Okay , before we dive in , I want to make something very clear . This discussion is not about shaming veterinarians . We have immense respect for veterinary professionals and the work that they do . Our goal today is to explore the many different approaches to pet wellness and highlight the various professionals who can play a vital role in your pet's health journey . This conversation is about empowering you , as a pet parent , with the knowledge so you can make informed decisions and build the best support system for your pet , one that aligns with your values and meets your pet's unique needs
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Charly PrudenHey everyone , Welcome back to the Next Level Pet Parent Podcast . If you're here , it means that you're a next level pet parent who wants to do the absolute best for their furry family . And today's episode is a big one because we're talking about something that I think a lot of pet parents don't realize . Your vet is very important , but they don't know everything about pet health , and that's okay . You wouldn't go to a general doctor for detailed nutritional counseling , right ? So the same thing applies to our pets . To help us break this
down , I've got an incredible guest for us today , which is Jessica Fisher . She's the founder of the Pet Parenting Reset podcast . A certified holistic pet health coach and an expert in raw food nutrition . She's dedicated to helping pet parents make informed decisions when it comes to their pet's health , combining nutrition , training and wellness strategies to optimize their well-being .
Jessica FisherJessica , welcome to the show . I'm so excited to be here . Thank you both for having me on .
Charly PrudenThank you so much for joining us and thank you for talking about this really important topic , because I think there's a big misconception , actually , where veterinarians are kind of thought to have to do everything , like they're supposed to be the dentist , the skin dermatologist . They do surgeries , they do like everything , and sometimes we even ask them questions about emotional well-being , like there's also supposed to be our behaviorist right . So can we just talk a little bit about why do you believe that our veterinarians are thought to be this go-to expert for everything ?
I think there's so many layers to this question or the answer to this question , and of course , this is all my opinion , having talked to so many veterinarians , especially holistic and integrative veterinarians . I was so fortunate to attend one of the AHVMA conferences a couple of years ago and make some friends there and just kind of be in the circle of you know these people who have spent four and five decades practicing veterinary medicine and hear the conversations that they were having and the things that concern them and the things that they've seen in their their lifetime of practice , and I think , one we as a society , especially here in the US , we have been so conditioned to kind of give a lot of authority to various positions in our society . So and I don't , I think this was very intentional and I think it started in human health care or sick care , depending on how you want to term it I think that's where it started , in human health care or sick care , depending on how you , how you want to term it . I think that's where it started . When we look to , we've been conditioned to believe that there are certain people in authority positions policemen , doctors , right and so veterinarians just kind of naturally fall under that where it's like we need . We are supposed to trust them implicitly and kind of just do whatever they tell us to do , and it has unfortunately been really detrimental for both our health as humans and our pet's health , because it's been kind of monopolized .
Jessica FisherYou know , if we look at I hate to almost say it because I know there are people out there who are going to be like , oh , you're just a conspiracy theorist , but I think all of these things that we're going to talk about today are completely factual . That you know the lobbyists in our government have just allowed so much to happen in our human healthcare system and it just has trickled down into our veterinary healthcare system . And so add that into some of the other conversations that I've had the pleasure of having and being just a fly on the wall with some of these incredible holistic veterinarians is veterinarians in general . When they go through veterinary school , they are taught to be uber competitive with one another , like one veterinarian will not almost ever even collaborate with another veterinarian . I don't know if anybody out there has experienced this . I know many people have experienced this where they will talk to their veterinarian and if they want to get another opinion they're like oh well then , I'm not your vet anymore , right , like they're so uber competitive and I think that is ultimately detrimental to their patients health in the end . But that's kind of how they're taught in vet school is to be very competitive with one another , and it just kind of trickles down and so we tie all of this together and we're left with a society who reveres the profession , which I mean , by the way , is an incredibly noble
profession .
Jessica FisherI have absolutely nothing against even allopathic veterinarians . I very much appreciate their knowledge and what they're good for , which is often critical care . Um , you know acute situations . They know the physiology of our dogs and cats so much better than us who haven't been through veterinary school do . I very much appreciate that . I just think that as a society we need to kind of unlearn the things that are detrimental for us and for our pets and relearn how to use people appropriately for for what they were actually trained to do . That was a long-winded answer yeah , um , I think .
Charly PrudenI just think it's so uh interesting that , know , vets are just supposed to be all these things all in one , whereas in the human world we have specialists . You wouldn't go to your general doctor if you have , I don't know , like some type of skin problem , right , so , and then there's this gastrointestinal doctor in the human world . So , like , like , it's just so interesting that , as pet parents , we all just have that one go-to person for anything that's wrong with our pet . So that's something that I think we're going to be challenging today and also to like help pet parents understand there isn't just one person that can help your pet . Sometimes your pet might need several different people and your vet isn't always the only person to go to .
Charly PrudenBut something that you actually said was , uh , something very important as well , which is to you're allowed to get second opinions . So I think that is a general misconception as well . Which is to you're allowed to get second opinions . So I think that is a general misconception as well , or something that I know can be very hard when you're standing in a vet office , to you know , say , okay , thank you so much for everything that you've done for me today . I think I want to get a second opinion , just to be sure that this is the route that I want to go . You're absolutely allowed to do that , even if it's a little uncomfortable sometimes .
