The Wavemakers Podcast

The Maritime Polyglot and Her Shipping Tales: Maria Rita Skog

β€’ BetterSea β€’ Season 2 β€’ Episode 4

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πŸŽ™οΈ In this episode of The Wavemakers Podcast, we sit down with Maria Rita Skog, a dynamic leader whose maritime journey began in young age aboard merchant tankers. From growing up on a vessel and assisting at shipyards to educating young generations and maritime board seats, Maria's life has been a blend of curiosity, exploration, and expertise.

πŸŽ™οΈ Learn how her passion for maritime evolved into a career spanning continents, industries, and roles. From broadcasting seafarers' stories to working with global shipping giants like Inchcape and Wilhelmsen, and managing vessel registrations with LISCR, Maria has seen it all. Join us as we uncover Maria's inspiring story, threaded with unique industry insights and the tales of shipping!

🌊 Whether you're an industry veteran or just curious about the maritime world, this conversation is not to be missed!

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[Music] hello and welcome to another episode of The Wavemakers podcast where we focus on the stories of the people in the maritime industry at the intersection of decarbonization and digital transformation driving the change. My guest today, I would say, is the maritime world in one person. She has grown up on a merchant tanker and has lived a life wearing many hats within this industry. Also throughout she always focused on the stories of the people and I was very curious to hear her story, how it shaped her as well, and how she sees the world from here onward. So today:

Welcome Maria Rita Skog. Thank you. How would you describe yourself, in your own words?

I, Maria, I am a lady of many hats. I am thriving in speaking seven languages, after living in six continents around the world. I represent women of the maritime industry. I represent quite a wide range of us. That being those of us from a shipping background, or oil, or energy, or chemicals, likewise those in mining, or minerals, and metals, agriculture, legal and law, banking and finance , 
architecture and engineering... Simply because we've all either studied or worked, or dealt with each other, as well as educating each other. I am also an alumni, and in the educational world I I am an academic, where I am a result of international high education. Yet, I'm also a product of global School programming workwise and that aside, I do enjoy the great outdoors. There is an element to me that is an avid scuba and a free diver. For the love of the ocean! I'm a hiker and a snowboarder, track runner and functional fitness, and a little bit of football every now and then. Yeah and that is why I think now the audience also understands why I said it's a whole world in one. And what was your journey into shipping? I mentioned that you were kind of... You grew up into it, right? But you chose to stick to it. Can you share more about what inspired you to do so, and how it began? My maritime journey is a continuation of an already existing one. I grew up with captains crew operators and tradesmen. I have been on 19 voyages and several vessels. I have also been fortunate enough to to to be on placement as a teenager for work in shipyards, so the the discovery of how different the world is of ports infrastructure development and the great port cities out there sparked the curiosity. I met a lot of people, different personalities and characters, a wide set of languages, and it became a goal very early on that making the world a workplace was always going to be... that's what I'm, you know, thriving for. So I remember uh 14 years ago when um I was in my first job, not at sea, or shore side, or in yards, but it was something so different than what I was used to. It was about being the maritime history presenter on the national radio for the Australian Broadcasting Corporation and I remember at the time that I felt this is so symbolic because we are now airing a sequence of stories of the seafarers,
the Pacific Islands, the world's biggest ocean, the Pacific Basin, and it it all came together and for me at the time it was also like - yeah I've been at sea; yeah, I've been at the yards, and now we're we're bringing it all into somehow an office and to see so many people tune in around Asia Pacific, but also hearing it from a Maritime Professional or Maritime academic uh perspective... People had so much to share uh over something just by like a weekly segment. From there, my career kind of took off into Commodities and I could see the world of derivatives and and more into like the trade flows and everything. I then started developing uh um a crave to work with Technologies: ship tech, fleet technical management, ship management... What was that like? I knew it from the perspective of the vessel, I knew the hull and the engine rooms, 
