Breaking Barriers: Advocating for Accessible Travel and Restroom Inclusivity with Corey Lee

In this episode of the Plum Delusional Podcast, host Daniel Mitchell welcomes Corey Lee, a celebrated travel blogger and advocate for accessible travel. Operating from LaFayette, Georgia, Daniel discusses Corey's journey with his blog, "Curb Free with Corey Lee," which focuses on providing vital information for wheelchair users navigating travel and restroom accessibility.

Corey shares his insights on the state of accessibility in the U.S., noting that while the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) lays down basic standards, many countries offer greater accessibility options driven by a strong cultural respect for those with disabilities. They explore the "disability tax," where accessible accommodations often come at a premium, and how this affects the travel experiences of many.

The conversation delves into practical accessibility challenges faced in public restrooms, air travel, and the necessity of companion care restrooms to ensure dignity and ease for all travelers. Corey shares personal experiences highlighting the need for continual improvements in facilities and the importance of empathy and inclusivity in society.

The episode emphasizes the collective responsibility to enhance accessibility, urging listeners to consider the needs of others in both public and private spaces. With a vision for a more inclusive future, Daniel and Corey advocate for the necessity of accessible restrooms and facilities, and the ongoing fight for improved policies that support the needs of people with disabilities.

Listen in for a heartfelt discussion about the everyday realities of accessibility and the steps we can all take to create a more accommodating world.

Welcome to Plumb Delusional, the podcast where Daniel Mitchell, owner of Mitchell's Plumbing in Lafayette, Georgia, takes you on a journey through the pipes and problems of modern plumbing.

Each episode dives into the nitty-gritty of the plumbing world—addressing common issues, uncovering surprising myths, and sharing memorable stories from decades of experience in the trade.

https://www.mitchellsplumbingga.com/
Phone: (706) 523-3201
Address: 206 N Duke St, LaFayette, GA 30728

Transcript

 Alright, we're back in the studio today with Plum Delusional Podcast. I'm Daniel Mitchell with Mitchell's Plumbing down in Lefet, Georgia 206 North Duke Street. We're here when you need a place to go. This week on our podcast, we've got a special guest celebrity.



 He is known in many circles as Corey Lee. He's curb free. He has no curbs in his way. Today we're going to be talking about accessibility of restrooms in and around this area and while traveling.



 For those that don't know, Corey is a well renowned travel blogger.



 The accessibility situation, he's had several Webby Awards and he's won those. Corey, would you like to introduce yourself and kind of tell a little bit about you? I'm sure you know more about yourself than I know about you.

 Yeah, for sure. Thanks for having me on today's episode, Daniel.



 Back in 2013, I started a travel blog called Curb Free with Corey Lee. It's all about traveling the world as a wheelchair user. I really started that right after I graduated from college and was trying to find a job, not really getting a lot of interactions with that or interviews. I also at that same time noticed a severe lack of representation on the internet when it came to finding accessible travel information. I wanted to start a website where hopefully other wheelchair users can go to it and figure out what's accessible around the world and what can they do once they get to these destinations.



 You and I have been able to travel to some pretty great places together. We just got back from New York a few days ago.



 We have gone to the Caribbean on multiple Disney cruises, which I always am a fan of.



 It's been a whirlwind of a journey over the past 11 years since starting my blog.



 Yeah, I mean,



 New York seemed to be pretty accessible while we were up there. I felt like you could find a place to go to the bathroom or wherever you needed to.

 Yeah, I mean, New York in general is fairly accessible. The subway isn't, but in terms of transportation, attractions, hotels, being able to find a place to go to the restroom is not very difficult. It is, I think, more difficult, though, than some foreign countries, which may surprise people because I think there's this perception that the U.S. is maybe the most accessible place in the world. From my experience, the U.S. does a really good job in a lot of ways because we do have things like the ADA, the Americans with Disabilities Act, which was signed in 1990.



 There are other places that I have traveled to where finding accessible restrooms was much, much easier.



 Well, I think we've talked about it before and everything. I think some countries have more reverence for each other. I think, I mean, they care more about the next person. I think in America, we get into the hustle and bustle and we forget about the next guy.

 Yeah, exactly. I think in the U.S., with the ADA, places are maybe thinking, "Well, we have to abide by the ADA standards." But in other countries where there maybe isn't an ADA, they're more willing to go above and beyond because morally, they know that it's the right thing to do. I feel like the ADA, it does help in a lot of ways, but it also provides a bare minimum for accessibility standards.

 Well, that's exactly what the codes are on ADA.



 When you write down a code book for ADA plumbing and stuff, it's the minimum standard code for accessibility or any kind of... Any code is the minimum standard. That's the least amount of codes you got to do to get by the pass. So municipalities like New York,



 Lafayette, Chattanooga, places like that, they can take



 that, amend that code and exceed the minimum code and places can have it. But it comes down to, and it's just like we talk about in our trade all the time, if you put accessible or handy in front of it, it becomes a whole lot more expensive.

 Oh yeah, absolutely. I completely agree. We call it in the disability community, the disability tax.



 Whether I'm booking accessible transportation or an accessible room in a hotel or an accessible tour, whatever it may be, it's often double or more in pricing. So it definitely costs more to be disabled.

 Yeah, and to me, that's kind of backwards.

 Yeah, I mean, you're absolutely right. It's wild.



 Yeah, it's wild.

 Yeah, it comes because you shouldn't have to burn up more of your funds just to be able to have your day-to-day life be as normal as possible, like everybody else.

 Yeah, exactly. I mean, and so many people with disabilities are already on such a budget that it's hard to pay these extra expenses that we often require just to be able to live the rest of society.