Jessica FisherIt is . It is , you know , and that actually recently happened to me . I took my dog to a new veterinarian . Didn't want to , but that's where we were , and I called the vet clinic . I called many vet clinics and I thought , based on talking to the person that answered the phone , that while they didn't necessarily agree with how I am raising my pets , that they were going to at least be , were going to at least be understanding that we were going to agree to disagree and they were just going to do the blood work . That's all I wanted done .
Jessica FisherAnd I got there and this veterinarian , um , who looked like she had been practicing for multiple decades , um , I mean , spent the whole time telling me how horrible raw food diets are , how she didn't believe in titer testing , how my dog needed to be on flea tick and heartworm prevention , and I mean just on and on and on . And I was very calm and very nice and I just said I appreciate it with everything she told me . I said I very much appreciate your opinion . That's not how I'm going to . You know , that's not what we're going to do . That's not how we're going to handle this today . And it got to the point where I said look , if you don't want to see my dog , if you don't want to do the exam , that's fine , we will leave . And you know she , she didn't know how to handle me .
Larry PrudenAnd .
Jessica FisherI wasn't being confrontational , I wasn't being rude , I wasn't crying and being emotional . I was just very calm , saying thank you , no , thank you . If you're not comfortable with this , we can go . And I mean she was frazzled , quite honestly , like it seemed like chaos to her and I'm like calm down . Like I literally told her at one point calm down , it's all okay . And my dog actually had high thyroid levels , which is fairly rare in a dog . Dogs tend to have low thyroid levels and she was frantic Like I've never seen this in a dog . Oh , my gosh , what are we going to do ? And I'm like it's okay , we've got time . And she's like , well , I need to research this . And blah , blah , blah . And I said that's fine , we have time . And I just like she didn't know how to handle me .
Jessica FisherI felt like that's that's so interesting , like that experience that you have gone through , and I don't think I think it it's typical for a pet parent to get that response from a veterinarian , but I don't think the response I gave back to the veterinarian yeah , it's typical , and so she just didn't know how to handle me .
Larry PrudenYou know , like she , it just seemed like chaos to her yes , it's so interesting because , like also , we've had an experience where we actually didn't agree with the veterinarian on . We were doing an ultrasound with milka and they needed to , like kind of get her down and so they can shave her stomach . Right , they wanted to do something to her stomach and she needed to be still for that and she wasn't still . They wanted to give her a sedative and we just asked what is the name of the sedative so we can look it up , but she was just like not really having it . He was quite rude to us but we actually said , okay , you know what , like this isn't working right now . We're gonna leave and we'll we'll maybe make another appointment or we're just gonna book with another vet that can actually do it with her being more calm .
Larry PrudenToday wasn't that day for her , but I think it's like it's really okay to , you know , be respectful first of all . You have to be respectful when you're talking to to veterinarians , you know , because I do think that's very important to be respectful to the people that are actually looking after your animals . But what would you say ?
Charly PrudenYeah , but to express that whenever you don't feel comfortable and you know to say that that's okay and you'll come back or you'll go somewhere else . Vets , like you said , they're trained to diagnose and treat diseases , but
they're not always the specialists and things like nutrition or behavior science . So what have been some of your personal experiences raising your own pets and like , can you just share some personal real life examples of situations where you have chosen to consult with a different type of pet wellness experts instead of a veterinarian ?
Jessica FisherThere are so many . Honestly , you know , I always start unless it's behavior , I think behavior you do tend to go towards a trainer or a behaviorist , I think I think a lot of us kind of know that that one unless it gets bad , like I think anxiety is something that we still tend to go to our veterinarians for , you know , especially if it has to do with like sounds or , um , anything like that , thunderstorms , like the barometric pressure changes , like I don't think we understand that one as much that we tend to go to our veterinarians for that . But , um , so much , I have gone to my veterinarian first , have gone to my veterinarian first again get diagnostics , because I want to actually know what I'm dealing with . But then there have been times well , let me go back to kind of earlier in in this progression that got me where I am today .
Jessica FisherI was feeding my pets kibble , all of them , my dogs and my cats . I was doing everything , literally everything my veterinarian told me to do . I was feeding you know four different kinds of kibble because they all needed different kinds . I was giving them , you know , dewormer every three months . I was giving them all of the vaccinations , the flea and tick .
Jessica FisherI was doing everything and I think I was just feeling motherly , maybe , and decided I wanted to cook some food for my pets , my dogs first . And then I was like , well , I'll give some to the cats too . But I was still giving it along with their kibble , because I knew enough to know that I didn't know what the heck I was doing . So on this path , I was just doing you know like what a lot of people start off doing chicken and rice and vegetables kind of thing . I went to my veterinarian at the time and I said look , this is what I'm doing . Um , I'm adding it into their kibble , but I would really like to cook for them , like completely cook for them , and get rid of the kibble . And my veterinarian , dead on , looked at me and he said I don't know , maybe add some tomatoes .
Larry PrudenTomatoes .
