Focal Point
Conversations with artists across all industries, taking a deep dive into the nuances, techniques, and philosophies of society's talent.
Focal Point
Every CRY is Different #51 w/ Actor Mikah Fikes
When the pandemic disrupted his college plans in 2020, Mikah Fikes rediscovered a childhood passion for filmmaking. With no connections, he dove in by taking local actor classes, eventually landing roles that connected him to the Midwest film community.
In our candid conversation, Mikah shares how acting has shaped both his craft of acting and long term goals of directing. He opens up about the psychological challenges of accessing genuine emotions on set, recalling an intense crying scene in his upcoming film What’s Wrong Wendy
Welcome to the Focal Point Podcast. I'm your host, tony Riggs. Here I take a deep dive into my personal interests of the hidden craftsmanship philosophies and passions behind society's talent. If you're intrigued by artistic nuance, please subscribe and follow on my YouTube channel, spotify and Buzzsprout. With that being said, let me introduce you to today's guests, micah, welcome to the podcast. How are you doing?
Speaker 2:I'm doing good. Thanks for having me on.
Speaker 1:You've been busy. You've been really busy as of late.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my schedule has been filling up a little more than usual recently, okay.
Speaker 1:Well, I love interviewing actors, but go ahead and just introduce yourself, what you do and how you got into it in the first place what you do and how you got into it in the first place.
Speaker 2:Okay, um, I'm micah fikes. I began acting back in 2020 after covid kind of hit. Uh, originally I was going to go out to college in arizona state university. Well, once I figured, well, once everything hit and the shutdowns and stuff happened, I figured, well, you know, I can't go anywhere. We had to have the whole lockdown, which I understand. So I just kind of stayed local. I'll be close to family, I'll do college online.
Speaker 2:And in the meantime, I was thinking like you know, what do I want to do with my life? What's my end game? What do I want to do? And I remembered back to a passion I had since fifth grade and it was to be a director, to be film director. I forget what led to it, probably a movie I saw or something that I walked out of the theater like whoa. That was incredible. And I started out making funny skits with my friends when we were in middle school, just funny stories and stuff like that. Anyway, flash forward to 2020, 2021, I was like you know what, there's got to be a way to get into this. But how do I get into it with no money, no resources, no connections. I come from a small town in Ohio.
Speaker 1:Is this when you robbed a bank?
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, that's what I did Once. I did that.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right, just keeping my timeline straight. Yep, yep.
Speaker 2:Once I did that. Okay, all right, just keeping my timeline straight, yep, yep. But I was like you know, I'm going to look up Columbus acting. I looked that up and I wouldn't advise this. I clicked the first link and signed up for acting classes and I did about a year and a half of classes within the first year. I finally got my first thing, and it was just a small background role on a um, a series that someone was making and it was actually called the bay, and a buddy of mine named dylan hughes wrote and produced that, and now we are like we're like good friends and through him I've met so many other people and it just, it was one little thing and then it opens you up to this network of people and, after working in this business for a little while, you're like it really is kind of a small-knit community like Midwest filmmaking.
Speaker 1:Well, it depends on where you're at. It could be a cult. Sometimes. There's some groups that are a little too close-knit. It makes me really, really suspicious.
Speaker 2:What year was?
Speaker 1:that when you got the background role, like that? What year was that when you got the background role?
Speaker 2:so that would have been 2021 and I'm I'm fairly certain I because I want to say I started. I can't exactly remember when I started classes, but I think it was at least a year or like eight months after I started classes and it was through um, the agency I was with at the time okay.
Speaker 1:So are you still do you still have that in the back of your head that you'd like to do some directing, or do you think acting is more or less what you want to focus on now?
Speaker 2:um, so, yeah, I that's still kind of end goal for me is one I I love acting. I've grown to love it since I started doing it. It's it pulled a different side of me out that I didn't really know was there. But it's incredible to do that, to play a character, and I do foresee myself directing eventually. I so far well, I actually just wrote and directed my first short film, called the Woodsman, and back in May we filmed it and it should be coming out here October 1st.
Speaker 2:That's kind of my goal is the first week of October, but that was my first taste of directing something that I wrote from scratch and I came up with the character, the idea, like four years ago, back in 2021. And it's been a long time of putting all the pieces together, but now that I'm learning stuff, it's like okay, once this gets pushed out, I've already learned so many things I can use for the next one. Slowly building. I'm slowly building my resume as an actor, but I'm also learning things on set and from my experiences to help me eventually do what I want to do make movies, tell stories, stuff like that okay, that that actually kind of makes me curious because, um, you know, I've directed some things in the past.
Speaker 1:Um, as of the past few years, it's mostly just been writing. But I have thought about, actually, you know what would would it make me a better director if I learned how to act, you know, and that is something that I've kind of considered, because, if it, maybe that would give me a new verbiage and a larger vocabulary to be able to speak with actors in terms of how to, you know, connect with them and work with them on their own performance. How do you think that has served you when it came to making your short I'm assuming you were in it. I'm assuming you were in it, of course.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was the lead, Because originally I wasn't going to do that, but then I was also like this is my baby. At this point in time, this is my baby. I put my heart and soul into this. And also, when I'm self-funding the whole thing and I'm not Mr Moneybags I was like this will save some money, but also I know I can do this. I know how I want this to go when it comes to making this film, but also I love acting, so I was like I'm going to do it.
Speaker 1:Did you end up like tweaking the dialogue the day of? You're like, what was I thinking? Uh, because your actor brain gets turned on like how would I actually say this?