I know the deck and the instruments, and I know the bridge, and the navigational support that goes on up there... So to to be in that digital transition when suddenly the world was going from charts to like ERP systems and and more hightech softwares. It was such a big journey in itself but you really got to see two types of people like the the tech oriented ones but also those who are more traditional and be like - whoa, whoa, whoa, we're not ready for to do that! We want to we want the charts we want to hold the charts and and who knows what's going to happen out there so I have since worked with a lot of um agency port management related roles I've also worked in flag state and worked uh close with the the IMO and its regulation and I'm I'm really glad that I have this extensive set of experiences but also having seen it from a different set of eyes throughout a lifetime. I I wouldn't be where I am today in front of you sitting here representing boards of maritime and academic directors if it wasn't from being from one journey to another, but always thinking there's so many ways! There's so many routes, you know, in this industry. It is very unique for someone to have that on the ground experience and to have that level of empathy of how the changes affect people on board and what the transformation means for them and that exchange with the the new technology that is put on and then again from the board level. Because often times uh there is a disconnect between what happens in the office and on the ground and it's so unique that you are able to be that tie and to also bring the voices uh through and raise certain questions or just the stories of that and I think that was one of the the probably successes previously um because people could recognize themselves it was coming from a genuine place the stories that you were highlighting and bringing their stories to life. And how... Do you have maybe a story of you as a girl on a vessel and something that you still remember that maybe was one of the reasons why that passion still sticks around? 100% I have a lot of stories! I'm going to keep it to one because it's all about impressions it's all about that first impression of something or like what you sensed and and and felt and saw now those of us because there are a group of us who did grow up at Sea. We do meet from time to time and uh try to find our feet sometimes in this oversaturated workforce as well as the maritime industry can be and and we try to like uh find out what can we say or not you you know like what are people people's perception of how life at sea was back then.And life at sea would be something along the lines of this: there would be more than a captain, there would be maybe two or three of them, and the accommodation sites were built very differently, and you had uh more than one let's say expat family on board, so we were more than just one kid. Very often, the crew and the captains would be sailing together so the wouldn't there wouldn't be much of a a change of people on board. If we behaved well, there would be rewards. Naturally, when you are younger, and you are at sea... This ambience: the vessel is in motion a big tanker or a chemical passer and product tanker or some of the container ships or even uh the dry bcus like they they all they are all different but at see they are very similar they are going at a certain speed and it's slow it feels slow and so you're always looking out the window going - oh I can't wait to see shore side but there's elements at sea you see the dolphins, you see whales from time to time, but you also have to be really careful! You don't go too close to the ship's rail you get closer just if you see something and it would be meanwhile at see that we who were kids we were allowed to roam freely on board now we didn't disturb the engine guys we didn't but sometimes we would get close and like to see what are they doing and sometimes uh on the deck the crew would be like - you want to help out? Do you want to come? So I think for for parents on board who were also working um and relatives aside they could just focus on being up on the bridge and they can also see us you know on the deck um then we would be in each of our cabin and the the cabins back then the captains and the chief engineers they used to have like what looked like almost like an apartment. 
They they had uh their office as you come in they had their their their bedrooms and on suite baths and then they had like a a living room and all so us on board the kids we would we would sit down in one of these and just uh you know we had toys so like we had our books a selfstudy so we would we knew when we heard certain sounds on board like the vessel being in motion or alarms we knew we have to be here like we cannot just go back and forth as much as we pleased um same thing with meal hours we we would go after the crew so we didn't disturb them in case they were doing shift and hand over work but there would also be like times crew would just come by and be like - What are you guys doing? Oh I've got a Donal magazine, what are you doing? So like there is a bond on board back then especially in the 1980s 90s up until early 2000s um once saying that we behaved well in so not disturbing crew it would mean that when we came to shore side it would be like - oh what are we getting? Are we getting are they stocking up the snacks? Is the chef going to get more ice cream? 
