S2 Ep 36 - Prem Rugby Delivers For Run In

The Premiership run-in just went feral. Five matches, five genuine humdingers, and a top-four race that suddenly feels like it could break three different ways depending on one last weekend of chaos.

We start with the big rugby news doing the rounds: the Shaun Edwards rumours. We talk through why he’s arguably the best defence coach of the modern era, what his exit from France might mean for their World Cup hopes, and why England’s coaching ticket could transform overnight if the RFU acts. From there we nod to Bordeaux’s Champions Cup win and the brutal fallout around Leinster, before widening the lens to the uncomfortable question English rugby keeps dodging: how do you build a system that can rival the Top 14’s depth, development and week-to-week intensity?

Then it’s straight into Prem Rugby Round 17. Bristol bounce back in style against Bath and we dig into whether Bath’s conservative approach is starting to stifle their strike runners. Saracens keep stacking points with a performance that screams late-season momentum, while Northampton survive a Gloucester scare that had all the ingredients of a season-defining upset. Up north, Newcastle pull off a comeback that feels like a trailer for next season, and Exeter go to Welford Road and shut Leicester down with set-piece pressure and some seriously organised defence.

We finish with our Team of the Week, Round 18 predictions, and the launch of the Rucks Mauls and Oval Balls end-of-season awards, including Player of the Season, Coach of the Season, Breakthrough, Signing, Dark Horse and Dog’s Body. Subscribe, share the pod with a rugby mate, and leave us a review, then tell us: who’s gets your vote?

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Transcript

Welcome Back And Life Updates

0:00

Rux and Overbulls is here again, another week of rugby content brought to you for the listener by the fans' favourite rugby hosts. It's me, Dave, joined as ever by Rory. And yes, I've changed the inclination of the intro. Rory, say hello to the listener. Hello, listeners. Hello, hello, David. Well, you were challenged to mix it up a little bit at the top of the top of the pod, and uh you did it. Well done. I've delivered on the fly. That's how I like to operate Rory. And you know, the listener's been waiting two weeks um for that delight, and uh hopefully it's enriched the ears of many. Um I've clearly David, would you like to explain why the listener's been waiting two weeks for that uh mix up? Um Well, quite simply put, there might you you might be aware of the heat wave that took place last week. Uh in the certain part of the country that I was in, I was recording heats above thirty-six degrees in the house, and you know, sitting in front of a computer recording a podcast in those heats, when you've got a three-month-old baby that uh is not enjoying the heat at the same time, it felt like the wrong priority to be having. Um and I couldn't really be making an argument to me have the fan, not the baby. Um so it it felt like a good welfare and health decision to uh postpone last week's pod, which is a shame because I'd lined up uh a couple of people to step in to fill your your boots, Rory, because you weren't available. But uh I will be getting those who I had lined up to return and come to the pod in the near future. Um but yes. There will be opportunities to speak to them, sure. And uh might I say, David, um well not to not to criticize you, this is obviously an audio medium, so there's some there's some people who won't uh necessarily realise this, but you uh also have any objective by looking incredibly beardy these days. Well, as we say, it is an audio focused podcast, and I I'm just yeah, I I've I have no defense. My uh You've got a lumberjack. It's not it's not it's not a summer beard you're sporting there. It's not a summer beard I'm sporting here, and it it does require taming, but I'm also quite enjoying the depth, the bristliness, the denseness. Like it's a beard many, many people would wish to have other than the colour of it, because it is ginger. But you know, yeah, I mean it's it's it's clearly ginger, but no, in terms of in terms of fullness of body, it's magnificent. Oh, I know, I know, but uh it will go eventually because um last week was no cake walk for for me, uh and that probably wouldn't have helped at all. But yeah, but how what about yourself, Roy? Because obviously you weren't available last week for much better reasons. Um so how have you been for two weeks? Good. I was yeah, I was um in uh I was north of the border. I'd gone beyond Hadrian's wall. Um I uh was in Edinburgh for a couple of days. My brother ran the marathon in Edinburgh. I obviously um supported by drinking lots of tenants and um just about making it in time to see him cross the finish line. Fantastic. Uh and then I was in Glasgow for a couple of days. A fantastic city. I urge everyone to go to Glasgow, it's just brilliant. Um, and then I uh graced the bonny bonny banks of Loch Lomond and did a bit of hiking at the behest of my uh my partner who insisted that we needed to do something active. Um I was happier drinking tenants, but you know, there we go. You weren't inspired to uh sign up for the marathon yourself? I was put off, completely put off. Um it wasn't quite as warm in in Edinburgh as it might have been in Bristol, but it was warm enough. And uh my brother, who's um suffers with uh a similar complexion and that he's pale and ginger, um finished with um what can only be described as second-degree burns on his shoulders from the sun. So uh I looked at that and I went, no, no, thank you. You'll stick to me. You'll stick to hiking around Loch Lowland. Yeah, that was that was better. Well, there we go. We've managed to frame it better because I know you would rather have been drinking tenants, but at least you weren't running a marathon. Exactly. You know, someone's always worse off than you. You know, you've got a perspective's key. Perspective is key. Um and what else is key, Rory? Rugby. And that's what we're here to talk about. Um this pod we're gonna cover the Prem round 17. We're gonna cover some news, obviously, first and foremost. We'll pick up on a team of the week, some predictions, and we're also going to announce some nominations for the Ruxmalls Overballs Awards for the Prem Rugby this season. So yeah, buckle in, folks, because I have a feeling it's another it's another humdinger. It's packed full of stuff, it's packed full of content, and I'm ready to go, Rory. Are you ready to go? I'm ready to go, David. Thank God, it'd be awkward if you said you weren't.

Sean Edwards To England Debate

5:04

Uh firstly, we'll start off with some news. I think the main thing that seems to be doing the rounds at the moment is speculation around the news of Mr. Sean Edwards being released from France, probably one of the most vaunted defence coaches in the modern era. A great track record of winning trophies at six nations and turning around kind of defences of nations like Wales and France. What what did you make of this? Uh should we be should Borthwick be banging on his door and kind of giving him a blank check, or is there more to this? Well, there may well be more to it. Um let's there there's speculation as to what the reason might be. It's kind of goes across the spectrum of uh Gautier through to reasons Sean Eppert's personal reasons as to why he would want to leave, and you know, there's things that we can only speculate as to why it's looking like he's gonna be released from his France contract. If it is spurred by Gautier, who has decided who has fallen out or lost trust or whatever it might be, uh my gut feel is this is a hammer blow to France's World Cup hopes. I think Sean Edwards, for me, is one of the top rugby coaches in the world. His track record speaks for itself. Um if he is available and the RFU still refuse to go for him, I think it is a huge error. I just think you we just I know and I realise adding to the coaching carousel of England is um is something we've we've talked about and we've we've said they need to stop doing, but there are exceptions to these rules, and for me Sean Edwards is a must-get. Yeah, no, I agree. I th I think they should be bending over backwards to try and get him in because you only look at the fortunes of France almost instantly when he came under kind of their coaching ticket, it was stark how quick he had an impact. And uh we've all seen with England I I think defence can sometimes be one of their weaknesses, certainly on the fringes. That's not something that uh Dawn Edwards would allow, and he would he would fix that real quick. Uh so yeah, it it remains to be seen the j the the reasons why he's leaving and whether that does open the door to him to come to England or dare I say a team in the north with a lot of money. Um but I I think notwithstanding all that, if if he's available, you get him. Uh can you imagine how pumped up an England team would be to have him been spoken to in the training rooms by Sean Edwards and Kevin Sinfield? I think they burst through the walls. Sinfield and Edwards as your coaching ticket for England, I think that is one way to maybe turn round uh the fortunes of England and certainly address some of the question marks we've raised in the past about being up for the games, for sure. I I think one of the big strengths that other nations have over England rugby teams is they have this innate um motivation to I'm not saying England players aren't motivated to go and win international rugby matches, but if you compare it to the like as likes of South Africa and the the motivation they have to represent South Africa, Welsh players to represent Wales, you know, uh French players in the like the Marseille comes on, New Zealand players with a hacker. England teams sometimes feel a little bit more uh controlled, mechanical. You know, it's what what gets what would get an England team, eyes bulging, bursting, bursting to go and win a game. Because I it doesn't feel like we've had that since Martin Johnson was captain, you know, and Martin Johnson and Lawrence Sedalio characters like that who'd get you pumped up. For me, the thing that's gonna do it is having Sean Edwards, Evan Sinfield just in there, just Ellis Genge. Ellis Genge would tackle the the stand to get out there after a team talk from those two. I just want to sit. Yeah if we're serious, well, if the RFU is serious of challenging for the World Cup, like why wouldn't we chase him down? But we'll see, we'll see, we'll we'll keep an eye on that one. Um it'll be one of two things. He'll either turn up somewhere quite quickly or that kind of news story will fade away into the distance and um be forgotten about for a little while before he re-emerges, but we'll keep an eye on it. I think the other thing worth touching up on because we weren't, you know, providing an episode last week after the European Cup final.