Jessica FisherAnd I say I tell this story all the time because it's like , oh my goodness , like most , most people are just like wow , that would blow your mind . And I went home that night and I think that was the very first time where I was disillusioned by something my veterinarian had told me . I was the perfect patient for a veterinarian . For many years I had many animals and this was , I think , the very first time that I came home and I was like my veterinarian can't help me . And that was huge for me , like it , I mean it . It . It shook my world because I was , I considered myself to be like , and , and everybody in my family and all of my friends , everybody I knew , was like you got an animal question , go ask Jessica . And in that moment I was like if my veterinarian doesn't know , what else ?
Jessica FisherAnd what else ? Yes , what else do they not know ? And fast forward , a few months later and I had a cat that was just could not get this ear infection to go away and he , uh , gave me revolution to put on him , even though my cats were strictly indoors . But I didn't , you know at the time , I didn't know . And so revolution for anybody that doesn't know is a topical flea and tick it goes , you know , like right in between the shoulder blades . Tick it goes , you know , like right in between the shoulder blades . And , um , I put it on my cat and it gave him a chemical burn . And I called my vet and I was like WTF . And he was like , well , he needs one more dose in a month . So blah , and I'm like you are out of your ever loving mind If you think that this medication that just gave my cat a chemical burn , that I'm going to put it on him again . So like , at this point I'm like and I say this half jokingly because obviously veterinarians are incredibly well trained for what they do but at that point I was just like what are these people eating good for ? You know , in this moment where your pet is physically harmed by something and your veterinarian is saying to do it again . I'm just like what is happening , like my whole world is crumbling , so to kind of and I don't know if that answered your question , maybe it half answered your question , but I think there are so many different things that we do need to look outside of our veterinarian for . So obviously there are specialists . Right , if you have an animal that has some sort of disease , there are various specialists out there , whether that's for the eyes or anything else yeah , the heart . There are cancer specialists out there not very's for the eyes or anything else yeah , the heart . And there are cancer specialists out there Not very many , but there are and there are .
When we think of all of the things that we , that our pets , need to have done , groomers are part of that team I have talked to and in my podcast . I have actually learned a lot of this through my podcast because I have had some biases in my life and I have been very honest with people when I bring them on . Um Kat Henschen I don't know if anybody is familiar with her , but she um used to own Platinum Paws . Her husband is the very , very famous BC Henshin and now they have the Ninja Groomer . I had her on and I was just very honest with her and I said , look , it took me a really long time to bring a groomer on this podcast because I have a bias .
Jessica FisherLike the only thing I knew about groomers and grooming were like the Petco grooming shops and all the horrors of dogs being left about . Groomers and grooming were like the Petco grooming shops and all the horrors of dogs being left in dryers and dying and you know things like that and I'm like . So she educated me quite a bit on how , for some dogs , the only time that they get checked for lumps and bumps and like growths and anything that's going on is when you take them to the groomer . So I actually now look at that as like an extension of a wellness routine for a pet . If you're not doing that at home , like for me , at night , I get on the couch with my dog and I , like she doesn't know what I'm doing . She thinks she's just getting rubbed at night , right , but I'm checking all over her body for lumps and bumps and is anything growing , is anything weird going on , right ? Um , so there are groomers . There are , um , uh , your , your pet sitters a hugely important part of your pet care team , um , and then we can get into other things energy work I think that's something really cool that a lot of people may not be aware of . I look at that as part of your pet care team and then , yes , nutritionists are a very big part of that as well . And then holistic or just pet health coaches
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Jessica FisherIn general , I obviously prefer a more holistically inclined person . I obviously prefer a more holistically inclined person . But pet health coaching is something that is relatively new , not like super , super new , but relatively new as far as like having certifications and designations and things like that . But it very much follows the same line as human health coaching , which has been around for a little while . And you know , doctors , human medicine doctors , we know the pitfalls . They've got maybe 15 minutes with you , for women especially . We're just kind of brushed off and like , oh , your symptoms are , we don't know anything about it . Right , you're , your labs are fine , so you're good . So you know , health coaches are something that again newer to the animal world , to the pet world , but it's that same same thing where we need somebody who , yes , is well-trained , does know a lot , works alongside what your veterinarian is doing , is not a replacement but can spend a whole heck of a lot more time and provide much more individualized recommendations for your pet . I'm just giving you guys such long-winded answers , for your pet .
Larry PrudenI'm just giving you guys such long-winded answers , no , but that's a really great , you know , especially like this , like having like a team of like health support . So I really liked the . The . The pet sitter , cause I I never like pet sitters are .
Larry PrudenActually they are quite important because they are the ones that are with your animal . They are , you know , I mean , depending on the type of care they're giving to your animal . They might be doing that rub down and checking and seeing is anything different happening with your animal ? The holistic pet health coaching as you said , it's more new . There's more certifications coming around this and it is really great because , just as you said you have now , first of all , not everyone goes to the vet so often and if you want something like a holistic or integrated vet , that can come at a pretty high price , honestly . So having a holistic pet health coach or somebody that is holistically minded to help you navigate what is good for your pet and what is not good for your pet and help you maybe even do research on certain topics such as flea and tick prevention .
Charly PrudenYeah , and then there are also herbalists as well .
