Swati Hegde on Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt and Second Chance Romance

Second chance romance has been testing my boundaries lately. After years of avoiding the trope, I am finally seeing the appeal of a hard-earned reunion. Today, I sit down with Swati Hegde to discuss her new book, Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt. We explore the sharp tension of the courtroom, the massive differences between the Indian and US legal systems, and the importance of writing neurodivergent leads with depth and soul. 

Swati Hegde is the author of Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt, Can’t Help Faking in Love, and Match Me If You Can, as well as the young adult romance As Long as You Loathe Me. She is also a freelance editor, mindset coach, and self-proclaimed coffee shop enthusiast who lives in Bangalore, India, and can often be found at the nearest café with a hot mug of tea or singing her favorite songs off-key at karaoke night. She looks forward to a long career bringing Indian stories and voices to light. 

In this episode, we're discussing:

• Swati breaks down the procedural differences in the Indian legal system, including why they do not use juries and how civil law shapes the courtroom experience.
• A conversation regarding autism representation that prioritizes the internal life and personality of the character over a clinical diagnosis.
• Why second chance romance works best when the characters have spent years developing the maturity needed to handle a relationship.
• How Swati navigated the complexities of legal research to ensure her courtroom scenes felt grounded and realistic.
• The significance of reflecting Indian family structures and traditions in a way that feels natural and lived-in.

CONNECT WITH SWATI HEGDE:

Website

Instagram

BOOKS/AUTHORS MENTIONED:

Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt (Amazon)

As Long as You Loathe Me (Amazon)

Can’t Help Faking in Love (Amazon)

Match Me If You Can (Amazon)

Running list of books mentioned (Doc)

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Y'all know how I feel about second chance romance, and I think that this season has tested that idea, and we've got some new episodes that we have already recorded going into next season. These second chance romances are coming for me. I'm going to blame Babe in Library Lisa for pushing the universe to make me read these second chance romances. But I really enjoyed this one. Today we're talking with Swati Hegde all about her brand new romance, Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt. This one was so much fun to read, but we learn more about Swati's writing style. We learn about the things that she does to research the stories, but also the differences between the Indian legal system and the US legal system, and more about the different aspects and the culture that's reflected in her stories. That's it. I think I'm convinced. I kind of like second chance romance. Listener discretion is advised. This podcast contains mature content intended for adult audiences only. Hello, SWATI. I'm so excited to have you on. And I want to make sure that we say your name correctly here. It is Swati Hegde. And you have a new book coming out. But before we get into all of that, which I'm so excited for you guys to hear about this book, it's fantastic. Tell us a bit about who you are and your author journey.

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Yeah, absolutely. Alicia, thank you so much for having me on. First of all, I think doing podcast interviews is always so much fun for me because it's so directly connected to a fellow lover of romance, but also the your general audience at large. And it's just so much fun. I love podcasts. So for all of you who are listening, my name is Swati. I am an Indian author living in India, which is pretty rare for the US publishing landscape. So my author journey has not really been very linear. It's been like so many ups and downs. It's like a literally a roller coaster ride, and I hate roller coasters, so it was not fun. I started querying literary agents in 2018, like fresh out of college. I didn't sign with my now agent until 2022. And I signed with her on my sixth manuscript that I queried.

SPEAKER_00 2:27

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

Which turned out to be my debut, Match Me If You Can. And then the second book that my publisher took me on for was my fifth book that I queried, which died in the trenches. So it was a really good sort of proof that a book isn't ever really truly dead. Like you can always resurrect it if you find the right agent and if you find the right publisher. It's actually been really interesting. I got my book deal for Match Me Fe Can in 2022. It was a two-book deal. And then in 2024, the same year Match Me If you Can came out, I signed another two-book deal for my YA romances. And then I signed the book deal for Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt. And honestly, since then it's been difficult because as of 2026, I think three projects that I pitched have been rejected. And we're trying to get one of them published with a different publisher. So we're on submission with that right now. I'm also working on a romanticy book, which is a little out of my comfort zone, but I'm really trying to get into it. And I'm really thrilled about this idea. I'm working on a speculative YA novel about mental health. And I also have an idea for another second chance romance, a second chance contemporary romance, inspired by my own love story.

SPEAKER_00 3:46

I'm so curious. Did you always want to be an author? It sounds like you were probably writing maybe as a teen or during college, and I'm curious what your degree is for. So tell me a little bit about that.

