Rucks, Mauls & Oval Balls
Welcome to Rucks Mauls & Oval Balls, the ultimate podcast for all things English rugby! Hosted by two former university teammates who shared the pitch and forged a lasting bond, this show takes you behind the scenes of the rugby world, blending insightful analysis with a shared passion for the sport. Each episode dives deep into the game, with a special focus on statistics, player performance, team dynamics, and match breakdowns. Whether you're a die-hard fan or new to the game, Rucks, Mauls & Oval Balls offers expert commentary, fun debates, and insider knowledge that you won’t find anywhere else. Tune in for the perfect mix of rugby banter, in-depth analysis, and a true love for the game!
Rucks, Mauls & Oval Balls
S2 Ep 13 - Champions Cup Mega Pod
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European rugby didn’t whisper this weekend—it roared. We dive straight into a Champions Cup slate packed with statement wins, shock upsets, and a few uncomfortable truths about where the competition stands. From the moment Sale’s injuries met Glasgow’s 25‑minute surge, the theme was clear: momentum punishes hesitation, and the best sides control the tempo.
We unpack Saracens suffocating Clermont at the set piece, Leinster’s seamless power with Quins fighting for a deserved bonus point, and Bath’s ruthless lineout ambush that left Munster reeling. Edinburgh’s storm‑lashed win over Toulon gets the spotlight it deserves—Ewan Ashman, scrum muscle, and smart game management in the worst weather. Then to Pretoria, where Bordeaux produced the weekend’s classic: Jalibert’s spark, Penaud’s finishing, and a 24‑point unanswered swing at altitude that felt like a title marker.
Along the way we get candid about the empty stands, the convoluted format, and broadcast choices that don’t help fans fall in love with Europe again. Still, the rugby at the top end is fierce: Toulouse look inevitable even without their biggest names, Leinster are suffocatingly coherent, Bath have steel to match their flair, and Bordeaux are hunting trophies. Saints’ scrum dominance at Pau, Gloucester’s bonus in spite of the lineout, and Quins’ bite in Dublin all point to an English revival with real edge.
If you want sharp analysis, clear takeaways, and predictions that actually commit, you’re in the right place. Hit play, share with a friend who loves a good maul or a world‑class offload, and tell us: which team convinced you they can win Europe this year? And if you enjoyed the show, subscribe, leave a review, and send us your boldest bracket—surprises welcome.
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Banter, Lions Win & Weekend Plans
SPEAKER_02Welcome to Rux Moores and Olds. That's right, it's the fans favourite rugby podcast. Once again, back to you with your fans favourites rugby podcast hosts. It's me, Dave, joined as ever by Rory. Rory, say hello to the listener now. Hello, listener! You got so excited, you got so excited there, Rory. Your mic cut off, but uh just for the listener, he was very excited to say hello to you. Uh hello, Rory. How are you? How are things?
SPEAKER_01I'm good, thank you, David. I'm good. Things are well. Things are well. Good, good, good. Big news. Huge W for the Lions at the weekend.
SPEAKER_02Oh, that's what I like to hear. Talk talk to me about the W.
SPEAKER_01Alright, so top of the table clash, away at Wonsted. Fantastic.
SPEAKER_02They turned up. Fantastic. They heard our play.
SPEAKER_01I know, massive, but not without their problems. We we got wind of it a day in advance. They didn't have any props. Oh I had to play 80 minutes without Scrums. It's weird, David. It's really weird. Do you know how much energy you have for running without Scrums? It's ludicrous.
SPEAKER_02Are you trying to suggest that you were effective around the park?
SPEAKER_01No, I was completely lost. I had no idea how to get into the game.
SPEAKER_02I was gonna say, Without Scrums, what were we doing?
SPEAKER_01As it turns out, nothing. But you still got the W. We still got the big W. Yeah, we were fortunate enough to have a very effective back line, which meant I just stood in the middle of the pitch and watched the ball go from wing to wing. Fantastic.
SPEAKER_02And were you uh instrumental in any of the ball playing moves at all?
SPEAKER_01Or were you just a very I was certainly there. I was certainly there.
SPEAKER_02Were you a very useful uh dummy runner? Or no, sorry, dummy walker.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that guy walking must get the ball. Yeah. He's walking so fast.
SPEAKER_02Uh you know, some some may call that an excellent tactic, Rory. Because some might. That one might. One in 99 times that ball may find its way to you. Could be that one.
SPEAKER_01But on a massive day, David, all three Westcliff teams, the first team, the Lions and the Rhinos, all racking up big dubs. What a day for the Westcliff. Huge day for Westcliff.
SPEAKER_02I imagine the clubhouse was bouncing after that day.
SPEAKER_01Crazy.
SPEAKER_02Well, it's very exciting. I I just the Lions continue to impress me, even though I've not seen any footage of the rugby they play. But go.
SPEAKER_01We don't set up the VO for the Lions.
SPEAKER_02That's a shame. That's a shame. I I'd love to I'd love to see it one day. I especially love to see you in action, Rory, once again. Because it's been some time since I've seen you with the ball in hand, galloping down a wing. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01A lot of my teammates saying that as I said.
SPEAKER_02You stole my punchline, but I'll allow it.
SPEAKER_01How have you been, David? That should ask, I suppose.
Light News: George Martin To Saracens
SPEAKER_02Rory, I'm proud of you to for remembering. Um thank you. Well, unfortunately, I haven't got any uh rugby-based anecdotes. I've I've done one of those really again middle class, but look at you, you get your own bespoke dog food delivered to you. I went to a lovely getaway in the countryside in Suffolk, uh, where there was no internet, no TV, just a nice getaway with friends with friends just uh do nothing and uh have a jolly good time. But it did mean that I was sons rugby for most of the weekend, which was uh a bitter pill to swallow. Uh but I did have a lovely time seeing friends and having a good old laugh. But unfortunately it's not it's not very rugby related and of no interest to anyone listening. Uh but what I did do is I booked Monday off work in order to try and watch as much rugby as I could. Um I did the same thing. As it turns out, there was a lot of rugby this weekend, so despite clipping off an entire day of work, still not been able to watch all the games. I will hold my hands up to the listener. You may sense the ones I'm not particularly clued in on, but Rory is here.
SPEAKER_01Fear not listener. I have had a very, very good few days watching all of the games that I could catch up on. Um I think we're pretty much there with it with every single one, more or less. So uh fear not listener, I've got thoughts.
SPEAKER_02Fan bloody tastic. So what we're gonna do, we're gonna touch on any potential little news things going on in the world of rugby. Uh, spoiler alert, not a lot to report on. And then we'll go game by game through the Champions Cup. Some games we'll dig a little deeper than others, some games we will probably barely scratch the surface on, but we will do our best to give you a rundown of what happened this weekend for anyone who missed any of the games or anyone who just wants to know a little bit more, and we'll let you know what we think, because there's a lot of rugby to talk about, Rory. First of all, rugby news wise, a bit light this week, I think. The only thing I am aware of, this is probably of note or interest to the listener, is the announcement today of George Martin off to Saracens. Uh so I suppose is this the start of the 26-27 recruitment window, should we say?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the start the starting pistols have gone. Um, yeah, it's a big move. Moving from Leicester to Sarre's 24 years old, come through the Leicester Academy. You know, that is a big blow for Tigers to lose that calibre of player. I know that he's had a lot of injury problems, probably just keen to get a kind of a fresh start and a new environment. Um, but that's a that's a real blow to Tigers. Definitely a coup for Saracens. I mean, he's he's a fabulous player when he's fit.
SPEAKER_02It's an interesting one because I've I've spoken to a few Leicester fans and none of them seem that bothered. And it's because in the last two years he's only played a handful of games, and I think they're seeing him as a bit more of a bit like a manu, uh taking up a lot of space in that salary cap that they're trying to manage safely. And I'm surprised how they're not more worried or more annoyed by this one, losing a an England international to a rival team at an age that is probably under his prime, so he's gonna get better if he does get fit. So it I'm surprised Leicester fans don't seem concerned by this in any way, shape, or form.
SPEAKER_01You've nailed it. If he gets if he gets fit, he's such a a handful on the part. You know, I mean, blocks that size are not easy to come by, and you know, people have short memories, they forget how dominant Saris were when they had Atoje and Cruz in the engine room. You know, this is this is similar kind of dap.
SPEAKER_02Um it's it's yeah, Saracen's with George Martin alongside Atoji with the back row riches they have. Uh I'm not saying it replaces the Tom Willis hole they have next season, but it certainly helps do a little bit of the grunt. Uh it's a bit of weight in there, isn't it? Yeah, and I like and I think to be fair, Tizard's doing all right this season. Um of the match of the weekend, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So like they're obviously not short at that department, but George Martin definitely uh definitely bolsters the ranks uh in a yeah positive way. I think so.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the the starter pistols have uh have gone off and um yeah concerning because I think Thomas Williams is off to Saracens as well. That's a big rumour. So I'm sure that'll be announced any day now.
SPEAKER_02So that yeah, that would be a that would be quite the coup as well, because that would be a big loss for Gloucester. Yeah, I I think I think we're in for uh a busy one. Uh with the the Red Bull curveball thrown in uh I think the market is going to be a fluid one, and I think we're gonna see quite a bit of movement. Uh so any player who's out of contract, I think there'll be interest because there is a club sitting there waiting that needs to fill its fill its cap uh with high quality players. I know there was talk in the Saints game, a couple of players that they're expecting that maybe maybe go that way. I think Sam Graham and Robbie Smith who are the names associated. So Robbie Smith are Scotland International. Sam Graham, arguably Saints player of the season last year. So, you know, two two good players, squad fillers. As I said last week, they do need to find some high quality squad fillers. I think Sam Graham fits that mould. Sadly, he's kind of like a good one.
SPEAKER_01Sam Graham feels like a good good Newcastle kind of style of player, you know, but actually very much kind of fills that hole that Callum Chick's left by goaded Saints, to be honest, I think.
SPEAKER_02So yeah, so yeah, it's it's a bit of a swap deal that seems to have happened with a with a year gap, but we'll watch the space. But at the moment, I haven't got any concrete news to share with you, listener, beyond George Martin. Uh with that in mind, Rory. I'd I'd either say we canter straight into Champions Cup. I don't know what you think.
SPEAKER_01Let's dive into it.
SPEAKER_02Let's dive into it. So we'll start off, we'll just run through it Friday through to Sunday. We'll try to do it in some sort of chronological order. Uh, and we'll start off bit of home turf, bit of bit of prem interest. Sales sharks versus Glasgow Warriors. Now, I did a TikTok live last week and I asked everyone who was watching what they thought, and they thought Sales Sharks were going to smash Glasgow because Glasgow's form is has been woeful in the URC. Yeah. However, this game suggested otherwise, Rory. What did you think?
Format, Crowds & TV: Is Europe Losing Shine?
SPEAKER_01Well, though those predictions wouldn't have taken into account how depleted Sale are this week, um, or have been this week. And not because they've um uh not targeted the Champions Cup. You know, they they have they have now hit their injury crisis. So the whole starting front row, Luke Cowindicky, Bevan Rodd, Ashra Poca for sure, all out. Uh Ben Curry was on the bench. Yeah, he was back, but he was on the bench. Uh is it Jean-Luc Deprier the one who's left off the twins? Yeah, he's out injured.
SPEAKER_02Uh oh no, Dan DePrier. George Ford. Dan DePrier's the one that's left. John Luke's the one that left.
