Almost Fans
Two friends, women, and moderately knowledgeable sports enthusiasts bring you Almost Fans. We dive into the drama and behind-the-scenes stories of mainstream sports like the NFL, NBA, soccer, and more, while shining a spotlight on incredible women making waves in the game. Along the way, we share our personal experiences as working moms, exploring modern parenting, pop culture, and entertainment. It’s fun, relatable, and perfect for anyone who loves sports—or wants to learn to love them. Join us weekly for laughs, insight, and sports talk you’ll actually enjoy!
Almost Fans
040: Simone, Naomi, and Why Mental Health Is Performance Health
When Simone stepped back in Tokyo and Naomi walked away from the mic, the world paid attention. Their decisions didn’t show weakness—they redefined strength. This episode explores the rise of mental health awareness in sports, the science of sport psychology, and how athletes are proving that mental resilience is just as critical as physical skill. From sports gambling pressure to the youth sports grind, we break down why mastering the mind might be the most important game of all.
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Chapters
- 0:00 - Sport Psychology Unveiled
- 5:00 - Simone Biles' Olympic Challenge
- 15:00 - Naomi Osaka Sets Boundaries
- 25:00 - Kevin Love's Panic Revelation
- 35:00 - Prop Bets and Mental Strain
- 45:00 - NCAA's New Mental Health Rules
- 55:00 - Mental Health: Your Winning Edge
So, what I hope that our listeners hear from Simone's story is that mental health can oftentimes be an indicator that a break is what's needed, that actually taking time off and stepping back is performance care.
SPEAKER_02:Have you ever wondered why people get so hyped about their favorite sports teams? Well, it turns out it's not just about the game, it's about the community. My name is Taryn.
SPEAKER_00:And I'm Amber. Welcome to Almost Fans, the sports podcast that's fun, a little bit educational, and will give you plenty to say when you're trying to keep up with those die hard sports fans in your life. Welcome back to Almost Fans, the podcast where we dig into the stories, the moments, and the people that make sports unforgettable. But before we dive into that, we've got our hat trick segment. Taryn and I agreed on the topic ahead of time, but we haven't compared notes until now. Today's hat trick topic is top three favorite drinks. Taryn, will you get us started?
SPEAKER_02:Oh my gosh. Okay, so favorite drinks. So simple, but not because holy cow, there are a lot of great drinks out there. My first favorite drink, okay. Don't call me an alcoholic, okay? Two out of my three are alcoholic drinks, but lessen up. They're just they're a treat, okay?
SPEAKER_00:And the third one's caffeinated for sure.
SPEAKER_02:Well, you know what the third one is if that's the other two. So okay, and then so the first one is none other than the brandy sweet old fashioned.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, that a girl.
SPEAKER_02:You probably don't even know what you're missing on one of these unless you have lived or have been in Wisconsin. I'm not even a full Wisconsinite by any means, but this one thing, the people of this state, we've got it right. The old fashions should have brandy in them. Period. Not whiskey, not bourbon, and they should be sweet. Muddled orange, cherry, sugar, bitters, topped with seven upper sprite, and another cherry and another orange.
SPEAKER_00:All the soup, all the people, the weird preserved fruit in the world.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, yes, there's no other way to have an old-fashioned. If you get an old fashioned in any other state, in any other place, it's wrong.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Yeah. Even if you say a brandy sweet old fashioned and they don't know sweet and they get the brandy, they're not gonna get all the other components. So don't even try it. Just come to Wisconsin, basically.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. My first one, I don't drink this often, but it is so good. And I meant to buy the ingredients for it, and then I forgot on July 4th weekend. It's a homemade strawberry mojito, like with all the crushed strawberries and mint. Mint.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, mojito was like a close number four on mine. I love a mojito. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, same. And I love them in the summer, but I also kind of just like them all the time. Yeah. So yeah. Strawberry like stuff. Strawberry mojito. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What you got next? Your next cocoa.
SPEAKER_02:Number two. No, no. So number two is my caffeinated beverage, and it is any flavor of latte. So more often than not, it's like vanilla latte or caramel, and it's usually hot, but don't tempt me with a good time. I'll try a butterscotch, a salted caramel, a maple syrup situation. The barista tells me it's phenomenal. I can be convinced and I will try it.
SPEAKER_00:Okay, can we just take a quick pause? You know, those people out there who are like, I'm really not picky. And then they like totally are, or at least moderately are. Taryn is not. Homegirl will eat or drink anything.
SPEAKER_02:I thought you were gonna say I was that person. I'm like, really?
SPEAKER_00:No, anything. I've never seen you turn down a single food or beverage or nothing. Nothing else. I always say I'll try anything twice. I believe that. I'll get Taren coffees once in a while, and I'll just walk in and be like, I don't really know. Like what looks fancy and seasonal right about now? And it's usually something like, yeah, caramely or maple-y or sugary or vanilla. Yeah. So it always works. Um you might not believe this, but my number two is also a vanilla latte. But to be, I know I miss it. I don't drink them anymore, but it's my like, oh, they're so good. But specifically, I know it is a treat. Specifically from that little coffee shop right off of the square around the Capitol building. Um, and on a morning in August when we're doing the cross country picnic, when we're doing an e a picnic event, and it we've finished all the stuff. We're just waiting for the people to arrive and we're just chilling in a really pretty place. Drink it, but like that one. Yeah, it's a good vibe drink. There's that cute little coffee shop. I never remember the name of it. I just know where to walk. It's like down that it's always right by the same place. We yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, anyway, that's my number one.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. My number one favorite drink of all time. You're not gonna be surprised by this in any way, shape, or form. It's a spicy margarita.
