Investing In Accessibility

Greetings From CSUN: A Conversation with GAAD Founders Joe Devon & Jennison Asuncion

• Kelvin Crosby & Chris Maher • Season 1 • Episode 7

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In this episode of Investing in Accessibility, co-hosts Kelvin Crosby and Chris Maher sit down with two true leaders of the accessibility movement: Joe Devon and Jennison Asuncion, co-founders of Global Accessibility Awareness Day (GAAD). Together, they share the incredible story of how a blog post, a tweet, and a Saturday night on Twitter sparked a global movement that now reaches over 200 million people annually.

Joe and Jennison open up about their personal journeys—Joe’s path through tech and entrepreneurship, and Jennison’s lived experience as a blind technologist navigating a rapidly changing world. They reflect on the early days of GAAD, the role of big tech, and the power of grassroots efforts to create global impact.

This episode is packed with insight, humor, history, and hope for a more inclusive future. Whether you’re an entrepreneur, investor, technologist, or advocate, this conversation will challenge you to see accessibility not just as a compliance checkbox—but as a catalyst for meaningful innovation.

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Kelvin Crosby:

Welcome to Investing in Accessibility, a Samaritan Partners podcast. We're not waiting for change, we're investing in it. Join us as we speak with entrepreneurs and thought leaders that are focused on creating a more accessible world.

Kelvin Crosby:

It's so good to see you, even though I can't see you. It's another beautiful day in the neighborhood and I'm so excited that you are here at Investing in Accessibility. My name is Kalvin Crosby and I got my co-host, Chris Maher. How you doing man.

Chris Maher:

I am fantastic, Kelvin, good to be with you today in person for the first time, which is amazing.

Kelvin Crosby:

I tell you, you smell great. You know it was the first time I was wondering how is Chris Maher going to smell at CSUN and I was like this could be very interesting.

Chris Maher:

It's awesome to see you in person, my friend.

Kelvin Crosby:

Yes, it's been great and we've had a good time at CSUN. And I tell you we got an amazing set of guests today and I can't wait for you guys listening tonight today or tonight, whatever time you're listening, that these two people, they're changing the world in a way that you don't realize, so why don't you introduce us to our guest?

Chris Maher:

It is my pleasure. We have two of my favorite people on the planet that are joining us today. They are the founders of GAAD, Global Accessibility Awareness Day, and they do a multitude of other things, and I would consider both of them to be OGs of the accessibility space in terms of advocacy for disability, and so I'd like to welcome Jennison Asuncion and Joe Devon to the podcast today. Welcome guys.

Joe Devon:

Thank you, Chris.

Jennison Asuncion:

Great to be here.

Chris Maher:

And so it really is such a treat. A quick story about how I met Jennison and Joe, and there is a common thread there that I honestly didn't really realize until we were, you know, going to do this conversation today. So I met Jenison first in October of 23. We were at M Enabling and I sat across the table from Jenison at a dinner that the folks from the Perkins School for the Blind were hosting. And so that's where I meet Jenison. And then fast forward a few months to CES and I'm at another dinner hosted by folks from Perkins and Howe Innovation, and I sit across the table from Joe. And so I have such gratitude for the folks at Perkins for bringing you two into my life, and so that's a pretty neat way that we all came together.

Joe Devon:

That is cool and they're a great organization.

Chris Maher:

Yeah, they are the best.

Chris Maher:

So let's kick things off here. I think what would be wonderful to start is for Joe and to Jenison just to take a couple minutes each to tell people about your personal backgrounds before we get into how you two came together and founded GAAD. So, joe, let's start with you.

Joe Devon:

Sure. So in terms of personal background, I'd say tech kind of started for me at 13 years old. I got an Apple IIe and just fell in love with it. Within a month I wrote a program that essentially was translating English to Hebrew words, and back then there was like no courses to take. I was too young, I had no access to any books. We just had to figure everything out and I really took to it from there. And then I was this combination of tech and entrepreneurship in my blood, so I just started lots of different companies. I went to Europe, you probably don't know this, Chris yeah.

Chris Maher:

I don't.

Joe Devon:

Russia was just opening up and it was really the wild, wild west. So I started a company when I was probably like 22 or so 23, in Europe, and I traveled the world doing international trading, all over Russia all over Ukraine.