Bordeaux Win And Leinster Fallout

9:26

A genuine nod to the champions of the Champions Cup, Bordeaux, uh really putting in one hell of a performance to you know strike a stark reminder into Leinster about why they're no longer the superpower of European rugby. Let's yeah, let's be frank, they it was a it was a shellack in in terms of finals. Um the fallout in Ireland is bordering on vicious. Nina Barr um is in the media today, in fact, questioning his future, feeling like he's being drummed out by media and fans who don't value him, I believe were his words that he's used. Um not to say whether they're right or wrong as to whether Nina Barr is the problem, but that is five European finals on the bounce, I believe they've lost, plus the semi-finals. Yeah. Um something is something is not working at Leinster. Uh, I don't know if it's Nina Beyer. I mean, he's only been there for this season, so that feels a bit harsh to put it all on him. But something's stopping Leinster getting over that line. And long may it continue. Yeah. Well, I I that that something seems to be the top 14, as they they seem to have a yeah, there is that. The thing getting in the way of Leinster is a really brilliant French team every year. Yeah, and that seems to be the problem for most of us, Rory, unfortunately. Speaking quite recently from a Northampton Saints perspective, uh I'm afraid to say, David, and it will continue to be. There's no two way, there's no two ways about it. Uh Bordeaux are just that much better than everyone else in Europe at the moment at their best. They are, and and it's so weird that they are sixth in the top 14. It's a strange old league. It's a strange old league, it's a strange old league. I need to start with it, but yeah, it's a strange one. I mean, just just look at the look at the teams around them, you know. Montpellier obviously won the uh the Challenge Cup as well. Yeah, and they're second in the top 14. Dispatch in Ulster, Toulouse is still magnificent, yeah, Poe are a resurgent force, you know. It's embarrassment at Riches in that league. And uh there's been a lot of talk um uh in the media. There's Bruce Craig was was writing a comment on it in the telegraph, um, they're very chirpy again, but how do we build a system in England that can rival France's? And it's difficult to see, you know. I think the way they think about the game, the way they market the game, the way they inspire kids to play the game, um, and the way they bring these kids through. There's just the the ability that these kids have when they come onto the scene in top-level French rugby. It's beyond, I mean, it's even beyond South Africa at this point. I mean, South Africa at the the South Africa's first team is at least the equal to France's first team, probably better. Um, obviously, one in the in the last instance, so yes, you probably should probably clarify they are better. Yeah, but if you look at the pipeline of players coming through, I mean, really, it is those two out on their own at this point, but you know, you've got to find a way to to combat that. England are gonna have to change their approach. Um, and I I think it's gonna take a bit of a system reset to try and catch those two up. Yeah, yeah. And are we in a position to do that? We all know the answer to that question. Recent votes, uh, members and things would suggest the RFU isn't quite ready to change its place. Not yet, not yet. But we will still support the lads regardless, Rory. And we'll go in with optimism and assuming they're gonna win every game until they don't, which will be quite quickly because they played South Africa first. Um but yeah, I think that's the news generally covered up for now. Um if I said if there's anything else, we'll cover it next week, I'm sure. But Rory, we have to go deep and dark into our

Premiership Round 17 Stakes

13:09

bread and butter. That is the Prem Rugby, round 17, the penultipot, round of fishes, the great run-in, lots to play for, and headline for this week, Rory, there are some surprises, and there are some hell of a performances here. No one would have predicted this set of results this week. Uh foreshadowing. This weekend, I would yeah, this weekend I would say is Prem Rugby at its absolute best. The most unpredictable series of games uh, I think all season. I don't think I don't think we've had a weekend like it. Uh, five games all that are all need addressing. Yeah. Um so should we just get into it? With that being said, we need to get into it because we are bound by time restrictions.

Bristol Fight Back Against Bath

13:53

Bristol versus Bath, the Friday night kickoff, Bristol at Ashton Gate, pretty good record against Bath. Bath really looking to turn around their fortunes, and uh obviously this game turned out a certain way. What did you make of the game, Rory? Well, I mean, the big context is obviously Bristol coming off the utter shellack in shipping 90 points. Shipping 90 points uh at Frankens Gardens, and there was always going to be a response. I don't think I quite expected to the level we saw here. Um, the physicality, the organisation, the uh commitment in defence by Bristol in this game, I mean, not just compared to two weeks before, but compared to pretty much this whole season, to be honest, was something to behold. Um, you know, I suspect Jordan Crane is breathing in a huge sigh of relief as defence coach after this week compared to the previous two. Um, from Bath's perspective, a really disappointing out-in. Um scoreless in the second half, shipping a 12-point lead at half time. Um and signs that this conservative style of play isn't quite getting them over the line in the moment in the same way it was. Um, and this week, David, you cannot blame Finn Russell for that because Kieran Donahue was given his shot, you would you'd been calling him for it for weeks. Yeah, you thought that was the fix. Um, and unfortunately, uh not um not strong, really. Uh pretty anonymous in this game. Um, they basically played a nine-man game, which didn't play to his strengths. Yeah, shock horror. Shock horror. Um, but interesting, interesting. And and you know, let's be honest, the first half it looked like Bath were were going to run away with this. The first half, they were they looked really, really they did look strong. Um, you know, it didn't start well for Donahue though. Fuck kicks the first um of his first touch and kicks dead. And and I have to say that did rather set the tone for his day. There wasn't a lot of standout moments from him in this one. Um, but by and large, Bath did dominate this half. Um Arundell had a try chalked off just before 15 minutes. Um Ollie Lawrence uh scores after 20. Um big punches from Thokina Singer, who when he was involved was prominent. Had one of his better games this season, I'd say. Yeah, um just not involved enough, really. I mean, just I can't I can't understand why you'd have a player of that size, speed, physicality, and form um and not try and get him involved more. You know, get him get him off the wing. I don't think he comes off the wing enough. I think I think that might be his problem. Whether he's told to stay on the wing just to spread the defense, I don't know. But you very rarely see him coming off the wing these days. Yeah, he used to do all the time. When he does, he's really effective, but yeah, he just doesn't seem to be to be there um be there enough. Um he makes a big punch, offloads off the floor really well, headhill barrels through Ellis Genge. Yeah. Uh Sam Underhill playing at number eight this week. Really interesting pick. Um, and good there, actually. He was better than I thought he was going to be. Um, much better than I thought he was gonna be. You know, I you maybe underplay Sam Underhill's handling ability, but he he he did show it off a bit in this um yeah, in this game, where his ability to be involved ball in hand rather than just as a hitter, although he was involved in that as well, has to be said. He flawed Bernard Jackson on this big point. Um, but yeah, no, Ollie Lawrence uh picks and goes over after 20 minutes. Um Guy Pepper scores just before the half hour mark. Uh they get a turnover, spin it right, Focket and Singer again involved, big bust, Ben Spencer snipes and puts Guy Pepper in. Um Bristol hit back through Fitz Harding, another excellent performance from Fitz Harding. I mean, just absolutely leads by example with this in this Bristol team. Yeah, he's he is definitely the heartbeat of that team for sure. 100%, 100%. Um, Harry Thacker got a ball off the back of the line out. I mean, Bath's line out, we've talked a few times about how shaky that looks at times, and it was shaky once again. Um, just and you know, you can't put it all on the hooker's feet, but I do wonder if having Kepu Tupelotto in there this week, Tom Dunn suspended, just creates a little bit more uncertainty. And you know, there's a lot of moving parts in Bath. They do rotate their pack a lot, yeah. Um, but um, yeah, Thacker steals it, Bath give the penalty away. Um, they tap and go, and and Fitz Harding runs an unders line under Harry Randle. They've run it a few times this season off tap pens off five minutes. It's a good move because Fitz Harding is just deceptively powerful. Um, but uh yeah, Brooke Bath hit back again before half time. Thomas DeToy doing Thomas DeToy things, they win a massive scrum penalty, yeah. Um, absolutely dominating up front, tap and go, lots of picks and goes, and eventually just power and weight um takes hold. And and you know, at halftime, I'd say at 1917, you know, Bathard, they'd had one disallowed, they'd messed um a five-meter scrum opportunity up as well after Ravuvu very daftly knocked the ball dead um off a kick. And you know, they've been on the trial, there's a lot of trial and pressure, but Bristol's defence under the amount of pressure they had in the first half was really excellent. You know, they won a penalty on the try-line, they they just looked a lot more committed, but even so, at half time, I thought uh this is only going one way, it's a better performance, but just Bath's power, Bristol's injuries, that's all sort of starting up, just the physics of it is just paying um paying dividends. Um, but the second half, you know, Pat Lamb just got must have got around the boys at half time because the second half Bristol just came out firing, start really fast. Um, Tom Jordan coming on at 10 seemed to make a big difference. He was very aggressive in defence, wasn't he? Really he's big and physical. Um, he's he's ambitious with the ball, but he he often puts himself in the kind of firing line. You know, he had a good couple of opportunities at chips and returns that he nearly that nearly came off. You know, he's quick. You know, that running threat at 10, I think, really helps Bristol, particularly with Harry Randall playing as well as he was at nine. This was one of Harry Randall's best games this season, I thought. Um, back to back to some serious form. Um they get the penalty try just for 45 minutes, another brain fade from Arendell in defence, tipping the ball on with his fingertips when he probably should have just held his ground and gone for the tackle on Lewis Reese Samet. Yeah, but gives away the penalty try, and just Bristol were um were well on top. Lewis Reese Samet knocked on over the try-line from another chip and chase. Really nice breakdown the right, just gasses everyone as Lewis Reese Samet does, nearly collects it, does it does a bit of um feigning the injury, just take the heat off himself for a bit. That's just if you watch Lewis Reese Samet a a lot as I have for Gloucester and for Bristol now. Uh if there's if something goes wrong, just just check to see how long he sort of feels the ankle and knees afterwards. All the time. It is all the time. He's always feigning an injury, and it's the reason why something hasn't gone right. I I picked up on it like the first few weeks of the season. Yeah, just just puts on just puts on the limp. Yeah. Just to make sure that the heat comes off the mistake. Um that's part of the reason why I think when they got the shellacking from Saints, he was so annoyed that Rich Lane got subbed off because it meant he couldn't be subbed off because they only had one back on the bench. Yeah, he had to play the whole game, didn't he? Yeah, you had to stay out there and keep getting shellacked. Um I think for this game, Rory, like you've subbed it up lice nicely there. But the the head the headline matchup was surely Yancy van Rensburg up against a Jomo and Lawrence. And sorry, bar fans, there was only one winner there. Player of the match, Bernard Jansen van Rensburg, uh head and shoulders above the other two. Um absolutely Answered all the critics, and I've seen very little comments in the uh the Facebook groups and the other groups saying, Oh, why is a Jomo and Lawrence not in ahead of Yancy van Rensburg? Well, there's your there's your answer, folks. Yeah, I mean, I I think it was really summed up when he got that turnover on Max Ajomo when uh Bartha were in the red zone. You know, it was a it was a good tackle by Moroni, I think, but he just comes in so fast, like and like an elite flanker, yeah, and jackals in when Bartha, you know, if they go on one more phase, I think they probably score. It's those kind of interventions you that put international class players above everyone else. Um, and I'm sorry to say, Bath centres did not have that impact. I know Lawrence scored, but outside of that, yeah, pretty quiet. Yeah, Maxijomo, pretty quiet in this game. And I think questions probably do now have to be asked of whether the Bath game plan is stifling the the um development of of these players. And you know, if you're not gonna say it, I'm gonna say it, David. I think Bath need to uh need to open up a little bit because they are losing the impact of the players of the quality of Max Joe and Oy Lawrence. And frankly, man as outspoken as you has been cowardly not to bring it up before now. No, it's very astute of you, Rory, to identify this issue that no one else before you has made. Yeah. Someone's gonna say it. Someone's got to say it. It's it's just submitted about like their their attritional game plan is to the detriment of their outside backs, and when you get a game where your pack is matched, which in this game Bristol fronted up was a tough first half, but the second half they came out and they they they fronted up and they defended. If you stop Bath in the pack, you stop Bath. And that and I think people have figured that out, which is why they've lost have they lost five in a row now across all competitions? Like they I think they've been figured out a little bit. Whether they're arresting Finn Russell and they're they're holding things back because they know knockouts are coming, there's a debate to be had there. But it's it is telling that like you look at the stats week in, week out of Bath, that their back three, like if it's not for every soft and Henry Arundel kind of getting an intercept or doing a full length of the pitch run, just stat padding his meters. That back three and those and the centres and just their backs in general have such a small amount of meters carried and line breaks and things like that compared to the rest of the league. It's worrying me as a bath. They've lost four of the last five, David. Um and if we look back at some of these results, so the one win they got was the big win against the Red Bulls at the wreck, no great surprise there. Yeah. This game against Bristol, where Bristol absolutely fronted up and and matched them physically. Um away at Exeter. Well, we know Exeter Chiefs pack is a big, big unit, and they've been working on that, and they've got I think the best defence in the league, or close two. Yeah, one of the I think it was them and Leicester have the fewest tries conceded, didn't they? Which is why the final game's really interesting. Yeah, absolutely. Um Bordeaux, well, everyone knows the state of their pack. Uh, and before that, uh it was away at Northampton. Monstrous pack. Well, well, on their day, Northampton's pack is is absolutely phenomenal, you know. The likes of a Yogen, Lockett, Prowse, Vandermesht, Kemley Graham, Pollock, you know, those are not shrinking violets in defence. So yeah, I think I think there absolutely has to be questions made now of whether Bath's style at the business end of the season, when there's no shortage of motivation to front up physically, actually does it have enough to overcome other teams whose packs, if they're fit and available, can maybe match them in at uh uh at this level. And you know, the caveat here I will say, you know, Ethan Stadder starts, you know, underhills at eight, it's not a natural eight, you know, you and Richard's coming on, Keppatu Pelottu starts, but it's a small caveat when you look at the other names on there: Ubano, Thomas Latoy, Ted Hill, Charlie Yules, Guy Pet 8, but he's still there, B comes on, Van Veit comes on. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think you can't really question that. Um, so that bar fans will point out to um Dan Frost disallowed try, um, Carreras missing the the penalty um the end to to snatch the win. But you know, Bristol fans are pushed to uh will push back on, you know, Hay Randall gets held up by Ted Hill very well. Actually, Ted Hill, I thought, did actually have a good game, and he's been pretty honest in the media about being omitted from England squats, and he seems like he's um finding some motivation of his own at the moment. Um, but you know, yeah, Bath had a couple of tries disallowed and a couple of other opportunities. I say we we mentioned the Bernard Jansen and Rensbeg turnover quite close to the quite close to the line. You know, there was another couple of occasions when Bath got really close to the red zone, but other teams have done this and we've accused them of profligacy. Yeah. Actually, maybe that's maybe that's part of the problem at the moment. And questions have to be uh asked at the rec whether they're playing the right brand of rugby at the moment. Well, well, I'll say five, six weeks ago, Rory. They all laughed at me. They're all laughing at me. They're all seeing sense now. You're all coming on board with my opinions on Bath, and I'm glad to see that my uh my analysis has been apt to date on Bath's downfall. And we'll see that. But yeah, game ended. Was it what was the final score already? 21-19 to Bristol. Big win for Bristol. Giving them a slither of hope of potentially getting fourth spot, notwithstanding the results we're gonna go through the rest of this pod. But at that point in time, Bristol very much thinking they're still in the race.

