Divorce Diaries: Lessons From the Trenches
Welcome to Divorce Diaries, where host Cary Jacobson, attorney and mediator brings you real stories, hard truths, and practical advice on navigating divorce and family law. Whether you're going through it, considering it, or just curious, this is your place for clarity, confidence, and resilience.
Divorce Diaries: Lessons From the Trenches
EP #15: Navigating Divorce Without the Drama: Lessons from Coach Eric Chilton
In this episode, host Cary Jacobson, attorney and mediator for Jacobson Family Law, sits down with Eric Chilton, a Certified Divorce Coach, as he reveals how communication strategies and proper preparation can save divorcing couples significant money and emotional distress. Eric explains why immediate legal action isn't always the best first step and shares practical techniques for managing high-conflict situations.
Visit palmettodivorcecoacching.com to connect with Eric Chilton for personalized divorce coaching.
Visit jacobsonfamilylaw.com to learn more.
Visit jacobsonworkshop.com to learn more.
So the biggest misconceptions. I even make jokes about my occupation, and Hollywood gets it wrong. Well, Hollywood gets divorce and family wrong as well. What's the first step? You call a shark lawyer and you start firing off motions and discoveries. No, no, no, no, no.
Speaker 2:Welcome to Divorce Diaries, where attorney Carrie Jacobson brings you real stories, hard truths and practical advice on navigating divorce and family law. Whether you're going through it, considering it or just curious, this is your place for clarity, confidence and resilience.
Speaker 3:Welcome back to Divorce Diaries Lessons from the Trenches. I'm your host, keri Jacobson, and today we have a great guest joining us Eric Chilton. Eric is the founder of Palmetto Divorce Coaching. He is a certified divorce coach who helps individuals navigate the complexities of divorce with clarity, confidence and future-focused mindset. His approach emphasizes emotional intelligence, communication strategies and practical solutions for achieving an amicable divorce even when the other party is not cooperative. Eric, thanks so much for joining us today.
Speaker 1:Thank you, keri, glad to be here.
Speaker 3:Well, before we kind of get into some of the topics, can you tell our listeners a little bit about what inspired you to become a divorce coach, as well as your personal journey that led you to this work?
Speaker 1:Sure happy to so, being that you're in Maryland. I spent a good part of my career in the DC area and folks outside of DC rarely get this. But I was with the agency that knocks on your door and does background investigations on all the civil servants and you say, well, what does that have to do with family law and divorce and whatnot? Well, when you knock on somebody's door, I start asking questions. The people are divorced and when you come from a procedural standpoint, you're reading divorce files, you're interviewing both parties, you're trying to see whose story matches up.
Speaker 1:You get people that throw all sorts of mud at the other party where he did this or she did this, and I say, well, wait a minute, I just read the public record. Why isn't that in there? Could you share that with me and you parlay that into? Then I became a leader within the government and all your staff comes to you with their problems and you partner up with the employee assistance program to help people work through it. So that's what brought me here, and I'm 10 years post-divorce myself and the therapist that I met with when I just looked at the employee benefit program of what do you do when you get divorced, I made the choice of just start calling lawyers and I know now you don't have to do that that there's much not to take any away from attorneys because mine is great. But there are many different ways to get divorced, and how you start on day one really sets the process for everybody.
Speaker 3:A hundred percent. It definitely sets the tone. You know, if you start out throwing that mud, it's often that that's going to continue throughout that whole process, versus if you start out with a more gentle approach. And I'm sure you heard lots of different stories.
Speaker 1:Yes, I say what's the weirdest thing you've ever heard? And I'm like you know, I'm not sure I can answer that because that's such a subjective, but I'll tell you. The thing that surprises me is who tells me stuff or where the information came from. And, like whoa, I did not expect you to say that I have a lot of those stories, I'm sure. What are some of the biggest lessons?
