Thinking Out of the Box as a Single Mom & Entrepreneur

Doris Muscarella, founder of Doris Business Development, shares her inspiring journey as a single mother who built her business from the ground up while raising two daughters.

Her conversation with Bringing Up Business podcast host, Kaila Sachse, explores themes of resilience, the importance of communication in parenting, and the challenges of starting a business. Doris emphasizes the significance of valuing oneself, setting boundaries, and being authentic in both personal and professional life. The episode also highlights the metaphor of golf as a tool for life and business strategy, encouraging listeners to think outside the box and never give up on their dreams.

More About Doris Muscarella

Doris is the founder of Doris Business Development, a boutique consulting firm that merges the influence of media with the appeal of golf to drive meaningful growth for businesses.

She is also the proud mother of two strong and capable young women. As a single mother, she worked tirelessly—often holding two jobs—to support her family and build her business from the ground up. Those challenging years taught her the true meaning of resilience and determination.  Today, she is proud to see those same values reflected in her daughters.

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Transcript

Kaila Sachse (00:02.536)
Welcome to the Bringing Up Business podcast, where we talk about business and parenting. I am your host, Kaila Sachse, toddler mom and owner of a marketing and creative agency called Yumari Digital. I'm excited to chat with today's inspiring and super lovely guest, Doris Muscarella. Doris and I crossed paths last year. I was tasked with elevating a client's social media account for a new brand here in the U.S.

And Doris landed in our DMs. I'm so glad that she reached out. She ended up connecting us to an amazing radio opportunity where she and a co-host interviewed me and our client live on the air. This was my very first radio interview. It was scary, but it was awesome. And from there, our partnership has blossomed. I want to share her story today on bringing up business because her story is incredibly inspiring.

She is the founder of Doris Business Development, a boutique consulting firm that merges the influence of media with the appeal of golf to drive meaningful growth for businesses. She is also the proud mother of two strong and capable young women. As a single mother, she worked tirelessly, often holding two jobs to support her family and build her business from the ground up.

Those challenging years taught her the true meaning of resilience and determination. Today, she is proud to see those same values reflected in her daughters. Doris, I'm honored to get to hang out with you again and welcome to the show.

Doris Muscarella (01:44.322)
Thank you for having me. You almost made me cry as you were reading that.

Kaila Sachse (01:49.172)
I mean, that's that's all you you did that that's

Doris Muscarella (01:52.79)
I did that. It was a lot of work, but it was all worth it. Absolutely.

Kaila Sachse (01:58.006)
my gosh, I can only imagine. Can you help us understand your story? Where did you start? Did parenting come first? Did the business come first? What did it all look like for you?

Doris Muscarella (02:10.488)
So I was married, I had two beautiful daughters and things went south for me so my ex-husband left and he told me before he left he said, know, you're never gonna make it, you're gonna be a failure and you know what, that fueled the fire. So it fueled my fire and I said, you are going to watch me.

Kaila Sachse (02:31.953)
Yes.

Doris Muscarella (02:37.038)
And I have to tell you, it was very difficult. I had to pay a mortgage on my own. I had to raise two daughters on my own. So I decided one job was not enough. I worked in the legal field. did intake the trial. I managed law firms. I did business development, but it just wasn't enough. So I decided that I was always been into PR and marketing. So I decided I would focus on that and I would start

I started to write press releases. started to market primarily nonprofit organizations that couldn't get off the ground. Love nonprofits, always giving back. So that helped me. My daughters, I lived in Miami, Florida, and Miami, Florida has what's called the Florida Pre-Pay College. So that I started very, when they were very young, which was a blessing in disguise because you never know what the future is going to bring. So be ready.

and be prepared. And I always have a plan A, plan B and plan C. And I always, even when I was married, I always had plan A, plan B, plan C. So when I was divorced, I already said, okay, well, their college is already in the works. So I don't have to worry about that. I have to worry about that days in days out. So my daughters graduated from high school and they started to go to college.

Kaila Sachse (04:02.002)
Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (04:03.966)
And of course they started to work. And what I did was as they were growing up, they saw a mother and a father in me. So I would tell them, you have to always be strong. You have to be resilient to whatever happens and you can't ever give up. And I lived in Miami where they speak Spanish and English. My ex-husband was Cuban. I am from San Juan, Puerto Rico. However,

because we lived in the United States, we didn't want to use Spanish. Don't ask me why, because it backfired. We only spoke English in the household. So we only spoke English. So when my daughters graduated from high school, they were trying to get jobs. They were trying to get, you know, and we're in Miami. So my first, my oldest daughter wanted to get into Warner Brothers as an intern.