SPEAKER_01:I knew it.
SPEAKER_02:But specifically, I love the spicy margarita from Full Mile Brewing Company. It's here in Sun Prairie. Oh, it's the perfect mix of spicy, and sometimes it is really spicy, depending on what bartender you get that day. But it just reminds me of like sitting out, they have the like garage doors, so it's like you can either sit outside or you can be like half outside, and it just reminds me of summertime. I love, love, love the spicy margarita there.
SPEAKER_00:I love that. You're not gonna love my final answer.
SPEAKER_02:It's water, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00:It's freak, it's water. I love water. I love water. I love water, I love water, I love water. It makes me a better person. I promise. I mean, it makes us all better, honestly. I mean, I I get at least 80 ounces, maybe more like 100 ounces a day. Insane. It's my routine. I pee for like three hours in a row in the morning because I'm usually drinking the most in the morning, but I just feel like a better person when I drink enough water.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I know.
SPEAKER_00:Maybe we all should drink a little bit more water. I know. I wrote this down and I was like, Taryn's gonna be so mad. She's gonna roll her eyes at this one. But I can't.
SPEAKER_02:I knew you were gonna put water down from the beginning of this. I just knew.
SPEAKER_00:I know. I'm so vanilla. I know you too well. You're the spicy one, I'm the watery one.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, seriously. The differen You guys, this is a this is a really good example of the difference between Amber and Taryn.
SPEAKER_00:Truly, truly. At Lululemon, their gear is designed with every body in mind, helping you look good, feel great, and move with confidence. Whether you're training, competing, or just living your day-to-day life. From supportive fabrics to thoughtful design, Lululemon knows it's not just about performance. It's about feeling comfortable in your own skin. Because when you feel your best, you show up stronger mentally and physically. Click the link in our show notes to shop. And when you do, we earn a small commission. So thanks for supporting the show. All right, so now we're headed in to the main part of today's episode where we're talking about sport psychology. And Taryn and I just want to give a really quick disclaimer before we hop into this topic. It is coming up more and more often in conversations around sports. Taryn, you and I have had so many guests on in the last this whole year. And this topic is coming up in a ton of different ways and shapes and forms. And I don't think that this conversation, that this topic is coming up more often because it's happening more often. I think it's coming up more often because more people, more athletes, especially pro-athletes with their big stages and big numbers of followers are talking about it, are normalizing it, which is amazing. And to that, we say to you, well done and thank you. But today's conversation, we we just want to give this disclaimer. We are not clinicians. What we're doing today is sharing information, sharing stories about athletes and even some of our own personal experiences. So, and a message for you listeners if sport is part of your life, mental skills and mental health should also be part of your toolkit as well. And remember, if you or someone you know is struggling, you can always call or text 988 to get support. So, what actually is sport psychology? I'm gonna rattle off some things here without sounding like a textbook, I hope. But really, it is the science of mind in sports. So it studies how a person's and athlete's thoughts, emotions, behaviors could affect their athletic performance. Sport psychology is tools like goal setting, self-talk. This made me think of right away. I I thought of playing hockey this morning and I missed just the easiest pass. The easiest pass, Taryn, it went right by. And it was at the blue line. Those of you who know hockey know that when the puck goes over the blue line, your whole team has to exit that part of the ice before you can put it back in play. So I was like, uh, if I could have just gotten my stick in like a better position, you know, so like in my head, and like, why couldn't I just have stopped the puck there? Um, but I, Taryn, you know I love this. I love the be a goldfish. And so my self-talk, I literally, as I was chasing this puck down and failing because there was somebody way faster than me who was already on it. Um, I was saying to myself, be a goldfish, you know, just on to the next play. Yeah, let it go on to the next thing. So sport psychology includes these sorts of tools like self-talk visualization. I've never used that. It sounds silly to me, but I know that there are a lot of people who do use this. Focus control, pre-competition routines. I eat the same cliff bar chocolate mint granola bar before hockey every morning. It says protein on it. It's lying. It has no more protein, sugar, any other sugary, chocolatey, but it is the thing that I eat. And I don't, it's just it, it's my my routine and my tradition. Yeah. Sport psychology is also health and safety connection, um, you know, recognizing that mental health directly influences injury risk, directly influences recovery, decision making, and one of those things that we love to um clap for, which is longevity in sport. So sport psychology affects all those things. And it is not just for the pros, it is for anyone who is playing a sport, including me in my be a goldfish self-talk, apparently. So okay. I wanted to, you know, really bring this conversation to a start by telling some famous stories and talking about some people who pro athletes who have struggled with mental health, who have come back from it, had success. Obviously, probably the first one that comes to mind is Miss Simone Biles. So um her and the 2021 Olympics in Tokyo. Taryn, what do you remember about her and this sort of situation that happened at the Olympics?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, I think I can tell from, I mean, I obviously know the story now because I've watched her documentary and all the things, but from the outside looking in, she was doing her, you know, her routines, and we're all watching on TV, and then all of a sudden she walks out of the gym. Like it's like it was so it seemed so out of the blue. I think she was on vault maybe at the time. Yeah, I can't remember because the vault's the one that's the scary one for her. She does that double back flip craziness, yeah, and um, yeah, and if you get the twisties, which is what they call it in gymnastics, it's very unsafe because you just don't know where your body is when you're in the air, and that's what happened to her. So she it's a it's it is a mental thing, but it like throws your body and your mind off so that you can't like really feel where your body is in the air, which is like so essential when you're flipping a hundred times in the air. Um, but yeah, so she just left and she said that she called her mom and she said, I can't do it. I can't, I can't keep going. And I don't want to like, I don't wanna make let everyone down. I want to let my team down, I don't want to let you down, I don't want to let me down, but like for my safety, I just know that I can't. And then she proceeded to stay there in Tokyo, and this was COVID times, so her parents were not there. It was the first time she'd ever competed without her parents being in the gym. And so wow, how hard. Um, and she stayed and cheered on the rest of her teammates and um was a great teammate to all of them, but yeah, she could she didn't want to compete the rest of the time. She might have competed a little bit, but just took out some certain moves.