 Yeah, and a good example is the foundation that you have,



 the Kerr-Lee Foundation.



 Me and my wife, we're some of the board members of that, and we get to read those heart-wrenching stories of people that can't travel just because of accessibility tax, as he said.



 Some people have never traveled to, they've never seen other parts of the world just because of the fact that, or not the world, but the United States, because it's so expensive for accessible travel. I mean, your van. I mean, I can go out and buy a $100,000 truck,



 but you got to go and buy an accessible van, just $100,000 for a van.



 It's wild. I mean, my van that I currently have was over $80,000, and it's nothing super special. It's just like a Toyota Sienna hybrid van, but just those modifications were actually, the accessibility modifications for the ramp and everything like that were more expensive than the actual vehicle.



 You bought it before and the vehicles really shot up, too, didn't you?

 Yeah, I bought it back in, I think it was, well, maybe in like 2020 or 21.

 Yeah, I know, right there around 2020, 21 vehicles went outside. I know that. They're starting to come back down a little bit now, but I'm just saying that even $80,000



 for, I could have bought the same van that wasn't set up for accessibility for probably half that. Absolutely.



 Yeah, I mean, that's weird, seeing a hybrid as like a $40,000 vehicle or like $50,000 at the most. So, I mean, you're looking at $30,000 to $40,000 just for the accessibility modifications.

 And that goes, and when you go into building, and that's really what we're getting into the core here, what we're going to get into is when you're building accessible buildings or facilities, that's one of the things that they try to do is keep a budget. And like I said, an accessible commode is probably twice what a regular commode is. Grab bars, grab bars are expensive,



 electronic eye faucets that you don't have to touch, which that's become a big thing anyway, since COVID.



 The less you touch the bathroom now, so that's helped that, I think. But you've got to have the stalls,



 the extra room for the bathrooms and stuff like that. A lot of facilities get to slide under through because they don't, they say they ain't got a public restroom.

 Right, right. Yeah, I mean, there are so many places that I've gone to and attractions, and in terms of the bathrooms, they may have an accessible, or they may have a public restroom, but it won't be accessible for me. So constantly having, so when I'm out, think about, well, if I need to use the restroom or find an accessible toilet, how easy is that going to be to find? When am I going to have to not really think about what I'm drinking, what I'm eating, because there may be a period of time where I can't even have access to an accessible restroom. So that is something that I'm constantly thinking about as I'm traveling, because I really have to do that P-Math and poop math for when I'm, and calculate when I'm going to be able to go to the restroom.

 Yeah, and your P-Math and poop math is different than my P-Math and poop math. I had to figure out how to get rid of it. You had to figure out not to have one to mid-fly.

 Yeah, exactly. I mean, like, it's wild. I mean, whenever I'm flying, especially, I mean, you brought up flying, so I'm thinking of how difficult it is for wheelchair users to fly, because when we're on a plane, we don't have, or I don't have access to the restroom. So the restrooms currently on planes are so small that I can't fit in the restroom with a companion, and I do need a companion to assist me in the restroom. So by 2030, the regulations are supposed to change, according to the Department of Transportation. So by 2030, every double aisle aircraft is supposed to have an accessible restroom, and how accessible that's going to be. I'm not sure, but I'm, like, crossing my fingers and hoping that it'll work for me, but just not, like, fully counting on it.

 Yeah, because there's accessible, and then there's fully accessible.

 Right, and the word accessible, I mean, I think it really means something different to each person with a disability. So, like, in your business, like, when you're, you know, building a house for someone or doing their plumbing, like, I'm sure you have to really talk to the person about it and figure out, you know, what works best for them, because, like, for me, I really need a roll-in shower with smooth entry. I don't necessarily need grab bars by the toilet. That's not helpful for me. I do need a blender sink, but other people, like, definitely need to grab bars more than anything. And then maybe they can, you know, take one step over into the, into, like, a bathtub, whereas I can never do that. So the word accessible definitely means something different to each person.

 Yeah, we do, speaking of that, we do a lot of work for the USDA and they fund accessible bathrooms for people that homes that has become, you know,



 disabled through accidents or some kind of disease or something like that. So they can, they can stay at their home and they get an accessible bathroom. It was, you was saying that we just got through doing one for a young man and he's paralyzed from his waist down and he, his arms are good. He wanted, he wanted plenty of grab bars. Yeah. Cause he can, as long as he can get the grab bar, he's pretty much so able to do what he wanted to. So he wanted grab bars from the commode all the way into the shower, into the shower. So he actually used to grab bars to hold himself up and get into the shower and stuff like that. So, and then we're doing one next week where the lady has got a deterioration of muscle. So she told me that's what she was here. So I really don't need to grab bars because I can't use them anyway. The only thing the grab bars would be good for would be putting my rag on. Right. You know, so she needs to roll in, you know, she needs to curb less roll in showers, stuff like that.

 So is that like a government program that helps like people with disabilities or what is it?

 Yeah, it's through the USDA. It's a government, it's a grant and it's got a lot of, a lot of paperwork. I know there's a lot of paperwork with it. You have to, you have to get, they have to come out, access your home, see that you're a candidate. Then they, then you fail off the paperwork. Then you have to get three bids and the three bids have got to be from a certified license plumber and general contractor with the right insurance and stuff like that. It's got a USDA number or a VA number for the state, you know, vetted stuff like that. They won't just let anybody do it because they don't want their, their money wasted. And then you have to know the contractor that you're employing has to take on the responsibility of doing the whole job without ever getting any money up front. And you don't get paid to the end as a contractor, which for us is not a big deal. But, you know, some people won't do it. So that's how they do it. But it is a government. It is a government program for the USDA. It's like I said, it's a grant. And most of the time they get approved, but it takes a lot of time. And I'm sure if you're going to, if you're on a bathroom now, you better start it. You'll get it by the end of the, you know, you get, if you want it in 2020, if you want a bathroom, you'll get it by 2026. If you start today.