Speaker 1:You, we were mindful of the fact that we can talk to each other for free and come up with resolutions ourselves, but when you start searching for divorce now, you'll see terms and many of them I commend you for using on your platform collaborative divorce and amicable divorce. Those things didn't really exist a decade ago, and I happen to live in the deep South, where it's not even possible to have a joint attorney or a true collaborative counsel, so you have to figure out how to do it on your own. So the biggest misconceptions I even make jokes about my occupation and Hollywood gets it wrong. Well, hollywood gets divorce and family wrong as well.
Speaker 1:What's the first step? You call a shark lawyer and you start firing off motions and discoveries. No, no, no, no, no, even if you don't want to be in the same room as the other person. I mean, we're getting divorced and something along the way fell apart. Learning that how you communicate, how you negotiate and how you offer proposals and counter proposals offline for free saves you tens of thousands of dollars, not to mention the emotional toil that comes along with it. So, thinking outside the box, realizing that what you've seen in drama is really the exception, Absolutely, and what you've been told by family and friends, yes, I say that as well.
Speaker 1:As much as I love my family and friends and support system, this is when I need you to tune them out a little bit. I will triage all that information for you. But even the well-meaning people, I mean they're sharing a story that happened to their next door neighbor's sister's college roommate's cousin. That has nothing to do with you.
Speaker 3:That's happened in a different state.
Speaker 1:Yes, Right Galaxy long ago and Star Wars yeah.
Speaker 3:Right, and I do think that there is that absolute misconception that the very first thing you should do is hire an attorney and file a divorce, and so often with the people that we meet with, that's like the approach that they are looking to take and we're like let's take this back a few steps. We try to negotiate it first and then only if you can't come to an agreement do we then file. Or you do come to an agreement and then we're filing for the uncontested divorce, or you do come to an agreement and then we're filing for the uncontested divorce. So it saves so much angst, because so many times what I see is that people get that divorce filing and their spouse's attorney has said all these horrible things about them, you know, for the purpose of the actual document, and then you're having to overcome and negotiate around what was said, even though it wasn't really necessary.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and I mean a civil court action for divorce is, by its core definition, court action for divorce is, by its core definition, adversarial in nature. But it doesn't have to be that way, and I use the cliche. There's a difference between disagreeing and being disagreeable. And that's one of the very first conversations and usually the first question I ask anybody that calls me is tell me the exact state of affairs today in level of communication. Do we dialogue about anything, or is this truly a burn bridge and the only way we can communicate is by carrier pigeon?
Speaker 3:Yeah, in your experience, what is a common mistake that you've seen people make during their divorce, and how can our listeners prevent that from happening?
Speaker 1:right. So you just used a term that I'm a big fan of mediation. Now I do not profess to know the policies and procedures of all 50 states. Everyone is different. The state where I live, mediation is actually a requirement unless you walk into the courthouse and check one box on one form that says this is completely not disputed. We just need a judge to sign this so that we can get divorced and not fearing the vocabulary, taking the time to learn the policies and procedures of your state because it's different in the next state, in the next state, in the next state. So you know again, using platforms like yours. I just wish I could provide that to clients here, locally, of here, is a much better way than what you know.
Speaker 3:But to answer your question, educating yourself as to the procedure where you live, yes, because it is drastically different from one location to the next, and sometimes even within the same state. Different counties can have different quirks and things that they are looking for and how they approach.
Speaker 1:You know the cases as well, so and then the next big topic after that is here's the second most common question. I get Something phrased similar to can he do that? Can she do that? Does that matter? And the answer normally is no. It doesn't matter how you feel about it. Sure that matters. How you react to that, of course that matters. But no, the court does not care that you think your soon-to-be ex-husband is a jerk. There's no law against being a jerk.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we get that question as well, and oftentimes it is not a great. There may not be a legal ramification but, sometimes it can impact how negotiations will go right.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 3:So you know a very common one is well, does it matter if I am dating someone else during the separation period until you know an agreement is signed and legally it doesn't make a huge difference?
