SPEAKER_00

Now things are much bigger and bolder and brighter colors, animation, video backgrounds, things are a lot more alive now than they were 10 years ago.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Hi, I'm Aravozeri and welcome to the Entrepreneur Corner of How Much Can I Make? If you're dreaming of starting your own business and looking for inspiration and ideas, you came to the right place. So today we're gonna speak with an entrepreneur, Lindy, who is a web designer and a graphic designer, correct? Yes. How did you get into web designing? Were you a graphic designer before?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I was. It's kind of a long story, but the the short story is I've always been like a very visual person, and I I started off focusing on drawing and photography. So I actually have a degree in fine arts, and I thought that I would be working as an artist or a photographer. Um so fresh out of college, I started working as an in-house product photographer for a great company, and I really liked the work, but there wasn't a lot of like upward mobility or room to take on bigger challenges, which is what I really was hungry for. So they started giving me some design tasks, which was very outside the photography realm. And I was not a designer then, uh, but it's where I discovered that I loved design, even though I was terrible at it.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

So how long ago was that? Uh that was about 12 years ago. You'd made the switch apparently to web design.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so I I do bold because I I always wanted to work for myself. So when I was working in this company and I started taking on design tasks, design became the thing that I could see like getting me to that point of working for myself. So I started taking on some freelance jobs and I met some great people. I I started on e-Lance, which is now known as Upwork, and I'm still working with some of those people, you know, 10, 12 years later. And then a couple years after that, started adding web design to my skill set.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

And how would you say web design changed over the years?

SPEAKER_00

When I got into the world like 10 years ago, there was a huge emphasis on a lot of really clean white space. There was space around everything. And now, I mean, space is still important, but now things are much bigger and bolder and brighter colors. Uh, colors were a lot more muted 10 years ago. There's also a bigger emphasis on movement, whether that's animation, um, video backgrounds. Things are a lot more alive now than they were 10 years ago.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

I looked at your on your website. We actually we're gonna put a link to your website if you don't mind on the show notes. And you have tons of clients. How yeah. How do you get your clients?

SPEAKER_00

Uh just word of mouth. I I don't advertise, it's it's just building through the web of client connection. I I have great clients that are just they're just fantastic people and they tell their friends about me, and that's how it grows.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

How did you get your first client?

SPEAKER_00

Well, I started taking jobs online and then What do you mean online? Sorry, so there's online marketplaces. Uh Upwork is a big one, and you can build a profile and put your specialties in there, and uh clients can hire you for different jobs. So that's how I started. But my first real life client was actually um, I think it was my landlord at the time. He had a yeah, a kitchen design business, and he wanted to do a big rebrand, and it was a huge job, and I was really nervous, but I knew I had to do it. So they hired me to do everything. So logo design, print packaging, and their website, even some photography. So I really pulled on like everything I could do to get this job done. And then he knew a lot of people in the area too, so he started referring me to more clients, and that was kind of, I guess, my like break into the local area.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Do you have to learn in-depth about everybody's business or basically just the visual aspects of the business?

SPEAKER_00

No, in-depth really, because that's where we find what makes their business really special and and different from all the other businesses in in their industry. And that's where we find things we can really leverage to make them stand out. And it facilitates an environment where their ideas pop up that they maybe never would have thought about. It's it's a ground where ideas can spark. And I've I've actually had a lot of clients say, wow, I've never thought this much about my customers before because we do such an in-depth dive into who they're selling to. Do you also deal with the marketing? They deal with that, but it is still good to know who we're designing for. And and that's I think a misconception a lot of clients have is like when I do a logo project for them, it's not what they want their logo to look like, something pretty that that's an art piece. What we're doing when we design a logo and a brand is bridging the gap between them and their customers. We need to know who they're selling to on the deep level so that we know when we put this brand out into the world, it's going to resonate with the right people.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Is it an ongoing business with the with the clients?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah. Most of them, they'll have me build their website to start off with, but then maybe in a year they'll reassess and we'll go in and add new content or change things around, add new pages. So yeah, I'm lucky that most of the clients that I build websites for, they become lasting relationships.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Nice. How long does it take you, a project from beginning to end, roughly?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it depends a lot on uh like client communication because some people will respond the same day and that's great. That moves the project along really quickly. Other people are super busy and they take three, four, five days to respond. But a typical project, if I was going to be doing branding as well as full website design, typical project is roughly eight weeks.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

So, how do you decide what to charge them?

SPEAKER_00

It's a combination of you know how much time I think the project's going to take, as well as what's the value that I'm providing for them. It's usually um a bit of a custom quote. So I'll talk to the person and and determine what they need, how big their website's gonna be, whether they need e-commerce built into the package, do they need a lot of content development?

Mirav Ozeri - Host

So if you don't mind, take me through a project. Somebody comes to you, I want to get a web design and and branding of my business. Where do you take it from there?

SPEAKER_00

So there's a lot that goes into it that's that's not just web design because I work for myself. Like if someone was going to be working for a company, then they'd probably have some of these things handled for them. But because I do all of it, so I start off with a brand discovery meeting where I get to know their company in depth. We go over their goals for the future, their target market, their competitors, we really dive deep. And then we start looking at visual examples of websites that I think would be appropriate for their industry. They also share examples of what they like. Doesn't necessarily have to be examples of websites in their field, but just so I can kind of see their aesthetic because one of the challenges is blending what they like with what is appropriate for their business and what's gonna work hard for their business. And then from there, I will develop two or three homepage concepts. So these are all distinct options that they can choose from. We work through some revisions on their favorite option, and then that finished homepage design informs the look and feel for the rest of the website, and then go ahead and build that. They get to review it. We do mobile optimization, so it's responsive, looks good on all screen sizes. We do basic SEO configuration, and that's pretty much it. They're ready to go. I love things that pull on many different skill sets, things that require the creative aspect as well as the technical aspect. And I like projects that take time and are multi-step, and yeah, we can really get into the nitty-gritty of their business. So that typically is something like a full branding project and website project together.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

What would you say is your biggest challenge in running the business?