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, she might have done some maybe some like individual um events. Yeah, I can you imagine yeah having the I don't having the gumption, I don't even know what the word is, but maturity, honestly. Maturity, that's the word to be able to come after you walk out and make that decision. By the way, and I remember because we had segment or we had spotlighted Simone for a she's got game segment earlier this year. But I remember uh when she called her mom. I'm picturing myself in mom's shoes. You know, hey mom, I just can't do it. If I were the mom, I would say, Well, what's going on? Tell me more. I would try, I would try to convince my daughter to like, well, you know, like let me try to help you now. No, no, no. Mrs. Biles, Simone's mom, who I think is her maternal grandmother, maybe. Yeah. But Simone's parent, her mom, said, Okay, honey, then don't. Then just stop. I mean, like, what an amazing support system. It is a bummer that she couldn't be there in person, you know, to support Simone that way. But I mean, exactly what Simone needed to hear. And I think probably this is not the first time that Simone was really mature and her mom knew that Simone had the ability to make a decision for herself. But and then to walk back in, knowing every single set of eyes, every single camera is trained on you, will be trained on you for the rest of the Olympic Games. Yep.
SPEAKER_02:And to have just I can't even stability not even imagine. And she I would be in a cloud hiding. Blew up. Like people were talking so badly about her. Oh, it just crushes me. And she knew it. I mean, people were asking her so many questions, and that's when you just want to go in a hole and be like, Yeah, everybody leave me alone. And and also you want to explain yourself, but like she didn't, she didn't like go out of her way to be like, everybody deserves to know every detail. Like, she's like, they don't need to know, which that's the hardest thing for me. Like, I I have a really hard time. This is just me being really honest. I have a hard time when I know the truth about what I'm thinking, feeling, doing, whatever, and everybody else doesn't. Like, I want to really explain myself. So to me, I'm like, oh, good for her, right? Like that's the goal, right?
SPEAKER_00:To not care what other people think or I mean, defending yourself from just an onslaught of criticism. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. So, what maturity? Um, honestly, amazing. So, uh, a couple of other details about this. The twisties is technically speaking, you nailed a bunch of this already, but it's a mental block that creates a dangerous disconnect between mind and body. A gymnast can have this, also a diver, martial arts, other athletes who are doing things where they're jumping in the air and usually twisting, so need to have some sort of sense of where they are in the air. But basically, it's a disconnect in the feedback loop in the brain. Like your brain and body are no longer talking to one another. And it, you know, as we saw with Simone, it can be incredibly dangerous. By the way, I feel like I kind of live in this state most of the time.
SPEAKER_02:Like it's just knowing where your body is.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Where's my car keys? Where's my life? What's happening? What's going on? I think.
SPEAKER_02:But I just looked into things sometimes, and I'm like, oh, how did I not know that I was there?
SPEAKER_00:Let's call it mom twisties, maybe. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's mom mental twisties. I think that there's definitely an association there. Yeah, I'll give you that for sure. But in some interview, Simone gave the explanation about twisties like this. And I quote, every day you drive a car, and then one day you wake up and have no idea how to drive that car. Your legs are all over the place. You have no control of your body, you've been doing something for so long, but now you have no control and it's terrifying. So that was how she sort of, you know, described the twisties. What causes it? Everything and anything. It's literally what I found in the research. It could be doubt, it could be stress, a quest for perfection. I feel like she probably experienced all of these. And just like any other time that you should be good at something, you have been good at something, and that talent, that technique, that whatever falters, it's really easy to get into your brain and then make it worse. And it compounds. Now I can't do it. Now I'm in my head, now I'm doubting everything. Do I actually have talent? So all of these things were going through her brain. How to fix this? Take a break. It's actually really simple and straightforward and boring, but take a break. Simone had to step back. Taryn, you probably saw this in the documentary, but she basically cold turkeyed it. She just stopped doing gymnastics. And then after a certain period of time, came back to the gym and just had fun. Flipped around with no purpose, no goal, nothing, just to sort of keep in shape. And then very, very slowly started relearning some of the basic skills, started adding on, visiting with coaches and trainers, talking about maybe what a return to gymnastics could look like. But it was a really long road and started at exactly square one. So what I hope that our listeners hear from Simone's story is that mental health can oftentimes be an indicator that a break is what's needed, that actually taking time off and stepping back is performance care. So I think Simone's story is really amazing. Obviously, her incredible success gives her a really big stage to share it on as well. And um, I've read, I've seen a lot of her stuff. I think she's done an amazing job at bringing this topic to media attention, to our attention as well. Okay, next story. Story number two out of three. Naomi Osaka. Do you remember much about her tennis player?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, I know. I mean enough.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. So she she was a young phenom tennis player, you know, those tennis players who, just like her, in her teens, you know, turns pro and wins against some really high profile athletes. And so everybody starts talking about her. Woo, you know, the newest, the biggest thing. And she really was. Um, she's a multi-grand slam champion. And with that, especially when she's young and you know, noteworthy and media worthy, comes a lot of scrutiny and a lot of speculation, a lot of pressure, a lot of expectations. So a few years ago, after a tennis match that she lost, I believe, she opted to not participate in a press conference. And I did not know that professional tennis players have a I don't know if obligation or duty, responsibility, or requirement to participate in press conferences. And I looked up okay, I say this with some sarcasm. Um the tennis association, US Tennis Association, I don't know, tennis governing body, gave the response when this came to light when she did refuse this um media press conference. The reason why they have pro athletes attend these media press conferences is because it helps to promote the sport and share the athlete's perspective. I hear cha-ching cha-ching, media press conferences are how they keep tennis in the spotlight, how they get viewership, TV contracts, money, tickets is my um sort of jam.