Chris Maher:

Were you based in Russia at that time?

Joe Devon:

I was based in Antwerp in Belgium and I met all kind of interesting characters, because when government collapses, a lot of people sort of take over different cities. So I have lots of crazy stories that I probably shouldn't say on a podcast. But my goodness, yeah, I forgot more stuff than that would go in a book. Thank God I forgot it. You know. Yeah, So then from there you want me to get all the way to GAAD?

Chris Maher:

Well, how did you, how did you really start to get into the accessibility space? And then we'll go to Jennison and then come back for you guys to tell us about how GAAD started.

Joe Devon:

Yeah, , so really the accessibility is the GAAD gad story, because I was actually working American Idol. com idolcom and I seen, seen I'd read one thing about accessibility by this fellow Mark mark Pilgrim, who wrote a blog called Dive into Mark, but he also would go like dive into Python, dive into accessibility. So that was the first place where I heard of it. And then I saw this fellow Victor victor Tsaran. He is a technical program manager at Google and he did a video showing what it was like to.

Joe Devon:

was then at Yahoo. He's like this is how you view a page with a screen reader. And I was blown away and I was always on the bleeding edge of tech and I had not really heard of this. So that percolated in my mind until my dad was in his mid-80s. He was losing his hearing and his eyesight and he couldn't bank, . And I got really upset because the banking website was inaccessible. So I wrote this blog post that turned into Global Accessibility Awareness Day.

Chris Maher:

You know, the lived experience usually comes into place right.

Joe Devon:

Absolutely. And my dad had an incredible history. He was in the concentration camps. He was in Auschwitz and Dachau. He spoke 11 different languages, including Aramaic. He was brilliant. He was as good at science, as good at Talmud as he was at science Just a genius. So watching my dad not be able to bank and be independent was really painful for someone of his stature. You know, he's like a god to me, you know, but I think this would be a good time to pass it to Jennison to tell his side of it.

Jennison Asuncion:

Let's do it, hey everyone. So I, what's my origin story? So, just so folks know, I am someone who's completely blind. I lost my vision when I was about a year and a half old, so this is all I've ever known, and I raise that here because I grew up as technology was actually innovating in front of me. So I'm a kid of the 70s and the first computers I ever dealt with didn't even have any software that read back to me what was on the screen. My screen reading software were my sister and my cousins.

Jennison Asuncion:

And so I would play games like Atari games. I would learn how to do it just with the sounds and stuff. But then in school they had this silly idea of teaching a blind guy logo on the Apple. So I remember I'll never forget FD40RT90 to create squares.

Jennison Asuncion:

But then I would just for fun to see if the teachers were paying attention. I would change the coordinates and see if they would tell me if I was really drawing a square or something else. So that was really my first foray into technology. And then so I learned BASIC and I remember those old computers with the tape decks and all of that stuff. But ultimately I learned I had access to an Apple computer with the very early screen reading software like really old, old stuff.

Jennison Asuncion:

That must have been torture.

Jennison Asuncion:

Absolutely, but I was learning. I was looking at games and how they were text games and how they were being built, and I was just basically learning how to program on the fly, fast forward. I thought, you know, being a, an Asian immigrant, that my lot was either going to be an engineer, a lawyer or doctor. Obviously, doctor was out of the question..

Kelvin Crosby:

Wait, you don't want to do brain surgery?

Jennison Asuncion:

I don't think people would want me to do brain surgery on them.

Kelvin Crosby:

I might trust a blind guy over esteemed person for brain surgery.

Jennison Asuncion:

Fair, enough, fair enough.

