Coming Out

Today we're digging into the topic that every gay influencer on the planet is expected to cover at least once in their online lives - our coming out stories! 

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Let's Dig In: @letsdigin.podcast
Matt Benfield: @mr.benfield
Omar Ahmed: @omarahmed.co

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Come out. Come out wherever you are. Have you been thinking about that one for a while? I've been practicing. God, your intro to this episode. Well, We're coming out today. I've been out to you to I've been out. I've been done, been out. I've been done, been out. But we're coming out again for you. That is spooky. We're going back in and then we're coming back out. Okay. I'm gonna do like a reveal, like I'm going back into the closet just so I can come out for you. Are you ready? Are you ready? I'm ready. Hi, I am gay. Whoa. We had no idea. Okay. Oh my God. Welcome back to our just most divine presence. That's all I'm gonna say about that. What are we digging into? Today's episode is long awaited, long coveted cov coveted, coveted, dunno if that's the right word. I don't, you've already like covet your neighbors. You already know this about me. I like to come up with random words and then put them in a different place than they belong in the world. We're gonna talk about coming out today and our coming out stories and how gay we are and how gay we've been and how gay we will be. Oh my God, I love that. Yeah. Peaks pits in the middle part. The middle part. What I always say peaks and pits, but rose, thorn and Bud. The Bud is what you're gonna look forward to. Yeah. Today we're gonna talk about our rose, thorn, and buds of coming out. It's been a really long time since I came out. So the, I feel like the information I'm about to share is gonna be very, it's rusty. Yeah. I also haven't told anyone the story to well, should we start in the beginning? When did you know you were gay? A flamer? No. Literally when I was like a fruit basket when I basket was at four. Really? Like when I could, like, when I like first developed the brain capacity to understand attraction in any way, I was like, oh, obviously I'm a flamer. But here's the thing, here's the thing. If we take back to, if we go back way back to baby gay Omar, I thought for the longest time when I was in primary school and I was like, all my friends are girls. And I wasn't hanging out with any of the boys. I didn't like sports. I didn't like the traditional boys things. And like obviously gender roles were so prevalent in the nineties. I was like, I'm supposed to be a girl. So when I was like as early as young as I think first time I went to visit my grandparents in Pakistan, I think I was like, I wanna say how old was I in the new millennia? eight. I was seven going on eight. Yeah. Or whatever. Or maybe, yeah. Yeah. I dunno how to do math. I was eight. Eight. I was eight. You were eight. And then I remember being like, I am supposed to be a girl. And my mom was like in the place where she lives. She used to, she grew up in Pakistan, the place where she grew up in Pakistan. There was a lot of shooting stars apparently. I remember this like very vividly. And she would be like, if you wish on a shooting star, like your wish will come true. And I was like, I'm gonna I, I told all my friends guys gather round. I was like, girlies, I, Chloe, Bethany gather round. I'm going to Pakistan and I'm gonna wish on a star that I can be a girl. And then. I'm gonna come back and I'm gonna be girl. So basically, and that's how that works. So basically that's how that works. Woman to man or man to woman. Oh my God. That's crazy. That is crazy. On the tail end of the Oscars. How dare you see, I also had the shooting star story, but I wished for Pokemon. Oh, I don't like that story. Yeah, you don't like that story? No. It's boring. It's boring. No, I remember having this, like my aunt told me to wish I was shooting star for something and I was like going home and I was like, I really like Pokemon. And so I want a real Pokemon in my bed when I get home. In your bed? Yeah. Just like hanging out. Oh, ew. And little did I know. It did not happen. And neither did you become a girl. Yeah. I was like, why didn't I transition? Hello? On the plane back from Pakistan. You're like, yeah. It was like, am I'm still a boy. Why am I still a boy? That's crazy. This problem. That's actually crazy. And then it took me a, I don't know, just only a couple of extra years after that to realize, oh, I am not supposed to be a girl. I'm just a boy who's attracted to other boys are just that boys. And that's like a normal thing. I didn't have any queer representation at all, and I didn't think I saw a gay person on TV until I was like maybe 15 or 16. So I didn't know what any of that meant. Yeah. That is Genesis. Genesis. You go to bring it back to the Bible. You go, Bible. Why the fuck would I talk about the Bible? You just did. He said, Genesis. Genesis, why would I talk about the Bible? Genocide happened in the Quran. Jews genocide. The genocide happened. Genocide. Hello? Is it plural? Me also like, I don't have a fucking clue if Genesis happened in the Koran, in the holy month of Ramadan that we're currently think you probably did. Me being SMUs. There was a genesis, which is a beginning. Genesis means beginning. Like that one Julie Lipa song in the beginning, God created. Oh yeah. Come on. Okay. You go. Wait did Dua Lipa write the Bible? Yes. She's God. Wow. She's a flop. God. Hey, do you know the Swift Ologist on TikTok? No. He like talks about like pop culture and like music. The Australian one? No, he is British. Mm-hmm. Oh no. He is not British. He's American. Whoa. he was like talking about how Dua Lipa is like a flop. And I was like, absolute. What? She bought you future nostalgia. And he was like basically hoing her like an influencer. She's like an influencer just that just makes music, which is completely untrue. No, you could say her last album, flop, but she flop. She was in my top art, one of my top artists last shit. And said flop a little bit. Why was she number five for me? Continue. I don't know. Come on. Let's keep on topic this time. I grew up in North, I grew up in North Carolina in the Bible belt and I went to church every Sunday. Didn't know I was gay. I knew I was gay. I knew there was something happening because I always went into my sister's room and looked at her. Tony Hawk magazine. That's fucked up. He was hard at I remember you told me that he was hard at the time. No, I dunno. He was then back then he was hot. When? Gimme a year. When was I born? 1994. Gimme a year. Like it can't have been early two thousands, 2005 maybe. The fact that you were born in 94 Yeah. And like your, like actual years of life didn't really happen until after 2000. Yeah. Do you remember how in 2000. Yeah, I was in first grade. Maybe. I always think I was in first grade, but maybe I wasn't. I dunno what age that was. Because you were six, seven, you would've been seven. Right? So that's first grade. So by the time I was eight and trying to trans transition, I'm trying to transition man. A woman, you stop. You were looking at Tony Hawk. Yeah, Tony Hawk was hot. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I had a Tony Hawk phase. I would look at my sister's Tony Hawk little magazines and I would be like, oh my God, he is so hot. It was like the shirtless picture of him, like holding a scope, holding a skateboard. And then I would go to Kohl's and I would wear like the no way hair comes. He was kinda hot in the day. He was like hot for like me as like my first, like that is Dweeb. I'm so sorry. No, but Dweeb type, Tony Hawk shirtless. Oh God. But not now. 