Is he getting or she getting are they getting chicken wings for us? Cuz the chefs on board they would also be like - stay out of the pantry! If you want something, ask. So we knew we had to be... not on our to like our toes tipping on our toes, we had to we had to respect every element on board. So coming to to short side meant - okay, we have behaved now. They start operating cargo we just need to wait till they done and then maybe we can go shopping ,
or maybe we can go to Kahu, or maybe we will get a you know a Barbie house, or like some new toy. Cuz you you would be sailing um roughly four five six seven months at a time so life on board would be in a different pace than to the real world. My absolute favorite part of arrival was when we got told we were going to Guinea  - we're going to Guinea next Friday! Okay. West Africa, great! Uh we're going to Conakry! And it was like a place we had never heard of, so it was like - okay, okay, let's go! And we get there um after starting the sail in um south of France in Marseille, and then going through the Mediterranean Sea, passing through Gibraltar was nothing new, here we go onto the African coast... And then we saw: Port of Conakry and it was such a contrast! It was like - wow look at this port! Where is the port? There's no there's no there's no fence! What are they doing down there? Selling bananas?! What, they want to come on board? And we were like -  
that's it? And we got told - that's it, the terminal is over there. And and that was also like for we knew about like safety measurements we we knew about how the gang ways and everything worked and working hours so not to be able to uh to be utilizing that in the same way was also like: Oh, we got to be careful here. We got to be really careful. And we learned... We learned safety of life at sea, so that's we learned about like stowages, we we also learned how to be compassionate as humans on board I mean I'm only telling you a sunshine story or two, you know, uh but there's other things out there that happens as well, that probably a lot of people don't talk about. And and I think um the pandemic it really made it through the weather, as we say. It was then I think a lot of us Maritime professionals that's when we saw like -  okay, now everybody has their ship together more or less. Yeah Because we have seen a big development of life of crew and life at sea after the pandemic. There was much more focus on that quality on life and improving it um and do you see that now change kind of unlocking from 2020 onwards, or was it with time? Also there was was different culture on board I'm not sure if they still allow kids to be there. Now is a different world. mhm We who have these uh memories and experiences we represent several age groups. You know, I might be in my 30s but there are other people out there in their 40s 50s and their 60s they can also relate. Why is that? And I think that is because I'm not alone saying that we look at the the ancestors we know that the maritime industry has been around with so many changes um since the Gold Rush that's when the mining industry starting getting a new change in in its then technology and before we know it we see one mining boom after another mining boom it went from gold, coal, iron ore, now in this uh year and age we are looking at boxite, uh we're looking at like lithium, we're looking at uh phosphates... That is one thing that has changed but we also saw the side effects we saw early on um pre-2020 levels that the coal uh terminals in China for example they had to change going into tier one tier two and tier three and I think the biggest change could be decarbonization and how the maritime regulations are falling into place. We are not alone when we say that it seems like one Maritime regulation doesn't have time to kick into place or people being trained before another one kicks in. Now I have only mentioned mining or coal, but it's the same thing with like the great oil adventure the 1970s and 80s oil gas and energy. it was already planned one or two decades ago how we were supposed to capture the carbon. Mhm. So we do see a very split audience in the changes there are those who are happy for changes because they're they're very Innovative or it's just that's something they recognize from the past, but we also have seen a lot of people who who may not who may not understand what is going on. So I try to tell people - look at it this way, there are two audiences. If it's uh decarbonization or changes in like digital transitions or like fuel and alternative fuels, we are two more or less audiences. We have the pragmatic a audience they have been there for a while and they're really into the whole uh changes of like technology the different IMOs, we see the regulatory frameworks changing, and they just excited for the leeway! Like - yeah let's let's let's do the scrubbers! Let's do it and let's uh let's do it like we did back in 2007 or between 1992 and 2013 let's lower the diesel! We went uh from a high level down to 50 ppm let's look at 10 ppm... How ultra low can we go on the sulfuric fuel oils types?! And and it just kept continuing, so this is fueling people more and more uh into the pathways. We have so many different paths of like climate change to tackle, but there's like many ways to to energize or like, to find a way ahead. Now, with the pragmatic audience is also those who are convinced