Historical Dramas and Korean Folklore with Claire Kohler

S1 E9 / We’re talking Joseon era dramas, nine-tailed foxes, and Korean food in this episode!  

🪄💗 Claire Kohler, Kdrama fan and author of historical romantasy and steampunk murder mysteries, joins me to talk about historical Kdramas, irresistible tropes like Girl Disguised as a Guy and Forbidden Love, and genre-blending in dramas. 

🐉 🥘 Claire also shares her love of Korean culture, including Korean food as well as Korean folklore, which she’s incorporating into her books.

⚠️ Spoiler warning! Our wide-ranging conversation touches on the following shows: 

• You’re Beautiful  
• The King’s Affection
• I Can Hear Your Voice
• I’m Not a Robot
• Sungkyunkwan Scandal
• Love in the Moonlight 
• Goblin
• What’s Wrong with Secretary Kim
• The Secret Life of my Secretary
• Avenger’s Social Club
• Tale of the Nine-Tailed

Current Watching/Rewatching: The King’s Affection, When the Phone Rings, 

Claire Kohler: https://www.clairekohlerbooks.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:15

This is the How I Met My K-Drama podcast, and it's all about K-drama origin stories and recommendations. I'm Sarah Rosette, and today I have player Kohler here. How are you?

SPEAKER_03 0:26

I'm doing really well.

SPEAKER_02 0:27

That's good. I tripped over your last name. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_03 0:31

That's okay.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

Kohler, right?

SPEAKER_03 0:33

Yes. Like the Stinks, but I am not related enough to get any money from. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 0:38

Well, that's a shame.

SPEAKER_03 0:40

Well, tell us a little bit about yourself. Okay. Well, I am I'm an author, an editor, wife, mom. I wear a lot of hats. Um I write historical romanticy books, and I recently co-wrote a steampunk murder mystery with some other authors, friends of mine. Uh I live in North Carolina with my husband and two kids, and I lead Bible studies at my church. Cool. Sounds like you were so busy. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:12

But you still have time to watch K-dramas, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:15

I have to make time for them, but yes, they're too important not to make time for.

SPEAKER_02 1:20

Yeah. Well, tell us how did you get into K-dramas? Do you remember what your first K-drama was?

SPEAKER_03 1:26

Yes, I do. Uh I started watching them back in 2011 when my best friend in high school recommended them to me. Uh, the first one I ever watched was Your Beautiful. Oh, okay. It came out back in 2009. And it's still a good one. It's it's a good one, but uh I've expanded uh into a lot of other genres now too. Okay, cool.

SPEAKER_02 1:54

So it was a personal recommendation somebody tells you about it. Yeah. Most of us don't have anybody in our lives who also watched K-drama, so that's kind of cool that you had somebody to immediately talk to about it.

SPEAKER_03 2:06

Mm-hmm. And then I shared it with uh all of my family members. So then I had a bunch of other people to talk about them with too.

SPEAKER_02 2:13

Nice. Oh well, I wanted to ask everyone who comes on for a top five list. So five favorites of it could be like your overall five favorites, five favorite rom-coms, five favorite things you go back to for comfort watches. So um give us your um top five and kind of tell us is it themed or is it just your overall top five?

SPEAKER_03 2:34

Uh well, I was thinking about uh what would be just my overall top five. These are all ones that I have re-watched at least once, some of them many times now. Okay. Um yeah, okay, cool. So my top five would have to be The King's Affection, I Can Hear Your Voice, I'm Not a Robot, Sung Yang Guan Scandal, and Love and the Moonlight. Those would be my top ones.

SPEAKER_02 3:04

Okay. So for people who aren't familiar about that, can you tell us just a little bit about each one? Just kind of a little summary. I've heard I've heard of like the King's Affection, and um, but I haven't heard of I Can Hear Your Voice. So the King's Affection is uh body swap, right?

SPEAKER_03 3:22

Yes, it's where uh it's a historical one, Josun dynasty, where the prince is born with a twin sister, but twins are considered to be cursed, terrible. I'm lucky. So the king tries to have her killed, and even though it's his own granddaughter, and so her mom smuggles her out of the palace, and then she lives away from them, but through a series of unfortunate events, she ends up in the palace area again, and then her brother gets killed because they think that it is her. The baggers think that it's her, and so in order to keep her from getting killed, she ends up having to take her brother's place as the prince. So that's very fun.