'cause he is ugly. Yeah, I'm, he's not ugly. He's just, we just age. Okay. I mean, I'm pretty sure he was ugly back in the day, but like he was my first guy that I saw and I was like. I like that. Ew. I don't like the search that's coming up. Was it this photo? Was it this photo? Yeah. No, it did it. Ah, it was this photo. It did it this photo. It was this photo. That's crazy. It did it. Oh my god. Ew. No, it it kind of did it at the moment, at the time, yeah. When like Skinny was in, when I didn't have what, like 2005? Did I have access early two thousands? Did I have access to a search engine then? No. Probably not. So I was looking at magazines. Yeah. So that as we all were Right. So I was like, what does my sister have in her fucking little basket? Calvin Klein section at Oh yeah. That was also, I was gonna say George Asda. Whoa. No. Coles. Yeah. Or Matalan. Whoa. Sure. Cultural divide. That's so, I knew I was gay, but I didn't like, know those words until like I was like, 18. I was like, yeah, there's something there. And then I would type like zaffron shirtless onto Google. That's ye that comes years later. Yeah, I know. We're in the genesis right now. I know. I'm just thinking about all the men. I typed blank name, shirtless blank name, shirtless, blank name. Shirtless. Yeah, that was, and then my father probably saw this as soon as the internet came about. Oh my God. When did the internet come? When did I start being on computer? Well, my brother, my older brother, I have two older brothers. My old, how do I describe them as the older one? The old, not the oldest one, but the second older one. The one closest to me, the second oldest, one second older brother. Yeah. You are the third oldest. He's the second oldest, yeah. Yeah. Fucking hell. Okay. He had discovered like me, like blah, blah, two boys kissing. He was like, him and his, him and my cousin, him and my, him and my cousin. So he knew I was gay before I even came out to anyone. That's embarrassing. I was like, what? 12 maybe. And he was like, oh, like really embarrassing. Your search results did he just come into your room and say I found this? No, he was just like. I think so. Maybe. No, he didn't come into my room. I think we was like arguing and he was like, you're a fucking widow. And I was like, Hey. And so don't tell mom, don't tell Mom don't. Please don't tell mom, don't tell. Mom's gonna be kissing. That is literally that video that girl, she's don't tell mom. Yeah. Anyway, we fast forwarded a little bit. There's like a d there's excruciating detail to go through. This is just, I also wanna preface this as we're still in Genesis, that this isn't gonna be like a mushy gushy. Wha Wha Where I'm so upset. Like my life was so hard. I'm crying. No. Coming out story, there's a lot of trauma behind it. Sure. But we're making light of it. It's humorous. There's enough fucking YouTube videos about people crying about their coming out stories. Go watch those. We did them and we delete them. And embarrassing. They're promptly private on our YouTube. Deleted. Deleted. Also, I like clickbait the shit out of that video. I made it in 2000. In 2019 and I was like, gay and Muslim question mark. Can I survive? Can I survive? Question mark. And it was so like we all did. Oh we all did. God, we all did. The views were high. The views were high. We love a coming. I used to hate comments, but we're trying to make this, we've dealt with all that and I don't need to cry about it again. It is what it is. And now Genesis, was that your genocide? That was my genocide. How old were you when I knew I, not saying genocide, it sounds like another word. Oh, I'm trying to say Genesis by the way, but like a funny way of saying octopi octopus, genesis, genocide. Yeah. Gen doesn't work. Sorry. No, sorry. Everyone. Sorry. What age? It was a fluid time. I don't know what age. I said Okay. I wanted to transition when I was eight. Come on. Figure out. Yeah. You were more confident than me. Yeah. No shit. You grow up in the city. I grew up in the town. I fucking grew up. I grow up in the city. Yeah. I grew up in the burbs in the city. I grew up in the field. born, I grew up around cows. Also, now that we're still in Genesis, let me also emphasize the fact we both grew up in very religious homes. Correct. Our parents were both extremely religious. Yes. Mine were Muslim and his were Christian. Could you imagine? Mine were Muslim. His were Lutheran. Lutheran. I mean, they are, They are what they are still. Yeah. I talk about them like they're on all their deaths. Both still are. So that was really hard for me. It really wasn't, honestly, I feel like that had a huge impact on maybe the way that I. I feel like, I don't know if it did that much. Like it did what? The religion? Yeah, the religion. It was like obviously a huge factor in like the way that everyone dealt with information through the coming years of me and being homosexual. Mm-hmm. Um, Homosexual. Homosexual you don't think it had that much of an impact on you? No, it definitely did, but at the same time I didn't really care. Ah. Everyone was like, we are Muslim and this is wrong. And I was like, I don't give a fuck. You were very headstrong. And are very headstrong. Yeah. And you were so we should get into it. I feel like a lot of people ask me, I think 'cause it's so rare to see someone who's openly queer. Like I didn't see another gay, brown, Muslim, platinum haired. Platinum haired at the time. Fuck me. Person in media or just anywhere. until the first season of Queer Eye in Tan France, which is like crazy. 'cause that was what, 2018? 17 or 18, yeah. Last year. That's, don't say that again. That's crazy. That is so wild to me. so I was like, oh, it's impossible. It's completely impossible. And I think it's very important to not only provide a space for people. Like I feel like I didn't plan for this when I first started, like creating content or like being like, I don't know, just public in, in some capacity. In a small, in the small way that I think I am. It reaches people and I think it's really it's so helpful to see yourself represented in someone. And even if I'm not like, loudly talking about my upbringing and like my Muslim background and all of this other shit, I'm still here. My name is still Arabic and I'm still like thriving. Just by being myself. And I think that's important. So that is how. It ends. Obviously I'm here right now, thriving, but it came out to my first friend. That was my next question when I was when I was, I wanna say 11 or 12. Crazy. I'm in high school now. That's crazy. So I'm thinking about boys in my mind I'm like, I like run away from boys in the playground. In primary school. But the things didn't start to develop until I was in high school. And then after my first, I think first year of high school, I think it was like towards the end of that year, or maybe it was the end of my second year of high school, because I think the following year I came back, I was like a little bit nerdy and I didn't really have like Yeah, you first, in the first year I was like, still going to like mosque after high school. Every day. So I would go into school and then go home, get ready for like Islamic school mosque, and then go to mosque and read the Koran and learn about Islamic teachings and stuff. And then be like such a little good boy. Yeah. Until I was 12. Yeah. And literally something flipped in me puberty like I told my friend in high school at the end of, I, I'm sure it was, I remember it being the end of the year 'cause it was like summertime, like everything was green and smelly and I just remember it so well I was like, oh my god. PE teacher. Mr. P. Teacher is so hot. I have a crush on him. About the teacher. The teacher. And I'm like, I'm 12. Do I? Do I have a chance? Crazy. I mean, Maybe a crazy. And so I was like, this is crazy. Like I am telling someone this and I'm like, oh my God, he's so cute. And what'd she say? She was like, oh my God, he is. And she was so supportive and she didn't tell anyone all summer. And then all of a sudden I came, I actually don't even know how it happened when I came back from my third year of high school. Like I was in year 9, What age were you? Because you saying high school is different from me saying high school. Oh, I was 12. Okay. I was 12. So middle school. and I came back for the new year and then I was like, I was just different. I like, I'd spent the summer being like a, I was just different. I was different. I spent this the summer being a bit of a diva, and then I came back, like I used to wear my first, like two years of high school. I would wear my uniform properly. Like I was like such a goody two shoes. And then I didn't really do anything like bad or anything, like getting attention would've made me cry. I would've gotten like upset about it and then it came back for. Third year of high school. And then I was like, let me be such a diva. And I started wearing my tie low and my shirt was untucked school uniform. And I belly wear my blazer. Like I was being such a diva. And I was like, oh. And I didn't even really have to come out to friends. Like people would just ask me and then I'd be like, yeah, obviously. And then I was the talk of the town obviously, obviously. But then I really played into it like, I think because I was so, like, I didn't give a fuck. I played into the stereotype so much. 