Hearing God’s Voice: Why Perfectionism Leaves You Confused | 027

Hearing God’s Voice: Why Perfectionism Leaves You Confused | 027

Anxiety, fear, rejection and confusion may still feel louder than God's voice.  

The truth? The enemy isn’t after your peace—he’s after your ability to hear God clearly for yourself.

If this resonates, you may benefit from Heather's Prophetic Healing Workshop every 3rd Monday of the month.  Reserve your spot here.

Scripture References
John 16:13 - Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

1 John 4:18 - there is no fear in love but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment.  He that feareth is not made perfect in love. 

Ephesians 3:18-19 - ...may be able to comprehend with all the saints what is the width and length and depth and height— ...to know the love of Christ which passes knowledge; that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.

Romans 12:2 - And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

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Have you ever wondered if you’re really hearing God’s voice — or just reacting to fear, pressure, and the need to get everything right?

In this episode of The Redeemed Perfectionist, we explore how perfectionism can create spiritual confusion and distort the way you relate to God. When your faith has been shaped by performance, fear of punishment, people pleasing, or the pressure to avoid disappointing God, it can become difficult to recognize his voice as gentle, present, and full of grace.

Lenee' is joined by prophetic healing coach Heather O’Brien for a conversation about Christian perfectionism, fear of man, inner striving, control, and the healing process of learning to hear God from a place of connection instead of pressure. Together, they talk about fear of punishment, spiritual confusion, renewing the mind, and what i

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Transcript

Hearing God’s Voice: Why Perfectionism Causes Confusion | 027

[00:00:00] Well, maybe after last episode, you find yourself wondering, how do I actually follow God from this place? Not perform for Him, but connect with Him, walk with Him, do life from the flow of that connection We had talked about so, much of who we've become has been shaped by what we do and how we perform, and measuring success by outcomes rather than obedience.

And then what do you do when you start laying that all down and you're no longer being pulled in direction of your familiar roles like motherhood or your career, and you're left alone in that quiet space asking who am I really? And that's been one of the hardest things for me, is to lay down that measuring stick and rest in the knowledge that I'm enough separate from what I do.

It is hard, y'all. It's hard, 

[00:01:00] but here's where it gets even more tender, because when you start letting go of performance, you might also, start realizing some of the things that you thought you were aren't really you at all, and that can be freeing and it also, can be disorienting, especially when it comes to hearing God.

Because if the voice you've been following has always sounded like, do more, work harder, be better, so, you'll be accepted. Well, what happens when you start questioning if that was ever His voice to begin with, and suddenly it isn't just about changing your behavior, it's. Can I actually trust myself to hear Him clearly?

And on top of that, there's still patterns in your life, habits, things you keep going back to that you know are not life giving. So, today we're gonna go deeper into some of these tensions because. What I found is that breaking free from 

[00:02:00] perfectionism or really any place of bondage, it isn't just about changing what you do, it goes deeper.

It's about learning what has been driving you…asking the question, where is this actually coming from? And I feel like that's where John 16:13 comes alive, that says the Holy Spirit will guide us into all truth when we slow down long enough to get quiet with Him and let Him reveal what's underneath the patterns.

We don't just find freedom. We actually start to recognize His voice again. And if that's where you are finding yourself right now, maybe you feel a little bit untethered, if you will, a little bit unsure. You might be even questioning if you can trust what you're hearing, you're not crazy and you're not stuck.

And we're gonna talk a little bit about that today and maybe you'll walk away with understanding a little bit more about what's actually been shaping the way you hear God and how fear can quietly distort His voice. 

[00:03:00] And then also, hopefully you'll recognize what it can look like to hear Him again from a place of connection, not pressure, so, you can walk away with a little more clarity, a little more confidence, and a deeper sense of peace in your relationship with Him.

Hey there, Sis. It's great to have you here today for this episode of the Redeemed Perfectionist Podcast. I'm your host, Leneé  Pezzano, and in case you were curious, I'm still journeying out of perfectionism, though it is thankfully much more in my rear view mirror these days. Today's topic is near and dear to me because for so, long I obeyed God from a place of fear of punishment, and it kept me in a place where I strove to obey from my own strength, a white knuckling rather than leaning on His grace to help me overcome, and then he showed up in experiential ways.