SPEAKER_02 4:18

Um yeah, and it sounds very sounds actually kind of dark when you just list it. But I've seen the previews for it, and it's on my list of things to watch, and it's actually looks like it has a lot of humor to it as well, and it's not um somber, I don't think, right?

SPEAKER_03 4:34

Right, yes. That's one of the things I really like about K dramas is that they oftentimes will blend a lot of different things together. It may have some really dark moments, but it also has a lot of light-hearted moments, too. So I that's one thing I really enjoy about K dramas in general, but that one especially.

SPEAKER_02 4:53

Yeah. Okay, and then your other one, your second one was I Can Hear Your Voice, right?

SPEAKER_03 4:57

Mm-hmm. That's an older one. Uh, it centers around um a lawyer who witnessed a murder when she was a child, um, and she and the boy whose dad got killed um are I guess you would say they are kind of hunting the guy who did it. Um, not hunting per se. He went to jail originally, he gets out of jail, and then they're afraid that he's going to try to hurt them again. Yeah, and um, so there's a lot with the lawyer elements to it, a lot of cases that they do, but um there's also the thriller element to it, um, and there's a strong romantic element too.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

Yeah, very cool.

SPEAKER_02 5:48

Okay, and then I'm not a robot was next. And so I've I've watched that one. I love that one. What did you love about that one? It's such a bizarre premise.

SPEAKER_03 5:58

It's so much fun. Really strange premise. Uh well, the characters are it's really sweet. I feel like the way that they uh the two the main leads really grow each other and see things in each other that they don't see in themselves. And it's really neat too because the other characters, even the minor ones, you can see a lot of growth that happens throughout the series. So that's one thing I really enjoyed about that one.

SPEAKER_02 6:27

Yeah, that was one of the early ones I watched, and I was so surprised that everybody had a storyline, even the minor characters, and I thought it was really well paced. The structure was really good because it didn't have a lot of lag, and I was like, oh, we're getting the full storyline about her, him, and then all these like supposedly minor characters, but I just I love that. I thought it was great.

SPEAKER_03 6:50

That was really well done.

SPEAKER_02 6:52

Yeah. And then what was your fourth one? I didn't get it written down.

SPEAKER_03 6:55

Uh the fourth one was Sung Young Guan Scandal, which is also an older one. Okay. That one is another historical one. Um that is an academy setting. Okay. And that one is that one is a lot of fun. Uh it really centers around four students rather than just two main leads. So I really enjoyed the friendship dynamics that they have between them.

unknown 7:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

So sort of an ensemble cast then.

SPEAKER_03 7:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:29

Okay, cool. And then Love in the Moonlight, right? Was the last one.

SPEAKER_03 7:33

That one's another historical one. I I really like the historical ones.

SPEAKER_02 7:38

Um, yes, that one is that one Josen as well?

SPEAKER_03 7:42

Yes. Um, most of the ones I've watched have been in Josun dynasty. That one seems to be more popular for K-dramas. Uh, I've watched a little bit um in the Goryeo dynasty, but not as much there. Um, that the Love and the Moonlight one is uh set in the palace, and the male lead is the crown prince. And so you get to see more of uh the political intrigue in that one as well. But it also it's also very funny.

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Cool.

SPEAKER_02 8:16

All right. Well, this is a good list. I like it. We've had I've talked to some other people, and we haven't had a whole lot of historical uh dramas talked that people have talked about, so this is good. I'm glad that you're bringing the historical.

SPEAKER_03 8:28

Yes, I love the historical ones, and thankfully uh my husband also likes the historical ones, so he is happy to watch them with me.

SPEAKER_02 8:37

Yeah, I haven't really gotten into the historical ones yet. So like I'm that's like a it's I feel like I'm still learning about the Korean culture and how to do things. I feel like that's like an even bigger stretch for me. So maybe I'll pick up some of those later, but it's good to have a list of things to try. Well, is there a K-drama trope that you just can't resist if you see a a certain trope, you're like, oh, I'm watching that. Doesn't matter what the description is.