SPEAKER_02:And if it wasn't required, who would do it?
SPEAKER_00:And if it wasn't required, everybody'd be like, no, thank you. Yeah, then pass.
SPEAKER_02:Especially after I've just lost. No thanks.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. When I'm feeling vulnerable, and of course, that's when the media, let's be real, I also love to see like somebody like, you know, really breaking down some that's terrible, right? I don't want to say suffering, but yeah, like to, yeah, a little bit of drama sometimes is is good for media. Anyway, so she was penalized, she was charged$15,000 in fines, yeah, for skipping this press conference because she set these boundaries, because she was really going through a hard time, and then this loss is sort of all compounded. She also made comments about how she's not a big fan of public speaking anyway. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So then to do it. She's super soft spoken.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, she really is like super soft spoken and kind. But to do this public speaking on a world stage after you just got epically beaten in a match, is you know, sort of like all of the all of the um things on top of you. Later on, she pulled out of the French Open, one of those Grand Slam tournaments. She mentioned she pulled out because of mental health struggles, and she got a huge wave of support from other athletes, which was really cool. So this was a number of years ago. Since then, she's had a baby. Not so yeah, yeah, she's had a baby. Um, she's 27 and she's lived a lot more life, and I think maybe gained a lot of perspective. And the amount of years between her withdrawing from the French Open and now, she when she did enter into tournaments, she didn't really do well until this year. At the US Open, she had an amazing showing. She beat Coco Goff, which I feel makes emotions about. I love Coco. She's a US player.
SPEAKER_02:So cute watching them play each other.
SPEAKER_00:They're both just like the young, cute, like lovable, so nice and like scary athletic. Um, but yeah, so it was a bummer to see Coco lose, but also really amazing to see Naomi succeed. So folks are calling this a comeback for Naomi Osaka. This it's at the US Open, it's way further than she's gotten in any recent tennis tournament. So that's fantastic. But the moral of the story, what I hear from her story, is a setting of boundaries. Yeah. So she set this boundary. I don't feel well enough to attend this press conference. I don't feel well enough to participate in this very prestigious and important tennis tournament. I mean, I'm sure that was incredibly hard for her to withdraw.
SPEAKER_02:Probably the amount of money she loses.
SPEAKER_00:And sponsorships and yeah. So I'm sure that was a really hard decision, but lots of respect for her and the way that she set boundaries in order to protect her mental health. At LSM Chiropractic, every patient gets a custom treatment plan designed to fit their unique needs, goals, and lifestyle. Whether you're aiming to climb mountains or just climb stairs without pain, they'll create a plan that works for you. And just like athletes use mental strategies to sharpen their performance, LSM helps you build the physical foundation to keep moving forward. Personalized care isn't just a buzzword here, it's their way of helping you feel your absolute best. Start your journey to better health today at lsmchiro.com. Okay, I've got one more story. Do you know who Kevin Love is?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, sure do. Uh play for the Heat. Great.
SPEAKER_00:Yes. Um, NBA player, obviously, then. So he's also been really outspoken about mental health. Here's his story. He was playing in a game, and during warm ups, it felt like as he was running around, his heart rate got really high really fast, doing things that shouldn't make him out of breath. Tried to write it off, you know, and thought it's just a little, you know, some nerves or, you know, whatever. And then somewhere during the game, his coach called a timeout. He went over into the huddle, and the symptoms got worse as he was standing there, and he almost couldn't focus. So his heart rate was racing. He was even more out of breath, couldn't catch his breath. He said everything was spinning as though his brain was trying to climb out of his head.