SPEAKER_01So Dan DePrier's injured. Yeah. George Ford injured. Tom Roebuck injured, Joe Carpenter injured. And in the game, Marzi White uh came off after about 15 minutes, had to bring on Ollie Davies, who's looked really good, but 19 years old. He had to um step in at 10, Rod De Prier moving back to the centre. Um so actually Sale did a pretty good job to be competitive in this game, given given that the depleted numbers. Um, Glasgow do have a few injuries themselves, but much, much stronger lineup. Um, and actually Sale started off really well. They were D and up very strong as they do. Um, really powerful. Van Rain scores after a few minutes. Um, they get a penalty, go down the corner, and just play play hard nose Sale Sharks phases, and Van Rain gets over. Um and then uh Ollie Davis himself, who's as say not on debut but only had a handful of games.
SPEAKER_02Um Champ Cup debut. Uh Champ Cup debut. And I did like the post I saw that I think literally the week before he was playing in Nat League 2 or something like that. Yeah, a week later he was making his debut in the Champions Cup. Pretty incredible.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. It's I mean it's a great, it's a great opportunity for him, but you know, it's a it's a bit of a sign of where the squad's at. Yeah, yeah. Um but no, he's got but he scored a try. Aaron Reed got a break off some quite soft D from uh from Glasgow and fed him in. Um and then just from there, I mean Rafi Quirk, he had one of those games, you know. I really like Rafi Quirk, and I think I think his ceiling's like 11 out of 10, but he's too often producing kind of four or five out of ten performances, which is why Gus War always gets the nod.
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, we've been we've been quite effusive about Rafi Quirk saying that we he's got this high ceiling, but these games are becoming more common than the good games at the moment. And I don't know, maybe maybe it's just uh the fact he's had so long out is just gonna take him a little. He needs a runner game starting. I think he hasn't really had that because Gus War is doing a good job when he's doing it.
Sale vs Glasgow: Injuries, Momentum Swing
SPEAKER_01Yeah, well Gus Gus War's giving you 7 out of 10 every week, so you'd be mad not to pick him because yeah, as you say, Rafik Works not produced one of those 11 out of 10 performances for some time, really. Um and his passing was wasn't great for a large period of this game, his kicking wasn't great, box kicking in particular. Um and that to be honest, it it gave Glasgow a bit of a route back into the match. So um they scored their first try off uh off a mall off a lineup. The Glasgow Mall was pretty notorious in the URC, um, and they got that going, and the momentum just swung all the way to Glasgow from there. Um Rory Dodge powered over after goal line phases just before the half time, and then right after half time, another poor box kick from Raffi Quirk bounces into Karl Stane's hands, who had a really good match. I didn't realise it was the skipper of uh Glasgow, it just dropped it just dropped really short and just bounced into his hands and he just stauntered through the sail defence. Um they then lost Jabulu for 10 minutes to their GIA. Um they lost Aaron Reid, had to bring on Gus War and put Rafi Quirk into the back three. So, like I mean, they were they were really real ragtag, real ragtag by that point, aren't you? Yeah, I mean it was it was really tough for them, and then uh uh Stefan McDowell Stafford Stafford Stafford McDowell, so very Scottish name, Stafford. Um, about 55 minutes in, it's all Glasgow at this point, and they get uh line out in the sale 22, go first phase, and he just runs over the top of RDP and just canters over the line. And at this point, you're thinking, right, that's this they just can't cling on because they they D'd up really well, particularly in the first half, you know, really physical, but they would you could just see they just run out of gas. Um, Tom Curry in the first half was an absolute nightmare for Glasgow, just a just nuggety at everything, and was just running out of gas at this point. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, but they managed to wrestle back a bit of momentum. Marius Lowe uh powered over there. They won a penalty at Scrum, which was really good because at that point they'd had to replace what was already their second choice scrum off with a third choice scrum off third second choice front row with a third choice front row, apologies. And uh the tight head harper, yeah, who I know is quietly being talked about as a bit of a prospect at tight head, um, absolutely went through the the Glasgow pack and won the pen. So really good from him. Kick to the corner, go phases, Mario Slogan's over. And at that point, I thought they could turn it around, wasn't quite to be. Um, but given where they're they were at by the end of that game, just with who was left on the pitch, yeah, they actually did quite well to get a point out of it. Unfortunately, it's an unforgiving competition in some ways. In a lot of ways, it's very forgiving. But I think if you lose your fur your opening game at home um against what is probably one of your easier fixtures in uh on paper, it's gonna be tough for Sale to recover from that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think I think their uh their ambitions probably now curtailed to either getting a an away fixture in the next round or dropping to the Challenge Cup.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean they go they go away to Claremont in the next round, which you know it's it's a very different prospect. Uh and then they are they're at home against the the other sharks, which they'll fancy the chances on. Yeah. Assume they've got some bodies back by then. Um and then they finish up by uh apologies, they go away to Toulouse.
SPEAKER_02Oh, that is okay. So, you know, winnable, winnable.
SPEAKER_01Um with the best win in the world, they need to get probably 10 points from the next two games. And away at Claremont, it's not guaranteed, not guaranteed at all.
SPEAKER_02Um all I'll say for sale is like their their work rate and defence. You see it in the Prem week in, week out, but it was like to see like the the tackle numbers that they put out there. So someone like I think Van Rain did like 33 tackles, yeah, which is like insane.
SPEAKER_01He's you can see why his captain, yeah. He's he's he's phenomenal.
SPEAKER_02But it does it does show how if you have to defend for long periods, I think that's why you see that 25-minute window where Glasgow just kind of took hold and kind of just ran riot, because it it takes it out of you. Like the fact that Sail are able to wrestle a back a little bit of momentum towards the end is huge credit to them. Um I think it shows that when you are defending for such long periods, like the dam does eventually burst.
SPEAKER_01Um ultimately they didn't have George Ford there to control the game, so they weren't and you know, with Rafi Quirk kicking badly, they just could they just couldn't keep control of the game by that point. Once Glasgow got the momentum, they were in real trouble. Um so they got a point out of it, so it's not it's not over for them, but they're gonna have to pull something out of the bag in Claremont.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, absolutely, especially well as Glasgow got the full five points out of it because they got the four four tries, like that, and that may considering the form they're in, they probably may not have been anticipating that, so they're probably actually in better shape.
SPEAKER_01Uh going Glasgow will be quietly confident of progressing. They have got to play Toulouse, but it's in Glasgow in the next round.
SPEAKER_02Um, but I also think if you if you're drawn into a group of Toulouse, you just kind of accept seconds you're ceiling.
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, I mean you you would think so. They they've got to travel to Claremont as well, uh, but they'll they'll be more confident. Um, but they've got a tough route because they've they finish up a home bit against Saracens. So it's not a guarantee for them, but they've given themselves every opportunity with that win because they would have been long odds to progress.
SPEAKER_02Tough old group. Saracens, Claremont, Glasgow to lose. Shark. That's a tough old group, that one. Yeah. So yeah, well, hopefully Sale are able to get the next game. Who do you say they got next week? With this weekend coming up? Is it Claremont? Claremont away. But uh I don't know whether that was I don't know if their selection in the game versus Saracens was enforced upon or optional. Um this isn't the Claremont of seven or eight years ago that was determined to win a champions cut. Well, it certainly wasn't at the Stone X, that's for sure. But uh this game alone, yeah. So it ended 21-26 to Glasgow. Glasgow getting all their points in like a 25-minute window on either side of half time. So it just showed it shows the power of kind of scoring going into the halftime break and then grabbing momentum. It shows how effective it is to get 26 points unanswered. Uh it's tricky. It's tricky to bounce back on and grab the game back. Sale did the best, they got the bonus point, but uh 21-26 probably not what you want to be considering they were ahead at half time. Uh, any other individuals or points you wish to drag out of this game in specific Rory? Because I'm conscious we have a lot of games to canter through.
SPEAKER_01No, I think I um the only one I would just highlight uh Alex Wills again in press in on the left wing, and definitely want to give him a prospector's name.
SPEAKER_02He's he's definitely a bit of a he's definitely a good mould of Tom Roebuck, I think. And it'll be interesting to see what other parts of his game he has, because obviously he's not gonna be like for like Tom Roebuck, but he's got he's definitely got the size and the speed. Yeah. Uh so it'd be interesting to see how he develops up at sale. He certainly seems to be getting game time at the moment, obviously, because Robuck's injured. Interesting to see what happens when Roebuck comes back. Now the next game on Friday night was I will put I admit, hands up, I have no insight in whatsoever, Rory. Uh, but it is Bayon versus the Stormers. And uh well, you know, a rare thing, Rory, is a South African side on the road, seemingly putting out a relatively strong team and a relatively good performance.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, actually showing up in the European Cup, which is uh nice to see.
SPEAKER_02They are top of the US moment, aren't they? The stormers, so maybe so, yeah.
SPEAKER_01So maybe they are taking Europe seriously. They are uh they they are a strong side. Uh the this result I think mostly landed with Bayonne missing a fair few, you know, the lowest amount of you won't play in.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um it would have been nice to see Bayonne have a real crack at the competition because they are a uh they are a club that I think everyone would like to see more of, particularly. With the kind of legendary home support they've got. But ultimately not just not being strong enough for this one. And you know, probably still being more uh concerned with top 14 matters than they are with with European competition. Um, so not a huge amount that um that I can say this one, other than the Stormers just having the power to um to put Bayon away with this one, you know, Swart kicking four penalties, just putting them under serious pressure. Um not a huge amount uh more to say there.
Bayonne vs Stormers: Boots And Basque Context
SPEAKER_02No, yeah, and because they had to make a late change for Warwick Golantka, I think. So they had to bring in Jonathan Roach to come into the centres, move Similany to the fullback. So they had a bit of turbulence ahead of kickoff, they dealt with it, and you know, I I've got um from what I'm looking at, which you know is my stats and everything like that, they look like they're pretty decent games. I've I've been given the nod ahead that um the winger Dylan Mart is one to watch. Uh he's been a big part of why they've had a good start to the URC. Uh and I think SWAT at flyoffs are also a big part of that. But I I I agree. I think the interesting thing with Bayonne is there's a little there's a group of very young Spanish players, which you know, as we're fans of second-tier nations, that uh they've got in their team. So they've got Hugo Gonzalez, who's like the backup prop. Uh Alvaro Garcia Yandalino, I think is a young Spanish player, they've got Manix Araqueta. It's interesting that they seem to be backing the Spanish rugby obviously well located.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the reason why that would be, I think, is Bayonne is uh effectively in Beer Ritz. Yeah, Ritz would be the Basque, and that's which is Basque, yeah. And the Basque region is your biggest rugby region in Spain, so presumably they regionally do look across um, yeah.
SPEAKER_02I just I I across the border of that. I like it because it seems like a good route for Spanish national talent. These are all names I recognise from their under 20 um pipeline.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, it's interesting. There was a there was a Spaniard playing at Prop for Cast as well. Um, caste is also very southern to the France, I believe, in the same region as Purpignon, which would be Catalan effectively.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. So yeah, it's interesting, but yeah, I there is also something here about, and it's not just top 14 specific, but I think some some clubs have either decided there's that that this competition isn't for them this year, or that there's certain fixtures they know they're not going to win, so they've not sent out their Ray team. Uh perhaps by on falling into that category. Uh we all know how important the top 14 is, how difficult a competition it is.