To reveal His heart for me of mercy and kindness and grace, and it took me a while to believe it was His voice. 

[00:04:00] And if you can relate, then please be sure to subscribe because we have many new perspectives here that we'll get you moving into the freedom you're longing for. And if you're out there on social media, be sure to join the Redeem Perfectionist Facebook community.  There's a lot of women, like-minded that you would be surrounded by friends who can be there when you need them.

MUSIC

Today we've got Heather O'Brien with us. Heather is a prophetic healing coach, minister, author and speaker.  She helps Christians heal with God by hearing God's voice. Heather's also, the host of a top 2.5% globally ranked podcast, Heal With God.

[00:05:00] Heather, welcome to the Redeemed Perfectionist podcast. It's so, good to have you. It is so, good to be here, Leneé . I am excited for this conversation. Looking forward to seeing what the Holy Spirit's gonna do. Absolutely. 

You and I have talked a lot and it's like when you and I talk, sparks fly.

This is a whole iron sharpening iron thing, so, we're gonna have to keep each other on track today. You and I resonate when it comes to a lot of the things around perfectionism and this whole fear of punishment and how we carried perfectionism into our relationship with the Lord.  I think you've said fear of punishment isn't just about fearing Hell…it can actually start way earlier.

How did that work in your life? When did you first notice that fear was shaping your identity and even this idea of being good? 

Yeah. Yeah. This is a new thought to me that the Holy Spirit's bringing, and it's, he unraveled it in me. And then every conversation and client and healing time that I'm having with people, it leads back to fear of punishment.

[00:06:00] And I go back to the scripture in 1 John 4, which I found a long time ago during my healing journey, But it's unraveling still. Yeah. You know how the Spirit, the Word is alive and active and it's, this word is unraveling for me in this season in such a deep, profound way. Yeah.

But that scripture, if I could just summarize, it says, yeah..something that we all are familiar with. It says perfect love expels all fear. Yeah. But then it keeps going, and it says, for if you are afraid, it's for fear of punishment. And before that, and around that, it talks about basically being afraid of going to Hell.

That's Heather's version. Yeah. And that totally makes sense. Like you shouldn't be afraid of going to Hell. You shouldn't be afraid of dying because all of that doesn't matter anymore once you've come to Christ. Because when you die, you get to go be with Jesus. And it, it makes sense in our mind.

But that only makes great sense whenever you're not faced with death. And maybe when you're faced with death, then you have to remind yourself of that. 

[00:07:00] But I found other layers of that in my life lately, that it's not just fear of death, it's fear of punishment by people. And so,, I used to call this fear of man, and now I see it as a fear of man is this umbrella where there's fear of rejection, there's fear of being alone. There's fear - abandonment. Fear of abandonment. Yeah. Abandonment. There's fear of you name it, there's a million different kinds of fear that goes under this umbrella of fear of man. There's also, this word, fear of punishment that goes under there too. And it's almost like that is a brand-new label for the fear of man.

Yeah. So,, fear of, so, imagine fear of man is now fear of punishment what can they do to you? They can make you not feel accepted. Yeah. They can make you feel like a reject. I'm taking my life and feeling this fear of punishment. I found it from fellow believers which is so, hard, so, difficult. And they aren't the enemy, and I know that. Yeah. The true enemy is the the devil, satan. 

[00:08:00] He ha he wants to steal, kill, and destroy us. Yeah. And we have a big red target on our back as Christians, and so, we're not immune from the attacks of the enemy, but they come through people and they come through.

People who have little openings of wanting control and wanting to control people. And I see this in the scripture now all the time. I guess you could interrupt me anytime, but I'm like, now, like every scripture is screaming. They don't have fear of man, they don't have this fear of punishment. I wanna be more like them.

Yes. Yeah. the last year or so,, particularly, maybe six months or so,, I've been presented in a similar way with challenges with people in the body of Christ where, loving them in the midst of, seeing the spiritual dynamic that you're talking about. And I am getting more secure because I'm being delivered more and more from perfectionism.