SPEAKER_02:Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00:Can you pick it up? I mean again, I can I can kind of like relate to that in some aspects of parenting. But yeah, everything was spinning, like his brain is trying to climb out of his head. What a feeling. So this is a panic attack. So he goes into the locker room and he says he ran from room to room trying to get his heart to stop racing. And he ended up at the end of this episode lying on the floor in the training room, trying to get enough air to breathe. So the next day they ran all these tests. Of course, they were really worried. Everything came back normal. And you know what his team managers, team personnel said? They said, Kevin, dude, you gotta see a therapist. So he says this about the stigma around pro-athletes and mental health. And I quote, growing up, you figure out really quickly how a boy is supposed to act. You learn what it takes to be a man. It's like a playbook. Be strong, don't talk about your feelings, get through it on your own. So for 29 years of my life, I followed that playbook. And look, I'm probably not telling you anything new here. These values about men and toughness are so ordinary that they're everywhere and invisible at the same time, surrounding us like air or water.
SPEAKER_02:Like the these, I can't, I mean, I feel so bad for men and the expectation that they have. Like, yeah, it's not fair that they have to be that way. And it's not fair to women, you know, like selfishly, like it's not fair to women that men have to be that way when you know that's not what we need, and we don't expect that from them, right? Because we want to talk about our feelings, we want to do these things, and it's just so hard. I mean, you know, you have two boys, I have one boy, like trying to raise boys to like be not that, you know, it's hard, it's very hard, and it's hard for me, and I'm aware of it, right? Like, yeah, you know, like setting like stigmas that I maybe like just come out of my mouth sometimes, and I'm like, blah blah blah, that's not what I meant. I meant yeah, it's okay to cry, you know, but we're not gonna do this in addition, you know, whatever it is. But yeah, oh, it's so hard and I can't imagine.
SPEAKER_00:Like, I so many times one of my kids have eaten it, fallen on rocks, gravel, roads, grass, whatever. Yeah, and I'm like, it's all right, bud, just rub it, hop back up, you can keep playing this if it's a sport, or like keep doing, you know, whatever, or come on, you know, get into your car seat. The number of times where I've encouraged them to just sort of brush it off and keep going. I can't even count, I can't even count in the decade that I've been a parent how many times I'm sure I have done that. And it's so because it's celebrated, right? It's celebrated in sport, it's celebrated in life. Yes, mostly from the perspective of men, but also women in sport. I was encouraged, like you fall down and you scrape something and you just like you know, wipe it, wipe the blood off or whatever, and keep rolling if you, you know, as long as nothing's broken. So and sometimes even when it is, you know, sometimes even if it is, yes, very terribly broken or injured. Yeah, okay. So so Kevin Love, he begins seeing a therapist and says he was actually surprised that the therapist did not want. To talk about basketball at all. Kevin's like, uh, you know, like we talked about anything else. And he said, and I found this too with my therapists, that it's never what you think is bothering you, which is the beauty I think of therapy or has been for me. A therapist can ask you enough questions so that you walk yourself around to what is actually going on. And for Kevin, he learned that what was what was actually going on was related to the passing of his grandma. Um, the two of them were incredibly close, incredibly, incredibly close. She sounds like a really sweet woman and her health deteriorated really quickly. He never had a chance to say a proper goodbye. And he learned in a lot of work with his therapist that that actually had caused a lot of anxiety and concerns. I know you're cutting onions over there. Onions over here? Yeah. But it has crept into that anxiety, that sense of loss, that feeling of incompleteness has sort of crept into a lot of different areas of his life in ways he didn't expect. And now he says he sees his therapist a couple of times per month every time he's, you know, in town and not traveling. So just a really cool story from the perspective of a man, which I think is incredibly valuable and one that is told less. More and more, but still less than the stories of women who are struggling with mental health. So I just want to wrap up these three stories with a couple of takeaways. First off, I've mentioned a couple times, but let me just reiterate wow, the power of sport to bring important topics to the front of the conversation and how awesome it is when athletes like these three use their platform to tell that story and normalize mental health struggles in sport, but just in general. And also, I love to mention to anyone who will listen that I see a therapist, that it is good for me, that it helps me, that it is healthy for me. But I always think of this in my brain like I see a dentist, I see a general physician, I see a chiropractor, I see other practitioners, a dermatologist on a regular basis. And sometimes that's because something hurts or doesn't look right. That mole looks a little bit funky.
SPEAKER_02:Or sometimes it's just I'm concerned that you're going to your dermatologist that something hurts.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, no, no, no. If it hurts, chiropractor. LSM shout out. If the mole is a funky color, that's a dermatologist situation.
SPEAKER_01:Those two things combined in the same thing. If something hurts, I'm gonna go see my dermatologist. Like, oh no.
SPEAKER_00:What about a sunburn? If a sunburn hurts, maybe that would call me visit. It's mallow.
SPEAKER_02:Amber's got a one appointment today. I was like, I have a daily doctor appointment today.
SPEAKER_00:I'm not at that level, although, although there, I mean, I could probably, if I didn't have a day job, I'm sure I could find more doctors to visit. Like a nutritionist, how great would that be? Like our guest, Grace Payne. Yeah. Let's see. Um no, dermatologist for a funky mole. And also, but also, okay. Also, I want to make this point. Also, we see doctors for just maintenance and general upkeep, not only when something is wrong. And that's how I view my therapists. I see her when I'm having a tough week, but also I just see her every other week, even if I'm not having a tough week. And at the bottom of all of this, Taryn, is that mental health is health. Right. It is not a separate category. It is in the same, we take care of our bodies. Why not take care of our brains as well? So, Taryn, quick question for you. When you were playing sports, or even now, did you, if you're open to sharing or anyone you know ever deal with mental health connected, mental health struggles connected to sport?