SPEAKER_01And well, there's always been French sides that don't don't prioritize Europe. And Montpellier are the most famous ones who just have no interest in Europe, they're only interested in the top 14. Yeah. Even in years when they've had very strong squad, they they've not really given Europe a crack. Um, so maybe Bayon fall kind of into that camp. Gut feelers, I think, you know, with their with their injuries, they thought, you know, let's let's not let's not worry too much about it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, this was a bit of a bit of a penalty fest by the looks of things. Uh, the boot of Swart kind of being a big decider here. Stormers coming away with the win 26-17. Uh, so by not even getting a bonus point at home, uh, the Stormers will be pretty pleased with that. South African side, you know, making a strong start to the Champions Cup. It'd be interesting to see how they go if they can carry that URC form through the whole of the tournament and whether they take it seriously. Because I think last year the Stormers kind of well, they they withered away and didn't really make much of an impact. So maybe this year's their year. Uh, but I haven't got much else on there on this game, Rory. I will admit. Uh, anything else from your perspective? If not, I will move on to Saturday's events.
SPEAKER_01No, let's get into Saturday.
Saracens vs Clermont: Set-Piece Maulings
SPEAKER_02Okay, Saturday. Let's start off a bit of Prem Interest one o'clock kickoff. Saracens versus Clermont. We've touched it slightly already, Rory. Uh so this is one I have been able to watch. And you know, going into this game again on my aforementioned TikTok live, everyone was saying, Oh, last year Cleremont beat Saracens twice, they were able to topple Saracens at the Stonex. Like, this is Clermont's for the taking. Uh however, this year to Clermont is not the same Clermont to previous years. Uh I think they I think they said on commentary that the there was like four teenagers in their back line at one point. Uh it's again, it seems like maybe they've decided this is a game they can't win, so let's just blood some of the youngsters instead.
SPEAKER_01Uh well, I mean, Clermont have always been very, very hometown focused in in the competition anyway. They they win their home games. Um, you know, and it is a it is a bit of a fortress going to Claremont. But even with that being said, this is a pretty disappointing showing from them. I thought, you know, the the fact that Saracens were able to get on top of them so quickly. I mean, Cynthia scored within 10 minutes, and then there's a bit of a lull for 20 or so, and then in the last 10 minutes they scored three more tries.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yes, yeah. So in that in that middle period, they were they were all over them. Um, and I think the Clement set piece just fell apart. Their scrum just couldn't handle the Saracen, and I and I I said what I said about Clement not really taking it seriously. Like Saracen, I'm not saying Saracen didn't take it seriously, but their starting hooker was James Hadfield, who's their third choice hooker. Uh they rotated Marcus Street, very good prop, but he's not their starter. But they still had absolute dominance um in the in the at the set piece. Like they um yeah, so like they Saracens didn't even need to roll out Gonzalez, for example. Like they they have ammunition left in the holster.
SPEAKER_01I think uh I mean ultimately Saracen's kind of strength is um is in has always been in their squad, whether legal law or uh or otherwise made here, no accusations made here. No accusations made here, but you know the fact that you can bring in someone like um Andy Ognomacristi as your like third choice seven to start, you know.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no Benel, no Gonzalez. Oh, that's alright, we've got another Scottish International on the bench. Hey, we're not here to judge, we're not here to judge, we're here to support Prem Rugby in this European competition. Because let's face it, we need all the help we can get, and if that's through some creative accounting, I will take it in this competition. Um, also lovely to see a certain young Mr. Callory announce himself in the European competition.
SPEAKER_01Really good finish, wasn't it?
SPEAKER_02Oh yes. Uh who was it I can't who is it was it Newsom who he does.
SPEAKER_01I think it was Newsom, yeah. I think it was it it was it was it was very reminiscent of. Do you remember the the try Johnny May scored against New Zealand? Yes, we rounded Conrad Smith, very similar kind of arcing, yeah, arcing run to that. Um and showing that he's not just uh uh a highball specialist, he's got some toe as well. Who knows?
SPEAKER_02Who who Rory? Remind me, who was it last week saying that Saracens need to make sure they use Calori more than a highball specialist? Something's coming to mind. Was there someone who said that last week? I can't who was it? Uh me, I think. No, no, you're close, you're close. Was it you, David? It was me, yes, Rory. Uh once again, I'm so glad Saracens are listening. Uh it's I'm so glad we're able to influence the sport in so many ways, Rory, because I I think what we saw from Calory. Yes, that so the first try for Stinty was actually off of a lovely bit of highball work that he did. He managed to bat the ball back until you know. Yeah. So showing exactly, exactly. But like that finish he did for his try. Oh, or it was lovely. Uh, but I think ultimately I think what we're seeing from Saracens now is I think having Elliot Daly back.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it really solidifies that backline for them, doesn't it?
SPEAKER_02It's and Malins looks like a different player to when he was covering that shirt. Malins looks Malins of old, where I think the first few weeks of the premise. Very nice finish for his try as well, the little um the little dab and go. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think it was also which uh which Cinti try was it there? Oh yeah, it was that dab, wasn't it? The Elliott Daily Dab, and they just took advantage of knowing that the uh the turf at the stone X basically means the ball doesn't go out. Yeah, leaving leaving the Clermont players blaming each other for not covering it. But I I Saracens are an interesting prospect this year. So one thing I will say in credit to Clermont, they seem to be one of the few sides who've been able to nullify Tom Willis to a degree. I think they had uh Tolfua, I think, was playing at eight, who seemed to be man marking him, and his tackling on Willis was exactly what you need to do. Get him around the ankles and just don't let go.
SPEAKER_01And just your issue with you can man-mark Tom Willis, but it's you know they should be. But that being said, you know Oh, he still had a great game. You know, he was still so involved constantly.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah. When I say that, I'm not saying he was man marked out of the game. I'm just saying that he was stock he didn't beat 20 defenders like he normally does. Um, no, that's fair. They did cover him well. And I would also say from a Clement's perspective, because I'm trying to look at positives for them, I really like the look of Baptiste Genot, another French scrum art who seems to be incredibly, incredibly smart. Probably the sixth in line for a French cap, but he looks a real handy player. Hundred caps he's got for Clermont, and he's only 22. It's made mad. And he was like an English grandmother or something. Hey, we there's another scrum art we can talk about. Yeah, we're fine, we're fine in England, Rory. Don't you worry for now. Uh, but no, like fair play. Like, he's he's a tidy, tidy player, but I think that's about it for positives like a draw out for Clermont in this game.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, ultimately, I think Claremont probably are not that worried about Europe this year. With that, you know, it is tight in the top 14. They're you know, they're they'll be in the mixer to uh make the barrage, but um it's you know they're they're still ninth at the moment, but well in the fight for it. But it's it it's just uh such a battle in that league. I think they're not not too concerned at the moment. Yeah, um they're home against Sale, they'll probably want to win that one in front of the home fans. Um, but uh yeah, home against Glasgow again, they'll probably want to win that. So they may well make the next um the next round. I don't expect them to take much of a team down to Durban for the final match, though.
Bulls vs Bordeaux: Game Of The Weekend
SPEAKER_02No, yeah, you don't really want that yeah, Miles and the legs, really, do you? It's an interesting one. It's an interesting one. Uh how the top 14's importance does play with some of these I don't want to say the mid-table top 14 teams, how seriously they take this competition. Maybe it's because they know if they push comes to shove, they get to a final, they ain't beating the top top 14 teams, let's face it. Uh so they just want to focus on solidifying themselves in that competition, which let's face it, very lucrative, probably more lucrative than this competition, which is a bit of a probably not the position it should be. Uh and also I think with Claremont, like their line out was precious. Dodgy. Uh dodgy. Uh yeah. Hard to think of positives for them, but plenty of positives for Saracens. Uh I don't know if you saw it, I did a post out kind of comparing the leagues and how the results were. Yeah, good a good week for the Prem. Good week for the Prem, bad week for top 14. Um be interesting to see if that carries on with the reverse fixtures and some of these away teams and them being at home. Uh we'll judge next week after the next round of Champions Cup about how seriously these clubs are taking the competition, I'd say. But ultimately, well done. Saracens 47-10. Um getting a big bonus point, scoring seven tries, two for Cinti, one for Malins, one for James Hadfield, Noah Calore, Hugh Tizzard, Theo Dan coming off the bench, having and Farrell and Burke getting a fair few points off the boot themselves. Oh, my doorbell's gone, Rory. I wonder what it is this time.
SPEAKER_01It's the weekly caviar and foie gras delivery. It's outrageous, really. At some point, he's just doing this to troll us, listener. Um could be bottles of Beaujolais, maybe. That's that looks like a case of champagne. That's a case of champagne.
SPEAKER_02No, no, no, it's uh it's for next door. It's not for us, unfortunately. I'll have to walk over the meadow to deliver it to them uh tomorrow. So yeah, a solid solid kilometre away the neighbours, obviously. I'm joking. I am joking. Uh so yes, where was I? Yeah, so yeah, well done, Saracens. Um next game on the menu. Uh in this one was the Bordeaux visit to Loftus Versfeld. Bulls versus Bordeaux, as a Saints fan, obviously interested in this game. Uh because it's a big one in that group. Uh what did you make of it, Rory? Bit of a score fest.
SPEAKER_01Well, for me, this was Game of the Weekend. This was phenomenal to watch. If you haven't watched it, listener, I implore you to go and watch this one back. It was so good. Um it's basically everything you'd want from a game between a French side and a South African side. It just it seeswored the whole way through. Um, you know, Bordeaux came right out the blocks, Jalabert was just on it from minute one, just making breaks, offloading one of those. Um Penot finished through about 40 defenders. I don't I honestly I don't know how he reached the line. I honestly I think some of his own team were trying to tackle him, he still made it. It was ridiculous. Um, then uh Declair comes back, Ube Bay uh don't field a kick, very reminiscent of France South Africa games. Bordeaux really did struggle with the kicking game.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, but they don't feel the kick, ended up giving away a five metre scrum, and Declerc dived in. Um, so he's was the left wing for Bulls, and they were talking him up as being the quickest player in the Bulls team. Um, didn't get a chance to him at full tilt, but definitely one to look out for if you watch any Bulls game in the future because I'd like to see how well he goes when someone like Moody's in that team. Um, he's gonna have wheels, yeah. Must have wheels straight from that like three minutes later, a beep beep, Louis BOBRA. They play they play lovely phases, they just keep going, and then uh Walkie, who's basically been involved in everything the whole game, uh gets the ball off to Jalibert, who throws just an outrageous basketball offload and and Louis B R A just dives in. It's just so good. Le beep beep. Le beep beep. Uh, and then Ludvig, the Pretoria Ball's flanker, he finishes in the corner at the other end, goes through three defenders after loads of really good phases, go back up the other. Um we're barely 20 minutes into the game at this point. Yeah, Lamate, they they pull a trick play off at the front of the line out. Lamate takes a pass off the tight head, dives in at the corner, and then we go back the other end. Aka Van der Merva scores off a brilliant offload off Andre Pollard, and then balls start getting some real momentum at this point towards the end of the half. Yeah, so Aiden Moody then scores an amazing finish, he just runs right round Burros. It's like it wasn't there. The the gas on him was ridiculous, just just went just ghosted round him, it's phenomenal to watch. Uh, and then Burros, who actually had quite a weak game, actually. Normally I really rate him, I think he's you know one of the better fullbacks in France.
SPEAKER_02But yeah, didn't you have him in your fantasy team, Rory?
SPEAKER_01Uh I did have him in my fantasy team poorly, unfortunately. Um, doesn't feel uh doesn't feel a box kick, I think it was. And then uh the balls just swept down the field, and Rudolph, I think it was, uh, who had come on by that point, uh power was over in the end. So that point at half time, it's something like 3322.