SPEAKER_01 4:00

So the first thing I ever remember wanting to be, I think I was like six years old, and back then I was obsessed with clothing. So I used to sketch the ugliest pieces of clothing on any sh any blank sheet of paper I would find. And I would tell my parents, I want to become a fashion designer one day. And then my dad said, There's a lot of drugs and alcohol in the fashion industry. And keep in mind that I'm literally six years old at this point. And my dad very sternly tells me, I forbid you from becoming a fashion designer. Pick literally any other profession, I will support you. And around that time, my mom had started reading out like picture books and just chapter books to me and my sister. And I vividly remember her reading out like the Cinderella picture book to me. I still remember the cover. It's like blonde Cinderella running away, running down the staircase away from Prince Charming, and he's holding up her shoe. I vividly remember that edition of Cinderella. And I remember thinking, this is such a cool story. Someday I want to make someone feel like that with the story I wrote. Then I think I wrote my first like book, or rather, it was like a 50-page story when I was, I think, eight years old. It was really bad. I think Jasmine and Aladdin were secondary characters in that book, along with Barbie. So it was really a horrible idea. I don't know why I even wrote that. And then my sister told me, hey, these are copyrighted characters. If you publish this book, you're gonna go to jail. And I said, okay, let me write something original. And then over the next like few years, through high school, through college, I wrote a lot of books. But it wasn't until I think I graduated college that I decided, okay, let me do this for real. Let me actually try to make some money out of it. And asked your question about what I studied in college. I did a degree in business and marketing because that was my backup. In case the writing thing didn't work out, hey, at least I have a degree, I can do something to feed myself. But thankfully I've never had to use that degree because straight out of college I started querying agents, but I also started my own editorial business. So that's something I still do to this date. I do developmental edits for other authors, whether they're querying authors or indie authors. And it's a really good career path for me because as you edit more books, you become a stronger writer yourself. And that's really helped me with my writing career too.

SPEAKER_00 6:27

Yeah. Oh, that's so interesting. I can imagine one, I'm guessing your sister is older, an older sister.

SPEAKER_01 6:35

Yeah, my sister's uh five years older than me.

SPEAKER_00 6:38

Yes, because I'm the oldest sister of five, and so I'm like, I can imagine me saying that to one of my siblings. I get that you want to do this, and also you're gonna go to jail. Like maybe figure yourself out. So definitely understand that. Okay, that is so fascinating.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

And I write slow burn romances that are agonizingly slow burn. So a lot of my one-star reviews and five-star reviews will say this book was so slowburn. People either hate me or love me for it. And I'm totally happy with that.

SPEAKER_00 7:11

I think with slowburns, sometimes the love has to be deserved. You know what I mean? Depending on the story, right? Some stories, a fast burn makes sense, but I feel like there is something so delicious about that slow burn. I'm actually thinking now about a book that had a slow burn and I wanted to throw it because they were just about to. And she was like, you know what? I and I'm like 80% into this book. Oh my god. Okay, it is a slow burn. And she's like, you know what? I really want Italian food. And I was like, what? I am gonna lose it. Oh my god. The book is called The Wall Banger. It's been around for quite some time. But I think because the guy was a little promiscuous and there was a lot of wall banging because they were neighbors, that they saved all of the actual book banging for the very end. And I was like, Oh my gosh. Okay, so now I know what I don't like, which is 80% of the book waiting for things to happen.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

Yeah. It's funny because uh Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt, the book we're gonna be talking about today, I feel like it's simultaneously fast burn and slow burn because it's a dual timeline. And in the past timeline, they have this steamy summer fling, which they literally hook up on day one of meeting each other. But then in the present timeline where they reconnect at the same law firm and they're both co-workers, it takes, like I said, an agonizingly long amount of time for them to get together. And you know what? I'm proud of that. I'm proud I could pull off both in one book.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