Jennison Asuncion:

But yeah. So one of my issues was math was never strong with me. For me. I was one of those kids who unfortunately got the advice from well-meaning professionals at the time that said you know, you're blind, don't expect to do well in math and science, you should consider doing psychology or law, and nothing against those two professions. But I was basically told, because I was blind, that math was not going to be part of what I was going to do. And so you build, I built math phobia and all that kind of stuff. So. But despite all that, I did take a kick at the can twice, once in college and one at university level. I got into computer engineering and hated it both times. But that was that. I finished up with a degree in political science. This was back in Canada, in Montreal, and then I was like what am I going to do now? And fortunately I learned about this degree in educational technology. I was already doing on the side stuff training people with disabilities on how to use technology at my local community college. So someone came to me and said, hey, you know you're a good trainer and stuff. You should consider this degree. So I said, well, this will be a fast track to getting into corporate. So I did the degree and left Montreal, moved to Toronto, spent five and a half years in the e-learning space doing a bunch of non-accessibility stuff, being a project manager, things like that and then in 2006, I quit cold turkey and my friends at that point were saying like why aren't you doing accessibility? You care about the stuff, you're passionate about it, blah, blah, blah. But there was a reason I decided not to do accessibility right away. I wanted to have what I considered real world experience doing other stuff. I didn't want to be pigeonholed as the blind guy doing accessibility. So I did all the other stuff which was important to me because my life in project management was like going to business school for me. So I learned all of that stuff and then I transitioned into digital accessibility full time in 2006, got my first gig at the Royal Bank of Canada, did a lot of stuff working with designers and developers all that good stuff, had an amazing time and I learned that part of what I was good at doing was making people feel comfortable around the concept of accessibility and making it fun and exciting and interesting.

Jennison Asuncion:

I'm fast forwarding here a lot, but in 2009, I ended up going to something called Accessibility Camp in DC and it was this totally weird experience. I'm a bit of a type A guy. I like structure and stuff, but I came to this event where people were putting Post-it notes up on a board and voting on different sessions around accessibility and I was like this is wild. It was a Saturday at the MLK Public Librar y. Shout out to John Croston who started that whole thing. But yeah, so I came to DC. I threw a networking reception even back then at a place called Ben's Chili Bowl and I talked to them and they decided to do an accessibility camp. They did that. I got bitten by the bug. I helped run one in Boston and then Toronto and then it just happened in 2011. I happened to be uncharacteristically home on a Saturday night.

Kelvin Crosby:

That's where the rumor has it. You're always out on a Saturday night.

Jennison Asuncion:

But check this out. So here I am, doing what all tech people do at the time was I was trolling on Twitter and here I was, and here I was, and remember what I said before, that I built this passion around like trying to find neat ways to make accessibility approachable for your everyday technologist. So here I am, I'm on Twitter and I come up upon this tweet that says technology must go mainstream, now. Something to that effect. And I activated the link and came upon a blog post by this guy who I didn't know at the time, Joe Devon, in Los Angeles.

Chris Maher:

Was that the beginning? That was the blog post and that was the beginning of you guys partnering for GAD.

Jennison Asuncion:

Yeah, so Joe wrote this blog post. He he vented a little bit talking about how he, as a developer, and other developers don't know what accessibility is or what it should be, and people don't know what a screen reader is. And then he said we need a day, an international day, to just bring awareness to accessibility. And I was like wow, this is like whew. And so I replied to the blog and we have the blog post still. If you go to accessibility. day, you can see the blog post there. And I responded, I said, hey if you're really interested in doing something you know this is what I've been doing in Canada, get back to me. And the rest is history.

Chris Maher:

I love how the universe conspires to bring people together like that. You guys are certainly kindred spirits, and that's just a fantastic story. Kelvin, do you have a question?

Kelvin Crosby:

Yeah, well, I think one thing that I would love people to understand is that, as we start connecting and making universal access, what we're realizing is that, as a business-led person, networking is not easy for us, and I think this is one of the biggest blessings of the blind person is that everybody is neutral until they tell you who they are. There's no judgment. And then the next thing you know, the world blows up once you figure out who they are the visually impaired person. And I think that's kind of what happened with you guys. It's like, wow, all right, the world is going to go viral, it's going to go boom, it's going to go crazy.

Jennison Asuncion:

We never thought. Joe and I, and I think Joe you'll agree with me, we honestly didn't think that this was going to go anywhere. We got on the phone back in the day. You actually picked up a phone and we just started chatting and Joe was very plugged into the mainstream Los Angeles tech community and had like really good street cred and was involved with a lot of open source and all of that stuff in the mainstream side. You know, I had built a bit of a thing on my end on the accessibility side, but we both truly didn't know, like what was going to happen. So we basically both individually just reached out to people and said hey, we're going to choose this random day, may 9th 2012, and we're going to call it Global Accessibility Awareness Day, and would you be willing to run an event?