I'm more secure in my relationship with the Lord. Perfect. Love is casting out fear. 

[00:09:00] So, I find my security in Him, but it's like I still have to love the people around me. And it's don't harden your heart even when you see what's happening in the dynamics with these other people.

Yeah. Even in the body of Christ. That's huge. It is. It is the thing. So,, if perfect love expels all fear, then we have to remember love is three-dimensional. It comes from God and it's supposed to come directly down to us. Phil is so, completely that we actually have overflow. To love other people.

Amen. And then we have to see other people as humans. God created who he loves. Amen. And he died on the cross for as well. Yeah. And sometimes it's so, hard to do that whenever Yeah. They've been mean to us, they've hurt our feelings or this or that. Yeah. But it is that constant, mind battle.

Yeah. we have to capture every thought and we have to make it obey Christ and to do that means I have to see you as a human God created and loves. Yeah. No matter what you do or say to me, 

[00:10:00] I still have to love you. Yeah. And it takes actions, it takes words, it takes intentionality, and it takes a supernatural thing.

Yeah. I think love is supernatural. Can we just get real? Yeah. Yes. Not just an emotion. Yeah, that's right. It's not just emotion that we muster up. It is a supernatural transaction that comes from God. Yeah. And so, in order for me to love you, I need to have love from God. I need to be connected to God. I need to hear what God is saying.

Yeah. And what is he saying about you? What does he love about you? Because I can't figure it out right now. I soetimes I have to do that for my own children. I'm like, God, you're gonna have to gimme more love for them right now 'cause they're irritating me to no end. Yeah. And so,, here's what comes to mind with that, and this is, I think this is so, profound, right?

One of the things that, as God has delivered me from perfectionism and exposed what His grace really means, he says, approach the throne of grace in your time of need. So,, there's something about His throne that helps us tap into a power that we receive that's supernatural to be able to do the thing.

[00:11:00] And he's been really encouraging me to do life with Him. Take Him into the like stay connected to the vine, right? His powers made perfect in my weakness. To your point, we need to be intentional. We need to have practiced and invested and know the Word and then ask Him daily to help us stay connected to Him 'cause he already lives in us.

We tend to go through life trying to do life separately, trying to white-knuckle our way through, trying to love in our own strength. We can't. But see, love is the fruit of the Spirit. Yeah. Exactly. And so, we need His fruit in us. And it needs to be that overflow like you were talking about.

And it's not always, we're not gonna be perfect at it. Let's just be real. But we do get better at learning to surrender and receive and let Him dominate 

[00:12:00] and we take the backseat, if you will. Yeah, for sure. 

So,, when did you first start realizing perfectionism was a thing in your life?

That's I think that's really part of the beginnings of my healing journey. It was realizing that the way that I was behaving in my home, I had anger for really ridiculous reasons. I could we could laugh about it right now, but it was real. Just not being heard. Not being seen.

I would say something to my kids, Hey, I remember this Nerf war going on and I'm like, oh, I have all boys by the way. And so,, there's this Nerf war going on in the house, and I'm like, would y'all stop? Please stop. Would y'all stop? Please stop. And it wouldn't stop. And so,, I wasn't being heard. And that is the thing that really, it just, it starts.

If but your insides start boiling. You start feeling out of control. Yeah. And the out of control it feels like anger. I don't know if I have all of the words. 'cause it's a feeling too, but you say things you didn't wanna say, you behave in ways you wish you didn't.

[00:13:00] It is almost sometimes out of body experience. and the Holy Spirit showed me that this was me not feeling heard. And needing perfectionism. needing things to happen right then, right now. And there's a spirit of control behind it. Yeah. There was a demonic element to this. Yes. Yeah. There was spiritual warfare at play.

My kids were playing Nerf wars, but there was a devil in the midst saying, Ooh, let's see if we can get back at her today. Yeah. Let's see if we can aggravate her today. And that, I would say that was part of my healing journey, and it was a really profound moment. I remember this nerve war thing because the Holy Spirit was showing me.