Honestly, and we've talked about this on the show before, second chance is not always my favorite. Yeah, but I actually really loved the way that you portrayed this, where you had the dual timeline, and I think having one is more of a fast burn. And so to give people an idea, it they're in Goa, they're in a hostel, forced proximity, in the same room, but of course, both of them are coming off of quite a bit of a heartbreak, wrong answers only, kind of summer fling, also like a bit of a like a fuck it honeymoon list because she was supposed to be on her honeymoon and she has a list of things that she wants to do, and he helps her achieve all of those different things, which I think is so fun and exciting. And so they quickly get to know each other, quickly get into action, quickly fall in love on his part, and maybe a little bit on hers. Yeah. But then it just stops, right? But I what I loved about how you portrayed this story was that yes, that part happens throughout the whole book, but the increments of what you see then make you like, I need to know what happened at the end of this summer fling, which keeps you going. Because you're like, all right, yeah, I get what's happening then. I understand what's happening now. They're both lawyers at a law firm. They have to work together to represent someone who did not do the crime, or so they say, dun, dun, dun. And you have to like kind of also the murder mystery-ish of now, but then the behind the scenes of back then, and then going back and forth. It's like you gotta know what happened. Both of the endings of these stories. And so I absolutely loved it. Didn't feel disjointed in any way, which I really appreciated. So, what all went into writing this story? You are not a lawyer by trade. And from reading the book, it made me my eyes wide the hell open that the law system in different countries, even developed countries, are very different than ones that I maybe see reflected on TV or ones that I've seen in the United States. And so tell me a little bit about the Indian law system. And I know you did lots of research for this. What all went into that research?

SPEAKER_01 11:16

Researching Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt was like one of the hardest things I've ever done in my life. And I have published, I've gotten five book deals in the US while living in India. And I still think doing the research for this book was probably harder than that. Um, I think the main reason for that is because even when you live in India, you're exposed to so many American TV shows and books. And the legal system in the US is so different from the legal system in India. And I had to do so much research. On one hand, I was looking up scenes from how to get away with murder while also looking at training videos from lawyers on YouTube who are like their target audience was law students in India.

unknown 11:58

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 11:59

So I was like doing both at the same time, and I was like, oh my god, this is so difficult, this is so different. The two biggest things that are different in the Indian law system versus the American law system, I think, is in India, lawyers are not allowed to solicit clients. So you cannot advertise yourself as a lawyer in India. I don't know why. I honestly don't know why, but the only way you can promote your work is by doing pro bono work and taking on pro bono clients or doing like charity-sponsored events. But you literally cannot advertise yourself apart from having a website that just has here's our team, here's what we do. But you cannot have a call to action of here's why you should work with us. I don't know the reason for that. Maybe it's to prevent like the really big corporate law firms from taking over and having a monopoly. I'm really not sure why that is good. Yeah, so actually mentioned that in the book as well that Indian law firms are not allowed to solicit services or advertise their services. The other really different thing is that we don't have the jury system in India. So if you want to win a case for your client, the only person you have to convince is the judge. Literally nobody else. And it's funny because I think up until I don't I don't know how many years ago, like a few decades ago, India did have the jury system. And then I think there was this landmark case where I think the guy was accused of really brutal murder or something really horrific. And for some reason the jury unanimously decided to say he's innocent. And the judge was like, What the fuck? This is not okay. And then I think since then that was the landmark case, and since then they were like, Okay, we're scrapping this this jury system, people are getting swayed. Citizens don't really know the law the way a judge would know. I guess that's their rationale, and so that's why they were like, let's just do a judge deciding the verdict system. And so in Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt, there's no jury that they have to convince or sway, it's just the judge. Which I guess in some ways is easier and also more difficult because with a jury, at least you can take on different angles of like how to convince the jury based on the people in the jury. But with a judge, it's one person decides the fate of your client. And in some ways, that's really terrifying.

SPEAKER_00 14:20

Yeah, I can imagine it. And then I'm even thinking with a jury, it at least you got 12 people that you have to pay off, whereas a judge, it's just one person that you might have to pay off, depending on how ethical those judges are, right? So fascinating. I remember you mentioning that in the book, I think it was the 70s, that they had gotten rid of it. And I thought that was so interesting. And so, yeah, very different from the legal system in the US, which I'm not saying is perfect in the least bit. And I do not think is perfect. I think that it'd be interesting to see what a perfect jury judge system would look like. Who knows? I'm not a lawyer, I don't know. So you have this kind of murder mystery happening on the now timeline of the story that also has a lot of because it's so high profile, there are actors and actresses that are involved in this. What went into that side of the research, or was it just this is fun and I'm having a blast?