SPEAKER_03 9:05

Um well, there are there are two big ones for me. Uh I still care about the description, so if it sounds terrible, even with trope, I will do my best to resist. But uh the big ones for me are when one is when the girl has to pretend to be a guy. Those are just so funny. Uh-huh. Those are hilarious to me, and they offer a great um amount of angst between the two leads. So I enjoy those a lot. Um, and then the other one is if there are fantasy elements in the story, even if they're really light, like in I Can Hear Your Voice that I mentioned before, he can actually read minds. But that's the only fantasy element in the whole thing. It's not really a fantasy drama, but they've just got this one small thing. Um, but then there are others where it's the main story, like in Goblin, which is also a great drama, where the male lead is a goblin and he's prophesied. There's a prophecy that he's going to die once his bride appears and removes a sword from his chest that has been in his chest for 900 years. So it's very different sort of fantasy from the other one. But yes, I I really enjoy the ones with the fantasy elements in them.

SPEAKER_02 10:27

Yeah, and they do have uh so many of the K dramas have some sort of even just uh smidge of fantasy, you know. Many like the office rom coms don't. But yeah, I've been surprised, and I actually wouldn't have thought that I really enjoyed it. I do. So I think that's fun. Discovered something else that I enjoy. Do you have it? Sounds like you gravitate towards the historicals. You like those. Um, are there any other like tropes or um types of K-dramas that you especially like to watch?

SPEAKER_03 11:03

Well, one of my favorite tropes in general is forbidden love stories. So if there's one where there's a really big reason why they can't be together, then I'll be very interested in watching those.

SPEAKER_01 11:17

Yeah, okay, cool.

SPEAKER_02 11:19

Can you I'm let's see, I was trying to think of do you have like if someone loves forbidden love, is there uh can you think of one off the top of your head that you would recommend? Um if not, it's okay.

SPEAKER_03 11:31

Well, one that I've been watching uh recently that is quite fun was um What's Wrong with Secretary Kim? That's a fun one where uh yes, it's between the boss and the secretary. So uh could be one that people who like forbidden love stories would enjoy.

SPEAKER_02 11:51

Yeah, I um was looking for something pretty light the other night and I started watching um The Secret Life. Excuse me. The Secret Life of My Secretary. Have you seen that one?

SPEAKER_03 12:03

I haven't tried that one.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

Yeah, it's good. It's pretty, yeah, it's pretty funny, pretty light, and it does have that kind of but it's got some other things mixed in there. It's not just an office rom-com. There's some other things going on, but I'm liking it so far too. So and it does have that kind of barrier where they it's hard, yeah. The boss the uh falling in love with boss trope, I guess, or the the boss falling in love with secretary troops. Well, um, how has K-drama watching impacted your writing?

SPEAKER_03 12:36

Well, in a lot of ways, uh it really birthed my love for Korean culture and also the folklore. I've I adore Korea culture now. It's one of the I would say that uh as an autistic person, it's definitely become one of my special interests in general. Just I love all things Korea. Um so I am actually writing a series right now that is set in the Joseon dynasty about Gumeo and Goblins and Grim Reapers, and I'm hoping that the first one out uh at the end of this year. So we will see. So that's that would be the biggest way that it's gonna impacted my writing. Um it also has been really encouraging to me as a writer because watching K dramas has shown me that you don't have to stick totally to one genre.

SPEAKER_01 13:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:37

I know that in the author community there's a big emphasis on making sure your books fit into neat little categories. I understand that that makes them more marketable. But some authors like myself are not good at market at writing to market. Yeah. I am a type four on the Ineagram, and I am autistic and have ADHD. So my tastes don't fit most people's tastes, and that is okay. A drama has really shown me that you can still make that work. Uh, the way that they blend things and still make a cohesive story is wonderful. Um, so knowing that I can write what I love, even though it is weird, uh, and there's still an audience out there, that's something that's been a big encouragement.

SPEAKER_02 14:30

Yeah, and I think sometimes those smaller audiences are the ones that are the most passionate because if they find something they love and it's hard to find it, then they're like, oh, I need more of this, and they want your books instead of just, you know, some any book in this category will do. They're they have a hard time finding their favorite content. So it can be, you can get really loyal readers that way. Well, um, why do you think I mean we talk oh before we go on, I was gonna ask you said you're a big fan of Korean culture. So do you have any Korean foods that you like to eat? Or uh because I have not ventured into Korean foods yet.