Saracens Control Quins Despite Flair

27:52

Uh, one of the other protagonists in that race is in our next game, which is Saracens vs. Harlequins. Which on paper seemed like an easy win for Saracens. But um I'll give you anecdotally, when I watched this game with my partner, she said she was concentrating on the the baby, so wasn't watching it closely, but she said every time she looked up, it felt like Harlequins were the better team, and they were the team in the ascendancy. And I kind of could see where she was coming from because I think a lot of the rugby was being played by Harlequins and Saracen's lead early, but then kind of failed to pull away, and Harlequins seemed to have found this ability these last few weeks to kind of have a second wind, and that almost came through, I'd say, to a degree. I I can absolutely see where she's coming from. I think Quinn's looked really good ball in hand, and they played some attractive stuff, but I think actually if you dig deeper on it, I think Quinn's played a lot of um a lot of good rugby, you know, to take a sort of slight football analogy, you know, in front of the back four. Yeah. They didn't it's a lot of yeah, it was a lot of nice stuff behind the game line, very attractive stuff. And actually, I thought I thought Quinn's looked better than they have done in a lot of recent weeks. I think I think they've been looking a lot better these last couple of weeks than we've got. Yeah, obviously we've got that win against Exeter at uh the Alliance recently. Uh yeah, uh yeah. Whilst I I would agree that Quinn's a lot when I suspect, you know, you you're a man in the stats, there probably there's probably some interesting sort of anomalies in terms of possession or territory, even in this, that that I haven't seen. But I I never really thought Saracens were in any danger in this one. Oh no, no. No, I I agree, I don't think Saracens are in danger, but it it was an interesting observation, I thought, that to kind of a neutral not paying too much attention felt like the score line should have been the other way around because every time they were watching it looked like Harlequins were the one doing all the rugby. Yeah, and and and look, I I think but it means nothing because the result was Saracens won. So well, and ultimately I think what what this sort of highlights is probably one of the um the sort of issues that Quinns have had, not just this season, but really in quite a few of recent seasons, where they've maybe not lived up to the expectations of their fans, where it's a lot of flash, it's a lot of entertainment, it's a lot of um showmanship, but how often were they really uh breaking the door down? I mean, I thought Chana culling himself Yellow Card aside, which was a daft one early on to give away the penalty try. Um, I thought physically he was pretty pretty strong. I thought Alex Don Brown carried on a good rate um a run of form that he's in. Yep. Um their locks I thought were really good. Uh Zach Carr and I really, really like Zach Carr and Elliot Williams as a pairing. I think yeah, I I I think they were really good. I thought Sam Riley was very good once again. He's he's really come into his own at the moment as a hooker, and they all had good moments in this game. But if I compare it to the players on the other team who had good moments, you know, Marow Atoje looked in absolute beast mode in this one in defence. He was just so dominant. Tom Willis are in a couple of slightly more even scuffings with Chanda Cunningham South, was I feel like physically I feel like Harlequins did a really good job of shackling him, barring the try he set up. That was kind of but but exactly, but you know, he did a really good job of shackling him, barring the try he set up. You know, it's yeah, they shackled him in the sense of he maybe wasn't he didn't get as many runs as he has done in other games, but then he still, in a game where he's been fairly shackled, sets up a try with a big physical carry and a fend and an offload. Yeah, but it's by Tom Willis standards, that's just not good enough. He needs to do that five times. Sure, no, no, no, I appreciate that. You're up you're right to call it out. Actually, Tom Willis is very quiet for in this game, barring the try he set up. No, what I'm saying is Tom Willis tried his best and he played well, but I thought Harlequins did a really, really good job. No, you're right, you're right. Um, I'm being I'm being fairly facetious, but I think he could afford to be slightly um quieter in this one because you know Ben R was very dominant. Yes, absolutely. Pizza was dominant. A number of players stood up. Yeah, Ironimaui was pretty monstrous when he was in the pitch. Um Ollie Hartley once again really like him. Really monstrous. His um his carry and offload for Tompkins try. Um you know that the pace he put on the ball, the line he took, and then the ability to throw that offload out the back. It's it's a it's a compelling sign of where his development's going. Yeah. And you know, I think I think don't rule him out of World Cup contention next year. Uh it on the current trajectory, you know, I think he's a very similar type player to Seb Atkinson. But that's no bad thing because Seb Atkinson's been very good at the league for the last couple of years, and actually having those two as sort of natural 12s playing week in, week out in the Prem is asks good questions for Borthwick. And I think he's he's starting to ask those questions. I suspect this summer's going to come too early for him to get a look in, but certainly some questions being asked as to where his development could take him. If he avoids injuries, I'll be really interested to see where he is this time next year. That's the big question with him, isn't it? Because he has got a bit of an injury record already. But if he does, compelling. But I also we're dancing around the one that person I do want to talk about. Uh it's a Saracen's winger, but it's not the one everyone else is always talking about all the time. I was just gonna come on to him, Toby Elliott. What a performance. What a performance. I mean, not many wings in this league have outshone Noah Clorey in the air, but he did that. Yeah, he utterly bullied poor Cam Anderson on the other side. He had a bad horrid old time of it against him. Um he properly burst on the scene last season. I and I don't really know why he's not had quite so many opportunities this season. I I feel like he's been loaned out. I suspect injuries as well. I I'm sure there have been injuries. Um, but last season he was such a lethal finisher. He's another one who looks to have really grown physically. He's got a he's got a broad old back on him. Yeah, he's a tall lad. If he continues to show that much ability in the air and physicality and defence, I tell I tell you what he slightly reminded me of this in this game was a young Ollie Thorley when he came onto the scene. That sort of physicality, and you know, but uh probably Oli Thorley with a more rounded skill set, if I'm gonna be slightly like Jack now, but with a few more inches, yeah, taller Jack now, you know, it just busy, busy, nuggety, physical, um, and aggressive. You know, I I got the feeling, I mean, you know, he he makes the tackle on Cam Anderson that gets the scrum that leads to the first try. Yeah, he dominated Cam Anderson so many times. I got the feeling he was rather enjoying bullying someone on the pitch. And you know, whilst we don't condone bullying in our playgrounds and uh in our workplaces, I condone it on the rugby pitch because there is something about physically dominating your opposite number on a rugby pitch that is satisfying, and watching it happen is satisfying, you know. As a prop, it's something it's a competition you get every week in the scrum, and if you can bully the person in front of you, you're having a lovely day. You're having a lovely day when that happens. You are um seeing a winger do it is is pretty special as well. I've got to say I thought, yeah, you're absolutely right. So I said it was just fabulous in this game. Um, Max Malin's another one really good coming back into some real form after some stinkers early in the season. Yeah, um, I was quite critical of him at the start of the season, but I I take it all back now. He is he's looking a lot like a lot more like the Max Malins of past, where he is just elusive, dangerous, and a real threat. Yeah, and and Saracen's looking a lot more like the Saracens of the past, and I think very much down to the Bracken Burke halfback partnership that they've got going at the moment. I like it, I like it a lot. And having that partnership to start with Van Zale and Farrell to come on later in the game, and once you're up once you're ahead, and you know, just take the sting out of it, you know, that's a formula that feels very Saracens, and it's a formula that feels very Saracens on a title charge, and with the motivation they've got in that squad this season in particular, the fact that they are now there, they're playing for Mark McCool, aren't they? Like they want to be able to do that. They're playing for Mark McCool, they are no shortage of of motivation, and uh if we look at so they are now three points below Exeter. And who do they play in the last yeah? You know, their last few results, so beating Quinn's, beating Gloucester, okay, you know, based on this season's form, not surprising results, beating Bristol very comfortably at Ashton Gate 41-26, beating Tigers at home 19-15, battering sail away, 85-19. You know, the form they're in at the moment since they lost to Bath in the Champions Cup. You know, I just fear that their forms come one round too late to them. It may well have. It's gonna be a case of you know, too little too late, possibly. But if any team was gonna go away to uh the Chiefs this weekend to get that last playoff spot, this Saracens team is the one that would do it, I think. They are the form team. Um so yeah, no, I I completely agree. It's very exciting what they're doing down there, which as a Saints fan, as I've said before, very painful to admit. But you've got to you've got to recognise something that's being done really well, and you can't ignore it. 100%. And I do what really like what they're doing with their young backs and and to a lesser extent their young forwards that they're kind of easing into first team rugby. Uh yeah, I can only applaud it, which is you know really difficult to say because we should hate Saracens by all accounts, but it's harder to hate them this year for sure. But yeah, I think was it 28-12 this game is a good one? 26-12. That's Saracen's ruthless streak, meaning they've got the try in the 81st minute with a lineup or having bundled poor Stu Townsend into uh into the first row of the stands off the kickoff. Um yeah, that that ruthless streak, ominous. Is ominous, and I think it I think that shows how hungry they are because they they were they were fighting tooth and nail for that final bonus point because they know every point counts. Whether it remains whether it's enough will remain to be seen, but it certainly helped them out for sure. Uh next game, Rory, the R Mob