like that decarbonization that is not just uh technical it's technical it's ethical and it is political.And they all kind of seem to shake hands and they're just standing there and like really glorifying all the technology that's out there and that's great it just means that it may or may not fit into all over the world.We don't know if this is affordable by all countries, or if the infrastructural developments are in place. We we went from like the fuel discussions and like dual fuel and LNG powered is there enough LNG? Is there enough in storage for this ammonia what's going on? And then we saw rotor sales and we started seeing like wind uh coming into the picture. We start seeing a new technology in propulsion and like the engine work and the thrusters and how they're they're being powered. So here, I think the pragmatic audience, they're just happy! That's what I said, I said back then! See the technology is there and then capturing the carbon dioxide there are so many ways to do this too now as well. Filter! Let's use this filter or let's try stone filter or like - what if we just go back to wearing a mask like back in the pandemic? We could take take that filter, too! And we can take every carbon and put it back into the ground where the oil wells, and everything is empty and keep it there. Then comes the Vendetta! The opponents the vendettas are just sitting there and going: yeah, yeah, yeah, decarbonization that's old news we have seen this before, we have., and all the Alternatives and all the futuristic um fuel types we could do or technology. iIt's there - what are you guys waiting for? The vendettas are also very defensive because they're going -  oh yeah here they go again attacking the maritime industry...Uh so there's like there is a very fascinating um dynamic between the two, uh when you start seeing these people come all together. My perception of it all  
is that it really differs where in the world we are, and to what extent. I'm a firm believer that we all need to do our very best to guide each other and help each other on finding the pathway for now, because it it keeps changing. We've seen that with the electrical vehicle industry and I'm sure that as exciting it is with battery driven, is there enough, you know?! Yeah.. How long how far will we take it? In 200 years of maritime history, the way I've studied it, the generational Gap is so big! Between technology, between world population and it's like the gap that was already there... It's bigger than now, than ever before. The technology is starting to run away from us. Just the other day I was checking the population and we are at 8 and a half billion and I thought to myself - it feels like yesterday that I was learning about six how did we get there so fast and that is happening also with the technology and you refer to wind assisted propulsion, I also feel that... There was the technology, and then maybe the business case wasn't as good, and then suddenly we see these pilots popping up, and everyone feels like - whoa, it actually happened! I think that it would be very interesting to to see how many of these popups uh materialize in the upcoming years uh and that is dictating now this fast pace of technology and the need for people to get upskilled very quickly in so many different areas, because then they need to work with so many different Technologies. I also know that you work with students who are I guess very Pro-technology. How does it feel to work with them and get their ideas? What are they thinking about? How will they shape this world? The students, they range from those who are our peers like doing far education, then we have the very senior ones, then we we have the undergrads, and then we have a few high schoolers, and when we ask them about like, you know - what do you what do you think is the most important skills to have? Or like - 
what are you learning? Is anything coming across as a surprise? And uh and we get some really varied answers uh it all comes down to how they view contingency planning. And this is a very exciting topic, because we see that those who are more senior, they know contingency planning. They know it. They have seen this before, and this is how they plan, and this is how they do it, so they just go straight to it. And some of them... they are working here in the UAE as managing directors and having to deal with company mergence and acquisitions.. and it's like uh when you see their grasp on the industry, it's very like: when this happens, we do that. Meanwhile, the other students they're more like uh inocent but cute it's like - yeah if if we run out of ammonia, if we do this, it's like very they're very on the back foot, but they're learning. So that's really interesting to see how they how they view it. And then we have those in the middle who are doing their internships and like doing their trainingships here in Dubai, um and I'm sure they have a lot to to manage. They have work, studies, uh social life, healthy life, but then we see them um in their first work experience especially those who are doing bunker management and they're going... In order to provide, we must so it's like we're trying to to work on their contingency planning and how they view the maritime industry as best as we can and I think there's no secret. That we are more or less in a center point of the world where this region here in the Middle East are taking