SPEAKER_023323.
SPEAKER_01There you go. 3322 at half time. So you're like, right, it can't continue in that vein. Like it was just ludicrous, it was just going end to end constantly. It's like yeah, it's not fair.
SPEAKER_02It's not fair. It's giving off this impression that rugby's like always like that.
SPEAKER_01And if only they were just they would honestly, it it was just bouncing from end to end to end. It was so good to watch, and you've got to remember this is at the elevation at Loftus Road. This is like this is where I've seen several international teams just gas after about 30 minutes because there's just no oxygen. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um, but they don't drink the Bordeaux wine, Rory.
SPEAKER_01Well, these guys were oxygenated because second half, uh there's been a broken field, uh, Bordeaux counter, and uh Palu, uh who was really, really good when he came on. Um uh which sorry started really at from second row, finishes off, they get down to the corner, he just gets great line, just dies over for it. Palu was one is one to look out for, he was brilliant. Yeah, uh, and then Jalibert puts in a grubber kick behind the ball's defence um and uh Leb beep gasses everyone.
SPEAKER_02I like that. I haven't heard that before.
SPEAKER_01And then Janibert scores a try where I can't I I literally can't even describe to the intricacies of the player are ridiculous.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's beyond it's beyond our front row brains.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Bordeaux put in a mall, which I can describe, it's just so powerful, just absolutely dominating the ball's pack. And then the backs do something weird, and Janabert ends up on going over. Yeah, um, and then Rey Asi um scores right at the end and powers over, like just about finishes up, like was being like dragged back and just about gets over. Um, and if if that sounds like a breathless review of the game, honestly, it it just it was a breathless game to watch. I promise you, you are not wasting an hour and a half of your time to go and watch this one back.
SPEAKER_02If you're trying to get a neutral into watching rugby, it's the sort of game you should show someone who's like, Oh, I don't ever want to watch yeah.
SPEAKER_01I honestly I can't um I cannot underplay how much I enjoyed watching this one. It was phenomenal.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, because I don't it's one of those games you don't need to be a fan of a club to realise how good the rugby is and to get invested because it was that it was so back and forth, it was so yeah, kind of um kind of punch counter punch, punch counter punch. It was uh really entertaining. Uh the game had everything, like fair play, and uh as a fan of a club in a group with both these teams in. One, I am definitely going to go watch Saints play balls next weekend because I think that's gonna be fantastic to just go and watch. But two, the quality, the quality in both of these teams is there.
SPEAKER_01Honestly, it was and to and to be honest, the fact that Bordeaux went in like 11 points down at half time to then come out in the second half and score 24 unanswered points. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, again, you know, not many teams go to lots of people. If you've not watched a game, yeah, if you've not ever watched a team visit Pretoria, it's difficult to comprehend how many teams I've seen just fall away in the second half because they can't handle the elevation. Yeah, let alone South Africans just live there. It's like they take you to a dark place. Yeah, yeah.
La Rochelle vs Leicester: Selection Signals
SPEAKER_02But they kneeled them, they kneeled them, they didn't let them score a single point.
SPEAKER_01Super superb game to watch. I promise you, it's it's it's worth everyone's time to go and watch that one back.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and Carl Dixon refereed it, and he wasn't the main talking point. Who to thank it?
SPEAKER_01I mean, I haven't seen anyone complaining about Carl Dixon. There we go. For once for once.
SPEAKER_02Uh yeah, fantastic. Yeah, 36 33. No, 46-33 to Bordeaux.
SPEAKER_01That is a big win for Bordeaux away. Massive. Uh massive win away at balls, and they look like they're having another tilt at it this year. Yeah. Like properly. Yeah. I think they really fancy it again.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, uh, and let's face it, they probably can do it again. Um yeah, Bordeaux look like you know, sometimes champions kind of there's a bit of a hangover. I I'm not sensing a hangover in this Bordeaux team. They seem To be they look hungry to have a few on the toe. I think they want to show that they're that Toulouse aren't the only team that can go back to back. I think Bordeaux want to have their moment where they're the dominant force in Europe. And on that display, they could do it. But sadly, we can't talk about that game for the entire podcast as much as it would be lovely to. Let's canter on to uh a couple of other former champions of this competition. Lara Shell or Stad Rochelet, depending on where you are. Uh based versus Leicester Tigers. Yeah. Tricky, tricky opening fixture for Leicester. Very tricky. Well, made a bit trickier by who they selected. Well, I may have given away my uh my angle here early, Rory, but I do feel that Leicester may have anticipated this one being a loss early doors and thought, let's give some guys some minutes, because you know, uh George Pearson at fullback. Yeah, talented young fullback, hasn't played a minute in the Premier.
SPEAKER_01No, but uh one unfortunate Sinbin aside, which I really disagree with.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, should we talk about that before you get into the game? What are your views on that Sinbin where it's the catcher using their foot as almost a brake pad?
SPEAKER_01Um I don't think that's what he was doing. It was really heightened in the stadium because as they said they mentioned on comms that Hastoy got red carded the week before for kicking out to someone in the face, and I've seen it and it is a red. Oh, yeah. This one, Pearson's jumped for the ball, he's slightly overcooked it, so he's lent back to catch it, and you know, naturally your foot's gonna come up. Um, and actually, uh Nini Ashvili, I think it was Nini Ashvili or Fav um took him out in the airs initially as a Leicester penalty, but because they took him out in the air, they basically ran into his foot, you know, and it is raised, but it's also it's it's in a natural position when you consider the fact that he's leaning back, so I think it was harsh. Um but I don't think that should be the reflection of his of his game because actually outside of that I was really impressed.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, he's good. I well I've seen him in under 20s, uh, and he's a pretty he's a pretty handy player.
SPEAKER_01So I mean he set up um set up Morro for his strategy with a really rangy, like mazey little run.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Run for several defenders, yeah. Um and he actually pulled that off a couple of times. Uh he was I you know I was I was pretty impressed by his performance. Um outside of that though, I mean I'd say for the first half an hour or so, Tigers put up what you might want to call a valiant fight, yeah. But ultimately, they were set up to fail in this fixture, and um they were just overpowered. You know, this this wasn't a La Rochelle team that came with you know that came to play, they came to dominate, you know. Yeah, this is a team with a back row, Gregory Aldry, Bottia, and Jigou.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that back row is insane. Uh let's face it. Um it's uh scary prospect that back back three. Uh and I think uh for Aldritt's opening try where he was like, alright, fine, I'll knock it over, I'll just go do it again then. Uh and just I think they showed they they were there to arm wrestle their way and show that they have a they are much more physical, much more dominant force, and Leicester just one didn't take the players, and they just didn't have an answer for it. And unfortunately, that did mean that uh Lara Shell were although it was close at half time, it did feel a little bit comfortable, it felt very comfortable for them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean there'll be there'll be some players who got some really good insight into what it's like to play top-level European rugby and that Leicester team, but ultimately I'm a bit disappointed in the titles to do that. You know, a team with that kind of heritage in the competition to take that team to La Rochelle, you know, even if you're not you know, and I know there's all the different things about you've got to rest your internationals, etc. I I I know there's lots of different things going on with this round of fixtures, but you know, they're at home against Leinster this weekend um on Friday.
SPEAKER_02They they obviously fancy their chances better against them.
SPEAKER_01Well, maybe they do, maybe they don't. I'm pretty disappointed in them for that, because I think I actually think their their best team would have made a real fist of of this game against Larchelle, because although I ultimately think the Larchelle team would have been too strong um for even their first team, they could have made a real match out of this and come away with with something more than just a bit of experience to the young players.
Leinster vs Harlequins: Brave Bonus Point
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I I agree. And I I I don't know if the likes of Tommy Rafael or I I don't know if Ilyoni's still injured, but I think there's a few players that weren't really away through the intention period. It just seems odd that they weren't selected for this. That's why it seems a bit more of a calculated decision. So yeah, so Josh Mann's, yeah, I'm sure he's gonna be a great player, but he's barely paid a handful of Prem games. Tom Mann's the same, James Thompson's a new sign, he's not played that many minutes. Uh the front row of Hafar, Heard and Claire, like that is their B team. Um yeah, it would have been nice. It would have been nice, but you know, La Rochelle could only play what's in front of them, and they certainly did. 3920 seems like feels like a fair reflection of the game. Um sadly, Leicester kind of well, they'll take experience from the event uh and nothing else. And La Rochelle will take five points and move on to their next game and be in a really good place. And I think they're one of they're probably one of the the three teams in France who may give this competition a real real go, I feel.
SPEAKER_01Well, they've been struggling in the league, I think, the last couple of seasons, but they'll they you know, they are a team that well the town was so mad for when they won the won the competition, you know, obviously won it two on the spin. I think they've just by dint of that legacy have to take the competition seriously. So um, you know, and they their fans travel quite well, so even though they're in Cape Town at the weekend, I would expect to see a few Larochell fags knocking around there. Yeah, um I think you'd be easy to spot because if you're watching the Bulls game, uh you'll notice that uh those stadiums don't get filled up for for these uh these sides.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm pretty sure we spoke about it last year how it is frustrating that you you watch the South African fixtures and they they may as well be being plays played behind closed doors with the attendances they're getting through the door.
SPEAKER_01There's no I will just say, just in fairness with African sides, um they're not the only ones suffering with bad crowds for this. I mean, the Gloss Gloss didn't sell out for their their fixture, nor did Saracen. Sale was basically one man and his dog. Saracen's was completely empty, really. Um I know even Harlequins are struggling to sell out games and they they sell out every home fixture.
SPEAKER_02Why do you think that is?
SPEAKER_01I think people have lost interest in the competition. The Scarlet was empty, and I know Welsh rugby's got all sorts of problems at the moment, but you'd think you know, technically against Bristol, you'd think that would be a big draw.
SPEAKER_02Everyone's been saying that, oh, let's bring the Welsh regions into the Prem. Everyone loves the Anglo-Welsh competitions. Well, you've got an opportunity to do it. There was no bugger there. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I do wonder whether people are just not interested in this competition.
SPEAKER_01Um I think I think I think they've made a real mistake with this competition the way it is. They've they've overemplayed the format's poor, there's too many teams, no one understands it. They've put it on a channel that has lost a lot of viewers. Um, let's be honest, you know. I know I know that URC's on there, and I appreciate that for our followers who are URC fans, they'll feel like we're slicing it for that reason. But with the best one in the world, the viewership's not on premier sports for club rugby, it is on TNT, yeah, and uh nor is the standard of production art either, because the games I've watched is pretty poor. Some of well, so even just that the quality of stream wasn't great for a lot of them. Um, but yeah, I think they've really diluted the value of the competition. The that old adage of more rug, like more games equals more value, which is they've copied from football. Maybe I mean I I think even football's reached the peak level for that. I think even I think people have even lost interest in a lot of the football, like even in the Champions League where they've done they've done this. But in rugby, I just think it's they've lost the heritage of the competition, and it's oblique.
SPEAKER_02Sadly, is it a bit of a foreshadow for the world cup where there's a similar approach been taken? I'm afraid to say I think it might be. Uh, because I've I'm already thinking like we saw the World Cup Raw. Had we spoke about the World Cup draw last week, Rory? I can't remember. I don't think we had. That should have fit in the new section, shouldn't it? Uh, but yeah, obviously the World Cup could do that in the end. Uh obviously there was that, and I've seen the draw of that, and I'm not really that excited for the group stage of the World Cup now because it seems all a bit obvious. Uh, and you do wonder I think the only thing that keeps Champions Cup interesting for me is the quality of teams is so high in most of the groups that you get very good games. But unless you're generally interested in watching all these teams, I I don't think a fan of if there's a great game going on in South Africa and no one watches it, does it really happen?