Do you see what it feels like when this devil is around? Because you, so, I had already cast it out. I had already told it to go, and yet I started feeling it again. And the Holy Spirit was telling me, notice this feeling. Note it’s a out-of-control feeling, is I tried to explain it with all of those words and He said, if you get free of something, you need to know its name.

You need to also know what it feels like when it's around. And so, that's part of hearing God's voice

[00:14:00] to heal and you start noticing, okay, when I feel this particular devil is around. This is the name of the thing that you cast out already.

Yes. And it came back to knock at your door to see if it could come back in, right? Yeah. I did have to tell it to go again. Yeah. So, I partnered with it because I didn't realize it was there until the Holy Spirit made it really clear, and then I told it to go and I don't wanna scare anybody. This was a partnership with the Holy Spirit.

This is what it looks like to partner and hear His voice. And He said, okay, name it, partnership with it. Tell it to go again and then. You take a deep breath. Yeah. And you're like, you again. And it's oh, that was a devil. That stinking thing. He's not getting back to me again. And you start fighting in a way that it's like the devil's gonna regret the day he ever messed with me.

Yes. 'cause now, ooh, I've got some powerful weapons and my arsenal. Yes. And you can too, but you do need to know its name. You do need to know how to fight it. And it's not something to be scared of. It's something to say, oh, this is not my personality. I'm not a perfectionist. This was a devil the whole time.

[00:15:00] Yeah. That's part of my healing journey. Yeah. One of the things I learned, I just turned 31 walking with the Lord and, have experienced a lot and I describe it, like there are times when I feel like there's an actual spirit present right now, and then there are times when I feel like what's present is the belief system and the garden he planted in my soul all those years ago. And it's like he still has a hook in me in those areas. Yep. sometimes we, in the name of Jesus, we will voice it. There's a spirit present and we will rebuke it and it goes, it flees, uh huh, but sometimes we can only be transformed by the renewing of our minds.

I was just fixing to say that verse Roman go too, because that's what deliverance is. It's changing the way you think. Yeah. But also, sometimes casting a devil out. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And we, I think we lack sometimes in the body of Christ, 

[00:16:00] the true discipleship of how do we do this.  How do we be transformed by the renewing of our mind? And what does this look like practically and tactically on a daily basis? Uh huh. 

So, what do you feel like, Heather, you would say to people Uh huh about that? Yeah that's a really good scripture. We talk about it all the time, be renewed in the spirit of your mind, but it also, says, change the way you think, depending on what translation you read. And I wanna remind you of the word repentance. And if you don't know this already, repentant means to change the way you think. It means to be sorrowful, mourn a sin that you participated in, that you don't reach to it again. To actually hate sin is to change the way you think because I think that we get in these cycles in our mind, in our behaviors, the addictions that we have.

We were like, I wish I wouldn't do this thing. I can't quit doing this thing. And the thing is, it could be a devil. You need to cast out. But also, it could be the way you think about the thing. Yeah. And so, I would say to you, if you don't hate sin, you're gonna keep participating in it.

[00:17:00] It's gonna keep being a cycle in your life. And if you think it's just your personality, if you think it, oh, this is just the way I was born, this is just the way I was raised. You're not hating it…you're not acting like it's the devil. That’s not changing the way you think.

Yeah. So, to be renewed in the spirit, to change the way you think means I repent of it. And repent also, means to turn 180 degrees, it means to change, to completely change. I   often think about this with, this client that I was helping he wanted to quit reaching to porn. He wanted to keep quit reaching to these vices.

He's in love with God. He is I know this is a sin. And I'm like, Do you hate it though? Because it doesn't seem like you hate it if you keep going back to it. If you think about a food that you like and a food that you hate.. it was just last week, my husband was trying to get me to eat some kind of greens, and we literally have been married 23 years now.

And I was like, have you ever seen me eat greens? And he had it in His mind that if he was gonna cook it, I would eat it because it was gonna be good. 

[00:18:00] And I was like, wait a minute. Hold on a second. Like you. I literally loath them. I hate them. I've not, I ate them once and I'm not doing it again.