Jessica FisherYeah , and you know , I think that's one of the other really cool things about pet health coaches is that , very similarly to human health coaches , we all have things that we are , different modalities that we are really interested in , that we are really well versed in in . Many of us have nutrition certifications as well . So , you know , my for me , nutrition is the very first thing we're going to talk about hands down period , and I think I wish that were true for people for human medicine as well . But , like , that is just the very first thing we're going to talk about , because it is the foundation of health . It's what you put into your body , is what builds the cells of your body , and so we all have different modalities that we are interested in and , with a more holistic approach , we do get to look into things like herbalism , homeopathy , you know , ozone therapy even if it's not something that we can give to a pet , like ozone therapy , you know we can provide recommendations and resources .
Jessica FisherSome of what we do is just to say you know what ? Your veterinarian didn't run these labs and , based on what I'm seeing , we really need these labs run . You know . Please go back to your veterinarian and get this done , or talk to your veterinarian about something like ozone therapy or mistletoe therapy or you know various things , depending on what's going on for the dog or the cat , and it's , it's . It is just such a cool and interesting thing . And I have even seen veterinarians become more interested in modalities because their pet parent has come to them saying I'm learning about XYZ , I really think it could be beneficial for my dog .
Charly PrudenAnd then they start looking into it because they had never heard of it , or you know , it's just's just really
, really cool , I think this is actually something we have also been uh having experience with , because milka has been having some lab tests done , like it was about a year ago now .
Charly PrudenLast year , april , we she had some elevated blood results and , um , the red blood cells were elevated . So you know they say , oh , she might have been dehydrated , but it got to a point where , like every single year when we test her blood , her red blood cell counts are high and we're actually doing a podcast episode just on this topic and our experience with this . On this journey that we've had with her in the past year , we have made the experience with our own with Milka , how important it is to like go to multiple different vets and multiple different health professionals outside of vets , because it has been so mind-opening actually , like the very different , like everyone says something different , and it's just been so interesting to like be on this journey with her um and then also getting getting like the feedback from people that are vets but then also people that are alternative health coaches or herbalists and homeopaths .
Larry PrudenSo , um , yeah , it's just just a very interesting um journey yeah , I think it's so important , honestly , just to have like a team of pet health , like just have a team of pet health wellness experts .
Charly PrudenAnd actually something that you said was with regards to pet sitters . I think that's like such a weird one at first when you first said it , but actually you know a lot of pet parents actually drop off their pets at the vet as well for boarding . I don't know if that's a thing in America , but I know it's a thing in Dubai .
Jessica FisherSo that's just another added on thing actually that you know vets are supposed to do yeah , no , it's very popular here as well , and I have never done it and I don't ever recommend it , but that is . Yeah , I'm just not a fan of boarding in general . I understand that , like , sometimes there are extenuating circumstances that may be , but like , yeah , it's , it's a big thing . Here too , I don't love it , but it is what it is . But yeah , I mean to to your point about you know the labs .
Jessica FisherIf I didn't know what I know now , I just going back to the experience that I started out this conversation with with this new veterinarian . Not only was her thyroid level high , her bun , the blood urea nitrogen was also high , and so that was the first thing . This veterinarian came back and said oh well , her bun is high , she has kidney disease . And I'm looking at her and I'm going we , we just spent 30 minutes of you telling me that I should not be feeding my dog a raw food diet . So you're very well aware that my dog eats a very high protein raw food diet and you're telling me that an increased bun is CKD . So I was like , okay , I understand that she eats a very high protein diet , so it kind of makes sense that her bun would be high .
Jessica FisherWhat's her SDMA ? It's normal . Okay , I'm not worried about that . And she was like , oh , okay , I guess if she eats a high protein diet , that could make sense . I'm like , yeah , that makes sense . So you know it . Really like if , if I weren't me , if it were just somebody else , they would have left that veterinarian's office thinking , oh my God , my dog has kidney disease . Yes , right , no , my dog doesn't have kidney disease .
Larry PrudenYeah , and that's again . That's why it's so important to you know , have a team of people that you can reach out to and say , hey , look , this is what I got back , you know what are your thoughts on this of people that you can reach out to and say , hey look , this is what I got back , you know what are your thoughts on this , and then you can have some reassurance on what might be happening with your animals . So having a team is so important and I'm so happy that you know we have a team for Milka .
Jessica FisherI really wish that and you know , as people start learning about it , I'm sure things will change . But right now people in in doing what I do , we're like the last line of defense . We're like people have tried everything , they have fed everything , they have gone to all the vets , they they've done all the things and it's like you're my last ditch effort and that it kind of sucks because it's like me like that's a lot of pressure but also it's so rewarding when you can give extra quality time that they weren't expecting to have with their pet
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So what would be your advice when it comes to pet parents knowing when it's time to bring in a specialist instead of just working with their veterinarian ?