SPEAKER_03 15:10

Well, Korean barbecue is wonderful. Uh-huh. Uh bulgogi, the meat, it's it's very good. Uh and I have tried kimchi and I just cannot get into liking the kimchi. Uh, just not a fan of that. Um, but yes, the meats are very good. There's a Korean restaurant near where I live, and it was so much fun to go because one, it was all you can eat, which is awesome. And two, you are cooking your own food like how they do over in South Korea. So you have the little grill right there in front of you. So that was a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

Yeah, that's funny. I guess it depends on where you live if you have the ability to have, you know, a Korean restaurant or Korean uh goods, I guess you'd call them, or supply, you know, staples, I guess you could get for cooking. My husband did go to Korea on a business trip, and he said they went out to eat at one of those places, you know, where they they you cook your own food. And it was a big group of Americans. And I guess the woman who owned the place didn't trust them, and she came over and grilled everything and cooked everything for them. And they tried to take over and like, you know, to cook some of the meat, and she'd slap their hand away. She'd be like, no, no, you you don't cook. So that's really funny. So yeah, that would be fun. Um, I have heard some friends of mine have tried baking the eggs, like the sauna eggs, that um that they've done it in a pressure cooker, so it was really good. So I might try that. But okay, so back on subject here. Um we've talked about it a little bit, but why do you think K-dramas are so addictive?

SPEAKER_03 16:58

Okay, so I I feel like I have a very good answer for this. Uh I think that they've really nailed the formula for what people, or at least a lot of people, want out of a TV show. They follow a very specific structure. Yes. Most of them are 16 to 20 episodes long, which gives you enough time to be drawn into the world and fall in love with the characters. But they're also short enough that they, for the most part, don't get too repetitive.

SPEAKER_01 17:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:29

You can even predict when certain things are gonna happen uh in the story. For instance, if you have a romance in this story, you can almost guarantee that there will be a kiss at the end of episode seven or the end of episode eight. They will probably get together in episode twelve. They might get one episode of fluff that everyone loves, but then they'll be dramatically ripped apart, probably at the end of that same episode. And that is that's that is almost guaranteed that that's how they will go every time. Yeah. But even though I know going into it that that's what's going to happen, I still love it because the writers have they just really know I feel like what people want and how long to keep going with certain elements of the story, when to move on to something else. At least the ones that are the really good dramas.

SPEAKER_02 18:26

Yeah. And I feel like there's nothing like we love genre fiction for a reason because we know exactly what we're getting. And and maybe like K dramas have their um pattern that they follow, but then by adding, blending in some of these other elements and different tropes, it's it can be very different. It can you can get a different experience watching each one. And then I feel like the characters have more depth to them than we might see in a movie because you have more time to explore and find out about their backstories, and then you find out about all their family and friends, and of course everybody's all connected. So I think that contributes to, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:05

Yes, the connections can be a lot of fun. There are a couple where I'll feel like this is getting a little too cliche, where okay, everyone knew each other when they were children, okay. But for the most part, those connections can be a lot of fun the way that they play with the dynamics between the different characters.

SPEAKER_02 19:26

Yeah, I think so. And I do like it when you start out and you don't know everybody's connected, and as the story goes along, you realize, oh, this person that we've been following along is actually lives in the same building or you know, works in the coffee shop or something. And so you and you begin to see, oh, or that's the sister or the brother, and you begin to see these connections that aren't visible in the beginning, which I think that's I think that's interesting to see how they bring it all together.

SPEAKER_03 19:53

Yeah. I think that kind of gives it almost a small town feel as well. Yeah, it does. Even though most of these are set in the cities, you get the sense that everybody knows everybody else. And so I I feel like that familiarity um is almost nostalgic as we watch it.

SPEAKER_02 20:13

Yeah, I agree. Yeah. Well, what makes a standout K drama for you? Is there any couple of elements that that just you're always happy to see that that you really enjoy?