SPEAKER_01Exactly.
SPEAKER_02That that ancient ancient proverb. Um but it does it does make you think like if if someone is like a diehard Leicester fan and all they care about is Leicester, they probably only care about the Prem at this stage, and they're probably like, oh I'm not I'm not gonna bother getting the extra subscription to watch them in this competition, I'm not gonna bother to go watch them live, I'll just care about the Prem.
SPEAKER_01I think he's a die in the wall Quinns fan, and he is he is absolutely devoid of interest of Europe. Um he said I'm not paying for another subscription, and I'm I'm almost certainly not going to go to the games unless unless you know I've got absolutely nothing else on.
SPEAKER_02It's interesting. It is interesting. I don't whether whether there will be any change in that approach, I don't know. But I think what we're seeing here from some English sides is that clubs have a similar approach to it than the fans. Um and only some yeah, yeah, we'll see we'll we'll see how it goes. But I I think you're right. Larishelle, big win for them. Leicester, some experience at the bank for some young young players. Uh that does start to make you think about the uh importance of this competition, though, and where we go from there. And moving swiftly on to the next game, Leinster versus Harlequins. But hey, before we dig into that, well done, Harlequins, for not getting niled at Leinster.
SPEAKER_01Well, yeah, I mean, firstly that, um, and I I don't know if you've seen the full game back on this one. I would put this as my nomination for Quinn's best performance of the season.
SPEAKER_02It's just a shame they were playing against a Leinster team that were.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean ultimately too much quality, too much continuity. Yeah, yeah. Um, but Quinn's uh, you know, and uh to be fair, Quinn's missing Tyrone Green, Marcus Smith, Alex Donbrandt, Cunningham Sands, um, yeah, you know, Jack Kenningham, you know, it it this was not absolute top-level Quinn's team. No, properly, properly gave this a good go. You know, showing actually Worcester Tigers what could potentially be achieved if you if you have a crack at some of these teams because they made life really uncomfortable for Leinster. Um, it was like worrying signs early on when Lama scored after like three or four minutes. Yeah. Um flashbacks off uh yeah, yeah. Um you know, and he powered through like three defenders to finish in the corner as well. It's like you know, you at that point you're thinking, oh, this could be another another one of those. But then they go back up, and Northmore um does a similar job, powers through you know, several several players. Will Evans made a break, and then after a few phases, Northmore powers over, and you go, Oh no, there's a game on it. Um and you know, again, it's a bit topsy turvy, you know. Lama scored another one, Ringro scored, but then Cleves scored a really nice try. Um, lovely to see him back on the paddock after all his hamstring injuries.
SPEAKER_02Do you know what's frustrating with Cassius Cleves? I think it's been I think that's the third time we've said lovely to see him back. Um he keeps picking up these injuries. Hopefully he gets a good one.
Scarlets vs Bristol: Cagey And Physical
SPEAKER_01He's a physical specimen, right? But because he's quite young, he's at that age where he's still physically developing, and players, particularly really muscle-bound players at that age, are really susceptible to to injuries because your your body's still developing so much. Um, but if he can settle in, settle into his physique, he's there's so much selling. You know, it was a really nice, it was like a one-two with um with Northmore, score the try off the back of a line out. Really nice try. Um, you know, as I say, let Leinster ultimately had way too much quality um in the end. But you know, I think if you if I was a Queens fan, having watched this game, I'd have gone, I'd have come away with my head held really high, actually. I thought they were I thought they were really well worth their bonus point, you know, really hard nosed indeed, made an absolute mess of uh Leinster's breakdown, you know, turnovers from the likes of Law Day, obviously Will Evans, obviously always involved in those. Uh Oscar Beard, very effective at the breakdown. Murley was was a menace there. Murley was absolutely mad indeed. I mean he he was properly banging people.
SPEAKER_02There are times where I watch Merley and I think he's just a super quick back rower the way he defends at times. Yeah, he's he's he's very, very good at the breakdown.
SPEAKER_01Real real uh Jack Knoll vibes from Merley. Yes, absolutely, absolutely possibly even quicker than Null.
SPEAKER_02I think he's just a quicker Jack Knoll. Yeah, which is no bad, this is no slight on Jack Knoll.
SPEAKER_01But yeah, he was he was excellent, like genuinely excellent. Actually, uh Cam Anderson of 15, brilliant, but had a brilliant, brilliant game. Um, Northmore, it had it not been for the fact that Leinster obviously won the game, would have been mad at the match, I think.
SPEAKER_02Northmore was he's reminding people how he got himself into the England squad. Um he does do a good job of filling that old Esther Hazen sized fast gap.
SPEAKER_01We spoke about it, was it last week we spoke about it when they put Jared Evans at 12? We're like, we got Northmore on the bench. Yeah, they put Northmore at 12. Yeah, obviously, Jared Evans has been 10, but just him and Oscar Beard as a centre partnership is so potent. Yeah, um Beard scored a 70 meter try to secure the bonus point at the end. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um and who'd have thought Harlequins fans, you got a bonus point away to Leinster after last year. You that's what dreams are made of for Quinn's fans.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I I I think off the back of that, you know, we know from Saints last year that having a tough time in the league doesn't preclude you from having a good European season. You know, these things don't have to always tally. You know, Quinns are at home against Bayon next week, yeah. And they'll they'll go they should go into that with real real confidence that they're gonna um get a result. They're then home against the Stormers. So by that point, they could already be qualified before they go to La Rochelle.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you know, it's they've got a good they've got a good run there. Uh Bayon, I think, will be eminently beatable. Um five points. It's just whether Harlequins perform like we saw them in this game or they perform like we've seen them in some of the Prem games.
SPEAKER_01I think that's the that's the thing they're such a parochial side, yeah, that you really don't know what you're gonna get from them. But if they turn up, you know, they are they are they they can still really pull it out of the bag. Um, really nicely Lucas Friday get half an hour on the pitch as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um I'm hoping this is gonna be a breakthrough year for him. Um yeah, you know, he looks he looked really good, looked really comfortable at that level, actually. Um, but um yeah, ultimately they didn't get the win here.
SPEAKER_02So that's no Leinster still a genuine trophy threat.
SPEAKER_01I would say well look, there's still only a handful of teams that would go into a game against Leinster confident they're coming away with the result. Yeah, so Northampton's still the reality.
SPEAKER_02Northampton Toulouse and Bordeaux, the three best teams in Europe, right? Um well, I mean, on basis of last year, yes, probably. Yes. Um thank you, Rory. Well, yeah, any any side that can throw out R. G. Sneyman and Ray Rico Yoani, they're gonna be a threat.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, and you know, even their sort of less fancy players, like uh Jimmy O'Brien at fullback was really, really good. Yeah, um, Tommy O'Brien on the wing scored a great trial for quite a bad crossfield that sent him backwards. Yeah, yeah. And he just sort of grubbered past, I think it was Cam Anderson.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think both the O'Brien's were both the O'Brien's were really, really good.
SPEAKER_01Um Lama, who's been kind of out of the picture for a little while, he's not you know, he's not been on form for some time, looked really good again. Yeah. Um, and then you've got you know, they again they've got a back row, well, a back five in the pack, Sneeman, McCarthy, Conan, Van der Fleer, Doris. It's just hard to beat that kind of quality.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's uh that's pretty potent, that one.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so you know, Leinster, you you'd still have to go some to beat Leinster. There's there's no two ways about it. You would you just would. So that yes, they're a they're definitely a trophy threat, but they're not infallible. I don't, you know, I don't I wouldn't go if I were you know the the names you mentioned, Bordeaux to lose Northampton, Bath, I think would you know on the right week, probably at home, I you know, all those kind of teams would fancy their chances. Probably Saracens, I think, would probably fancy their chances on a one-off game. Um you know, they're not unbeatable by any stretch.
Bath vs Munster: Lineout Destruction
SPEAKER_02No, no, which is I think is it makes it's all it's good for the competition, um having a beatable Leinster. I'm fine with that. I'm fine with that. Uh but it did end 45-28 to Leinster, so it's a pretty big score uh for them home at the Aviva bonus point, another five points for them. Uh when do when and where do they play uh Larochell? Because I think that'll be a Humdinger.
SPEAKER_01Leinster or Quinn, sorry. Leinster. Uh Leinster play Larochelle at home on the 10th. Okay.
SPEAKER_02I think that's that's a good one to try and pen in to have a lot of. That'll be one you want to watch. Yeah. Yeah. Uh hopefully Larochel is still interested in sending a team outside of France. I'm sure they will. So yeah, I think that might be the game of the round uh that weekend. Well, certainly the game of the group. That'll be very decisive for where those teams end up. Uh but yeah, ominous for the rest of the group that Leinster are looking pretty good, but positives for Harlequins getting 28 points at the Viva. Regardless of how many you can see, it's pretty good going. A bonus point, probably something that they would have taken before the game if it was offered to them. So not a bad day at the office at all. Then we move on. We move on, Rory. Scarlets to Bears, we touched it already. Little little Anglo-Welsh head-to-head, tete a la tete, whatever they say. Tete tet. Uh at the Parkiscarlets. Good to see a European rugby at Parky Scarlets again. Good to see a Welsh region in the competition. I mean, it didn't seem like they thought that, but yes, it is. Um yeah, it would have been nice if uh people would have turned up, but yeah, we've touched.
SPEAKER_01Well, they missed out because this was quite this was quite an absorbing game. Um, not probably of the kind of quality or um obviously not those kind of tri-scoring exploits of some of the other games, but pretty absorbing, really physical battle. Um, I was pretty impressed with how Scarlet's end up in this one.
SPEAKER_02They felt really they fronted up well, didn't they?
SPEAKER_01Massively, massively fronted up, um, and really put um put Brist under serious pressure. Um, I was really impressed with the Scarlet Wings. Uh Tom Rogers, we know, he scored a hat-trick against New Zealand recently, we know quality of him. Um Ellis Me, I think. Well, he's had he's certainly had Wales cats, but in you know, games when Wales have done pretty poorly. Yeah, I think it wasn't a player I'd seen huge quality from, just I didn't know who he's played for, but he was very good in this one. Yeah, um Costello at 10. I thought was really good. Um, you know, again, another one who's had who I'd only ever really seen in quite struggling Wales performances.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but it was quite nice to see some of these Welsh players play in an actual fluent, yeah, thought out system, and it shows that you know there is there is some positivity in there, like the likes of. Gareth Davies, a player, a scrum halves whose name used to bring fear to English fans. They seem to always score breakaway tries against England. It's just good to see that they are still there. So Eddie James at 13, he's he's a really good, he's a really, really good young centre for the Scarlets. Yeah. Johnny Williams, uh, once touted as being the future of England's centres when he was at London Irish, I think, picked up a really bad injury and has kind of struggled to find his feet in other clubs. But it's good to see him kind of finding him himself in Welsh rugby. Yeah. So yeah, I I'm you know, it's it's there's optimism there for Scarlets. But there was a lot to like about their performance.
SPEAKER_01Um but you know, after three minutes, it was looking pretty ominous when Bill Matter kind of sauntered through the um uh the defence.