SPEAKER_01 15:22

It was this is fun and I'm having a blast. The really funny thing is, and I think my editor was like spot on with this. Where in the first draft of the book, the first few chapters, I sold this book on proposal. So I hadn't written the whole book before we got the offer. So in the synopsis, the initial synopsis of the book, there was no murder mystery. There was no murder case. It was a sexual assault case between an actress and her director. And my editor was like, you know what? Why don't we put a murder mystery legally blonde spin on this? And I was like, I guess I could try that. It's a lot of research, but sure. And then I kid you not, literally two days later, we found out Blake Lively and Justin Baldone, that whole thing happened. And I was like, you know what, I actually don't want to write about this because people were going crazy about that on social media. And I was like, I am not stepping into that territory. I don't want people to think I based it on them. And of course, I knew people would assume that. So I think my editor had sixth sense or something. I don't know how she came up with that, but I'm glad she did because I really love the murder mystery subplot in this book. It's so fun. And having this sort of film industry, like the movie industry, subplot of an actress allegedly murdering her director of her comeback film, who she had an affair with years ago. Is it's so convoluted and it's so complex, and it's such a fun whodunit mystery that I really had so much fun plotting and unpacking. And since I was a young girl, I always wanted to write a murder mystery. I just didn't know if I had the brains to do it. But now I guess I do. So that's good to know. And maybe someday I'll write an actual murder mystery, just focusing on that. But there's gotta be romance in that too. I cannot write a book that doesn't have romance.

SPEAKER_00 17:09

No, I totally get that. Yeah, it gives a almost knives out kind of vibe to me. Because you're like, you know all the characters, you maybe have an idea of maybe who done it, but you're also not really sure until you're sure, right? So I I really, really liked that aspect of it and had fun reading that part because I was like, I want to understand. And then the fact that the lawyers are doing quite a bit of the secondary research, the police reports do not seem like they're fully fleshed out.

SPEAKER_01 17:43

That's realistic for maybe for the United States as well. I don't know, but in India, if there's a really high-profile case and the public is like, this is the person who did it, the cops will more often than not just be like, Yeah, we want to pacify the public. Let's just go with that. And I think in high-profile cases, especially, it's like you want to wrap it up quickly. The cops want to wrap it up quickly and be like, hey, we put this person behind bars so we can just get done with this whole the paparazzi and the press and all of them hounding us and the people hounding us on social media. And so I think in cases like that, it's so difficult to really know what's going on and really hope for justice. So I'm really glad my main characters were able to figure out the who done it part of it, and I'm glad I was able to figure it out. I had to be the one to tell them who did it.

SPEAKER_00 18:29

So you pulled it off. I love it. And I think we see it in the US too, with police force where they do want to appease the public, or maybe the chief of police is up for re-election and things like that. There's so many behind the scenes that can influence that. Now, in the story, getting them a little more into the Indian culture and the Indian background in the story, it does take place in India, like you mentioned, both your main characters are Indian. You have the male main character. One thing that I really found unique about him and his experience was two things. One, he's bisexual and hesitant to be open about being bisexual, which makes sense. And then you have a situation with his sister where she was in an arranged marriage, ended up getting divorced, and then was disowned by the family because of that. So let's talk a little bit more about what went into maybe that aspect and how you used either your own experiences or the experience of people that you know to portray this in a way that felt authentic.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

I think writing a bi male main character was really important for me because I think it was just a few years before writing Love Beyond Reasonable Down, I came out as bisexual. And I kept noticing that in so many romance novels, not just Indian romance novels, but just in general, I always noticed it's very likely for the female main character to be bi in a male-female queer romance. And I was like, that's so interesting. And then I looked around at my daily life and I realized, huh, I have male friends that are bi, but a lot of them are really not open about it because I think bi men are really stigmatized so much more than bi women. For some reason, I think it's the whole toxic masculinity thing. I really don't know. And biphobia is so rampant in queer circles, even apart from the straight community, like queer people are also so biphobic sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 20:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:34

And especially towards bi men. And I just wanted to write something that would resonate with romance readers, but especially bi-romance readers, and also destigmatize Indian men being bisexual and just men being bisexual in general. As for the thing with his sister, I actually know a few people that's happened to, like when they've had an arranged marriage, it didn't work out for a multitude of reasons. I am very anti-arranged marriage, by the way, which is something that not a lot of people would agree with in India because half of my friends from college have had arranged marriages. And I'm like, it's lit with literally in 2026. Like, why are you having arranged marriages? But a lot of people find love through arranged marriage. I just haven't really seen that happen in most of the arranged marriages I've known. I've had a few friends who, after their arranged marriages didn't work out, they decided to get divorced, and their parents were like, Okay, if you do this, we are never gonna speak to you again. So in India, a lot of people say India has one of the lowest divorce rates in the world. And that is not because people are madly in love in India, it's because divorce is highly stigmatized in India, and in a lot of scenarios, the woman physically cannot leave because she's so dependent on her husband for money, for food, for a roof above her head, and even if she decides to get a divorce. So parents are. Gonna be like, you do that, you lose your husband, you lose us too. Because what will people say? And I wanted to really show Tejas, my male main character, being progressive enough to realize, hey, my sister's not in a happy marriage, I'm gonna support her. Fuck my parents if they don't agree. And so throughout the course of the book, he's not in touch with his parents, they aren't a part of his life. He's not open to them about being bisexual, one, because it's none of their business, and two, because they're clearly not gonna be open-minded about that.