Speaker 2:well, what was? What was actually really funny is there's a lot of dialogue that didn't even make it into the film during the action scenes. Because I first short film, I I underest or I overestimated, like underestimated how difficult it would be. I think I did that. No, underestimated, that's what I did, because when I was actually out there assistant directing and acting and setting up scenes and planning because I had to put a bunch of hats on to do something like um, um, oh, I'm sorry, I had to put a bunch of hats on to make this work.
Speaker 2:It was kind of skeleton crew so running a little rampant like a chicken with its head cut off and I it was just way more than I thought it was fun. It was very fun, but there's definitely some things I would do different next time. Maybe I would even spend the extra money to delegate positions to people, or even because I mean I like paying people if I can pay them, because I know it's a lot to commit time to a project, but we lost certain voice lines, which I don't think hurt it, because it still portrayed the scene pretty well, like what's going on.
Speaker 2:You know, you can still tell what's happening even without the voice lines or what the main character was feeling. And then I, surprisingly, was having trouble in the dialogue scenes because we had like a bunch of action scenes outside, then we had some indoor scenes. Surprisingly I was like what's my line? And I thought that was so funny because I'm like I literally wrote this thing and I'm like bombing my lines. So I definitely under prepared for that side of it and with everything else going on and preparing everything else, I definitely learned like, okay, so even if you do write the script and everything, it's best to still prepare like you're just an actor right and manage everything else do you think you were fumbling with the lines?
Speaker 1:because you were also focused, being the director on, like everything else?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean, I was. I I had, uh, one of my friends be the director, meshack Malley. He came in and he directed that for me, but I had an idea of how I wanted it to look. We spoke very closely about how I wanted it to look, but the combination you're exactly right the combination of me delivering my line, especially because one of the actresses was my daughter. I had her play my daughter in the film, but she's also my daughter in real life. And it was difficult, trying to make it work that way.
Speaker 1:She starts beefing her lines. You're like work kid. I hired you for this project and then suddenly they have like. Come on.
Speaker 2:Come on, no, she did a great job, considering she's only four and she's never done anything like that before. She did an amazing job. It's just it adds it's a. It's something I've never done before because I've never worked with a child actor before on any set. It adds a um different level of planning, preparation and how you have to set up something. So there, there was a lot of to focus on, but I feel like it does draw your attention away because you can't be in full actor mode. I show up, I know my lines, I do my lines. You're like okay, this is done. Is this next scene ready? Um, is this? How's this going to look when I edit this later? And there's just a lot of switching gears between the hats, like, am I a director now looking at this? Okay, let me put my actor hat back on. Go and do the scene again. I want to change something. Go back Back and forth.
Speaker 1:Gotcha to write for yourself that you think would reveal some skills or a different type of genre or character that would, um display your abilities um in a way that they haven't necessarily been before yeah, are you necessarily saying like to challenge myself and kind of showcase my strengths as an actor, kind of like that? Yeah, if you could write yourself the perfect role in order to display your abilities that you are confident in as an actor, what would that be?
Speaker 2:Man, that's a hard question. That sounds like something. That's what we do here.
Speaker 1:I'm not even good for. I don't even want good answers. I just want to watch you stumble for an hour, that's all.
Speaker 2:I get that. I know you're tripping me up, make me act a fool For me to write a role like that. I mean, I won't lie, it probably took me a lifetime to transition to different emotions, like whether I get really like I say angry and then it has to turn into sadness. Because I had a recent experience on a feature film that I had the opportunity to be a part of. It's called what's Wrong, wendy. It was written and created by Spooky Madison, directed by Dusty Austin and one incredible experience. Everyone on set. It was awesome. It was such a cool vibe and thriller, which not thriller, but horror, and I think it's actually I don't know when it's coming out out, but it's definitely something to look for.
Speaker 2:Anyway, when I was on set, there was a specific scene where my character had to without giving anything away, I had to like cry, but it had to be like a panic, crushing weight cry. And when I, when I read that, when I read the script, I was like, okay, how am I going to do this? Am I just going to, like you know, use the eye salve? Uh, what, what it's called like the peppermint stuff you rub under your eyes and cause? That's helpful, those are really helpful. But as we were like building up to that scene, I'm like you know what.
Speaker 2:I think I'm really gonna try to do this, like I'm gonna see what I can do, and I am a big music person. I use music for like emotion, so like something I'll do sometimes if I need to get into character on the drive there or if I have like a headphone and I'm not actively busy on set, I'll go over my lines and I'll have like an instrumental soundtrack or I'll have a song playing, something that'll like get me into that mindset. And that's kind of what I did. I got ready, I prepared and when it was time to shoot I was like let loose and it was my first time really tapping into that emotion as an actor and it was powerful because I cried. I wouldn't advise this, but it felt like a panic attack somewhat Because I induced a real cry and I'm like I hope that looked good. I was like you better look good for me to do that.
Speaker 1:But how many takes did you have to do of that?
Speaker 2:so there was like five takes probably. They uh captured, um, they captured everybody's close and the wide and stuff, and then mine was the last one. So like five, five times. The first couple times it was like right here, and then when it was finally to my take, that's when I could like let it out and like fully for that take, which all I can say is when you do tap into that kind of like whether it's an anger pool, like a, a well of anger, a well of sadness, a well of joy, and you actually feel that it's powerful and it's hard to, I guess it's more than you expect. You've got to really control it Because too much the next thing you know, something comes out that you didn't know was there and it's just trying to contain that and get back to baseline, where you want to be. That sounds like agony.
Speaker 2:That sounds like the worst thing in the world it's a little bit, I'm not gonna lie, I it was like it. I had to take like five minutes after the scene and just like come like back to earth. That's, that's the best way I can describe it and I don't think it was like a dangerous sort of way like not like a you know intense self-harm kind of way. Mentally it was more just like really coming in touch, getting in touch with my emotions and my feelings, which it was very interesting.