Jessica FisherHonestly , I wish they would start from the beginning , especially when it comes to like a nutritionist , because that isn't something , and I won't say all , because there are definitely some veterinarians out there who are like I know everything there is to know about nutrition because Hill's told me so . I know everything there is to know about nutrition because Hills told me so and you know , bless their hearts and I appreciate everything that they do learn in vet school . But if we can start off on the right foot , like and what is that term , an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure , that you know . Like , if we could start off on the right foot , like , oh my gosh , you know there's , there's certainly a lot that needs to be overcome and this is something that um and I've talked about here and there I think I started this conversation with . I mentioned BC Henschen at the beginning of this podcast and I'm sure most people have no idea who he is and that's okay , but he he has been in the world of pet nutrition for a very long time and I had him on my podcast a couple of times and we were talking about this kind of a little over a year ago I don't know if people remember there was a big to-do with a particular pet food brand very , very popular , one of the most popular and a lot of dogs getting very sick and dying and the FDA not doing anything about it still hasn't done anything about it and the conversation that we had kind of wound up with .
Jessica FisherLike dogs may have been eating similarly to how they're eating today , but one thing that we're not taking into account is like genetics that are being passed down from generation to generation , and so we have .
Jessica FisherWe have generations of dogs and cats that have been fed such poor quality nutrition for generation after generation after generation , and this is the first time we're seeing this .
Jessica FisherSo to me I mean I and I know this is probably a huge like moment for a lot of people but to me I feel like kibble is a failed experiment and the sooner we acknowledge that , the sooner we can get back to a state of health , for for our dogs it's going to take generations to get there , because it has taken generations to get where we are to , where the same , and we don't .
Jessica FisherWe do not have the same level of nutrition . We do not have the same level of toxic environments that we did 50 years ago . It's worse now , but even if we did have the exact same level as we did 50 years ago , our dogs aren't as well equipped to handle it anymore , because it has been generation after generation after generation of poor quality nutrition , of toxic overload , that isn't being you know that like they're just not able to properly detox All of the chemicals and all of the , everything in the air , everything in the water , everything in their food , and so it has just gotten to a point where they're just not able to handle what they should be able to handle in a normal environment .
Jessica FisherAnd so , starting from the beginning , starting from you adopted this dog like that would be my ideal , especially for getting a nutritionist on board .
Larry PrudenYeah , Well , you know , what you just said is so I didn't . I actually never really thought about that . And BC is an amazing person honestly . An amazing person honestly . But thinking what you just said about dogs 50 years ago and , yes , they were eating processed food and yes , they were exposed to toxins and yes , and they were exposed to all these different environmental issues back then . But today it's so much worse and generation after generation , if the parents are continuing to pass on poor gut health , you know a lot of this is just like their guts are just completely , almost genetically wrecked in a way , you know . So it is important to you know right from the jump just do everything within your power to get them on the right track as far as their health .
Charly PrudenYeah , we're always so big on prevention , you know , because the best way to it's just like it's just so much better to prevent a disease rather than hoping that you can find a treatment option later down the line , right ? So , like we have , this happen a lot , with pet parents talking to us actually and saying things like oh yeah , I'll just get back in touch with Podego when my dog has a problem .
Larry PrudenAnd we're always like .
Charly Prudenthat's not why we're here . We're here to help you prevent the problem from happening in the first place , and I wish more pet parents understood that and how important it is to prevent something . So to give like one example out of our life that is really prominent right now or really recent , is we've just left an island in Thailand with Milka and of course , we have all of the natural flea and tick prevention stuff with us and we use that on Milka right , and we take a multifaceted approach to helping to prevent flea and tick on Milka . But unfortunately , unfortunately on this island there must have been a very high tick um location where she was and we found ticks on her . So immediately when we found ticks on her , we searched her entire body , which we were sitting there for hours , just like you know dissecting every piece of fur .
Charly PrudenExactly and we ended up like finding , I think , the first hour . We found like three or three , between three and five . They were very small so they just must have latched on her . So we right away had the tools to first of all pluck them , but then also use a natural flea and tick shampoo on her that helps kill the ticks . So we were literally standing there on the side of the road in Thailand with a bottle of water , like bottled water .
Charly PrudenAnd shampooing her on the road , on the road , yeah , so we're like leaving it in for 10 minutes letting it soak and then . But you know , to come back to the prevention aspect , a veterinarian might have just at that point obviously gave flea and tick medication and stuff , but there's no preventative aspect that a regular veterinarian would have taken as far as helping to prevent something like Lyme disease . Because we've worked with a homeopath before that is , in our holistic health expert panel we know that there are homeopathic remedies that we can give that can help prevent Milka from developing a disease from the ticks . So , like that is just one aspect of how a healthcare team is helping us prevent disease in the future , versus where a veterinarian might be reactive and might just say , okay , come back if symptoms develop . A holistic health coach or a homeopath or you know , depending on what your dog is dealing with , but they are more , they are more likely to be able to tell you how to help prevent something so that you don't get the symptoms .
Jessica FisherYeah , absolutely . And just to kind of hit that home , I think it's Dr Kendra Pope who said that we already have the cure for cancer and that's not to get it in the first place .
Charly PrudenYes , yes , yeah . And Dr Kendra Pope is also an amazing integrative veterinarian who we've worked with last year as well during Milka's , because of her blood work , so yeah , just to add , you know , um to anybody you know that may possibly go through this with ticks .
Larry PrudenLike what we actually used was the flea and tick shampoo by kin and kind , which really worked , because later on , while we were combing through her fur again , we were able able to see dead ticks , so they actually died right within her fur .