Yeah. And so, he had to get in His mind a little bit differently. Like I had already determined that's not going in my mouth again. I don't care who cooks it, I don't, I'm just not, I'm not interested. And we have to get that way with sin. Yeah. Where I'm not participating in this anymore. It actually is a sin.

It's not good for me. I don't like it. It doesn't taste good anymore. Yeah. But sometimes we just keep tasting it and it, and the more you taste test it, you're like, oh, I could get used to this. 

I used to tell people I used to be a personal trainer and I said, whatever you feed your body will crave that, which you feed it.

Oh, that's so, good. Yeah. Yeah. What's so interesting and complicated about being a perfectionist, and applying what you just said in experience, I had such a fear of punishment. So, going back to 1 John 4:18 that we were talking about…

[00:19:00] when I knew I was in sin and I knew I had to repent, I white-knuckled my way through it versus going to Papa God and being like, Father, help me.  Help me. I couldn't approach His throne of grace. By nature, we don't wanna follow the Lord. So, we're already in an uphill battle because by nature we just don't wanna follow the Lord.

We have to be intentional and choose that. But there were times I was so, weak, and so, my spirit was willing, my flesh was so weak, but I didn't know God's love. So, again, I saw it as He’s honked off at me. I have to go fix myself before I'm accepted in His eyes, before I can even approach Him.

And that was life for me as a perfectionist. Yeah. Yeah, it was a lot harder. 

So, what did it look like for you to begin to hear the voice of God? What was that like for you? Yeah, so, it, it goes hand in hand with what you just said. 

We have to actually experience God's love in order to expel that, fear.

It is actually experiential; it's not just knowledge based. So, you could read the scriptures all you want. You have to read it with the Holy Spirit. So, it's the Spirit plus the Word equals truth, and the Spirit will always give you experiences. And the Word will too, and the Word will never contradict the Spirit or your experience.

But it might challenge you. It might challenge you. Yeah. And so, in Ephesians 3:18-19, there's a great verse there. It talks about love. It says love is four-dimensional. It's high, it's wide, it's long, it's deep. And it's a prayer in there that often I would say to you, I could pray over you, but you could pray over, you open up the scriptures into Ephesians 3:18.

It says, may you experience God's love as all God's people should. Yeah. And it tells you how it's four-dimensional and the thing here is, okay, so, I'm not necessarily a math whiz, but I was trying to do a bible teaching on this for my Sunday school class. 

[00:21:00] And I was asking my husband what's a prop?

Like, how can I give them a prop that explains this? It's four-dimensional. And he was like, there isn't four dimensions. There's three. And I was like, what? But the thing is the cross is four-dimensional. It's long, it's high, it's wide, and it's deep. And that doesn't make sense to those who are in book knowledge.

And it, and I don't necessarily even understand all the math, but the thing is that we understand high and wide. How is high and long different? And how is wide and deep different? The thing is you have to experience it. It is a whole different thing to know it versus experience it.

Sure. And I would say to you, you said, how did you learn to hear God's voice. You know what? I started asking Him questions. Just like you said a minute ago whenever we were talking about something. You said, why don't we ask, God, do you love me? Yeah, I would ask God, what are you thinking right now? And I would hear it.

[00:22:00] I literally, I remember this moment, He said, I love you. And I just started weeping profoundly, profusely. And just three words just overtook me. And I'm like, this is so, ridiculous. Why am I crying? I just heard you say I love you. But it was the most profound thing. 'cause guess what? I experienced it.

Yeah, that's right. Words. That's right. And so, you have to ask God some questions if you wanna experience His love. Yeah. Ask Him and then you hear His voice. So, hearing His voice equals you're gonna experience love that you can't separate it. Oh, it's His liquid love that'll come over you as you hear His voice.

I love nothing more than to hear God's voice and as He matures us in the Lord, He will put you into the testing fire a little bit at times. Where are you gonna trust me when you can't hear my voice the way that you did before? So, He's taken me through that maturation process, but still, there's nothing greater for me than when he talks.  There's such a security it brings and a fullness of joy. It's just a beautiful thing. It's a beautiful thing. 