'cause I was like, I'm having fun and I wanna be gay and I wanna be visibly queer. It was not single other gay person in my school. And there was like a thousand people at my school. So you got a lot of attention. And I loved detention attention. And I loved attention. Oh, I thought you said detention. I got detention too because I stopped wearing my uniform properly. Oh yeah. And also there was one fucking dickhead teacher. Mr. Fucking Parker. No. Mr. Parker. Fucking day. Count your fucking days, bitch. Every time I'd be on my phone, I swear he's homophobic as fuck. 'cause when I started like looking visibly gay at school, and I'd be like in the quad with my like phone chewing my chewing gum with my phone out. And then he'd like always, people would have their phones out all the time and he'd snatch mine. Yeah, snatch mine. And then he like gave me this sob story once. He was like, my wife went into labor and I couldn't have my phone, so you shouldn't be allowed to have your phone. And I was like, Hey, this sounds like a big fat. You problem. I don't care. Shut the fuck up. What does his wife out be? I'm 13. Give me my phone back, bitch. What does his wife being in labor have to do with anything? I don't know. What a freak, Mr. Parker. What? Also I'm like, are you trying to like make a 13-year-old, feel sorry for you? Like I don't give a fuck. Literally. You're like, what is labor? Yeah. Yeah, labor. I don't know her. Did you never have a girlfriend? No, I didn't have a girlfriend. I did. I had two duet tell me, I had two girlfriends. My first girlfriend was in middle school, which was like, what is high school? 14 to 18. That's crazy. 18. You graduate for me and go to college. High school is 11 to 16. Yeah. So you have some weird numbers. I don't know. 14 to 18. Yeah. So middle school was like 12 to 14. Was when I had a girlfriend. 14 to what? 12 to 14. 12 to 14. 12 to 14. Oh, I was a big flavor by then. I was, no, I was a nerd. I was a nerd. and I had an archeological bible and I I was like in, not Catholic school, but like Lutheran version of Catholic school. I was like trying to be an A acolyte and I was like learning the 10 commandments and shit. So I was like a good Christian boy still by like middle school, by like the start of high school. Honestly. I was like still really good. And I was always really good. I was never like bad. I think when you have this like religious upbringing and like before you really come out like balls to the wall you like are such a goody two shoes. 'cause I did the same thing. I was like, I'm gonna be so like well-behaved and like I love going to the mosque. I love to pray. Yeah. And then I all of a sudden I was like, wait no a minute. No. I know. Yeah. Mine was a bit more delayed than yours. You ended yours earlier than me. But my girlfriend in middle school. Your girlfriend? My girlfriend, we just We would just hold hands and just be close to each other. It was the most like gay best friend relationship ever. I remember like walking and we had a campground in North Carolina where we would hang out and it'd be like a, in the summer you'd go to the campground and everyone would be there and I would be there. And remember this first time, like I held her hand and I was like, oh my God, I'm holding her hand. This is so crazy. It was like, I was like making out with her, but it was like just holding her hand. Did you make out with her? Did you make out with her? No. What a loser. And then I had a second girlfriend for two weeks, and then I really realized I was gay. And this was like sophomore year of high school. I dated her for like two weeks and I was like, actually, I've realized. How did you realize to yourself and then who was the first person you told? I realized to myself when Blaine kissed Kirk in Glee shut up. I was already in college by then. Are you fucking kidding me? How old were you? 18 was when I came out to my first friend. 17, 18. 17, 18. That is crazy. 1718 was when I came out to my first friend. No, obviously you told me this story like a billion Jill times. Yeah, but it is like late. I like forget it's not late. It's I think I'm crazy compared to No, compared to me. Everything's late. Yeah. But that's crazy. and then like a junior year and senior year of high school. I was like a gay. And then I also came off to my parents. Well, We'll talk about parents. Is that when you went to New York and you wore that scarf? Yes. That was sophomore year flame. I think I was, I think that was, I was still, when I was dating that girl and I went to New York and wore this, put it on the screen, this beautiful outfit. Oh my God. And they said, that's a straight man. No, it's a bender. A bender. A bender. A bender. Oh my god. See the British um, British slurs, slow words. The British slow words for a gay person, they're so much better than the US ones What do we have? Flavor. Are you bent? I'd be like, every time I'd walk down the corridor at high school. In high school, someone would be like, oh, are you Ben? I like that. Are you a bender? That's fun. Bring it back. Fudge packer. Oh, I like that one. That one's good. I feel like that's a very American one actually. We just have no, we just have flamer and flamer. Fruity and flamer is such a American Forget. Oh yeah. Forget time. Say that one. Can't say that one. Can we now forget? Sorry. We can say forget. We can say forget. Yeah, we can say forget. Okay. Fun And now we've come to our parents. Have we yet? Yeah. I think we can come to our parents and yeah. I think in my mind I wanna, I'm like, when did I reconcile this with myself? And also like religion. Acolyte what? Acolyte. Acolyte. You were an acolyte. Acolyte. A what? Apostle? No, an acolyte. You just dressed up in little robes. It's a very gay thing. You dress up in little robes and then you go and light the candles on fire and then you go before the pastor comes on, he does his little preachy and you go and sit down and then you hold the book, the Bible for the pastor. That sounds like witchcraft. I'm not gonna lie. It pretty much is, but really boring. Really boring, rich witchcraft. Oh. 'cause you also told me like Lutheranism is like Catholicism, but without the gold. Yeah. That's so boring. It's like stone and boring churches. Stone. Yeah, brick. Like the church stone. Yeah. The churches are made of just like stone and brick and it's so boring and then you just sing the worst hymns ever. Oh. With the worst organs And all old people. No one's young. There were like 10 people in this fucking church. Oh wow. I had there was like a good like maybe 70 people at my mosque. I think there used to be more people and then they either A, died or B. Okay, good. Went away. Perfect. Great. Love that for you. Well, So you didn't mention the fact that you grew up in the tiniest town in the world. Did I not? No. Yeah, I grew up in a farm town. Farm town. Conservative. No, this is very important to the story. What, how many people live in Alba, North Carolina? The amount of people who live in Catawba City, North Carolina City. The amount of people who live in Catawba Town, North Carolina, Catawba County, North Carolina are different. 