She went and gave her resume and they said do you speak Spanish because it was what Warner Brothers International Division and She said no not really so they said we need somebody in Spanish and she came back up and She came back to the house and said mom and crying very upset I Didn't get the job. I don't speak Spanish. You never taught me how to speak Spanish. I Said okay, I'm gonna tell you what

I learned when I came from Puerto Rico. I, when I came from Puerto Rico at 16 years old, didn't speak that much English. I did understand it, but I didn't speak that much English. And I went to an English class and I got the biggest F. So I went to the teacher and I said, I don't like this F. I want an A in this class. And he said, well, you're to have to work for it. I said, I want to speak English. And this was

Kaila Sachse (05:50.162)
Yes.

Doris Muscarella (05:59.254)
a long time ago, like an American where I have no accent or nobody knows where I come from. And he says, well, you have to do the following. You have to think in English. You have to watch TV in English. You have to watch the radio in English and you read in English and you don't think in English. Don't speak Spanish again. Exactly what I did. So when my daughter didn't get the job, I said, OK, I'm going to tell you what my English teacher taught me.

and you're going to go back in a month, you're going to dress in a suit and you're going to ask for the same job. So she did that and she got the job. She worked for them for eight years. Yeah, she got the job. She worked for eight years for them, which launched her career in marketing.

Kaila Sachse (06:39.524)
What?

Kaila Sachse (06:48.67)
Gosh.

Doris Muscarella (06:49.294)
My other daughter who refused to learn Spanish, and as you know in high school you have a second language. You can take Spanish or French or Polish. She looked French because she ate Spanish. I'm never gonna speak Spanish, I don't wanna. So fast forward, she studied and she became a doctor. And she became a doctor and they...

Kaila Sachse (07:00.815)
Hmm. Hmm.

Doris Muscarella (07:15.81)
She wanted to get into a hospital in Miami. And they said, do you speak Spanish? She goes, no. They said, sorry, but if you don't speak Spanish, you can't get the job. So I went back to the same thing and said, if you really, really want this job, this is what you're going to do. She's been working in Miami for five years, and she's working for the hospital. So resilience.

Kaila Sachse (07:28.666)
you

Kaila Sachse (07:40.349)
my gosh.

Yes, yes, there's that persistence. my God. Okay, so maybe that's something I need to try. I've been trying to, let me back up. My husband is Filipino. He understands Tagalog, but he doesn't speak it. And so together, he and I, with our toddler, we're all learning how to speak it together. And for me, it feels like it's been really sluggish and that's, I just have to do the Doris way. I just got to immerse myself for a month and then I'll be a pro apparently. That's just like.

man.

Doris Muscarella (08:14.69)
You know, if you really want something, if you really, really want something, the sky's the limit. The sky is the limit. Never give up. Try. I tried. It was brutal. Raising two daughters on my own in Miami. I did have to sell the house because I couldn't afford it. And I moved to Fort Lauderdale where I commuted on a daily basis to Miami. I drove because I didn't want to uproot them from their schools.

Kaila Sachse (08:20.676)
Yeah.

Kaila Sachse (08:42.735)
Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (08:43.022)
So I did that for a year. did whatever I had to do to raise them, know, work two jobs and it really paid off. One of them is working at right now in New York for a Fortune 500 company on her own, has her own place overlooking the Hudson River. And then the other one is the head of the doc. She works at the Miami Cancer Institute working as the head of

Kaila Sachse (08:58.637)
Wow. my gosh.

Doris Muscarella (09:12.11)
the division that they have there. And they did it because, we worked at it.

Kaila Sachse (09:19.164)
my goodness. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they obviously had a powerful role model. And it sounds like you were in their corner to back them up when they felt stuck. They had that comfort with you to go to you and say, Mom, I need help. And you were there for them. And it's just such a beautiful. So for me, the way that I'm I'm approaching how I raise my son, I really want to keep those lines of communication open.