It's, and I love how you say there's this, there's a process with it. 

[00:23:00] Yeah. And so, you get to know Him. He already knows you, but you get to know how you hear Him. Yes. And you're getting to know Him, but you're getting to know you in the process.

You need to start noticing how you hear His voice. Because for everybody, it's not gonna be the same. I actually have visions. I have visions in the day. I have dreams in the night. I actually hear Him in my internal dialogue word for word. 

Someone the other day was talking about something and I was like, oh yeah, I heard God tell me.  I was asking Him how to heal my high cholesterol, and I heard the word cilium fiber, and I was like, what's that God? And she said, you actually heard those words? And I was like, yeah.  That's it. That's literally how I hear God. Like I literally hear Him sometimes.

Now it's not a moving voice, it's just another voice in my internal narrative, which also means it could be me, right? It could be me. I guess y'all need to hear that, that we have to distinguish it and then you have to have the confirmation. So, I went and I looked up cilium fiber, and guess what? On the bottle it says, this helps with high cholesterol.

And I'm like, alright, then I think I heard the voice of Lord. 

[00:24:00] And guess what? It helped. Yeah. Yeah. And so, there's confirmations that come with that. And so, hearing God's voice is a process of you getting to know how you hear Him and. A lot of this is just relational. Yeah. Just like I'm getting to know what your voice sounds like.

It's just a relationship throughout the day. Yeah. It doesn't have to be for big things. It needs to be for the little things. Yeah. 

What does your relationship look like now with Him and with your family? You alluded to this anger, and that's how you first started to recognize, 'cause perfectionism is a byproduct of this fear and need to control, right?

We need to control the world around us and we end up taking God's place is what we try to do. We actually make ourselves God.

How have things changed for you? 

So, I haven't arrived, but I will tell you there is a difference. And there is a process.  As I've repented, as I've cast out devils, as I've changed the way that I think I respond differently. I respond more quietly. 

[00:25:00] My voice tone is a little different. Like literally on different decimals at times. But there's also, I can feel the bubbling up in, in my insides, like if I can feel that anger.

So, my, I have very strong-willed kids. Not everyone understands what that means. So, if you don't have a strong-willed kid don't try to tell a mom of a strong-willed kid how to discipline them. This is my little 2 cents. When you have a strong-willed kid, they can push buttons you didn't know you had, and it's something to be grateful for.

I turn my prayer a little bit different. Instead of, God, why'd you give me these kids? It's God, thank you for these kids showing me I had buttons that could be pushed because you don't know you have buttons. I didn't know I had buttons that be pushed until I had kids, and now I know, okay, when I feel this way, I'm being tested.

I think God is permitting the testing, if I could be real with you. Yep. And it's seeing where am I at? And I realize, oh, cuss words didn't fly. My voice stayed even toned, but I felt my insides 

[00:26:00] saying it's…are you gonna let them push you over the ledge? Are you? And I realize now I'm able to be quiet.  I'm able to shut my mouth. I'm able to walk out of the room. I'm able to end conversations that need to be ended. I'm able to love in a way, I'm able to pray for them in a way that couldn't be for, and that's a maturing process. Yeah, that's is hearing God's voice.  He, His voice is quiet and He taps you on the shoulder.

He is like Heather, are you gonna respond to that bullying? Because I, I think that, there's spiritual warfare still going on and so, I get to partner with the bullying from of the devil, or I get to partner with Love. Yeah. And I'm not gonna say I've got it all figured out, but I sure notice that I am responding differently in this…Nice… because I'm hearing God's voice, because I'm more and more filled with His love and it is a daily process. There's not an arrival point. 

That's so beautiful to hear. How long have you been seeing progress and how has it changed? Like how you parent now?

[00:27:00] It's been okay, so, I actually literally started writing books through my healing journey. And a lot of it happened because I was finding that I had buttons that could be pushed.

And so, you said how long I…listen, my oldest is 18 now. Okay. And He pushed buttons when he was an infant. He was the infant that no one knew how to take care of. Everyone was like, my baby didn't do that. And I'm like good for you. And so, I had a lot of trials through that and then I had a second baby.