Speaker 1:I'm excited how did Spooky work with you when it came to approaching that scene to get that performance, because some directors it depends because, you know, not all scripts require a crying scene. However in the indie world, where we don't have CGI budgets, we're like all right, we got to do something. Hey you, I need you to cry we make this interesting um yeah, but uh, not a lot of people necessarily know how to.
Speaker 1:It's a very unique skill set to be able to work with an actor specifically when it comes to that type of performance. Yeah, it's not like, uh, you know, being a more visual director, who are? Some directors are actor directors and some directors are, like, cinematographer directors and they sometimes they're hybrids. But, you know, generally speaking, one tends to kind of sift into one of those categories, that type of scene. It requires a whole another set of vocabulary that they themselves also have to be in touch with their own emotions in order to be able to actually relate and communicate what they need from you.
Speaker 1:So what was it like working with spooky to be able to um approach the scene in that way?
Speaker 2:um, I would say it not just, not just spooky, but a lot of people, everybody on set, especially like Spooky and Dusty. They what's with these names?
Speaker 1:Spooky and Dusty. Yeah, One of the middle names Dry Sock.
Speaker 2:I don't know that's. I just know that I I was like when I first heard spooky I was like, oh, that's pretty cool that is a cool name yes, spooky, yeah, but I need to change they made it.
Speaker 2:They made it such a um, I would say such a comfortable environment, um, that's what really kind of helped drag that out, is they made sure one I was comfortable and that it was a safe environment to really let that out. And like, immediately after the scene, dusty came to comfort me and she instantly comforted me and just made me like you're okay, you know, like brought me back down to earth and I was like that's incredible to get that from somebody and to know and feel that like wavelength of emotion and know what to do, like OK, and I'd say that's what it is. It's just they're my friends and I love them. And being in a comfortable environment, like that comfortable, comfortable set where everybody's caring about each other, making sure everybody's okay, safe, that made me, that's what really, I guess, made me able to do that, able to pull that out, is that level of comfort.
Speaker 1:Does it take? Have you done any other? Actually, no, I know you've done at least some other types of emotional scenes because we were just on set together like one or two weeks ago, I forget, but that was actually the second time that I've been on set with you, and the previous time was also with the same director and more or less the same crew. So it was just a nice little family get-together, family reunion. But you also on Brian Jones' film the name escapes me of it. God, it's okay, I'm sure he'll forgive me, but there were some emotional moments that also not just you had to go through, but also your co-star, ashley Lawhorn, playing your wife. Yeah, it was wife.
Speaker 2:It wasn't just partner.
Speaker 1:It wasn't sleeping buddy, it was wife. What was it like to be able to have to be in that headspace along with someone else who was also in that headspace? Because there's a level of chemistry that you play off of one another in order to be able to deliver. Who was also in that headspace? Because there's a level of chemistry and um uh, that you play off of one another in order to be able to deliver that performance, cause you're not just by yourself. You know, having panic attack. Granted, I don't know the context of that previous scene, but it sounds like it was more or less centered on you.
Speaker 1:Um, what's that headspace like when there's somebody else in your headspace?
Speaker 2:because of the scene, because the scene requires it so I want to say, when somebody else is in your headspace and it's a similar um emotion or a similar like I don't want to say emotion, because there can be different, varying emotions, but like levels of intensity of that emotion it helps to have a good scene partner, like ashley was a great scene partner when it came to pulling out your a game like bringing that level of emotion to where you can just sink right into your character and, I guess, react off each other.
Speaker 2:Excuse me, because you're not, excused, put it back in but when you, um, when you have a scene partner that does that, it brings the best out of you. It'll bring a realistic, um, I guess, actor, like an act I can't, I can't, I can't get the word for it but it's like it brings a realistic and authentic feel. That's the word I'm looking for.
Speaker 2:It's authentic feel to the scene, that energy, and when you're both at that headspace, you're keeping each other in check, you're watching each other, you're keeping each other in check. In between takes and scenes you're communicating like making sure to do something or react off something. You know communicating like making sure to do something or react off something, but also you recognize, like, say, if the other person has to go to a higher plane than you, a higher level, you're able to give them that space but also still communicate with them in a way like, okay, let's do this for the next scene, but you're also giving them space to get into that headspace, to get into that emotion. And then, when they're giving that level, you're playing off of it and helping them stay there. So it's almost like a level of awareness on set. Although you're focusing on your character, your mannerisms, how you should sound, how you're feeling, you also have a situational awareness.
Speaker 2:It's like you're on both sides of the, both sides of the plane. You're, I have an awareness of what's going on around me in the real world with my um scene partner and what they're doing. But I'm also in character, I'm also paying attention. What do I need to do? What's next? What do I need to say, what do I need to give off, whether it's to my scene partner or to the camera there's, there's always a balancing act, I feel like, and once you kind of understand how you need to do that, it really helps you start to progress as an actor and get better at what you do how do you, how do you develop the stamina when it comes to approaching those scenes to keep the emotional engine idling?
Speaker 1:Because if you're setting up for another take, you know you might have a few minutes in between. You know where you don't necessarily have the momentum to go right into the scene. If we're doing takes back to back, you know. So when you're having large gaps between delivering those sorts of performances, how do you get back into that head space to get that momentum back?
Speaker 2:Hmm, well, first off, it's not easy. It's definitely a muscle that you have to train, which is just, I would say, over time, of doing projects, doing monologues, self tapes. It's a muscle Because, especially if the emotions in the middle of a scene, like you have to keep, I feel like that might be a little easier because you have to keep building up to it every time. So if you can kind of train yourself, say, when you are practicing for that scene, like okay, how am I building up, what do I need to feel, what's going to help me get to that level, you can just do that every time. And then, once you're on set, everybody's in wardrobe, uh, cameras rolling and everything's set up.