Saints Snatch It From Gloucester

39:02

Derby. I'm not gonna gloat. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna sing and shout about anything here because this was a game that um in the run-up you you said yourself that you didn't want to go to this game because you didn't want to watch Gloucester get bullied and have a cricket score put on them. Well, I also knew I was wasn't gonna be also knew you weren't in the country, um, but like that I think everyone was expecting this to be a one-sided fair. Yeah, and it was and let let's let's be honest, uh, we were robbed. Um not sure about that. Um I if you'd told me at the start of the day on Saturday, Gloucester are gonna come away from Franklin's guards with two losing bonus points, I'd have beaten your hand off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, but to lose it last minute of the game, um it sticks to the crawl a little bit because watching this game back, I thought it had all the hallmarks of where Gloucester were absolutely at their best in recent seasons. Um, and the blueprint for what this Gloucester team could potentially be next season. Um you know it's it's the running joke of the league. Next year's always Gloucester's year. Yeah, um, but just to take some of the raw ingredients out of this performance for for Gloucester, um, the midfield absolutely dominated. Seb Atkinson and Max Nowlin were um were absolutely phenomenal. And you know, Rory Hutchinson um scored a very good try off of Finn Smith grab a kick, which was an excellent grab a kick, by the way. Um but Hutchinson and Litchfield um were pretty well bullied in this game. Grossa's defence in general in the midfield was was excellent. Very well. Um and it took it took some special play from Saints to score some of their tries, and they did score some special tries. Let's you know, let's have no bones about it. You know, the Finn Smith try going coast to coast was something something special. Absolutely, it was absolutely fantastic. Um, but you know, in that back line, you know, Oli Thorley, I thought, absolutely back to his best in this game, just used and used really, really well, uh, in a way that he sometimes hasn't been this season, but just an absolute battering ramp of performance. And you know, there will be some Saints players who will have nightmares of Ollie Thorley peeling round a Gloucester line out because the way they were using him as a as a first up carrier was um well, it was doing some real damage. Um, Charlie Atkinson carrying on a really good run of form, looked excellent in this game. Ben Redshaw, uh kind of atoning to some earlier performances against Tigers in particular. The tackle he put in on Tommy Freeman at the corner. Yeah, I was gonna say that's was that was that was his moment. That was that was like the standout moment for me for him because he's not been known over his defence in the past. No, and you know, I think he got he got dropped after his defensive performance against Tigers at um Villa Park because where he was just not committed. Well, that shot showed that he's got it in the tank, yeah, um, and that's that's the level now. Um up front, I thought Seb Blake was phenomenal. Um darts were very good, but I thought his all-round play around the pitch, the physicality with which he played with was excellent. Arthur Clark was just dominating, um physically dominating all over the park. Freddie Thomas was very good, Dan Gwynn scored a really nice trial in the lineup mall and just sort of nuggety his his developments, really exciting. Venter carrying on a screen, his runner form, but Will Trenham at A, as a as a burst-through player in a what has been a poor old season, but for Gloucester as a whole, his um commitment to the cause at A is something to behold. He just keeps going, just keeps on carrying and running and tackling, and you know, he's a player it's very easy to love because he's just such a workhorse, um, you know. And to come out of sort of relative obscurity and have the impact he's had, it's uh it's really, really good to see. Um forward to where he goes next season. But the Gloucester performance all rounds, I was delighted by um you know, good mixture of tries, you know, line out malls, uh you know, ruthless edge, Thorley's try when Hendy's off the pitch. Uh really nice play for Seb Atkinson's try. Um Ben Loder, a first phase move off of Scrum. I mean, quite poor defence from Saints, but it was a good move. Um Maxwell in another one, first phase move. But there's no um there's no getting around it. The Saints won this game, and I think the way they front it up in what was probably overall a pretty average performance by their standards, yeah, to have some magic moments and hold their nerve and win it in the 18. You know, it's it's Screams champions. Um, and you know, you're right, on paper, there's no way this game should have been this close. Um Saints should have won this one very comfortably, but you know, sometimes the game throws up these kind of results and these kind of performances. Gloucester turned up, turned up to a better extent than they have in in the league all season, maybe barring the extra Chiefs performance. Certainly their best performance away from home all season, you know, even contending for the um the win away at the stoop. This was a much better performance all round. Um Saints dug in, they stood up to really, really fierce defence from Gloucester, some really direct physical running from Gloucester, clung in there, and picked out the right time to perform magic moments. You know, I'll come back to the Finn Smith try, the Hutchinson try, you know, Freeman's try, you know, Sam Graham. Um that break that uh Pearson makes, you know, and it doesn't quite work out for Freeman's um, it doesn't quite work out, but the Freeman goes in the corner. Um Sam Graham's try where it's just really big, direct running both sides of the rug, just creating pressure you can't um you can't resist in the end, and then just having that ruthless edge to keep going, keep piling the pressure on, forcing discipline, uh, mistakes from Gloucester and and Furbank cutting that great line, which he's very, very capable of, cutting that line off Finn Smith to score it. You know, it's a ruthless edge that they're gonna need to win this league, but they are eking out results even when they're not at their best. And yeah, you know, whilst they I think they'll need to turn that form around to to win the league overall, winning's a habit, and they've got it. They've certainly got it. I there is a correlation with Northampton that every time there's a rest week or an international camp, we seem to perform quite badly the week after, whether it's because we had nine players who are in that training camp. It's very hard to then prepare for a weekend when you're missing half of your first team. So I reckon there is a bit of a correlation there. So I I put part of it down to that, but I put most of it down to how well Gloucester performed, and yeah, I'd it's not it's not a performance that I'm coming away from thinking yes, Saints are still on fire, but you're right, it's that ability that we've kind of had since Six Nations barring the Leicester debacle and um losing to Bath, we've been able to win most games we've not been playing well at, and this was just another example of that. I think there's just a belief that they'll win every game that they're in, and if if if they're within touching distance with a minute left on the clock, they still believe they'll win. And I think that that goes a long way when you come to the the business end of a competition. So it it does fill me with confidence that we've still got that. It'll be interesting to see what Northampton do next week against Harlequins because they've now secured top spot uh with Bath losing to Bristol. Um so if you give it away to Quince and we lose eighth spot, I'll be very, very upset. Although we have got Newcastle at home, hopefully we should should. Well, if you if you perform as well as you have done against Northampton against Newcastle, that's true. We should you should. And we gave you two points, so we've given you as much help as we can. Gave Gave Okay, you've earned you've earned two points uh quite uh deservedly. Uh so yeah, it next week will be interesting to see what sort of team we do put out, and then uh all eyes from a Saints perspective is who lands in that fourth position. And 'cause there's a f there's a few permutations of the sides that can land there. Yeah. Can I raise some points of contention from this game though? Oh, yeah, I'm sure there are. Well, not points of contention, points, points to discuss. Um, first and foremost, the Hendi try should never have stood right, that ball wasn't out. I don't know what you mean. I think you do. I'm just putting that out there just to, you know, I've it needs to be acknowledged that that wasn't a try. But anyway, two other issues that are uh all pertaining to to Saints in general. Um, very quick to get on the wrong side of the referee. Oh and it's Matt Carley, so you know he could get on the wrong side of uh you know of his car, you know. He's he's a cantankerous individual, let's say. Yeah, but you annoyed him very, very quickly. Um Manier Yogan's yellow card, you know, in isolation was harsh, but actually, in the lead up to it, you have to say it was a pretty dark thing to do when you were so quickly pissed him off. Yeah, it it had shades of that less performance where we conceded like six penalties in the first five minutes of the game. Yeah. Saints and the offside line this season seem to be um bordering on it's it's just it's not working. I don't know what I don't know why it's not working. Whether teams have figured out that Saints are just trigger happy on the pick and go, and we just get pinged for offside almost every time we're inside our own 22, and it just accumulates, and then when our scrum was just being rubbed, like we were just conceding penalties left, right, and centre, and then oh George Furbank goes and says a naughty word, and Matthew Carley thinks it's directed at him. I don't know if it was, George Furbank seemed to think it wasn't. Um but yeah, it it wasn't. I just wonder is there an attitude amongst Saints players at the moment that is a bit pervasive? Because I we we have to talk about him, it's the obligatory in Repollo chat. The the reaction to a perfectly fine tackle from Will Trenome on him to then start start the wrestle. Is it a sign that there's kind of a this I don't know, is it an arrogance in the Saints camp? Are Northampton Saints an overly arrogant team slash club slash fan base, David? Discuss. Uh no, they're not. I disagree, but yeah, that's fine. Just discussion close. I don't think it's arrogance. I I I think I I think so the whole Pollock thing, I I think he now is in a position where he has a decision to make with his game. Whether he continues with this spiky nature where it seems every single game there's an instant where uh there's holding on the ground, there's something going on kind of off the ball. I I think referees are becoming smarter to it, and he's probably if he's not careful, he's he's gonna start getting away with very little of what he does. Um I think this is one of the first games where he's repeatedly getting pinged for his style of going over a ruck to try and slow down the ball and but looking like he's competing for the ball. Like it's something he regularly does, but this is probably the first time I've seen him pinged a couple of times for it. So he's he specifically, as we are on the Pollock Hour, uh he he needs to think about how he picks his moments in games, whether he just gets his head down and does the dirty work, which he does very well. Like you can't argue, he's still had a good game, but it's those moments where he seems to choose to make a bit of a point, a bit of a song of a dance, a bit of a I don't know, like like I said on commentary, uh D Hearn maybe encouraging him to have some you know boxing style, face-to-face push and shoves, I don't know. Yeah, but it loses impact if you do it once or twice every single game, and it's well exactly, and it it's not serving much of a purpose. And I do wonder whether there if there will ever be a point where the Saints players will s be like, this is getting a bit annoying now, Henry. Can you just wind your neck in a little bit and just concentrate on the game? Um because there will inevitably be a moment in the future where he'll be busy resting on the ground with someone where he could have been in a defensive line and then there'll be a gap and he'll get exploited. Yeah. Um so that there's definitely a talking point around that, but I still stand by my statement that I don't want him to change, and I want I still think he is a positive force for the sport and for the league and for Northampton Saints. I don't think it's arrogance, I think it's a need to find a balance about when to time these sorts of things, because there's there's a time and place, and it's not every game, and it's not every time. Um as for your accusation that the fan base and the club is arrogant, is just completely unfounded, Rory. Um well agree to disagree. Um yes, on that admission by David that uh Saints are an arrogant club and fan base, um that game finished Northampton Saints 36, Gloucester 32. Um heartbreak for Gloucester. But the Saints championship charge rolls on. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And in a completely unarrogant way, we're top of the table and are the rightful champions of the league, if it wasn't for this silly playoff system. But hey, gotta do what we gotta do, haven't we? Gotta go beat them in every other sort of way. We which we will. Because you know, we're that arrogant. We'll do it. You gotta hear first, folks. Now, next game, we're not talking about two teams involved in the playoff race here. We're not talking about very much not. Talk about the other side of the table. We're talking about the Red Bulls, and we're talking about the Sale Sharks, probably the two teams really wishing this season had ended already. Yeah. And one of these teams probably wishes even more,