SPEAKER_02It's it's ominous wherever Bill Matter is, because if Bill Matter sauntering towards me. Yeah, if he's sauntering towards me, I'm I'm feeling ominous. No, yeah. Scary chap to have running at you. Uh so yeah, it's fair to go that way. 100%.
SPEAKER_01Um, but you know, the Scarlet's then put the pressure on. They they have a try disallowed about 10 minutes after that, which was I think they went back too many phases to check the knock on.
SPEAKER_02Oh, it's very annoying how often that happens.
SPEAKER_01It's like I'm pretty sure you can't go back like four phases to check that. That's that's a bit was it knock-on or was it forward pass? I forget which phase.
SPEAKER_02I forget. Is is there actually a limit written into the law book? I'm sure there was like two phases or three phases, but I can't remember. So I thought there was as well, but it's very often now where they seem to go back many, many phases to knock-ons and forward passes to just disallow things. Maybe it's part of the how TMOs just get really involved these days, but it does feel like we're going a bit far back just to try and rule things out.
SPEAKER_01TMO's again pretty interventionist on this whole weekend, I think. But yeah, um, but no, I mean, you know, Scarlet specifically their kicking game, the highball game. Um, we're putting Bristol on a lot of pressure because you know Tom Rogers and uh as me were really good under the highball, and Revu Vu in particular struggle because it's not really his forte. No, um what is his forte is amazing offloads, and he chopped out another brilliant one to put Bill Matter in for a second after about 17 minutes or something.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, um there's few things in life that are certain. Vuvo doing an outrageous offload is up there, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, death taxes and an absolute arrageous offload from uh Revu Vu are all guaranteed. Yeah, just lovely. Um, but uh you know, let's say Scarlet's came back again. Gareth Davis sniped for a nice try um just after a half-hour mark, and it was just high. I mean, at that point I think it was 1210, something like that. Yeah, half time was 1210. Um yeah, so you know, really tight, really tight game. And again, after the first sort of few minutes, it looked like Bristol were just gonna walk all over Scarlets in this one, and it just really didn't end up being that way. And the second half was super cagey. Um, a couple of penalties for Scarlets, and Lewis Rusamek gets the um gets the kind of the deciding score basically off his knees. I'm not really sure how he scored it, to be honest. It was a really weird one. Um, but yeah, I mean Bristol kicked pretty poorly. Um they were they suffered, particularly when Worsley went off, but actually they kind of suffered all day. Whenever it wasn't Kieran Mami and kicking, they kind of just kicked badly and quite short, sort of gave gave Scarlet's quite a lot of easy entries into their half um off their kicks. But you know, Scarlet's just loads of endeavour, loads of loads of hard work, really, really physical. We'll probably be pretty disappointed not not to have got more out of the game, but um, you know, and Bristol I think we can breathe a bit of a sigh of relief. I know going away is never easy in Europe, whoever it is, but Scarlet's at the bottom of the URC, and um Bristol made really hard work at this one.
SPEAKER_02Yes, I think this this is the fixture for Bristol that they would have been circled as a must-win because if you're not winning this one, the rest of the group doesn't get any easier.
SPEAKER_01No, and to be honest, the fact they didn't get a bonus point, I think, is could be a could be a real issue for them because they are home against Poe in the next one. We'll see how that goes. Poe obviously struggling with injuries, as we'll we'll discuss, but yeah, um, and maybe more focused on top 14, but you know, they are second in the top 14. Uh, they're then away at the Bulls, you know. Again, they may fancy their sales over there, but I wouldn't back them necessarily, and then they're home against Bordeaux. Oh, love. So not an easy three fixtures if Bristol has imagined.
SPEAKER_02That is literally the definition of just a rising difficulty setting. Yeah, in the fair that's that's that's a tough challenge for Bristol. Um, interesting to see where they land in this pool, uh, specifically as I am a Saints fan who's also in that pool. I don't know if I mentioned it, Rory. I don't know. You've mentioned it once or twice in the past. I've mentioned it once or twice, but you know, they got the win 17-16, so real close one. Um, quite cagey, but as you say, quite captivating at the same time.
Pau vs Northampton: Scrum Dominance & TMO
SPEAKER_01Uh yeah, sometimes you know, some games like Bald's Bordeaux, you're you're captivated by because of how breathless and how exciting it is, and some games are just captivated because you it's not the quality but the the kind of intensity and pressure of it kind of gets you, and it's again, you know, Scarlet's really made a good fist at this one.
SPEAKER_02They did, they did. Uh moving on, the final game on the Saturday, uh, Bath versus Stu. Wow.
SPEAKER_01I'm making horse noises, listener, because uh I know how good Bath are. You know, I realize that uh I'm often accused of anti-bath bias because of my pretty obvious anti-bath bias, but I did not see this result come in because it's Munster. Yeah, you know, do you know what I mean? It is Munster, and for for men of our age, that is a name that rings beer into the heart of anyone watching European rugby because they just turn up and make your life hard, or at least they normally do. Yeah, um, this week never got a look in because uh well Bath first and foremost demolished their line out. Yeah, I mean, to the point where I mean we're gonna talk about Gloucester in a bit and how bad their lineup was. Munster were sixes and sevens this one because they just couldn't win a lineup for the life of a they just can't they had no answers to what Bath were doing. Yeah, um they gave away a penalty try. Uh Ty Byrne, my worst pick of the round in my fantasy, getting binned after five minutes for swimming up the ball and collapsing it. Yeah, um, Ben Spencer was just kicking phenomenally well. He just I think as soon as they realized that the uh the monster lineup was was in pieces, he just knew all he had to do was kick it, kick to touch, yeah, and it just did so well.
SPEAKER_02It says a lot that when the other side's lineup becomes a weapon for you, that's yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, yeah, 100%. Um yeah, miles read scored after 10 minutes, scrum, phase, pick and go. Just the power of it.
SPEAKER_02Miles is miles read one of the most underappreciated players in English not in bath. Not in bath. How good was he? Like, at what point do we actually genuinely need to start thinking about him being international level? Because I know we talk in the past about having these superpowers.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. That man has superpowers. He he is he's genuinely phenomenal. Like, he is genuinely phenomenal. There's there's no two ways around it. Like, there's no there should be no secret to this now. Marles, there's a reason Marles Reed gets in this team, yeah, with all that star power, and it's because he is every week, you know. We talk about those kind of seven out of ten a week players, he's more like an eight or nine out of ten a week player, like to the point you know, he is probably international quality. Um, again, he's just got so much competition to shift to get in there, but most nations, you know, I don't know. Other nations will be thinking it's really annoying that you don't have other heritage that we could pray on.
SPEAKER_02I'm sure you know, there's probably been some Welsh, Scottish, and Irish scouts that are thinking, have you have you got an aunt maybe that lived in Abertiery?
SPEAKER_01Or you know did you have a third cousin that ever uh visited Dunfermline? Yeah, exactly. Uh because he's genuinely phenomenal, he was so good in this game. Um, Arundel, another lovely one. It's similar to the try against Fiji, just dude over the top from Redpath, just gasses everyone.
SPEAKER_02When you can literally walk over the line, it says a lot.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, ridiculous. Just ridiculous. It's so much time, it was so much faster than everyone else there. Oh, no one else is here. Okay, yeah, just ridiculous. Um, and then Tom Dunn scores and Multri for the bonus point. And this is after 18 minutes. I I honestly I've never seen a Monster side so comprehensively dismantled. Yeah, like to the I've never seen it, you know, unheard of.
SPEAKER_02Bath mean business in this competition this year. I thought I think they are they are gunning for it, they have to be.
SPEAKER_01They they are properly on one. Um, very few shining lights for Munster. The only one is a dogbow, uh second row who I hadn't really come across beforehand.
SPEAKER_02I'd so I've I'd seen his brother Sean uh in a couple of under 20 stuff. I hadn't captured much of Edwin, but yes, no absolute unit took his try really well, really, really powerful.
SPEAKER_01Um, and you know, really good feet as well. So, you know, putting a little shimmy at points. Yeah, um, you know, I don't think it was at fault for the lineup falling apart, but obviously, you know, if you're a second row, you're part of that equation. Yeah, but you can certainly see why there's some whispers in Ireland about uh about this kid because he's he looks a prospect. Um you know, there was a bit of a a bit of a shift towards Monster at that point, a little bit of momentum got back to them at that point. You know, Will Stewart got binned for pushing a lifter and like you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. Lots of penalties given away. But then um before the before the end of the half, Bath wrestled about momentum, they uh keep the pressure on at Scrum, kick chase, pick and go, Ben Urbano. Just very Bath classic try, set piece, kick chase, pick pick and goose, just picking goose, picking goose.
SPEAKER_02Um also that was pretty sad news about Will Stewart as well, picking up that ruptured account.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yeah, um yeah, that is sad news for for him. He's really, really good this season, particularly sad that that also Ashra Puka for Jorge looks like he's gonna be out for a while as well. So um tiehead uh looking a little bare, tight couple of little bear at the moment for Ingmans, but you know, opportunities for maybe for AFF as open, Trevor Davison, Billy Seller, Billy Seller, yeah, yeah. So there's options around, but yeah, sad sad that he's a because he's got been going really well. Um but uh yeah, I mean Craig Casey scored on half times again. You're sort of thinking 35-14, you know, Monster have pulled off some crazy performances in the past, but second half never really got a sniff, and Ted Hill finishing it off right before the end of the match. It was nice to see Ted Hill on the rugby pitch. Um it was nice to see him on the Premier pitch. Um yeah, um yeah, not much I said. I mean, Bath was just so impressive. The only thing I would say, did you think Finn Russell had quite an average performance? Kick two dead. I I I know I know don't be wrong, I know it was biblical weather, right?
SPEAKER_02I guess not one it was Bath by name and Bath by Nature in the stadium. Uh Finn Russell this season hasn't set the world on fire, I'd say. And he is he is susceptible for this. He it's not unknown for him to have kind of prolonged periods of dips in form. It is something he's known for. So whether you know he secured that new contract, maybe he's just kind of like, oh cool, I can kick back a bit. I don't know. I I'm I'm not I'm no expert and I don't know Finn Russell. I'm sure me accusing him of taking his foot with the gas is probably way off the mark. But it does it does feel like he isn't the master, he isn't the puppeteer leading Bar after all these victories, he's just a part he's just a cog and what is a very efficient machine, and it's not because of how good he's playing, he's just you know No.
SPEAKER_01Do you know what I kind of thought was we love Finn Russell for kind of how casual he looks on the foot? He it's at times he's looking a bit over casual at the moment. He's looking a little bit like I don't really care about what the outcome is here.
SPEAKER_02Or is it just because Bath are so dominant at the moment, both domestically and so even better?
SPEAKER_01Maybe like you know, obviously he looks brilliant in other teams where maybe the quite level of quality on average isn't as good.
SPEAKER_02Maybe it's just that maybe it's just too easy for him, and he's got too much of an armchair, so he doesn't need to try as hard.
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, but I you know, I did come away from that game thinking, you know, not I wasn't over enamoured with his performance, but you know, that is it. I mean, he says some nice touches, he's still Finn Russell.