'cause there's Catawba Town in Catawba County. Gimme the lower number. Catawba Town is a hundred, 109 hundred, sorry, 900. Back in the day it was 600. No, it was 900. It's 600 or 900 people. Yeah. Very small little tiny town. I think its crazy that like you grew up in a town like that and here you are. Oh, from the small town to a big shady. That's crazy. Yeah. It's like a Hallmark movie. But reverse. It is reverse. Yeah. Yeah. Why do they do that in Hallmark movies? That's so boring. Sorry. People love the idea of going backwards. Going backwards of resending. Yes. Because they've never had trauma in their lives as devolution. which is also why they walk slower than us. They do walk so slow because they've never had to run from trauma. That is so embarrassing. Yeah. Okay. before I came out as actually at the same time as I came out as gay to my parents, I came out as not believing in God. Same. Yeah. Which was really like a double whammy. It's like a really, actually, I thinking back on it, I'm like, that was like kind of mean to do, but maybe I shouldn't do it. Shouldn't have done that. Yeah. But I was, and like I was in AP biology in junior year of high school and then she was talking about evolution and I was like, this makes sense in my head. The fact that you actually grew up thinking that God created That's crazy. Yeah. In seven days. That's that. No girl. Like he was productive. Yeah. No girl. And I was like, girl, no. Yeah. For the most of my life I was like, this makes so, makes sense. Wait, you were like, you were in also, is it bio? It's not biology. It's the big bang. Isn't that like physics or shit? No, I was talking about evolution. Oh, is evolution. Oh yeah. Five valid, wouldn't it? Maybe you should go back to my evolution is, I remember when I was in high school, I was like, I really love planets. Like the solar system and like learning about that. Yeah. But the science that that category fell into was physics. Oh, no. Yeah. As, yeah. Yeah. Physics and astronomy. No, 'cause we had chemistry, physics, and biology. Yeah. But the, yeah. But then the plans would go into physics probably. Yeah. Yeah. And chemistry. I was like, I don't wanna fucking use a bunsen burner. Yeah. Fuck chemistry. It's so annoying. Chemistry is so hard. And then biology, it's like, why is this frog on the table? Loved biology though. Okay. Anyway. Let's stop detouring God brains. Well, That's when I realized I didn't believe in God. And then double whammy. One, two punch. Parents religion. One, two punch. Do you have something else to say about religion? Let's go back to Islam. Girl, we're gonna Islam. I was waiting for that one. So girl, we gonna Islam. Back when I lived in Islam, I I was born in Islam, so I grew up, so you can say that I grew up at a very young age. That's, Very religious, all of a sudden gay. And I'm like, none of this aligns. None of this aligns. It does for some people. Now let me preface this by saying, if you're listening to this and you're like, you can be gay and Muslim. Yeah, I believe you, you can do whatever the fuck you want. No one's here to tell you otherwise. For me, there are so many people that have been like, ah, you can be, you're like deterring people from Islam. And I'm like, this is my fucking story. Shut the fuck up. Okay. People love to censor themselves and people love to send to themselves. Also ever since I like bought this information or this story to the internet all those years ago, the online Muslim community to their detriment. Are so mean. You still get comments on the video? Oh, all the time. All the time. All the time. Like that you made this video ago. I don't like, I'm not like a practicing Muslim. I grew up in Islam and I have, my entire upbringing was through the mosque. And I, in my mind, like there I guess I guess you would call me an ex-Muslim, but I don't believe in God. I don't believe in religion at all. I just don't, so when people say oh my God, are you Muslim? I say, no, because I'm not a practicing Muslim right now. And I'm not going to be sorry. And someone's in my DM the other day 'cause I was posting about food in the middle of the day and someone was like, you're not doing Ramadan. Mm-hmm. Anyway, that's actually how it began. I was in high school, 13, 14, and it was like Ramadan time. And I was like, this is a very, is this the story? This is a really pivotal moment. No, I'm not, I'm not telling that story. I'm not telling that story. Not telling that. That's a good one. It's so bad. It's a good one. It's such a bad story. Maybe subscribers, only content. No. Oh my God, that's such a terrible story. It's not gonna get me canceled, but like I've told my friends and they're like, it's such a bad, it's like I was such a little shit. I was such a little shit. I would say we all were, but I wasn't really. So it was my coping mechanism. Okay. Yeah. So anyway, Ramadan time, which is quite pivotal. Pivotal, quite ceremonial. Important, Important to right now in the moment. 'cause we're in Ramadan. Correct? I was like let me pretend to fast. 'cause like I still had to wake up. I was still very young, so I'm like, my parents want me to wake up and fast. And so like, how am I gonna say like, I don't wanna do this anymore. then I would wake up and then I would like fast and then open. Like close my clo, open my fast. Close my fast. Yeah. I'd wake up and then before the sun rose, eat my food, go to school. And then I would like secretly go eat in school. And before you judge me, so many people do this. So many people did this back in my day. So many people did this. So many people do this. My brother did it. We all did it. It was a thing that we wanted to do. 'cause we didn't wanna fast, but we didn't know how to tell our parents. It's a lie that we told. I'm like, oh, they come home from school. I'm like, wow, I'm so hungry. That was a really hard one. My mind is so clear and I feel so close to God. Yeah. Literally. I'm like, meanwhile I've been smoking cigarettes behind a hamburger in your stomach. I've been like smoking cigarettes behind the like school shed when I was like 14 years old. I know. And like eating pepperoni pizza in the school cafe. That is my God. Ziggy's at a pizza. Ziggy's At a pizza. Yeah. I reconciled this in my mind very early on. 'cause I was like, this is, this seems fun to me. And all my, I'm like making friends with like only white people. Yeah. Because I grew up, my high school was fully fully white and there was like a few south Asian people. Yeah. And I had like my girlfriends that were South Asian, but our like values just stopped aligning. Yeah. Obviously. 'cause I was being a degenerate then like I was just like drinking and smoking. At the age of 14. All of a sudden I was like, this seems so fun. I bequeath you Islam, you Islam. And so in my mind I reconciled that like quite early on and I told, I think my brother, like second oldest brother knew by the time I was 14. So timeline wise, came out to my first friend when I was like 11, 12. My brother knew when I was 13, 14. The rest of my family, I told when I was like, I wanna say 15, 16. So I'm being a degenerate obviously. You just heard about that. It was my coping cope. Can I fucking speak fucking out? Am I about to crash out? as you heard, I'm being a delinquent, a degenerate, I'm like, why am my, am I, why am I, can I fucking speak? Why are me and my. Family members are not getting on so well. My mom's really sad and annoyed at me that I'm like leaving the house or like I'm lying about where I'm going. I'd be like, oh, I'm gonna go spend, I'm gonna go to my friend Paul's house, who was a boy. 'cause I'm a boy. I'm supposed to only be friends with boys. And like, I would sneak out to my girlfriend's house. We weren't allowed to have girlfriends. 'cause you know, you're straight and you'll get them pregnant. Big scary by just looking at them. Yeah. Big scary mom thoughts. Yeah. Little did she know I'm going around and she's doing my makeup. like first like really close high school best friend, me and her. We just I would go to my friend Paul's house and then walk to Rachel's house. It was not close. And I would walk my ass over there. And then walk myself back over to Paul's. Mm-hmm. I think one time, like my mom went to Paul's, or called Paul and I wasn't there. Oh, Paul's a real person. Yeah. I thought you made up Paul. No. I thought you made him up. He was pretending to go to Paul's house. I thought you made, just like you were like, I'm going to Paul's house and you're really going to Paul's house, yeah, I was like going to her house and she was doing my makeup and I was like 14, 15. And it was so fun. I was like, oh my God. I've always wanted to like, have a girlfriend and we would watch movies and we would paint each other's nails and very nice. And then I would make sure I took it all off and before I went home and one time my mom clocked me with makeup on and when I was like four again, 15 or something and was livid. Bear in mind, hijabi woman, I'm coming home with a little bit of smudged eyeliner on my face and she's like, what the fuck are you doing? You piece of shit. And I was like. You don't get me. I'm like, mom, I wanna go to fashion school. You don't get me. I'm not your little girl anymore. That was me crashing out at 15. She was like, you're a psycho. Who have I raised? I