 Oh, wow. Okay. It takes a minute. Yeah. It's not surprising dealing with all that, but at least it is an option.

 Why that's good to hear. Yeah. And another thing I was going to say about the accessibility accessibility, not only you was talking about companions, you know, you have to have a companion help you in the restroom. Well, all the time, unfortunately,



 it ain't always a gentleman, you know, your mom or yeah, you know, my wife, she, she helps take care of you and then Kayla. Yeah. And, and, you know, it's just, and then you go into these restrooms and if there's not a family restroom, what do you do?

 Yeah. It's interesting. I've had some pretty interesting debacles because of that, because like my mom travels with me a lot. Keela, who is your wife and my primary caregiver for the past like 10 years or so. And then my other caregiver, Kayla, that travels with us sometimes. If I'm traveling with them and there is no companion care restroom, then I have to go into the women's restroom to just let their accessible stall because I need their assistance.

 Right.

 And if they like Keela or my mom or Kayla are going into the men's room, they're like addy urinal and you know, but in the women's it's all stalls. So in general, it's just easier for me to go in the women's to the accessible stall than for them to go in the men's room. And we about, I guess it was like 12 or 13 years ago, I was in Nashville at a concert and had to use the restroom. And so I went into the restroom with my mom and someone, a lady, started like screaming at us and saying that I couldn't be in there. But it was the only option. Like there was no companion care restroom and she actually called the cops on me and the cops came like banging on the stall door and were telling me that I had to leave. And I was like, I'm just trying to use the restroom. Like it's really not a big deal. I'm in a stall. You cannot see anything in those stalls. And then again, about a month ago, I was flying out of the Atlanta airport and then one of the terminals there, there is no accessible companion care restroom. So I had to go in the women's again.



 And one of the people in the airport, like an airport worker, started yelling at us and saying that I couldn't be in there. And she called security on us to get me out of there. And so it's like constantly an issue. And I do feel like awkward going into the women's room and I try to just like look down and not make eye contact, but it's still very awkward. So I mean, like whenever I notice a companion care restroom, like I just try to use it whether I really need to go or not, because you never know where the next one is going to be at.

 Yeah. Yeah. And then it's it's also I I'm sure that it would be, I don't know.



 There's no if you don't have a companion, companion care restroom, there's no good option. You know, right. My wife or your mother or Kayla going into the men's. Right. I don't see being any better.

 No, I mean, it would be worse because they're like out of urinal. Right.



 Yeah. Like, yeah. So I mean, me going in the women's is really the best option if there isn't a companion room, but it's still not a great option.

 And I can see why I can see what you're saying. I mean, you know, women, they're all commodes. Yeah. So they have saw doors and stuff like that. You go in and you do and come out. It ain't like it ain't like like you said, men standing around in a yard.

 Oh, yeah, exactly. And yeah, I mean, a lot of places, I mean, like luckily, I feel like companion care restrooms are becoming more like normalized now and more widely available, but they're still lacking in so many places. I mean, like in New York, when we went this past weekend, when I went with you like there, I don't remember. I mean, I don't even remember there being a companion care restroom when we were out like it. I used the women's like when we were out like one day and you said we did find one in LaGuardia Airport when we were flying out and it was a really good one. And the Delta Sky Club. Luckily, they had one. But I mean, you just it's really a guessing game. Like you never know if it's going to be an option or not until you actually get there and start looking around.

 Yeah. Yeah. And that that's another thing we was talking about this weekend. And I had a I had a he would have been he was my father's cousin and he was born with a disability where he could not do anything for himself. He had to be changed and stuff like that. We was talking about actually in some of the foreign countries. You've seen adult changing tables.

 Oh, yeah. Yeah. In America, they're super, super rare, unfortunately. But I was in Japan like two months ago back in October and they had companion care restrooms at every metro station. There was one at most of the attractions. They had one and in like 90 percent of the companion care restrooms that I saw anyway, there was an adult size changing table. And so with the adult size changing table, like if you are if a wheelchair user needs to like get out of their wheelchair and lay on that table to be changed or to use the restroom like it's an option available. And so I have only seen a few of those in the U.S. Sadly, but in Japan, they were so widely available and it was just like amazing to see that. And I think Japan like has by far the best accessible restrooms in the world. They have more of them than I've ever seen in any other destination. And I've been to like 50 countries so far, all seven continents. And Japan is really leading the way in terms of accessible restrooms.

 Yeah. And in America, the trend I know when we're building houses, we're seeing a trend of building houses more accessible now. Yeah, I don't know if it's I'm assuming it's because of the boomer babies or, you know, we're getting to the point that they've got to start thinking about, you know, what they're going to do in the next few years, because we see a lot of we do a lot of curbless showers now. We do a lot of bathroom or houses. It's on one level. People not really want to do a lot of upstairs stuff no more.



 We're putting in more handhelds. We're putting in grab bars where, you know, even if there's no one that really needs them right now, they kind of look into the future stuff like that. But, you know, I when I first met and you first met, I did not pay attention to the accessibility stuff as much as I do now. And I think I think it's in which my dad, he he owns the company, you know, he he he owned the company before I did. And he founded the company. Now he's in a wheelchair. So we I guess on with Keela being with you for so long and now him, you know, we always we're always talking about it. I mean, it's like this is it becomes second nature to us. We can see the the flaws in, you know, just just a layout of a restaurant tables. Oh, yeah. I mean, we had that happen this week. You know, here we are. We can't even get to our table because the chairs are laid out wrong.

 Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, 20 to 25 percent of the world's population have some kind of a disability. And so it's well over a billion people with a disability around the world. And out of that 20 percent, 13 percent of those have a mobility related disability and use a wheelchair. And so I mean, I think like with the boomers that are aging, like they're needing accessibility now and then like Gen Z and Generation Alpha, they're more inclusive than other generations. So they're constantly thinking about, well, how can I accommodate, you know, as many people as possible, whether they're they're building businesses or just trying to accommodate people within their own home space? And so I mean, I do think like accessibility has definitely become more of a priority now than it ever has been before. And for good reason, because I mean, it's such a huge we're actually I mean, we're the largest minority in the world, people with disabilities are. And so to be overlooked by businesses and by, you know, people building houses like anyone in the world could become disabled at any moment. Like there's no person with a disability that thought they were going to be disabled at like, you know, at birth, most likely, like in a lot of cases anyway. And anyone with a spinal cord injury that is an Emmanuel chair now, they never thought they would be disabled one day before they had their injuries. So the fact of the matter is that it could happen to anyone at any time. And just by, you know, making your home more accessible now, like you're making your life so much easier in the future as you age.

 Yeah.

 And you say that and the people don't think about it. I mean, you didn't start off in a wheelchair. No, because I've seen home videos of you taking videos of yourself running around the house, just normal everyday kid.

 Yeah, when I mean, my mom did not even know that I had a disability until I was two years old. And then I started like kind of falling down. Like I would take eight steps was like the most amount of steps that I ever took. And then I would just fall down and she started getting concerned when I was two years old and it took me to a doctor where they did a muscle biopsy. And then I started using a wheelchair at the age of four. So I mean, there for a couple of years that we had no idea that I would be disabled, you know, or have a disability of any kind. So you just like really never know when it could happen to you or a loved one like your kid, your parents.



 And so it's important to really think about it now. Like it's so much easier like to retro flight to make it accessible now instead of trying to retrofit it like in the future.



 And not only that, I think you touched it there with the Gen Z and the Gen Alpha and then the boomers, the boomers are looking more toward accessibility because of the need. But Gen Alpha and Gen Z is looking more at the accessibility because of empathy.

 Oh, yeah.

 You know, and that's what we was talking about at the first of the show. I was, you know, other countries seem like they have more empathy for or respect. I don't know. I wouldn't want to call it empathy as much as I do respect. I mean, I want to respect you enough that when you come to my place of business or my home, I mean, even my home, I want you to be able to come in and feel comfortable, be able to use the restroom. And I'm not going to sit here and tell all I mean, I don't have a ramp at my house.

 I'm going to get one. I have been in your house many times.

 I know. I did build the lawn in the back. But, you know, my bathroom, you could get in there and use the bathroom if you had to. You could. But, you know, my bathroom, I got grab bars and stuff like that in it. But even, but me and Kila was talking about it because we was getting ready to do this podcast. And I was like, you know,



 when I built my bathroom down at my plumbing shop, I didn't have to, but I went ahead and made it handicap accessible. You can go in there and use the restroom. And I'm probably going now that I've thought about it. I'm probably going to revamp the front of my building where when you come in, you can get to my bathroom without having to go through the side door. Now you have to go to the side door to come to the bathroom because I ain't got a wide enough door where the counter is at. But, you know, as we grow and as we learn, new products are available to make accessibility better. Yeah.

 I mean, I can do that. Yeah. I mean, I don't blame like I mean, I know like if you don't live in the world where you know people with disabilities and have someone with a disability in your life, it's hard to think about that. Like if you aren't dealing with it on a daily basis in your everyday life. But I mean, I think as long as people are like really open to, you know, learning and being willing to accommodate and learn and like listen to other people about, you know, what they go through and how they deal with life and with accessibility challenges, then like, you know, the world can be a better and more inclusive place, but you just really have to be willing to listen to other viewpoints and realize like, why is accessibility even important for this person?

 And it becomes it becomes a big focal point for plumbers as because restroom accessibility out in public is a big thing. That's that's one of the that's one of the things you really have to I mean, we talk about it all the time, you really have to plan your day around where you use the restroom and where your mother can take you to use restroom or your caregiver can take you to use the restroom. Right. Because you can't just be running down the road and go, I gotta use the restroom and pull over pull over at any random place and run and use the restroom like we can, you know.

 Oh, yeah. Yeah, right before actually I came here to do this podcast with you, I like drank a bunch of Starbucks like before this to get like energized and pumped up. But then I had to use like the restroom. And so we I was like, I don't know where I'm gonna go now. Like, what are we gonna do? Where am I gonna go?

 Because somebody was late.

 Right, Daniel.



 But we I was actually were late because I had to use the restroom. But we stopped at the gas station down the street. And I was like, God is probably not accessible. Like, what's it gonna be like? And we went in there and the women's restroom was out of service, of course. So they had the men's and then we were like, well, how are we gonna do this? What are we gonna do? But luckily, it was a single stall. So there was no like there weren't any urinals or anything like that. So we just went in there and I love a single stall restroom. Like for us, that works beautifully. So that worked out. But it was something that I was even less stressing over right before this podcast because I didn't plan my P math correctly.



