Hidden Pests, Big Problems

This time on PEST PROSpectives, ACE Tony Sorrentino is joined by Daine Patton of Nebraska-based Bats to Rats Wildlife Control and Prevention. Tony and Daine trade real stories that prove pests and wildlife can live in attics, crawl spaces, and wall voids for years with almost no obvious signs. 

Listen to Daine and Tony share the small exterior weak points that let animals in, plus a simple inspection mindset that can prevent costly surprises. 

Episode Resources
Pest Pros of Michigan
Bats to Rats Wildlife Control and Prevention

PEST PROSpectives is a Livemic Communications production.

Transcript

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Welcome And Why Signs Matter

Richard Piet 0:08

I'm Richard Piet. This is Pest Prospectives, the official podcast from Pest Pros of Michigan. We talk about bugs and wildlife and lots of things, perhaps, that maybe weren't obvious at first, that they could be a signal to maybe a wildlife problem or a pest problem in general. Tony Sorentino's back from Pest Pros of Michigan, and we have a special guest today, Daine Patton, from Bats to Rats Wildlife Control. That about covers it, doesn't it, Daine? That's right. So our intent today is to give folks a couple of ideas about things you might see around your property, your business, that could signal bigger problems.

The Bat Colony Nobody Detected

Richard Piet 0:57

If we were to just name a few things that you've seen that didn't look like much, but sure turned into something bigger, what would they be?

Tony Sorrentino 1:09

We've been in in attic spaces where the people literally had nothing, there was nothing visible from the outside from the ground level. There was an access point uh along the the ridge vent on the spine of the roof. And um there was a maternal colony of bats there. There was over 400 bats that were living and roosting in the attic space. What caused them to call us to come out was a bat-human interaction where uh a juvenile bat had gotten into the living space because it wasn't sure how to get in and out. The whole exclusion ridge vent or ridge guard and um sanitation bioremediation of the attic space was $13,000.

Richard Piet 1:55

So they can really exist in that vast number, and no one hears a sound, no one ever heard any kind or saw any kind of signal.

Tony Sorrentino 2:07

Most people don't go up in their attic spaces. I know I've we've lived at our house for five or six years now. I've never been in my own attic.

Richard Piet 2:16

I guess you think that you're gonna hear some noise or something's gonna happen that's gonna tip you off. Does this sound unusual to you, Daine? Have you seen this before? Uh a bat colony and no idea it's there.

Daine Patton 2:29

Oh yeah. We s we see this stuff every single day in in the in the field that that we do, you know.

Years Of Rodents Without Knowing

Daine Patton 2:34

Actually, just two weeks ago, I remember getting a call, um, and it was somebody that's lived in their house since 1993. Never been in their attic space since they've lived there. You know, when they when they moved in ther 30 some years ago, um they were a bit younger, but now they're an older couple and they're like, hey, um, we just want want somebody to take a look. They they've had so much mouse activity. All of the insulation was completely matted down. There was tunnels, runways throughout all the insulation. Um, I went down into the basement. There's three separate crawl spaces plus a full basement, and it was just littered with rodent activity. And and they're just in areas that these people weren't going in or never had the need to go in any any any longer. And and there's been probably 20 years of rodent activity that that they just didn't didn't realize. Every once in a while they would catch a mouse in the fall, and most customers that we have, they think that's normal. Little did they know they had years and years worth of rodent activity, and we we need to bring the insulation team out, the exclusion team out, we're gonna have to bait and trap and reduce population numbers. So it's gonna be a huge project, and and it was just because they didn't ever go and take a look at these things.

Richard Piet 3:44

You know, I latched on to something you said there. They saw a mouse occasionally and dealt with it and thought that was normal.

Daine Patton 3:52

Is that typical thinking? I hear it all the time. You know, people they'll they'll say, Oh yeah, we you know, every fall, you know, because we live in Nebraska, so we have a we know we're an agricultural state, and and every every time that uh corn's um harvested in the fall, there's always an influx of of rodent activity. And people think, well, it's just normal. Come come when it cools down and the harvest and that, uh I catch a couple mice and and then we let it go. But what we try to do is educate our customers and let them know that the reason that they're finding them is because there's some sort of weak point on the outside of the structure, a hole, gap, crevice that they're able to sneak themselves in, or they've just shoot a hole somewhere, and and that's how they're coming in. And and we provide them solutions to take care of those issues.

Richard Piet 4:36

Tony, you probably heard that too. Uh I catch a mouse occasionally, no big deal.

Tony Sorrentino 4:41

Michigan, we get seven months of summertime and uh in the springtime, and then the when the weather really starts to turn bad, people will start calling in. Well, we we usually see a couple in the fall. The the mice are harboring inside of your home, and like Daine said, gaps, cracks, crevices, plumbing penetrations, corner posts where the the mice can climb all the way up to the soffits and then they have access to the roof. So having having these these open entry points, plus Daine, Daine spoke about sebum a few minutes ago. Um sebum is the the combination of body oils and microdroplets of urine and pheromones that they they track on every entry point, and it's like a flashing neon light to these rodents when they they come to repopulate the area, which inevitably is going to happen.

