Hmm. 80s NPD. Not great. Stop dibbly dabbling in the evidence room, please.

Dani:

Stop doing drugs. 1, 000. Whoopee! Gotta drop that charge. All

Stephanie:

the cocaine is gone. Don't know what happened

Dani:

Somebody's like dude. Look what I

Stephanie:

fucking

Dani:

caught at work.

Stephanie:

He's like party. We are getting down This is the 80s, you know, they're having fun anyway Thank you guys for listening, this has been another episode of The Lethal Library. You can reach out to us at TheLethalLibrary at gmail. com. Email us new tips and cases, we love to hear them. Thank you Diana for

Dani:

emailing us. Thank you for that. And also, you can reach out to us on any of our socials and also I wanted to give a shout out to Lisa, who is, been a day one listener and, gives me, positive feedback,

Stephanie:

We love to hear it. We love you guys tips, tricks, and what you like to hear, what you don't. We know we're not everyone's cup of tea. We'll do our best.

Dani:

Thanks for listening. 10 4, rubber ducky. Fuck yeah.

Thank you for watching.

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