He's the one that could push a button. Listen, if you don't think you had a button, let me just get you around this one. He will show you, you have buttons to be pushed, and he continues to challenge me and encourage me. It's both. And so, he just turned 15 and so, now I'm okay. I guess you need to hear this.

I got free of this perfectionism, which is rooted in control and I'm sitting over here in the passenger seat while he's learning how to drive. 

[00:28:00] Oh girl. Zero control. I don't have any pedals. I don't have the steering wheel. And I'm like, listen buddy. This was like, we were wearing week one. And I'm like, listen, in the most quiet voice I can, if you can't be coachable, we're never doing this again.

And I'm realizing, wow, Heather you have really matured because I'm not losing it. I'm really not. I'm literally not losing it. Yeah. And that's where I can see the healing power of the Holy Spirit in my life, that I could just literally talk to Him in a really peaceful, calm voice if you're not gonna be coachable or not doing this anymore.

And he looks at me and he realizes, oh, she's for real. Right on. And so, there's a lot of healing in that. There's, and it's still, there's always an opportunity to see if I'm gonna partner with God or if I'm gonna partner with fear. And I think we all have those opportunities, right? Absolutely.

What other areas, so, parenting, what other areas did things show up in your life? 

[00:29:00] The control, the fear.

And what did that look like? The fear of punishment is really real, even in my ministry time. So, I learned how to heal by hearing God's voice. And so, that's what I do.

I'm a prophetic healing coach. I help people heal by hearing God's voice to get to the roots of the issues. And as I became radically in love with Jesus and filled with the Holy Spirit, I did things that were out of the box for some of my other Jesus-loving friends. And as it was out of their box the fear of punishment became real because I didn't necessarily do it the way that they would've loved it to be done.

There was times when I cast out devils before I led someone to Jesus, and it was a whoopsie daisy. I..I was just excited. I saw a devil. Let's cast Him out. The person was ready. Yes, I don't wanna deal with this anymore. And then the next day I led Him to Christ. Guess what I mean? It still happened, but it was outside of that box of the norm.

And I started getting their feedback and, oh, you didn't do it right. 

[00:30:00] You messed up. You're not supposed to do it that way. And there was that fear of punishment that kind of started to hush me. She started to silence me, started to hold me back, and my God-confidence. Got locked in a cage if I'm real.

I really felt like it got locked in a cage. Not for just a season, but my season was years. Like this has been something I'm just coming out of where I'm just like, no, I'm done being put in a cage. I actually think that part of that was my maturing process. That God allowed it. Yeah. But also, now He keeps giving me dreams in the night and He is -- come on--come on girl. 

Let's do this again, because I loved it. I was so, radically in love with Jesus and the power of God that was evangelizing. Yes, all the time. Everywhere I went I was evangelizing and that even rubbed my family the wrong way. Heather, can we not just sit at dinner and not talk about Jesus with all the waitresses and I'm like.

But I love that. Yeah. Yeah. I feel called to that. I'm madly in love with telling people about Jesus. 

[00:31:00] And then also, praying for their healing and deliverance. I don't care who they are. Like if we're getting groceries, if we're at the, and so, the fear of punishment has been real in my life, even in ministry.

Even in the things that I'm really passionate about Jesus. And that is a maturing process in itself. Yeah. That it's and it has become part of my healing journey of oh, I was fearing their punishment. They might tell me that I'm too much. Yeah. Yeah. And I see that now and I'm like, you know what?  I just don't care anymore. 

Yeah. I have to get like the disciples they got put in jail. Yeah. And they were like whatever you wanna do God -- if it's under jail, okay, but I'm gonna preach the Gospel and I just have to get that way in myself. And that's part of Being healed. That's part of my healing process is getting over this hump of whatever people think.

Even if they've got titles and they've got Yeah. They're part of the fivefold and this and that, and I'm like, listen I gotta follow what God's saying. I gotta do what the Holy Spirit is leading me to do. He's showing me that they're full of the devil, and yes, they need to get delivered. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:32:00] I love that He, you're not lukewarm. You're not lukewarm. 