SPEAKER_00 22:31

Right.

SPEAKER_01 22:32

And there's also a scene in the book where when he comes out to Nena, our female main character, he's actually anxious at first of how is she gonna react to this? Because we're literally hooking up, and I'm gonna tell her that hey, my ex was a man. But she takes it so well, she's like, so what if your past involved a man? You make me feel good right now, and that's the only thing that matters to her. And that was also really important for me to show because again, fuck biphobia. And also just make my politics really clear. Because I don't think there's quite a few romance novels that don't really make their politics clear, and I don't want to be one of those. I didn't want that to be my readership. So I made that abundantly clear or where I stand politically because reading is political, romance is political, life is political, and I wanted to make that really clear.

SPEAKER_00 23:21

Yeah, oh my goodness. Okay, so as a bisexual woman who's married to a man, there's a lot of that erasure that happens. Well, you're not a real bisexual woman because you're in a relationship with a man, and then even seeing the fetization that happens with bisexual women of oh, you want a third for a couple, that never sets. Oh my god, that's not that's not my thing. Let's just be clear on that, right? So there's a lot of that that happens, and then from the queer community, we get a lot of pick a side. When is that's I don't want to have to. My sexuality is not determinant on that. But then I also think as you were talking, it made me think of even the I know with the AIDS epidemic that happened in the 70s and 80s. I want to say it was 70s and 80s in the US, but don't quote me on that. There was a lot of fear of men who were in relationships with men and being sexually active with them after that. And I think that the media just twisted that in insidious ways that they like to bring fear towards these men who needed support, right? And it needed the to be taken care of, quite frankly, as they were suffering. So yeah, I think there's so much to it that's ugh, but I love that you had a bisexual male main character and Nena, how she approached the whole thing. She's just like, and yeah, exactly. Okay, she was respectful to him. Like, she could tell you clearly tell he was anxious and hesitant to say something, but she's just like looking at him like blank face. Yeah, okay, what's the point? Let's get to the point of this conversation. And so really loved that part. Now, in Goa, they stay in a hostel, and you should have seen my brain misfiring constantly as I'm reading this. And this is such a US thing for my brain to be doing, and so I apologize in advance. I had a whole conversation with one of my team members talking about the book, and I was like, I didn't know that people stayed in hostels. Yeah, like I've seen them in like movies and stuff, but I didn't know that that was like a thing that people did. And she was like, Yeah, Alicia, they do. And I was like, I don't know, I've never been outside the US, so it's probably my fault that I didn't know this. So for people who are like, wait a minute, what is a hostel? And why would they be in a hostel and be sharing a room together as strangers? Give us a little rundown of that.

SPEAKER_01 25:52

Yeah. So hostels are first of all really, really inexpensive. And I think when you're traveling, like in the book, they travel in Goa for I think it's two weeks. And that's a huge chunk of time to be on vacation and spending so much money on like a hotel room. Right. Because hotels are not cheap in India. And unless you stay in a really good hotel in India, like it's gonna be like really weird. You might not get like great food, or it might be in a really shady neighborhood. So your options are usually like stay in a really good hotel or maybe get an Airbnb, but usually one person's not gonna get an Airbnb just for themselves. Right. And then you have the option of these youth hostels, which are really a nice way to also find community while you're on a solo trip. Because not only do you get to stay in this room, which you might have to share with another person, but that's cheap and a great way to meet someone new. But also everyone in the hostel is gonna be probably from different cultures. They're all here to experience the beauty of the city that you're visiting and you're vacationing in. They're all gonna be most likely on either solo trips or in like a couple, and they're really eager to make new friends. And I think for both Nena and Tejas, this trip to Goa was all about I just wanna be free. I just wanna be myself. For Tejas, it's about I wanna forget about my ex who just got married to someone else. And I was at his wedding being the best man because we used to be best friends and his family thought we were best friends and not a couple.

unknown 27:33

Right.