And he's two, right? So there isn't a whole lot of communication past like, you know, tired, hungry, you know, all the basics right now. But I hope that I can just have that same relationship with him that it sounds like you have with your daughters, where they can come to you or he can come to me and we can talk it out and work through things.

Doris Muscarella (10:10.828)
Yeah, communication is very important. And transparency, you know, don't think you're, you know, mom, because sometimes they tell you like, in our culture, they tell you to always don't cry in front of your kids. Don't show your emotions, always be strong. But we are human. Their day, you know, their days that it's great and their days that are not. So be you.

Kaila Sachse (10:13.58)
What do you think? In transparency. Tell me.

Kaila Sachse (10:27.38)
Mm.

Mmm. Yeah.

Kaila Sachse (10:37.315)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. that is so inspiring to hear. I once heard that your kid doesn't need a perfect parent. Your kid needs a human parent. So you have to be, you have to be a hundred percent in who you are and all of the things, all of the ick. And I can, I can envision that being where if you are, if you're having that upset day, yes, they see you upset. They see you cry and they see you maybe even,

Doris Muscarella (10:50.434)
Correct.

Kaila Sachse (11:06.823)
feeling angry and all those expressions. But then they get to see you work through it and resolve it. And that is a way to model for them how to do the same thing. So they aren't floundering a lost when they have those big emotions for themselves.

Yeah. tell us, okay, so obviously you have done a killer job in raising two powerhouse women. What has business looked like for you? When did you decide to start it? How did you start it? What inspired it? All of the things.

Doris Muscarella (11:40.526)
So I worked, as I said, in the legal field for many years. I made a lot of attorneys very wealthy with my skills, talent, and experience. a couple of years ago, always worked sidebar. I always work in the nonprofit arena. I always worked in charitable, fundraising, PR, marketing, whatever. And it was a couple of years ago. I think it was like,

after COVID or before COVID. Yeah, before COVID, I started the business. After COVID, I decided to go full speed ahead. And I said, I'm going to use all my skills, my talent and everything I have and just start my own business and go for it. Was it hard? Absolutely. All right. Very difficult. The good thing is that I knowledge hungry. I have to constantly be learning. That just fills my heart.

So I took classes, I still do. I put in my calendar an hour a day to learn something new. I'm a read-a-holic. I read every book you can think of. So with that, I continue to improve and that I highly recommend it. is a book by, there was a couple of books that I could start to tell you about, but one of them was Think and Grow Rich by Napoleon Thiel. Inspirational.

Kaila Sachse (12:59.65)
yeah, yes.

Doris Muscarella (13:04.34)
Mark Victor Hansen is another writer that is very inspirational. All these books inspire you. So I, you know, when I don't feel I'm inspired, I read one of the books or I listen to a podcast, which are now so accessible to us that are great. So, you know, I inspire myself. I work hard. I love, I have incorporated golf because I love golf. I learned it about, it's going to be 10 years. I learned it.

Kaila Sachse (13:17.677)
Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (13:32.896)
When you're playing golf for those that are golfers, you're out there for hours and you listen to I need, I want, do you know anybody? Boom, referral, lead, referral. So I incorporated golf. I love the media. I write press releases. I was on the radio at the, in the golf and travel show. I'm launching my podcast. So the media is a very good avenue, but if you take them all together and you combine them, it's

a game changer.

Kaila Sachse (14:03.341)
my goodness. So you touched on spending an hour every day learning something. It sounds like that is a blend of hard skills, maybe education that can contribute to your business career, but also soft skills, that personal development, that self-improvement. I can also see how golf, I also golf, and there are moments out on the course when, my gosh, I am just,

kicking myself, I'm starting to get into my head, I'm feeling frustrated, I can't make a shot or whatever it is, I'm having a rough day or just a rough hole. And my mental tape starts to play, right? We have the old stories that we tell ourselves and golf is such a cool sport for being able to switch the paradigm, right? And just say, okay, you know what? That was a bad shot. I'm going to put that in the past. Let's move forward. Have you had the same experience with golf or has golf taught anything?

anything to you where you you probably some things. Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (15:05.13)
yes. Think of golf as your life, right? For example, when I learned to play golf, I was told to keep my eye on the ball because, you you got to keep your bend, you hit the ball, you got to look at it. So I think about life, OK? If you don't keep your eye on your goals and what you want to achieve, you will never get there. So it's like keep your eye on the ball. If you don't keep your eye on the ball, can't hit it.