SPEAKER_02:Um, I would say, like for my personal experience with sport, I don't know if it, I mean, I think it's all sort of rel relative, but for me, a big part of it was when I was out of sport. I tore my ACL after my freshman year, um, in the summer of my freshman year going into my sophomore year. And so that was really tough. Not only did I like have to miss my seasons, but then it was a lot slower going back to it. And that, you know, it made me feel slower physically. And also, like I think my coaches were like, oh, she didn't play last year, so like she's not as good. And that made it really tough to like, you know, get through sitting on the bench, right? Basketball. I sat on the bench my like junior year, I think, because you know, after my sophomore year, it was like, oh, I don't know. She's in, I don't know if she's any good at this point. But um, yeah, so that was really tough for me. I I wouldn't say that I like needed a like a therapist at the time, but it was really hard. Like I remember going into college being like, this is shows my privilege, right? Hardest thing I've done in my life is that I tore my ACL and I had to sit out of sports, and then I had to like come back and try and like get back to my old self. And that was just like, it was tough. It was really hard for for someone who put a lot of their identity in sports. And I think that's a big part of it right there was that like I was a sports girl, you know. My dad was a coach, like my brother played sports, he my dad played sports, and I played three sports almost all the way through high school. So yeah, it was it was my identity being kind of like pulled away from me and trying to figure out like who am I outside of sports.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Wow. I can totally relate to that as well. And still sort of relate to that. Yeah. I run around and I play all sorts of sports, and it's the talking point that I use with coworkers and family and friends, and you know, they're asking about hockey or my golf lessons or whatever, but to not have the physical ability to do those things, my conversation topics would be much less.
SPEAKER_02:For sure. And I think this podcast is also part of that too, right? Like, I think you and I have a good dynamic because like you don't pretend to like know everything there is to know about sports. But I feel like my sort of persona was that like I knew more about sports than you. So sometimes when I don't know, it really affects like I'm like, yeah, why don't I know that? Or like I'm not sure about that. And that affects how I view myself when I'm when we're talking on here. And I think probably a lot of our listeners feel the same way, right? Like they want to join in on conversations, but they're too scared to because they're like, if I become sports girl and I don't know the answer, or if I say something wrong, I'm constantly like, doesn't that guy play for so and so? And like some dude is always like, no, they play for so and so now. And I'm like, I can't keep up. Okay, no, there's so much to keep up with. There's so much. I have a child and a yeah, four jobs that can't do it all, you know. So, but that it is, it does affect me. It does affect me when I like don't know something or can't get something right, say something wrong.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. I love that. Um, I hadn't even personally prepared for this question, but I'm thinking back to uh obviously identity identity tied up in sports, but then also some level of body image. So when I was in college and grad school, I did a lot of long distance running and I used up my knees. I can't do that any longer. But I had to stay active. I I loved the adrenaline of it, but also it was a body image thing. If I wasn't working out and I wasn't staying fit, if I didn't have the physical shape that I wanted to have, uh it would really impact me. And I could, you know, my shape could change just a little bit and I would know it, I would feel it, and it would just sort of sit in the back of my mind and follow me everywhere I went. So on the mental health side of things, I think that's probably where I, in the span of my career in sports, probably have struggled the most and still do in some respect. You know, eating a cheeseburger is gonna say it's gonna it's gonna do something to my brain for sure if I haven't, you know, played a sport or done a workout that day. So and all things my therapist and I are currently unpacking. All right, natural. That's good. Keep at it. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Anyway, but really awesome conversations. Thanks for sharing that. Yeah, no, super cool. Thank you. Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00:Okay, so I want to transition now. We've talked a lot about pro athletes, at least three of them in their stories. I want to segue just sort of briefly into some hot topics in college sports. And this one particular hot topic is connected to gambling. I'm so tired of hearing about gambling. I feel like every other commercial is for some sort of sports gambling. Save money and gambling. It's fine, but I'm just tired of hearing about gambling. But here we are talking about it anyway. Tanner, do you know what a prop bet is? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. That's like the I mean, I'm probably not gonna give the right definition of this, but my my perception of it is it's basically the the atypical kind of bet. So kind of more like the not like moneyline or not like win-loss or spread. It's the color of Gatorade that's gonna be dumped on the coach. Or like, is the national anthem gonna go X amount of time? Like the kind of weird one-off ones.
SPEAKER_00:Yep, exactly. Basically, what I found anything that is other than win loss or point spread, like those very high-level um sorts of bets. So, where this leaks into mental health is that a lot of prop bets now are based on an individual player's performance. So I bet that Taryn will score X number of three pointers in the following game, basketball game, college basketball game, right? Or I bet this baseball player is gonna hit a home run in this game. So why this matters is because it turns the view and the focus from the team as a whole, the Arkansas Razorbacks, the Florida Gators, to that one specific person. And then, you know, when it comes to gambling, I am tying my money to this team to win or to that person to hit a home run. So all of a sudden it becomes a little bit higher stakes. I got money on this. And now when my money is tied to one individual person, it is a lot easier for that to lead to social media harassment, to even something as simple as someone posting on social media, tagging a college athlete. I'm betting the under on you in you know tonight's game. Something as simple as that, all the way up to you're worthless, you're useless. Like, how could you not have scored at least this many points? Threats, harassment, yeah. And it uh for these college athletes, y'all, they're students, they're like 20 years old.