Chris Maher:

A true grassroots effort. So, Joe, give us a little bit more about GAAD and your mission and some of the things that you folks are doing.

Jennison Asuncion:

How was that history, though? Did I get it right?

Joe Devon:

Yes, yeah, that was an interesting memory, like you know, bring you down memory lane. What's interesting, there's a few alignments here is that Jennison was from Montreal. I was born in Montreal as well. I believe you were working at a bank, right?

Jennison Asuncion:

RBC.

Joe Devon:

Yeah, so he was working at a bank ensuring accessibility there, and here we have a bank that is what prompted the blog post. And then we thought if we work really, really hard, we might be able to get a bit of a success. But the reality with virality is that you just don't know what's going to hit. And the blog post was on MySQLTalk. com, a database blog with a huge audience of maybe 10 people in its entire history, and a few years later this thing is reaching over 200 million people on the hashtag. And another interesting aspect is that by year three I never mentioned the bank's name publicly, but people from the bank, and I wish I could find find that email, they reached out to us and they said we know our accessibility sucks and we're doing an internal event. Please don't tell anybody publicly, but we're going to improve our accessibility internally,

Chris Maher:

Your dad's bank?

Joe Devon:

Yeah,

Chris Maher:

Oh my god, full circle there, huh?

Joe Devon:

Yeah, huge bank and and, like I've done all kind of enterprise work but never had an impact on an organization as this one little blog post out of nowhere, and it's really about tapping the vein of an unmet need and people. You know it is so frustrating sometimes because when you're talking to enterprise, they don't, not all the divisions understand how big this is. Like this didn't reach 200 million people because it's a small market, like it affects so many people. So I wish that they could understand how that translates into income. But it's so subtle because there's so many aspects to disability and and so they want to see the numbers in a very concrete way and that's, I think, a bit of the challenge.

Kelvin Crosby:

Yeah, I mean, I think what we're realizing and I think investing in accessibility, what we're realizing is that for so long we've been pushing so hard and I think the bucket is getting full on all the different resources and it's starting to pour out. And I think we're at CSUN and I'm curious from your guys' perspective at the 40th anniversary of CSUN and like are you seeing that same? Like the bucket's getting really full, the opportunities are becoming better for people with disabilities, and really creating an opportunity for people with disabilities to be successful in a way that we haven't had for years. But I feel like this is the season and that bucket's getting really full. What would you guys say about that?

Jennison Asuncion:

Yeah, absolutely so. This is my, I think, 18th or 19th CSUN conference and I haven't yet had a chance to fully walk the exhibit hall, but that's always where you see all the latest assistive technology and accessibility-related things. The one thing I have to say is, you know, back in the day a lot of this technology was out of reach of those of us with disabilities from a price point perspective. But now you're seeing like $200 pair of glasses that now are bringing such independence and empowerment for people with visual impairments. Different sets of glasses, different smart, all these smart devices and sure, there is a price tag to it because people need to pay in order to invest in the technology and research and all that stuff. But where I'm going is the prices have come down significantly on a lot of the technology, so it's putting it in closer range for more people.

Jennison Asuncion:

Is it getting to everyone? Absolutely not. Let's be realistic that we're still dealing with this high unemployment rate In different countries. People with different disabilities are still shunned or hidden away. None of that stuff unfortunately has moved the needle fully in every country on that front. But, what I see here is so much new technology that makes it that much more possible again for those of us with disabilities to really seek out and really dream big and see what might be out there. I mean autonomous vehicles. I mean, we got Waymo in San Francisco. The idea of hopping into a car, a driverless car, is amazing, and particularly for my peers who have service animals, you know, this is an amazing opportunity for them not to be potentially discriminated against by badly meaning drivers. I'll leave it there.

Chris Maher:

Janice, and I think that was really well put. So thank you so much. And, Joe, as we hand off over to you, whether it's here at CSUN or just in the broader market, I know AI is something that you're very focused on right now, and so like we'd love to get your take around AI as it relates to assistive technology.