 Well, we ain't gonna beat up on build something media too bad because they ain't got accessible restroom. But we are gonna try to teach them a thing or two. Okay, good. Exactly. But you know, you say that about the the the gas stations. We have actually been doing some with Kenneth Ash of K and A Electric that they go in and redo the bathrooms and they're been bringing them up to, you know, ADA, widening them out and making them single stalls and making them family restrooms or his and hers. They don't matter, you know, non-binary restrooms. Right. Right. That way you can go in one person at a time and you lock the door. It's not like, you know, everybody comes in here and don't matter. You know, I love those. Those are great. Anybody does. I mean, I don't like pooping with friends. Right. Right. Yeah.

 I mean,



 and I don't like getting security called on me for trying to throw up.

 It works out beautifully. You've got me on that one. I've had I've had a lot of funny stories in bathrooms, but I haven't ever been in the bathroom and had security come knock on my door in the bathroom. That's got to be that's got to be a hoot.



 Now, when security come to Atlanta that day, did they tell you to leave or was they understanding?

 I mean, they were telling us to leave at first. And then once I explained to them, I said, well, there's no companion care restroom in this terminal. Like I did what I had to do. It took me literally three minutes to get in and out. No big deal. Like, I mean, we explained the full situation to them and then security was really understanding. And they said, well, OK, that's fine. But next time, can you try to let us know and we can just like close off the women's restroom so that you can go inside? And which I mean, like, it's OK. But why should someone that uses a wheelchair and is trying to make their flight on time go through this process of tracking down the person that can close off an entire restroom and wait for everyone else to get out? Like, why is there this added hassle instead of just, you know, making everything universally accessible to begin with?

 And that's another thing, you know, it's not like you want to be the focus of everybody shutting down a bathroom.

 Right. No, he's coming into pee. I mean, yeah, well, security actually put up caution tape like before I got out of the restroom and they came in, they put up the caution tape. And so when I came out after I had that talk with them in the restroom, everybody, all the women were gathered around like waiting to get in. And so I'm like a spectacle at this point. And it was just like embarrassing, honestly, like to have to be a spectacle. Like when I'm just trying to go pee, like they're all doing, you know, like, right. And just trying to like, I think I was flying to Istanbul at that time. Like, it's it's bizarre.



 And like you said, just go ahead and make all bathrooms accessible. Right. I mean, because everyone and I don't know if you know it. I mean, I know you know it, but the people out there listening and they know it too. They just don't realize it a lot of times. People will use the accessible restroom all the time to one over the regular style. So why not make all of them accessible?

 Yeah, every time that I'm in the Atlanta airport,



 like 99 percent of the time, we have to wait on someone to come out of the accessible companion care restroom. And it's always a flight attendant or an airport worker. Like, it never fails. Yeah. I mean, but to their benefit on the signs in the Atlanta airport, it does say like this restroom is for anyone regardless of gender affiliation. And so it's not just specifically for people with disabilities. But I feel like, you know, people should know like they they have to know that that's meant for people with disabilities to use because there's no other option. But it's just like, I mean, I guess it would be discrimination. Like if the airline said, well, only people with disabilities can use this, you know, but I don't know.

 It's well, I'm talking about even in the even in the. In the the the the public restroom where there's four or five styles of things, some that the installs always, you know, the bigger stock. Absolutely. That's like we got portable restrooms. We do portable restrooms at Mitchell's Plumbing. Yeah, two pots on the spot. And if we've got three regular restrooms and one of our ADA compliant portable, you know, portables, they're bigger, they're more spacious. They'll be people waiting in line to go into the accessible restroom instead of going into these because there's so much more room. You know, I've said it time and time again, we were just buy all accessible. But there again is that accessible tax.



 As I'm sure they're a lot more expensive than a regular one.

 Standard regular unit is seven hundred dollars.



 A handicapped accessible unit is thirty two hundred.

 Wow, really? Yeah, that is a huge increase.

 Yes. And they are bigger, but they're not three or four times that. Right. You know, and they've got the same tank. They've got the same, you know, everything. The only thing is they've got grab bars in them and they've got the five foot turnaround. Right. Yes.

 Wow. That's well, I would never think it would be that much more expensive.

 That's crazy. Yeah. There are there and that's why that there are there again, if there's a festival or anything like that, that's why you have to wait.

 Yeah.

 Oh, yeah. To use the restroom. Right. Because it costs so much to buy those units. They're more expensive than the standard units to rent out. So therefore people get less of them. And the code, the environmental code



 says that you don't even have to have an accessible restroom till you have rented four standard. So if you rent four, you've got to have three standard and one handy or one accessible. I want me to use handicap.



 That's another thing I've I've tried to change my my my verbiage and my my my my vocabulary on how I address accessible.



 Yeah. Yeah.

 I mean, it doesn't really offend me at all. I'm hard to offend, but I think, you know, if if we're talking about terminology, like just ask the person with the disability, like what terminology they prefer. Like the only terms I do not like and I hate are the term wheelchair bound and confined to a wheelchair, because I feel like when people say that I'm wheelchair bound, like they like I picture myself like strapped to the wheelchair like Hannibal Lecter or something like. And, you know, my wheelchair actually gives me freedom. Like it's the opposite of being bound or confined. Like it's actually a freedom device.

 The only time you want to balance if I'm driving you across.

 Right. Exactly. Yeah. Daniel was driving my van one day and we went, I guarantee you guys, we went 80 miles an hour over the biggest speed bump in Walker County.

 Now we need Alec here to show you how his head went.

 Right.

 Right. Yeah.

 Daniel Sutter. She can do a recreation of that. She would love it.