SPEAKER_03 20:27

Uh for me, a standout drama would be one where I love more than just the main plot and the main couple. One where I'm also invested in the subplots and I really am rooting for the supporting characters in whatever it is they're learning or aiming for. Uh not to the point where I don't want the main couple to get together if there's a second guy trying to get into them. Don't break them up. Which is so wrong. But yes, when it's uh multiple characters beyond just the main two that I also really enjoy. Um, that was one of the reasons I really liked Sung Guan Scandal, was because all four characters change and they grow significantly and they interact with each other in different ways that evolve throughout the series. So things like that really um yeah, they are really great to me.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

Yeah, I like that too. And I feel like uh a lot of times one of the things you get in K-drama is like the three friends, and you get to see, like you have a main character, but then oftentimes she'll have two close friends, and you get to see their different types of lives and and really explore that. And uh I just watched one called Avengers Social Club. It's on um Apple, I think. And it's about three women who become friends, they're kind of sort of it's almost like a first wives club. Type scenario where they want to get revenge. But in the end, it's much more about their friendship. But it's interesting because like one is young but very wealthy. And then another one is not as wealthy, but she's very unhappy in her marriage. And then and there's problems. Oh, and then the third one, she's widowed and she's older. So it's like they're all different ages, different social status. And so I like seeing all that play out. I think it's just interesting and fun to see that I like that. That's another thing I like about them.

SPEAKER_03 22:32

Um yes. They do a good job, I feel like, with a lot of them where they'll have different, they'll have different age groups of the actors too. And it's not just young actors that have a big role to play, which that can be fun.

SPEAKER_02 22:47

And it's fun to see somebody who's in a subplot in one show and then you see them later as a main lead somewhere else, or you see them in another show, and you're like, Yes, have I seen that person? You have to track them down.

SPEAKER_03 22:57

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 23:00

Well, do you have any K-drama disappointments? Anything that you were like, this is not for you.

SPEAKER_03 23:05

Oh, yes, uh definitely. You're such a long time viewer. You probably haven't had so many. Um, but I also am just not going to continue with the show if I don't like it pretty early on. I'm just, nope. I have other things I could be doing. And I'm sure there are better shows out there. So if you don't seem like you're gonna be good in the first couple of episodes, I usually am moving on. Uh one specifically would be uh Tale of the Ninetailed. I really wanted to love that one, and I was really into it in the beginning, but it just got too it was too dark and too scary for me. So I just had to stop watching it, and I hated it because it was about Gumio, and I loved that. Um, so it was just I I I just got too scared watching it.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

Yeah. Well, I mean, they're not all going to fit everyone's taste, and so that's kind of why I asked this question because if somebody's going along and they like everything you're talking about, then that might let them know, and maybe give this one a pass or whatever. But how so how many episodes do you give a show before you're like, eh, I don't think this is for me? Do you have an episode?

SPEAKER_03 24:17

Usually only one, but if the the description was really good, I may give it two, but like a lowly way there. Or I've I've I've got ADHD. I just I'm not gonna stick with it.

SPEAKER_02 24:28

Yeah, I mean, I figure if you give them if you give them an hour or two, that's a lot of time in my mind to set up a story. And if you can't do it by then, then I'm kind of like, I don't know. I don't know if you can if it's worth 16 to 20 hours of my time. Yeah. Well, do you keep track of your dramas that you've watched in any way, or did you just go in and enjoy?

SPEAKER_03 24:50

I used to keep track of them, uh, but since I've been watching them for so long now, it's way too many. Um try to keep track of them all. I just keep track of the ones that I really like.

SPEAKER_02 25:02

Uh at your point. Yeah, your best of the best, right? Yeah. Well, if you had a friend who had never watched K-drama, and it sounds like you did this with your family. Do you um do you have uh something that you would recommend? Um, how would you go about recommending K-dramas? Uh, if somebody wants to try and convince somebody to watch a K-drama.

SPEAKER_03 25:26

Well, I actually had this very exact situation last year because I made a new friend, which is always awesome. Um and she wanted to try it out. She'd never watched a K drama before. So I said, Okay, you can watch it with me. It'll be awesome. And I told her pick contemporary or historical first off, because that makes a huge difference in what you're going to get. So she said, Okay, let's go with historical. So I just picked my favorite, which is the king's affection, because I was like, Well, I'm just gonna give you the the best that I can offer.