Speaker 1:At least now in Maryland we don't have adultery as a fault ground any longer but it can impact how willing your spouse is going to be in negotiating the terms of the agreement so yes, if I show up to baseball practice and my new girlfriend is sitting next to me, yes, everybody sees that, everybody reacts to that. Everybody reacts to that, and it's probably not in the most warm and fuzzy way.
Speaker 3:Right. So my advice typically is let's get that agreement signed first and then talk about introducing a new significant other to the kids or your spouse.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 3:What are some strategies that you recommend for responding to tense conversations often emails or texts, maybe it's high conflict situations to help your clients bring down those tensions.
Speaker 1:Right. So this is something I love to role play with my clients of. Let's just pretend Carrie sends me a text message at 9.30 at night. It's very long and rambling about how I stink at life because I didn't buy Susie the shoes that she needed and the new lunchbox. And why would I dare bring my Susie the shoes that she needed and the new lunchbox? And why would I dare bring my girlfriend to the baseball? I'm going to reply to you in business hours. I'm going to reply to you only with the material facts of. You're absolutely right. Sorry about the shoes. We're going to go to the store this afternoon. I know you have an extra lunchbox at the house. Could you please use that? Until I get a new one and you'll see it's softball, I'll be alone.
Speaker 1:I responded in bullet form. I took out the emotions and I didn't fire back immediately and especially for any type of high conflict situation, I do get a lot of people that come to me. You know, saying so-and-so is a narcissist. I was like, well, hold on, We'll get to that in a minute. But taking the emotion out of it, that is, I like to say, is my gift in life. And responding in reasonable timeframes and hours. You do not get dragged into a dialogue. We've already established that we're breaking up and we don't need to keep rehashing that as to why so, and so is a jerk.
Speaker 1:Yes, setting those boundaries is what I hear you say yes, there you go, boundaries, and pick and choose your battles. To use more cliches yes, okay.
Speaker 3:How can someone practice emotional intelligence when they are dealing with that? You know person who just doesn't want to follow those boundaries.
Speaker 1:So again, the terms you hear a lot high, conflict, narcissistic. I call it the emotional selfishness that comes from divorce. A certain degree of paranoia creeps into everybody, a certain degree of animosity creeps in, but along to what I was saying before of having a very calculated response, thinking about your response, playing through it with your coach or a trusted advisor, of can you take the feeling out of this and just focus on the facts. The same thing the court will do to you if you go the route of litigation, of not allowing yourself to be drawn into that slippery slope of you know you're never going to see your kids again, I'll never pay you a dime. All right, I heard you, but I've been doing lots of reading and research and I'd like to address the following in business form.
Speaker 3:Yeah, keep bringing it back to being more of a business. Like response.
Speaker 1:Exactly yeah.
Speaker 3:We know that you mentioned kind of collaborative and mediation before. Obviously, keeping and reaching an amicable resolution is often best for everyone that's involved. But what if the other party is not on board, not willing to negotiate? Is there anything someone can do to take that reasonable approach?
Speaker 1:Yes. Now, again, this is assuming that you have a platform to present your argument to that person. So email or a letter of? I understand this is painful. I understand neither one of us like this or want this, but here are the facts of our situation. You and I can communicate offline between each other for free or via this, you know, third party mediator, with or without attorneys. But if we don't, that means there goes the college fund and there goes. You want to buy a boat. I hope you get that boat, but we're going to spend the amount of money for that boat just for you and I to feel like we won.
Speaker 1:And the words that are coming out of my mouth now are similar but different for everybody. So, putting it in the context of your relationship and your marriage, of what matters to that person Are they financially driven? Are they emotionally driven? Are they the type of person that will spend a hundred grand just for a judge to say you win, she was a bad wife. If I said that to you right now, could we settle this? I will admit to being a bad wife you know something in the terms that that person understands.
Speaker 3:I also, I 100% agree. I think that it's finding what is that underlying interest of the other person and figuring that out so that you can appease that or appeal to that.