didn't raise a girl. I raised a boy. And I'm like actually you did. Yeah. The shooting stars said, so actually I wished upon a star. There was also another thing that happened in my brain that like, I remember being, when I was young, my mom had two boys and then she had me and she prayed for a girl. She wanted a girl so badly, she never got one. Spoiler. Wow. She never got one. No. Literally. And they joke about it all the time, still. I know. Now that we're friends, they joke about it and she's like, I always wanted a girl. And when I was, she was pregnant with me, she paraded the house down, boots that I'd be a girl. And then I came out jazz hands. And I was like, flamer, sorry. And she was like, oh, no, disappointed. And then I was like, little did, Chino was, it was close enough. You got a gay, it was close enough. You got a homosexual. And then, yeah that led me to coming out when I was still in high school. I, I was 15 at the time. And I was in high school and I was like, my parents, we are not getting on. Me and my mom like barely speak and I'm living in her house. And I'm like, it's creating so much angst and stress in my life and she's trying to ground me and tell me that I can't like go see my friends and I'm like, jokes on you. I'm gonna do it anyway. I don't care. so I was like sneaking out and stuff and like our relationship was rocky and in my mind I was like, you don't get me and this is why. So I was in my like home ec class with my girlfriends around me and I'm like, let's write a letter to my mom. And so I like wrote a letter or letter her out. I spent all of Friday, like I didn't do was so dramatic. I know. Yeah, I know. Dad. I spent all day, it was a Friday, I spent all day crafting out this like handwritten note to my mom and it was like, you don't get me right now. Like we aren't getting on and it's because I'm gay. Did you actually do that? Dot Dot? Yeah. I was so dramatic. I was I was like. This is how we've been getting on like feeling at the moment. I was like, therapizing her. I was like, this is the reason we have Minging on. It's because you don't understand me. You don't see where I am right now. And where I am is out of the fucking closet and then diva. Oh, it's like one of those letters that you open in the song plays and it's like, I'm coming out. That's exactly. Because you, that's what I imagine. I've, I should have done that. Fuck. That's what I imagine. I should have done that. I went to the store and got one of those cards and like, I I should have done that. M gay. M gay. When we talk about crashing out, Venus is in retrograde right now. Mercury is about to be in retrograde. I'm about to crash out. My mom had the worst crash out in known to Humanity when I came out to her. Mm-hmm. But I've been talking for enough time. So now it's your turn and we'll get back to me. It's suspense. It's suspense building. You do have a lot of words. Also, I love the drama. This is so fun for me. My fucking YouTube video that I did in 2019, I was like crying. I was like, oh my, actually I wasn't crying 'cause I don't cry. I cried. I don't cry on camera. That's so embarrassing. You did cry. I remember you crying. I did cry. It was emotional at the time. I also wonder, I'm like, we don't need to be emotional, like things are emotional. Sure. In this podcast, the backbones of it are comedy. I'm not gonna sit here and like trauma dump and cry to you. That's so embarrassing. What I'm gonna do is make fun of it. I did not come out to my parents. I was kicked out. No, I was forced out. I was almost kicked out. Boop Ooh, ooh, diva. Um, I was kind of forced outta the closet. What when was this? This was senior year of high school, I'm pretty sure. Senior year of high school. I was up in my room doing my homework, doodling, doing whatever I was doing, talking to my friends, high school things. my, my dad he called it from the stairs. And he was like, Matt, come down here right now. And I was like, okay, whatever. I walked over to the door and I was like, what the fuck do you want dad? No, I was not. I was not at shut up. You wouldn't. I like to pretend. No, I like to pretend that was more of a rebellious team, but I wasn't, no, I wasn't. I was a goody tissue, so I was like, yes, dad, what do you want? And he was like, you like, yes, papapa, you cold. And he was like, he said, I think he said you're not like this are you? And I said, what? How do you know? I said, what? I'm getting there, it's called suspense. And he was like, you're not like this are you? And I was like what are you talking about? And he was like, I saw something on the computer and I need you to explain it to me. You're not like Elias, or you're not like them or something And he was like, he found something on my Facebook account. I had liked a video from a gay couple that I was following at the time. I had liked a video from a gay couple that I was falling on time on YouTube Because you like was so into YouTube. Gay couple culture. Yeah. It was the first, my first exposure to gay people. Yeah, because I didn't have any gay people around me in high school. Maybe like one framer, rookie ma. Rookie mistake, liking a video on YouTube. I know, but I didn't. I don't think I knew that it could be as opposed to me two boys kissing. No, I was definitely doing that, but I erased my history. I didn't know how to do that. You just click, erase your history back in my day. No, you couldn't do that easily. It's not very two years younger than me. Yes, it was. So when I was doing that was 2000 and like two. Okay. Or three maybe. I erased my history, but I did like something on Facebook. The two guys in doing their little things. Facebook. It was like, I think it was like a status update or some shit. Oh, okay. I don't think crazy. It was like a, or like they shared the video on Facebook and I liked it. I don't know. And he was like, you didn't like, I don't know how he found this one random like that I did. Maybe it went on my what is, that's time. What did you call the feed? Yeah. News. Yeah. Newsfeed. Timeline. No, timeline. It was timeline. Facebook timeline. Yeah. So you used that was the, and anything you liked just came up. Yeah, it'd be like, oh, Matt Benfield like this. It's a dumbest feature ever. Yeah. So he saw that and then he was like, you're not like this. Why are you? And I was like, maybe. Yeah, I guess so. And he was like, what did you actually say? I think I said, yeah. I was like, I was gonna come out eventually, I think I was waiting to like, leave for university. I think it was like right before I graduated high school and I was like going to leave for university. And then I was gonna say, my plan was like, I was gonna say like, I'm gay, go to university. Dunno how I was gonna pay for my college if they, if they, if they, it was like a bad response, but I was gonna cross that bridge when I came to it. there was a big yelling match. I went outside and I was like calling my friend. I was like calling my friend at the time who knew I was gay. I was like, can I come and stay at yours if things go south over here? it is like a really sad actually, but like I can make fun of it now. I know. She was like, yeah, of course. 'cause I was like, had a couple of friends that were like. Cool with me. Being gay. And then went back inside. I think they had simmer down by this point. It was like hours after our original fight. And I just left and I was like, I'm not gonna deal with this right now. You can deal with your shit and then I'll go outside and deal with my shit. And then I came back in and then we didn't speak for two weeks like silence, just not gonna look at your way, not gonna look my way. We're just gonna move around each other because everyone's awkward and know we What were you off to university? This was like my last semester, so I think it was like a couple more months. And then I was off to university. 'cause no one in my family could talk about their fucking emotions. So we were just like going around the topic. And then I remember being in my room two weeks after the two week mark, I was in my room. I was like laying down doing fucking homework. I don't know. And then my dad came in, he was like. You want go therapy? And I said, no. And then he left. And then another two weeks went by of not speaking. I was like, that was a great try, dad crazy. Offer me psychological help for a nons psychological issue. Crazy. now thinking back on it, this was like over a decade ago, at the time they had no education or idea of how to deal with something like this. 