 They had to give Alec a shout out on here with me on here and her uncle Corey, too. We'd be in trouble if we did something about Alec. Yeah. Sweet Alec. Yeah. And that's another thing. She's been raised to not see.



 The she just would assume everything's going to be accessible because she does. She's you're just Uncle Corey to her. Right. Right. I mean, yeah.

 And that goes back to what we were saying about like, if you're around it every day, like around someone with this with a disability, you just know like what to expect and how important accessibility is. But, you know, for another kid like that doesn't have an uncle that uses a wheelchair, like they would have no idea. But when I'm with Alec, like she's like opening doors for me and she knows that I can't do that. And she's like, if my leg falls and it needs to be crossed, like she'll lift my leg up and cross it or, you know, like she's constantly willing to help out. And I think it's just like she has a lot of empathy. But it's also just like she is around someone with a disability that lives a different life, you know, than everybody else that she knows. And I mean, her grandpa also like Jean, like uses a power wheelchair, too. So like she's very aware of accessibility. And I think, you know, that's important and like it's super helpful. And if the whole world was that way, like we would say a much more inclusive and empathetic world.

 Right. And she she brings it to our attention. I thought she'd be like, well, they don't, you know, Uncle Cory or Bob, Bob can't get in here. They ain't got a thing around. I mean, she sees it sometimes before I do. Because like you said, she was she was she grew up in it. She was accustomed to it. And I think a lot of times that's what some of this stuff happens is there's a stigma around it, maybe. Yeah. You know, you know, like, you know,



 we've noticed it, too. And, you know, with dad with you, there'll be little kids who want to come up and talk to you or something like that. Oh, no, don't leave him alone.

 Leave him alone.

 You know, like, why?

 Right. Yeah. Right. I would much rather a kid ask now than, you know, grow up. And then 20 years later, they're like being ableist and just, you know, think, well, he's weird because he's in a wheelchair. Like, just ask me while they're young. Like, I'm completely open to that and would love for every child to meet someone with a disability and like be able to learn from that.

 And, you know, a child's question usually is completely honest and pure.

 Oh, absolutely.

 They're going to ask you something. And that's just like a great a great thing that you've done. You and your mother both was wrote the book, the children's book. Let's explore with Corcor. Right. That's a great book to have to have in.



 I think one of them want to be in every school around. I mean, I think they order because there's there's a lot of children that don't know what to, you know, that's not been around it. They don't know that just the unfamiliarity of it makes them, you know, question and they won't question whether when they're they're told not to. I think that's where the stigma is built.

 Oh, yeah. And we really wrote that children's book because originally we wanted it to be a book for other kids for kids with disabilities to be able to see themselves represented by a character in a children's book. But then after we release the book, we've gotten so much feedback from, you know, parents of kids that don't have a disability. And they're saying, like, well, this is really cool. This taught my child that kids with disabilities can travel the world and they can do all these cool things. And that's really been one of my favorite things about like, let's explore with Corcor the children's book is just like knowing that we're having that impact not only for kids with disabilities, but also, you know, hopefully making the ones without disabilities more empathetic towards other kids with disabilities that, you know, they go to school with. And when you were talking about like kids say the weirdest like, you know, they're they're very honest and it reminded me of when I did my college internship at Disney World, a kid came up to me one day and I was like in my Disney uniform, like working. And he came up to me and he said, is your butt stuck? And he just like started like he was like, really thought my butt was just stuck.

 Yeah.

 And that's why I couldn't stand up. So I mean, that shows again, like why it's so important to like teach them now while they're young. Yeah, yeah.

 And that's why. See, now you need to write a book about



 Corcor goes to the bathroom. Right.

 Really, really. We actually have started on this. This is an exclusive. We have not announced this anywhere, but we have started on a second book. But it's not about going to the bathroom. It's about Corcor taking flight. And so he's going on his first ever plane ride.

 And so well, we're here for folks on Plum Delusional Podcast. It is. Corey Lee is done working on a second book.

 Yeah, we're very, very close. We have like two more illustrations to get done and hoping to release it in like the spring of 2025. So hopefully very soon.

 Yeah, that's good. I'm glad I'm glad to hear that. I think I may have known you was working on one. You probably did because of the table gossip at home. But it's good that you I think that's a great thing. I think I think once you get done with that one, I do think you need to make one about, you know, going to the accessible restrooms. Because if we can instill it in our children now, when they're young and they're impressionable,



 you know, that's the kind of stuff we need to teach them. Oh, yeah. That's what's that's what's going to make our nation great again. It's teaching our kids to be empathetic, to think about the next guy down the road, right? To to to to to have a bathroom that you can use, I can use your mom can use anybody that walks, you know, down the free sidewalk in the United States or to be able to use the bathroom without a spectacle.

 Right. Yeah. I mean, it's something that literally every human does. So it should be, you know, something that every human can do.

 I mean, I make a living off of making sure people have a place to go. Right.

 Yeah. And a good living. I mean. Oh, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, yeah. I know. I wish like I wish this country could do a better job at it and like, you know, get more inclusive restrooms everywhere. But hopefully one day.

 Well, it bothers me. It bothers me when you come back and tell me how, you know, inclusive China and stuff is. Well, I've not been to China. I mean, Japan. Japan. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.



 Japan, you know.

 Oh, yeah. You know, I thought we led the way.

 You know, oh, yeah. No, that's what I mean. I really thought we did, too, until I started traveling. And then like it really opened my eyes to like, wow. Like, I mean, I've really like misconstrued this my entire life. Like there are other places that really, you know, have like better health care where you can get caregivers for more hours per day. Like in Georgia, where I live, I can only get a caregiver for like 10 hours a day. But my friend in Finland can get one for 24 hours a day. I mean, so and some other states in the US also can get more caregiver hours. Like in New York, like New York State, you can get up to 24 hours a day. So it really just depends on where you are, where you live. But there are so many aspects of living with this with a disability where it often is much better and other destinations.