I'm not anymore. I'm done with being lukewarm. Yeah. Perfectionism, people pleasing, striving, exhaustion from trying to perform. It's all fruit of another gospel. It truly is. And. Galatians is one of my favorite books because Paul really tells them, who cut in on what I taught you?

And why are you trying to perfect yourself and be justified by your works? Let Him be accursed who tries to follow a different gospel is what he says. I find it super exciting the more I also, get delivered and realize how much He loves me. And it's oh, you just want it for everybody else, Uh huh, and you see the brokenness.

He'll guide. He's guided me to be quicker to listen and slower to speak. Yes. 

[00:33:00] He's guided me to remember that, sometimes we have to give to somebody little by little, we don't give a whole bottle of medicine all at once. We would kill somebody. Yeah. Yeah. But I think the intentionality of investing time, getting quiet with the Lord, getting in His word, getting into Him.

Like just into His presence is really the way we begin to usher in that voice and then truly overcome. For sure. 

What other things do you hope to share with our listeners today that we haven't already talked about? 

I think we hit the nail on the money.  Always the perfect love cast out all fear, and really, if you're in love with God, He doesn't want you to be anxious for anything. He doesn't want you to be fretting and to be worrying about tomorrow. Tomorrow has its own worries of itself. And so, I would say be present with the Lord, because that's where He is.

He's right here, right now. He said, I’ll never leave you or forsake you. So, He's not in the future where your mind's wondering what if this, what if that 

[00:34:00] He's not in the past where someone has hurt you and betrayed you. And I know those things weren't right and they weren't okay but forgiving -- it doesn't mean that they were right and okay.

It just gets you right with God. And so, I would love to welcome your listeners to come over and listen to my podcast, Heal With God. Yeah. Or join the workshop that I have every month, on the third Monday of every month. I have a free live Prophetic Healing Workshop, and that's where we just do a little three step prayer model to get to the roots of what's really ailing you…what's causing that depression, what's causing that anxiety? What's causing the fear of punishment? And maybe you've been struggling with a certain addiction or bondage and you just, you wanna get free, you love God, but you're stuck. I would love to help you get unstuck. 

If you wanna join that workshop, it's Heather O'Brien.net/workshop.

That's Heather, O-B-R-I-E-N.net/workshop, and I'd love to get to know you and see you there. That's awesome. 

Heather, thank you so, much for being here, and 

[00:35:00] I will drop those links and information in the show notes and just bless you, sister. Keep being you. Keep using that voice of yours. Thank you.

Leneé:  It is a powerful thing when you start walking from a place of alignment with the voice of God, and if you're just starting out, it's okay. Please know that He desires nothing more than to spend time with you teaching you how to hear Him and how to obey Him. He longs to bring the word to life in you and empower you to follow Him.

He's not asking you to do this walk by yourself. I talked about the measuring stick that I had a hard time letting go of. I used to measure myself and basically conclude that I'm not progressing fast enough or I'm not good enough. Things like that. And the reality was. He measures differently.

He measures progress like a parent who's proud of their child or so, excited that their child has grown another inch. 

[00:36:00] So, just a whole different perspective and heart than what I would ever conclude previously, and it's way more fun. I can tell you it's way more fun finding that security in Him and walking with Him through the journey.

Remember to subscribe so you can keep coming back when you need that reminder that He is in it for the long haul, Sis, and He's got you…one step at a time. 

 If you're itching to know what's coming up next, we are stepping into a conversation that could possibly change the trajectory of your walk with God. 

What happens when you love the Lord deeply and you would do anything He asks only to realize somewhere along the way, the way that you learned to obey him wasn't actually aligned with His heart?

And that was not because your heart was wrong, but because something underneath it in your foundational theology and belief system was off. In the next episode, we go deeper into the tension we talked about today, and we cover what it looks like when sincere devotion gets mixed with subtle deception, and then how God gently begins to untangle it. I have a feeling this one might meet you closer than you expect. 

I'll meet you there.