Larry PrudenBut I would say , you know , whenever you're doing anything natural , it really is about multifaceted approach , and natural sometimes is really not convenient because , like , of course , it would just be so much easier to just give your dog poison and kill all the ticks , but that's not what we want to do , because there are serious side effects when it comes to these chemical based products . But the natural way is , like , really , we were really going through her fur and we were doing that for hours and hours and hours and hours and several days after , just to be 100% sure that she has no tics . And now I'm just like always combing her fur , checking , checking , checking . But that's because of our environment , right ? Like , depending on where you live , this might be something that you need to do and where we lived before , I never felt like I needed to do it . So of course I always check , but now I check every single day , you know , because of our , because the environment that we live in .
Jessica FisherYeah , well , and to to your point about how different natural modalities work , I think that is something else that people , it's another thing that we have to unlearn Unfortunately I think unlearning is harder than learning is that we have been taught by the pharmaceutical companies for so long that you have X problem , take Y pill and it's going to fix your symptom right , your symptoms are going to be gone , nevermind all these other symptoms that are going to pop up because of what you just took . But you know , that is that's kind of how we think now , and I and I also see that happening with natural supplements , natural solutions . People are like , yes , I want to do things holistically with my dog . What can I give for X ? Right , and it's like , no , that's not how , that's not how nature works . So it's just one of those , another one of those things that we have to kind of unlearn that . Those things that we have to kind of unlearn that to truly have a holistic approach to our health care . We're looking at the whole body , and not just the whole body , but the energy and everything around in our environment , like we have to .
Jessica FisherAnd I get that what I'm saying right now can be very overwhelming , can sound very daunting . You don't have to do everything all at once . You can take baby steps . That's totally fine . I just that one of those steps that we need to take is that we have to get out of that mindset of . This is my symptom . What do I take for it ? That's not how natural modalities work .
Charly PrudenAbsolutely so what are some practical steps that pet parents can take to build a very well-rounded support system for their pets ?
Well , I think the very first step is going to be finding a veterinarian that you trust , that you can have conversations with , even if that veterinarian is not on board with everything that you want to do holistically or integratively . As long as you have open communication with them and they are willing to do the diagnostics for you and talk to you about anything that is coming up , that really is going to be very important . If you have a veterinarian that is just going to tell you all the horrible things about what you're trying to do with your pet , it's going to make things so much more difficult for you because you are going to feel bullied , you are going to feel alone and that's not a good place to be . So , finding community and finding a veterinarian that you can just have conversations with and agree to disagree that probably is going to be one of the very first things that's going to make this journey a lot easier for you .
Jessica FisherFinding that community I think social media is such a double-edged sword . We can find the best and the worst of everything in the exact same place , and so it's hard , and I get that it's hard . Finding community is helpful . Find at least one creator on whatever platform you choose to be on TikTok , instagram , facebook , youtube , wherever At least one creator , on whatever platform you choose to be on TikTok , instagram , facebook , youtube , wherever At least one creator who you really , really resonate with that you feel like you can trust to start going down those rabbit holes and then take everything you learn and start applying it to every aspect of whatever it is you need for your pet . So your pet sitter may be one of the first ones .
Jessica FisherDepending on how often you travel and you know , if you have a pet sitter who you maybe you have started implementing a raw food diet and your pet sitter is like , oh , that's that ? No , that's too much , I'm not doing that , or I'm not touching raw meat or whatever , maybe that pet sitter is not right for you , right Anymore ? So you know taking baby steps . But I really think and granted , it's going to be difficult for some people to have these real honest conversations with their veterinarians for possibly the first time in their lives but that , if you can , if you can just agree to disagree , I mean , in a perfect world our veterinarian would be like , yay , let's get your pet healthy , right , but you know , that's just not how they're trained , it's just not so expectations , having realistic expectations and just seriously agreeing to disagree , if that's the best we can do with our veterinarian , it's a pretty darn good step , I think ,
in the right direction in the right direction .
Charly PrudenSo , let's say , someone is looking for a pet nutritionist right ? There are so many people out there that claim to be pet nutritionists today , especially on social media . How can pet parents find these professionals and make sure that they're properly qualified , and are there any red flags when it comes to choosing these pet professionals ?
Jessica FisherI think it is difficult . I get that it's difficult and there are only a handful of certifications out there in North America for small animal nutrition , some of which are even more specialized , like the ones I have . One is just for dogs , the other is for dogs and cats , but it is just for raw feeding . I , for me , personally , I picked those because of my belief system and how I feel dogs and cats thrive , how they should be fed . Um , some of the so so looking for , when you're looking at the certifications that someone has , okay , look at their website or wherever they have their credentials if that's on their Instagram or their Facebook or whatever and then , like , you can actually just go to that website , wherever that credential is through and like , read through what they've learned . Like you're obviously not going to get the course , but like , what is that certification all about ? You can read through that and see if that resonates with you or not . So , not everybody does this . Currently . I still offer free 15 minute . If somebody does offer a free consultation book , it talk to them . Do they even resonate with you ? And that's one of the things that I talk to people about . I'm like this 15 minutes is for us to decide if we want to work with each other , and that goes both ways , right ? I , in fact , I just talked to somebody last night who I I mean I , I hated to do it , but I told her I was like I can't take your money . I cannot take your money because I can give you some advice . I can tell you that I prefer this brand over that brand . I can tell you that your dog has a heart murmur , so I would not recommend CBD , even though a lot of people are going to be recommending it , because she has arthritis . You know , I can tell you and I'm going to tell you this for free , because at the end of the day , she wasn't willing to transition her dog off of kibble and I said that's you know what . I respect that you have decided that for your dog . Because of past experiences I don't think I can help you in the way you're looking for , and so book that free . You know , free . Call if they offer it , see if you jive , see if you resonate with one another .