Richard Piet 5:28

Yeah, I hope not. But right, you've made a point here. You've made a point here that uh this can happen under the radar for 30 years or something, this could happen. That is unbelievable. Do other ideas, other uh things you've seen come to mind that fall into this category? People live for years without knowing it.

Overlooked Entry Points Like AC Lines

Daine Patton 5:52

Yeah, you know, and the same thing I was just thinking about that we see quite a bit is air conditioner lines. When those lines are coming into the house, so often is that something simple that that you know, our listeners, our homeowners, could take care of themselves or that they could at least look look out for. And we see it too often we're walking around, and that AC line has the plumber's putty around it, and whether it's it's been chewed off or it just dries up, cracks, falls off, stuff like that happens, and it's just a super highway for mice to f or rats to find their way into people's homes. So that that's something that's small that gets overlooked way too often.

Richard Piet 6:29

And we probably underestimate how flat they can make themselves and get into small places. So uh what's the Tony, the most impressive, other than maybe bads, uh the most impressive thing you've seen, and maybe the most unbelievable thing that was a small entry point that turned into something big.

Raccoons, Squirrels, And Surprise Wildlife

Tony Sorrentino 6:53

There was a uh grapefruit sized, so you know, about four, four, four and a half, five inches hole in a gable vent. Ian pulled 15 raccoons out of this attic, and they were they were living there. The house was vacant, so that yeah, there's no way you'd miss 15 raccoons. This is no easy task, I presume, because they can be aggressive. Yeah, and it was multiple trap sets over about a week of time to get everything out of there. There was there was mothers and and juveniles, and they were all cohabitating. It was like a I don't even know what the word. Daine, do you know what it's called for a group of raccoons? Isn't it like a bandit or something?

Daine Patton 7:32

Yeah, something like that. But yeah. It's it's funny that you brought that up. Fifteen's fifteen's more than than I had, but a couple years ago, dirt between Christmas and New Year's, I caught 10 raccoons out of somebody's attic space, and it it it it took me like two hours to find the hole on the house. There were so many raccoons up there, but it was a you know concrete tile roof, and the the one hole that that they found, they were getting underneath a tile, and you'd never know looking at it, but then you know, we had to do our inspection and and it it just took forever. Looked all over the places you normally think, and then yeah, here's a loose tile, and they're just going right underneath. Ten raccoons. It was like two every other day for a week.

Richard Piet 8:12

Was that another of these under the radar things where you might not see it, but you also weren't hearing it?

Daine Patton 8:18

Yeah, a hundred percent. The they were living in these people's attic spaces, and they they just started seeing a stain coming through their ceiling. They didn't hear anything or anything like that. And and this this was a newer, newer built home in a pretty nice uh area, so they had you know R63 insulation. There was so much insulation up there, and in the raccoons they were on top of it and just kind of padded it down, but it acts as a noise blocker for for lots of people. And it's nice and cushy for them.

Richard Piet 8:48

Exactly. Is there uh something in Michigan, Tony, that stands out in this category? Something sneaky in our state?

Tony Sorrentino 8:59

Southwest Michigan, um flying squirrels and red squirrels. Fliers are notorious, they'll live in your house. We've had huge infestations with flying squirrels, and red squirrels are notorious for chewing wires and and ruining insulation.

Richard Piet 9:15

When you say flying squirrels, so it's a squirrel with wings. I mean, what do these look like?

Tony Sorrentino 9:22

They have they have a uh piece of skin that runs from their from their wrist and then it it's attached at their ankle, and so they're gliders. If they jump and spread their little arms out, they fly. Flying squirrel. What about Nebraska, Dang?

Daine Patton 9:37

Got something special there? Oh, I don't think that we have any kind of different uh wildlife than than Michigan's gonna have because we have we have winters here too, so we don't get the the exotic things like they do down south, but um every once in a while we get some some good snake calls, and and those are always fun to deal

The Simple Case For Regular Inspections

Daine Patton 9:56

with.

Richard Piet 9:56

So what's the moral of this story? You might not realize that you have an infestation, number one, right? So what's the solution? A periodic inspection.

Daine Patton 10:10

Is that it? Uh 100%. I it seems like people that that own homes, they they don't necessarily maintain them as well as they used as we used to. Also, we we have a lot of storms. There's always new construction going on and people replacing roofs and people are putting new siding on, stuff like that. And just walking around the outside of your house and making sure that that that your gutters are are free and clear and water can flow through them, making sure that like your AC lines are sealed, making sure that vents have have proper screening and cages on them, uh, making sure your crawl space vents are caged and closed off, stuff like that, because it it doesn't take much. It takes about a dime size hole for for a bat to get in. You know, if a mouse can fit its head in, uh chew a hole in, if it's head, it can fit the rest of its body and its whole family inside there.