Speaker 2:It becomes a little easier almost because you're not just simulating, you're reaching back to your memories, your experiences, but it's real in front of you, you're everything. You perform a little better on set just because you're in that world for that moment. And and it's just the repetition, building that muscle, that helps you get that emotional idling to where you can hold it here. And then it's like, okay, final take, you can let it all out, you can, you know, let some of it out. And then it's like, okay, after you're done. Some people can just cool down like that. But that one scene I had to do specifically where I cried, and I've had experiences with other actors where as soon as they said cut.
Speaker 2:That was it. We're moving on they same thing. They had to step away for a couple minutes because they had to pull from somewhere powerful, some untapped well of emotion, and they just had to get back to baseline to date.
Speaker 1:What is the role that you're most proud of, and why?
Speaker 2:Hmm.
Speaker 1:It's okay If you say your own project I mean bias is fine as long as you're honest about it.
Speaker 2:Um, honestly, I probably want to jump back to what's wrong, wendy, just because that, that feat of pulling that emotion out is it was something I a couple years ago never thought I could really do, really do, just because it was like that's so difficult to do that, especially on the spot, like when you're out there.
Speaker 2:But being able to do that because I don't want to sound egotistical it's just like I surprised myself with that. I like, oh, wow, that was there, that felt, that was a strong emotion right there, and being able to pull that out it made me think, okay, if this is how I can do it here, how can I use this with other emotions on other projects? How can I get to that point? And it was just a major learning experience for me, I would say, just because I had a lot of instances, like I said, I was around a great crew, great cast, great people that really made you feel comfortable and pushed you everybody. Just when you're in a scene, they, they pull it out of you and it's like wow, I didn't know I could do that. And I learned so much, not just from being on set and experiencing it, but watching and observing everybody else and what they do is like oh okay, I've never really looked at it that way before.
Speaker 1:Well, when you're working with a director not even necessarily just on high stakes, emotional scenes where you got to really crank the engine or actually get something authentic out what are the best ways that you think an actor can give their voice, to communicate their own creativity and their ideas to a director that they feel is going to be helpful for the particular scene or at least approaching that scene in a particular way?
Speaker 2:So I think the first thing is you've got to know your director. You've got to know are they which I'll just straight up ask? Sometimes I'll just say, hey, I just want to like, if it's a new director I've never worked with before, I'll genuinely. I'll generally try to stay on what they want and what they think. I'll usually ask questions if I don't understand something or I want to see like hey, could you explain this a little more? Because most directors aren't going to have an issue with that. If you're genuinely asking like OK, this is how I interpreted it, can you like kind of explain a little more? Most of them won't care. But when it comes to like hey, what if I did this instead?
Speaker 2:Some directors will be like no, I want you to stay exactly how I wrote it. That's it which I understand. You write something, you have a vision, stick to it. I perfectly understand that. But other directors will be like no, I mean, let's try it and see what happens. Some will be more open to those ideas and want to see what happens. They might want to do both, but ultimately it's just, it depends on your director and I usually want to just say, hey, is it okay if I like suggest something that I see or feel, or do you want me to just kind of stick to what you have? And most of them, if you approach them with that question, they'll let you know like some things are okay or no, let's stick to what I have. I have an idea, or like we just need to get this done and others are yeah, let's see what you can bring.
Speaker 1:it's just it depends on the director and everybody has a different directing style have you ever had any um, maybe not necessarily negative but subpar experiences on set or crews that you've worked with, where you took away some lessons in terms of you know, because you're fairly new to acting. Retrospectively speaking, that became a learning experience for you, not just learning what scripts to say yes and no to, but also you know what kind of people do you want to spend your career working with. Because, generally speaking, you you know in the midwest people, people that don't aren't fun to work with or aren't nice to work with they get weeded out pretty quickly because, like you said, we are a tight-knit community?
Speaker 1:yeah, but even if it's not necessarily a person, was there a tough or negative experience that gave you a lesson to walk away from and be able to apply that on other sets?
Speaker 2:So I've never personally had a really bad experience on set. I mean, the worst thing I can think of is I was a background extra in a scene with like probably 100 people and the camera was moving by and the director was like snapping, like move in my face, which I was like, okay, I mean that wasn't terrible. That's probably the worst thing I can think of. Um, I'd say most of my stuff is just like most of the experience that I had where there has been like somebody I've never had any bad experiences with the person. I had one thing where, um, nobody got paid and which I feel like I understand.
Speaker 2:Not everybody's made of money, which I feel like I understand, not everybody's made of money, not everybody can afford to fund films and stuff. But you got to pay your people, especially if you promise, like you say, hey, this is the pay rate for this job. You got to pay people. You can't just expect them to do free work but you basically essentially lie. I don't want to say they lie Like maybe something came up or something, but that's like, for when I did my short film, that's the first thing I did was pay everybody. Just made sure, okay, everybody's paid within the first week and we're good, we're, we're settled, um and I guess, uh, another experience. No, that's about it.
Speaker 1:I guess I've been lucky to not have you're just floating on, you're just floating on on it on, you know yeah, but when somebody does have a bad experience, word does spread.
Speaker 2:Like you said, it's a close-knit community. Word does spread when somebody has a bad experience and then one time it's like, okay, you know, you know that's unfortunate, like, but we're, you know, we're sorry that happened, we'll keep an eye on this person, but that second time it's usually done. I mean, everybody has bad days. I feel like, but if you're consistently having people kind of see something or like oh, we're, you know, we're not having a good experience on set, and I don't mean like you have one bad day, I understand, but the way you treat people lying or things you do, making people uncomfortable that's when people are going to be like we don't want to work with you.