Jessica FisherAnother thing that I will say is that I , I work with people to the best of my ability to meet them where they are , Um , and so one of the things that I talk about is what's going to be the best for your dog or your cat , but also , what are you realistically going to do ? And the reason I bring that up is because I'm not a big fan of using multivitamins or premixes or any of that . I would much rather hand you recipes that are 100% balanced with whole foods . That may not be the reality of where everyone is , and I want you to succeed . So if it's going to be , if you're actually going to be able to stick with it , if I use a multivitamin , then let's do that .
Jessica FisherBut if you are working with somebody and that's all they do is this you know some meat , some veggies , some grains and like a balance it . If that's all they do , for me that's a huge red flag , right ? Like if you're not sitting there and saying I can give you whole food , balanced recipes . That's a huge red flag for me .
Larry PrudenBut it makes sense . It makes so much sense Cause , like you want somebody that will give you options and not kind of only one option , you know yeah .
Jessica FisherYeah .
Larry PrudenYeah .
Jessica FisherI , I just I see that so often and it it breaks my heart honestly , because I have people come to me who are like I've just spent so many hundreds of dollars to get this one recipe and my dog won't eat it . And I look at it and it's a balance it recipe and I'm like I'm so sorry and I hate to charge you , but unfortunately , like my time is valuable and I am gonna have to charge you , but I'm gonna give you , by the way , more than one recipe , because rotation is so important and also like we're gonna make sure that your dog is gonna eat that yeah
Charly Prudenthat is that's that's such good advice , because , even if you're feeding complete and balanced recipes , it is so important to feed more than just one recipe and constantly change through recipes , not just for nutritional reasons , but also for the sake of keeping things fun and delicious for our dogs , because there's a lot of dogs that will just become very picky after eating just one recipe for a long time . So , yeah , those are some good tips .
Like when it comes to building a health care team , a lot of pet parents might think that it sounds expensive , especially when they're already paying for vet visits . So what would you say to someone that wants to take a more holistic approach but is concerned about the financial side of this , and are there any budget-friendly ways to build this well-rounded team ?
Jessica Fisheryeah , well , I think some parts of the team you're paying for anyway pet sitters , groomers , trainers you're already paying for for those services . So just being a little bit more specific in what you're looking for isn't going to make a difference one way or the other in the pricing . And yes , when we start out on a more holistic journey or integrative journey , there are some upfront costs and they can be a little overwhelming sometimes . And I think that we just have to realize that , while nobody can ever guarantee anything we talked a little bit earlier about overcoming genetics it's it's it's difficult and then we really we really have to pay so much attention to the epigenetics and like how we are managing the environment and what we're putting in and on the body so that we're not turning those switches on , and that , yeah , there's a little bit of upfront cost to that . There's a little bit of upfront cost to that . But the goal ultimately is that over the lifetime of your animal you are actually spending less money , and sometimes it may not feel like it .
Jessica FisherI know you guys can probably attest to that as well . Sometimes it may not feel like it . I know I spend so much money on food and sometimes supplements . I don't use a ton of supplements , but it can feel really overwhelming . But at the end of the day I can look back and see that for the first I don't know 10 , 12 , 15 , I don't know how many years it was of me being an adult , being a pet parent I spent so many thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars every single year in vet bills , whereas now , yes , I'm spending a whole heck of a lot of money in food , but at the end of the year it nowhere adds up to the amount that I used to spend in vet bills , which , by the way , now my animals pretty much only get there every six months checkup , like that's .
Jessica FisherThat's where we're at , unless something happens , unless it's an end of life type of situation where you know you need some diagnostics generally for that and make some decisions . It doesn't have to be all or nothing all at once either . So I think that's where people can kind of take some baby steps financially as well , where you can just start adding some higher quality fresh foods to the bowl . See how that feels . See how it feels to maybe at the same time that feels , see how it feels to maybe at the same time you're buying yourself that regeneratively raised chicken and sharing it with your dog or cat . How does that feel , you know , financially for you ? So you know , taking baby steps is totally fine . It is totally fine and kind of giving yourself that buffer of like , okay , I can do this this month and maybe next month I can throw in some , um , I'm gonna buy some mason jars and and , uh , grow my own broccoli sprouts , right like . There's so many things that you can do .
Jessica FisherUm , and that's again one of the first things I talk about with people is , like , where are you as far as you've got to decide ? I don't care what we're talking about in life Just right now . We're talking about your pets . You're either going to put money into it or you're going to put time into it one way or the other , and you just got to make that decision wherever you're at in your life right now . And that can change and that can go back and forth a lot , like you guys were saying when I had had you on my podcast , like having this freeze-dried food is , uh , amazing . Right for milko right now . Because of your travel situation , that is more expensive than making your own raw food meal for her . Um , but that's what you need in this , this season of life . So it's it isn't all or nothing . Make tiny adjustments here and there , see how it feels , see what you can do differently next month . And yeah , I think those are some , some of the tips that I have .