'cause they were raised, how they were raised. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. two weeks after that, they said they brought me down. They were about to have a conversation with me and they said, we're okay with the gay thing, but not with the God thing. Oh no. And I said, I don't know what to tell you. Both are gonna be here for a while. Then it after that I was like you said you're okay with the gay thing. But it's been a while. And the only in the past two years have they come around to the gay thing for like a decade. They didn't mention the gay thing or like ask if I had boyfriends or ask my girlfriends, they literal acknow my existence like two years ago maybe. Yeah. Two or three years ago. Which is great 'cause we've been together for almost eight. Yeah. So it took them a while to actually be okay with the gay thing and we'll come to like their presence right now. that was like 18 and it took until like probably 28 for them to actually start recognizing you. Or like that I was gay or that I had a boyfriend. Because remember you made your like YouTube video in 2019 too, and you were like, there is no resolution here. We don't speak about, we don't speak about that. It was like, that was like put behind a wall. Yeah. And like you can't reach it or like behind a safe and they were like, we'll deal with it later. Yeah. Yeah. And later never came. 'cause we actually still haven't really talked about it, but it's just like they have come to their own conclusion that they're fine with it. And that they like you rightly, they like me as gay, apparently as a parent we've never met, but they've, I don't think my parents have I don't think most of my family, it's like a southern thing. Like not being able to like, speak about your emotions properly. Totally. To not like, actually show what you're feeling and like actually have the words to communicate. They like the emotional intelligence to communicate how you're feeling on the inside. Meanwhile, like I'm from a fucking family of talkers. That is crazy. But that is my story. Yeah. That is my story. It's not anything crazy because I did think I was gonna get kicked out. Like I really did think it was a possibility that I would get kicked out. But I didn't. Oh. Because I think I was too headstrong at that point. 'cause I was like, you're not gonna fucking kick me out. I've not heard this story in so long. I'm like, sad. No. Ew. I'm like, sad. Sad. No. It makes me sad a bit. I'm about to tell my story. In a non sad way. It was terrible at the time. Let me start there. Okay. I wrote Revelations, I wrote this Revelations, chapter three, revelations. I crafted this note to my mother and then I went home, packed a few bags of clothes. 'cause I knew for a fact I planned for it. I asked my friend if I could stay at her house. She asked her mom if I was, it was okay for me to stay there for a couple of weeks. I had researched if I can find council housing. 'cause I knew one girl in my high school who like had a council flat because her parents were like, I don't know, on drugs or some shit. And I was like, I feel like I could do that. That's what I could do. There was like council flats, like close-ish to my house. I was like, I wouldn't have to leave the neighborhood. It'd be so great. I could still keep going to my high school, whatever. Packed my bags, wrote this note, left it in the kitchen and I ran away from home. Drama. Drama. What? So you love drama? I'm so you love the drama at all? So dramatic. So dramatic. And what did my mom do find? It immediately starts calling me on my mobile, on my Nokia. Calling me and I like put my phone. I turned my phone off and then I like, apparently they're like my brother and my mom. They're like, are driving around the neighborhood, like looking for me. 'cause I've obviously gone by foot, right? But I take the back roads. They're like, I knew that they would, I had a feeling that they would, my brother. You made a movie in your head about this. I know. My brother text me and he was like, okay, we're on the road. We're like going around looking for you. Do you want to be found? And I was like, no. Oh my God. And then I was like, let me take the back roads. And then I like did, I took all the back roads and hours passed. All of a sudden I'm at my friend Rachel's house, her phone rings and she answers the phone. Hello? Yeah. Hands it to me. And I'm like, fuck. She like redialed numbers on the landline that. Weren't anyones that she knew. You might think you're smart, but your mom's smarter. My mom's a genius. She's literally like in another life. My mom is a detective. Yeah, for sure. She is a crazy person. And so found me at my friend's house using the landline, which is crazy. Crazy. And then like me and her went to our other friend's house 'cause we had plans. I was like, I got plans. Sorry. I was like, I actually had plans that night. So I was like, I wanted to like still go to my other friend's house and like you with your bag full of like scarves. I'm sure. Yeah. I like, I was like, let me take my accessories. That's like mostly the only thing I took with my accessories and I was like, this will feed me. Did you take any snacks? No. Oh, you literally just take accessories? I didn't take any food. I took some clothes I took. I didn't even take my school uniform. This is the gayest running away story I ever heard. I didn't take my school uniform. I was like, if I have to, if I'm being kicked out of my house, I'm not gonna, I'm gonna go to school on Monday. And this is Brian mind. This is Friday night. So you were gonna go party. Yeah. I was like, I'm gonna go to my friend's house. She found wine. This is why gays will not survive the apocalypse because we do shit like that. Yeah, I know. I mean like survival instincts were strong. Like I did the thing for myself. Anyway, it was all very scary and like terrifying at the time. It's funny now. yeah, my dad came to the fucking loser. My dad came to pick me up at my other friend's house and then we didn't really speak on the drive home. And then Yeah. Dropped me off and then we didn't, I didn't speak to a single member of my family all weekend. And it was my oldest brother who approached me first. 'cause my second older brother remember, knew already. My oldest brother had no idea and he was on like the path to be to being like super, super religious. He was like such a strict older brother. So strict. And there was only like a three eight age gap. Quick spark notes. My dad's a piece of shit hate. We all hate, not because he was homophobic or anything, he's just a terrible person. No one in my family speaks to him. He just sucks. So because of that, my older oldest brother took the mantle of being like a parental figure. I fucking hated that. I was like, you're annoying me. it was that moment when I came home that weekend when me and him like fully spoke heartedly about life and stuff and we just like really didn't get on very well at all. And it was that moment that changed that. And he like really saw me and he like had his own. Realizations about life and changed his life trajectory because of it. And so influential. And if he's listening to this, it's you're a piece of shit. Literally. And then I spoke to my mom. So this was, that was a Friday that, that all happened, weekend happened. Didn't speak to anyone until Sunday night. And my mom was like, this can't happen, blah, blah, blah. I don't give you permission to be this way. And I was like, I girl diva. I wasn't asking for permission, but like fully, I was like, I really don't care what you say. Yeah. But I was also at the time where I was like, I'm scared. I don't wanna get kicked out and like actually be homeless. 