um a really strong stance on fighting climate change like last year and this year ended and started with COP28. The 28th, we are perhaps in a part of the world where there's a lot of attitude, investment, it's very visible, and UAE and Dubai are lucky in the sense that this is a very fragmented uh society so this there's more than just the maritime industry here, um but to see how uh Middle East uh especially with Saudi as well how they're going to Triple uh their take on like decarbonization and towards the goal of net zero, That's really fascinating! And it's great to see that this is spurring off into to the other Arabic countries and the the six countries that makes up the the GCC the Gulf country Council and not to mention the African continent.So I think a lot of the students here they they are coming here or they already here or they're sitting they're sting sitting in one of these countries or they're sitting in Europe and their eyes are like more and more um on Middle East. I think one of the main reasons why that is is because they were paying attention to the changes or decarbonization back in Asia Pacific be long before the pandemic. They were looking at like how China and India and Australia was decarbonizing themselves. I do also have uh students saying something I find really interesting and that's when they ask and say - how long will it take before we are decarbonizing so much of the decarbonization that it's decarbonizing itself before we even get to the next decarbonization? And we you know we don't know what to how to answer or or provide feedback on it. We just say - that's a really good point, do you think it's possible to just to just just keep going into another enforcement or regulation or or do you think? We ask the students uh -  it's only here you're seeing it? And they know, they know like that this is the region, that has a lot of solar powered energy, and probably some of the most lowest cost as well in the world, but they always need that kind reminder like - yeah we're seeing it all happening here, it's all in action, you know. But we also have to think about what's the next steps for the future mhm What do they think about future technologies? How do they see this world beyond 2030? What do they think is the winning combination of fuels & technologies, and how do some of these latest advancements uh shape their suggestions? They are convinced 2030 is here. mhm It's not in the next five years it's happening. And um and they also and myself too like - we we sit in the the board sometimes and we go what is the real difference between 203 and 2050 because some of the students are really challenging us right now, because they might find a lot of Technologies out there self-evident. If it's if it's not that it's the use of artificial intelligence chat GPT and a lot of the times we have to like clamp down and be like yes there's more to it you know so so their take on it is that it's either self-evident that a lot of technology is out there, um if it's not they try to discuss like what will be the big difference between 2030 and 2050. Because we all agree that 2030 is already here we are trying in the industry to get through all those goals but the the road ahead between 2030 and 50 is is actually very short because of the technologies. I think it works in favor for a lot of the students and there are a lot of them who are convinced saying um - I had work experience with this company, they do autonomous vessels, they're saying it's impossible for the vessels to collide. And then we have to ask them - are you convinced? Yeah Can they not collide? -No, there's sensors, there's like satellite network, it's not possible. - But have you been on board a vessel before?Do you know what can happen if there's no communication with the vessel? 
So like, there are some of them who who who might take a different take on perhaps our uh mindset on it but then there's also those who go like - 
we're so glad we're working in an environment with like remote office centers and like virtual reality, the chief engineers, I'm so glad they're in the office... And and there's those of us going - 
you know, these engineers, they should probably be doing both, and I'm sure they do because they know the vessels well, um but it is strange to see that generation there who just takes it almost for granted, that because of all the technology the guys don't need to be at sea anymore. They can be in the office and and that can be challenging into the industry already by now because there are a lot of uh owners and principles out there and they keep saying -  Reduce the Manning! We have the technology, reduce the manning. And sometimes, we feel like saying - we can reduce the manning to a certain extent, the technology is there, but it's still being tested out! It's still being tested out! Like, we don't know if this is going to work or not. How does that older generation feel when they are being pushed to such an extreme view of the world? Okay wow ,that's a good question. There are something called memory groups, um there's one big one for example on social media. It's closed uh, but let's saysailors coming from the 1960s 70s 80s 90s early 2000s this is a very big group of sailors, and it's a really big group of maritime professionals, and we do see them reconnect and like reach out to each other but we also see them sometimes going -  is it just me?