SPEAKER_01 27:33

And so for him, he just wanted to be free and maybe make use of the jumbo pack of condoms in his suitcase. And what better place to do that than at a hostel with probably really good crowd of people around. And for Nena, one of the things on her anti-honeymoon checklist was stay anywhere but a hotel room. So she said no to the honeymoon suite at the Taj Hotel, which she was supposed to share with her cheating ex-fiance, and she's like, let me just go to a hostel and see what that leads to. I have personally actually never stayed in a hostel on vacation. I've stayed in one while in college because that was cheap. And my college did not have enough dorm rooms because I was in Mumbai, and Mumbai does not like historically does not have enough space for everybody who's living there. So yeah, I stayed in a hostel while I was in college for a year, and then I was like, I need to get an apartment. I cannot share a room with three other girls. That's not happening. I'm not doing the whole bunk bed thing. Like I'm 19 years old, I'm not doing this shit. But yeah, I've never actually lived in a hostel on vacation, but I know a lot of people who've done that. And it's a fun, inexpensive way to get to meet new people and just have a lot of fun. So yeah, that's really why I wanted to include that because honestly, how else are they gonna meet in the book? Right. Like it's gotta be some sort of force proximity pushing them together. And I was like, okay, it's gonna be a hostel.

SPEAKER_00 29:00

Yeah, your choice definitely makes sense for the story progression and moving the story along. But yeah, my brain was just like, what? Why? What is happening? But yeah, I think it's so interesting, especially because both of them are lawyers, right? So they're probably making a pretty significant financial again. I don't know because then the system's a little different than in the US. But I know in the US lawyers make pretty good money. Is that the same in India?

SPEAKER_01 29:30

I think they make decent money. It's not like you're gonna be out on the streets or sharing an apartment with five other people. That's not gonna happen. You can probably afford to have your own place, even if it's smaller. And you can live a comfortable life. I don't think you're gonna be making enough money to stay in like a good hotel for two weeks straight without burning out a significant chunk of your finances.

SPEAKER_00 29:53

Yeah, that definitely makes sense. Okay, so my one question that I have as I'm thinking about this idea of them being lawyers, Nana's on the partner track. She wants to be partner so bad. And one thing that I loved about this story is her being a woman in a predominantly male office, right? Yeah. And the misogyny that can happen with that, also the people that can have your back and can say, no, this is what she did, and this is how she should be compensated for it. And so I thought that aspect was so interesting. People who listen to the show know I worked in manufacturing for quite a number of years. So, like one of five women to about 100, 150 guys. And being in male-dominated fields is very normal to me. And so I loved that aspect. Why was that part important for her growth as a character, but also for placing her kind of in this more male-dominated space?

SPEAKER_01 30:54

Yeah. I think someone like Nena, who's had a really rough experience with not just relationships with men, but also I I think just in in the law system or like just a legal field, I feel like even in India, you throw a rock at a law firm, it's gonna hit a male lawyer. Even if you open up like a law firm's website and you look at their our team page, it's mostly just gonna be men. And so for Nena, who's so ambitious and she has so many goals and dreams, and like she's the kind of woman who's gonna prioritize her career over a new relationship. And once she gets into a relationship, it'll probably be like balancing both. But for her, like her career comes first. She has big dreams, she wants to be able to live a good life, especially support her father, who's retired but is a single dad, because her mom went off to chase her dreams of becoming a singer, which is another element of the story that I really wanted to explore. Because you often hear about these dads who like leave the family and they're like, I'm gonna chase my dreams. And so I really wanted to show that her mom is the one who does that. And the thing I really try to focus on was like not painting her mom in a bad light for that. Like she just wanted to chase her dreams, and Nana wants to chase her dreams as well, but in a very different way. In a way that she's doing it not just for herself, for her future, but also for her dad, and to be able to give him a good life as well, even after he's retired. And that's why she stays with her dad instead of getting her own place, because one, they're really close, but also she wants to be there for him because he doesn't really have anyone else. And so the misogyny thing, I really wanted to explore that because A, misogyny exists everywhere, but especially in the career field of lawyers, and also with the case focusing on an actress who's been accused of murdering her director and the misogyny that comes with that, people calling her a homewrecker for her affair with him when she was 19 years old and he was significantly older than her, and clearly he was grooming her, right? But people don't care about that because he's a famous director, he's got money, he's got the charm, he's worked with everyone, he's got sway. So, of course, this innocent young woman must be the one who's problematic. And so I really wanted to show that the many layers of misogyny that come across in my book, like whether you're a lawyer at a good firm or you're an actress in a really good film industry, you're gonna be affected by misogyny because unfortunately that's the world we live in, and we have to talk about it if we wanna work on eradicating it.