Speaker 1:Right, right, what's the most difficult skill you've had to be able to pick up as an actor?
Speaker 2:you've had to be able to pick up as an actor, um, I would say a hard skill, harder than a lot of people think, at least for me is falling into authentic like, um, micro expressions, like when you're talking, you're doing something and you're not like rehearsing or acting out micro expressions like my eyebrows and stuff.
Speaker 2:You just make it flow with your speech, you feel the words as you say them. I say that was kind of hard for me to learn and because it's like that one um, that one principle where, like you observe somebody, like if somebody knows they're being observed, they'll act different. Same with like if somebody's got a camera in your face and they're recording and you're like you don't you think about all the little things you do, instead of just doing them and making the micro expressions natural. That was definitely probably the hardest skill I had to pick up, I would say, and just like I said earlier, with that muscle for emotion and just experience, like self tapes, practicing monologues, being on set, feeling it out, that's, it's just, it's the muscle you got to build it how did you first learn to get comfortable in front of a camera?
Speaker 1:um, definitely, like just suffered, I'd say what you would eventually stop whining about it, and you?
Speaker 2:know, I would say the biggest thing was exposure therapy that's what I would call it. Where I took acting classes, they had a few moments where you would go up on stage and you would do a monologue and you would have a lot of people around you, have like a lot of people around you, have like eight people around you watching your monologue, and that was a lot of pressure and you almost just had to like stare out, pretending out there, but you'd still feel it and I think it's just another thing of repetition eventually like I'm on camera for a couple things, oh, it wasn't that bad. And then the years go on, I'm on more things and I start feeling it less and less and less. It just starts becoming more like I get in my zone. And a big, a big example would be uh, what we just filmed, what I just filmed last weekend, uh, end of another time. We had to go up on stage and play and I played a guitar. I've, I have zero musical background.
Speaker 1:I can't play guitar yeah, you've been learning guitar for that, haven't you?
Speaker 2:yeah, I actually have been sitting down and learning chords and stuff to learn, but that was my first time using an electric guitar because I have an acoustic, and I didn't realize it until after, like we had pretty much filmed everything. But I'm like, wow, I just sat up here on stage in front of a crowd of people and played a guitar to the best of my ability while acting, and I wasn't nervous at all and I was thinking like three years ago, four or five, a couple of years ago, I wouldn't have been able to do that without sweating bullets and shaking and being so nervous. And it's just the evolution of pushing yourself to just do it in front of the camera. Something else that helped me is really learning to just talk to people, like introduce myself to people, start conversations, get more charismatic, but I'm just learning to speak with people, learning to embrace the awkwardness of situations.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm on camera and I'm making myself cry or scream or do something weird. It's going to be awkward to the average person, even to people that are used to it. It's awkward. I mean, what? What kind of person goes on camera, just starts crying and acting crazy, you know.
Speaker 1:But probably somebody really self-absorbed. Yeah, like me, like me obviously yeah, but it's.
Speaker 2:It's just building that muscle, building that repetition, and getting to a point where it's like, okay, I don't care what people think about me Not in a bad way but if people want to judge me or make fun of me for doing this, I mean they're allowed to do that. And then just getting to a point where I'm in this world, this is what I'm doing. I'm this character, and you're not thinking about the camera. The camera doesn't exist, except it's something you're not supposed to look at, so you just ignore it.
Speaker 1:But it's like it's kind of like Medusa If you look at it, then you turn to stone.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly it's like that.
Speaker 1:or you just pretend it doesn't exist, but you know, like subconsciously, okay, I'm not supposed to look there yeah pretty much yeah, I mean I, I admire you know actors because, like it's, it's being able to like psychologically manipulate your own mind into more or less believing what you feel is is something that I don't know how y'all do it. I'm just gonna say I don't know how y'all do it and sometimes it seems like I like I don't know how I did it either. I just like I told, I told my subconscious like hey, you, you better start working because you know people are watching.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's just, it's impressive, it's definitely difficult it's, it's mentally taxing, like if I have a few for sure for a day my body might hurt from, like, say, standing or doing something over and over again, but more than likely my I'm just so mentally fatigued that I'm I'm usually ready to sleep as soon as I get back, because I just it's so mentally taxing making yourself one.
Speaker 2:You have to remember a lot of stuff if you have dialogue, especially if you're monologuing you have a lot to remember, a lot of cues to give yourself, whether it's, uh, something in the conversation with somebody or multiple people, even you have cues that you look for. You have what, what am I feeling? And then, especially, you have to make yourself feel an emotion. You have to build that up. By the end of the day, you just want to go to sleep like man I've, I'm dead unless, of course, you have a dp who's wired and uh wants to play card games all night.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's true, Then you're playing card games for a couple hours. That's always fun.
Speaker 1:There's definitely not somebody we know. What skill do you think that you need to work on the most in order to reach that next level of where you want to achieve? Nothing, I'm just the best obviously I bet, I bet man um, so I don't.
Speaker 2:I don't know if I can narrow down one thing. I want to say everything. I mean you can always be better, you can always improve on something like. I feel pretty good about some of my abilities as an actor, like memorization and other stuff, but I know I'm not the best. There's always a bigger fish. There's always going to be somebody who's better than me at something or in a you know, with an ability, and for me it's. It's always working on something.
Speaker 2:I take every opportunity on set or if I'm researching, to see like, okay, how do other people do this? Can I add any of these to my toolbox to make me a better an actor? So, everything like memorization. I really try to push myself to memorize lots of dialogue if I can Like. If I can, I will try to memorize an entire scene, like Giancarlo Esposito.