Okay? When you go out to a golf course and those people that play golf, you analyze, you're very strategic. You're like, okay, what's the yardage? What's the club? Where am I going to hit? What's my target? Same thing in marketing. You can't just, you know, hit a ball and hope it goes to the hole. So in marketing, you target your target audience. Don't waste time.

Don't waste, know, there's a lot of groups or networking groups that are not your target market. Don't waste your time and money. It's like, you know, you want to focus, you want to have a strategic idea, your yards, everything, and then hit the ball.

Kaila Sachse (16:18.816)
my goodness. What a cool metaphor. That is yes, nailed it. So let's talk about finding your target market as a business owner, right? It's not, from what I've discovered through working with many clients, you don't just create a product, build it, and then the audience will just come. Like they'll just appear out of nowhere. You don't just set up a website and you don't just launch a product catalog and then poof, you're selling things. You know, there's a bridge between those two.

between the two. So how do you find your target audience and then what do do next?

Doris Muscarella (16:53.08)
So I like the challenge, okay? So I like the, and I get calls and they will tell me, well, you know, I've been doing this for a couple of years and it's not working and whatever. And I'm like, okay, I will think out of the box and I will do marketing out of the box. And they're like, no, no, want, I want, you know, I want to stay where I'm at. Okay. That's not who I want to work with. I want to work. I work, I have a client.

Kaila Sachse (16:55.221)
Yeah, yeah.

Kaila Sachse (17:18.261)
Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (17:20.974)
that hired me for three months. And she says, it's very difficult market. This is what you have to do. I said, I'm going to try it, but if it doesn't work, I'm going to come back. And I did. I said, this doesn't work. OK. The way that I think you should do it is this way. Out of the box thinking, go directly to the target market. She wanted me to work on one on one finding leads one on one. I said, no. What if I go to a group?

that earns the amount of money that need to pay your, which is pretty much the country club industry that pays your fees. She goes, I've tried to get in there. I've never gotten in there. I said, okay, give me a chance. As of today, we're in seven country clubs because of thinking out of the box. So, and she was like, and I've been with her, it's going to be a year and a half. So.

Kaila Sachse (18:07.912)
Let's go!

Doris Muscarella (18:18.936)
Thinking out of the box, being unique, and the fact that I was a single mother with two kids, I had to make ends meet. I had to do, be creative. I sold Avon, I sold Tupperware, I sold everything you could think of because I had to meet the mortgage and stuff. Same thing with your marketing. Think out of the box. We have a lot of tools. Internet is free.

Kaila Sachse (18:25.652)
Bye.

Doris Muscarella (18:46.254)
Some other social media is absolutely free. Target your audience.

Kaila Sachse (18:51.71)
Yeah, yeah. What advice would you give to the business owner who is afraid of putting themselves out there? And more specifically, there is a crossover between marketing and sales. No matter which, you have to put yourself out there, get in front of the people who you need to get in front of, and you need to give the pitch in one way or another. So what would you say to the business owner who's like, I don't like marketing, I don't like sales, it makes me uncomfortable?

What do you do? What do they do?

Doris Muscarella (19:23.308)
So if you have the resources, you hire somebody. Okay, you hire somebody. If you don't have the resources, train, okay? Read, take courses online. One, I am a big fan of LinkedIn. LinkedIn offers courses that you can learn. Always learn, always constantly evolve.

Kaila Sachse (19:26.086)
Mm-hmm. Yep. Yep.

Doris Muscarella (19:45.922)
Because what you're doing, if you're doing, and there's a saying that says if you're doing something and you repeat it and you repeat it and it's not working, then stop. Reinvent yourself. There is a book that I highly recommend. It's called Twist. Highly recommend. Twist. Twist your brand. Okay? So there are hundred people that do business development.

Kaila Sachse (20:04.222)
what is twist about?

Doris Muscarella (20:13.294)
So I went to networking groups and they all, everybody's selling their business. And I'm like, okay, how can I stand out? A friend of mine said, get the book Twist. And it takes, it says twist the brand, try it this way. Doesn't work, twist it again, try it this way. Okay, so how many people do you know that do PR and marketing with golf and the media?

Kaila Sachse (20:38.771)
Just one, Miss Doris, Doris Buscarella.