Newcastle Stun Sale With Comeback

53:12

but it's not the Red Bulls. Yes. No, so uh it might not have escaped too many listeners' attention that we've not talked about the Red Bulls much in recent weeks because they keep getting yeah, if David and I are honest, um and we were very effusive about the Red Red Bulls project at the start of the season, and we're looking forward to where it goes next season, but we'd rather run out of steam and enthusiasm about them for this season because it was um it was getting a little bit um it was hard to provide good analysis when the analysis was basically they were not playing well and they were getting thumped far too easily. End of end of analysis. Yeah, when it was week in, week out washouts, uh ultimately uh it wasn't too much of too much interest to us. Not the case this week, David. Um in I'm gonna say it, comeback of the season. Yeah, yeah. 1035 down at half time. Red Bulls win 45-42. Sail sharks collapsing under the sheer weight of Geordie pressure. Um, what did you make of it? It was it was bizarre to a degree because that second half it got it it felt inevitable, like it's just the momentum swing was just so impressive, and I can't put my finger on it exactly where it was, but I think a number of the substitutions Newcastle made, so I think bringing on Ben Healy and Cammie Hutchinson made a huge difference. And yeah, I thought Ben Healy in particular, and I'm a big fan of Brett Conan, but I thought Ben Healy was a big difference maker. Oh, he he absolutely steered that ship just perfectly, and the sale didn't have an answer. And I know Sale fans, if there are any left, would probably point to the fact that they chose quite an inexperienced um side. Uh their their back row was Seb Kelly, a player that we've kind of pinpointed in the past, Ruben Logan, another young player, and well, Sam Dugdell, who's very experienced. Been around a little bit. But they they certainly threw the dice a little bit in their team selection. But I s I still don't think that makes up for the fact that Newcastle were just an unstoppable force in the second half, and I can't I I can't put my finger on exactly why it clicked, but it did. Yeah. And I don't know why. Yeah, that's but I enjoyed watching it, whatever it was. I I did too, yeah. I I did too. I thought uh I don't know what you're right, it's it's difficult to actually see it because it just felt like sale rather lost interest. Well, it they lost impact, they that you know early on, the likes of Marzi White were well because sale started so strongly. That's I think that's why it's so confusing because they they looked like they were gonna run away with it at half time, and like the likes of Roebuck at 13 was having a bit of a lovely day. Um scoring scoring with his first touch at 13. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was brilliant, and uh they they were looking dominant, they were looking powerful. Um but it just second half, like the Newcastle carries just all sudden became dominant carries almost exclusively. Uh, and where in the past they just seemed to have no direction and no steer, they just suddenly seem to have a coherent game plan. It just doesn't make sense. And unless Stephen Jones pulled off the most awe-inspiring team talk of half time, I just cannot fathom how you can have such a change of fortunes in a half-time window. It's it's it's it's it I'm still a bit confused now as to how it happened, and it really is a nail in what has been a rather poor season for sale in the in the coffin that is the 26 25-26 season in the Prem for sure. Yeah, yeah, I I completely agree. I mean, I think I think sale just have to go back to the drawing board. This sort of Alex Sanderson Sarry's light game plan that they've been playing for the last couple of years. You know, when it works, it works, and when you've got you know a couple of Dupreers, a couple of curries, you know, those kind of things can can work just through the sheer quality of player you have on the pitch. When those players aren't available, as they're frequently not, um, including, I think all the Dupreers are now leaving or have left. Um, I don't think I don't feel like they've got a game plan beyond let's hope George Ford picks the right pass. Yeah. Um, you know, tackle tackle more ruck and then give it to 40 to either kick it into space or pick a pick a good pass. Um they don't seem to have an attacking flow. No. Um they they do also just seem they seem quite low quality, and it's uh it feels like a harsh thing to say, but and they have got a lot of injuries, and you know, not I'm not just counting the fact that you know any team would suffer losing both Curries, you know, all the Duprees, um Luke Cow and Dickey. You know, I I do appreciate that you know this is a tough moment for sale, injury-wise, and you know, they've got some good players who are coming in next year that might raise um yeah, that their recruitment is probably the best of the lot this for next season. Yeah, yeah, I I I think that's fair. But the foundations look a bit shaky to me at the moment, and I really like Al Sanderson, I like the way he speaks, I like how straight talking he is, I like that he's got an attitude about him, but is it coming to a bit of an impasse at the moment where he's just doesn't seem to be connecting with the players because once they lose their absolute commitment in defence like they did in this game and have done in recent weeks, what's left of the in this team? It's a it's a it's a fair challenge, I think. Um, well, obviously, because they look they've lost Byron McGwigan full time to England now as well. Um so whether that's going to be having an impact, yeah. You do it does make you think something hasn't felt quite right um up at sale. I I've I've been calling it for a little while now, that they just look physically knackered because their game plan is just to tackle, tackle, tackle, tackle, and it just it feels like that their bodies have been put on the line and it's a long old season. And you know, when summer can't come soon enough for them, can it? No, and we and you consider the amount of injuries they've had, some players who probably aren't used to playing as much as they have been are are rolling out week on week, and it's probably it's a hard slog, and when you're not winning games and you're playing for nothing, that is a hard that's hard to get yourself up for. Um and that like you can credit for that. They are they're basically they're trying to do the thing that like Harlequins are doing of blooding the players for next season, the ones that they want to be pushing for first team. Oh, and look, you know, some of these lads I'm very excited about, you know. Um Mark pointed out Seb Kelly to us some months ago. Very impressive. I thought he was really impressive. Ruben Logan, we've been excited about for a little while. Um, and he's you know, you can tell he's still got a bit of development to go, but he he looked pretty good in this one. I think um Alfie Longstaff, the hooker. Yeah, he's good. He's good. He I think he's very good. Um, but yeah, just it I'd be able to, you know, giving up a 25-point lead at halftime would be bad against anyone. Giving it up against this Red Bull side is really poor. Yeah, also how good was uh Amanaki Maffey? Well, that was one of the names that was gonna shout at you. You know, I I would say it's been uh harshly disappointed return from Maffey this season. He's he's been put in a position where he is the star name in a team that's not got much around him, and he got asked to do too much work too early. And I think it's it's put pay to his impact this season. He was brilliant in this one. I mean, the power for his try was was phenomenal, but every time he got the ball, it was like fireworks were going off. Yeah. Um, Tom Christie, I thought, was world-class in this one. You know, he was he was so highly rated when they signed him from the Crusaders. You can see why in this yeah, you really see the the quality of the of the player in there, um, and he'll be one who's who will glue them together because his very old-fashioned seven link play between forwards and backs from him, and his his ability to do that with the players they've got coming in. If he can provide that extra link, man, he's gonna be a very key player for them next season. Um Leather Barrow, you know, we've we've liked him for a while, we've liked him for a lot this season, just carries, carries, carries. Um, and you know, there's there's still the spec, you know, Cruz at nine, I think still very exciting player. Obatoyembo's still performing really well at this level. Christian Wade pulled out some good moments, didn't quite score this week, but you know, his grubber for uh it was his grubber that Reed carried over, yeah, that Maffey scored from. You know, he's still having impact. And then you know, the man of the hour, Alex Hurl. Hat trick. Yeah, hat-trick. I mean, I I liked Alex Hell. Yep, yeah, absolutely. But a hat-trick and scoring the winning try off the the Cam Hutchison break at the end. You know, I liked Hurl at Gloucester, but I always thought, you know, good player, good squad player, but you know, it's when he left, it was like, no, good luck to him. I I hope it goes well for him up there. Well, it has, and he's done really, really well. Um, they've kept him on for next season, which is a testament to his performance levels, you know. Performing in this Red Bulls team has not been easy for a lot of players this season, but I would say that Hurle is one of their shining lights, um, which is definitely why they've kept him on. That moment of him running under the sticks. I mean, a very average splashdown, but other than that, lovely to see there's a really good angle they've got from behind the posts of when they make the break and run it in, and the smiles on faces is something to behold. You know, wins have been few and far between for Newcastle at the best of times the last few years. This felt a bit special for them to win it in that manner. It felt like a really apt way to end the season because last game at Kingston Park before you know a bit of stardust comes flooding in next season. Just briefly on this season, I'm really hoping that the rumours that Fahi Feing and No Co probably butchered his name, but the New Zealand, I think. Oh, they've bought out his contract or something, and they're denying basically New Zealand are basically wanting to stop him from going there because he's basically tearing up the competition out there. I really hope that's not true because I'd love to see him uh in the Prem. Um tearing up in Super Rugby is code for I want to see them in the Prem. Yes, absolutely. Uh so yeah, I think it was an absolutely wonderful way for them to end like a season for their fans who've probably thought it was going to be a bit more exciting to stick by stick by them. So any fans who've stuck with them to this very final game that they're able to give them that before you know, an exciting summer and exciting season ahead for them. Yeah, it's quite it's quite a nice feeling, quite nice. Um it was nice for Newcastle to have one nice moment this season because there's not been many. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, and that's not to patronise it, it just says it is what it is, and actually, you know, you saw the joy on the players' faces when they won it. You know, I suspect they'll still hang over today. And you know, long may that continue because they've got to come to King's and weekend. Yeah, if they want to win a week-long binge is absolutely fine in this scenario. Newcastle players, um, Gloucester won't mind it at all. Um, but yeah, so what was the final score in the end, Rory? Newcastle Rebels 45, Sale 42. Lovely, lovely humdinger, 87 pointer. Can't go wrong. Then final game of the round.