SPEAKER_00 33:34

And I think it's so important too to have the male allies, right? And not just people who stand by and say nothing, right? Because that's not necessarily an ally, but the ones who do stand up and say, No, this needs to stop, or this is a problem, or we need to do something different here, or they did such a great job. Let's make sure we recognize them. And I've had people like that in my life who've made such a difference. And as a mom of boys, I'm constantly reminding my boys that they will most likely always have more rights than I ever will. And because of that, they have a duty and a job to protect the people around them and the people that they care about and the people that they don't care about to ensure that everyone has uh equal playing field in their career or in their life or whatever. And yeah, it's such an important part. And I love what you said earlier that reading is political. I guess we use it to escape a little bit sometimes or to fall into these love stories, but so much of it is a reflection of our own experiences. And it doesn't matter if it's sci-fi or speculative or fantasy, right? Like we're thinking Star Wars. We could draw some analogies from Star Wars in the world we're living in right now. Like there's always something about the human experience that we could pull from that I think is yeah, it's so political. And I don't think we can escape it. But I think that these stories where we can see this reflected people standing up and people making a difference can really help. And then your story also has a second chance, which we talked about beforehand. Neither of us really like second chance romances. And this story has seen you at your worst and at your best. So tell us a bit about your own second chance romance and how you maybe use that to help fuel this story.

SPEAKER_01 35:30

Yeah. So I started writing this book, I think, in December of 2024, when I was in uh a really toxic relationship that my friends were like, she needs to get out of it. But I was very delusional, rose-tinted glasses, even though everything was murky gray, I was like, no, I don't want to be single again. I'm just gonna make this work. And I hate that I was in that mindset, but I think when you're in a relationship and you've had horrible experience on the dating apps, you're just like, I have to make something work. And while I was writing this book, I saw a lot of red flags popping up, and eventually I was like, okay, I have to get out of this. And so January, when I think I was probably like 20,000 words into writing this book, I ended things with that guy. And it's very difficult to write a romance novel when you're right at the beginning of a breakup and you're just like people suck, love is dead. I hate being single, but I also hate being in a relationship like that, and so it's just really difficult. And so I was in a bit of a writer's block situation for a bit, and then funnily enough, I reconnected with my best friend from high school who had also just gone through a rough breakup a few months ago, and he'd just overcome that breakup by then, and he really helped me overcome mine, and then next thing I know, we start dating. And the funny thing is, this was actually a second chance romance on its own because we were best friends through high school, and then in college, right after my first boyfriend broke up with me in college because I have bipolar disorder, and when he found out he couldn't handle it, and yeah, it was really shitty, but that's life. Yeah, and so I was in this mindset, like I was 20 years old, and I was like, nobody's gonna love me because I'm broken and I have bipolar disorder, which is such bullshit. I was 20 years old, had my first heartbreak, I didn't know any better. And so my high school best friend, who was still my best friend at the time, he flew in to see me and cheer me up. And this fool takes this opportunity to tell me he's in love with me. Oh my goodness. And I'm like, okay, this is interesting. And I think that whole weekend we try to like date and be a couple, and I was like, I'm not ready yet. Like, this is not gonna work out. I don't think I feel that way about you. And he was like, if you didn't feel that way about me, then what are these two days about? What is this weekend about? He was completely blindsided. I was super blindsided by what I had done because I was like, I should not have let him on, but he also should not have told me he loved me right after my breakup. So, you know, we were both 20-year-old kids with very different ideas of what love looked like, I think. And so we decided to not talk for a while, and that turned into I think six years of not speaking to each other. And then over the years, after the pandemic, I think we started to talk again a little bit because we were both like you don't know what life is gonna take you. It's you need to value the connections you had or have. And we talked every now and then, we didn't really mate in person as much, even though we were we ended up in the same city again. Uh and then I think around the time of my breakup, I was reaching out to him more, telling him about this horrible ex of mine. And he was like, you know what, we should just mate and rant about our exes. And I was like, deal. And so we met properly for the first time in I think eight years at that point. And the first thing I noticed about him was that he had grown a beard. And beards are my kryptonite, okay? And I was like, okay, I'm in trouble. And then, like, literally a month and a half after that, we just started dating, and it's been the best relationship of my life. We actually got engaged in February on Valentine's Day, which was a really beautiful memory. It was the best day of my life. I was actually in Atlanta for the Love Y'all Romance Festival, and right after my panel, he proposed, which was just so amazing. Someone caught it on camera, and that's one of the best videos I've ever seen. Best proposal video, in my opinion. I may be biased, but best proposal video ever. And yeah, I think my relationship with him as I wrote the rest of the book really helped me sort of get that second chance element into play because I was like, huh, I guess this can actually happen in real life, which I never thought was possible before. Right. I would not want to be in the same room as any of my exes, like ever. Like you cannot pay me to be in a room with them. I'm like, once the door closes, it's closed forever. But I guess with my now fiance, that door was always slightly open, and it was just waiting for a gust of wind to come by and just completely open it. And I guess that's what happened. And now I am a believer of second chance romances. There you go.