 Yeah. And like I said, it comes back to it comes back to price. Yeah, I mean, we pay we pay a premium price for accessibility.

 Yeah. And often what is the government willing to spend toward accessibility, toward making things accessible and providing care?

 That's a whole other podcast. I mean,



 I understand what you're saying. And but the thing about it is if it was affordable, the government wouldn't have to pay for it. Right. Oh, yeah, absolutely. It's not it's not. And that's it's people don't just people with disabilities. And that's one of the things I think people another thing that people miss construe is they're not all jobless. Right.

 Oh, yeah, no. I mean, every disabled person I know, I mean, there is this like preconceived notion that people with disabilities are not out there working. Like we're not contributing to society. We're just like maybe laying at home in the bed, like not doing a lot with our lives. And that's like the truth is the total opposite. Like every disabled person I know personally is like really like, you know, their public speakers, they have regular everyday jobs like everyone else. Like, I mean, we I mean, I, for example, I mean, I run a travel website and like do that for a living. I'm a public speaker also and do like 15 speaking gigs a year around the world. So we are not just like sitting at home bored. Like we're out there like living just like everyone else and trying to live and to be able to live a normal life.

 Yeah, you're not just going, you're not getting out once a week just to go down here to see if you can use the bathroom and complain about it. Right. Yeah. You've got your out, your duty. I mean, and folks, I'm going to tell you, you can you can take this from me. I was with him this weekend in New York and I still got blisters on my feet from trying to keep up with him. I mean, he's all the time doing something. You really are. You really I commend you on your work ethic. I mean, I tell Kila all the time, you've got one of the best worth I've ever seen, you know, and you've you've used that to build yourself a a following and a base to be able to get your word out. And then you're also using it as something good to promote the accessible travel and accessible restroom stuff and accessible planes. I mean, you've a lot of people may not know this, but you've had a lot to do with accessible plane travel.

 Yeah, I mean, I've that's like the part of traveling that I honestly dread the most is flying just because it's so difficult as a wheelchair user because I can't use the restroom on a plane. So I flew like two months ago to Japan and it was a 14 and a half hour flight from Atlanta to Tokyo. And I couldn't let go to the restroom on the plane. So during that plane ride, I was like constantly worried like, well, OK, like did I drink too much two days ago before the flight? Like, am I going to have to use the restroom? And about halfway through that flight, I had to pee. And I was like, oh, my God, what am I going to do? Because I've never used the restroom on a plane until then. I even flew 17 hours nonstop to South Africa from Atlanta and did not use the restroom the entire time. Wow. And so on the flights to Japan, about eight hours went through the flight and then I needed to use the restroom and go pee. And I couldn't get to the restroom, of course. And so my mom was traveling with me on that flight and my friend Kayla. And so Kayla got up and held a blanket over me. And then I slid out to the edge of my seat and just used like a portable urinal jug and just peed in that and went. And I was like so sketched out about it. And was like, oh, my God, are they going to like ground this flight? Are they going to kick me off this plane? Like if they figure out what we're doing. But everyone else was like asleep and like the lights were off. So I don't think anybody even saw what we were doing because they were all asleep at that point. But I was like really nervous about it. And that's like a huge reason why accessible air travel has been such a focus point for me and why I create a lot of content around it. I mean, like on Instagram, like I try to post about it at least on a weekly basis. There are amazing organizations like All Wheels Up. That's suing a lot for accessible air travel. And then the Department of Transportation currently is headed by Secretary Buttigieg, which has really put a focus on making air travel more accessible, luckily, because he has one of his best friends uses a power wheelchair and her name is Emily. So he has that firsthand perspective again, which is so important, as we've said, just to have that firsthand perspective and to be able to know. So I do have hope that within the next few years, we'll see a drastically better air travel space, hopefully, because it's finally being talked about for the first time ever over the past few years. So I just hope that we can like continue that momentum.

 Yeah. And and me and you was talking about it this weekend. The small amount of percentage of the population that is actually in that way. We was talking about, you know, you having the followers. And we were talking about you would say, well, you know, of that percentage of, you know, disabilities or mobility and stuff like that. So that also is the decreases, the percentage of people that's that's able to the to, you know, come forward and help them, you know, to like people to check, you know, you know, there's less and less people that is adapted or in into the the the know of what accessibility, you know, means to people.

 Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I mean, on like Instagram, I mean, I constantly receive messages from people that are saying, you know, if it's enabled by the person, they'll say, well, I just stumbled upon your real or your TikTok or your Facebook real or whatever it may be. And I've never even thought, you know, that people with disabilities can use the restroom on a plane. But then they see my content like for the first time, they really start thinking about it. And so I feel like the more content that we put out about it and the more people will realize just how important it is to make the world more inclusive and accessible. So.

 But I got to thinking about that as we talked about that bathroom usage on the plane.

 Yeah.

 Yeah. I hope it ain't illegal. Yeah. We just put it on. We just put it on recorded tape. Yeah. But nobody died. I mean, that's the thing about it. People. Right. We all get so excited about bathrooms. Yeah. I mean, there's people that look down and they look at me and they're plumbering like, oh, I hate that's a nasty job. Yeah. Well, yeah, it can be nasty. Yeah. But I don't let it be nasty. All right. You know, we wear our gloves, we wear our spider shields, we wear our suits. We do get in some bad places. But, you know, it's just like anything else. They make tools and stuff like that to do it. And just because, you know, bathrooms need to be accessible, that don't make that don't make it any really that much harder. And I don't see why we can't have some kind of regulations or regulations process on accessibility, you know, materials to build stuff like that.