Exeter Outmuscle Leicester At Welford Road

1:04:46

Uh again, another humdinger, Leicester against Exeter Chiefs, basically third versus fourth, and Leicester's opportunity to spring spring themselves above Bath in the table. Exeter's opportunity to try and fend off the competition from Bristol and Saracens. Leicester at Welford Road, really hard to beat. Exeter looked a bit bit weary last round, didn't question marks over their fitness and the form and the injuries they're carrying. Everything going into this game was pointed in one direction, and once again, it didn't end up that way because Exeter were so good. They're magnificent, yeah. Um two teams that uh neither of us like to praise. Uh yeah, but uh yeah, you're right. Going into this game, I would have predicted the Tigers win all day of the week. Um, you know, it's uh and to be honest, at points you would you know you'd be forgiven for um thinking it was it was just gonna go that way, you know. Um and there was some good performers on the tiger side. I thought Pearson was excellent at fullback. Yeah, really good under the high ball. I thought Titcombe did pretty well at 10, and obviously it was slightly difficult circumstances coming in to fill in fur, but it's And James O'Connor, so they can keep their centre partnership as uh Bailey and Wand. But Chiefs stood up to Tiger's physicality in a way that no other team has done in recent weeks. And some big performances from their big name players. Lenick Atal, just impact. That break. That's prime Waboso. Yeah, yeah. Just ghosting through putting Hollywood Burning under the sticks. Henry Slade, just an absolute Rolls-Royce performance once again. And you know, to kick that well, firstly to kick the conversion off uh Zamboni and then to kick that penalty just to hold his nerve. And I know the penalty wasn't the hardest kick in the world, but holding the nerve to leave Tigers not taking a single point at home. You know, that is balls like walls. Yeah, yeah. Um and you know, if Henry Slade's in that kind of form, he is just one of the best around. And then up front, Scott's excellent, Nori, excellent, Daft Jenkins performance, yeah. Zamboni, brilliant once again, you know, finish for his try. Oh, work at the lineup and there's finish for his try, you know, the step and go, and to finish in the corner, just he is turning to special, special type of player, I think in the moment. Um, and the back row, all the back row were very good, but Hooper and Roots on the flanks were just nails, and you know, Roots, you know. I might argue he should still be on a ban, but um his his work around the pitch, his work with the ball in hand. Um yeah, it's Chiefs Chiefs playing like that are a very, very attractive team to watch. They are, and the Chiefs playing like that are a Chiefs side that can beat anyone. And yeah, that's so two weeks ago we were saying they were looking like they were tired and they were kind of well arguably potentially being out of the running for the playoffs. I think this performance puts that theory to bed to a degree, because they're still up for it and they're still churning if they could churn out this performance now, yeah. They've they've they've got a lot to play for still. Um I mean the defence in the second half from them. Oh, it's it's so good. It's so good. They they've absolutely nullified everything that has made Leicester so hard to beat this season. Um at the set piece, next to match match them at the scrum most of the most of the time. Bar in the cracknell tribe. Bar in the cracknot. Massive scrum off that one. Yeah. But they just absolutely dismantled the Leicester line out, which is not something anyone's been able to do this season, I don't think. No, they were they were fantastic there. Oh it's Zambone. Samboni is, I think, is uh becoming one of the best lineup forwards in the Northern Hemisphere. Of on the evidence of that game is really hard to disagree with you. Um, so yeah, and and like you say, their defence, I think having Ichtau back, and thank God he has come back because it's been really good. We've been able to see a bit of him in the Prem because I was a bit worried he was going to be one of those lost players. I think his partnership was Slade in that sense of channel, classical, it's classical, it is so rock solid, and you know, we we've been waxing lyrical about the likes of Will Wand and that partnership with Orlando Bailey and being able to unlock and unleash Hassel Collins and Radwan. I know Radwan had a couple of moments, but Hassel Collins pretty anonymous of this game. Will Wand had a couple of moments, but a couple of moments, but not nowhere near the impact he's had in most recent weeks. No, so I think what we saw here is the evidence of why Exeter are I think they have conceded the fewest tries. Uh Leicester were the other side that are up there with them, but I think the stardust that Exeter had been able to bring back in Ikatao and Fayo Boso coming back for injury is why they were able to go that one bit further and kind of put Leicester that put that put the game to the sword, because that that stardust that they've got with this just absolutely fierce defence. Um it's it's so impressive and yeah um Fizzelau as well. Fizz yeah, so they they've timed the return of the likes of Fizzelau, Feyera Boso, um Ethan Roots back from you know suspension, arguably probably not warranted, but I think the return of those players has been basically ideal. Um Stephen Varney continues to be incredibly impressive and yeah, he's been so good this season. He was he was so good again. I mean um in this team, he actually doesn't make a lot of uh or doesn't seem to get as much sort of uh of a much of his running game going, which he hatch absolutely has in a couple of moments in this one, but his passing game in this and I wonder if it's a specific tactic with Extra, is they just want him to bring his passing game because the wide passes he makes off the base are yeah yeah I mean they just take out defensive lines, and he just makes good decisions. And the thing is, I should absolutely dislike Stephen Varney because I just detest box kicking, and he does more box kicks than any other nine, and he kicks he he kicks more than any other nine, but he just seems to make the right decision at the right times. Yeah, I mean that is also partly because Harvey Skinner is one of the poorer kickers at 10 in the league. Well, and Stephen Varney seems to play 80 minutes week in, week out, because for some reason they do not trust Tom Cairns to come on and replace him. Um no, they signed Stephen Varney and Charlie Chapman. No, they they've decided that Varney is an 80-minute scrum half, which you know may explain why he's gonna be able to get the screen. Well, it's it's working for them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Why change a recipe that works? Um, but like it's really interesting because I thought everything before this game was pointing towards Saracens having fourth place locked up. Now the question marks remain: could Leicester end up in fourth place? Which, as a Saints fan, finishing first would not be ideal because they're our bogey team this season, it seems. So but that's how it's it's it's interesting. We'll do some predictions in a bit, but yeah, I have to say, I didn't see this performance coming from Tigers. I thought they were um they weren't abjectly poor, but they were nowhere near at the levels we've seen in the last few weeks. They're returned back to one-out runners, yeah. Every time they've had a bad game, that's what they've done. Yeah. Does it just come down to the disruption they've had in the back line? Is this is it the worst injury crisis at the worst time possible for this Leicester side? Potentially. So the the I suppose good news for Leicester fans is it sounds like Billy Searle and James O'Connor will be back in time for playoffs. Uh, they've said that Stewart would be back for a final, I think, because he had a broken thumb, although he's in a cast. So how how how match fits and how able they'll will be able to go, I don't know. But I'm sure that'll be an element of why they've perhaps not done it. But I think even just up front, they didn't seem to they didn't have that kind of movement at the line that they've been showing in recent weeks, yeah. Like I think first half, like so. Tommy Rafael was an absolute pest at the breakdown, sure. Absolute workhorse, big day for him. I think it was his 150th game for Leicester or something like that. Um, so like some big performances. Would have been his final game at Welford Road as well. Yeah. Well, unless they get out of semi-final, I suppose. True. Uh, but I think some of the other players who've been absolute stalwarts, I think Jamie Blemeyer had a relatively quiet game, Chesham had a relatively quiet game, Martin, like some of their big ball carriers just didn't seem to have as much impact as they have done in recent weeks. So you can't put that game, you can't put that on the backs players missing. Yeah, Moro wasn't the player he's we've seen in recent weeks. And look, sometimes rugby comes down to who wins the physical battle, and if you're if you're off it by even one percent in this league, you lose it. And Chiefs, Chiefs were at 100% and Tigers weren't. Yeah, yeah, I think and I think that's it. But that's round 17, Rory, and it's five humdingers, five great