Doris Muscarella (20:41.292)
Think about it, and think about it, you know? And if it doesn't work and people start to do the same thing I'm doing, I'm gonna twist it again. And I'm gonna change it again. Constantly evolve. You have to always make yourself relevant. Set yourself apart from the competition. Be different, be unique. It's hit or miss sometimes, okay? But one of them will stick and work.

Kaila Sachse (20:49.319)
Yeah.

Kaila Sachse (21:08.105)
Right, right. Well, that's a really cool lesson for the business owner, right? Yes, you're going to invest your time, maybe some money, energy, your team into trying a new thing. There is a chance that it will flop and that's okay because if it fails, now you have more data to move forward with the next idea. You just gotta make sure the next idea is different, right? Don't do that same initial idea that failed over and over again thinking that it's going.

Doris Muscarella (21:39.148)
Right. And you know, also in social media, everybody does sales. You make a connection in LinkedIn, the first thing they do is sell. That doesn't work. Build a relationship. I, my stepdaughter and I were always, you know, we would travel and take pictures and stuff and post on Facebook and put it and I got tired of it.

She kept on. She was always on. Okay. As of today, she is an Amazon influencer because of those videos. So never give up. Keep on trying. I gave up. I'm like, okay, I'm done. This is not happening. It's not working for me. And she just kept on going, going, going, going, going. One video was all it took. It went viral. So never give up. Be resilient.

Kaila Sachse (22:19.389)
Yeah.

Kaila Sachse (22:30.321)
goodness.

Doris Muscarella (22:34.87)
If you fall down, you know, like a two year old, no, one year old, they fall down when they're starting to walk, but they get up again and they walk again. Same thing, same concept.

Kaila Sachse (22:44.774)
Yeah, yeah. So what is the difference between knowing intuitively that something just isn't right for you versus something that is right for you, you just got to keep going? How do you know the difference?

Doris Muscarella (22:59.138)
That's a good one. That's a great question. Do you love what you do? Think about that. That's when somebody calls me and asks me to do something. This week, I got a, you know, a job, a lead and they want me to do something and I'm like, am I going to like this doing? Am I going to do a good job? Just think about it's not only you do an assessment. Okay.

Kaila Sachse (23:21.192)
So, yeah.

Doris Muscarella (23:28.846)
Okay, they're going to pay me well. However, do I really want to do this? You to think about you. It's always, you know, it's not always about business because if I love what I'm doing, I will excel. But if I don't like it, it's just a job. So if my company, I love golf. just told you, you know, I incorporated golf. I love the media. I incorporated the media PR and marketing. I could do it with my eyes closed.

Kaila Sachse (23:39.836)
Hmm.

Mm-hmm. Right.

Kaila Sachse (23:53.554)
Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (23:58.604)
So that's what I do. Okay? And I will work 10 hours a day and I have no problem because it is what I like to do. I recommend that if you're gonna do something, do something you love to do.

Kaila Sachse (24:10.057)
Yes, yes, yes. And to add onto that, if we don't know what we like to do, then it sounds like we have to get out into the world and do some experimenting and just try different things, see what clicks, what resonates with us, what doesn't and start to build the intuitive sense of what is going to work for us and what isn't. correct me if I'm wrong Doris, you would know more than I do, but.

Intuition is created. It's not just instilled from the get-go. mean, how much of that is learned versus organic and instilled in us? I mean, what would you say about creating your intuition?

Doris Muscarella (24:45.443)
Correct.

Doris Muscarella (24:57.996)
maybe we automatically create it. Think about it. And then we develop it.

Kaila Sachse (25:02.034)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. we're getting deep here.

Doris Muscarella (25:06.35)
What made you go into graphic design and what you do? Because I've seen your work is spectacular.

Kaila Sachse (25:12.93)
thank you. That really means a lot. my gosh. So I was a lucky kid in that I had two really supportive parents. If I wanted to play with photography, they would get me a camera, which at the time was a little film camera, and I would play with developing the film. Later on, when the computer started to become a more normal household item, they got me a computer.

and I played around with different software. I actually played a lot with creating video. And in high school, I took a video class, learned how to edit and play and add in music and do all the fun stuff. And so I thought I was setting sail for a film school. Well, at that same time, I found out that I had the opportunity to get a full ride scholarship at

Caltech, which is a huge engineering school here in California. And so I was like, okay, do I get into the arts or do I take advantage of free college? And I had to sit, I had to sit with that one. And I thought back to all of the different things that I liked to do. And unfortunately for my wallet, but fortunately for my soul, I realized that engineering just wasn't it. I had to go into the arts.