 And that's one thing that I'm going to try to do is as 2020, 25 coming on is to, you know, to look more into the accessibility bathroom stuff and see if we can't entrain my guys on it more. Because if that's the thing about it is if they don't know if they're not trained, right? I mean, if they know if they know, which we do a bunch of commercial stuff, too, which they know, you know, the heights for the commodes and the urinals and stuff like that. But we put urinals in sometimes and I'm like, you know, we put the handicap urinals in and they're low. But a urinal for you.



 Yeah, I mean, they really need a companion for every bathroom we put in that's got a man and a woman's companion in the middle of it.

 Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I mean, it would be and then it would work for everyone. I mean, that kind of goes back to like universal design, which is this idea that like, if you make everything universally accessible, it's good for everyone in the universe. So if like every building had a ramp to get in instead of steps or if, you know, everywhere had a companion restroom or like not even a men's restroom and a women's restroom, but just companion restrooms, it would work for everyone instead of only a certain like small percentage of the population.

 Right. And it would it would it would eliminate any of that man going into the women's restroom or men going into the or the women going in the men's restroom to help, you know, if we had the companion restroom, it would eliminate that. Right. Yeah, it wouldn't even be a worry. Exactly. So you're not only you're not only making it accessible for people that that need it, you know, you're eliminating other problems with it too. Oh, it's like you said, it's like a universal it's like the antibiotic of the bathroom world.

 Yeah, exactly.

 You know, it works for literally everyone. Right. Right. And just give them a handful of companion bathrooms. Right.

 Exactly. They'll call me back in the morning. I hope that'd be the dream.

 Yeah. And that's another thing, you know, is just you can talk about it. The more you talk about it, that's one reason I know I wanted to get you on here with us is to be able to talk about it. You know, not only is it something that we deal with, you deal with it. Hopefully a lot of people get to see this podcast and can understand why it's so important that if you're doing a new business, if you're opening a business or if you're building a commercial building or even if you're building your home, you know, think about it a little bit ahead of time to put in some accessibility. You know, your house is your house, your room is fully accessible.

 Yeah.

 And your bath. I mean, your bathrooms is as cute and nice as any bathroom I've seen.

 Yeah.

 You know, and it works perfectly for my needs, but it may not even be accessible for someone else with a disability because I don't have grab bars in there. But I mean, for me, it's perfect. So I mean, again, just like focus on what the person with the disability needs and tries to accommodate their individual needs. Like if you're building that house or that restroom for them.

 But you was talking about, I was talking about what you had done. You actually went to Washington and spoke about disabilities with Governor Warnock, didn't you?

 Yeah. Well, with his office, he was. I'm not Governor Warnock or Senator Warnock. Yeah. Yeah. Senator, what am I? I don't know what I'm saying either. Yeah. But yeah, I went this past summer and it wasn't necessarily about accessibility though. It was more for talking on behalf of Google for things related to digital advertising. Okay. So your other job, right? My other job.



 But I did. I was having able to talk with Secretary Buttigieg twice over the past few months about air travel and making air travel more accessible. And he is like super open to it. And we've talked about the bathroom issue on planes with him. And he is like super nice and really receptive to making the changes. So, I mean, that's why I'm so hopeful about the air travel will improve. Yeah.

 Well, hopefully it won't start over from Squire one. Let's go around.

 I hope.

 You can only hope. But I've enjoyed talking about this. I think we've had a great discussion about it. I think I'm glad. I'm going to have to get you back on because I don't think we covered. I know there's other things we can cover and we're definitely going to make more adventures down the road. And but y'all do. Y'all do tune in to his Instagram and Facebook. And you want all the social media channels. Okay. If we want to find you on Instagram, how do we find you?

 So my username on Instagram and TikTok is at curb free Corey Lee and Corey Lee is just C O R Y L E.

 Okay. And Facebook is just Corey Lee. I just curb free with Corey Lee. Curb free with Corey Lee.

 And then you have a website, correct? Yeah. My website is where I share all of my travel information and I publish really in depth, accessible travel guides. And that is that curb free with Corey Lee.com.

 Okay. All right. Is there anything else you want to leave the people out there in podcast land with?

 Ah, I mean, you'll have to get me back again to talk about my poop stories on airplanes.

 Oh yeah. I know you've got plenty, plenty of food stories because

 we can, we can just leave a little teaser for the people for next time. Yeah. Yeah.

 Everybody, everybody has to do it. That's the one thing about it. Everybody has to do it and it don't smell good. Right. You know, but that's it for today, guys. We appreciate you tuning in. We appreciate everybody listening to this. And if you can share this one, get it out there, especially because we want to get the word out about the accessible bathrooms that we need in America.



 We want to get, we want to include everybody. We want, we want the uncle Corey's of the world to feel that they can go out with their Alex of the world and not have to worry about where they're going to use the bathroom. We, we, we, we can do that. Now, you know, if we, if we don't do anything else, we can at least make them feel included, you know, if you, if you got something you want to, to, to, to get with us at, you can get, you can give us a email at, uh, Mitchell's Plumbing at winstream.net. And that's going to do it for today on plumb delusional,



 uh, with Daniel Mitchell and Corey Lee. Morning. Thank you for having me. And, uh, remember we're at 206 North Duke street in Lafayette, Mitchell's Plumbing. And we're here when you need a place to go. See you next time.