Team Of The Week Selections

1:14:10

games. What an advert for the competition, and it meant it means there's there's still a lot to play for going into the final round. So before we go into our predictions for next week, Rory, throw me your team of the week for this round because I I want to hear your thoughts because I suspect you're gonna be wanting to throw a hell of a load of Gloucester players in. I'm here to stop it. Uh I did want to throw in a lot of Gloucester players. Um, I've resisted the edge to throw in too many, but I've maybe one or two. Um okay. Uh Lu said, I've got Scott CO. Okay. Um, you know, matching Joe Hayes in the scrum. I thought he was just um I mean Nicky Smith actually was pretty good around the park, but um no, I thought Scott stitched it and Lu said. A hooker, I am gonna go Seb Blake. I thought it was his best performance of the season at Hooker, and I didn't think of another hooker who was that outstanding outside of that. Uh other people who maybe maybe Harry Thacker. Harry Thacker's probably the the argument, but probably the only argument I can think of off the top of my head. Um, I'll give you Seb Blake. I'll give you Seth Blake. Thank you. Kite Eds, because he scored a try, um, and because he came on and matched up to the Bath Scrum, I'm gonna have Max La Heath. I know he didn't play the whole game, but he did come on quite early, so he came on quite early, and I thought he was good, and he's he scored a winning try against uh against the champions, and that was enough for me. It's a strong argument. I accept Max Laheath. He's in. Second row, uh, I've got Alex Coles. Okay, um I I thought he was good. Um his wide pass off the ruck set away Finn Smith's coast to coast try. Just excellent. I mean his all-round skill set's excellent. I think I think when Alex Coles plays, Saints play a level above they do without him. I think he is so influential. And uh I I could have made the argument for Arthur Clark here, if nothing else, because he actually dismantled the Saints lineup pretty well at times. Um I thought he was a really good ball carrier, but ultimately I had to lean towards the the the player that won on the on the day. Well um probably should have gone for Maro Toge, but I just thought I liked Alex Cole's performance in this week. Okay, okay. I'm guessing Zamboni's number five. Zamboni's number five. Yeah, couldn't pick anyone else there, couldn't pick anyone else there, let's face it. No, he was just outstanding. Um on the flanks, I've cheated a little bit. I've gone for Tom Christian Fitz Hardin. That is a little bit cheaty. Tom Pearson will probably have an argument for the six shirt, I'd say. I think if I was gonna j debate the six shirt with you, which I'm willing to debate, I'm probably leaning towards Hooper. Hooper would be in the equation too. If we're going for an out and out six, Hooper will probably actually because I he Hooper's just been incredible for extra season. Um button. I'll change Christy to Hooper, but I'm keeping Fitz Harding. Yeah, yeah, Fitz Harding needs to stay. He he is the heartbeat of that Bristol side. He monumental, so you can't drop Harding. Uh who's your eight? I'm gonna go Maffey. Going Maffey. I can't think of another eight who had quite as dominant individual performance this round as Maffey did. His turnover work, he got he won four turnovers, and there was a couple arguably he should have got, and he got pinged for anyway, so he could have had kind of five or six. Yeah, he's just a freak and I love it. And his ball carrying is is uh incredible because he's 36, like he's yeah, like fair play to him. So yeah, I'm I'm it's crazy to think there's Red Bull Red Bulls players in the equation there, but I I think I'm willing to cede to Maffey Gaegu, our team of the week. So yeah, go for that. Yeah, you're nine Harry Randall this week. I mean Steven Varney was was well up there in my estimations. Um McPahland, I thought had some really good moments, but he also had some some brain failing moments. Um Bracken was good, but for me, I just thought way Harry Randall ran the show for Bristol and created moments as well, nearly scored a try with a really good hold up from Ted Hill. For me, I thought he was the best nine this week. Well, I I would have gone McParland, but I'll let you have Randall for now. McParland lost it when he um knocked that ball on uh off the five-meter lineup. It's just one it's just one mistake. Yeah, you've got two or three assists. Give him give a bit give him a bit of credit. But yeah, okay, Randall, who's your ten? I've got a split one here, and I want your input on it. Um, and no, it's not Finn Smith. And no, it's not Charlie Atkinson. No, it's between Burke and Jordan. I thought you were gonna say Ben Healy, uh, because he did get player of the match. Um yeah, Ben Healy was was really good, but I thought Tom Jordan changed the match for Bristol, but I thought Fergus Burke was excellent all day for Saracens. I would lean more towards Burke because I I think the way he's playing is what's is is what's steering Saracens to these comfortable wins that feel inevitable at this stage. I think I'm happy okay. We'll go Burke. We'll go Burke. Yeah, I'm happy with that. I couldn't decide between the two, so I'll go Burke. Okay, centres. 12, Bernard Janssen van Rensberg. I don't think there's any argument there, is there? The only argument would probably be Hartley, but I think Jansen van Rensberg, the both sides of the ball was meant. Amazing. Yeah, probably he's probably a player of the round, to be fair. Game of the team, authors. Yeah, 13. Uh 13, winning try under the sticks. Well, well, we discussed before the round about what centres you wanted to pick in your fantasy team, and like your banding about Tom Litchfield, Will Wand, Revovo is in the centres on the on the fantasy, but none of them really performed this week in this in the way that no, not the same way Alex Hell did, um, which is bizarre to think, because he's like yes, he's had a steady season, but he's not he's not pulled up threes like he did this week, I'd say. Do I give another Red Bull player team of the week? Um come on, how many wins do they get? Topkins, could you be in with a shout? Tompkins was really good, but I'm I'm not budging on this one. Fine, you can have Alex Hurl as long as Tobias Elliott is one of your wingers. Tobias Elliott is my left wing. Okay, right wing. I really wanted to go for Thorley because I thought he was brilliant for Gloucester, but at some point I had to accept that we did lose that game. And so I'm gonna go Manny Fayo Boso. Yeah, you can't. Yeah, I was gonna say you can't you can't ignore the Fayo Roboso performance as much as you'd want us to ignore it. I want to, but I can't. Yeah, yeah. No slight on Manny. I just I just wanted to give Thorley his props. I thought he was brilliant. Thorley was very good. And and for the record, I thought Freeman was pretty good as well. He was. And who's your fullback? Tempted by Pearson, because I did think he was very good for Tigers, but I did have to accept that I think Furbank was very good for Saints. Yeah, Furbank would be my pick as well. He's just constantly reminding us at the moment the player we're losing, uh, which is not ideal. He's had a couple of things. I do think him and Marcus could really work quite exciting. Could really, really work well. Um yeah. Oh well. It's okay. I don't think we're signing anyone. There's rumours that we might pick up Rich Lane, which feels a bit of a Well, there's there's rumours that you might pick up James Lowe, David. No, it's not happening, it's not happening. That that's uh that's that's uh smoke, smoke and mirrors. That's a load of nonsense. That isn't happening. If it happens, I'll actually I'm not gonna commit to anything strange things happen. Um but yeah, so let's move on to predictions for round 18, Rory.

Round 18 Predictions And Permutations

1:21:41

All games kick off at the same time. Um alphabetically, yeah. Should we go through alphabetically or by order of importance? However, they're still order of importance, I'm gonna do it on the fly. Do it on the fly. Okay. So least important game of the day, Harlequins, Northampton Saints. Yeah, there's nothing to play for for either of those sides, really. Let's face it. Yeah. I'm going for a Saints win, though, I think. It's hard to predict because I don't know what sort of thing. Saints will either pick a strong team to keep momentum or they'll send a youthful side to rest some key players. I think off the back of last week they'll pick at least a relatively strong side because I don't think they'll I don't think, well, Phil Darrison was certainly not happy in his post-match comments. I don't think they're happy with the level of performance they're given. I don't think they're gonna want to rest on their laurels. My gut feel is they send up. Maybe there might be a bit of rotation, but I'm getting I'm guessing a pretty strong side. I reckon it'll be strong, but I think there'll be a couple of key positions. So I think we'll see Tony Bellow instead of Finn Smith, for example. Fine, love him, he's great. I think we'll see McParland being rested, so we'll probably see Tom James, probably see Freeman being rested. Um, we'll probably still see Pollock, we'll probably still see Pearson, Chick. I imagine that'll be the back row, Hebene maybe in there. I expect to see Van Der Meshed back because I think we're keeping him wrapped up a little bit just to keep him secure, but he needs minutes. So yeah, I'm predicting a Saints win as well. Yeah, I'm gonna go with Saints Saints 31, Quinn's 12. And I'd be really interested to see if they roll out Jack Lewis, who's just signed a senior academy contract to see if he's getting parachuted straight into the first team, and I suspect is the reason why we've not signed anyone to replace Sam Graham. Just calling it. Um next, least important, sale Bristol. Yeah, yeah, as least important because again, two sides very slim hopes, Bristol, of of getting through, but I don't I think I think they have to thread the eye of the needle to get through. I'm not even sure there is any mathematical hope still, but uh yeah, but I thought I think they had to get a bonus point, didn't they? To give themselves a chance. But but um in fact, no, you're right, yeah, they need bonus points, so they can't they can't go any higher than fifth, but I do think they'll want to finish the season off. They comfortably think are done. I think so. I think Bristol go and have a party and score lots of lots of tries and have a great time. I'm thinking Bristol 45, Sale 19. Yeah, I'd I'd be surprised if Bristol get less than 40 because they'll they'll want to go out of a bank. Next game, order of important order of importance, Rory. Gloucester against Newcastle Rebels. Tempted to leave Gloucester till last, but um I have to acknowledge that it's not necessarily the most important game this week. And arguably, you could argue also equal is equal level of importance to the Northampton Harlequins game, I would argue, because you're both playing for eighth. My game, my rules. Um Gloucester to round the season off at King's Home with a big performance, securing seventh place uh in one of the least deserved top seven finishes in uh prime history. Um, but I think they're gonna come out on top. I suspect it'll be fairly comfortable. I think Newcastle will have been partying all week. Um, I don't expect them to turn up this. I mean, I could be wrong, maybe they'll want to finish with a real bang, but Garfield says they've got their they got their win last game at home. Most of them aren't there next season. Yeah, I think Gloucester got the motivation, got the momentum. I'm going for 38. I was thinking like 50, 50-10 or something like that. I'd love it if it was true. Let's hope. I could yeah, we've seen this season Newcastle haven't really been able to back up good performances week on week. So I'd be surprised if they did. But you I'll I'll be glad to be proof wrong. Who knows? Who knows? Then um Bath Leicester. I'm gonna go Bath Leicester, yeah, because I think that is just about the second most important game, not the first. Bath Leicester at the rec. Let's just decide second. Um difficult one because both teams are gonna want to bounce back, both teams need to get momentum going into the playoffs. It's just who's got who's got the real edge physically and the edge in motivation, and I think I'm just going to shade it towards Bath at home on this occasion. I I think I'm not rolling out Tigers pulling off an upset in the playoffs. No, I think it'll be a really close game, and I don't see it being lots of tries. I think we talk like 19-17. Yeah, I was thinking something like 17-15, but yeah, 19-17, 17-15. I think there's a a score in it. Yeah. Best. Um, but I think Bath will just edge it. Which is really agonizing because that would mean that Leicester would only get one point, assuming they won't get four tries in their 17 points. And then it comes down to Saracens versus Exeter down at Sandy Park, which is the game, basically a final for fourth space. Well, yeah, fourth or third, depending on how Leicester game goes. Yes, this is tough to call. Chiefs have been very good this season. They were very good against Tigers at uh Welford Road. I I'm struggling with a logic, but there's something inevitable about Saracens at the moment. There's something in the water in Barnet, and just something tells me they go down and do a job at Sandy Park and get themselves in the playoffs. I thought you were gonna say it was sewage in the water, but yeah, carry on. Uh no, there's a lot of limescale in North London. Um, yeah, Saristons for me, I think, are gonna do the job down in Sandy Park. Again, tight. I'm going 2018 to Saracens. See, I I think Exeter win it. Yeah. Yeah, either so. There's not a great logic to what I'm saying. There's just something in the back of my mind that's like, you know, the evil empire is is back, and there's something inevitable about them. Just the it's just from that exit performance against Leicester. If they back that up, yeah, they were so good. They were so good. There's no reason for me to think they can't back that up. That would nullify the Saracens' threats if they defend the exact same way. And with Sarah with with Exeter's finishing that they've got with the likes of Fayo Boso, Orley Woodburn, Campbell. Or Paul Brown Bampo off the bench. Yeah, great arguments. All great arguments. And Sandy Park, and it's supposed to be quite a horrible weekend. Yeah, and yet. And yet, you still think Saracens. Hey, we we don't have to agree. We don't have to agree. I think it's clear. No, we don't. We don't. There's no there's no rules of us agreeing. There's just something gnawing away at me that says Saracens might lift the trophy this season. Oh, you think Saracens win the trophy? Lift a trophy. It's I almost don't want to admit that I think they might, because it feels daft and they've been poor for a lot of the season and not really in it. Well, I'll tell you what, of the three teams in the running for fourth place, the team I'd like to play most as a Saints fan is Saracens because we have their number based off the last five fixtures. Yeah. Yeah. Again, I'm not really applying logic here. Okay. Well, who needs logic? This is this is gut feel. This is gut feel predictions, Rory. It's fine. Sport doesn't always need a logic, David. Sometimes sport just throws up something ineffable, and there's something ineffable at Saracens at the moment. And I absolutely love the fact that the final round of the competition still has some jeopardy. Yeah. Who says you need relegation? Um, but those are our predictions. And we're not stopping here, Rory. No, let's press on. We're pressing on. It's a bumper, big episode for the listener because we weren't here last week. We're gonna do some awards.