Richard Piet 10:58

Unbelievable. We just got through talking about in our last episode about home inspections and pest inspections. Here's another reason to consider a pest inspection, the notion that it could be I'm still lingering on this 30-year infestation that nobody knew about. It it that seems extreme, but uh the point is they could be there and you don't know. Do you run into this a lot, Tony? Somebody calls you about some weird thing and it's an infestation.

Tony Sorrentino 11:28

Mm-hmm.

Noises, False Alarms, And Real Fixes

Tony Sorrentino 11:29

It it it it happens more times than not, where I'm hearing noises, whether it's scratching or chirping or thumping. If you're hearing noises, say something. That's a a good starting point where where we're gonna come out and do an A-Z evaluation of your home from the the ridge vent to the foundation line, and we're gonna figure out what's going on and how we can help.

Richard Piet 11:52

And when you do, if it reveals a problem, there's gonna be a plan to sort that out, and then you're gonna come back and check that again, right?

Tony Sorrentino 12:02

Yep, that's the warranty on all of our exclusion services, termite services too. But um, that we put a one-year warranty on it, we'll do uh a whole house exclusion where there's so much going on that we need to wrap the foundation with metal to seal up all the gaps. Or if we have to build custom roof returns or do custom built color matched metal work for the roof, whatever it takes to get the job done.

Richard Piet 12:31

So, Daine, do you ever go to a uh a pest inspection and you find nothing? I mean, somebody's called you and uh there must be some kind of suspicion about something. But do you do you go and and everything's fine and you say see you in a year? Or what's the thought there?

Daine Patton 12:49

Yeah, uh every every once in a while that that does happen, and it can happen from time to time. People are hearing noises, and like I said, they're not just going outside and walking around, they're calling an an expert to come and take a look at it. And I've I've been plenty of times where it's just trees scraping against the the s the roof. One time I had a kite that was stuck uh wrapped around somebody's chimney, and every time it would blow, it would it would uh start hitting this metal vent up there, and you know, just you you you just you see everything. I mean, I've been doing this for almost 20 years now, so every once in a while, but for the most part, you know, those are few and far between. Mostly we find some sort of of issue that of uh rodents or bats or or some sort of wildlife issue.

Richard Piet 13:32

Yeah, and as you pointed out, uh taking care of a home is perhaps more difficult than it's been in uh prior generations. And so sometimes, you know, the idea of spending a few bucks just to have a peace of mind or have a at least a report and approach is not something people want to do. But boy, imagine a 30-year infestation like that example is the alternative sometimes, and that is tremendous. Tony, you've probably seen that too. The idea that um somebody doesn't want to do this, but boy, when they do, they end up happy they did.

Tony Sorrentino 14:12

It's a differentiator. Where you the Daine said something that was important, and I wanted to add something. The the people aren't keeping up on their houses as much, and the houses that they're building these days aren't built to the same standards with the same materials that they were built with 50 or 60 or 75 years ago. The wood that they use and and the framing and structural timbers is not as dense, it's not as um robust. And the the the builders that are building these houses these days leave gap, they have they have a term for it. It's called building builders' gaps. And if it's if it's less than a if it looks good from 30 feet or 30 miles per hour, you're good to go. There's a structural vulnerabilities that that are left behind and then behind the siding, so then the the owner, the homeowners don't know that either.

Annual Checkups And How To Reach Us

Richard Piet 15:03

So how often, Daine, then, should we have an inspection? If everything turns out okay and there's nothing to it, when do you want to go back again?

Daine Patton 15:11

Yeah, I always reckon my customers do an annual inspection. You know, uh if you're gonna hire a professional at least once a year, or if you have any exterior construction done to your house, it's always good to have um somebody like myself or Tony, or there's so many great companies out there come and do a walk-around of your property and and do a full inspection. Um for for customers that we have have uh secured their properties, we offer that extended warranty service. So we we do the same thing like Tony, we give them a one-year warranty, but then every year we offer to extend that warranty for for a low price, you know, much lower than what the actual job costs. But for us to come out and and uh for our time and and energy and effort to come out and do a full inspection, and we we do the same thing like we do if it's if it's a first uh appointment. We'll get the ladder out, we get up on the roof, we do the full roof line, we do you know, basement, crawl space inspections, underneath porches, all that kind of stuff. And it gives people peace of mind because most for most people, your home is the most valuable thing that that you're gonna spend your money on, and you'd much rather not be sharing it with with wild animals that uh that aren't aren't uh part of your family.

Richard Piet 16:22

At least the wild animals that aren't part of your family. Yeah, okay. No, that's uh great information, something for you to think about. And of course, if you're in Lincoln, Nebraska, Daine will be happy to talk to you about that from Bats to Rats Wildlife, and of course, Pest Pros of Michigan in Southwest Michigan, Tony and the team ready uh there as well. Check the show notes for the links through and make contact if they sparked an inspiration for a question, they're ready to answer. All right, gentlemen, thanks for what you do. We appreciate it and we appreciate the insight.

Daine Patton 16:55

Thanks, Richard. Thanks, Daine. Yeah, thank you, Tony. Thank you, Richard. Uh, super grateful to be here and uh and love you guys.

Richard Piet 17:03

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