SPEAKER_02:20 years old.
SPEAKER_00:Some like give them some space. I mean, but but prop bets, I mean, you know, like we as fans have always discussed games and discussed players' performance, but prop bets assigns money, so it elevates the emotions, and then prop bets helps us narrow in on one player, so all of a sudden, all of these emotions are connected to this one player in this one time frame, so it can really quickly spiral into something that's really negative. So the NCAA, there are some states, by the way, who have legislation in place to protect athletes, and it's all over the place. Some states say no prop bets at all, some states say no prop bets on in-state teams, you know, it's sort of all over the place, but not all states have protections in place. So the NCAA is lobbying, um, encouraging states to put some sort of protections in place for these poor, poor college athletes, these 20-year-olds who are just trying to play a game and take some classes and do a bunch of stuff that is already really, really hard. So now that was really an interesting tie-in between sports and mental health. And the NCAA is doing some other stuff as well. Policies, absolutely, matter. So the NCAA now expects all schools to have clear mental health plans, not just posters. I'm picturing like in PE class, you know, you had like the pyramid of whatever and how much physical activity. Okay, not just posters, but actual plans. And maybe coming from a recon sport management background, I will call this with a grain of salt because I have a lot of questions on, you know, how is this going to be enforced? It's uh, you know, there's so many schools, so many programs. But some of the some of the things NCAA has put into place, and this is in 2024, so it's pretty recent. Schools are now expected to have clear referral pathways when you are concerned about when you personally are struggling, if you see someone else who you feel like is at risk, is struggling with mental health um concerns. Is there an easy and very clear way for you to refer that person or yourself? Emergency action plans. So after that referral happens, or if there's, you know, other um higher level concerns, what exactly is the way that athletes, coaches, team personnel can get help for that person? And also education for coaches and athletes on all of these things, but just in general, how to identify somebody who's struggling, what's the right thing to say in that moment, you know, how to help, sort of thing. So the NCAA with these mental health policies, there were other things wrapped in as well, which makes me more impressed because what I've just said is great. But also listen to this. They've also passed legislation um along with information about the following topics the intersection of mental health and sports betting. Great, just talked about that. Social media, corruption in sports, suicide contagion, which sounds terrifying, but is an official term. I know deep breath. NIL. Yep. And then also includes some specific considerations for student athletes of color, LGBTQ, student athletes, international student athletes, and student athletes with disabilities. So um, I think I need to dig further here, maybe in a separate episode. This all sounds really, really amazing. I think it's gonna be interesting to watch how it's executed.
SPEAKER_02:Especially in today's time.
SPEAKER_00:Especially in today's time. How is it executed and how is NCAA enforcing and making sure that these policies actually bring value to the athletes? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I have my doubts on how well they can.
SPEAKER_00:I have some skepticism as well, which is so unfortunate. And I hope that we are um brutally incorrect. Yeah, but we'll have to see sort of how it plays out, and hopefully, you know, the next crap of student athletes can get, you know, more support from their schools. All right, now it is time for our final segment of the day, which is She's Got Game, where we highlight a woman doing something awesome in gymnastics today. So, Taryn, I want you to picture this. It's the day of a gymnastics meet at UCLA. What is a brewing, by the way? Do you know what a brewin is? Is it a bear? Yes. I think so. I meant to look this up ahead of time. All right. Anyway, it's the day. We're gonna get a lot of um we're gonna get roasted if it's not.
SPEAKER_02:It's the I'm gonna Google it before we do this because then I'll just cut this out.
SPEAKER_00:Fair enough. It's the day of a gymnastics meet at UCLA, a super successful and prominent gymnastics program. Not as prominent as Oklahoma, as we know from Kaylee, but still has won some championships recently. But like you're picturing this 10 years ago. Okay, so the UCLA Bruins have a gymnastics meet today, and the pride of their team is Jordan Weber, Olympic gold medalist, world champion. She's won six major all-around titles and captured three American Cups. At this point, again, the story is back a few years. At that point, she's only 19. She's healthy, she's strong, she can even do push-ups on parallel bars. And during UCLA gymnastics meets, she displays her talents in all the ways that she can, including moving mats, refilling water bottles, firing t-shirt guns, selecting matching leontards for the athletes, but she doesn't get to wear one. Whispers ripple through the crowd. Is that Jordan Weber, the Olympic medalist? Yes, she is an Olympic medalist, but she can't compete because 10 years ago, when she was a pro-gymnist, she accepted a sponsorship deal, which made her ineligible to compete in college. This was 2015. We know now 10 years later, after the NIL court ruling has come down, NCAA eligibility is a lot different. But back then for Miss Weber, it was a super challenging decision whether to make some money in her gymnastics career or to be eligible to go do gymnastics and compete at the collegiate level. So let's back up a little bit to get the whole story here. Jordan started gymnastics at the age of four and really started getting into competitions by age 11. At just the age 17, she helped lead Team USA to Olympic gold in London. This is 2012. She was part of the legendary Fierce Five. Um, Allie Raceman was there, and Gabby Douglas, and I didn't recognize the other girls. Um, she wasn't just a member of the team, she was totally an anchor and had some had some pain as she was competing at those Olympics. Speaking of, you know, women gymnasts who were competing through the pain, later found out she had a stress fracture in her shin, regardless, still crushed it. So an amazing, amazing gymnast. But at 17, before, you know, as she was getting ready for the Olympics, she