And so that's when I played and I decided between film school and graphic design. you know, I did more soul searching. What did I really like to do? And gosh, if you look through all of my old journals, there are doodles everywhere. I like playing with different typography and, you know, different ways I could play with letters and shapes and colors. And, you know, my old bedroom is a bright teal color with all these band posters that were just so

Doris Muscarella (27:02.573)
Nice.

Kaila Sachse (27:02.651)
Beautiful to look at. Yeah, and I saved like hang tags and stuff from clothes I mean, I just loved graphic design and you know long story short. I think that was the the right choice for my soul I'm super glad I did that. So yeah, that's if that's not a lesson for everybody. Look, it's Choosing and not to do something, you know it choosing to do something with passion versus money The passion will feel more fulfilling in the long run

Doris Muscarella (27:14.798)
There you go.

Doris Muscarella (27:33.172)
Absolutely. Absolutely. I know. I know. But if you're very good at what you do, the money will come. Think about it. The money will come and then you can ask your price.

Kaila Sachse (27:33.478)
But the money is important too. The money is important too. Yeah. Ooh, yes. Yes. Ooh. So tell us about that. Tell us about asking for your price. I mean, if somebody's not used to stepping into their value and if they don't know their worth yet, how do you practice increasing your own sense of value?

Doris Muscarella (27:48.59)
So long.

Doris Muscarella (28:04.558)
So I believe in three things. I believe in research. You do your research first. How many, let's say a consultant. How much does a consultant, PR consultant charge? So you do your research, okay? Then you develop a strategy. Okay, I call it the RSE, research strategy execution. All right, the three things. Research strategy, so.

Kaila Sachse (28:25.84)
Mm. Mm-hmm.

Doris Muscarella (28:29.41)
Before I became a consultant, I researched it, I created a strategy and then I executed it. People will say, we're not going to pay that. Okay. You're going to come across that. You're going to come across people that say, no, I don't need your help or anything like that. No worries. Absolutely. And then two weeks later, okay, can you, can we negotiate your salary? So if you don't value your work,

Who will? Them? The person that's trying to bargain you down? Absolutely not. Always give yourself the value. Always be prepared to answer any questions about yourself. It took me years to gather the skills, knowledge. I went for an election and 50,

year old woman was also being a candidate. I am older, I'm in my 60s, a candidate. They picked her because she was younger. Okay, no problem. It took me 24 hours to feel sorry for myself. And after the 24 hours, said, Okay, dust yourself off. What's next? Okay. Fast forward. Now they're calling me. And they're asking me

Kaila Sachse (29:49.957)
Hmm?

Doris Muscarella (29:56.11)
questions and I said wait a minute you have this person that is young and you know you voted for her and they're like well she doesn't know what she's doing so you know it's not always you know you I valued myself I wouldn't take anything less she did yes I wanted I wanted I want it okay that's what you get so value yourself always stick to your guns whatever you charge stick to it

Kaila Sachse (30:23.695)
Yes.

Doris Muscarella (30:24.578)
They will pay for it and always value you first.

Kaila Sachse (30:30.608)
Yes. Oh, that is great. That's great advice. It reminds me of a time where I shifted my billing, the way that I billed out for a service. I used to take deposit and then collect the balance on the back end. And then I switched it to 100 % upfront, which I realize is a very big risk for my client. But I know that I'm going to show up on time. I'm going to deliver.

product's gonna be great and we'll all be happy. Well, I had this one lead who talked me into a 50-50, 50 % deposit, 50 % on the backend. And I told him, hey, I don't do that anymore because what I find is that that 50 % ends up getting convoluted and now there's like a value issue and I don't end up collecting the full amount that I've provided value for already.

you know, long story short, that that deal went sour and I should not have caved and gone back to something that I know doesn't work. But what I learned in that was that the value in valuing myself, valuing my work. And we can only learn that through just getting in there, throw in some punches, figuring out what what the world is about, figuring out what our business is about and and learning. You know, we're not we're not going to be perfect up front.