Because I'm I'm 72 now technically I could be a dinosaur, but I have we have a colleague who is so young and it's starting to drive my mind mad! But at the same time this person doesn't know better. How do I manage, how do I tackle? So it's fantastic to see how some of these people are trying to to help each other and they be like - yeah my my my nephew or my granddaughter or my grandson, yeah we they, let them try this try to to navigate through so and so.. We also have seen that the maritime industry has has started to become a little segmented on the age groups. Mhm. And I know I'm not alone when I say this, but like, there are companies out there who will only have a certain demographic, 18 to 28. Great, do it that way, whatever floats your boat. If that works for you, do it. But then, there are the other companies and they will rather have, you know, the representation from 16 to 76 and that's a very very healthy demographic in a company, because everybody has different sets of knowledge or knowledge banks and skills, but 
we also see that when the youngsters are asking the seniors something we see how quick they get the answer and I think they get a bit caught by surprise going - oh how do you know all this? Because I ask you something and the solution is just there, there, there, and it's more than one. Because they're used to seeing perhaps people in between age groups, who needs time to assess the situation, do a risk assessment, and analyze that, and then come up with maybe this or maybe that... So there are those moments where they really learn from each other but we also at the end of the day we do see them more supporting each other, than damaging each other, which is a fantastic thing to see. How did you change? How do you present yourself in that environment of navigating all these different opinions, stakeholders and being that sponge to to make the environment comfortable for everyone? How did that early experience also change you? Look we've all been there.We have, and I'm sure when we were doing our placements in the shipyards when vessels being constructed I'm sure even those of us who were in our late teenagers, we were probably not that perfect either, you know, and I'm sure there were tradesman engineers and other maritime professionals just going - what are they doing here?! And we would be eager to learn and we would let them uh guide us and help us we wouldn't step onto their um daily tasks so we've all been in those steep learning curves. We have. What has changed for me, personally, is the skill of staying agile. You have got to stay agile in in this industry! We never know. We never know what the markets will throw at us, we don't know what the next trends will be, and a lot of people still have a lot yet to learn about staying agile. I tend to tell a lot of uh um people that you know: if there's a change in the company, that being restructures restructures or like redundancies, that's a great thing! Take it to your advantage! it's time to be tactical and elevate and and and go for for something bigger and greater, or it's time to obscure a lot of people. When it comes to education, they they think that - okay I graduated that's it. Now, those of us who hold high education, we know that this is fresh wear. This needs to be worked on, further studied and continued, and that's the most powerful thing you can do. It is to stay agile and it is to combine it with that. Another thing I that changed for me was triple E um, and this is because I like to to view the audience in the maritime industry because we still have them: the ethics, the educate, the etiquette, and the younger generation they have some of it, but there's still a majority out there that have this courtesy levels. So in some of the companies I have represented I have always asked: how are we with triple E? Because this is something everybody needs to to pick up, and I have always seen that sentence, that we need to build people not break them. I think this is one of the most important aspects we can bring with us in leadership and that's something that I picked up early on, but I also realized we need to sit around several seats of a maritime or shipping table to pick up all of these skills. We have to we have to change up. Changes good! You know, and that removed my old mindset where I'm like - yeah I'm going to be in this company for the next 20 years.

The world doesn't work like that anymore. I think uh working in in projects or project-based or or shifting around, a little bit, because we're not mountains! We're not a tree. We can move, we can so so that's one of those things that changed in me really early on that I'm like - yeah I've got to stay agile. I've got to say yes and I've got to take those opportunities. I mean - why not?! You know With that, uh how would you identify yourself as a vessel? I love this question! Oh wow! Okay uh In my next life when I become a ship... I have a few I want to be if I could be a vessel. Okay! And I will start off with saying one of the Frontline vessels FRONT BEAULY. She's a big tanker! She turns one years this uh this year and I have worked with a lot of the guys within the Frontline group of companies and and there's so many memories, there's so many projects we've done together, and when I met John last year, it was it became like the next motivator or the next inspiration to it all! Like, yes this is why I'm in the industry it's because of the people like him you know. He did The Impossible so oil tankers aside, uh if I was to be a chemical or product tanker it would have to be one of the Hong Kong or Singaporean or the Bergen uh ship owners vessels because the amount of trust these guys have put to me throughout my career and what we have managed to conquer of challenges is another level and I think here: ASKVIKEN is also really beautiful vessel um this one has the latest technology is dual fueled and LNG powered, and I remember uh when this vessel was um uh coming into the sea trial and the maiden voyage... The sun was shining uh over the Chinese province, which is it was it was just a spectacular beautiful day! Um so that's the tankers segment. Then we have the container and the box ships okay if I was going to be a container vessel... Ohhh, there is MSC Irina 