did turn pro and she signed with a media group, did commercials, gave speeches, and basically became financially secure, but it came at the cost of being able to compete at the collegiate level. So again, this is very different now. But back then, gymnasts had this really difficult decision to face. A gymnast's career is really short. So Taryn, gym little gymnast, talented Taryn, could either decide to compete in the Olympics or, you know, go the pro route. Maybe she's 16 years old, get some sponsorship dollars, make some money, or she could not do any of that, play in college, and then maybe have a role at the Cirque de Soleil. I don't know, like after college, you know, 22, like your career as a gymnast is probably over for, you know, most gymnasts. So it was a really tough decision, and she went the route of being financially secure. However, she still decided that she wanted to be in that culture. She wanted to be in the gym in college, right? Like she was pursuing a psychology degree. Even if she couldn't be in that leotard, she still wanted to be supporting all the other girls who were in those leotards. So she would go in when she first started college at UCLA. She'd go into the gym. She was a volunteer sort of student manager. She'd go in and she'd train in the morning because she hadn't totally decided if she wanted to retire yet or not. So 2012 Olympics had wrapped up gold medal for the team. She was sort of waffling on, you know, do I want to go for 2016 gymnastics? So that would be in Rio. You know, do I wanna, do I want to aim for those games or not? She hadn't decided. So when she was first in college, she was a student manager of the college team, but she was also doing her own workouts and her own training. Um, she did, however, in 2015 decide that she, it was her time. It was time for her to be done. I don't really know what was the hard stop, you know, like was it an injury that wouldn't go away? Was it, you know, something else? I'm not really sure. But in 2015, just one year shy of Rio Olympics, she decided that she was hanging up the leotard and the scrunchie and the bun and whatnot. However, her career in gymnastics was not complete, as we know, because she took a job as a head coach with the Arkansas Razorbacks, Whoopig Suey. That's where I went to grad school. So I was so excited to read this about her. Um, and she took this head coach job when she was just 23 years old. Taryn, basically one year older than maybe the oldest gymnast on this team. Crazy. I mean, you know, so but she had this great experience. The coach at UCLA is fantastic. Field condos, I can't remember her first name. So Jordan got to really learn from her, mentor with her, shadow her. When Jordan was hired to be the coach with the Razorbacks, she was, yes, very young, 23 years old, but also at that point, she was the first ever Olympic champion to become a head coach in NCAA women's gymnastics history, which is both exciting and also very sad that it took that long. She's done a fantastic job with the Razorbacks. They've had several top 10 national rankings record attendance at their meets. I went to a couple of meets when I was in grad school, amazing postseason finishes. They don't have any number one, you know, championship titles to their name yet, but it's yet. And I say yet because her contract takes her all the way to 2028. So she's got lots of runway. I do want to talk, though, about how she coaches. We've talked about some of the older mentality of gymnastics. Push yourself, push through injury, push through, work as hard as you possibly can, burnout, what's that? Just keep going. But Jordan does not subscribe to that philosophy. She got a degree in psychology from UCLA, for goodness sake. So she knows a little bit about how to motivate people. She knows a little bit about the inner workings of the human brain and emotions, etc. So she draws on some of that experience when she's coaching her team. She actually, instead of encouraging these girls to push through pain or push through struggle, burnout, whatever, she encourages emotional openness, communication. She empowers her athletes to take care of their bodies. She says that she's not just coaching gymnastics routines, she's rebuilding a culture. And her athletes don't just compete well. They feel heard, they feel valued, they feel safe. So I just want to go back to that moment that I started the segment with when she's, you know, refilling water bottles and firing the t-shirt gun and helping everybody else, even though she's so qualified to actually be competing. You know, you might think of that moment like, oh, she really missed out, or oh, you know, like that's so unfortunate for her. But I think it's impressive that she turned that. And she's known for her mental fortitude. You know, her coaches and her teammates say that too. But I think that's just one moment where she was faced with something really hard, really tough decision, you know, and sort of stood tall and said, you know what, maybe I can't contribute in that way, but I know that I can contribute in this way. And her ability to make that decision is, I'm guessing, you know, part of why she was hired at Arkansas and now is making an impact in even more awesome ways. So we talk about how hard it is to leave your sport, how hard it is to make those transitions, but um, you know, Jordan really did it with a lot of grace and now is taking on all those things that she learned in her career and helping other people learn them. So she's fantastic. But anyway, so for all these reasons and so many more, is why we have chosen to spotlight Miss Jordan Weaver, Olympic gold medalist and head coach of the Arkansas Razorbacks gymnastics team, as our she's got game lady today. That is a wrap on today's episode. Thanks so much for joining us for this really important conversation on sport psychology. From youth sports to the biggest stages in the world, we've seen how mental health isn't separate from performance. It's actually part of it, a really integral part of it. So if sport is part of your life, we want to reiterate mental skills and mental health should be part of your toolkit too. And remember, if you or someone you know is struggling, you can call or text 988 to get support. And our hope is that today's stories, information, conversation gave you new perspective on what it means to support athletes, teammates, kids, and even ourselves. And if you enjoyed this episode, please share it on Instagram and tag us at AlmostFans Podcast. We love seeing your tags, and it really helps us reach more people like you. So thanks again for listening, and we will see you next week.