Speaker 2:He said in one of his interviews he was like you have to show up bulletproof with your script and he's basically saying like if you show up to an audition this is back when a lot of the auditions were in person he's like I would show up and I would know it inside and out and I would sit there. Everybody else is reading over their script and they see you just sitting there doing nothing, then they get intimidated. They're like, okay, this guy is pretty confident and then you walk in no script, no, nothing, which I can't even say. I do this because I'm still reading the script day of really feeling it out, because it's hard skill to build, like I said, that's why it's something I'm still working on and he goes in, lays it out, lays out the script, the monologue, whatever, says thank you and leaves.
Speaker 2:And that's incredible, especially when producers, directors, casting directors they see, they see that they're like that's impressive that you can do that and it's. It showcases your ability as an actor. And I thought that was really cool, a really cool saying. He said but that's just like an example of one of the things that I feel like I'm good at, but I I can say, yeah, I still need to work on it. I mean I still need to work on it. I mean I still need to work on everything. That's the only way you're going to become the best actor.
Speaker 1:You can be, Now that you've had some experience as an actor underneath your belt, and then you're working on that craft on the side, why do you still prefer to want to be a director? Curiously, what about directing? Has that element that acting can't give you?
Speaker 2:I would say it sounds a little bad. But control. I would say, like if you pull a script that you wrote, a vision you have for it I guess that's what it is is like your vision. Like compared to if I'm an actor, I'm playing a character, I'm telling a story, a part of a story as that actor, part of a story as that actor. But when you're directing and you have control, you know, kind of ultimate control over angles, pacing, um, kind of what the actors do or what you want them to perform or showcase, you have a lot more control over the story. So I guess it's more of like uh, how do I want to tell this story? Kind of thing. Like I can tell a story of a character or part of a story through a character. I feel like I love that about being an actor I can bring that character to life. Like, um, if I'm going to be a hero, I'm going to be a hero I'm going to showcase a heroic traits.
Speaker 2:if I'm going to be a villain, I'm going to make people know I'm a villain, I'm evil. That's what I want to showcase, and being on the directing side it kind of opens you up to. You have more options as a creative to tell the story, I guess.
Speaker 1:Well, what was it like directing yourself, though, because that is a difficult task to not just you don't have, I mean okay, well, granted, you did have a little bit of help, you know, having that assistant director there, which personally I would think is like a godsend, like if I was fumbling over my own lines, and then I'm like, and then I'm also thinking about the creative direction in the background and then all those sorts of things. But how do you pick on what to be focused on in the moment? How do you decide what needs the highest priority of your attention?
Speaker 2:I would say it's a pretty simple answer. It's the scene, whatever scene is going on, and whatever needs to happen to set up the next scene or to make this scene work. That's probably the most important thing. So you have to be ready to put on any hat you need to for whatever you're doing, like for, for example. We're like for, for example. We're like, okay, we need, um, we need props for this next scene, we need this and this, but we just got to shoot this one first.
Speaker 2:I'm like, okay, hey, can you somebody, if that's on set? I'm like can you grab these? Get this next scene ready? And then I speak with the director or the other actor, actress. I'm like, okay, we're gonna do this real quick, let's get this down. This is what needs to happen while they're preparing that, and you kind of have to just shut that off for a minute, like when you put the other the acting hat on. You shut off everything. Okay, this scene is the most important thing right now Getting this scene shot. Okay, scene is done, now let's jump to. Is the next scene ready?
Speaker 1:put that director hat back on. Is this next scene ready? How do you think directors could best communicate their vision to you when you're not necessarily understanding the motive of why the character is doing what the character is doing in a particular scene? I guess there's confusion in the script, you know, because, yeah, you could, sometimes multiple interpretations could technically be correct and then you're interpreting it one way, the director has something else in another. There's a synchronization issue when it comes to what the director is trying to get out of you and then how you're interpreting what he's saying. Oftentimes it's not even like there's an idea clash. Fundamentally, it's just literally the vocabulary necessary to be able to communicate properly. When, when you're experiencing something like that, you know how do you, how do you not necessarily dance on eggshells, but how do you approach the director to be able to be like hey, you know, um, there's something I'm not necessarily understanding about the scene. How can I best serve your vision?
Speaker 2:So what separates, I would say, interpretations from people is experiences. If I read a sentence or something in an action and then how somebody says something, that director or writer probably wrote it with an intention to be a certain way. But I'm a different person, I'm a different human being, I have different experiences, different memories, different feelings. I'm gonna interpret it a very different way, whether whether it's similar or like polar opposite, depending on my experiences. I mean mean, you know, I'm going to read it differently and the best thing you can do is just straight up ask you want to ask.
Speaker 2:You never be afraid to speak up on set, whether, especially if it's about being uncomfortable. If you're uncomfortable with something, you have to speak up. That's what I tell a lot of actors you always never be afraid to speak up. And then, when it's like a idea or understanding something, I'm always going to speak up and say, hey, so I was looking over this. This is what I was kind of getting from this.
Speaker 2:I just want to know am I right in what I'm thinking or or do you see it a different way and they'll be like, no, that's pretty good, or they'll say, no, I actually this is kind of the way I wanted it to be, and they'll either tell you know what, go into that or let's go back to my way, which it's better to do that earlier than later, because you don't want to practice a scene a million times a certain way, and then, when it's time to go, you do it. They're like no, I want to go for this. You're like, oh, on the spot I got to pull myself out of what I've been practicing and feeling and do something different so do you think an actor can be over prepared?
Speaker 2:then yeah, absolutely, and an actor can be over prepared. I, I don't. I don't want to say like, don't prepare, because you should. You know you should read your script.