'cause that's, it's crazy. Right. It was very like very possible And then I was like, let me. Fight. Let me fight. We spent hours just fighting and fighting and fighting and fighting. And she was like like you can go see a doctor, like you can get better. And I was like, not the therapy. Fucking, oh, love that one. Crazy. It was so crazy. A couple like weeks, months, however many, however long the time period was go by. And my mom like, there is like a, an imam like a religious leader who will like, who wants to talk to you. Like it's not gonna be anything crazy. Like he just wants to just he's like a child psychologist. Bullshit. That's what she told me. Liar. And I got in his car and we like drove around. Spooky. It was really spooky. Honestly, this, if I ever had a moment in my life where I was like, maybe I can like open my like mind and like heart to Islam again after having dealt with all of the trauma of growing up in this religion. And being different. And being ostracized for it. I will also preface this. the part of the story that I didn't mention is like, growing up religious, I have so many family members and all of my cousins, like ostracized me. Like not a single person, gave a shit about me. It was crazy. Apart from like my close, like girl cousins who I love. Anyway, this man takes me in his car and then this is like weeks after this, like weekend happened and he's like, I've seen this happen to a lot of like young men. Were you like molested as a child? Oh, by a man. This one of the main ways that this happens to young boys, that they think that they're gay and they're not. And I was like. Are you fucked? I was like, it was in that moment I knew that. I was like, nobody here has my best interests at heart. I fucking hate everybody. And now I'm about to go. If you thought it was off the rails before, I'm about to go even more off the rails. I did. And it was perfect. And it was like my truly my like, coping mechanism to go out party. Like I was 16, 17 now, like I'm in sixth form college. And I'm like, I don't give a fuck about any of you 'cause you clearly don't give a fuck about me. That is like not, that is not putting my like, wellbeing or like my best interest at heart. And I realized in that moment I was like, I have to take care of myself and if I'm allowed to stay in this house, which is thank God. Okay. But you're doing the bare minimum. I'm allowing me to stay in your house. Thank you. Do you want me to like. I'm not gonna be like, oh, thank you so much for not kicking me out. You did the bare minimum. We didn't speak for two years from that point. From that point. No. It's crazy. From that point to like when I graduated, when I moved to university, when I moved to Liverpool, when I was like 18, we barely spoke. No. Two years is crazy. No, it was, oh, maybe it was like three years. 'cause I went to college for the college part. College in the UK is not college in the us 16, 17, 18. I am like living at, my mom's still going to school and partying. Like I'm out all the time. I'm staying with friends. I'm barely home. Like I'm being a delinquent. like, we slowly I think I forced my lifestyle. I really did force my lifestyle onto her. Mm-hmm. So she was just like, I either have to get over it a little bit. And she wasn't. And she was completely unhappy with it. Me, like sneaking bottles of alcohol out, like down the stairs, like all these like glass bottles, like clanging together. And she's like, where are you going? What is that? And I'm like, nothing. And I'm like running away being a diva basically. And it was my coping mechanism and I I had my friends and that's how I survived and it really made me who I am today. 'cause I was truly hand on heart. The most unapologetic version of myself I've ever been in my whole life was when I was like 16, 17, 18. And I look back at that version of myself and I'm like, I'm so proud of that version of myself because I wouldn't be here without that person. So how did you come back? Like how did your mom come around? I was little cunt and then I moved to university. And then we really weren't like that close. I think we were like forming a closer relationship. 'cause I think I was getting older and I was like, I wanted to invite some of my friends to my house sometimes. And like my mom was there and she'd like she was, it was like nice. Like she was meeting some of my friends who maybe were never welcome round before. Some of my girlfriends, for example. Who in a Muslim house. Like we weren't allowed to have girlfriends, but then she was like, obviously these girlfriends are not gonna be his girlfriend. Mm-hmm. So they're just friends. They can come about. By this time, my oldest brother, who was also coming through his realizations and like being a little bit more like. I don't know. He was like, he didn't really have girlfriends either. He just started like expanding his world a bit more. My other older brother started dating a white girl. Like I really set off a chain reaction, I think it just slowly, like the three of us started doing our own thing and my mom was just like, I have to get used to it. There's nothing I can do. She was, we argued still. It was anger. It was a lot of frustration involved in those three years. But then I moved to university and I think that helped us get closer. 'cause we weren't living in the same house anymore, so we would let call and catch up and stuff. And then we formed a slow friendship again. And then I graduated university and moved to Australia. Remember? and I think the distance made us like closer in like a friend friendship way. But we never spoke about the gay thing. We never spoke about it. It was something that was never, ever talked about. and it really wasn't until again, I think maybe the last few years or so, like we started dating. She met you. She would give me funny eyes. She met you in 2018. And like the first time you came around I could see, she knew, I knew she like made like funny little eyes at me and I knew she was okay with it. 'cause obviously she wouldn't have allowed you to stay at our house. And In my room. In your bed. In my bed. Literally when you first came to stay but we never spoke about it. It was just like never mentioned. And then she mentioned it to my brother once years ago. Yeah. This is maybe I'm gonna say four or five years ago. Yeah. I wanna say probably maybe this was like 20 19, 20 20. She like mentioned it to my brother once, or like he mentioned it to her and she like acknowledged it and it was like a completely normal conversation about the fact that we were boyfriends and we lived together. And then he messaged me and he was like, this is crazy. We've just had a breakthrough. We've had an open conversation about you and Matt. And I was like, shut up. That's crazy. we never spoke about it up until that point. And then I think we were leaving in Toronto and I remember I called her on the phone and I was like, I was so nervous to bring it up. I was like. So you know about Matt, don't you? my brother told me you had this conversation and so I just wanted to have a conversation with you about it. And she was like, yeah, obviously I know. And then I was like, oh my God, okay. Crazy mom that this is just like randomly happened and like we've never spoken about it. And she was like, I didn't wanna bring it up because I didn't want you to get mad and like whatever. 'cause we used to fight about everything. Like she used to bring things up or try and I don't know, we were just like butt heads all the time. But then we just had this moment like pre pandemic where we were like, I see you, you see me. We've both come a long way. We haven't really spoken about the trauma that happened in between. And like I can't hold any like hatred and resentment in my heart because she was young. She moved to Pakistan. She moved from Pakistan to the UK when she was 16 via arranged marriage. And then popped out three kids. And then another one 10 years later. Before she was even like dirty, like my age. She had three children. So I'm like, I give you like so much grace and have so much empathy for like your situation. I understand where she came from. She was able to grow, learn, and just evolve as a person and had her own journey, which I won't speak on right now, actually probably ever. 