Joe Devon:

Yeah, and let's just talk about innovation. What I think a lot of people don't realize is, if you want the coolest innovation, you go into accessibility. One of the things that I've seen here in previous years is a company called BrainPort. I mean, this thing blew me away. Brainport uses what's called sensory substitution and it uses electro-vibro-tactile stimulation and takes essentially a camera. So there's a camera mounted on glasses and then it films and then attaches it to this lollipop that you put on your tongue, because your tongue has all these sensors and essentially, you're seeing through your tongue. Right, this is all about accessibility, right? This technology is amazing and can be applied in so many different ways.

Joe Devon:

There's a TED Talk by neuroscientist David Eagleman, who also has an amazing podcast called what was it? It'll come back to me now that I need it. I don't have it, but maybe there'll be a new technology of AI that'll inject the right thought at the right time. But anyway, inner Cosmos, there we go. Inner Cosmos, fantastic podcast and he talks a lot about sensory substitution. And he has done this TED Talk where he took a vest and connected up. It's a haptic vest. He connected it up to the sound, the audio of an iPhone, and one hour a day showed someone who's deaf had him put on this vest and it translated the sounds into haptic touches and after about three, four days, this person was able to hear through his back and now he created a little bracelet. Essentially that he reduced the form factor to a bracelet, and these are just incredible technologies.

Joe Devon:

And there is an AI component to all of this. And now there's, you know, AI researchers. I don't know that they realize you're sitting here with artificial intelligence trying to emulate a human being and if you don't want to have that uncanny valley effect, you have to get this perfect. You have to get it right. And who other than the accessibility industry, the professionals who have spent decades learning about the differences in people's abilities, who else is going to give you the kind of data where you get all the edge cases and you get every aspect of being a human right, because all of us have extremely different abilities? So this is a really exciting time.

Chris Maher:

Joe, I think I agree with you 100% and that's part of the reason why the fund Samaritan Partners is 100% focused on the disability sector. Because there's so much innovation happening at that early stage. I think there's a super unique opportunity for private capital to come into this market to not only provide that catalytic funding but also the operational assistance to really advance these innovations that are going to change the lives of millions of people, and not just people in the disability community. As we know, when things are designed for the disability community with inclusive design and universal design, they tend to be really valuable to the broader general public.

Jennison Asuncion:

Yeah, If I could add to that, what's exciting to me is the older adult, the aging adult community, for lack of a better term these days. These are people now who have grown up with the technology and they have expectations of technology working a certain way, which is amazing, right? So we're at the point now where the 50, 60, 70-year-olds they've been exposed to all this technology, and so we have this opportunity to your point, Chris, that it's not only about people who have permanent disabilities, like myself who grew up with a disability, it's just people who are aging and acquiring disability later. They don't consider themselves as quote-unquote disabled, but they'll certainly enlarge the font sizes and they'll be taking advantage of some of this assistive technology, not on the basis of them quote-unquote having a disability, but just because it's easier and more convenient. But because that population will be making, you know, they have big wallets as well. They want convenience, they want to age gracefully, and so that all is going to drive some amazing things in the next like 10, 15 years. I'm really excited to see that stuff.

Kelvin Crosby:

I think one of the things I want you guys, the listeners, to really understand here, what we just heard today is something that I don't think people are putting the math together. You got aging people that are becoming disabled later on or that have tech skills, and we have people that are growing up with technology. We have people that have an expectation that they want to live life more successful and their loved ones are trying to help them as well. And I think, if you add that all up, I mean I don't have concrete data, but that number is not 25%. You're at least half 50% of the market. And I think this is why this is such a unique time in the accessibility space because we're starting to hit opportunities for people with disabilities in ways we've never been able to do for years. And this is the time, this is the season, to be able to have this opportunity and to really make this growth happen, and I think this is what I'm super excited about.

Joe Devon:

So I'd like to give you a little bit on that.

Joe Devon:

I don't remember the exact numbers, but I'm pretty sure about this because I literally went in to check the population figures in America and whatever I could globally, and the populations in most countries are aging. And in America right now the millennials, that everybody has been focused on for so long, the oldest millennial is about 43, 40, maybe 44 already this year. So it's not not that young anymore and literally at 40, your eyes start to change and they start to need more color contrast and those font sizes that Jennison was talking about. So over 50 percent of the population in America is over 40 and so and we bring with us, as Jennison was saying, we bring with us 30 years, three decades plus of digital content with us. We're not aging the same way that our parents and grandparents aged, and therefore, you know we we cannot be ignored. We will will not be ignored and we are a huge part of the population. And there are definitely some headwinds right now in accessibility. However, that pendulum is going to swing back because of the fact that this aging population is going to demand that the services are accessible for us. So that's where I think it's going.