and MSC Loreto, the sister ships from last year. I mean they're 399.99 in length in meters but there's a historical element where you start seeing that the accommodation site is suddenly no longer at the at the back end of the vessel. It has some somehow it's been Incorporated more and more into the middle and that's something in in naval architecture and construction we haven't seen much of that since 1958 so like that's incredible that this is kind of like coming back again so these vessels I would be... We could be one each, you know, be sister ships twinning! I like that! Lastly but not at least dry bulkers...Ohh here we go! Oh Newcastle Maxes and the Capesizes definitely I would want to be one of the Himalaya shipping and 2020 bulker vessels um I remember this project and I was lucky to be working with the first uh transactions of the eight new buildings and then the next 12, and all the people who have been working on this project, um throughout the pandemic between 2020 and 2024, um we have all worked together before more or less in other companies so it felt like a high school reunion coming together! And again these vessels latest Technologies they have dual fuel, LNG powered, but the names... are some of my favorite mountains and cities out there! With that, what would be your next Port? My next where are you going? Now you're in a spot Market. I'm in the spot Market! I think having been in all of the continents and then coming here I'm glad I came here to the Middle East um I've been living in the UAE for the last two a bit of two years I'm glad I'm here for now and there is no next for me because the only two continents I haven't lived is the Arctic and Antarctica, but hey I'm International Norwegian, I've spent more half a lifetime in Australia so I technically have been there so for me, there is no next. There's going back to, maybe, but we shall see, you know, what the future holds. I know that for now there's nowhere else I would rather be than here in the Middle East. You also mentioned for one of the vessels that, what you love about them is the trust, so with that that, I would also like to wind down and thank you for your trust on embarking onto this journey with me and as we sail back into the port. If you have any questions for me I'm happy to take them. What drives you into the representation of entrepreneurial shipping rather than the typical traditional corporate shipping? I love to drive action! I'm one of these people who get excited by new things and new technologies and that new world and also I have been in sustainability my whole life so I'm waiting for that sustainable world and I think that level of impatience in me uh makes me tilt more on the entrepreneurship side because we tend to move faster we are able to pull in different resources and people and uh I love that, as opposed to one corporate and taking it slower. I do think that there has to be a place for both, but personally I just love to see things in my heads and to steer the wheel so hopefully I will get more opportunity to to develop that and grow that and to see the world settle into that vision that I have, and I have had since I was a kid. So that is why. What inspired you to go into the maritime industry in the first place? This is an interesting question, because I was an entrepreneur before - again, sustainability. My friend... I told this story before, but my friend founded a martime startup, and he asked me to join him as one of the first team members and I said -  
yes, but I really don't think I would be the best team member you can have because I'm so passionate about sustainability and decarbonization. I know I would be a good team member, but I don't know if you would get my spark in it, and I want you to get my spark in it, and then when Maersk put together their decarbonization team, and put down their strategy they were, um bringing together people to make it happen, and I was offered to join the team at a very early stage and that was that shift for me. So I was not a product of Maritime industry, I was transferred from the sustainability, and then once I landed there and talked to so many people, heard their stories, it really opened up a whole new world um for me. I found it fascinating and interesting, and I also felt that before I thought that shipping was quite traditional, and to some extent very constant, not so dynamic -  everything opposite of what it actually is! So that opened that new portal for me, and that's also one of the reasons for these series. I want to also show to others uh how colorful, dynamic and different it is, and for those who are not sure whether this industry is for them, I also want them to know that there is a place for you here, no matter what your background is and or if you didn't know much more than what a containership is, so that's why. Thank you and I'm looking forward to many more of this because I could listen to your stories I think for another 10 hours. I didn't want to interrupt you, because it you're so passionate about it and just I could almost see the pictures from your past as you were um talking about them and I'm sure that people will find it very unique to to hear that. So thank you so much for bringing the the passion, the stories, and making it so alive Thank you for for your kind words and thank you for having me. That's a wrap? That's a wrap!

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Gordana Ilic

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