Speaker 1:The other thing that I find, and I don't know you're in South Carolina, which there are five ways to get divorced in South Carolina, but because you want to get divorced has only been legal in my lifetime, so we're still learning the collaborative, uncontested model here.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I would say that it's relatively recent for Maryland as well. But one thing that many people don't realize is how long the process can take if you go through court. At least here, we are experiencing in some counties up to two years before they actually get before a judge, and most people want to resolve things before that, and so using that time as an incentive can also help.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 1:And again, being that you're in Maryland and I came from the government, so I'm allowed to make jokes about the government. Do you really want to fill out more forms and stand in line and go to the bottom of the pile, or do you want the speedy pass to where you're able to say, yep, we're good, and get that done quicker? And of course, it depends on which state you're in. I just read a study that where I live is number 46 out of 50 in terms of timeliness. But we also have a mandatory one year wait, which brings you to a separate conversation of do you file now or do you file in the future. It's usually better to file now, just because of the merits of the system where I live.
Speaker 1:But yeah, the time I had one client call me on September 1st and she goes well, the attorney says we can get divorced in another 72 days, so that means by Christmas. I can go on tenderandmatchcom, right, and I said what you could do it now, but I don't think you should and you will not be single by Christmas. I'm just here to tell you as a former civil servant.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, though. If parties can reach an agreement and they have that signed separation agreement contract, that resolves all of their issues, then that allows for more freedom.
Speaker 1:It does, and even financially, like if you're going to be financing a new house, you can craft the language in that document that's gonna make a lender feel much better about giving you money, even though your legal spouse isn't on the documents. And what? Oh yes, the more often than not I say that's the way to go 100%, because it saves everybody time and money.
Speaker 3:What roles do you think?
Speaker 1:mindset play when navigating the divorce process successfully. Yeah, so divorce isn't pretty, even the nicest ones. So, no matter what you're going to have a different living situation, no matter what you're going to have a different financial situation, if you are a parent, you are more than likely going to have far less time with your children. Accepting that and I say using that to make the life that you want, knowing that those three factors and probably many more are an absolute certainty, accepting it and going from there of that's what will make this more tolerable. I've got a client recently that said you know, my whole life I've wanted to live in an apartment in the city. And I said now is your chance. You get to live anywhere you want. Now does that make sense for your lifestyle and your job and whatnot? We'll talk about that separately, but you get to choose now and I try to spend the positive on it as much as I can of you know we've had a setback, but you now have a clean marker board to draw that the way you want.
Speaker 3:And it's a new chapter to create the life that you want as well. It is.
Speaker 1:I like to say you are becoming a single legal entity. Right Reset, let's go.
Speaker 3:Right If you could give one piece of advice to someone who is about to start their perfect client, the one that I feel I can serve the best comes to me before they have retained counsel, made life-altering legal decisions and learning.
Speaker 1:the tone that you set now is going to keep going. So if there's any possibility we can swallow our pride a little bit and smile versus frown and start off amicable. You've got the best chance ending that way 100% agree, Chris.
Speaker 3:thank you so much. Where can our listeners find out more about you and your work at Palmetto Divorce Coaching?
Speaker 1:Well, you just said it. For me it's palmetto divorcecoachingcom. I prefer to work only one-on-one so I don't have any type of group things or files to buy when you come to me.
Speaker 3:That's what you get is me Wonderful. Well, thank you so much for sharing your insights today. We know communication is such a critical part of the divorce puzzle and I know your listeners will benefit from the strategies you've shared with us today. If you're going through a divorce and need guidance, be sure to check out Eric's work at palmetto divorcecoachingcom and, for our listeners, if you found today's episode helpful, don't forget to subscribe and share with anyone who you think could use this advice. Until next time, thank you and take care.
Speaker 2:Thanks for joining us today on this episode of Divorce Diaries. Remember every journey is unique, but you don't have to navigate it alone. Visit jacobsonfamilylawcom or call 443-726-4912 for support and guidance.