Chris Maher:

Yeah, really well said, Joe. Jennison?

Jennison Asuncion:

Yeah, just to build up on this a little bit.

Jennison Asuncion:

What's really exciting to me, Chris you mentioned how you and I first met, it's that stuff now. It's these startups that are focusing on the disability community or disability in tech, whether it's our friends at the Howe Innovation Center at the Perkins or ATS Labs in Canada or Remarkable, I don't want to forget anyone there, but all of them and I'm meeting, so I'm spending a lot more time. Like I'm not just so this is Joe's wheelhouse all the startup stuff that's his thing.

Jennison Asuncion:

But I'm now like getting and learning more and I'm meeting so many people who are building startups, whether it's on assistive technologies, that for us with people with disabilities, or they're trying to solve some of the pressing issues when it comes to making digital content and websites and apps more accessible. But I guess my point here is that there's this groundswell that to me, that's what people are like aren't you like jaded and bored of the space and all that stuff? And to me, I'm thinking this is really exciting stuff happening and just meeting people and hearing about their ideas and all of that certainly gives me more reason to double down even more on the stuff that Joe and I are doing, whether it's through Global Accessibility Awareness Day or through the GAAD Foundation.

Chris Maher:

Yeah, I agree completely. It is such an exciting time and obviously the four of us, we're living it every day. But that enthusiasm is growing and I think the work that you folks are doing at GAAD and the GAAD Foundation is critically important, because you're getting the word out, you're creating the awareness and we're getting a groundswell, and it's not slowing down, it's picking up speed. And so, as we wrap up, how can people learn more about GAAD and the GAAD Foundation? And if you guys want to share anything about yourselves personally in terms of links where people can find you folks online, as well, would be great.

Joe Devon:

Sure. So I'm at Joe Devon, j-o-e-d-e-v-o-n, on all social media essentially. I just started a weekly newsletter where I'm sharing all kind of crazy stuff about tech, so that should be a fun link. And then the GAAD Foundation itself, the link is GAADFoundation, so G-A-A-D. Foundation dot foundation. And then the actual day, global Accessibility Awareness Day, is on accessibility dot day, and I'm not going to spell accessibility. You may have to look that up. It's too many letters and I'll pass it to Jennison.

Jennison Asuncion:

Cool. Well, people can find me on LinkedIn. So, jenison, j-e-n-n-i-s-o-n, and then A-S-U-N-C-I-O-N, happy to chat, drop me a message and happy to hop on a communication platform. We can chit chat. But yeah, this has been great. Thank you for having us. Remember Global Accessibility Awareness Day is always the third Thursday of May. We salute all the companies and individuals who have taken it up. We know some companies have even made it a whole month, some made it a week, some take an hour. Whatever you do to spread awareness, particularly among everyday technologists, because we're all amongst the converted, all of us here around these microphones now, but we need to get the word out to everyone else.

Chris Maher:

Thank you guys. What a treat to have you two on the podcast today. Thank you so much. You guys are the best. So, Joe, Jennison, thank you.

Joe Devon:

t

Jennison Asuncion:

Thank you, Kelvin. Thank you, Chris.

Kelvin Crosby:

Well, that wraps up investing in accessibility and, as I always say, go live beyond your challenges and we'll see you in two weeks.

Kelvin Crosby:

Thank you for listening to Investing in Accessibility, a Samaritan Partners podcast, where we invest in change for accessibility, not wait for change. If you want to follow us, you can find us on YouTube or LinkedIn at Samaritan Partners. If you would like to invest in Samaritan Partners, email Chris at chris@samaritanpartners. com. If you'd like to learn more about us, go to www. s amaritanpartners. com. You can take the first step in investing in change by giving us five stars and sharing this podcast with everybody that you know, so we can spread the word, so that we can give access to all by Investing in Accessibility.