SPEAKER_02 26:02

Did she enjoy it?

SPEAKER_03 26:04

Oh yeah, uh, we're both very busy moms, so uh it takes a long time to get through a full 20 episodes. Uh, but we've been watching one to three episodes a month together for several months now.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

Oh, nice.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Wow. And such I don't know that I would be patient enough. Although if you've already seen it, then you know what happens.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

I've seen it multiple times. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 26:27

I think that would be hard to be patient with somebody else who is watching it with you. Yeah. Well, what are you currently watching now? Other than are you still watching the King's Affection with her?

SPEAKER_03 26:37

I am. I am still watching it. Uh, and I have been watching the What's Wrong with Secretary Kim with my husband? Off and on. I just finished When the Phone Rings. Oh, highly recommend that one. That one was so good, except the last episode. Could have gone without the last episode.

SPEAKER_02 26:57

I know that. And I feel like everybody was really disappointed in that. I mean, I was too. I enjoyed all of it except for that little trip to Argon. I could have done without that.

SPEAKER_03 27:10

Where did this come from? It didn't match the rest of the characterization uh for the guide. Like, why would you do this? And why Argon? It's totally out of nowhere, has nothing to do with the plot. So it was like they just threw it in there to give themselves a little more time. So yeah, that part was displayed.

SPEAKER_02 27:31

Yeah. But you would still recommend it, right?

SPEAKER_03 27:34

Oh yes. Maybe just skip that last step.

SPEAKER_02 27:38

Yeah, I would recommend it too, because I think the first part was so well done, like the the uh hooks at the end of each episode and how you got the epilogues that showed you more. The epilogues weren't just filler, they you know showed you more of what it had happened in the history and the story. I mean, it was just so well done. And then it just kind of fell off a cliff there for a little bit. Yeah. So okay, well, cool. Well, um, anything else you want to talk about about K-drama or K drama watching or anything?

SPEAKER_03 28:15

Just that I'm very excited that you started the podcast. Thanks for starting this. It's always awesome to get to chat about something that I love so much. So thank you.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

Well, yeah, I mean, I figured it's like my hobby now is watching K-dramas, so I might as well talk to other people about it and see what they like about K-drama too. So it's worked out great.

SPEAKER_03 28:38

Oh, and also uh, if you want another source for watching K dramas, I have a I have very few subscriptions. I I don't even have a Netflix subscription anymore to w go back and watch certain things. Um I just I bought the Kings of Fiction, so I have that one. But one thing I am do have a subscription for is Vicky, because that has so many Korean dramas. It's got Chinese and Japanese dramas on it too, but that's a good one.

SPEAKER_02 29:10

Yeah, and they do have new content every once in a while that comes out that are like all the time. They have stuff that's exclusive just to Vicky. So you can see some of the new stuff too, as well as some older stuff. Yeah. Well, tell people where they can find out more about you and your books if they're interested. And you said your book that's uh historical uh was going to be out this year.

SPEAKER_03 29:33

The plan is to have it out this year, yes. It is a historical fantasy romance. Uh it is called Gumio Kiss. So the main character is a Gumio who moonlights as a vigilante in in her city, and then her new fiance is very worried about her safety because there's a vigilante in her city. So he hires a bodyguard to protect her from the vigilante, and the bodyguard is the male lead.

SPEAKER_02 30:04

So it was very cool. Okay. And that's a great title. People who know what that means, like I didn't, I'd never heard of that before I started watching Cateron, but who people who know that term will be like, ooh, this is interesting. So it's great. So tell where do you have you have an author website, right? Where is that?

SPEAKER_03 30:22

I do. It's uh www.claircohlerbooks.com. And then I'm also on Instagram and TikTok at ClaireCohler Books.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

Perfect. Okay. Well, I'll put those show those links in the show notes so people can find your book. And I think that's great that you're incorporating that into your writing in such an interesting way. So that'll be cool. Looking forward to it.

SPEAKER_03 30:47

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 30:48

All right. Well, um, if you enjoyed this episode, please take a few minutes to write or review it wherever you listen to podcasts. That will help K Drummer fans find the podcast. And I'll see you next time. Bye, everybody.