SPEAKER_00 40:22

So sweet. I love that some like cheesing so hard when I love love. So I love that so much. And I agree, you could not put me in a room with any of my exes. Most of the time, when I think about them, I'm like, oof, dodged a bullet there. Yep. And so, yeah, I can't imagine it in real life, but I love that it happened for you. And what an incredible way to be able to write this story as you're living your own second chance. And maybe that's why I felt like this one was done so well that it was so believable to me. Because I can suspend my belief for a lot of things. Second chance, I don't know about all that, but I felt like you did it so well in a way that felt really believable. It felt like these people maybe were not ready to be together just yet. And then now we're at a point where balls in her court. What is she gonna do? Yeah. And then she makes the decision that she makes where there is that second chance romance. Oh, so good. Okay, before we wrap up, for people who because yes, this is we read smuts, so we do tend to read more adult romances. I know there are quite a few people that do read YA. So could you give us a quick rundown of what people can expect in your YA imprint and stuff like that as well?

SPEAKER_01 41:33

Yeah. So currently I have one YA book out which came out March 31st, so just about a month and a half before my release of Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt, which is a crazy timeline for an author to promote her books. So as long as you loathe me is my YA romance. Obviously, because it's YA, I did not want to write any spice in it. And one thing I really wanted to make distinct between my YA romance and my adult romances is my YE romances are all in first person present tense. And my adult romances, which have increasingly gone spicier with every book, are all in third-person past tense. So this was like something I really wanted to make to differentiate, just for the sake of differentiating my voices for my two different audiences. And so while my debut adult romance, Match Me If You Can was entirely closed door, and then the second book, Can't Help Faking in Love, had one scene that was like Fade to Black. Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt has a bunch of open door scenes, but I wanted to focus more on the emotional aspect of the spice than the graphic sexual aspect of it. The main reason for that being my father reads my books, and so I was just like, let me do my part of writing the spice I want this book to have because it is a summer fling. It is this book where they're both extremely horny for each other, right? But also my dad. So let me just try to figure out how to cross that line, but also not entirely cross it. And so that's how the spice in Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt was gone. I would probably rate it like 2.5 to 3 chili peppers, but I know everyone has their own scale. So, you know, read the book and find out is all I would say. And that would also really help me with my book sales and my reviews. So yeah, please read the book and then decide what chili pepper you would assign to it.

SPEAKER_00 43:20

Perfect. And slide in our DMs and let us know what you thought about the book after you read it. Definitely go check it out. Swati, this has been so much fun. Thank you so much for being on the podcast and sharing about your journey and all the things that went into writing this incredible book. For anyone who wants to connect with you or slide in your DMs, whatever is the best place to buy your books and connect with you?

SPEAKER_01 43:43

To buy my books, you can just head on to the Penguin Random House website and just search for Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt. There will also be links on my website, which is Swatihegday.com. I'm super, super active on Instagram. I post like literally every day. So you can follow me on Instagram, it's at SwatiHegday.com. Author, simple as that. Just look up my name and you'll find me beaming at you from my profile picture with all of my silly reels and my silly carousel posts, which I love making. But then when I look at the stats and the engagement, I'm like, why did I make this? But hashtag just authorlife. So Instagram and my website are the best places to find me. And yeah, I really hope if you're gonna read my book, whether you get it from the bookstore, your favorite indie bookstore, like support indie bookstores, y'all. Yes. Whether you get it from an indie bookstore or like Barnes and Noble or online or even just from your local library, because libraries are so helpful to the reader community. Whatever you do, I hope you buy my book or borrow my book and enjoy reading it. But even if you don't enjoy reading it, please do leave a review because that really helps other readers. And it helps me as well. So, Alicia, thank you so much for having me on. And yeah, I really hope people enjoy reading Love Beyond Reasonable Doubt.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

Me too. I thought it was fantastic, and I absolutely love what you did with it. So thank you.

SPEAKER_01 45:05

Thank you so much.