Toulouse vs Sharks: Ominous Class
SPEAKER_02He's still Finn Russell. Uh I'm sure he'll probably go out next week and absolute have an absolute 10 out of 10 performance to prove us wrong. Now, I'm very conscious that we are rattling through games and rattling through time on this podcast, and there's there's still a couple of games we are keen to get into, Rory, uh from our perspective. So let's move on quickly. So Bath won 4014. Next game, Poe up against Northampton Saints. Now, for this game, I reached out to our friends over at La Ros Beef's Rugby, the Ross Beef's rugby podcast, because I wanted to get an insight from him because he is a Poe fan. Well, half of them is a Poe fan, and I was like, tell me your thoughts of this game. So I'll just give out a couple of the highlights. Um obviously they thought brilliant game, Scrum was a disaster, uh has been dreadful for recent seasons, but they they thought those days were behind them. Uh obviously, a number of players being out because of injuries, Montoya, Maddox dropping out in the daily game. Uh, any rest player who was going to France or trained with France this autumn was all dropped, so they knew it was going to be tricky. Uh, and in the scrum, Le Clayette was missing, who's been in great form, had their second choice, second rows. But uh still a bit surprising how easily Northampton dismantled that scrum, uh, especially because they brought on Papidze to steady up, who's been one of their better scrummagers, and it didn't change the to the tide. Yeah. Felt that they did well to stay in the game for as long as they did, um, but kind of gave away giving away free kicks and penalties every scrum just kind of stole any momentum. Uh pleased with Desperate's kicking game, really pleased with how Robson and Suverby who came on for Robson did at Scrum half. Half We on the Wing, who's been an absolute star for them this season in the top 14, has come out of nowhere, picking up two lovely tries. Uh so very happy with that. But a very frustrating perspective for them coming away with nothing after having what they seemed thinked was a good performance. But considering in recent years, Poe have been kind of bottom dwellers in the top fourteen, I think there's there's there's a lot of positivity and optimism around that club at the moment, how things are going. Yeah, this is their first year back in the top top level for a long time, right? Yeah, and um I think that it was quite a long conversation, but uh ultimately that he's he's thinking that maybe because of this result, Poe may take their eye off this competition because top 14 will obviously become their focus. They're currently second, as you say. They're in a position that they probably weren't expecting to be in. Uh but it it seems to be a bit of a rising force. Their coach is the ex-France under-20 coach who was in charge of that that group of French under under-20s where they are really, really dominant. I think it's when Pasolo Touilang was kind of ripping up trees for them. Uh and he has openly stated he wants to focus on developing young French talent, which, from a Saints fan perspective, I can very much admire because it's a very similar philosophy that the Saints team has of uh using Academy, using young English players and kind of developing them and using that as your model. So, like uh they seem to be the Northampton Saints of the Pyrenees.
SPEAKER_01Um lovely way to put it. I think um so I think I thank you for the guys at Rosby's for uh for that bit of context because um it I did a bit of digging. Um I went onto the Poe website to see kind of what their wider score, because it's not a I don't watch loads of top 14. So I wanted to see, you know, how does this team kind of stack up against the players they have available? Because I knew that Joe Simmons was at the club but not playing, at a Selkby, yeah. Um uh the centre's name's just kind of escaped my mind for a second. He's got a couple of France caps, not Gorges. Gayetan. Gayatan, yeah, um Guyard, you know, I then knew there was some players, Montoje, obviously. So that all that context put into put into that. What's your honest assessment of this Saints performance? Obviously, bonus point wear in a way in France, never to be sniffed at. Never to be sniffed at. Given this is a team that hasn't really played at the top level of Europe, and certainly not for a very long time, missing a lot of players, uh, a mixture of kind of squad players and very young players. So it's quite a leading question, obviously, with all that context. But what is your assessment of um of Saints after this game?
Gloucester vs Castres: Bonus Point Despite Lineouts
SPEAKER_02So, remembering the backdrop of us getting demolished last week at Bristol, yeah, remembering that, uh I I come away from it feeling relatively optimistic. Seeing the scrum go as well as it did filled me with um joy and happiness and rainbows and sunshine. Uh seeing how the influence of Alex Mitchell and how important he is to that team, you can see it. Obviously, I think the first half specifically, there was maybe I think at one point we had seven entries into the 22 and hadn't scored a point. Uh so there was a there was still some disconnection. It was there was still lots of passes being dropped or completely just misplaced, and that put us on the back foot quite a few times. Uh so that was obviously.
SPEAKER_01So I think this this was my big takeaway from Saints in this one was kind of how surprisingly profligate you were, because actually, I would say your ruthlessness is one of in those situations, is one of the big things at Saints, right? You take those opportunities.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but I I I would put that down to like you have to remember, like the Saints back line probably haven't played a game together for about six weeks. If you can if you consider the game we had last week where it was a very different selection, uh Mitchell Smith, uh Dingwall Hutchinson kind of connection, they haven't played a game together for six weeks or so. So I I think I think the timing issues I can kind of allow because it was just timing issues, and there was the odds of time where it showed that it was on it was still working.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, um, I mean the ding the Dingwall try was phenomenal, as was the Ram Ram second try. Yeah, both really, really good, like great interplay. Like properly phenomenal tries to watch. Um yeah, with that with all that kind of context in there. Look, I think from from from my perspective watching this, I thought uh I thought Saints showed that they're a lot better than actually this performance probably.
SPEAKER_02Oh, if if everything had stuck, Saints Saints probably would have put 50 on Poe in this game, I'd say. Yeah. Um and I think because of that we kind of let them back in quite a few times, and and they they took advantage of the opportunities they got, and they kind of and they didn't get they didn't have that much of the ball. Like it was a lot of the rugby was played by Northampton. Um obviously having the scrum as dominant as it was as a big part. The yet the red card to Ram, like I can't argue with the red card, like it was what it was. Wasn't a massive fan of uh Gomez having a little smile on the ground. The medic comes and says, Oh, look like I loved it. I loved it. I'm sure you did, but I was like, oh god. That's great. So blatant. Um, but you know, it's funny. It's you can laugh at it because it didn't influence the game all that much. But if this was a game that went down to the wire or was a final, I'll be seething. Uh there's a few moments where it felt quite frustrating how much Piardi seemed to be influenced by the T MO and how much the TMO may have been influenced by the crowd as being suggested by Andy Good, not by me. Uh uh before you get in there. Uh and George Furbank did ask the question on the pitch, like how how often are we gonna be stopping and checking everything? Because it did seem we were checking absolutely everything for five minutes. Yeah. Um which is quite frustrating. But you know another one is weak the TMO was far too involved. The TMO got way too involved. And I think there was a coup there was one of I think there was a try that was a couple maybe and disallowed for knock-ons that they went back for several phases. It's just frustrating. Like it's a game how far back that that line out that because the player threw it back in that whole farce of the TMO get involved in that saying oh so he didn't touch the line so it should still be a Powe ball but if you let the game carry on Poe ended up in the in touch anyway but for some reason it's just messy and it's unnecessary and I don't think that's what a TMO's there to do. And no it's it's too interventionist.
SPEAKER_01Yeah I look I think I think there's a PRD's not our favourite referee in in World Run B to be honest.
SPEAKER_02And it's not the first time he's had this sort of interest in the game but from a Saints fan it's really good to see Hendy back really good to see Ram back. I I think it's very very promising from a Saints perspective that these players are coming back from injury and the meshed again just absolutely integral. Again he dropped a few balls uh but he also was an absolute pest and uh it's obviously a very big part of the Saints game plan now is having him as a bit of a um yeah they've worked him out they've worked out to use him anyway. Yeah and it's and it's working really well and I think as we said last week him alongside Alex Coles works so much better uh than alongside Ed Prouse. Hello dog. My dog's come to say hello. But yeah I yeah from a Saints perspective I'm uh really I was quite pleased five points you should be I'd like to ask your opinion on on a few things uh firstly off weeze finish for his first try just how like how did he get that down how is it just brilliant I loved it yeah answers on a postcard I don't know how he did it but fair play fair play to the chap wheels wheels on him serious wheels on him uh uh Alex Coles is he having a post England bounce where he just he seems to have he's almost seems like he's hitting another I know Saints fans have always rated him really highly but he seems like he's even hitting another level above that I maybe because he seemingly ended the autumn international periods as like the first choice second row alongside of Toji maybe he's starting to feel that that's his level and I I've always rated Alex Coles really highly obviously but I do it it does feel like he's maybe he's just a bit of confidence around him he feels like that's his level so he's just going that's his just natural baseline now. I've enjoyed watching him this season he's I mean he's a menace in the loose he is a menace in the loose he's got some serious gas so some good hands he knows how to spot a good line and spot a gap and he's he's got an engine where he can do those supporting lines that you would expect from a back rower and that's kind of why you see him sometimes in the six shirt. So I think that's why he's a really useful option to say Borthwick because he does have that bit of versatility as well.
Edinburgh vs Toulon: Storm And Statement
SPEAKER_01So yeah I think him and him and Chesham are quite actually quite similar players. Absolutely quite a good battle between those two yeah yeah yeah absolutely and then the last one Henry Pollock uh was he being booed because the French now inherently hate Henry Pollock or was he being booed because he's on top of dyeing his hair blonde he's decided to sport a rat tail as well.
Next Round Predictions & Closing
SPEAKER_02It is interesting that he's getting booed by a French crowd before he's even set foot to play in France before and has has hasn't played a French team France ever before haven't played Poe before and yet for some reason they really hate it is I this is po this is post uh Ubai final booing though isn't it it is but why why are Poe fans booing but obviously he's just living in every single other nation's heads at the moment uh I'm I'm here for it he's here for it he enjoys it he plays up to it uh is it the rat tail wouldn't be my choice but he can do what he wants as far as I'm concerned oh I'd love to see you with a sport in a rat tail all I'd say on Henry Pollock is this season I'm yet to see in a Saint shirt I I haven't seen the heights of some of his performances last year yet no I didn't want to um it's difficult because he because of who he is and because of how hyped he is by us as much as anyone um I don't want to be the guy who immediately jumps down when he's not in massive form but I think the reality is he hasn't been in he's not been bad so he's not been so one thing he's still doing he's he's still making really really important turnovers at important times he's still been doing that so like he's still doing his job as a back rower but it's the things that we got used to seeing last year we're not seeing we're not seeing a lot of him with ball in hand at the moment but to be fair this season he's mostly come off the bench in both a Saints shirt and an England shirt he's not really had much of a chance for a runner a starter yet so maybe we'll see that once he starts starting more and I think that's more down to how well Callum Chick and Tom Pearson have been playing like he can't drop them so you just I think Pollock's quite happy with coming off the bench and being an impact player so uh I just want to see him make a bit more of an impact but that's by no means saying he's not playing well no doubt he will though I don't I don't think he's you know he's not a shrinking violet you know I think even if he's slightly out of form I don't think he's gonna um back away from the challenger bouncing back. Not at all not at all but yeah in in uh in the aim of trying to canter through this podcast and not make it a two hour special uh this fixture and 35 27 Northampton bonus point for Northampton actually taking away a bonus point from Poe uh because they they only picked up three tries so them going scoreless uh I kind of agree with Ross Beefs in that maybe they'll take their eye off this tournament and maybe maybe we've made the route for the likes of maybe Bears a bit easier because I suspect they may not take it quite so seriously next weekend. We'll see but it's a great start from Northampton moving on another bit of a powerhouse Toulouse versus the Sharks a bit less of a powerhouse if you look at the teams well I mean still quite quite a lot of good names you know like some of Pimpi and Hendrix sir and yeah you know there's there's still some names in uh there's certainly some names there's certainly some names but yeah I mean this was fairly routine for for Toulouse uh ultimately yeah um all I'll say is capawato as my captain was an inspired choice by me very frustrating very frustrating how many people done that and I didn't yeah um but look I mean to lose to lose just looked like to lose in this one I mean if you if anyone wants to take the time to look at their team compared to the players that could have been in their team that just just to pull up some names up that weren't there Malvaca Jack Willis Flavian Kroll DuPont was on the bench Entermac wasn't playing uh Labelle who's the top scorer in the top 14 wasn't playing uh Teddy Tomara was at 13 um so they didn't play Costes Peter Aki's left um toma Ramos was at 10 not a fullback yeah um you know Shokarres wasn't playing yeah you know ice and they let's be honest and they still still scored 56 points yeah I you know I don't want to um be the harbinger of doom for anyone else but uh Glasgow next week in Glasgow Saracens away in January um still think they might go unbeaten home against sale for the last one I don't I think they might they might still just get come on go unbeaten in this they they they just looked good not just unbeaten but you know bonus point in every game like they're they are levels above not just demolishing they're they're levels above everyone else in that group certainly they are in the elite group of kind of two or three clubs let's face it they were just too good for sharks from what I from what I saw they just like they're I think it's their connectivity from their pack to their backs like it is it is there's there's no hesitation uh their their pack can filter into their back line like there's no there's no hesitation there that there's no problems with that uh their back rowers can do whatever they want they can it's just they they're almost like a 15 man squad uh and then you've got the likes of Kapuwatsu who finishing in this game was unreal he showed everything he showed strength for his first try where he broke about 20 tackles I think for his second try he gassed the entire sharks team uh and then the third try it was just you know having a laugh it's just yeah I th I think they they for me I have a feeling they all want to Bordeaux and I think they they will want to show that they are the force of France and with DuPont coming back they may well they may well do it. So yeah in the interest of time I don't want to dig too too much into this game but basically long story short listener Toulouse were ominous sharks not too much to write home about yeah like a couple of good names in there but I kind of feel like they went into this one knowing that they probably weren't going to get much so a lot of a lot of the names in that team selection I'm not overly familiar with um but you know maybe they'll do better next week. But an easy win for Toulouse 5619 uh is quite some result. Next game Rory because I know you want to talk about this one Gloucester versus cast I do want to talk about this one.