Speaker 2:I, I read my script multiple times, like over and over and over and over again, because each time I'm gonna one, learn the dialogue, learn the flow, I'm gonna see something different every time. That adds to my character, that adds to what I need to do. But you also have your co-stars, your scene partners, where they come on set and bring in energy and you're like, oh, I didn't expect. Um, when I read it to myself, where I, like you know practice on the script, I, I didn't expect that person to act or do that, but they're bringing their own energy.
Speaker 2:So if I over prepare too much, I'm kind of caught off guard. But if I, if I know the lines, I know what I'm supposed to do and what we talked about earlier, that like bridge between I'm in this character but I'm also like aware, I have like this scene, or like awareness of the scene, what's happening in the scene, then I can adjust and be like, oh, and adjust a little bit, or do something a little different. That'll make it work how it needs to work for the scene. That's like improv. People are good at improv, have that ability to have that scene awareness where something happens off script or they mess up a line or something happens, and they're able to keep that flow of what their character's motivations are, what their character's feeling, but make it work to where it's not awkward I see what makes a script worth your time, though.
Speaker 2:Huh, what makes a script worth your time oh, I, I would have to say telling a good story, like. Is it going to tell a good story? Is it going to teach somebody something? Is it stating like? Is it like stating somebody like a question? Is the film asking a question? Is it answering a question? Is it presenting something and saying why? And leaving people with that, or their interpretation. I love something that Brings people to think. It makes them really sit back and go huh, well, you know, like it puzzles them. Or they're like I, I never thought about it that way before. Or they're like wow, that was stunning that you know what just happened.
Speaker 2:Like people don't, can't process what, they just watched something along that line, something that, because I feel like films, good films have a purpose. They're bringing something across, whether that may be be an idea, an opinion, something political. I mean, you're always telling a story, you're always presenting an idea or a theme in a story that people are going to be able to relate to, and that is one of the best things about movies I feel, and, honestly, about being human, is relating to people, feeling connected to something you know, feeling connected to other people having similar experiences and being able to say that has being an actor and having to run through a range of emotions and expressions.
Speaker 1:Has that affected any changes in your personality at all? Sometimes it could be like therapeutic, you know honestly, just to be able to use a character to vent I would.
Speaker 2:I would definitely say you learn you. You do learn things about yourself, whether it's like, if I'm trying to feel angry, what makes me really angry, if I'm trying to be sad, what makes me really sad. Or, like you know, like why am I feeling? Something Like, for instance, if I have a scene where I'm sad, why am I sad? Like, if I need to cry, why am I crying? Like a good friend of mine, anthony Dane, he told me every cry is different. You know, you have different cries. Like you have an angry cry, you have a happy cry, you have a sad cry, and there's many different sub layers of of that. Like, am I sad because of um loss? Am I sad because of, like, grief or frustration? Am I sad because of fear or feeling like worthless? Or am I sad because of panic? Like, am I so panicking so much? I just start crying because I'm like upset. There's so many different ways to cry. I just start crying because I'm like upset.
Speaker 2:There's so many different ways to cry and different ways to present an emotion. Like, am I angry because I'm frustrated? Am I angry because something's out of my control? And I mean, it's very easy to overcomplicate it, but when you really start to get into it. It helps you bring different emotions out and then you look back at yourself and you're like how can I bring that out of myself? What makes me feel frustrated, what makes me feel upset? And it's it's.
Speaker 2:It can be a can of worms because a lot, some people, they try to tap into that and they may not have, they may have some trauma or unresolved feelings about things and it'll really kind of like, affect them. It'll make them think differently about something. So it's important to really try to be in touch with your feelings and your emotions in a certain way or understand what my limits are. If there, if I say, if I've suffered an extreme loss, I might not want to touch that at all, if that's too much for me to handle, for me to bear, I might not want to touch that. That. That can be something I deal with another time.
Speaker 2:But maybe there's something else I can pull from to kind of do that emotion. You just you got to know yourself. You got to be in touch with your emotions and feelings because not only is it safer for your mental health, because in a business where you are judged by your looks and how you act and do stuff. Mental health is a very serious thing in this business. I definitely want to say that it's something that we really have to watch and keep track of and and always check in with our fellow actors, like, if everyone's okay, like how's everyone feeling? Because it's. It's very easy to go to a different space. It's very easy to go to a different mental space when you're playing the motions.
Speaker 1:When that kind of makes me think about something, and I don't even know if this is necessarily a remote possibility, but maybe you can tell me.
Speaker 1:Do you think that? Because, like you were saying, you know, sometimes you have to relive a particular memory in order to do, you know, reinduce that feeling that you had. Uh, from that memory that you're going to then apply to the scene, do you think that it will affect the way that you remember that? Actually? Because if you touch that spot enough, I would think that there would be some type of, you know, psychological change or perceptions, that of that memory, that evolve over time, and maybe even there was a point that that memory no longer is useful because you have touched it too much. It's kind of like, um, there's something sacred you know to about why we feel what we feel. Do you think that maybe acting could like therapy? You can, you can do so much crying that eventually you don't need to cry over something anymore and now you have to go reintroduce some new strategies into your life in order to actually have something sad to cry about and reflect on.
Speaker 2:I mean it's definitely therapeutic for some people. It's therapeutic for me to let, because it's like an outlet, it's a creative outlet and especially when there's emotion involved, it's there's a lot to it. I don't even know if I could break it down, because emotion, so many memories ride on emotion that you have, because you know the saying where it's like you might not remember what they did, but you remember how they made you feel. Memories really ride on emotion like that. So I mean I guess there is a point where you can tap into something and like say, if you do resolve that trauma, you might, it might not be as hard for you to go to, but that feeling is still there. You, you still know how you felt about it before and. But but maybe, like you do make a good point, because maybe sometimes you might think about something differently now and now it's like, okay, I don't really feel that way about it. But you can also say, oh, I remember how this used to make me feel you know, okay, it also makes me wonder.