Doris Muscarella (31:56.876)
You know, you're always learning, always learning. That reminds me of another book. Let me get it really quick. I will read. It's a book called The Gifts of Imperfection by Renee Barrow.

Kaila Sachse (31:58.669)
Yeah. Yeah.

Doris you have all these awesome recommendations. I love it

Kaila Sachse (32:10.568)
Ooh, ooh yes!

Doris Muscarella (32:13.55)
She's amazing. We're not all perfect. We make mistakes. You you learn, but it talks also about being authentic with yourself and with other people, which is something that we need to work on because you want to be a people pleaser. You want clients, you want this, but you got to be authentic. One of my clients was calling me and they shifted in, you know, they shifted owners. So the...

Kaila Sachse (32:18.104)
Yeah.

Kaila Sachse (32:23.171)
Yes.

Doris Muscarella (32:43.134)
New owner's giving me instructions, but the old owner's sending me emails. Okay, so it's tug of war. And I said, okay, that's it. I took the phone and I said, that's enough. Who's gonna give me the orders? One person, be authentic, put your foot down. This is the way. You gotta respect my time, I said to them. You respect my time. Who's gonna give me the orders and what am I gonna do?

Kaila Sachse (33:08.141)
Mm-hmm.

Kaila Sachse (33:12.131)
Right. Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (33:12.66)
It was hard. You know, it was hard. And then afterwards I said, my God, they're the clients, you know, they're always right. But now only one person is sending me the information. So you have to put your foot down sometimes and it's not easy.

Kaila Sachse (33:24.683)
Yes. Yes. It's not. It's not because I imagine going through your head at that moment was maybe a little scarcity reel. Like if I put my foot down, then they're going to fire me and now I'm out of a client. I got to get somebody else. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's important to hold our boundaries. on that note, how do we hold our boundaries both as business owners and as parents? You know, what does that

Doris Muscarella (33:42.136)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Kaila Sachse (33:53.965)
look like.

Doris Muscarella (33:55.928)
Boundaries is something very, very important. Okay? So I used to work like 10 hours and people would text me seven o'clock in the morning, six thirty in the morning, ten o'clock at night. And I said, I read another book that talked about boundaries because you don't have a life. So I took my phone and I now I block all the calls that come in before nine o'clock in the morning unless they're my daughters. And I blocked the calls after five o'clock unless they're my daughters.

Kaila Sachse (34:12.418)
Thank

Kaila Sachse (34:22.006)
Yeah. Yeah.

Doris Muscarella (34:22.966)
I do not answer emails until then and they come through my phone, but I do not answer emails until the next day at nine o'clock in the morning. Respect my boundaries. It's the only way you're going to have a life, you know? And if you don't do it, nobody will do it for you. You're not going to lose a client because you didn't respond at 10 o'clock at night. Okay? So the next day, respect it. And once they get used to that, it works.

Kaila Sachse (34:30.444)
Yeah, yeah, right, right. No. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what we're learning is if...

Doris Muscarella (34:52.472)
So.

Kaila Sachse (34:54.27)
a client doesn't respect your boundaries or if a client isn't willing to pay your price or if a client is trying to talk you down into something you're uncomfortable with, then it's just not a good match. And that's okay. They can find somebody else. You are bound to get more clients or more customers or whoever it is that your business model entertains. yeah, yeah. my goodness, Doris. This has been an amazing conversation. Can you tell us where people can find you?

Doris Muscarella (35:15.988)
Absolutely, absolutely.

Doris Muscarella (35:24.554)
My website is dorisbusinessdevelopment.com. I'm also on LinkedIn and I'm on social media a lot. I have a TikTok and everything and they're welcome to, you know, there is a 15 minute conference that they're welcome to go online and just schedule and I'll be happy to help them in any way I can.

And thank you for having me. It's been great. Hope we continue to work together. Your work is amazing. yeah, I wanna keep on working with you. Absolutely.

Kaila Sachse (35:45.395)
Amazing.

Kaila Sachse (35:51.423)
Thank you. we definitely, definitely will. I so love having you in my circle. You are just such a lovely bright, bright light and you're inspiring as heck. my goodness. You're amazing. Thank you for being on the show, Doris.

Doris Muscarella (36:05.582)
Thank you. Absolutely. Have a good evening.