SPEAKER_01I will do my best to keep this brief because um could talk about this one all day and uh not necessarily just because it's a really good win for Gloucester because although it is yeah um it is a it is a very good win for Gloucester. We won this so much in spite of ourselves it's fucking ludicrous. I'll just give you some highlights of some of the notes I made during this game uh I won't read through all of them but here are just some of the things I'll just pick out uh first note line out is shit again squandered to squander two 5022s with line out issues line out is fucking useless again gloss scrum on top but the line out is such an issue again you know honestly I don't know the stats the stats will probably say we won something like 50% of our line outs or something which would already be bad enough yeah the stats alive we didn't win that man we were honestly palling it's uh to the point where you're going our DO is an ex-prem second row how are we this bad but we just we honestly I I couldn't believe what I was watching it was so poor so the the the few times we actually managed to secure a lineup we tend to score so Freddie Thomas scored off the back of um us actually winning one um Oli Thorley with a huge carry and then Freddie Thomas just finishes it off just powering over um Will Trenome scored off a tap penalty but after we'd actually put some pressure on and retained some ball in their 22 so that was really good for half time so we managed to just about get 14 0 at half time um Will Trenome by the way another brilliant performance from him really really looking very impressed very impressed with him yeah um Dion Gwynne got binned for an accidental eye gouge yeah yeah yeah yeah I saw that weird it's it's it's either an eye gouge and it's a red or it's it's it's accidental right yeah and if it's accidental should it is it a pen I don't think so because he basically stood up from a ruck and his hand kind of as he stood up his hands got in someone's eyes and he's gone oh you can see he's pulled it away he's not done it on purpose yes just weird weird weird weird yeah um but put some pressure on got a couple penalties and then Charlie Atkinson players I mean both of his tries uh I thought were really good the first one the little show and go to run it in just sending everyone the wrong way lovely lovely try absolutely lovely um and then Thomas Williams with the 30 yard left handed over the top pass to secure the bonus point just I mean you can see why Saracens are signing him right yeah yeah yeah if I was them I'd sign him as well yeah um but I I mean I don't know enough about the current cast squad to tell you how close to their best side this is um my gut feel is not that close it it it it won't be uh they did similar to because we had Northampton Hampton last year I remember going to watch them play I think they're one of these clubs that don't take this competition all that seriously in their away fixtures and they focus on their home games for their fans but they don't really mind about the away ones yeah I mean uh uh just a quick look through their squad will Collier not playing Nakarawa not playing uh Arat's uh Arata the scrum off not playing Jack Goodhuber's on the bench um yeah I mean not their strongest side I mean I'm gonna take the win say it quietly Gloucester of one four on the bounce two in the Prem Cup admittedly but with one four on the bounce yeah I'd be saying that real quietly yeah um but you know there's some more green shoots from Gloucester that's all I'm looking for at the moment just some green shoots compared to the start of the season I think it's much better than it was for sure. Yeah yeah and you know we've the squad's looking a little bit more solid some players come back in so we we actually had two sets of props who are who are genuinely good um Max Lowelling went off injured and Ben Redshaw went off injured so those are both a bit worrying hopefully too serious there but knowing our luck this season um and Will Joseph in fact went off injured as well in the second half so again knowing our luck they'll all be um getting amputated legs at this point hopefully not but yeah but um you know I'd say I I'm gonna take the winn however it comes at the moment I'm actually we've got Monster in the next next round I'm actually off to watch it with uh the old man and my brother as well I look forward to the report yeah uh the the reports will be foggy I look forward to the foggy reports Rory that'd be that'd be good that'd be a good trip yeah I've been really looking forward to that but um no I'm not I I won't delve into this because actually it was mostly a tale of uh not that high quality a game Gloucester producing just enough quality to get over the line um and get the bonus point you know the reality is obviously I don't expect us to get anything out of a game against Munster particularly with them wanting to bounce back I'm sure um but we then go away to Edinburgh we'll talk about them shortly but you know obviously that's not a banker of a fixture but it's winnable. Yeah yeah um and then we finish up at home against Toulon and off the back of their result this weekend they may or may not still be interested you may you may get a bit of a shot at them. Yeah it'll be interesting so yeah maybe we don't dig too deep into this fixture because then you'll pick away at some of the problems that maybe we don't want to delve in too deeply for Gloucester I I would say that you could you don't have to scratch too far under the surface at this one okay we'll take it 3414 bonus point win for Gloucester happy days four on a trot Gloucester fans are happy supposedly uh as you said Edinburgh versus Toulon now this one I did not predict no no I didn't and actually early on in the game it looked like it would go the way that we would have thought which is Toulon kind of yeah runway with this biblical weather I mean terrific weather in Edinburgh yeah if you went to watch this game you're a braver man than I because that was that looked unpleasant to be in yeah um but probably quite far away from what the Toulon players are used to as well yeah yeah yeah I mean very different to the south of France I think on on most weeks a smidge a smidge different yeah um but fair play to Edinburgh because they properly properly um showed up in this one um their their pack in particular I mean Ewan Ashman is far you know fast becoming one of the premier hookers in the northern hemisphere because he's he is proper impact um I really liked him when he was at sale and I was surprised when they let him go obviously he knew he had ambitions in that Scotland shirt and he's showing why uh yeah can't can't take it away from him he's a he's a he's an impact player for sure yeah 100% 100% um too long got two tries in the first 20 minutes because they were they were the only ones sort of at that point able to put through phases yeah they put through two sets of like 10 plus phases in the 22 and eventually got over but actually outside of that showed not loads of quality in this game I thought um they I mean Jamine going off obviously hurt them they I think they really struggled to cope with Jamine going off. Yeah um Gar B didn't have a great game they actually replaced him with uh Serran um just before the hour mark um which was a bad mistake because then Ben White came off five minutes later injured so they were in real trouble there. Yeah um but you know Ludlam was good Ludlum was good ribbons mostly good until he got a daart bin um Mercer was pretty absent he got I mean carried carried quite a bit of ball in traffic but didn't really do anything you'd expect from Zach Mercer.
SPEAKER_02He seems to have dropped off from the levels we saw of him in the past I'd say he doesn't seem to yeah I wasn't I don't know what you've done to him at Gloucester but he doesn't seem to be the same player.
SPEAKER_01Well he had a terrible ankle injury didn't he that that sort of thing can do it yeah we I mean he basically the the he stayed at Gloucester for two seasons brilliant in the first season and then we didn't see him in the second one. Yeah he played like three or four games after not getting selected for England and then bust his ankle we never saw him again yeah yeah yeah take him a bit of time to get up to speed again but yeah it wasn't his best show no um but I mean to Edinburgh brilliant I thought I think they were just excellent um yeah Ashman really good schoon uh really good Goosen particularly when he went to full back I liked the look of him a lot um Magnus Bradbury eight just one of those players that's maybe never quite hit the heights you thought they would but really good um really impressed by him um they got a penalty try off a scrum a lover walk over scrum you do not see it often at this level not enough you particularly don't you particularly don't see it against French sides by Scottish sides. No very rarely um but you love to see it when it does happen. But yeah I look I Edinburgh for them massive result because huge win for them you know I don't think it's unkind to say that Edinburgh wouldn't be the most fancied team from the URC in this in this competition um but I think Edinburgh fans would agree yeah I'd like to think anyway that's the reality of it they are the the weaker the weaker of the two sides but massively showed up in this one I mean we're and were really genuinely quite good and they're going away to cast next week um if you're travelling to that as an Edinburgh fan I'm very jealous because I have been to see rugby in cast a couple of times and it is a real experience it's one of the the French grounds you really should visit. But they will go there I think with a bit of confidence and you know thinking they can get something out of that particular if casts aren't fancy in this one.
SPEAKER_02Yeah maybe maybe maybe Edinburgh could be a surprise package see how far they can go because if they've certainly started well and started strongly. So yeah 3320 against Toulon that's that that's some result and uh not to be ignored. Now Rory this has quickly become the Champs Cup megapod and uh I reckon do we swiftly canter through predictions for the next round and then we bring the pod to a close let's do it let's do a real quick real quick real quick one through predictions.
SPEAKER_01Okay Leicester versus Leinster Leinster by 15 Stormers versus Larochelle Larishelle by five or less sharks versus Saracens Saracens by ten Clemont versus Sail Sharks Clement by ten Bordeaux versus Scarlets Bordeaux by twenty five That's very kind versus Gloucester I will be there but I think Monster win this one by fifteen points probably Glasgow to lose To lose by ten Quins versus Bayon Quinns by fifteen Cast Edinburgh Edinburgh by five or less.
SPEAKER_02Toulon Bath.
SPEAKER_01Bath by five to ten.
SPEAKER_02Northampton Saints vs. Bulls.
SPEAKER_01Saints by ten.
SPEAKER_02And rounding it off, Bristol Bears versus Poe.
SPEAKER_01Bristol by ten.
SPEAKER_02There you have it, folks. Those are predictions for next week. Tune in next week to find out how they've gone. Before we go, before we close, Rory, a chance for your final thought.
SPEAKER_01If you see me wandering around Cork, feel free to buy me a Guinness, a Beamish, or a Murphy's. I would take any kind of stout.
SPEAKER_02And we've been Rux Balls and Oval Balls. Hope you've enjoyed listening to this bumper Megapod on the Champions Cup. We'll be back again next week with hopefully a slightly more refined version, and it doesn't take up too much more of your time. Hope you've enjoyed listening. Make sure to the like, subscribe, and follow. And we'll see you next time. Tada.