Speaker 1:It's like I wonder if there's some actors which, now I think about it at least a couple of them have to exist deliberately. Don't heal certain things because it'll be good for their craft. And that idea is somewhat a little, is a little irking. Honestly, it's well not irking. It's tragic. Yeah, there's probably some people who, like I, would prefer to be mentally fucked. That way I can have good art well, that's sort of that's well, that's not just acting. That's a pitfall of a lot of artists, just in general.
Speaker 2:Yeah I mean, the first name that comes to mind is, uh, heath ledger. I mean, look at his performance in the Dark Knight and how deep he went into that and it ended up killing him. I mean, at the end of the day, I think your safety and, like, your mental health, is the most important thing. If you're doing something that's going to damage you, whether it's like physically to your body or mentally or emotionally, it's not worth it at the end of the day it is. I know a lot of people talk about method acting and how it's really cool and it's impressive, which I mean.
Speaker 2:It is impressive when people bring that to the table, but if it's damaging to you in any way, you're only hurting yourself, you're only hurting other people that might want to try to emulate that and in turn, they're going to hurt themselves because they don't. They don't understand the um, how heavy of a subject or how difficult it's going to be for them. It's it's. It's not worth it at the end of the day, especially when it can result in somebody losing their life or, say, going to like a manic depression or something, because you can. Really, the brain is a very powerful tool. It's a very awesome and complicated thing that exists, a brain that tells us to do things and how we can recognize ourselves and self, self-reflect, etc. But it's also like you got to be careful with it too.
Speaker 1:You only got one brain and you do not want to break it that is the danger, I think, though, is that artists they're, they're seduced by the idea that if they break it, then they'll make something worthwhile. I think artists actually this is a better way to say it I think artists are God. There's a seduction to misery as an artist, because it's such a potent tool for inspiration and and creativity, and we tend to reminisce a bit too much, because creativity comes from, in many ways, reflection about things, and a big reason. I think artists, I mean, you're going to suffer through life, no matter what. You know, life is suffering, but artists, it's like well, how much can I crank up the dial on this? You know, some people are seduced by power, but I think artists are seduced by misery.
Speaker 2:I can definitely see that. I mean misery, sadness. It's a very powerful emotion. It's very powerful and our emotions can be powerful, all of them. So there's definitely that inspiration because they that it had to make somebody feel a certain way for them to present that idea the way they did, whether it's in a painting or a film or a story like a book.
Speaker 1:Something made them feel that way to tell that story well, now I'm sad, so I going to go write something sad. All this sadness, dude, you're a bummer.
Speaker 2:I'm never having you on again. Bring the place down.
Speaker 1:What has acting taught you about life?
Speaker 2:I'd say the most important thing acting has taught me about life is empathy. Most important thing acting has taught me about life is empathy, as in there's so many different people out there. Like there's so many different people you'll meet when you go out in the field and work with other people on set, and it's definitely empathy when you sit and you listen to people. Like coming from a small town where I really didn't have a lot of friends, I didn't know a lot of people, I went to a small school and then being able to because I eventually moved schools to a bigger school my junior year and then going out and meeting all these different people from different walks of life with different experiences and different things, it's eye-opening and it really makes you have empathy and look at people and think you know, I've never really understood this before, but you tell me from your point of view and it's like I try to put myself in your shoes and I'm like, oh, I've never thought about that or that makes sense and it just it's a great learning tool. It's a great way to really build meaningful relationships and learn about people, learn how people think and learn how you can be a I guess, a more empathetic person. The more you learn, the more you can help people, the more you can build your knowledge of how you can, I guess, live better.
Speaker 2:I've I've made so many friends in this industry. I mean I know I've listed some of them earlier, like Dylan Spooky, brian Dusty I mean I could go on and on Anthony I listed so many already just in this call. But I've made so many good friends, like ashley too, uh, theo, those ones I I could go on and on. But that's probably the most beautiful thing about what we do in this field is you find so many like-minded people and people that are passionate about what you're passionate about and you build these lifelong friendships and these relationships with people. That just it's. It's a beautiful thing. I have so many friends that if I didn't get into this, I never would have met, and I'm grateful to call these people my friends I agree.
Speaker 1:I mean artists, the the bond bonds that artists have with other artists. There's just an unspoken understanding that they have that, unless you are an artist, nobody else is really going to understand. It's like, oh you know, because you're talking about a collection of things that, when put together, make something beautiful, and when artists talk to each other, you know about their particular craft. There's an unspoken, there's a language that only they understand, and I think also that's why a lot of people who drive themselves a little bit too much to the extent when it comes to pursuing their art, they, conversely, don't rely on the only people that they have to understand them in the first place, but, on the other hand, they also some people do, some people do they. Also, when some people do, some people do, and when, when we have those sorts of people, it makes everything worthwhile. I think, yeah, worthwhile. Well, micah, it's been great having you on. I appreciate you coming on um.
Speaker 2:Do you have any?
Speaker 1:final thoughts you want to leave with the audience uh, thank you for having me on.
Speaker 2:I really appreciate it. It's been great talking to you. I guess the only thing that I would leave is Drop some wisdom, man Come on, quote something, quote something. I'm joking.
Speaker 2:I would just say you got to chase your passions. You have to at least go out and try to do what you do like. I originally wasn't going to do this. I was going to go into cyber security and work a nine-to-five and do that, which no hate if that's what you want to do. I just that's what I was going to go do, and I don't think I really would have been happy doing that. And now I took a risk. I was like you know what, acting Columbus, and now, five years later, I'm doing what I love. So just, you got to chase your passions. That's all I got to say.
Speaker 1:Well, Micah, it's been great talking to you.
Speaker 2:Thanks, great talking to you as well.