'cause that's her own story. And she had her own journey to discovering herself and her life and just like how she stands in the world and now for fucking besties. And I love that bitch so much. And she loves him maybe a little bit more than me. No, she's my mom. That's my mother. Yeah. It's crazy. Sorry. Yeah. That's the whole story. Whoa. Yeah. Whoa. Crazy. Oh my God. That was exhausting. I saw something on TikTok that said. It's your parents' ex first. It's your parents' first time. And that makes me cry. It's your parents' first time experiencing life too. And I was like, oh, I know. Was a few. I think I saw that like a couple years ago and I was like, this makes me sad. Yeah, so sad. Like when I think about the fact that this is also my mom's first time living so sad. This is my first time living. Yeah. This is also my mom's first time living so sad. So I'm like, oh, what if we were to like cut our parents a little bit of like grace and like a little bit of slack. Yeah. Let me still cry now. Sure. The trauma traumatized me significantly and like I was in therapy for a while and I was like, this is freaking me out. Oh my God, there's so much, there's so much more that went into it and my parents' divorce happened like shortly after. It was a crazy thing. At the same time, as you're dealing with all the trauma, you have to decenter yourself sometimes. And I think we forget about that and they're coming out stories like, it's not all about us. It's not all about us. Like we did go through some shit. But our parents also went through. But when you're young too, when you're young, like 16, 17, you're like, it's all about me. When you're, When you're like, it's sad I'm not, when you're really, when you're really crushing out, you're like, it's all about me. You don't understand me. Yeah. I am the most person in my world right now. Basically, the world does revolve around me. None of your views are worthy, valid or valid. but again, I think it's because you like, the older you get, the more you're able to empathize with your parents and yeah, I'm in my thirties now and I'm like, oh, my mom was just trying the hardest with what little information and resources she had when your mom was 33. How old was your old oldest brother? My mom had my oldest brother when she was 17. Yeah, so I can't do the math. 3, 13, 16. He was 16 when she was 33. Wait, I didn't even think about that. So like right now you would have, like right now So when my mom was 35, I was being a little bitch, like almost just two, two and a bit years older than you. That's crazy. Now that is crazy. Could you imagine how you would, you, you would be reacting or like dealing with shit like that. me, like telling my first friend in high school that I was gay. Yeah. Or I liked the PE teacher and like Googling two boys kissing. My mom was my age right now. Yeah. That's crazy. You gotta cut some slack. We gotta cut our parents with little slack. Yeah. This is called maturing. This is called maturing. It's called being in your thirties. Yeah. Do you know why is I think if everything, like everything that has transpired, everything that's gone down, if I was to hold as much like hatred as I probably could because of everything that went down and the details of things that really weren't reconciled. 'cause a lot of stuff was just like she got over her stuff just because she decided, she just got over it. In her head. And your parents have decided that they've gotten over stuff mm-hmm. in their head and not spoken to you about it? Not spoken to me about it. And you're just supposed to meet them at the point that they are now. And give them Grace A. Little bit. I think you have to 'cause it's like we're not gonna go back there and rehash all of that and Yeah. And probably would be healthy, but we're not gonna do that. Yeah. It depends on how much closure you want. Yeah. I'm fine. I'm fine. It depends how much closure you want. I'm fine. Then great. We're fine. Then great. We're fine. My life is great. This is what I mean. I'm like, here we are on our little podcast. Yeah. Filming in our little studio. I'm like, I don't need my parents to be at Pride Parades. Totally. I don't need my parents to be worrying about rainbow colors. Totally. I don't totally, I don't need my parents to be like, oh my God, I love you Gay Sun. I'm so proud of you. Gay sun. Yeah. I don't need that. I don't crave that. Like I have a parent then. That's great. Yeah. Yeah. I don't need them to be like, it's great if you do have parents who are like at Pride parades and like being so like Yeah. Yeah. Loving. I think like when the you grow up and you like have this. Experience in life and you're like, I don't need all these people, have supportive parents from the minute that they come out, which is fantastic. As everyone should, I wonder what that's like and I wonder how much that would've formed my life a little bit differently. I don't actively think I would've changed it 'cause it, nothing could have changed. Things happened the way that they happened. I'm in the position I'm in right now because of it. And I'm grateful that I wasn't kicked out. I'm grateful that my mom had her own journey to like self-discovery. Yeah. In a world where she didn't have anything to go off and as a woman married to a Muslim man and like the patriarchy that surrounds that kind of relationship. Mm-hmm. She became her own person and formed this independent life that she has now. And I really think a big thing. I think this was my closure actually, that I'm gonna say this was probably my closure when I came back home from university. My mom told me that she wanted to file for divorce for my dad. And she was like, you've seen like the world, done so much already and like you're only 22. She was like, I've not done any of that. And I wanna do something with my life And then I was like bawling my eyes out. I was like, that's really crazy. And it was like a really healing moment for me. To have her say that to me. Oh my God. And then my dad crashed out. 'cause he apparently thought it was my fault that we were getting divorced. And I was like, you cunt iactually. Go fuck yourself. Ugh. And there it is. And there it is. Revelation. Revelation chapter. Revelation chapter 13. Ended. Exodus. Exodus. That's the beginning. Yeah. Oh, was at the beginning. It's not right. Genesis, Exodus. I thought Exodus was at the end. No. Genesis and Exodus. that was a great coming out episode. Yeah. Whoa. We came out and I'm never going back in. I only went back in once. For you not going back there. I started out, I started out this episode. Very out. So you and a girlfriend? No, we had to go back into the, we had to open up the little drawer and go in. Just like drawer hang out. Hey guys, I'm coming out the drawer. I am so small. Where do we think, oh my God. We open the drawer. Spec of dust flies up a mad. I am. That's me. I'm so sad. Where do you think the term coming out the closet came from? Like the closet. Like where did that come from? That's crazy. 'cause gays would hang out with their accessories in their closet. No, that's not true. That is not true. Where did you have a better guess? The, yeah. Google will tell me, won't it? Where did the term, Coming out of the closet come from. Yes. Google AI overview tells me, oh, period. The phrase I love Gemini. The phrase coming out of the closet originated from the concept of debutante ball of a de. Oh my God. I did not expect that. Of a debutante ball where young women would be formally introduced to society, essentially coming out into society. Thus borrowing the metaphor of stepping out of a private space to reveal oneself publicly. In this context, the closet represents the act of keeping one's sexuality hidden, similar to a secret kept in a private room. Oh, wow. Debutantes. Oh my god. Wait, they need to do that on Bridgeton. Oh my God. Yeah. Oh my God. That's great. Crazy. I love that. The more you know. Okay. That is so wild. That was a lot. My brain hurts a little bit. Well If you enjoy that episode, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. Follow us everywhere Peaks, pits and, no, shut up. We're not doing that again. No, this has been a long enough episode. I am done with you. We've been filming for 75 minutes. That's crazy. Yeah. I'm over it. We don't even have time for dinner. Table game. I need you to get the fuck out. Yeah. But not before reading us on Apple Podcast. Thank you for trauma jumping with us. Join us next time for another drama dump session around the dinner table. We'll see you goodbye and be gay. do you know those people who say be gay and do crime and millennial fucking phrase, there is literally a fucking on yeah. 16th Street. There's a duck. There's a Oh, what you call it? The millennial goose. LED goose. Yeah. Millennial goose in someone's window. Yeah. Be gay. Do crime. And it's like a goose, like neon sign thing. If that's yours, disgusting. Put that away. Disgusting. Put it away. Put that away. Bye. I have to go and lobotomize myself now. Goodbye.