Awards Noms And Listener Voting

1:29:29

The Ruxaballs Overballs Awards for the end of the full season. Um six months. So we're gonna do the nominees and we're gonna ask the listeners to um make some decisions for us. No, so yeah, so what we're gonna do, there's gonna be six categories. We're gonna ask the listener to provide some nominations, and we will also be talking about our own nominations. But what we want is people to get in touch and let us know who you think should fit into these categories and who should be in contention on top of the nominees that we're gonna suggest. So we're gonna talk player of the season, coach of the season, breakthrough player of the season, the signing of the season, the dark horse of the season, and the general dog's body of the season. Yeah. So, Rory, who should be in the mix for your nominee for player of the season? Yeah, I mean there's so many players to to talk about. I'm I'm just gonna throw it up to sometimes you just have to give props to the team that comes top. And on this occasion, I'm gonna give my player of the season nomination to Vin Smith. I like I like it. I like you nominating a Saints player. That feels nice, warm, and fuzzy and cozy. So you know me, I'm a stat man, I'm driven by the numbers, and I can't ignore a certain individual player who defies any other logic in that Tom Willis still puts out ridiculous numbers across a season. Like he's double beaten, he's he's double second place in defenders beaten. He's done more tackle more carries than anyone else. Like, for forwards, he carries more meters than any other forward. So he's for me, Tom Willis would be my nominee. Um, just because I I really can't nominate another Saints player if we're gonna go two. I can't go two Saints nominees. So, yeah, that those are our nominees. Let us know who else you think we should be considering for player of the season. Now, coach of the season, Rory, who would be your nominee? Yeah, um, we'll go head coach. I think you know, let's let's not uh show off by going down the coaching tickets too much. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um I think because of the improvement and the um the levels they have hit this season. I mean, there's a there's you know, there's obviously three or four coaches you can nominate for this, but I'm just gonna give it to Jeff Party on this occasion. Okay, that's I think that's fair. Now I am gonna fight every urge in my body, and I'm not gonna say Phil Dowson, even though I think he deserves to be a nominee here. I'm gonna say Rob Baxter for a very similar reason. Yeah, because of the turnaround from X to our season to this season uh and all the noise that was going on kind of behind the scenes towards the back, and we were very critical of it. Uh, how he has steered that ship and kind of really reinvigorated that scene deserves kudos. So, yeah, as much as it pays me to not say Dowson, because he steered Northampton to top of the table and a really impressive season. Baxter gets my nominee, gets my nomination. Okay, breakthrough player. So this is player having their first season in the Prem who's kind of come through the system, kind of well, maybe it was second season, but it's kind of really broken through this year, Rory. Who stands out for you? And there's so many players that fit into this category, it's a really hard one to hone in on. Yeah, this is this is really, really difficult. Uh, and because I've got first pick, I'm going to uh once again take away your thunder of picking a Saints player because the for me, the breakthrough player amongst many good ones, is Archie McParland. So that is who I was going to pick, so thank you for that, Rory. Um, and I would be so tempted to double down and go Edo Todaro as my second nominee. Had he not been injured so early into the season, I think he would have been well in the running for this. But there is another name. There is there are other names out there. Obviously, I I don't think we could not nomine nominate Noah Callory just because he's top of the tri-scoring table. But there are so many players out there. Um Yeah, do tell us who the other who the other youngsters are who deserve kudos this season because there are an a lot who've come through this year, some exciting talent coming through. I will accept having 10-20 nominations from uh from the viewers and the listeners for this category because I think it's been a great season for it. Uh, next up, next nomination, Rory. I want your signing of the season, and I think I have a feeling where I know where you're going with this. Oh, do you? Yeah. Um well, yeah. Who's been the best? Well, for me, I mean, I think the the smartest bit of business, the biggest impact to a team, um the most, in some ways, the biggest surprise this season, I think, is it's Zamboni for me. That's exactly where I thought you were gonna go. Uh, and I think it was a very good shout. My nomination is gonna be Billy Searle. Was he signed this season? I hope so, because otherwise I have to think of another nomination. Or was he signed or was he signed back end of last season? Please confirm for me, Rory. Otherwise, I'm gonna have to start thinking of someone else. When did Billy Searle join Leicester? He definitely joined in June 2025. Searle agreed to pretend to have the sign for the premiership team, Leicester Tigers, from the 25-26 season. You're safe, David. Billy Searle gets my nomination because of just another. Everything he's done this season. Everything he's done this season. He he has been the catalyst for what has been a fantastic season from Leicester, I'd say. Arguably could have been player of the season. Yeah, yeah. And if anyone nominates him, I I would have no bones about it at all. Absolutely not. Um, he definitely is someone who could easily fit into that category as well. Now, Dark Horse Rory, the Dark Horse nomination. So, this is someone that's kind of surprised us and kind of really kind of had such a huge improvement to previous seasons, or as yeah, come out of relative obscurity, someone who you thought was a fringe player and is suddenly a star. And for me, I think there is only I I I actually am glad I get the first pick on this one because there may only be one real pick for this one, is Will Wand. So yeah, he's he is definitely he was one of the names I was thinking of uh for this one. I think Will Wand definitely deserves a nomination here. Uh arguably you could say he's up there in the player of the like he's won the player of the month for the last two months in a row. I'm gonna I'm gonna turn the tables on you, Rory. Go on, Will Trenum. Oh yes, please. Give it a Will Trenum. No, we need to we need to allow a fair and open voting system. Uh yeah, absolutely. Listeners, all nominate Will Trenum. Yeah, uh, really, really fair. Um as a it's a good pick because he did come out of when he when he was signed last summer, you know, glosses on a lot of players last summer, not you know, to the detriment of our season, frankly, in a lot of ways, wasn't one of the names that jumped out at anyone as being you know, potential star man. Um, and it his graft is on a different level to a lot of players. He's just just a a really, really good workhorse, yeah, committed player. Will Tredum's the one that stood out, and he's surprised a lot of people. So, yeah, that's why he got my nomination. Now, next one is the dog's body, or you know, maybe more kind of the the unsung hero, the the the players that don't get the kudos they deserve and get their time in the limelight. Who would be your nominee for this category, Rory? So the sort of difficulty here is if you watch enough rugby, the dog's body players do get a lot of chat about them because they are so involved. But I think you know, you're talking you're Richard Hill types, yeah. You're you know, you do the dirty work. The men who do the dirty work, the men who who make the rest of the team shine. Um, and these are sort of players that you love to watch as well. If you're if you're a real rugby fan, you love these players. If you if you're a fan of a club and you've got one of these guys in your team, it's one of those things where if you know, you know, sort of players. Yeah, yeah. Um Fitz Harding's tempting to pick, but he's almost he's almost too um lauded, yeah. Too flashy at this point almost to to receive this award. Um Aaron Liebenberg would be another one, yeah. That sort of player, that sort of player, just constant, constant impact. But again, is he too flashy at this point to receive that award, David? Um I think the one I'm going to go for on this occasion without delay. The pausing for extra thinking time is magnificent here, Rory. Yeah, because I wonder if I've hamstrung myself by saying I'm not gonna go for Fitz Harding when he's the obvious pick. I think there's I think there's a more obvious pick. You think there's a more obvious pick? We'll look forward to your um your nomination. In a poor season, the player that I think has held things together whilst all falls around him. I'm gonna go for Van Rayen. Okay, that is a good shout. That is a good shout. I was thinking that the dog's body of all dogs' bodies in this league, Miles Reed. Oh yes, please. Yes, please, yeah. Miles Reed, excellent choice. For for a player who is so so good, he just does not get the credit he deserves. And uh, and he just embodies the dog's body. Uh so that that's where my nomination goes. But listener, viewer, however you're absorbing this information, let us know in comments. Let us know if you can comment on the Spotify episode, you can send us an email, you can send us a text, you can whatever it is, get through to us any nominations you've got for any of these awards, and uh we will then in next week's episode go through those nominations and really settle on who the award winners are. We'll pick some winners. We'll pick some winners. But this has been a blockbuster, Rory. Yeah.

Final Thought And Goodbye

1:39:44

But we can't change we may have we may have changed the inclination at the start of the episode, but we're not gonna step away from Rory's final thought. That's a mainstay. So, Rory, please do give me and the listener your final thought for this blockbuster episode before we run to the jingle and say goodbye to the listener. North London forever, whatever the weather, Saracen's gonna pick up the trophy this season. And with that, folks, a wild wild prediction from Rory. We've been Rux Malls and Overballs, back once again with some rugby content for you all. Hope you've enjoyed listening. We'll be back again next week, as long as the weather's nice. And uh we'll see you then. Ta-ra! Ta-da!