SPEAKER_00

What is tough for me is that I'm such an introvert, like to a fault, that when I have meetings and phone calls and stuff, I really have to psych myself up for it and then recover after. It is really draining to me. But I know it's essential. And I I actually worked as a bank teller through high school, which was very face to face. So I got a lot of practice that way. So I can do it, but I would much prefer to just work quietly for hours at a time, you know. Like if I could work day and night alone and be perfectly happy, but most people are probably not as introverted as I am, so that could be another challenge too. It's just the isolation.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Right.

SPEAKER_00

But yeah, I mean, when you're hunched over a computer for hours at a time, that's definitely um a challenge. But I also have a dog who has to go out every few hours. So we'll go out, play fetch in the yard, I'll get a little movement in, you know, and I also make it a point to exercise almost every day.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

What's the biggest misconception about web designers? Probably that it's easy.

SPEAKER_00

You know, a very focused area where you're only designing and building, and there's so many other things that go into it, you know, especially for me working for myself. There's the client relationship and communication side of it and content development. Do you have people that help you that work with you? I should have people who tell me because it's getting to the point where oh, I was working till 10 p.m. last night. So it's it's time to hire someone. I've just been enjoying keeping it small because you're an introvert. Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I never wanted to be anyone's boss, but uh I think I have to now. And it's been a few years coming. Every January I think about goals for the business and you know, what do I want to do differently? What didn't work last year that I want to change? And hiring someone has always been one of the top items. I just have not gotten there yet, but I need to.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

What advice would you give to a web designer, wannabe?

SPEAKER_00

Definitely spend a lot of time learning your craft, staying fresh and current because design trends are always changing. And when you first get into design, you will find that whatever the current style is is gonna try to stick with you for the coming years, and you really have to fight against that to stay current and not let your designs get stale. You have to be constantly feeding your brain with new designs, looking at other websites out there, what other designers are doing, staying fresh and staying adaptable because technology is always changing too. You know, things that we had to hand code 10 years ago, now there's widgets for everything, or you can get AI to like I even have AI write code for me sometimes if I can't, uh if I can't figure out how to get a website to do something. The problem is right now, but I think this is changing, but right now, when you use AI for things like that, the answer to your question usually has to exist somewhere on the internet. So if it's a brand new problem you're trying to solve, it's not very good at that most of the time.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Can AI eventually take your job away?

SPEAKER_00

I think there's always gonna be some kind of demand for someone to head the project and to be more of the consultant aspect. But you know, that it's definitely a potential that AI is going to take away some aspects. It's in every industry too. A lot more things are gonna be automated. It's gonna be a little less hands-on than it is now. I think we're gonna be able to step back even further from the coding side.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

If a business needs photography, for example, you have a photographer, you go yourself.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I go myself. I I still have, I mean, I'm still such a photography gearhead, so I'm still in that industry as well. And I I love photography. I love the technical side of cameras, and so I'll do that for clients as well.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

How much can a beginner, let's say somebody just finished high school, has pretty good knowledge about graphics and design and all of that, wants to go get the first client, how much can they expect to earn?

SPEAKER_00

That's gonna depend a lot on where you are, where you're located, and what the demand is. If you look online, you'll see figures, you know, anywhere from like 60k up to 150k on the high end or even high, even higher. You know, but when you're breaking into the industry, you're probably gonna be starting around the lower end. But I have found the best way to scale is working for myself. There's no one telling me I can't take on this project or I can't charge this.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

What was the most valuable lessons you learned?

SPEAKER_00

Boundaries are very important. Boundaries are important and protecting your peace because you know, when I first started, I would work weekends, I'd work nights, and that will wreck your mental health. But also to remain open-minded and really listen when when people speak, because some of my best projects have been collaborative with the client in a way that you know it was successful in a way that never could have happened if it was just me telling them what I thought was best for their business.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Yeah. But if you could start all over again, what would you do differently?

SPEAKER_00

That's a really good question. What would I do differently? You probably hire someone else sooner. You do what? Hire someone else sooner. Get some help. Instead of trying to do everything my myself.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

What's the biggest reward of the job?

SPEAKER_00

Oh, well, seeing the smiles on all my clients' faces now. When I finish a big project and it's out in the world, that's really rewarding. When I walk down the street and I see my logo on a sign in front of a restaurant, and I walk in and their menus have all the branding. And I have you mentioned the Dutch Alehouse. I do photography for them as well. So I get to go in to their restaurant quite a bit and just, you know, see all the work that we've done around us. That's that's really cool.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

Before we go, could you please recommend some software or apps that a web designer wannabe can start playing with?

SPEAKER_00

I use the Adobe Suite, but I know some people are moving into some of the free programs. Figma is a big one. You know, you can you could definitely find some free options online when you're just getting started. Although I think Adobe does have like a student discount if that's in your budget.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

There you go. So if you're thinking of becoming a web designer, at least you know where to start. Lindsay, thank you so much for your time.

SPEAKER_00

Sorry, my dog is moving. Okay, he held it until now.

Mirav Ozeri - Host

You need to take him for a walk. All right, thank you so much. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah. That's a wrap for today. If you have a comment or question or would like us to cover a certain job, please let us know. Visit our website at how much can I make that info. We would love to hear from you. And on your way out, don't forget to subscribe and share this episode with anyone who is curious about their next job. See you next time.