Charly PrudenThose are some really amazing tips . For sure and just we can totally second what you just said . We've made the same experience as far as how our vet bills looked like . When we weren't focusing on prevention and we weren't going down that natural way of feeding and you know the holistic route of pet wellness Our vet bills were so high . And ever since we've started on this healing journey with Milka and started focusing on good quality nutrition and supplements and things like that , like we are definitely spending a lot more money on her food and her supplements now and her lifestyle just in general , but we're spending close to no money in vet bills . So that definitely for anyone you know just starting out their journey as a pet parent , or for anyone who has a new pet , or for anyone who has a pet that doesn't have any symptoms , starting with prevention as early as possible is definitely going to save you so much money down the line . And even as far as like healthcare , the healthcare team for people who have pets that already have certain concerns , we've made the experience last year that a holistic vet was much more expensive all at once . But the time that we spent with that holistic vet or actually she's an integrative oncologist , dr kendra pope . The time that we spent with her actually equaled out , because it equaled to like going to the vet , like what , for like six times two hours , like you don't ever have , yeah , or even more than that . You don't ever have that much time with a conventional vet . So it actually is around the same price at the end of the day . But yeah , that's just
our experience .
Charly PrudenOne thing I did want to mention is , because we've talked a lot about , uh , pet sitting today . Something else that we've done last year is actually , uh , become members in a platform called trusted house sitters . I'm gonna leave the link in the description below , but , um , basically what that is , it's a free pet sitting platform . Well , you pay a membership once a year , which is like $100 , I think , or so , but everyone on this platform is vetted so people can apply to pet sit for you . So if you say you're going for two weeks in August somewhere , you can put your house and your dog .
Larry PrudenIt's like an Airbnb .
Charly PrudenYeah , it's like an Airbnb , but with dogs , basically , and cats , so you can like put all your information there . You can say this is what I'm expecting from my pet sitter . You will need to give this supplement , or you know . Basically , you write down the routine , you write down like exactly how much time your dogs should be outside or exercise , and you know all of that . So the pet sitters know what they're committing to , and then you can interview the pet sitters and it's an exchange , so the pet sitter stays at your house for free but in return they look after your dogs and your house and your cats . So that's also a way of at least having that one part of your pet health care team a little more affordable , if that's something that works for you .
Larry PrudenBut just to add to this , you know , or whatever these things are called , right Like the shorts , whatever wherever you can get information from really great content creators , those are really great places because a lot of content creators ourselves included we put out so much free information and you can go check this information at any time . If you want to learn how to make a recipe , if you want to make your own dog treats , if you want to learn how to , you know what , what , uh , flea and tick prevention to stay away from or to use , or you know like , all that information is there and that is a just a really great way to get started and going in the right direction without even necessarily having to pay for anything . So I just trying to think back on what did we do in the very , very beginning and that was one of the things that we did in the very beginning is check content online and because a lot of content creators they do put out a lot of free information that is honestly very life-changing .
Jessica FisherIt is , and that's actually why I started my podcast is because , you know , I've been in the digital marketing space for over a decade now and I learned in this process that you give your best stuff away for free , and so I created . That's why I created my podcast , because I said you know what this is ? How I feel like I can best give back , that I can best give to the community , is by amplifying those voices of people that I trust and respect in this space , while putting good quality information out to people . That , I feel like , is the best information that I could possibly be giving .
Charly PrudenWell , thank you so much , Jessica , for being on our podcast today . We've learned so many amazing our podcast today . We've learned so many amazing , valuable tips from you and I hope that everyone listening is inspired to slowly add on to their pet healthcare team and slowly add more and more professionals into this team and advancing on their wellness journey . Thank you so much for taking the time . We really appreciate it .
Jessica FisherGosh . Thank you guys so much . Thank you for what you're doing and for just helping educate pet parents so that they can do better for their pets . It means the world too , I'm sure everybody listening . So thank you for everything you do .
Charly PrudenCan you just tell everyone where they can find you if they want to get in touch with you or listen to your podcast as well ?
Jessica FisherYeah , the podcast is called the pet parenting reset and it is available on all podcasting platforms Spotify , apple , google , all the places . You can also go to thepetparentingresetcom and listen there if you prefer to do so . And , yeah , if you want to get in touch with me , the best place to find me on socials is Instagram at thepetparentingreset , and if you want to book that free discovery call that we talked about , you can get there through the link tree on my Instagram , but it's JessicaLFishercom is my main website that will actually get you everywhere else that you want to go .
Charly PrudenAmazing . Thank you so much .
Larry PrudenThank you .
Charly PrudenThank you guys . Thank you so much for tuning into today's episode . If you like this show and you like what we do here and you want to support us , the free and simple way to do just that is by hitting the subscribe button . Larry and I spent countless hours creating this podcast , and seeing our community grow really means the world to us and enables us to keep creating awesome content , just like this .